# Horus Heresy Books



## mal310 (May 28, 2010)

Warning Spoilers in parts 

Horus Heresy Series
I love this series. Some people moan that it’s being dragged out but for me I hope they drag it out as long as possible. There is after all a lot to cover. I do feel however that the quality of writing varies considerably. In my opinion the best books so far are Legion, Horus Rising, The Flight of the Eisenstein and A Thousand Sons, in that order. I think that so far Legion really has been the stand out book. I would go as far to say it’s one of the best books I have ever read. The characters were extremely rich and interesting the story convincing and the twist fantastic (and I for one hope means that The Alpha Legion are not who they originally appeared to be in 40,000).

The next few in my list would be Mechanicum, Fulgrim and False Gods, again in that order. I enjoyed all these books immensely. My only complaint would be that I did not find the dream sequence (or whatever you would call it) in False Gods convincing as I did not feel that Erebus ‘s argument would have been enough to sway Horus, even with his mind poisoned by that blade. I thought that could have done with a bit of work. 

The next two I thought were only ok. Battle for the Abyss and Galaxy in flames. I was disappointed in Galaxy because the first two books set the scene magnificently and I felt that it did not quite deliver (although I still enjoyed it). I thought that the inner conflict that the Astartes on both sides must have felt before they first fought each other face to face was not covered at all. Another area I felt that could have done with more work was exactly how these Lodges turned the Astartes against their Emperor. 

Apart from the short stories that leaves two. Both about the Dark Angels who I feel have really been let down so far in this series. I much prefer Decent of Angels as although quite boring it does have some interesting aspects and at least the author seems to have made an effort. 

For me Fallen Angles is a total joke, utter garbage that seems to have been written in the space of two days by someone that could not care less about what they were putting on paper. It really pi**es me off to be honest because it should be an honor to get to write about the heresy. There are so many things wrong with this book that the mind boggles. A total lack of attention to detail prevails throughout. For a start, the main characters from the first book seemed to have swapped identities. Wasn’t it Nemiel who had doubts about the Dark Angles in the first book? (Although to fair there was not much to separate their non existent personalities. If anything the character building is even worse in this book. Just a bunch of non-descript standard Space Maries and their Sergeant. ) Mike Lee regularly gets confused about his own characters and what they are doing. At one point in the book Marthes and Vardus seem to keep switching between carrying a meltagun and a heavy bolter. Later Nemiel is summarizing his squad’s injuries. He mentions the Astartes with the sore knee but does not seem to care that another of his brothers had his eye blasted off! This same guy has his helmet wreaked but is wearing it again a few pages later! At another point two Rhinos have their engines destroyed, another is blown apart and a fourth crashes. A few minutes later the same four Rhinos are driving off with troops on board!!! The author cannot even be bothered to get the color of the Sons of Horus’s armor right. Astelan is my biggest issue however. I have not read Angels of Darkness (just about to start) but I have read Call of the Lion (which I thoroughly enjoyed). I was very much looking forward to Astelan’s story ark in this book and his interaction with Israfael (a fellow Terran). Mike Lee obviously was not. He introduces him correctly as a Terran and then seems to forget this for the rest of the book; at one point he even has him banging on about creatures he came across as a kid, creatures that happen to be native to Caliban! Hmmm. LAZY SHOCKING PATHETIC. 

There are a few other stupid mistakes as well. Even one of the few good bits, the assault on the deserted outpost, on refection seems to be a lift from Aliens. 

What surprises me most through is that so many people seem to like this book (and obviously everyone is entitled to their own opinion), but I just don’t get it. For me it’s just a load of mediocre non-stop action involving a bunch of non descript boring one dimensional characters. 

I do really hope that Black Library only use their best authors in future on this series (Dan, Graham and James so far). On that note I’m really looking forward the First Heretic by Aaron Dembski-Bowden. I’ve yet to read one of his books but they all seem to get fantasitc reviews and his blog is great. I will be purchasing soon. 
Any thoughts on all that guys.


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## donskar (Apr 8, 2010)

Just a quick note on Fallen Angels. I remember it was one of the lesser books in the series. No writer ever sees his words in print exactly as he wrote them. There is always an editor involved, who is responsible for grammar, diction, consistency and fact-checking (among other things). The blame for the errors you cite must be shared between writer and editor.


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## World Eater XII (Dec 12, 2008)

I thought the follow up to fallen angels, descent of angels was cracking. Some very good twists and a fantastic ending!


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## Baron Spikey (Mar 26, 2008)

World Eater XII said:


> I thought the follow up to fallen angels, descent of angels was cracking. Some very good twists and a fantastic ending!


Just because I'm a pedantic bastard- _Fallen Angels_ is the follow up to _Descent of Angels_.


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## World Eater XII (Dec 12, 2008)

fuck...i had a bad feeling i was had em wrong way round! Descent of angels is a cool name though!


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## FORTHELION (Nov 21, 2009)

Call of the lion, i dont remember that book, could you tell me where you got it and who wrote it? I wouldnt mind getting it myself.

Ooops never mind i did read it, it was in tales of heresey

Oh and i have to say i thought decent of angels was pretty shit but fallen angels was a cracker of a book which really sets up for the final book of the trilogy.


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## Child-of-the-Emperor (Feb 22, 2009)

I have to agree with you _mal310_, _Legion_ and _Horus Rising_ are also my two favourite Heresy novels by far. I don't however share your apparent disgust of _Fallen Angels_, it was okay in my opinion - neither fantastic nor rubbish, but what I will say is that it was an enjoyable read, as is the whole Heresy series bar one (guess which one im referring to!).

I too thought that _Galaxy in Flames_ was a poor conclusion to the opening trilogy (_Horus Rising_ which was fantastic, and _False Gods_ which was decent), maybe its just Ben Counter that im not a fan of, because the calm, calculated, brilliant tactician that was Warmaster Horus, turned into a cartoon villain. I thought his portrayal in the third novel was not justifiable at all.

Theres really only two novels out of the series so far that im not a fan off, one of them I detest (and their both by the same author... Im glad hes now off the HH team). The rest have been good and interesting reads with a few utterly fantastic additions thrown in. Overall though a highly enjoyable series, and I find myself as excited as a 8 year old about to go to Disneyland when a new novel is released.


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## Lord of the Night (Nov 18, 2009)

Child-of-the-Emperor said:


> Overall though a highly enjoyable series, and I find myself as excited as a 8 year old about to go to Disneyland when a new novel is released. [


Well then your next trip is only a few weeks off. Nemesis will be released very soon and I cannot wait for it, after what James Swallow told us in The Bolthole about an Assassin who is going to kill the Emperor, he will be nothing short of a monster. And I can't wait to see what he's like.

Personally my favourites are _A Thousand Sons_ and _Fulgrim_, both of those were sheer triumphs of literature. _A Thousand Sons_ is the best Horus Heresy book and probably will be for some time, and _Fulgrim_ is a close second or third, depending on where _Legion_ goes in that ranking.


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## Baron Spikey (Mar 26, 2008)

The _Nemesis_ extract in the BL preview Catalogue (May-August) was cool, apparently it's a team of assassins sent under order by the Emperor led by a Vindicare.


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## Child-of-the-Emperor (Feb 22, 2009)

Yeah, have you read the other extract online as well?


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## CursedUNTILLDEATH (Apr 25, 2010)

Galxey in flames, fulgrim,thousand sons are my favorites. Looking forward to The first heritic and nemesis looks intersesting. hopfully we will get to see something about peutrbo and i would love to have something on Dorn sometime. as for the dark angels books i thought they did a good job of making El'johnson look like a human in a primarchs body other then one who is sure of himself all the time. He made mistakes and that came back to haunt him (i hate him and his legion almost much as the ultrasmurfs by the way). Other then that they are a little off at spots but not terrible. We also need a book that gives us a indepth look at the emporer...dont tell me that wouldnt be awesome.


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## Baron Spikey (Mar 26, 2008)

Child-of-the-Emperor said:


> Yeah, have you read the other extract online as well?


I got it mixed up- the Vindicare extract is the BL one, the catalogue extract is from the Sons of Horus view point when Erebus suggests to Sedirae that they send their own assassin (without informing Horus of the plan).


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## World Eater XII (Dec 12, 2008)

I think a ultra smurf and DA book would be funny. I dont think ive ever heard those to legions fight together!


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## bobss (May 18, 2008)

_Nemesis_ is set to be certainly intruiging, and sating various fetishes for Assassin`s to some. Also, various characters from the Original Trilogy; such as Luc Sedirae are set to return, along with the famous Callidus M`shen, though only a brief mention for the latter.

Im currently reading _Descent of Angels_, and admittedly it is neither as well wrote as _Horus Rising _or_ False Gods_, as jaw-breakingly slaughterous as_ Galaxy in Flames_ and _Fulgrim_, or as emotive (Terra-rise on Luna... glorious....) as _The Flight of the Eisenstein_, it still portrays the Lion to an acceptable standard, and its perspective is of moderate interest. _Fallen Angels _is next to my list, as I chat to Mike Lee occasionaly, enjoying his fluid style of writing in comparisson to the more description/characterisation heavy approach of the Dan Abnett and Graham McNeil.

As for _Battle for the Abyss _(which will inevitably be ridiculed/belittled/mocked upon Heresy no matter the context) I am yet to read it, although after _Galaxy in Flames_, I confess that Mr. Counter can deliver within various aspects unlike any other. One example is his ability to detail action, only inferior to McNeil and possibly Abnett. Amongst a plethora fantastic novels that plunge us into depths of emotional-reflection and ponder, and supreme character-development, I occassionally want ''Shit-to-die'', and Counter does this excellently and offers us a brief, enjoyable and simple respite from the more weighty and excellence-incarnate stuff from the others.


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## World Eater XII (Dec 12, 2008)

Battle for the abyss does just seem like its sunday afternoon cartoon. 

The word bearers in it were pretty fucked up...by the word, have you heard the word? about the word? because by the word the word shall be worded.


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## dark angel (Jun 11, 2008)

I loved Battle for the Abyss when I was re-reading it a few weeks ago. Easily one of the best Horus Heresy novels in my opinion, cliched plot aside. But then again, what novels now are not cliched?


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## World Eater XII (Dec 12, 2008)

True, i enjoyed all the world eater parts, hell they the only parts i read! 

I think what bugged me about the book was just how the word bearers were over simplified!


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## Child-of-the-Emperor (Feb 22, 2009)

dark angel said:


> But then again, what novels now are not cliched?


Quite a few I would say. 



World Eater XII said:


> I think what bugged me about the book was just how the word bearers were over simplified!


Thats the main thing that gets me so rattled up about it aswell. Ben Counter seems unable to develop any kind of intricacy with his 'bad guys'. Its similar to how he portrays Warmaster Horus in _Galaxy in Flames_. His novels just seem so black and white/good vs evil and very basic in my opinion.


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## World Eater XII (Dec 12, 2008)

Which in some cases is a nice change!


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## bobss (May 18, 2008)

Child-of-the-Emperor said:


> Quite a few I would say.
> 
> 
> 
> Thats the main thing that gets me so rattled up about it aswell. Ben Counter seems unable to develop any kind of intricacy with his 'bad guys'. Its similar to how he portrays Warmaster Horus in _Galaxy in Flames_. His novels just seem so black and white/good vs evil and very basic in my opinion.


Gaunt`s Ghosts are highly cliched, and yet Gaunt and the Tanith First-and-Only are perhaps the best characters, within one of the best series Black Library has ever- and still continues to publish. 

Onto the latter point: lets be realistic here. This is not Dan Abnett, we are not going to tear out our hearts for Counter`s characters are we? One anomalae to that is the continued portrayel of Torgaddon and especially Tarvitz in _Galaxy in Flames _which left me somewhat upset with both their deaths after a truly excellent continuation from _False-Gods_, of the Luna-Wolf joker and the subtle Emperors-Children line-officer. 

The point is- well, what even was the original point of this thread?... Oh, _Nemesis_. Well, having read the extract from the pamphlet, and Erebus` portrayel is delicious, ''If a tactic can be used _against_ us, it can be used by us''


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## Child-of-the-Emperor (Feb 22, 2009)

bobss said:


> Onto the latter point: lets be realistic here. This is not Dan Abnett, we are not going to tear out our hearts for Counter`s characters are we?


I don't think thats the point. Warmaster Horus went from being the calm, calculated, god-like warrior-lord in _Horus Rising_ to being pathetic and subject to the laws of cartoon villains in _Galaxy in Flames_. His quest to turn against the Emperor and supplant him shouldn't have made him idiotic, he was still the genius we knew from _Horus Rising_, just with different motives and perhaps a darker character.

A much worse crime was committed with the Word Bearers in _Battle for the Abyss_ though, something which I have every confidence will be remedied with _The First Heretic_.



bobss said:


> The point is- well, what even was the original point of this thread?...


Beats me. :biggrin:



bobss said:


> Oh, _Nemesis_. Well, having read the extract from the pamphlet, and Erebus` portrayel is delicious, ''If a tactic can be used _against_ us, it can be used by us''


Indeed. I also enjoyed the second extract which introduced the Vindicare Assassin. Im looking forward to _Nemesis_.


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## World Eater XII (Dec 12, 2008)

Hopefully nemesis will be qiute intrigiung, specially with shape shifting assassins lol!


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## Baron Spikey (Mar 26, 2008)

World Eater XII said:


> Hopefully nemesis will be qiute intrigiung, specially with shape shifting assassins lol!


Well from the extract I'm thinknig there might be an assassin from every temple in the team- that should be interesting especially since we'll find out about the temples other than the 4 we know (the extract including the Vindicare had another assassin in it from a rival temple- the Vanus).


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## Lord of the Night (Nov 18, 2009)

James Swallow said that every Assassin temple, although the word temple isn't used in _Nemesis_, will be featured in the novel. And there will be a special Chaos Assassin that apparantely is strong enough to kill The Emperor. Wonder what he's like.

So we can expect to see Vindicare, Callidus, Eversor, Culexes and Vanus in _Nemesis_, and some brand new temples with brand new types of Assassins.


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## Child-of-the-Emperor (Feb 22, 2009)

Lord of the Night said:


> And there will be a special Chaos Assassin that apparantely is strong enough to kill The Emperor. Wonder what he's like.


Thats the main thing thats got me intrigued. James Swallow was giving nothing away over on the Bolthole, what kind of entity/individual is strong enough to take out the Emperor? And I wonder how far he gets?


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## Lord of the Night (Nov 18, 2009)

One bit thats a shame is that we do know that neither the Imperial Assassin Kill-team or the Chaos Assassin will complete their missions, but two things do salvage that. How far will they get, as CotE said, and what will they do to succeed in another way.


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## bobss (May 18, 2008)

Child-of-the-Emperor said:


> Thats the main thing thats got me intrigued. James Swallow was giving nothing away over on the Bolthole, what kind of entity/individual is strong enough to take out the Emperor? And I wonder how far he gets?


Daemon. There are Daemons within _Nemesis_, It involves much more than Erebus whimsically cavorting with Warp-Xenos. 



Child-of-the-Emperor said:


> I don't think that’s the point. Warmaster Horus went from being the calm, calculated, god-like warrior-lord in _Horus Rising _to being pathetic and subject to the laws of cartoon villains in Galaxy in Flames. His quest to turn against the Emperor and supplant him shouldn't have made him idiotic, he was still the genius we knew from Horus Rising, just with different motives and perhaps a darker character.


I will confront both of these issues within the confines of this single thread. To begin I do believe you’re a hypocrite sir. Your infatuation with one Aaron-Dembski-Bowden and your utter contempt to another Ben Counter traverses the realm of pure contradiction. Fortunately I have a far blunter axe to grind for Lord of the Night, so not all is directed at you, Child.

I _enjoyed _ Soul Hunter, and _adored_ Helsreach. Both terms are born from my opinion and the expression of pleasant emotions during the reading and direct-aftermath of such book and novel. I liked the flair they contained, the humour they hold and the fast-paced they revolve around. I will not take enjoyment in tearing these apart, and souring my recollection of them, but feel it is necessary to eternally cleanse the fog between Myself, Dark Angel and the rest of you. 

Ben Counter lacks depth for his characters, you say? Horus is but a babbling spool, and more akin to an alabaster Ork impregnated into antique Power-Armour. Correct, and exempt from the manifestation of that rather random Orkish metaphor I myself seem to have conjured, you are generally correct. I don`t read anything with Ben Counter`s name detailed upon the front in tight, capital script for the emotionally-depthful characters, dark-humour borne from the slaughterous Galaxy or characters who will bring tears to me once they are torn apart by Daemons. I read it for the description in places, themes and fundamentally the pure butchery within his words. You may throw the ''But you merely seek action, nothing more depthful'' card, but considering the sheer amount of Robin Hobb, Anne McCaffrey and Iran Irvine I had read, it destroys such a ploy instantaneously.

You and Lord of the Night bequeathed the excellence that is 10th Company. Really? A rather succinct, boring and typically unlikable Dak`ir of the Night Lords, a babbling -- Khorne worshipping, and thus fundamentally shallow -- bloody-minded character, a Pre-Heresy Lucius clone, and a Naval-strategist with ungodly control of the Tzeentchain daemon within him, do not cut excellence. They do not bombard Counter into ruination, nor do they escape the shadow cast by Abnett and McNeil. Grimaldus is barely acceptable due to the mediocre input of a first-person narrative, and various, minor differences aside, there is the ever-clichéd, ever-present Lucius-clone, and the self-doubting Apothecary that is seriously lacking to Fugis from _Salamander_.

So whilst were verbally-flaying _Soul Hunter _and _Helsreach_, how about things are done proper? Action. The defining device and the epitome of Black Libraries output into the Sci-Fi genre. Counter is moderate at this, with the Ordo Malleus, Drop-Pod assault on Khorian IX fantastic. When has ADB ever show anything resembling more than half-a dozen pages of action, in which the cacophonous ringing of steel and smell of blood that McNeil is the master at, present? Soul Hunter... the attack on Crythe-Prime by Drop-Pods into Skitarii was too short. The Black Legions assault upon Seventeen-seventeen amongst an entire Titan-Legion facing the Legio Mortis is given a solitary line, the main assault upon the walls of Helsreach is _epic_ but too small, the fall of the wall to the Hive isn`t even detailed, the numerous Titan-duels by Stormherald against Ork scrap-Titans are poor, short and frankly nothing to that of _Titanicus_, the Sisters of Battle, Steel Legionaries and Black Templars during the finale barely fight at all, and the Ordinatus Oberon destroying the Godbreaker is but a mere trio of sentences. I cant wait for ADB to produce something with not the promise of slaughter but actual, bolter-round by bolter-round coverage.

ADB`s Guard are fantastic. Andrej will always be amongst Tarvitz and Torgaddon and Vespasian to me; but I honestly believe he cannot write Astartes. I will hold from sealing such a statement until The First Heretic, but boy does he have a challenge to match up to Anthony Reynolds, although frankly a picture of Uriel Ventris and Honsou partying would rectify McNeil as an inferior author to the rest of you.

I do not hate the author, I like his flair, and his new input, and certainly enjoy his fiction (though I also enjoy Pornography but is that not clichéd?) I don’t savour pissing on the bonfire that you all continue to heap upon, but frankly every author needs a few Bobss` or Dark Angel`s to rein in their flattery by drooling, awe-struck fans. But realistically guys, you are so bias so you cannot see it. I won`t rank Ploss in this, because to his credit he still retains his neutral-opinion and I find his reviews far more interesting and fundamentally fair, but Lord of the Night... you give _Helsreach_ 10/10.... you put *this* in the league of _Horus Rising_, _Fulgrim_, _A Thousand Sons_, _Storm of Iron _and_ Eisenhorn_... its beyond amusing, it really is. There is no feasible way you can place a Space Marine Battle novel (as pleasantly surprised as I was to _Helsreach_) in comparisson to the higher-echelons of the Horus Heresy or the famous Omnibus`s of Abnett. It’s an utter joke.

I loathe to use such terms as ''arse-licker'' though I undoubtedly believe Dark Angel will not show such restraint, but I just think that there is such an injustice on this site nowadays; Maybe if Gav Thorpe or Graham McNeil came here, I would be *reduced* to this, but I like to think not....


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## Lord of the Night (Nov 18, 2009)

I see. I will now give my counter to this.

I have never said anything against Ben Counter. I very much enjoy his work, _Soul Drinkers_ and _Grey Knights_ are both excellent and _Daemon World_ will always be one of my favourite novels. And _Galaxy in Flames_ was quite good and I did not notice a real difference with Horus, at least not one that could ruin the novel for me, the death of Tarik Torgaddon was enough to make me hold off reading it, I just couldn't bear to read that part. I have not read _Battle for the Abyss_ yet, once I get around to it I will address my opinion on it. Personally from what I have read I think ill like it, but ive been wrong before. We shall see.

Talos is more then Dak'ir, his depths of revenge and loyalty to his Legion are very interesting. Uzas is a bit of a typical Khornate marine but there has only been one book, give him time to grow more. I think Uzas will become a very much bigger part of the series. I am not sure who the Lucius-clone is so im going to guess Xarl, I dont see any comparisons between Xarl and Lucius besides their hatred of weakness and if we compared all marines by that then every single one would be the same. And The Exalted does not control the Daemon in him, he has already lost the battle. The Daemon is controlling him.

Counter is good at action, the Soul Drinkers assaulting Ve'Meths beachhead was a great scene and three-hundred Grey Knights attacking a Daemon World is pure epicness. However ADB made it very clear that Crythe would not be the focus of the novel, it would be the background. Perhaps a bit more of the battle could have been shown but too much and it would become just another battle novel, _Soul Hunter_ was more then that. It was based around the Night Lords Legion, not the Battle for Crythe. As for _Helsreach_ I thought the battles were portrayed quite well, enough was shown to give off the depth. And the Ordinatus Oberon was quite a good scene, the death of Godbreaker made so easily shows the power of Oberon. I personally imagined the shell of Oberon punching into the Gargant's head and it exploding violently in an instant. Short but good because it shows that this mighty scrap-titan is nothing to Oberon. The Sisters of Battle should have gotten more fighting but the Guardsmen and Black Templars got plenty of battle action.

I have never said that McNeill is inferior. If anything I believe he is the true king of Black Library and not Dan Abnett. McNeill wrote _A Thousand Sons_ and _Ultramarines_, _A Thousand Sons_ is my favourite heresy book and _Ultramarines_ was the first full series I ever bought. Both are favourites of mine and I also have the limited _Iron Warrior_ novella by McNeill which cost me £40, not an amount i'd spend on an inferior author.

...I will admit that 10/10 for _Helsreach_ was over the top. I had just finished _Helsreach_ when I wrote it and I was still coming down from reading it, given some time to have perspective on it i'd say _Helsreach_ earns either a 7 or an 8. And I would never rank Helsreach among the Horus Heresy giants that are _Fulgrim_, _Legion_ and _A Thousand Sons_. They are in a whole different league, its called 30k. I believe that 30k and 40k novels are entirely different things because nearly everything is different in them, so they can't be judged by the same standards. You can't say thats the 40k universe we all love about a Horus Heresy novel because its totally different, theres no God-Emperor yet, theres no Tyranid Hive Fleets or Necrons or Tau Empire. I use different standards for these novels when I rank them. _Soul Hunter_ however I stand by my 10/10 for an extremely well-written novel and very likeable characters.

Now it looks like I must give the full article on this one. *Never* call me an ass-licker. I *do not* spare feelings when I talk about anything. I do not lie about my opinion and I dont allow enjoying one thing to influence another. If ADB, Counter or McNeill come on this site I will give them props for what they have done, but if they do something I dont like I wont hesitate to tell them. When _The First Heretic_ and _Blood Reaver_ are released I will buy them immediately, if I like them I will give ADB a good review and tell him to keep up the good work... and if I dont like it ill tell him to go back and re-read his copy of _Soul Hunter_ to see what made it great and what he missed.

I will admit that I have liked every 40k book ive read. I enjoyed the _Blood Angels Omnibus_, the _Deathwatch_ series and I actually liked _Descent of Angels_. However if I come across one I dont like, and I think I have, ill make it very clear. You claim that _Soul Hunter_ lacks battle, read the _Enforcer_ Omnibus. That lacks battle, im five chapters in and theres only been one death of a nameless minor character and one explosion.


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## Child-of-the-Emperor (Feb 22, 2009)

I respect your opinion _bobss_, as I do everyone's. But quite frankly I do rate _Soul Hunter_ as clearly in the top end of BL books, surpassing most of the Heresy series and other 40k novels _in my opinion_. _Lord of the Night_ covered the counter point for _Soul Hunter_ so I won't bother repeating what he said. 

I do refute however you claiming we are 'so biased that we cannot see it'. I have read all of Aaron's Black Library work so far (bar _At Gaius Point_) and quite frankly he is a well needed breath of fresh air into the hallways of the Black Library. Also, why on earth would we be biased? If I didn't like his work I would gladly say so (as I have done with several other authors/novels) whether he is a member on Heresy or not. Anyone active on this BL forum will know that I dislike Ben Counter's work, and I judge it solely based on my opinion of his work - nothing else. As I do with every author. For me, his novels are too basic, misportrayed, lacking in character development and I quite simply just don't enjoy them (although given I havn't read all of his novels). I am obviously entitled to vent my thoughts and feelings here, as is everyone - I like Aaron Dembski-Bowden's work, I dislike Ben Counter's, simple.  - But I honestly fail to see how I am an 'arse-licker' or biased in anyway! Please enlighten me.


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## World Eater XII (Dec 12, 2008)

Maybe the chaos assassin is some bizaare possessed oblit/lashyprince/zerker hybrid? that'd smash up anything


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## Child-of-the-Emperor (Feb 22, 2009)

Maybe! I queried James Swallow on the Bolthole whether or not the Chaos Assassin (if it can indeed be classified as 'Chaos') was a Daemon, and I don't believe I got a straight answer if I remember, hes obviously keeping it a closely guarded secret. 

If its some sort of Daemon though, that means it will need to be sustained in the Material Realm by rituals/incantations and the like, which I can see as being very difficult if this Daemon has to travel to Terra (assuming that is where it intends to strike at the Emperor). Or maybe the attempted assassination of the Emperor will be more subtle? Kind of like a battle of wills from across the galaxy, without the need to be anywhere near Terra? Hmm... Very much looking forward to this. :biggrin:


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## Lord of the Night (Nov 18, 2009)

World Eater XII said:


> Maybe the chaos assassin is some bizaare possessed oblit/lashyprince/zerker hybrid? that'd smash up anything


This is an extremely wild theory. But perhaps its Drach'nyen before he was sealed. He is the only Daemon that could perhaps be a match for The Emperor.


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## World Eater XII (Dec 12, 2008)

Hah and ill take pride in that theory when this P.O.LP.Z hybrid thing, deep strikes, lashes the emp to assault range and then zerker fies him up.


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## Lord of the Night (Nov 18, 2009)

http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/reader/1844168689/ref=sib_dp_pt#reader-page

A new, at least I think its new, _Nemesis_ extract has been released, its not much. Its set from the POV of a Venenum Assassin who is after Horus on the recently conquered world Gyges Prime.


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## dark angel (Jun 11, 2008)

It's good! Interesting to say the least, Devram Korda being included is nice imo. It is a bit of a pointless novel if I am honest though, as we know that it will fail anyway


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## Child-of-the-Emperor (Feb 22, 2009)

dark angel said:


> It's good! Interesting to say the least, Devram Korda being included is nice imo. It is a bit of a pointless novel if I am honest though, as we know that it will fail anyway


Thats like saying the entire Horus Heresy series is pointless because we know what will ultimately happen! 

And nice find _Lord of the Night_, I presume that is the assassin that is foiled by Erebus and Sedirae in the other extract?


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## Lord of the Night (Nov 18, 2009)

Most likely CoTE.


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## bobss (May 18, 2008)

Upon my person as I utter these very words I wield an extract of _Prospero Burns_, yet alas! I cannot decipher the runes upon my printer to show yee such! 

... That said, I doubt you haven`t seen it, especially Child-of-the-Emperor


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## Lord of the Night (Nov 18, 2009)

You have no link for us?!, I must read _Prospero Burns_. I need to fuel my hatred of the Space dogs!


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## bobss (May 18, 2008)

Lord of the Night said:


> You have no link for us?!, I must read _Prospero Burns_. I need to fuel my hatred of the Space dogs!


I don`t have a link, nor do I believe it is even upon the bosom of the internet. No, honestly, with mediocre if-not poor theatrics aside, I honestly have an extract right before me, in a rather old Black Library pamplet from January. I... was kidnapped by aliens (forgot) so I couldn`t show you it!

Upon edit, I used my camera to take pictures isntead. I know they are not the _best_ quality, but I hope you appreciate it, as I - having not read the Space Wolf series - do not really; although it clearly oozes that Norse-theme, and typically of Abnett floats upon a sea of liquid-genius.















































To make reading easier, I believe Dark Angel will copy this into a typed format at a later date; as-soon-as-possible I think.


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## World Eater XII (Dec 12, 2008)

Norse terms galore is an understatement!


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## dark angel (Jun 11, 2008)

The sound of an axe knocking-in is a wet smack of slicing meat and shattering bone, like sapwood being cut. A maul makes a fat, bruising sound like a mattock driving pegs into marsh loam or wet ice. Worse than both of them are the after-sounds. The screaming of the agonised, the ruined and the dying. The begging shrieks of the hurt and maimed. The hacking impacts of death knocking until the fallen stop being alive, or stop trying to rise, or stop screaming, or stop being in once piece. 

Fith had just enough time to get his shirt and loft his axe. Several other hersirs fell to arms with him, and they met the first skirmishers coming in through the walls and window-slits of the settlement, head on. The panic was up already. It was a blind blundering in the dark, a reek of urine, the first nose-fill of smoke. 

Fith’s axe was balanced for a single hand. It was a piece of proper craft, with a high carbon head that weighed as much as a decent newborn baby. From the toe of the blade to the hell of the beard, it had a smile on it wider than a man’s hand-span, and it had kissed a whetstone just the night before. 

The axe was a simple machine, a lever that multiples the force of your arm into the force delivered by the blade. The rudiments apply whether you’re splitting wood or men. 

Fith’s axe was a bone-cutter, a shield-breaker, a helm-cleaver. A cutter of threads. He was a hersir of the Ascommani aett, and he knew how to stand up for his ground. 

It was a throttle-fight in the settlement itself. Fith knocked two Balts back out of the tent wall, but the tight confines were choking his swings. He knew he needed to get out. He yelled to the hersirs with him, and they pulled back. 

They got out of the tents into the settlement yard, wrapped in swirling black smoke, and went eye to eye with the Balts in their spectacle-helms. It was mayhem. A free-for-all. Blades swung like windmills in a storm. 

Fenk went down as a Balt axe split his left calf length-wise. He bawled in rage as his leg gave out, useless. Seconds later, a maul knocked his head sidelong, and snapped his neck and thread and he flopped down on the earth, his shattered skull-bag leaking blood. Fith drove of a Balt with a mattock, scared him back with the circles of his swinging axe.

Gheff tried to cover Fith’s flank, using the basics of shield-wall tactics. Gheff, however, had not had the time to collect a decent shield from the stack, just a tattered practice square from the training field. A Balt spear punctured him right through, and tore him open so thoroughly that his guts flew out onto the snow like spilled sausage ropes. Gheff tried to catch them, as if he could gather them up and put them back inside. They steamed in the spring air. He squealed in dismayed pain. He couldn’t help himself. He knew he was ruined unto death. 

He looked at Fith as he squealed again. It wasn’t the pain. He was so angry he was irreparably dead.

Fith put mercy into his stroke.

Fith felt the red smoke burn up in his head. 

A Balt came at him, silent and intent, and Fith flexed the lever of his axe, and hooked it in, and made a ravine of the Balt’s face. 

Four hersirs left. Fith, Gutthox, Lehn and Brom. No sign of the aett-chief. The chief was probably dead and face down in the snow with his huscarls. 

Fith could smell blood. It was overpoweringly strong, a coppery reek stripping the freezing dawn air. He could smell shit too. He could smell Gheff’s insides. He could smell the inner parts of him: the ruptured stomach, the fat of Gheff’s belly muscles, the heat of his life.

Fith knew it was time to go. 

The Upplander was in the furthest shelter. Even the Ascommani knew to keep him away from people. 

The Upplander was propped against cushions.

‘Listen to me,’ Fith hissed ‘Do you ken me?’

‘I understand you. My translator is working.’ the Upplander replied, looking pale.


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## World Eater XII (Dec 12, 2008)

Ah good effort DA! i think we all might neesd a translator for pospero burns...


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## bobss (May 18, 2008)

World Eater XII said:


> Ah good effort DA! i think we all might neesd a translator for pospero burns...


Before you begin to frett, as I indeed did, I believe this rather ''uneducated'' and base portrayel of the Space Wolves represents them during their time before the enlightenment of the Imperium; similar, although hopefully better, than that attempted in _Descent of Angels_. Though of course, it will be better than the mediocre Knightly Order`s of _Descent of Angels_, the sheer Nordic-terminology and rather bloody-minded approach by the Wolves really adds to the Pre-Great Crusade ''Warrior-Culture''. 

As Dark Angel pointed out, I believe the ''Upplander'' may indeed be the Emperor; and it will be interesting to see how this links into the eventual battle at Prospero. I wonder if it exceed`s the traditional 416-page limit, that McNeil is usually intent of ignoring:laugh:


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## World Eater XII (Dec 12, 2008)

Aye fair point.

I dont think the upplander is the Big E, i dont think he really liked to chill around on cushions or generally looked pale... i maybe be wrong though.


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