# Crusade of fire



## jondoe297 (Jan 6, 2010)

Campaign book pre release

Not seen any info else where about it!

Pretty standard but due to the 'while stocks last' I impulse bought

http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=cat440160a&prodId=prod1780018a


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## Zion (May 31, 2011)

Looks like the Wall of Martyrs isn't completely gone either, they just have it in smaller sections now...

Also it's kind of a dick move by GW to put the details out for the products in the White Dwarf. I get that they want to push the magazine, but some of us would like to have some IDEA of what we're looking at BEFORE we buy it and have a chance to get it before it's gone.

EDIT: Well at least the book looks good. Apparently some new rules for Flyers are contained within as well as rules for specific board setups (underground, Daemon World....). I don't think it'll have an Imperial Shrine world in there, but I'm picking it up because it could still have some neat stuff that could be fun to play.


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## Doelago (Nov 29, 2009)

Looks interesting. Might pick it up for myself for christmass. 

Ooo, individual Wall of Martyrs segments. Cool. Might have to pick some up. Was not too fond of a huge arse box full of parts, just need some bunkers and a few normal segments.


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## Azkaellon (Jun 23, 2009)

Shame i don't have 50 bucks to pay to play in a campaign....


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## Archon Dan (Feb 6, 2012)

Zion said:


> Looks like the Wall of Martyrs isn't completely gone either, they just have it in smaller sections now...
> 
> Also it's kind of a dick move by GW to put the details out for the products in the White Dwarf. I get that they want to push the magazine, but some of us would like to have some IDEA of what we're looking at BEFORE we buy it and have a chance to get it before it's gone.
> 
> EDIT: Well at least the book looks good. Apparently some new rules for Flyers are contained within as well as rules for specific board setups (underground, Daemon World....). I don't think it'll have an Imperial Shrine world in there, but I'm picking it up because it could still have some neat stuff that could be fun to play.


James Swallow does a pretty good job describing an Imperial Shrine World in the Blood Angels Omnibus. It's technically a cemetery world but has a lot of similar elements and is ruled by the Eclesiarchy. 

The book does seem pretty interesting and supplying alternate scenarios, rules and battlefield ideas is great. It helps our creativity.


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## Zion (May 31, 2011)

Archon Dan said:


> James Swallow does a pretty good job describing an Imperial Shrine World in the Blood Angels Omnibus. It's technically a cemetery world but has a lot of similar elements and is ruled by the Eclesiarchy.


Ah yes, I remember that. He REALLY needed a thesaurus for that book. He gets a lot better though.


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## Azkaellon (Jun 23, 2009)

Best part of the book is Local GW is holding an event but if you don't buy the book you can't play...so...60 bucks for a 1 use book.....On behalf of all of us on a budget. Fuck you Games Workshop, Fuck you.


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## TheReverend (Dec 2, 2007)

I think it's great that they have brought the campaign books back, it's something we've all been asking for for ages and now they've done it, so great work GW! 

And yeah, you have to buy the book to play in store, but you know, usually you have to pay toplay in campaigns anyway, and at least you then also have the book with all the artwork and background fluff to use again at your own leisure.


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## Dicrel Seijin (Apr 2, 2011)

As much as I love books, I really don't want to buy blind, especially at that price point. I'm going to pass.

I do like the individual boxes for the Wall of Martyrs. It's a bit more palatable. I'll definitely pick up a couple of boxes of those. Anyone know if there's going to be a FAQ update for purchasing them as a fortification?


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## Azkaellon (Jun 23, 2009)

TheReverend said:


> I think it's great that they have brought the campaign books back, it's something we've all been asking for for ages and now they've done it, so great work GW!
> 
> And yeah, you have to buy the book to play in store, but you know, usually you have to pay toplay in campaigns anyway, and at least you then also have the book with all the artwork and background fluff to use again at your own leisure.


Nope now you can't play if you don't have the LIMITED EDITION book...for that event that lasts 3 months or so.....little unfair i would say.


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## slaaneshy (Feb 20, 2008)

I like campaign books so happy to see these make a return as well.
But I do feel 25 notes for something with a limited life span is too high, maybe £15 would be more palatable. 
I have to say i'm confused to why they have gone down the limited availabilty route....could it be that it is a pile of poop so they are milking the fan boys on pre-orders before anyone gets a whiff of it?


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## scscofield (May 23, 2011)

I am betting it is more a xmas push type thing and they will just release them as normal after the holiday.


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## MidnightSun (Feb 10, 2009)

Has anybody else read the Fighting on Daemon Worlds spread? I'm not sure if I'm missing something, if it's badly written, or whether it really is a chunk of shit.

So there's this mechanic of applying counters to units and it gives them a special rule, but your opponent can remove all your counters and cripple your squad before you get a chance to use the rule. I don't get it. It sounds like a buff system, until you see that it only really affects low-leadership units, and then you think it's a RANDOM DESTRUCTION element, but then why include the special rules bit?

I think it's more of the same old stuff at the back of the rulebook about high gravity/low gravity environments, toxic wastes, warp rifts etc. I hope I'm wrong.

Midnight


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## EmbraCraig (Jan 19, 2009)

MidnightSun said:


> Has anybody else read the Fighting on Daemon Worlds spread? I'm not sure if I'm missing something, if it's badly written, or whether it really is a chunk of shit.
> 
> So there's this mechanic of applying counters to units and it gives them a special rule, but your opponent can remove all your counters and cripple your squad before you get a chance to use the rule. I don't get it. It sounds like a buff system, until you see that it only really affects low-leadership units, and then you think it's a RANDOM DESTRUCTION element, but then why include the special rules bit?
> 
> ...


From what I can read, you take a LD test on the highest 2 from 3D6. If you pass, act normally. If you fail, you get a number of counters equal to the amount you fail by at the start of the game.

Plus side for you is a universal special rule applies to the unit, but your opponent gets to use it against you. TBH, would seem strange if failing a leadership test had a purely positive effect on the unit, so that doesn't seem too strange... I guess the beneficial rule is to encourage people to actually use them, since they're all listed as optional rules in the introductory paragraph. And it looks like the counters are placed at the start of the game, so your opponent has the choice between leaving you with a USR for longer and keeping the effects for when they think they'll be of most use, or getting rid early and screwing with your first turn or two. And it seems to apply equally to both sides (well other than the fact low LD armies will be affected more, anyway).

Given how many people seem to hate random objectives, terrain, warlord traits etc, I'm expecting people will have a pretty negative reaction in general. I'm not a massive fan of random effects myself, but if you're fighting on a deamon world then wierd shit should happen.


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## Sethis (Jun 4, 2009)

EmbraCraig said:


> Given how many people seem to hate random objectives, terrain, warlord traits etc, I'm expecting people will have a pretty negative reaction in general. I'm not a massive fan of random effects myself, but if you're fighting on a deamon world then wierd shit should happen.


So long as you're aware that you're only playing for giggles, random is fine.

The problem is when you try to apply random shit to games where you actually care about winning.

My suggestion for Daemon Worlds is to roll on a 2D6 table with random events from WoW raids - everything from wall of fire to three dragons to adds to pits of acid. On a roll of a 2 you have to do the dance from Naxx with all of your infantry units.


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## Arcane (Feb 17, 2009)

Does anyone know anything else about the book like what armies it supports or what themes it has?


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## Zion (May 31, 2011)

Sethis said:


> So long as you're aware that you're only playing for giggles, random is fine.
> 
> The problem is when you try to apply random shit to games where you actually care about winning.
> 
> My suggestion for Daemon Worlds is to roll on a 2D6 table with random events from WoW raids - everything from wall of fire to three dragons to adds to pits of acid. On a roll of a 2 you have to do the dance from Naxx with all of your infantry units.


The problem for this is that the book is apparently for GW's most recent campaign. So some people will be upset anyways.



Arcane said:


> Does anyone know anything else about the book like what armies it supports or what themes it has?


Sadly, I haven't heard anything that wasn't on the GW site. It seems that this caught just about everyone from left field. Now considering it's for a big GW campaign, in _theory_ everyone should be getting someone out of this regardless. In _practice _I have a feeling some armies won't be getting anything.


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## Arcane (Feb 17, 2009)

So you're supposed to shell out you're money for a book you don't even get a synopsis on? Seems legit.


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## Zion (May 31, 2011)

Arcane said:


> So you're supposed to shell out you're money for a book you don't even get a synopsis on? Seems legit.


Well don't jump to far with that conclusion. You do get a little about the book on the GW site (about as much as you do for any of their books sadly).

From the books page itself:


> Crusade of Fire is a campaign system for Warhammer 40,000 that enables you to join the campaign to control the Corvus Sub-sector. Whether you choose to join the Crusade of Fire itself, the foul Servants of Ruin or the bloodthirsty Prophets of War, the fate of the sub-sector lies in your hands.
> 
> This 96-page, full-colour hardcover book features exclusive artwork and a host of dynamic new rules. As well as the campaign system itself, the book contains rules that can be used in any Warhammer 40,000 game, from massive multi-player scenarios fought in low-gravity environments or in bunkers deep below the ground, to expanded rules for Flyers. It also features rules for playing games in the gladiatorial arenas of Commorragh as well as for fighting battles on the surface of a Daemon World.
> 
> Crusade of Fire also features the story of nine hobbyists as they play through the campaign, including detailed battle reports, fantastic army showcases and turn-by-turn accounts of their conquest.


And from Saturday's What's New Today:


> _Crusade of Fire_ is a hefty 96-page hardback book that features new rules and scenarios for your games of Warhammer 40,000. There's so much to look at in this book, it's hard to know quite where to start. There are nine beautiful armies to look at, campaign rules to pore over, maps and artwork in abundance, additional rules for flyers to try out, new scenarios to play and so much more. There's even a section on Arena of Death matches, the classic one-on-one, hero-vs-hero challenge where only the strongest (or sneakiest) will survive. This is one of those books that, while not essential for a game of Warhammer 40,000, should be part of every hobbyist's collection - it's insightful, inspirational and, above all, fun.


The problem is GW never really says outright what's in any of their books. It's a bit of an annoyance, but it's about on par with shopping on Amazon and running across books that don't have real synopsis there. Now if you have no plan in being part of the campaign or just don't want to play this then don't pick it up, otherwise see what it contains when it comes out an pick up a copy then (or if it's somehow sold out by then and your FLGS doesn't have copies, abuse the internet for a copy, they've always got one).


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## Arcane (Feb 17, 2009)

What I am looking for is what I find in the synopsis for most D&D campaign books or the like, that is, 

-How many players is the campaign intended for? (Obviously at least 9 but can it handle as little as 2-3? What about larger like 15?)
-What armies are covered in the book (why do I want a book which ignores the armies I've spent thousands of dollars on)
-How long is the campaign intended to last? (Usually in RPGs they give a level range or number of game sessions). 

I would like to get several of my friends to pitch in on this and play it together on a weekly basis, but without knowing almost anything about it... that's hard to do. GW just tells you what is obvious; it's a campaign, there's pictures and words, it has new stuff, there's examples of how it is used in the book.


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## Zion (May 31, 2011)

Arcane said:


> What I am looking for is what I find in the synopsis for most D&D campaign books or the like, that is,
> 
> -How many players is the campaign intended for? (Obviously at least 9 but can it handle as little as 2-3? What about larger like 15?)
> -What armies are covered in the book (why do I want a book which ignores the armies I've spent thousands of dollars on)
> ...


And that's the kind of thing GW is bad at saying. I'm hoping they'll explain more soon.


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## Zion (May 31, 2011)

From the December 2012 White Dwarf (some of these are from captions so I'm sharing them as completely as I can):



> The book contains three new expansions, including Burning Skies, which gives you rules for aerial combat, advanced manoeuvres and fighter aces.
> 
> The Crusade of Fire campaign can be recreated with your own gaming group.
> 
> ...





> Crusade of Fire is a campaign book for Warhammer 40,000 that is packed with all manner of new rules and scenarios for you to use in your games. You'll find a completely new campaign system, background to go with it, loads of new scenarios and rules, as well as the story of how the Studio's own hobbyists fared when they played through the campaign. It's a hardbacked, full-colour book that features lots of sumptuous photography featuring the player's own armies.
> 
> The campaign found in the book can be combined with the Planetary Empires expansion, enabling you to represent the entirety of the Corvus sub-sector and fight for control of it with your friends. Rather than battle over a single world, the campaign allows teams of players to fight over control of several planets. Success one planet affects the outcomes of battles on another. Players can work together, counting their victories towards the team's [Zion's Notes: The paragraph stops right there, I presume it should have continued, but it doesn't.]
> 
> Crammed into the 96 pages of the book are also three expansions for Warhammer 40,000 - Burning Skies, Daemon Worlds and Arena of Death. Burning Skies expands the rules for flyers found in the Warhammer 40,000 rulebook, containing rules for fighter aces in your armies, as well as a new dogfighting system and options for performing advanced manoeuvres with your flyers. Arena of Death recreates the deadly duels fought int he gladiatorial pits of Commorragh and includes rules for gaining the adulation from the crowd and surviving the hell of captivity among the Dark Eldar. Daemon Worlds contains rules for fighting on planets found on the fringes fo the Warp, where you must face a world of nightmares, and risk your squad being possessed.


So there we go. It's actually 4 Expansions in a single book, with the main focus being the campaign system. I can't claim how good or bad it is (since I haven't gotten my copy of it yet), but it sounds interesting enough at least.

I apologize for anyone who was looking for scans, I get the digital WD and couldn't provide pictures.


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## TheReverend (Dec 2, 2007)

Cheers Zion, you've enlightened us all. Sounds like an interesting addition though.


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## humakt (Jan 2, 2008)

Its a book I would like to get a look at, although not nessacerily buy. Now I have somebody at home who is starting to enjoy palying 40k a campaign could be a good thing to do. I dont really need a book to setup a campaign, but something my son can run could be useful.

I wonder if it is easily compatible with Planetary Empires?


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## Zion (May 31, 2011)

humakt said:


> Its a book I would like to get a look at, although not nessacerily buy. Now I have somebody at home who is starting to enjoy palying 40k a campaign could be a good thing to do. I dont really need a book to setup a campaign, but something my son can run could be useful.
> 
> I wonder if it is easily compatible with Planetary Empires?


They claim it is. The only downside is that it's becoming harder and harder to find as GW has already sold out in North America and is quickly running out from there.

I'm all for limited runs, but shouldn't you, ya'know, not run out of product until AFTER the release date? I thought pre-orders where to reserve early copies so you don't have to run that risk.....yet here we are, running out in the pre-order...again.


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## humakt (Jan 2, 2008)

Zion said:


> I'm all for limited runs, but shouldn't you, ya'know, not run out of product until AFTER the release date? I thought pre-orders where to reserve early copies so you don't have to run that risk.....yet here we are, running out in the pre-order...again.


I dont think they should have limited edition rule runs, it doesnt make sense. If its good enough you will get sales for an extended period.


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## Zion (May 31, 2011)

humakt said:


> I dont think they should have limited edition rule runs, it doesnt make sense. If its good enough you will get sales for an extended period.


I think the bean counters and the like are nervous because of how few copies of Dreadfleet they sold (to be fair I think they didn't really give anyone time to warm up to the game and didn't really cover much about the game itself (would it really be that hard to show us the basics and give us a couple of turns in a video so we get the idea?) other than how awesome models were and the like) so instead they're doing less and less copies of things.


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## Arcane (Feb 17, 2009)

LOL! So it's advertised on their main page (GW) yet they are out of stock. What a joke... >_> 

And since GW won't do digital releases they can't even sell the book for $5 to those who missed it so looks like yet another book you will have to illegally download since it's not available (lookin at SoB dex )


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## Zion (May 31, 2011)

Arcane said:


> LOL! So it's advertised on their main page (GW) yet they are out of stock. What a joke... >_>
> 
> And since GW won't do digital releases they can't even sell the book for $5 to those who missed it so looks like yet another book you will have to illegally download since it's not available (lookin at SoB dex )


Actually the Hobbit is now the front page item now.

In other news my copy of Crusade of Fire finally shipped and once I've got it in hand I can share a little more about it for those who want to try and obtain a copy for themselves.


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## Arcane (Feb 17, 2009)

Sorry I meant front page for the 40k section. Wanted to read/watch some reviews before going out and buying it -_-


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## Svartmetall (Jun 16, 2008)

Well, it's still order-able from GW UK's site, I just pre-ordered one. Be nice if they'd tell us when the bloody release date was, though...


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## Boc (Mar 19, 2010)

Well Svart couldn't you, you know, ask someone in your building?


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## Stephen_Newman (Jul 14, 2009)

Svartmetall said:


> Well, it's still order-able from GW UK's site, I just pre-ordered one. Be nice if they'd tell us when the bloody release date was, though...


Release date is tomorrow. They have already arrived in my local GW store.


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## Adramalech (Nov 10, 2009)

EDIT: just another GW fuck-up as far as I'm concerned.


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## Suijin (Aug 11, 2011)

Zion said:


> I think the bean counters and the like are nervous because of how few copies of Dreadfleet they sold (to be fair I think they didn't really give anyone time to warm up to the game and didn't really cover much about the game itself (would it really be that hard to show us the basics and give us a couple of turns in a video so we get the idea?) other than how awesome models were and the like) so instead they're doing less and less copies of things.


Didn't they make all GW stores ship their extra Dreadfleet games back so they could grind all the models back up and reuse the plastic, along with increase the value of the other existing Dreadfleets because they destroyed so many?

I know of someplace who has a lot of them left and really wants to be rid of them, hehe.


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## The Son of Horus (Dec 30, 2006)

I was able to get a copy. But I imagine a lot of people won't be able to-- it was another one of these allocated products that most stores can get one or two copies of at most. 

Honestly, they should have just released it as a regular expansion release, just like they've done with Cities of Death and Planetstrike, and made it regularly available. It's not that the rules in it are that exciting or anything, but it does have a complete campaign in there, as well as rules for daemon worlds and greatly expanded rules for flyers. The Arena of Death thing in the back of it is kind of cool I guess... it plays like a card game though, and it really looks like something they put in there just for shits and giggles.


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## Zion (May 31, 2011)

Suijin said:


> Didn't they make all GW stores ship their extra Dreadfleet games back so they could grind all the models back up and reuse the plastic, along with increase the value of the other existing Dreadfleets because they destroyed so many?
> 
> I know of someplace who has a lot of them left and really wants to be rid of them, hehe.


That they did. 

Dreadfleet was a flop for a few reasons:

1. It didn't really tie into Fantasy very effectively.
2. People wanted BFG with Pirate ships. What we got was a random effects board game. This made it less popular than it could have been.
3. There was 0 warning on this until the pirate stuff on the blog the week of release. There was no talk about the game, the kind of story it was telling or anything that made us want to play it. All the marketting was about how detailed the models were, and how high quality the game is.
4. They didn't give us time to warm up to it. Within a month of release they decided to pull the plug on it and act like it was our fault that they'd mispitched it.

I think 3 and 4 are the deal breakers on this one frankly. Most of us aren't THAT critical of models to care if they're UBER HIGH QUALITY or not. We like good looking models, sure, but more so we want to know about the game and what it's about. Sure GW is a model company, but their pitch should be how the models interact with the setting in the game more than how uber detailed they are (at least as a hook, you can sell me on the models AFTER you sell me on the game).

And by not giving us time to warm up to it, no one did. There wasn't time to really warm up to the game with GW pulling off the shelves so quick. I'd considered getting it, but it's been largely forgotten by people and now no one wants to touch it.



The Son of Horus said:


> I was able to get a copy. But I imagine a lot of people won't be able to-- it was another one of these allocated products that most stores can get one or two copies of at most.


My FLGS managed to get six copies. But then again he keeps up on these kinds of things thanks to us who keep up on the rumors locally. We've got a small circle of rumormongers who keep each other up to speed when we've been out of the loop.



The Son of Horus said:


> Honestly, they should have just released it as a regular expansion release, just like they've done with Cities of Death and Planetstrike, and made it regularly available. It's not that the rules in it are that exciting or anything, but it does have a complete campaign in there, as well as rules for daemon worlds and greatly expanded rules for flyers. The Arena of Death thing in the back of it is kind of cool I guess... it plays like a card game though, and it really looks like something they put in there just for shits and giggles.


I agree, the whole thing FEELS like it should be an expansion. I still think someone is thinking that anything that strays more than more than a certian distance far from the established IPs is FAR too risky to release fully (and I blame the mismanaged way Dreadfleet was given to us, and how they handled the initial reaction). 

I think it'll get better when GW's knee jerk reactions stop occurring....assuming they ever do.


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## Arcane (Feb 17, 2009)

Could someone who has access to it do a brief review, also mention how well it incorporates all armies? Would still like to get a copy.


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## Zion (May 31, 2011)

Arcane said:


> Could someone who has access to it do a brief review, also mention how well it incorporates all armies? Would still like to get a copy.


I'm waiting on mine to come in but if you're impatient TastyTaste covered it here.


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## Arcane (Feb 17, 2009)

after reading that I'm glad I didn't pre-order it. Seems maybe their obscure description was an effort to hide an overpriced expansion for an expansion with half the content you pay for and expensive required models...


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## MidnightSun (Feb 10, 2009)

Arcane said:


> after reading that I'm glad I didn't pre-order it. Seems maybe their obscure description was an effort to hide an overpriced expansion for an expansion with half the content you pay for and expensive required models...


Exactly what I feared this expansion to be.

Midnight


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## Zion (May 31, 2011)

Arcane said:


> after reading that I'm glad I didn't pre-order it. Seems maybe their obscure description was an effort to hide an overpriced expansion for an expansion with half the content you pay for and expensive required models...


I've got the book in hand, and the only thing I saw that was required was the Planetary Empires sets. I'm working on a review for it to include what's in it to give everyone a chance to really see what it is.


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## Arcane (Feb 17, 2009)

It seems like it would be hard to play without fortifications, a spare Daemon army laying around, a Zone Mortalis set, a kit bashed space station, and Planetary Empire tiles... that plus the $40 book makes this a very expensive campaign to run. 

Now... luckily my gaming group has most of these things but it's still frustrating.


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## Zion (May 31, 2011)

Arcane said:


> It seems like it would be hard to play without fortifications, a spare Daemon army laying around, a Zone Mortalis set, a kit bashed space station, and Planetary Empire tiles... that plus the $40 book makes this a very expensive campaign to run.
> 
> Now... luckily my gaming group has most of these things but it's still frustrating.


Orrrrrr....you can steal parts of the campaign, use stuff you have and make your own?


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## EmbraCraig (Jan 19, 2009)

I've not picked up the book yet (it's at the Post Office waiting for me to go get it), but surely you can use a good old fashioned square/hex bit of paper for your campaign map and not use planetary empire tiles?

And as said on TastyTaste's review, Space Hulk tiles (or something similar) could do a perfectly good job of replacing Zone Mortalis. You could build something similar to the space station using the old Necromunda scenery. Not have Deamons? How about replacing the random demon encounters with deathworld wildlife (pretty much anything)/rebel uprisings (guard, necromunda, cultist models)... use the framework, change it to suit what you have.


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## Suijin (Aug 11, 2011)

I got his book, mostly due to it being the last one heh. My friends and I talked about going through some of it, so we will see what we think about it.


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## Arcane (Feb 17, 2009)

Finally got my hands on a copy of this book. 

Not sure how I feel about it over all... it has a lot of specific rules for every army, like special flyer rules or pilot upgrades depending on your army. Every army is represented with something special but as per usual SoB got left out... :/


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## scscofield (May 23, 2011)

I'm curious, are the SW mentioned in the flyer rules?


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## bitsandkits (Mar 18, 2008)

scscofield said:


> I'm curious, are the SW mentioned in the flyer rules?


they get a special character called Stringfellow Hawke, he unlocks flyers called Airwolves.


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## nevynxxx (Dec 27, 2011)

bitsandkits said:


> they get a special character called Stringfellow Hawke, he unlocks flyers called Airwolves.


Do they have a catchy theme tune?


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## bitsandkits (Mar 18, 2008)

nevynxxx said:


> Do they have a catchy theme tune?


now that you mention it i think they do....


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## scscofield (May 23, 2011)

Cute....

To expand on my question do the SW, DA, BT, or Tau have expanded flyer rules in the book?

Reason I ask is because I am wondering if they actually blew off SoB or if they just didn't bother with flyerless codexs at the time of release for the book.


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## Zion (May 31, 2011)

scscofield said:


> Cute....
> 
> To expand on my question do the SW, DA, BT, or Tau have expanded flyer rules in the book?
> 
> Reason I ask is because I am wondering if they actually blew off SoB or if they just didn't bother with flyerless codexs at the time of release for the book.


Anyone with a flyer can use the rules, but only certain armies got an Ace/Special Manoeuvre. They are:



Eldar
 Space Marines
Blood Angels
Space Wolves
Grey Knights
Dark Eldar
Tau Empire
Orks
Dark Angels
Imperial Guard (since Sisters aircraft is Imperial Navy like the Guard they could just use this one)
Chaos Space Marines
Necrons
Black Templar (only gets an Ace and has to share with Space Marines to have a manoeuvre)
So out of everyone Sisters got neither, and BT only gets an Ace. Sisters can realistically borrow the Imperial Guard options though as they don't have any Sisters who are dedicated pilots at this time, and BT can borrow the Space Marone special manoeuvre so they're not completely boned.


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## Arcane (Feb 17, 2009)

scscofield said:


> Cute....
> 
> To expand on my question do the SW, DA, BT, or Tau have expanded flyer rules in the book?
> 
> Reason I ask is because I am wondering if they actually blew off SoB or if they just didn't bother with flyerless codexs at the time of release for the book.


No, that's why I mentioned it. I wasnt't trying to be my usual grumbly self about SoB being left out... They literally got completely left out as if they didn't exist without a single picture, model, rule or representation in the book. Even armies that as of right now can't use them (unless you're using Forgeworld) got special flyer stuff...

So imo that either points to that SoB are on the cusp of a release this year and they didn't want to spoil it (but that's also what we said about the 5th ed codex when it came out) or they were just oddly, completely and utterly ignored. Very glad I didn't actually waste money on this book.


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## Zion (May 31, 2011)

I just realized that FMCs didn't get any sort of rules for the flier battle thing. Shame, that could have been pretty cool.


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## scscofield (May 23, 2011)

Interesting info thank you. The store I got my DA dex from had like 10 copies of the book but I didn't have time to page thru it.


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## Sothot (Jul 22, 2011)

Zion said:


> Orrrrrr....you can steal parts of the campaign, use stuff you have and make your own?


Exactly. I tend to treat all the other expansion books and campaign releases as idea supplements for making myown campaigns. I may not have a spare Daemon army around, but how hard would it be to modify the Daemon World rules to fit my Dad's Tyranid Army and represent a Hive Fleet invasion instead? You don't have to stick letter to letter.


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## Arcane (Feb 17, 2009)

That's what I am planning to do. However, GW lost a sale with me by leaving out my army, or else I would have bought/preordered it. Now I just take the usual route with all their out of print material.


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## Sothot (Jul 22, 2011)

Fair enough. I remember when Apocalypse first came out and I jokingly told the GW employee I wanted a discount on the book since only two pages in the book were relevant to me... Suddenly I feel incredibly privileged to be one of the "hot" armies and back in the loop of updates and whatnot.


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## scscofield (May 23, 2011)

From the reviews I saw of the book and the rumors that the flyer rules will be in the next WD, your not missing much by skipping the purchase of the book.


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