# Are Flash gits a good heavy support?



## kell111 (Jul 31, 2011)

I love the flash gits in the Codex and they have always been an interest of mine since I even heard of them. I like them but haven't gotten to play them allot so don't know how effective they are and was wondering if they were good tactics wise and if they can be competitive? Please give me some advise on them for I really do like them.


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## Boc (Mar 19, 2010)

Moved to Tactics forum.

Apologies for the delay.


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## Sakura_ninja (Apr 29, 2012)

I don't know allot about them, but rarely see them mentioned.

But if they interest you and you like them just take a unit regardless


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## Madden (Jan 22, 2012)

There really in the wrong slot I see them more as an close range fire support unit (should be elite), where as the better heavy shooting goes to lootas (should be heavy), but as said if you enjoy the unit and like the look go for it.


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## mcmuffin (Mar 1, 2009)

They are horrendous, lootas do their job better in every way.


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## Sakura_ninja (Apr 29, 2012)

mcmuffin said:


> They are horrendous, lootas do their job better in every way.


but then they aren't flash gits, so that's not allot of use to somebody who would like to use them.


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## mcmuffin (Mar 1, 2009)

Sakura_ninja said:


> but then they aren't flash gits, so that's not allot of use to somebody who would like to use them.


Well dip me in dog shit, we have a proper Sherlock Holmes in the thread!


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## Fallen (Oct 7, 2008)

competitively no Flash Gits suck in every way. and as mentioned before Lootas do the job 300% better.

there isnt really any good tactics for them because they just cannot be accountable for anything (variable AP, shots, terrible BS, etc)


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## Sakura_ninja (Apr 29, 2012)

mcmuffin said:


> Well dip me in dog shit, we have a proper Sherlock Holmes in the thread!


Your powers of deduction are exemplary, now why don't you say something useful, like how to use flash gits effectively despite being a weak choice?, or is that actually to difficult because it involves tactics and thinking and its easier to make a copy of the stupid defiler thread?

"x is crap, y is better, take y cus I say so".


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## Iron Angel (Aug 2, 2009)

Well, the question posed in the thread title is "Are Flash Gitz a good heavy support", which is a no. I've never seen anyone use them and have heard that they are terrible, and there are better options for heavy support. I have no advice beyond that, unfortunately. You could use some Flash Gitz _as_ Lootas though, I mean, its Orks. Pretty much anything goes, modeling wise.


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## Sakura_ninja (Apr 29, 2012)

Iron Angel said:


> Well, the question posed in the thread title is "Are Flash Gitz a good heavy support", which is a no. I've never seen anyone use them and have heard that they are terrible, and there are better options for heavy support. I have no advice beyond that, unfortunately. You could use some Flash Gitz _as_ Lootas though, I mean, its Orks. Pretty much anything goes, modeling wise.


That's what the title says but does anyone give a shit about the post under it?, I am guessing no.
"i love the flash gits in the codex"
"give me advice for I do like them"

If I did orks I would also be interested in them, but not interested in shitty comments on how much they suck.

It the whole point of the forums tactics section is to come along and say
"that is shit, because I said so and I refuse to give good advice because I don't have to"
Then what the Hell is the point in TACTICS?


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## Iron Angel (Aug 2, 2009)

I suppose the best thing to really ask is whether OP likes Flash Gitz because he thinks the models are great, or because he thinks the fluff is great?

Trick question, it doesn't matter. You can use your Flash Gitz models as Lootas, and give them appropriate fluff.

However, if he like Flash Gitz because of their rules, that will make them harder to shoehorn into another unit's place. But then, its not the end of the world if you take a unit of Flash Gitz just for the hell of it. If you want to do it, do so.


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## Zer0 (Jan 13, 2009)

Flash Gitz can do a lot of things, but none of them well and are expensive. They have the stats of Nobz, but none of the close combat options. The can shoot, but don't have the volume or range of Lootas. Their guns are higher than normal strength, but not by much, are only assault 1 and you can't rely on their AP. You can mitigate these problems by paying for upgrades, but now they're more expensive and not much better.

If you do want to use them, give them a painboy and cybork bodies to make them more survivable, throw them in a battlewagon so they can get in range and use them to soften-up units before charging them.


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## Sakura_ninja (Apr 29, 2012)

Zero you may be responsible for posting the first ever tactic in the tactic forum...can the server handle this?, or do we balance it out with more X sucks crap?


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## Zer0 (Jan 13, 2009)

Sakura_ninja said:


> Zero you may be responsible for posting the first ever tactic in the tactic forum...can the server handle this?, or do we balance it out with more X sucks crap?


Maybe. I just like to think that GW doesn't intentionally put sucktastic units in the Codex; just ones that have a very specific niche and instead of just saying "x sucks, take y" you should say "x sucks in general and y is better at doing z, but in case j x has an advantage and here's how you can force j to happen."


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## Sakura_ninja (Apr 29, 2012)

My god, can we have zero as a mod for the tactics area?


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## mcmuffin (Mar 1, 2009)

Sakura_ninja said:


> Your powers of deduction are exemplary, now why don't you say something useful, like how to use flash gits effectively despite being a weak choice?, or is that actually to difficult because it involves tactics and thinking and its easier to make a copy of the stupid defiler thread?
> 
> "x is crap, y is better, take y cus I say so".


Good tactics involve using the best units, maybe you should consider that? But derp away, i don't give a shit


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## Sakura_ninja (Apr 29, 2012)

mcmuffin said:


> Good tactics involve using the best units, maybe you should consider that? But derp away, i don't give a shit


Tacticians make the best with what they have, do you think back in WWII allied commanders had a choice of what they had?, if they were given shermans they didn't bitch that another tank was better and refuse to use them, they got on with it and used there brains to win with what they had at there disposal.

Do you think patton won against rommel and his superior equipment by replacing all his shermans with pershings?

Do you think the British got a victory at taranto by bitching that the swordfish was crap and would only use the avenger?

Do you think the British won at waterloo by fielding only the best guard units available and refusing to use fresh recruits and new officers?

Do I need go on?


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## Zer0 (Jan 13, 2009)

mcmuffin said:


> Good tactics involve using the best units, maybe you should consider that? But derp away, i don't give a shit


We did consider that. The OP wants to know if there are tactics to use with Flash Gitz to make them competative. The answers have been 'not really, but if you insist . . .".

If someone asked "I'm thinking of using Gitz for a tournament, is this a good idea?' then the answer would be 'No, Lootaz are better." But that's not what was asked!


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## Ravner298 (Jun 3, 2011)

> I like them but haven't gotten to play them allot so don't know how effective they are and was wondering if they were good tactics wise and if they can be competitive?


The question that was asked, was answered. Validly answered by competitve players, and they even added their suggestions in for lootas as as replacement, or 'count as' flash gitz with loota statlines. I personally have never seen flash gitz on the table, for the exact reasons mentioned above.



> Zero you may be responsible for posting the first ever tactic in the tactic forum...can the server handle this?, or do we balance it out with more X sucks crap?


Every thread you speak up in you rub people the wrong way while contributing absolutely nothing. He came for advice from a competitve stand point and he got it. You seem to have a violent reaction to competitive viewpoints (and the players that share them), which is ironic because that's exactly what the OP was asking about. If you have a problem with competitive players giving their opinions on whats good and bad, just stay out of the thread or keep your mouth shut. You might even learn a thing or two.


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## Zer0 (Jan 13, 2009)

I think we should just chill-out until the OP gets back to us.



Ravner298 said:


> Every thread you speak up in you rub people the wrong way while contributing absolutely nothing. He came for advice from a competitve stand point and he got it. You seem to have a violent reaction to competitive viewpoints (and the players that share them), which is ironic because that's exactly what the OP was asking about. If you have a problem with competitive players giving their opinions on whats good and bad, just stay out of the thread or keep your mouth shut. You might even learn a thing or two.


Is that directed at me or Sakura_Ninja? Because I don't think I've had a violent reaction and, in Ninja's defense, another user did direct some hostile language at him first.


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## Sakura_ninja (Apr 29, 2012)

Ravner298 said:


> Every thread you speak up in you rub people the wrong way while contributing absolutely nothing. He came for advice from a competitve stand point and he got it. You seem to have a violent reaction to competitive viewpoints (and the players that share them), which is ironic because that's exactly what the OP was asking about. If you have a problem with competitive players giving their opinions on whats good and bad, just stay out of the thread or keep your mouth shut. You might even learn a thing or two.


Isn't this whole section about tactics though?, not just saying x is crap take y, which is all you see over and over and over again, how does anyone learn anything from that except to build a list like everyone else?, where is the individuality?, where is the advice for using x unit other than replace with y?, its boringhammer.

The op asked how to use x in a competetive manner, he did not ask what should he repace x with instead, so why give that advice?, that's the opposite to what was asked and is useless, anyone can read replace x with y, but people want to read use x like this.


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## Ravner298 (Jun 3, 2011)

Of course not you, zero.



> I like them but haven't gotten to play them allot so don't know how effective they are and was wondering if they were good tactics wise and if they can be competitive?


He asked for advise on the unit. Even the title of the thread is "Are flash gits a good heavy support". The answer is a resounding no, because theyre lackluster, overpriced, and arent as good as lootas. If he really likes the unit, he will use it regardless of what is said here as any casual player will do. The keyword in his question was 'competitive', which drew answers from competitive players, and gave me the impression that he was aiming to play competitively. That changes the tone of the thread, in my opinion, entirely. He is asking if they are a good choice for a HS slot to use competitively, he did not say hey, im using flash gitz can you give me some pointers on how to maximize their efficiency. He simply asked if they were good because he liked them.


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## HOGGLORD (Jan 25, 2012)

Give them all the upgrades for their guns and use them to support boyz squads and remove tougher units, they are good termie hunters. Flash Gitz are like shoota boyz, only tougher, with better guns and awesome fluff but can't take objectives.


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## scscofield (May 23, 2011)

Give it up Ravner you won't get past her irrational rage issues at the fact that competitive play style is what dominates a tactics forum. We need to be all fluffy rainbow farting bunnys that play things because they are pretty and give us warm fuzzies, anything that does not support this is met with spaz outs.


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## Sakura_ninja (Apr 29, 2012)

scscofield said:


> Give it up Ravner you won't get past her irrational rage issues at the fact that competitive play style is what dominates a tactics forum. We need to be all fluffy rainbow farting bunnys that play things because they are pretty and give us warm fuzzies, anything that does not support this is met with spaz outs.


If that's what you think.

Your wrong of course, and no doubt your aware of that, but your none the less welcome to think that how I think.

I know the image it does give is that I would NEVER use heresy for advice on my armies when I rebuild them, never ever ever, I don't want my list to be a boring selection of units because they happen to be the only ones you "tactical" people are capable of using.


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## scscofield (May 23, 2011)

Doesn't matter how I think, the fact that you almost rage quit the place shows how it has been going. The OP asked if they were competitive, its been highlighted a few times in this thread. He got a response to that, yes he likes the fluff, he likes the models, he wanted to know if they were effective on a competitive nature. He got a response, and you spazed out.


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## Sakura_ninja (Apr 29, 2012)

scscofield said:


> Doesn't matter how I think, the fact that you almost rage quit the place shows how it has been going. The OP asked if they were competitive, its been highlighted a few times in this thread. He got a response to that, yes he likes the fluff, he likes the models, he wanted to know if they were effective on a competitive nature. He got a response, and you spazed out.


Because the response was the same useless no good bullshit you always get
"they are crap, take lootas"
BOOOOOOOOOOORIIIIIIIIIIIIIING.
and least zero bloody bothered to actually give an idea on how to use them.


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## spanner94ezekiel (Jan 6, 2011)

I don't want to sound offensive, but that is _your_ opinion and other people are entitled to theirs. You just seem to have a knee-jerk reaction every time someone says anything you vaguely disagree with.

OT: I think Flash Gitz are meh as they get outperformed by other units in the HS slot, and there are other units that do their job better i.e. Lootas. Take them if you want by all means, but that's the truth.


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## scscofield (May 23, 2011)

Competitive play is about the most bang for the buck. Fluff, models, all of that matters not. It is has been boiled down to pure math, x is better than y as you stated in some form earlier. The majority of the questions on this forum and the actual list ones are of that nature. They are questions on how to make the army competitive. 

I honestly have no interest in that play style myself. I find it boring and not the way I want to spend my day. It is a play style though, one that at this point drives a good chunk of this hobby. You railing against it on these forums is just going to give you more emotional upset than not. You are the extreme minority in these terms, if you accepted that you would have a less stressful time here.

I will never do a tourny, the lists I play would drive the people that you post against nuts. I play a list that I like to play and it lacks many of the things that good SW lists run. I also can make the mental switch to see the competitive aspect of this game though. I have many posts on the aspects of this game that the competitive people agree and support. This forum is for those types of play style, it is less 'fluff' and more 'math'. 

At the end of the day it is their money and if they are die hard to play that unit they will play it no matter what is said here.


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## Sakura_ninja (Apr 29, 2012)

It's not a knee jerk, its just annoyance, if somebody wants tactics, give tactics, don't just say "replace x with y", that's not tactics, by all means it should be pointed out x is better than y, and a better over all competitive choice, BUT, while your at it give ideas on how to best use x, now that's tactics, and useful even if not to the OP who shockingly may not be the only person who reads these tacticas.

I see so many that are all the same crap over and over again, if I wanted to have someone point out the obvious and not be if any help at all I would go to warseer, as it stands that's about what I can compare most "tactics" here to, a warseer poster.

Give aid on using x, suggest y but don't forget x will probably be the posters primary concern, but they can then choose if they want y instead of x or enjoy the challenge of x.


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## spanner94ezekiel (Jan 6, 2011)

Aye but this the _Army lists_ forum, not the _army tactics_ forum. Subtle difference I know, but hey.


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## scscofield (May 23, 2011)

Then how about you give some of these 'tactics'. I have yet to see a solid post on how to play a unit from you. If you did that you also would have less backlash. Your posts run along the lines of 'No your all dickheads!' but lack any real tactical advice beyond 'Play what you want!'


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## MidnightSun (Feb 10, 2009)

Sakura_ninja said:


> It's not a knee jerk, its just annoyance, if somebody wants tactics, give tactics, don't just say "replace x with y", that's not tactics, by all means it should be pointed out x is better than y, and a better over all competitive choice, BUT, while your at it give ideas on how to best use x, now that's tactics, and useful even if not to the OP who shockingly may not be the only person who reads these tacticas.


But the _only_ good use for Flash Gitz is as counts-as Lootas. What's the best tactic for them to use? Well, it's shooting with Str 6 and 2 shots each... wait, don't Lootas get that? Well, Gitz get their random AP... wait, half the time that's equal to or worse than Lootas. Well, at least they have a better range than most Ork guns... except Deffguns.

List-building is equally important as generalship, if not moreso. A good general with a bad list can beat a bad general with a good list, but a good general with a good list will beat another good general with a bad list.

Flash Gitz are awesome in Dawn of War (the computer game), but suck in tabletop. They cost far too much for too little.

'Boring' armies are subjective. Personally, I think that my Lash Sorceror, Winged Warptime Prince, and their MSU CSM army backed up by Obliterators is anything but boring, because I think that having a chance at winning makes a game more interesting. One-sided games are what I think are boring.



HOGGLORD said:


> Give them all the upgrades for their guns and use them to support boyz squads and remove tougher units, they are good termie hunters. Flash Gitz are like shoota boyz, only tougher, with better guns and awesome fluff but can't take objectives.


No they aren't. They lack the single primary advantage of Shoota Boyz - throwing down 60 shots per turn. They're far too expensive. They don't 'kill Terminators' - they have a 1/3 chance to get their guns to AP 2 or less (slightly higher chance if you take Blastas, but now you're wounding yourself 50% as often as you hit something). After 5++ saves, the Terminators will kill you horribly with their accurate, reliable Storm Bolters and Cyclone Missile Launchers/Assault Cannons and their killy Power Fists. If they're Assault Terminators, they'll simply laugh off your puny attempts at shooting them and then mash you into a paste with their Thunder Hammers.


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## Sakura_ninja (Apr 29, 2012)

I would think army lists, tactics, kinda combined really, but more concentrated on an army not individual units.

I don't bother posting tactics I have no codex for but have an interest in, and feel around here it would be as much use as a chocolate fire guard.
But as a player (or restarting) if I asked on here "how do I best use the legion of the damned in competitive ways as I like the models, but want to still use them well" I would be sick and pissed if all I got was "don't use them, use hammer shield terminators" and that's it, no advice on my stated unit.

How is that useful to me?


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## scscofield (May 23, 2011)

Last post I will make on this. 

If you do not have any of this 'advice' or 'tactics' that you are wanting posted, find it and post it here for them. Do not come into a thread and do what you are doing now. You have monkeyfucked the majority of the threads you post on in these lists because of the way you post. It is the reason you were getting compared to a ex member until the mods got tired of it. 

If you didn't catch it.

Either post the information you are wanting them to see or shut the fuck up. 

'If any mods are wanting to slap me down for this I accept it. I most likely have stepped over the line on this but I am tired of her crap. She has derailed a large pile of threads that more likely or not in the long run would have gotten to what she is demanding. She does not make these threads any better, she causes them to spiral to shit' If she actually bothered to dig some of this information that she is always screaming about up or even half assed googled and then posted the link I wouldn't care.'

::wanders off to other threads and accepts whatever will come of this::


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## MidnightSun (Feb 10, 2009)

Sakura_ninja said:


> I asked on here "how do I best use the legion of the damned in competitive ways as I like the models, but want to still use them well" I would be sick and pissed if all I got was "don't use them, use hammer shield terminators" and that's it, no advice on my stated unit.
> 
> How is that useful to me?


Using Legion of the Damned in a competitive way?

Sorry, the two don't go together. You take Legion and bone yourself, or you take Sternguard or Hammernators for cheaper and you don't. Your choice.

Competitive armies just don't take certain units, by their definition. Look at the lists people took to the Grand Tournament, Throne of Skulls, Ard Boyz, Centurion, or NOVA. Find me a list that did respectably with Vespid, or Possessed, or Flash Gits. It doesn't happen - competitive armies choose different builds. For older books, it's more limited - Tau and Eldar have very few viable lists. Dark Eldar and Grey Knights and Imperial Guard have more than one. That's just the way it works.

Midnight


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## Iron Angel (Aug 2, 2009)

Guys? Can we not shit this thread up with your bullshit argument over what is and is not acceptable advice?


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## Sakura_ninja (Apr 29, 2012)

MidnightSun said:


> Using Legion of the Damned in a competitive way?
> 
> Sorry, the two don't go together. You take Legion and bone yourself, or you take Sternguard or Hammernators for cheaper and you don't. Your choice.


Point proven.
Tactics given on using unit 0
Helpful advice given 0

Some useless inbred moron chewing on his toes at warseer could of told me that, even I knew that, but its not what I asked is it, nothing is straight up uncompetitive, lots of choices are weaker, nothing is useless, you ask for help using x your ignored and told to use y, amazing.


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## khrone forever (Dec 13, 2010)

Sakura_ninja said:


> Point proven.
> Tactics given on using unit 0
> Helpful advice given 0
> 
> Some useless inbred moron chewing on his toes at warseer could of told me that, even I knew that, but its not what I asked is it, nothing is straight up uncompetitive, lots of choices are weaker, nothing is useless, you ask for help using x your ignored and told to use y, amazing.


pot calling kettle black, or in other words you filthy hypocrite 

in all your posts in the tactics/army list forums i have seen not one iota of fucking advice on the list given, if you dont have anything to say except whine like a little girl about the competitive environment then dont fucking post anything


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## HOGGLORD (Jan 25, 2012)

MidnightSun said:


> 'Boring' armies are subjective. Personally, I think that my Lash Sorceror, Winged Warptime Prince, and their MSU CSM army backed up by Obliterators is anything but boring, because I think that having a chance at winning makes a game more interesting. One-sided games are what I think are boring.


Ok, fair enough, I know as well as anyone how boring one-sided games can be, but at the same time just pounding your opponent into the ground with a vastly superior list is just as one-sided. I have had games where I flattened my enemy, tabling them in 2-3 turns, it was ok, and we had a laugh about his poor luck, but it wasn't that much fun for either, then I had games where it was very close, lasting until the very last moments of the game, then when I lost or won I had huge amounts of fun. It all depends on what level of opponent you have.
I do feel that just telling someone that a unit is bad is unhelpful. If I asked, theoreticaly, what the best way to use Huron Blackheart is, I wouldn't want to hear that he is crap and a DP with lash is infinately better. It is better, but I wanted to know about Huron, what he's good at, what he shouldn't be fielded for, what squads are best to put him in etc.


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## Sakura_ninja (Apr 29, 2012)

HOGGLORD said:


> I do feel that just telling someone that a unit is bad is unhelpful. If I asked, theoreticaly, what the best way to use Huron Blackheart is, I wouldn't want to hear that he is crap and a DP with lash is infinately better. It is better, but I wanted to know about Huron, what he's good at, what he shouldn't be fielded for, what squads are best to put him in etc.


Theoretically don't bother asking would be my advice, I wanted to ask about restarting my guard at 1000pts, but I'm not going to, which is a shame as somebody MIGHT have helpful advice, but I'm not gonna bother.


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## Ravner298 (Jun 3, 2011)

> I know the image it does give is that I would NEVER use heresy for advice on my armies when I rebuild them, never ever ever, I don't want my list to be a boring selection of units because they happen to be the only ones you "tactical" people are capable of using.


Heresy has some of the most competitive players and is the best of the forums to come for COMPETITIVE advice and list building. If you want to play casual, why are you reading a tactica forum at all? 



> Because the response was the same useless no good bullshit you always get
> "they are crap, take lootas"


Thats what happens when you ask for COMPETITIVE advice. Sorry its not what you want to hear.



> Point proven.
> Tactics given on using unit 0
> Helpful advice given 0
> 
> Some useless inbred moron chewing on his toes at warseer could of told me that, even I knew that, but its not what I asked is it, nothing is straight up uncompetitive, lots of choices are weaker, nothing is useless, you ask for help using x your ignored and told to use y, amazing.


Ill say it again since you didnt comprehend it the first time it was explained to you. The OP didnt ask for tactics on flash gitz. He asked if they were a good option for COMPETITIVE play. He did not request tactic on using flash gitz. So the origonal question of, 'are they good' was answered, with reasons why and an alternative, more competitive option presented. Never once was this thread derailed. 

The irony of it all is the only person here with warseer calibur posts are you. You're a constant non-contributing thorn in every thread i've seen you in. You admittidly don't even have any input or experience on the thread topic, youre just here because you don't like what was said. The fact that you have the audacity to say heresy is shit for tactics, and that zeros suggestion was the only real tactic on this entire forum that would cause a server crash is spitting in the face of every contributer on here. All of them 100000x more knowledgable than you are. Instead of adding your inexperienced and useless opinion everywhere why dont you just silently read and learn a thing or two about the game.


@hogg


> I do feel that just telling someone that a unit is bad is unhelpful. If I asked, theoreticaly, what the best way to use Huron Blackheart is, I wouldn't want to hear that he is crap and a DP with lash is infinately better. It is better, but I wanted to know about Huron, what he's good at, what he shouldn't be fielded for, what squads are best to put him in etc.


Those threads exist and helpful advice is given. But that isnt the case here. The OP asked if they were a good competitive option, not asking how to use them and for tactica. There's a HUGE difference that is being overlooked. If wrote 'man I love flash gitz, can you tell me some ways to utilize them'? That'd be different than 'are they competitive'.

example A: "Is huron blackheart competitive?"
example B: "What is the best way to use huron blackheart?"

A is what this thread is about.


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## MidnightSun (Feb 10, 2009)

Sakura_ninja said:


> Point proven.
> Tactics given on using unit 0
> Helpful advice given 0
> 
> Some useless inbred moron chewing on his toes at warseer could of told me that, even I knew that, but its not what I asked is it, nothing is straight up uncompetitive, lots of choices are weaker, nothing is useless, you ask for help using x your ignored and told to use y, amazing.


When did I say that uncompetitive = Useless?



Sakura_ninja said:


> lots of choices are weaker,


And they are what we call uncompetitive units, because why take weak units when you can take strong ones? 

Midnight


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## khrone forever (Dec 13, 2010)

Sakura_ninja said:


> Theoretically don't bother asking would be my advice, I wanted to ask about restarting my guard at 1000pts, but I'm not going to, which is a shame as somebody MIGHT have helpful advice, but I'm not gonna bother.


well that just cutting your nose of to spite your face, if you want to re-start your guard in a non competitive way, just state that very clearly in the thread and people will respect that


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## MidnightSun (Feb 10, 2009)

HOGGLORD said:


> I do feel that just telling someone that a unit is bad is unhelpful. If I asked, theoreticaly, what the best way to use Huron Blackheart is, I wouldn't want to hear that he is crap and a DP with lash is infinately better. It is better, but I wanted to know about Huron, what he's good at, what he shouldn't be fielded for, what squads are best to put him in etc.


A. Lash Princes aren't any the most competitive choice, Lash Sorcerors are where it's at. Winged with Mark of Nurgle is where it's at for Princes.

B. The best way to use Huron Blackheart - use him as a Lord with Power Fist. He'll still suck, but you'll get more use out of him that way. Alternatively, use him as you'd use any power-armoured Lord, but more expensive so you can't have as good a retinue - why take Blackheart when you can take a Lord with Power Fist and a Chaos Terminator meat shield?

Is this so hard to understand? List-building is just as much a strategic skill as on-the-table playstyle. If you really like the specific rules for a unit, you should know how to use them because why else would they appeal? If you like the fluff or the model, counts-as it as a similar unit that's better.

Midnight


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## mcmuffin (Mar 1, 2009)

Sakura_ninja said:


> Tacticians make the best with what they have, do you think back in WWII allied commanders had a choice of what they had?, if they were given shermans they didn't bitch that another tank was better and refuse to use them, they got on with it and used there brains to win with what they had at there disposal.
> 
> Do you think patton won against rommel and his superior equipment by replacing all his shermans with pershings?
> 
> ...


Too long, didn't read. but if is the same rambling bullshit as most of your other posts then I probably saved myself 2 minutes of my life. By taking flash gits, you are trying to put a screw in with a hammer.


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## Da Joka (Feb 20, 2009)

First of all I happen to agree with what most people say in that Flash Gitz are sucky.

But If you really want to use them then I would say use them as range finders. They have one of the coolest pieces of Wargear in the Ork Codex, Git Finda (or something like that, Don't have my Codex right next to me), it allows you to measure BEFORE you choose your target. So stick them next to a group of shoota boyz, or other shooty unit, and use them to check range before you choose your target, with the other unit.

Off topic, if they had BS 3, they would kick serious ass and I would use them in every other Ork list I made.


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## Fallen (Oct 7, 2008)

LotD - best way to use them is in a 5man squad with a sarg with a combi-melta (if he can even take this - dont have codex on hand) a MM and a melta - they are relentless so they will blow up something important...or at least should. I take them in my fun lists that has 15 terminators and Lysander...in a 10man squad.


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## Zer0 (Jan 13, 2009)

. . . Anyone else think it's funny that, in 5 pages of posts, the OP hasn't said a thing since starting this and has probably been scared off the forum?


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## Ravner298 (Jun 3, 2011)

well, it did get moved zero, so there's a possibility that he hasn't found it or got confused as to where it went.


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## Lord Azune (Nov 12, 2011)

I dunno about them being so useless. With a painboy, you don't really need to overtly worry about Blastas getting hot, not to mention they have a 4+ save anyway. Give them a full set of upgrades and stick them in a deffrolla battlewagon and you've got a pretty good squad for taking out TEQ. Sure, their BS still sucks but 20 shots from the gitz and 3 shots from Badrukk, you're not gonna do terrible.

(Note, I don't play orks, I merely play against them and have seen that do well against both my Nids and my Necrons.)

(Second Note, I'm also not saying they're top level competitive as I don't play Orks.)


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## Zer0 (Jan 13, 2009)

Ravner298 said:


> well, it did get moved zero, so there's a possibility that he hasn't found it or got confused as to where it went.


Good point. I'm just surprised how nasty a turn this took. I mean, if my third post had turned this ugly, I'd probably not have stayed on the forum.


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## mcmuffin (Mar 1, 2009)

It hasn't turned ugly, it is just a debate and the inevitable "well you are clearly not a good player if you can't use bad units" argument starts.


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## Black SainT (Apr 13, 2012)

I've never been an orky fan as such but from what it seems lootas would work better in a competitive list rather than flash gitz. Thou if u wanted to use them i suppose shooting up footslogging heavy units perhaps or anti horde maybe? or a rather expensive anti something(not familiar with orks) suicide unit?


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## Ravner298 (Jun 3, 2011)

Zer0 said:


> Good point. I'm just surprised how nasty a turn this took. I mean, if my third post had turned this ugly, I'd probably not have stayed on the forum.


Nasty? I don't think so. Ninja took the thread and changed it into what he/she wanted it to be about, and proceeded to trash talk heresy at whole for keeping the thread on topic. There's a pretty good reason he/she got the reaction he/she did.




> I dunno about them being so useless. With a painboy, you don't really need to overtly worry about Blastas getting hot, not to mention they have a 4+ save anyway. Give them a full set of upgrades and stick them in a deffrolla battlewagon and you've got a pretty good squad for taking out TEQ. Sure, their BS still sucks but 20 shots from the gitz and 3 shots from Badrukk, you're not gonna do terrible.


I'm no ork expert but that seems like a HUGE investment. Would that even be worth it for what it does?


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## mcmuffin (Mar 1, 2009)

Fine, if you want to bait me into finding some overcosted use for flash gits then i will, however they will underperform and lootas will do the job better. Note to the OP, this is not directed at you, i think we can all guess who it is directed at.

7 Flash Gitz: More Dakka, Shootier, Blastas, Painboy: 310pts Badrukk: 135pts
Battlewagon: Deffrolla, 4 big shootas: 130pts

So you throw the lads into the battlewagon, drive 12", hop out dakka some stuff, and then probably die or get severely injured. Use them to annihilate space marine, but even then , you don't have enough shots or a reliable AP to reliably damage a unit of marines.

Or, you could get this

15 Lootas: 225pts Which will fill both an anti-tank role and a very good anti-infantry unit for less than half the price which puts out 15-45 shots at a higher strength with a reliable AP.

We done here?


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## Sakura_ninja (Apr 29, 2012)

Direct at who you want (i wonder who), my point was proven long ago, so I no longer care, its just a shame only a couple of people posted uses while the rest whine like kids about how crap everything is.

I couldn't find my tiny violin.


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## MidnightSun (Feb 10, 2009)

Lord Azune said:


> I dunno about them being so useless. With a painboy, you don't really need to overtly worry about Blastas getting hot, not to mention they have a 4+ save anyway. Give them a full set of upgrades and stick them in a deffrolla battlewagon and you've got a pretty good squad for taking out TEQ. Sure, their BS still sucks but 20 shots from the gitz and 3 shots from Badrukk, you're not gonna do terrible.
> 
> (Note, I don't play orks, I merely play against them and have seen that do well against both my Nids and my Necrons.)
> 
> (Second Note, I'm also not saying they're top level competitive as I don't play Orks.)


They aren't really good at that - they still have only a 50% chance to get to AP2, and with cover saves (which we should really give the Terminators, considering that they cost a lot less points then the above combo) they aren't killing many. The Terminators return fire, which if they have a Cyclone Missile Launcher is actually quite likely to take down the Battle Wagon, and will proceed to hammer the Flash Gitz. Take them a while, and it's not a certain thing, but hey, they cost half as much; you can't expect miracles.

Tyranids might struggle with them because of their fairly good anti TMC upgrades, but if they're close enough to shoot their Snazzguns at your Monstrous Creatures you can either chase them and make them useless as they cannot fire due to moving quickly, or catch them and kill the tank before ripping into the squishy contents.

@Sakura
If you don't care and you've been proved right, why bother posting again?

P.S. I hate your signature. Change it back to the one whining about how you have nowhere else to go.

Midnight


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## mcmuffin (Mar 1, 2009)

The only one whining here is you, you come in here, give no tactical advice and bitch about everyone else's input. I gave my input, it was frank and to the point. Flash gits are shite, lootas do everything they do for cheaper and they do it better. If you don't like that then tough titties, those are the facts, no amount of whinging about other users is going to change that. 

So em well . . . :bye:


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## MidnightSun (Feb 10, 2009)

:goodpost:

Midnight


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## Ravner298 (Jun 3, 2011)

> Direct at who you want (i wonder who), my point was proven long ago, so I no longer care, its just a shame only a couple of people posted uses while the rest whine like kids about how crap everything is.
> 
> I couldn't find my tiny violin.


You don't have a point other than trying to make heresy as a whole worse at the game and derail threads to be what YOU want them to be, not what the OP was asking for.

Also note you havent once addressed my posts which directly prove you wrong, you just post dillusional nothings. 

Also note you haven't contributed one damn thing.


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## Red Corsairs (Jun 8, 2008)

Iron Angel said:


> Guys? Can we not shit this thread up with your bullshit argument over what is and is not acceptable advice?


As said by Iron Angel 3 pages ago, cut the shit out already. Stay on topic and quit the bitching and whining. And don't go blaming Sakura as some of you have already attempted, it takes more than one person to start a piss fest.


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## Taggerung (Jun 5, 2008)

McMuffin is right...flash gitz are outclassed by lootas for cheaper, though a lot less likely to run off the board and flash gitz do stand a better chance in melee than lootas as well. They i think are a fun fluffy unit, like the shokk gun...not terribly useful but still fun


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## MidnightSun (Feb 10, 2009)

kell111 said:


> I love the flash gits in the Codex and they have always been an interest of mine since I even heard of them. I like them but haven't gotten to play them allot so don't know how effective they are and was wondering *if they were good tactics wise and if they can be competitive?*


It doesn't matter if they're fun or fluffy or slightly less laughably terrible in close combat than Lootas, that's not what this thread is about. It's about whether or not Flash Gitz are a good Heavy Support choice, and the answer to that is no.

Midnight


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## Zer0 (Jan 13, 2009)

MidnightSun said:


> It doesn't matter if they're fun or fluffy or slightly less laughably terrible in close combat than Lootas, that's not what this thread is about. It's about whether or not Flash Gitz are a good Heavy Support choice, and the answer to that is no.
> 
> Midnight





kell111 said:


> I love the flash gits in the Codex and they have always been an interest of mine since I even heard of them. I like them but haven't gotten to play them allot so don't know how effective they are and was wondering if they were good tactics wise and if they can be competitive? Please give me some advise on them for I really do like them.


Maybe I place too much emphasis on the last line, but I assumed that, regardless of how competative they are (they aren't!) Kell111 wanted to include them and would appreciate some advice on how to make the most of them. 

Last thing I'm going to say on this.


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## MidnightSun (Feb 10, 2009)

Ah, since the majority of the post, and indeed the post title, was about how competitive a choice Flash Gitz were, I took it the other way (hehehe, took it the other way).

Sorry for the misunderstanding. Oh well, now the OP has two different views, competitive and casual, so I guess the thread's been quite productive.

Midnight


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## kell111 (Jul 31, 2011)

ok yes I havnt posted but thats because i didnt see anywere to post that would stay on my topic. Barley any tactics were given and just lots of bitching from 2 people about how sucky they are. Then others just told me that Y does X better and I know but that wasnt the question so stop iv heard it enough on one topic. But there has been a few comments that helped me. Then there was a 2 page long debate on how they suck and also completely off topic talk. so if any competitive players here have any true tactics and not what will do better please post it other then that just dont say they suck ive heard it enough.


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## scscofield (May 23, 2011)

The problem here and one of the reasons the whole thread spiraled to crap is asking competitive players about this is going to get you the answer of use the other units listed instead. The competitive players do not feel that they make their points back, they feel that the best tactic for them is to not use them. 

Probably the best route for you it to post a list on the Ork list forum that focuses on supporting them. State from the get go that you want to use them, build a list to the point level your wanting to play, and see how it goes. The reason I say to post a list and not just ask for tactics is because asking for a just straight 'how do I use them' on units often depends on what else you are bringing to your list. It might be that the rest of your list will perfectly support the unit.


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## kell111 (Jul 31, 2011)

Hm.... that sound good thanks.


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