# HWS tactics



## sadyn (Jul 29, 2010)

Ok so I am trying to devise tactics to make HWS more useful. First the few advantages of running HWS instead of hiding heavy teams in platoon squads:
1. Fit more heavy teams in List relative to PIS's
2. Bring it down order more effective since its used on 3 teams instead of 1
3. Allows the platoon blob or squads to be more mobile not tied down to a heavy team.

Disadvantages:
1. Survivability much decreased
2. If a HW team is in a platoon blob it allows more friendly models to engage combat b/c of such a large base, the within 2'' rule has its radius increased.


Now the tactic that i am thinking of to have HWS is to basically hide them behind a platoon blob. During the opponents turn i have a 2 rank deep wall of infantry blocking all LOS to the HWS so they cannot be targetted. On my turn, i move the platoon blob 6' to right behin the HWS and then fire them. After i fire, i use run run run to assure a high roll to move the blob back into blocking position.

I basically hide 2HWS and my PCC behind this blob. I take all the heavy teams out of the blob so they are not wasted with all the running and moving. The blob has hidden power weapons depending on the size of the army list. The blob only runs interference and if melee units get close enough they triple tap the lasguns with FRFSRF and then receive the charge.

a 50man blob with 4-5 commissars with all the commissars and sargs holding power weaps costs 500ish points..... not even accounting for the blobs shooting capabilities, this squad can easily beat a 10man terminator assault squad, which is strictly built for melee and costs just slightly less.

thoughts and comments are welcomed and maybe we can brainstorm new and effective ideas.


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## ItsPug (Apr 5, 2009)

In the first example you are wasting the firepower and scoring capabilities of the infantry squads, plus if you get bad run roll you may not end up being able to block the LOS to the HWS even with Move! Move! Move! from the PCS.

Better option would be to include the heavy weapons in the blob squad, firing as normal until they are close (50 is too much btw, try 30-40, although YMMV) and then use the large bases to increase the amount of CC attacks you get when charged (I don't understand why you listed this as a disadvantage) power weapons on the sergeants and commissar and if you feel like it you could maybe take straken for counter attack.


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## The Thunder of KayVaan (Jun 19, 2009)

Umm, About that Move, Move, Move order after you fire your HWS.

Can't do that unless you ordered the HWS first.

Imperial Guard Codex pg. 29 Paragraph 3 in imperial Guard order's section "Orders *Must* be issued at the start of the shooting phase"


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## don_mondo (Jan 28, 2007)

Even a two-deep line of IG in front of the HWS is not likely to comletely block LOS. All I have to see is one foot of one model between the legs of the intervening models and I can shoot them. Using orders on HWS is chancy, given their LD 7, unless you're also going to add a Commissar Lord or Kell to boost the LD they can use for orders. I've pretty much given up on trying to make them useful. Gotta agree with Pug. Three squad blob with three HW Teams, Commissar and sgts with power weapons, and vox.


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## ItsPug (Apr 5, 2009)

The Thunder of KayVaan said:


> Can't do that unless you ordered the HWS first.


Yeah but the CCS orders come first, which should be used on Heavy weapon squads if you have them (bring it down etc) the ones from a PCS are not that great for a HWS. So you'd move the infantry squads, use bring it down or fire on my target on the HWS and then Move! Move! Move! on the infantry squads to put them back into place. Its possible but not really all that effective.


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## jaws900 (May 26, 2010)

and i shoot them with scatter lasers and they die. 5+ armour and instant death (due to S6 weapons agaisnt T3). I would suggest always putting them in a blob. If i do use them i will always have a nice big blob to discrat and i will NEVER put lascannons in that team as they will get killed in seconds. Always Autocannons or Heavy bolters for them.


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## HOBO (Dec 7, 2007)

Another one for embedding HWT's into Platoons as HWS's are too easy to kill - Mech Guard eat them alive due to the abundance of Multi-lasers.
I know Vendettas don't fit easily with Gunline IG but when I see people spending 105 pts on Lascannon HWS's I cry a little...for not that many more points the Gunship is even more of a bargain.


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## sadyn (Jul 29, 2010)

thankyou all for the feedback. First, i put the enabling more cc in disadvantages of having HWS over embedding the teams. And yeah i think i even agree that it makes more sense to put them into the blob.

I am somewhat limited to what i have modelwise for now. I just started my IG army and i have 6 HWT yet only 3ish squads. So i cant field all the HWTs unless im making HWS, just tryin to figure out better ways to use them.

basically i would just move the wall only 3-4inc back and forth from in front of the HWS to behind them, so i think i would be in good shape running them back into position with runrunrun!

I think i can block the HWT with a 2 rank wall. all i have to block is the infantry models on the HWT not the gun or any extraneous parts. This would make me a little more clumped than i would prefer however.

what really sucks is how HWS cant take vox's and i really dont wanna waste points on a lord commissar


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## thisisaguard111 (Oct 20, 2010)

if you take al-rahem the like the wind order is pretty useful as you can shoot then run


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## shaantitus (Aug 3, 2009)

I have had good results with a CCs with creed and kell in with my 2/3 hw squads surrounded by 2x20man blobs. Gives a solid firebase that has worked so far.


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## MaidenManiac (Oct 2, 2008)

don_mondo said:


> ...Using orders on HWS is chancy, given their LD 7, unless you're also going to add a Commissar Lord...


This is the solution to the problem. The Commisar Lord doesnt need to be in the unit, just within 6 of them for a rather polite LD10 for orders. With some cleaver placement of the CL in a normal guard unit nearby he should be able to give all your HWTs proper LD and make them useful.
This is probably mandatory for making HWTs worthwhile in the first place.

My local IG player have perfected that art quite well. It doesnt give them more survivability, just more reliability, so the problem of S6 guns killing them will naturally remain...

Survival chances are the flaw that one really cant help HWTs with very much. The only thing that we have come up there is placing them behind a vehicle wall if you go second. If going first its not that much of an issue, guns will be blazing until you die! Coversave or not, folks will shoot them, so the only reliable thing is taking away folks chances of shooting them in the first place...


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## Widowmaker666 (Jul 30, 2008)

Take a chimaira for one of the blob squads and deploy it right next to the HWS, first turn jump into the chimaira and zoom off up to 12" into a good firing position, it wastes one turn on shooting but it affords protection, extra fire from the multi-laser and heavy-bolter and the ability to redeploy easily


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## bishop5 (Jan 28, 2008)

Widowmaker666 said:


> Take a chimaira for one of the blob squads and deploy it right next to the HWS, first turn jump into the chimaira and zoom off up to 12" into a good firing position, it wastes one turn on shooting but it affords protection, extra fire from the multi-laser and heavy-bolter and the ability to redeploy easily


I'm still unsure if all three squads can fire out the back, as it's a 5-model limit?


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## don_mondo (Jan 28, 2007)

bishop5 said:


> I'm still unsure if all three squads can fire out the back, as it's a 5-model limit?


Well, first of all, only one squad can get into the Chimera. And since the squad only consists of three 2-wound models, yes, all three HWs can indeed fire out the hatch.


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## Karnox (Feb 27, 2010)

pity you cant mount them in a chimera =/


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