# 40k Gathering Storm



## Khorne's Fist (Jul 18, 2008)

I think this deserves it's own thread because it's going to be a pretty significant event. We got a teaser intro over on the Warhammer Cummunity page. 



> The Eye of Terror is about to open and unleash a tide of darkness, Daemons and traitors into an already beset Imperium. Against the unified might of the Traitor Legions stand the heroes of the Cadian Gate, who will stop at nothing to drive back the Gathering Storm.
> 
> The scene is set for the most epic narrative in the history of the 41st Millennium – a fitting celebration of 30 years of Warhammer 40,000 and a great way to kick off the next 30 years of grim darkness in the far future.
> 
> ...






































There's also a few hints in the Regimental Standard.



> Greetings Guardsmen,
> 
> Today’s news comes from Cadia, where everything is fine, and where you’ll be redeployed to with immediate effect.
> 
> ...


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## Loki1416 (Apr 20, 2010)

I've put together vehicles with less shit to paint on it than that Archmagos! Like the look of all those mini's though. That Inquisitor especially. That bolt gun/crossbow is pretty cool.


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## Old Man78 (Nov 3, 2011)

Please do not let this be the thin end of an "age of sigmarfication" wedge! 

Love the inquisitor mini, the celestine mini is great but I prefare the old metal one with years of dust on it in my pile of unpainted stuff to be painted pile! The magos , I'm not feeling the love for him, to many fine dainty bits sticking out


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## Khorne's Fist (Jul 18, 2008)

These appear to be in the January WD, but as the leak comes from a Spanish version, these may or may not be a 40k release rather than an AoS one.


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## Lord of the Night (Nov 18, 2009)

Not at all happy with the pricing and release style for the Magos, Saint Celestine and Inquisitor: as one box. Triumvirate of the Imperium for £50 contains all three...

Well that's great but I only want one, the Magos. Not bothered about Celestine and I have no use for the Inquisitor. But if I want the Magos for my Mechanicus army I need to either buy two figures I don't want as well or buy a Magos separate on eBay for an inflated price...


LotN


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## Khorne's Fist (Jul 18, 2008)

Lord of the Night said:


> But if I want the Magos for my Mechanicus army I need to either buy two figures I don't want as well or buy a Magos separate on eBay for an inflated price...


Or you could buy the box, and be the one selling Celestine and the Inquisitior at over inflated prices.


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## Kreuger (Aug 30, 2010)

Khorne's Fist said:


> These appear to be in the January WD, but as the leak comes from a Spanish version, these may or may not be a 40k release rather than an AoS one. ...


Looking at the backs of the guys in the foreground, this definitely looks like an AoS release.


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## Zion (May 31, 2011)

From /u/Sanguinius on Reddit:



> Well, I was having beers with my GW source the other night and the topic got onto the Fall of Cadia and the coming story arcs and releases. He claims to know out to mid-2017 what is going to happen, but obviously needs to remain tight lipped. I did get the following tidbits though:
> 
> 
> Outside of Celestine and her Geminii bodyguards, there are no plans in the next 5 months for any SoB boxes/kits.
> ...





> Sanguinius[S] 11 points 23 hours ago To tell you the truth though, I don't know how GW are going to attack the Loyalist Primarchs model wise. Roboute already has a FW model, and placing that next to Magnus, the loyalists are going to be pretty underwhelming size-wise, surely?
> And how much can you already improve on Rowboat's model? Add a neck scar?
> Apparently my man was saying that Roboute wakes up quite pissy when he sees the mass religion bullshit the Imperium has become!


RE: "RIP Sisters":


> [–]Sanguinius[S] 2 points 12 hours ago
> If it makes you feel any better, he hasn't been wrong on anything he's told me yet.
> He didn't say there wouldn't be plastic Sisters, it's just that with the release schedule, we won't be seeing any before May....or more correctly, if they exist, they don't appear on the release schedule.
> From what I am led to believe, the focus of this Fall of Cadia release is on the 'Triumvirate of the Imperium'; and doesn't necessarily mean a Primarch is going to show for this release window.


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## Drohar (Jan 22, 2014)

Lord of the Night said:


> Not at all happy with the pricing and release style for the Magos, Saint Celestine and Inquisitor: as one box. Triumvirate of the Imperium for £50 contains all three...
> 
> Well that's great but I only want one, the Magos. Not bothered about Celestine and I have no use for the Inquisitor. But if I want the Magos for my Mechanicus army I need to either buy two figures I don't want as well or buy a Magos separate on eBay for an inflated price...
> 
> ...


I only want the inquisitor. So if you are in and we find one person, who wants Celestine, one of us buys the kit and ships the models (presumably it comes with rule sheets as well) and the model's rules to the other two. We could all get the models we want for roughly £18 each. (counting postage as well) Actually might it be cheaper as normally element games have the new releases 20% off RP.


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## Khorne's Fist (Jul 18, 2008)

Some news on the new Imperial characters, including the fact the the new Inquisitor might not be a big fan of St. Celestine.


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## Khorne's Fist (Jul 18, 2008)




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## ntaw (Jul 20, 2012)

Let the storm gather! I can't wait for them to delve in to the way-back story of the 40k universe with Eldar and Necrons having more and more explained. Not too much as their mystique is kinda what makes them interesting, but enough that we see some seriously long-term plans come to fruition.

EDIT: Looks like the Eldar are becoming the Aeldari just like the Imperial Guard and Space Marines became the Astra Militarum and Adeptus Astartes. Rebrand ahoy!/?

Linky


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## Khorne's Fist (Jul 18, 2008)

Tomorrow.


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## ntaw (Jul 20, 2012)

It's onlyyyyy a dayyy aaaaaaawaaaaayyyyyyyyy :crazy:


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## ntaw (Jul 20, 2012)

Well shit. This looks fun!


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## Brother Lucian (Apr 22, 2011)

I guess the events of Death Masque got retconned, if Ynnead is growing strong instead of dispersing. So it looks like Slaanesh is on track to bite it in 40k as well now. 

But whom or what could fill such a hole in the chaotic pantheon? 40k has no Horned Rat waiting in the sidelines as the obvious candidate for Disorder.


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## Shandathe (May 2, 2010)

Not necessarily. Eldrad's ritual did reach it crescendo, and might actually have worked SOMEWHAT despite the Eldar's general propensity for screwing the Imperium over coming back to bite them in the ass hard. Ynnead's "full apotheosis" was denied, but apparently, they got THIS, at least.


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## Khorne's Fist (Jul 18, 2008)

Is there fluff out there yet to explain why that lad looks like a Slaaneshi demon?


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## the_barwn (Jul 23, 2011)

Khorne's Fist said:


> Is there fluff out there yet to explain why that lad looks like a Slaaneshi demon?


Who says it is a lad though........ from another angle where the warp lightning or whatever it is is not hiding features there is boob armour :shok:


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## Shandathe (May 2, 2010)

Presumably because, if the whole Ynnead thing went through even vaguely according to plan, (s)he consists of Eldar souls and stole a gigantic bunch of those from Slaanesh. So there's a definite taint from the start. The Eldar screwed up creating one god, let's not assume they can't screw it up AGAIN on this more deliberate attempt 

The really interesting bit is what (s)he and Saint Direct-from-the-Emperor-to-you Celestine will have to say to each other...


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## Moriouce (Oct 20, 2009)

I wonder if we have The Laughing God around the corner aswell. Personaly I think he should have been the first pick. But this Avatar of Ynead looks intresting. Want to see more fluff around he/she soon.


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## the_barwn (Jul 23, 2011)

Shandathe said:


> Presumably because, if the whole Ynnead thing went through even vaguely according to plan, (s)he consists of Eldar souls and stole a gigantic bunch of those from Slaanesh. So there's a definite taint from the start. The Eldar screwed up creating one god, let's not assume they can't screw it up AGAIN on this more deliberate attempt
> 
> The really interesting bit is what (s)he and Saint Direct-from-the-Emperor-to-you Celestine will have to say to each other...


Yes according to the fluff with the death masque box set it dealt with the attempt of birthing Ynnead by Eldrad but I think everyone can guess what happens because of the SM DW involvement :angry:


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## Myen'Tal (Sep 4, 2009)

Moriouce said:


> I wonder if we have The Laughing God around the corner as well. Personaly I think he should have been the first pick. But this Avatar of Ynead looks intresting. Want to see more fluff around he/she soon.


The Laughing God is still a complete God though, right? He hasn't been broken down into Avatars like Khaine or Ynnead, I think, so making a model for him maybe more complicated I think. Of course, I could be wrong, so someone feel free to correct me :smile2:. 

I don't know how I feel about the Yncarne Avatar. A part of me like's it, and another part of me feel like it's a little too much. 

The other two models are dope though, would consider finally buying into a Craftworld force if the Gathering Storm II formations are cool enough ^^.


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## Moriouce (Oct 20, 2009)

Myen'Tal said:


> The Laughing God is still a complete God though, right? He hasn't been broken down into Avatars like Khaine or Ynnead, I think, so making a model for him maybe more complicated I think. Of course, I could be wrong, so someone feel free to correct me :smile2:.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




That is right. The laughing god is very much alive and kicking. I have had this Idea that he could grant or bless a harlequin with some of his powers. A Jester or Champion of The Laughing God would be a good deal for the Harlequins. 

The new models though look very much Dark eldar. But the name suggest a schism in the craftworld eldar, or Biel-Tan atleast.


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## Myen'Tal (Sep 4, 2009)

Moriouce said:


> That is right. The laughing god is very much alive and kicking. I have had this Idea that he could grant or bless a harlequin with some of his powers. A Jester or Champion of The Laughing God would be a good deal for the Harlequins.
> 
> The new models though look very much Dark eldar. But the name suggest a schism in the craftworld eldar, or Biel-Tan atleast.


A Champion for the Laughing God would be sweet, would really love to see one after the models that GW has been putting out lately. 

As for Yvraine and the Visarch, that's along the lines of what I was thinking, the main-plot is going to concern Biel-Tan, so it would be weird not to have these new models available for Craftworld players(Unless this whole scheme by Eldrad was made possible by the Dark City ).Best case scenario is that they are available for both Dark and Craftworld Eldar ^^. Or maybe Yncarne for both, Yvraine the Emissary for Craftworld, and the Visarch for Dark Eldar? 

I guess we shall see soon.


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## the_barwn (Jul 23, 2011)

I thought that the Solitaire was the champion for the Harlequins because the laughing god & she who thirsts duel for the soul of the Solitaire when they expire....


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## Gret79 (May 11, 2012)

In the Harlequin performances, The Great Harlequin plays Cegorach and the Solitaire plays Slaanesh. Slaanesh gets the soul of the Solitaire - this is why they are seen as damned by the other eldar. I think this is why Solitaires eat the souls of other eldar (I think the book this was referenced in was called masque of vyle - it was tied in with the dark eldar trilogy) When the Solitaire dies, slaanesh claims the soul of the Solitaire, but the laughing god has the chance to fight for the soul and sometimes, but not always tricks Slaanesh and wins the soul of the solitaire.
So the Solitaire is 'kinda' a champion of slaanesh and the great harlequin is the mortal champion of the laughing god. 


A buffed up Great Harlequin would be a great addition to the harlequins imo


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## ntaw (Jul 20, 2012)

Taken from Atia's blog, here's a picture of some Eldar factions I assume will be featured heavily in the coming book:


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## ntaw (Jul 20, 2012)

More WD pics, lifted from Atia's blog:


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## Brother Lucian (Apr 22, 2011)

Intriguing, so the Death Masque has become canon. And I am utterly laughing at the notion of Eldrad Ulthran being put on trial for it!


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## Shandathe (May 2, 2010)

Well, if Yvraine is absorbing dead Eldar... I can only say they apparently go straight to the hips. Remember kids, if you want to maintain your figure cut Eldar souls from your diet


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## Khorne's Fist (Jul 18, 2008)

Should be a rude awakening.


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## ntaw (Jul 20, 2012)

I'm sure a few DE players will be stoked to see Vect featured in anything. I'm very ok with the Oprah approach GW seems to be taking to the Gathering Storm; models for you, models for you, models for everyone! :laugh:


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## Lord of the Night (Nov 18, 2009)

By the Emperor! 

Guilliman returns! An alliance with the Eldar and Cypher?! To save the Imperium?!

Will definitely be getting this.

LotN


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## Gret79 (May 11, 2012)

Lord of the Night said:


> By the Emperor!
> 
> Guilliman returns! An alliance with the Eldar and Cypher?! To save the Imperium?!
> 
> LotN


WELL SPIN MY NIPPLE NUTS AND CALL ME FRANK! :shok:


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## Kreuger (Aug 30, 2010)

Lord of the Night said:


> By the Emperor!
> 
> Guilliman returns! An alliance with the Eldar and Cypher
> 
> LotN


So apparently the Imperium is entering the end times in a rowboat! 

Interesting take on Roboute. He seems much more imposing and massive compared to the Forge World sculpt.


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## Gret79 (May 11, 2012)

Now I've got over my initial surprise, I'm not keen on Guilliman. He looks too much like a superhero :/


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## ntaw (Jul 20, 2012)

I'm very curious to see how Gulliballs is revived, I know he's been in stasis but wasn't his head cut off??


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## the_barwn (Jul 23, 2011)

ntaw said:


> I'm very curious to see how Gulliballs is revived, I know he's been in stasis but wasn't his head cut off??


This will be the cunning plan to give us desmond Fulgrim because he will want to finish the job he started 10K years ago..... :yahoo:


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## ntaw (Jul 20, 2012)

Damn it I can't get this out of my head now:


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## Khorne's Fist (Jul 18, 2008)

I'll just drop this here...


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## Lord of the Night (Nov 18, 2009)

Khorne's Fist said:


> I'll just drop this here...


Beat you to it KF, hehehe.


LotN


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## Old Man78 (Nov 3, 2011)

There will be some absolute neck bearding about him coming back! Is it the picture or does he appear a little pea headed? Also will he be saying "hey Calgar, thanks for keeping me gloves warm now I'll have them back"


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## Lord of the Night (Nov 18, 2009)

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=327303624331289&id=230219510706368


LotN


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## Moriouce (Oct 20, 2009)

Is that The Lions sword Cypher has gotten his hand on. Why would he want to get to Terra with it?


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## Khorne's Fist (Jul 18, 2008)




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## Shandathe (May 2, 2010)

Moriouce said:


> Is that The Lions sword Cypher has gotten his hand on. Why would he want to get to Terra with it?


He's ALWAYS had the sword that he's not using. It's been part of his lore since the beginning I think. Lot of theories on what it is, but none have ever been confirmed... until Real Soon Now?


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## Kharn The Complainer (Aug 19, 2015)

Look at the proportions of the Ultramarine. Could it be Robute? 
Corax could easily come back since he's not dead, just off crying emo tears somewhere. The Khan could also come back.
But nobody cares about the Raven Guard or White Scars, so I'm more inclined to think it's Robute.


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## Fallen (Oct 7, 2008)

Did anyone else notice that a "2" (only in Roman numerals) was on the Grey Knight's Thunder Hammer?

Possibly more fluff on one of the unknown legions....maybe...


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## Khorne's Fist (Jul 18, 2008)

Kharn The Complainer said:


> Look at the proportions of the Ultramarine. Could it be Robute?
> Corax could easily come back since he's not dead, just off crying emo tears somewhere. The Khan could also come back.
> But nobody cares about the Raven Guard or White Scars, so I'm more inclined to think it's Robute.


You're questioning wether or not it's Girlyman? Why would they bring back a primarch that's not Giryman, but dress him up like him?


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## Kharn The Complainer (Aug 19, 2015)

OK, turns out it is Guilliman who is coming back. Nice. He'll sort out the Imperium.

You had ONE JOB FULGRIM...and you blew it.
I bet Matt Ward died from cumming too much at the idea.


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

These look pretty awesome. REALLY liking Cypher. Wonder what the sizes are.


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## Kharn The Complainer (Aug 19, 2015)

Awwwweeeesssoooooooooooooome


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## Khorne's Fist (Jul 18, 2008)

I'll definitely be assembling Girlyman with his helmet on. That face is awful. Other than that all three are stunning, particularly Cypher.

Also, is that the Emperor's sword, I wonder?


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## Old Man78 (Nov 3, 2011)

Love Cypher, love the Grey Knight guy, not loving Guilliman, the pose and proportions remind me of that Kubuki mini of the emperor, not too bad with his brain bucket on but the bare head is awful


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## gen.ahab (Dec 22, 2009)

Second favorite primarch is back? EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!


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## ntaw (Jul 20, 2012)

Saw this PS'd pic online, had to share. Is that Girlyman or the big E??


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## Old Man78 (Nov 3, 2011)

@ntaw, I love it, the mini comes with multiple heads and weapons, to be whatever primarch you like


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## Haskanael (Jul 5, 2011)

Roboute guilliman and from some of the leaked images, 3rd company Ultramarines (fuck I've been painting my 3rd company all wrong. FUCK fuck fuck.)


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## ntaw (Jul 20, 2012)

Oldman78 said:


> @ntaw, I love it, the mini comes with multiple heads and weapons, to be whatever primarch you like


To be sure, that's a very photoshopped (PS'd) picture. Just thought it was a little Emperor looking given the stance, blade, and the recent HH book cover featuring him.

Also, the Emperor's face in that pic reminds me of Nathan Explosion :laugh:



Haskanael said:


> Roboute guilliman and from some of the leaked images, 3rd company Ultramarines (fuck I've been painting my 3rd company all wrong. FUCK fuck fuck.)


Gold trim on the shoulder pads instead of red?


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## Gret79 (May 11, 2012)

Massive rules leak of The Shattering of Biel Tan 
http://m.imgur.com/a/dbR41

Via warhams77 on data according to Facebook


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## Gret79 (May 11, 2012)

*dakka not data... Not sure how to edit last post on phone..


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## Shandathe (May 2, 2010)

Brother Lucian said:


> Intriguing, so the Death Masque has become canon. And I am utterly laughing at the notion of Eldrad Ulthran being put on trial for it!


They didn't just put him on trial, I'm pretty sure they had to created new LAWS to be able to do it. "Misappropriation of the Eldar's mutual destiny" indeed.



Gret79 said:


> Massive rules leak of The Shattering of Biel Tan
> http://m.imgur.com/a/dbR41


Some interesting stuff in there... Especially the many occurances of 7".


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## Haskanael (Jul 5, 2011)

ntaw said:


> Gold trim on the shoulder pads instead of red?


eeeyup


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## ntaw (Jul 20, 2012)

Haskanael said:


> eeeyup


Shitty deal. What made you think gold was for the 3rd?



Shandathe said:


> Some interesting stuff in there... Especially the many occurances of 7".


What's the significance of the number 7?


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## Shandathe (May 2, 2010)

ntaw said:


> What's the significance of the number 7?


Because practically all normal weapon, psychic ranges and other effects tend to be multiples of 6. So the 7" has to be a deliberate choice - maybe because 6 is Slaanesh's number?


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## Haskanael (Jul 5, 2011)

ntaw said:


> Shitty deal. What made you think gold was for the 3rd?


bad research, thought the whole chapter had gold trim except for the 1st company


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## Kharn The Complainer (Aug 19, 2015)

Haskanael said:


> bad research, thought the whole chapter had gold trim except for the 1st company


haha, that was some really bad research. I just did a quick google search for 'Ultramarines company colours' and came up with a million pictures showing all the colours.

But that's not too bad, right? You can easily paint over the yellow with red. It would be more difficult to do it the other way around.


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## Khorne's Fist (Jul 18, 2008)

:laugh::laugh::laugh:


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## Brother Lucian (Apr 22, 2011)

Woah, this is some explosive news indeed! Hearing blabber that theres a new supreme grandmaster and draigo lost the role. Probably due to being too busy wandering the warp. Ive a sneaking suspicion to the identity of the new GK guy, whom I think could be Janus. Id love to see a confrontation between Magnus and Janus.











Edit: Looks like I was off the mark:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/02/03/gathering-storm-iii-rise-of-the-primarch-first-look/

The GK is called Voldus, so looks to be an entirely new character. Ah well.


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

I really love that model, so hopefully the character has a cool story to back it up. If only we saw a Mordrak model :<


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## Brother Lucian (Apr 22, 2011)

When the Gathering Storm turns to the Orks, I think its a pretty safe bet that Ghazkull will ascend and become the Great Beast of orkkind. Perhaps at the climax of another war for Armageddon that sees Ghazkull and his numberless horde victorious as they reclaim Ullanor to be the center of his empire. Would be a fine time to have Vulkan return for a rematch.

Edit: Easy centerpiece monstrous creature on the same size as daemon Magnus the Red.


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## Gret79 (May 11, 2012)

Another rules leak. Stats for the three characters, rules, psychic disciplines and formations 

http://natfka.blogspot.co.uk/2017/02/images-from-inside-fracture-of-biel-tan.html?m=1


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## Khorne's Fist (Jul 18, 2008)

I'm liking the DE feel to the characters restoring wounds on deaths of allies. They do like they'd work well together. A ready made death star.


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## Shandathe (May 2, 2010)

Khorne's Fist said:


> I'm liking the DE feel to the characters restoring wounds on deaths of allies. They do like they'd work well together. A ready made death star.


I don't know. For all that they've all got Eternal Warrior, they seem to be lacking in the necessary invulnerable saves, especially if they don't get a lucky Sanctuary from Daemonology Sanctic... Yvraine and the Visarch look like they can be boltered down with relatively little effort. The Yncarne's the bigger problem - he may not be as tanky as a Belisarius, but he's going to be in your lines, killing your dudes.

They can all definitely dish it out, high WS/BS with THOSE weapons, back up by a good selection of Psyker powers (Gaze of Ynnead WILL KILL anything not at least multi-wound with T6 or Eternal Warrior with near certainty). Noteworthy, Ynnead armies are going to have to stick close together for best efficiency (standard Soulburst range seems to be 7"), so bring the AOE damage if you face one.


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## Gret79 (May 11, 2012)

I really like the sound of 'attack of the swordwind' from the glossary leaks. But I can't find which formation it refers to in the new leaks...


Null deploy and then 1st turn arrival of reserves (including planes) seems like it could be great for my eldar. 


Just waiting for Saturday...


Pre ordered the characters and the book.


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## Brother Lucian (Apr 22, 2011)

Looking in Gret79's rules leak link, I saw a few offhanded comments about Cypher supposedly killing Abbadon. That would be a major  if that comes true. But I could see something is affoot with Abbadon, with him no longer having the favor of the four and not having a new model yet. A Horus 3.0 waiting in the wings perhaps?

DAMO.R (the real one) Joel Munson • 17 hours ago 
But Abaddon supposedly gets killed in the next book so if that's the case then maybe that's why Chaos haven't really been in the limelight...

DAMO.R (the real one) Joel Munson • 17 hours ago 
Well apparently Cypher kills Abaddon so that will be interesting if true...


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## Shandathe (May 2, 2010)

I could get behind Abaddon getting offed. Aside from avoiding further comparisons to Archaon... Abaddon's got a reputation as a failure among fans (somewhat earned), and he just seemed tired of it all in Fall of Cadia. He didn't really WANT to command after the Horus Heresy to start with, and it's looking like 10 millennia of having to hold together and babysit dozens of factions with at least 4 other loyalties have further soured him on it. Getting the Primarchs to kneel before him was one thing, but... it's taken forever to truly get things moving.

He's achieved the impossible right now. He's gotten Chaos as united as it's ever going to get, it has FINALLY started marching on the Imperium in force. It's okay if someone else takes over from here, because no matter what happens this is *Abaddon's* 13th Black Crusade. Anything it achieves is only because HE set it up. 

Fenris has been ravaged, and the Space Wolves humbled and decimated. The Planet of Sorcerors looms over Prospero. Cadia has fallen, the Eye of Terror is expanding... all this despite annoying interference from the Emperor, the Eldar, and the general incompetence of his Chaos-addled minions. And these were just the opening moves. 

I don't doubt he wants to see things through to their conclusion, but he'd definitely be going out on a high note.


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## darkreever (Apr 3, 2008)

Shandathe said:


> Aside from avoiding further comparisons to Archaon...


Really? I've never heard the two compared, wheres that from?



Shandathe said:


> Abaddon's got a reputation as a failure among fans (somewhat earned)


Oh? Please do explain this one, though if your answer is going to be his previous black crusades failing do keep in mind that that is not correct.



Shandathe said:


> it's taken forever to truly get things moving.


Times moves differently in the Eye, ten millennia for the Imperium but considerably less for the likes of the Despoiler.



Shandathe said:


> It's okay if someone else takes over from here, because no matter what happens this is *Abaddon's* 13th Black Crusade. Anything it achieves is only because HE set it up.


Except no, if someone else takes over and, say, tears the Emperor from the golden throne than no one will care that it was because of what the Despoiler started. And lets not forget that one of his biggest driving forces is to succeed where Horus failed; with the galaxy choking in his grip at the final moment of the final hour.


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## Gret79 (May 11, 2012)

Just realised... The Ynnari get to put banshees in raiders. 
That's it, I'm going ynnari. That being the reason I bought enough DE to make an allies force for my elder with extra raiders to transport CWE CC units - literally the week before the faq said 'no battle brother taxi's' .

Jain Zar with banshees in a raider.
Karandras with scorpions in a raider.
Incubi in a raider.

Thank you GW


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## ntaw (Jul 20, 2012)

Is that specifically in the rules somewhere Gret? The Imperium got the Castellans Detachment which mixes Factions and their Transports and that doesn't change the FAQ ruling at all; we still can't take a bunch of SoB or Scions and pack them into Drop Pods.


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## Gret79 (May 11, 2012)

From what I thought then checked online


Faq - battle brothers can't start the game in each others transports.


DE, CWE and Harlies all become the same faction (ynnari) - so you can take a an empty raider as an ynnari fast attack choice and put any unit with the ynnari faction in it.


What stops the castellans detachment from doing this? 
I've not seen anyone arguing against this for the ynnari, but if the castellan detachment can't that might stop this.


Either way, I should be getting the book tomorrow so I can actually read everything myself. I've still not seen what formations some of the terms in the leaked glossary relate to.


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## ntaw (Jul 20, 2012)

All units in the Castellans Detachment retain their Codex Factions, which precludes members of other Factions from deploying in Battle Brother's transports at deployment. Essentially, even though they are all from the same Detachment they aren't the same Faction in game terms.

I have no idea how the new Eldar stuff works, which is why I ask about the wording of the rules. For reference, here's the FAQ wording:



> Q: Can units that are Battle Brothers embark in each other’s
> Transport vehicles during deployment?
> A: No.


and here's the page that describes how the Castellan rules, which states that all units taken use their Codex's datasheet and does not in any way contradict the FAQ wording:


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## Gret79 (May 11, 2012)

Well, you've convinced me 
Serves me right for not waiting till the rules actually come out. I'll bet the same wording is used in this book too 
Thank you


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## Shandathe (May 2, 2010)

darkreever said:


> Really? I've never heard the two compared, wheres that from?


People seeing parallels, especially when GW starts shouting 'End Times' again. Abaddon's got a bigger job ahead of him than Archaon, obviously. One world, pfah. In all fairness, they ARE the only ones that really succeed in getting Chaos to point all the noses in one direction for their respective universes.



darkreever said:


> Oh? Please do explain this one, though if your answer is going to be his previous black crusades failing do keep in mind that that is not correct.
> 
> Times moves differently in the Eye, ten millennia for the Imperium but considerably less for the likes of the Despoiler.


That still counts as ten millennia. Especially since, for all we know, Abaddon has had MORE time than that available to him. It moves DIFFERENTLY, that's all we know. Abaddon effectively fast-forwarding past the boring parts is both unlikely and very un-Chaos-like. Ten millennia is the only measurement we have worth a damn.

As for failure... Grand Strategy retcon or not, a ridiculous amount of tactical failures has been seen in the previous Black Crusades, even if they may have (usually) accomplished Abaddon's main objective - and note that objective may have been rather meh to begin with. The 1st works out fantastically. The 2nd Black Crusade got pretty much stopped in its tracks despite bringing more forces than the 1st Black Crusade. The 3rd Black Crusade was more of a pinprick against Cadia than an actual threat to the Imperium itself, and it's only the 4th Black Crusade that really DESERVES the title again (but Abaddon makes and error that costs him most of his forces in the end).

And it goes on like that. Abaddon usually loses more forces than he should have(7th) and/or ones he rather could have rather used later, or gets sidetracked (6th and especially 11th). There are very, very few unqualified successes against the Imperium in the list. Abaddon admits as much to himself on page 56 Fall of Cadia. "_Too often, the_ Vengeful Spirit _had borne witness to failure. It would do so no longer._"


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## Kharn The Complainer (Aug 19, 2015)

Just to clarify the issue about time and the warp; Time moves as fast or as slow as the Black Library writers want it to. In some novels one thousand years in the warp is one day in the materium. In other novels, one thousand years in the materium is one day in the warp.


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## Serpion5 (Mar 19, 2010)

Can I also point out that worlds in the Eye of Terror are not in the warp? The Eye is an overlap of Warp and Realspace. They are technically in Realspace with constant warp storm surrounding them. 

Also I cannot say where, but I do remember reading that less time has passed for the Legions in the Eye than for the galaxy everywhere else.


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## Khorne's Fist (Jul 18, 2008)

Serpion5 said:


> Also I cannot say where, but I do remember reading that less time has passed for the Legions in the Eye than for the galaxy everywhere else.


In the NL trilogy I think it's mentioned that for First Claw only about 300 years has passed since the Heresy because of the time they've spent in the Eye and other spots like the Maelstrom.


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## Serpion5 (Mar 19, 2010)

Khorne's Fist said:


> In the NL trilogy I think it's mentioned that for First Claw only about 300 years has passed since the Heresy because of the time they've spent in the Eye and other spots like the Maelstrom.


That would be where. :good:


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## Khorne's Fist (Jul 18, 2008)

*Next Demon Primarch?*

Saw this over on BoLS. See the last paragraph.


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## Brother Lucian (Apr 22, 2011)

I bet snakey Fulgrim is peeved at losing his kill on Roboute.


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## Gorthol (Dec 16, 2015)

Has there been any confirmed details on Gulliman's return?! 

Can't wait to see the significance of the new Cypher mini too


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## Gret79 (May 11, 2012)

Khorne's Fist said:


> Saw this over on BoLS. See the last paragraph.


 

Ok, now this is getting ridiculous 


Me:Honestly honey, there won't be anything else for a while I want to spend my money on after the eldar campaign.


Then I see this. Chances of Giant Snake Deamon Primarch increase dramatically. 


I've got to do one of two things. Either stop buying 40k for a while or stop telling my wife I won't buy any more 40k for a while :laugh:


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## Gret79 (May 11, 2012)

ntaw said:


> All units in the Castellans Detachment retain their Codex Factions, which precludes members of other Factions from deploying in Battle Brother's transports at deployment. Essentially, even though they are all from the same Detachment they aren't the same Faction in game terms.
> 
> I have no idea how the new Eldar stuff works, which is why I ask about the wording of the rules. For reference, here's the FAQ wording:
> 
> ...


 
Hi, I finally got my copy of the shattering of biel-tan last night - this does work for Eldar.


Any eldar taken in a SoBT formation gain the 'Ynnari faction'. So it skips the whole BB can't go in each others transports by making all the eldar the same faction. 
It doesn't change the unit options so you can't take DT raiders for CWE units, but you can choose to take a raider as a fast attack choice and put a craftworld or harlequin unit in it.


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## ntaw (Jul 20, 2012)

Gret79 said:


> Hi, I finally got my copy of the shattering of biel-tan last night - this does work for Eldar.
> 
> 
> Any eldar taken in a SoBT formation gain the 'Ynnari faction'. So it skips the whole BB can't go in each others transports by making all the eldar the same faction.
> It doesn't change the unit options so you can't take DT raiders for CWE units, but you can choose to take a raider as a fast attack choice and put a craftworld or harlequin unit in it.


Crazy. I'm sure some day soon I'll read all about it more specifically but that definitely helps out Eldar, who at the moment are quite under powered and in need of just about anything to make them more effective in the competitive scene.

:laugh: I almost typed that with a straight face.


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## Shandathe (May 2, 2010)

Well, we're currently seeing a lot of Windriders with Scatter lasers, and this is going to see a lot of Craftworlders charging from Raiders...

Obviously, we need to take this to its logical conclusion and carry all those Windriders with Scatter lasers into battle on a Raider.

They're only Very Bulky, you can fit 3 in there. Think it will catch on? :grin2:


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## Gret79 (May 11, 2012)

Shandathe said:


> Well, we're currently seeing a lot of Windriders with Scatter lasers, and this is going to see a lot of Craftworlders charging from Raiders...
> 
> Obviously, we need to take this to its logical conclusion and carry all those Windriders with Scatter lasers into battle on a Raider.
> 
> They're only Very Bulky, you can fit 3 in there. Think it will catch on? :grin2:




:laugh:


This isn't going to see craftworlders charging from raiders for the most part. They'd have to push the d-scythe wraithguard out of the way first :suicide:


First person to model a wraithknight with each foot on a raider wins :grin2:


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## Khorne's Fist (Jul 18, 2008)

Interesting. The help from the shadows looks like more than just Cypher. Or I may be reading too much into it.


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## Haskanael (Jul 5, 2011)

Khorne's Fist said:


> Interesting. The help from the shadows looks like more than just Cypher. Or I may be reading too much into it.
> 
> https://youtu.be/_2sCeLFK_Xw


looks like Cypher is leading a band of renegades perhaps


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## Brother Lucian (Apr 22, 2011)

:smile2:


Haskanael said:


> looks like Cypher is leading a band of renegades perhaps


Some of the leaked shots of the upcomming white dwarf had Cypher flanked by a squad of Fallen Angels at Guiliman's side.


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## Shandathe (May 2, 2010)

A band of Fallen being there with Guilliman. That would... rather break the terrible secret of the Dark Angels wide open, wouldn't it?

So... 
Raven Guard: Lost their Chapter Master (War Zone Damocles), homeworld Deliverance about to be overrun by Orks
Blood Angels: Largely eaten by Nids
Space Wolves: Mostly killed and/or Wulfened (War Zone Fenris, Fall of Cadia)
Dark Angels: Exposed

That's at least 4 out of 9 First Founding Chapters in serious trouble...


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## Brother Lucian (Apr 22, 2011)

Didnt the imperial fists have trouble with the phalanx, the iron warriors and another daemon invasion? Or did that get solved prior fall of cadia? If the phalanx took part there as I vaguely recall something about.


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## ntaw (Jul 20, 2012)

Shandathe said:


> Blood Angels: Largely eaten by Nids


Not to mention the same 1st and 2nd Companies from Shield of Baal featured in Traitor's Hate/Angel's Blade and the 5th almost wholly fell to the Rage (hence rules for Death Company armies in the book). I don't even know how the BA have any marines at all. Must have massive Scout auxiliaries waiting to be jumped into power armour.


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## Brother Lucian (Apr 22, 2011)

ntaw said:


> Not to mention the same 1st and 2nd Companies from Shield of Baal featured in Traitor's Hate/Angel's Blade and the 5th almost wholly fell to the Rage (hence rules for Death Company armies in the book). I don't even know how the BA have any marines at all. Must have massive Scout auxiliaries waiting to be jumped into power armour.


Most likely they milk the successors as they have been known to be doing. But yeah, at this rate the Blood Angels would be better served reforming the legion. And that might just happen under guiliman if he revokes the chapter split.


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## Haskanael (Jul 5, 2011)

Brother Lucian said:


> But yeah, at this rate the Blood Angels would be better served reforming the legion. And that might just happen under guiliman if he revokes the chapter split.


if he does that all hell is going to break loose inside of the Imperium.


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## darkreever (Apr 3, 2008)

But why would Guilliman revoke the split? He was the one who saw to put it in place, and events like the Badab war can be cited as to why such a thing is necessary.


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## Brother Lucian (Apr 22, 2011)

darkreever said:


> But why would Guilliman revoke the split? He was the one who saw to put it in place, and events like the Badab war can be cited as to why such a thing is necessary.


Well the Eye opening fully now that Cadia has fallen is a pretty damn good reason. As well the numberless hordes of the tyranids comming means the imperium needs maximum power concentration to beat such threats.


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## Kharn The Complainer (Aug 19, 2015)

Shandathe said:


> A band of Fallen being there with Guilliman. That would... rather break the terrible secret of the Dark Angels wide open, wouldn't it?
> 
> So...
> Raven Guard: Lost their Chapter Master (War Zone Damocles), homeworld Deliverance about to be overrun by Orks
> ...



And while all this has been going on, the White Scars have been chilling out max and relaxing all cool. Jaghatai Khan came back centuries ago, but nobody in the Imperium gives a shit about the White Scars, to they just made a big theme park and have been riding on all the rides and having fun whilst everything turns to shit.


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## darkreever (Apr 3, 2008)

Brother Lucian said:


> Well the Eye opening fully now that Cadia has fallen is a pretty damn good reason. As well the numberless hordes of the tyranids comming means the imperium needs maximum power concentration to beat such threats.


While I agree that concentrating forces does give you a greater force to bear on individual targets it also means you have less coverage.

And again, this is Guilliman we are talking about. He was the one who made the legions break into smaller groups so no one, not even himself, could wield that much power for any reason.

His codex has always had strategies in it for multiple chapters working in unison, plus he was considered one of the greatest strategists of his time. I'd be more surprised if he turns around on all that he put into place and does something so radically different.


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## Khorne's Fist (Jul 18, 2008)

darkreever said:


> And again, this is Guilliman we are talking about. He was the one who made the legions break into smaller groups so no one, not even himself, could wield that much power for any reason.
> 
> His codex has always had strategies in it for multiple chapters working in unison, plus he was considered one of the greatest strategists of his time. I'd be more surprised if he turns around on all that he put into place and does something so radically different.


Agreed. I think any changes he makes will be at the senior management level of the Imperium. I think he's going to have very similar attitude to Vulkan when he returned in The Beast Arises.The High Lords et al are in for a rough ride if he gets a chance to return to Terra.


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## Brother Lucian (Apr 22, 2011)

Saw an interesting rumor over on B&C
Gathering Storm III: Rise of the Primarch | New video - Page 40 - + NEWS, RUMORS, AND BOARD ANNOUNCEMENTS + - The Bolter and Chainsword

A few pages back a rumor was discussed where Guilliman goes to Terra, talks to the Emperor (red flag #1 ) and is told to fix the Imperium. He apparently gets ahold of the genetic modification info (red flag #2 ) and is going all Corvus Corax on the Astartes creation process. Supposed to reflect on the table.


--------------
A rumor about super astartes comming. I bet Fabius Bile would be twitching with anticipaition. But with RG getting the Emperor's Sword, it looks quite plausible that the Emperor might have awakened and is commanding his son. If the above rumor is credible, I think the space marine legions will return for sure.


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## darkreever (Apr 3, 2008)

I sincerly hope that neither of those things are anything more than speculation and rumour in the end. The Emperor was already supposedly aware of what Guilliman was doing during the Heresy with the Imperium Secundus, so why would he think the man would do anything less with such information and power?

There was a reason Corax was given that knowledge over others. At the time, would it not have been helpful to the likes of Dorn in defending Terra or Russ to replenish his losses? If neither of them were even considered to be given that knowledge, why would Guilliman now? He reshaped his father's empire in the aftermath of running the traitor legions into the Eye of Terror, if anything I would think that the Emperor might task Guilliman with locating and/or recovering his remaining brothers.


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## ntaw (Jul 20, 2012)

darkreever said:


> I sincerly hope that neither of those things are anything more than speculation and rumour in the end.


Absolutely, that B&C member immediately went on to say they "didn't buy it" but paranoia of terrible fluff writing is rife in most 40k forums.

As for the return of Legions, I don't buy it from Guilliman at all. If they resurrect Sanguinius I could see all BA successors flocking to him Legion-esque due to the flaw...now that I'm thinking of it that would be a hell of a shake-up for BA and their successors. I mean, Big Blue being resurrected is pretty game altering for the seemingly hundreds of UM successors but which Space Marines are more tied to their Primarch than the sons of Sanguinius? His death fundamentally damaged them in a pretty unique way.


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## darkreever (Apr 3, 2008)

ntaw said:


> but which Space Marines are more tied to their Primarch than the sons of Sanguinius? His death fundamentally damaged them in a pretty unique way.


The Iron Hands I would think, they might not have been damaged on the genetic level but mentality? Without a fucking doubt:laugh:


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## Platex (Feb 22, 2017)

Spoke to a GW store manager in my home town (major UK city) the other day. I bought the first 2 Gathering Storm books and we were talking about the third, the Guilleman model and the Warhammer Community post about the upcoming release.

Normally when you talk to GW people, you get the whole "oh well we don't know about that, we only hear about stuff when it arrives" etc. And this guy, from my experience, really isn't into the online rumour mill at all.

But this time, he said something along the lines of that the Dark Angels are rumoured to actually have been corrupted, that the "bad guys won" in his words, and actually Cypher is the good guy. He cited also the daemons infiltrating the Rock or being summoned by the DA, something to that effect, in last year's War Zone Fenris fluff. I'll be honest, I haven't read those books, 40K writing is generally total crap to me and Gathering Storm is the first release I've picked up. Even what I've read so far of Fall of Cadia is nothing on the Forgeworld content, the writing is full of paragraphs beginning with "but"s and "yet"s. Cringe.

All the same, pretty exciting. By the end of the year, we could have The Lion back as well. Wouldn't be surprised if most of the Loyalist Primarchs return, and that's the big shift. They've seen how the 30K sell like hotcakes, how can you miss that opportunity?


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## ntaw (Jul 20, 2012)

darkreever said:


> The Iron Hands I would think, they might not have been damaged on the genetic level but mentality? Without a fucking doubt:laugh:


:laugh: oh man, I just read their 40kwiki summary on the topic. Begrudged indeed! Good call.


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## Brother Lucian (Apr 22, 2011)

Huh, the dark angels rumored to be turning? Would be a chiller if that is true. I could see it happen, their secrecy comming back to bite them. But it would be a strong reason to why the Fallen Angels is seeking protection with Guiliman.


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## darkreever (Apr 3, 2008)

Platex said:


> But this time, he said something along the lines of that the Dark Angels are rumoured to actually have been corrupted, that the "bad guys won" in his words, and actually Cypher is the good guy.


Thats been a popular fan theory for the better part of twenty years. (I should know, I wrote some of it about fifteen years ago.)



Platex said:


> Even what I've read so far of Fall of Cadia is nothing on the Forgeworld content, the writing is full of paragraphs beginning with "but"s and "yet"s. Cringe.


Having not read it myself, unless every senteance in those paragraphs began with buts and yets I see no problem with that. Literary snobs may look down on the use of those words at the start, but they are not signs of bad writing; overusing any word at the start is an indicator of that.



Platex said:


> Wouldn't be surprised if most of the Loyalist Primarchs return, and that's the big shift.


Personally I hope not, the return of the primarchs would likely be the cause of another civil war for the Imperium.

How many of the primarchs would outright condemn the religious nature of the imperial church? Its a direct smack in the face of what they fought to achieve, a secular empire of man united under one banner. Now you have religion with a near stranglehold on the Imperium, the power wielded by the likes of the fractured Inquisition, and the infighting between imperial bodies if one gains a little to much sway.


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## Platex (Feb 22, 2017)

Brother Lucian said:


> Huh, the dark angels rumored to be turning? Would be a chiller if that is true. I could see it happen, their secrecy comming back to bite them. But it would be a strong reason to why the Fallen Angels is seeking protection with Guiliman.


Ya - to clarify it's more like the leaders of the Chapter are actually the Chaos faction within DA from HH era, rather than the whole thing. Kinda like what happened to the Blood Ravens.



darkreever said:


> Having not read it myself, unless every senteance in those paragraphs began with buts and yets I see no problem with that. Literary snobs may look down on the use of those words at the start, but they are not signs of bad writing; overusing any word at the start is an indicator of that.


Sorry, I was implying something more with messy lazy wording. It's more that it is LADEN with Deus ex Machina. Stuff like "BUT the loyalists pushed back and this push was greater than the 10 other's we've just described in the last 2 pages... BUT the traitors were unnamored" etc. Use of the 2 words is sporadic but it's pretty much the same thing. It's just really poor quality cheese. Like the processed slices you buy from Aldi. Where the Forgeworld is a 50 year old bottle of matured Red. Yaknow. And you're bringing it to a King's banquet. It should really be better, the universe (and standard of HH) demands better now.

Like I get it, it's designed so that it creates ~100 potential battles you can play out with your friends. But I think it's perhaps a bit too much specifics. Too many different forces maybe, referred to individually rather than the whole. It's lazy, that's the problem. Makes me kindof reticent to have paid £30 for it if I'm honest. For that price point, it's just not good enough to me. Not in 2017.



darkreever said:


> Personally I hope not, the return of the primarchs would likely be the cause of another civil war for the Imperium.
> 
> How many of the primarchs would outright condemn the religious nature of the imperial church? Its a direct smack in the face of what they fought to achieve, a secular empire of man united under one banner. Now you have religion with a near stranglehold on the Imperium, the power wielded by the likes of the fractured Inquisition, and the infighting between imperial bodies if one gains a little to much sway.


Depends. There's a lot of "they have their morals but the situation demands they work together" stuff in the 40k fluff being produced right now. Most SM Chapters already hate each other! Situation now has the Eye of Terror expanding uncontrolled, and Abaddon going for Terra. I can't see infighting taking precedent over that personally, no matter how poor writing it may be.


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## Shandathe (May 2, 2010)

darkreever said:


> How many of the primarchs would outright condemn the religious nature of the imperial church? Its a direct smack in the face of what they fought to achieve, a secular empire of man united under one banner. Now you have religion with a near stranglehold on the Imperium


That's one reason I'm hoping that Rise of the Primarch will have LESS battle and MORE character interaction than the other two books. Seriously, we'll have Guilliman and Celestine in one room. That's having a great champion of the old Secular Imperium in one corner and the very manifestation of the current Faith-based Imperium in the other. So much potential there you could probably fill the entire book just having them talk... 

And yet I expect them to waste it.

Fall of Cadia especially missed a lot of opportunities (the dynamic between Grexfax and Celestine, and perhaps Creed, really should have gotten more screen time). Fracture of Biel-Tan ALSO was a bunch of battles with only some teasing about what the characters involved were thinking/talking about.


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## darkreever (Apr 3, 2008)

Platex said:


> Most SM Chapters already hate each other!


Unless I missed something recently, thats very far from true. While most chapters prefer their own autonomy, very few outright hate one another. (Its like saying that most chapters hate the Ultramarines for being an example to strive for. Considering what they've accomplished thats far from true.)



Platex said:


> Situation now has the Eye of Terror expanding uncontrolled, and Abaddon going for Terra. I can't see infighting taking precedent over that personally, no matter how poor writing it may be.


[/quote]
Look into The Beast Arises series. Infighting and politics nearly destroyed the Imperium when it was closer to the height of its power. The actions, or rather lack of action in some cases, of some of the most powerful figures in the Imperium caused the destruction of a first founding chapter and nearly saw Terra herself invaded.



Shandathe said:


> That's one reason I'm hoping that Rise of the Primarch will have LESS battle and MORE character interaction than the other two books. Seriously, we'll have Guilliman and Celestine in one room. That's having a great champion of the old Secular Imperium in one corner and the very manifestation of the current Faith-based Imperium in the other. So much potential there you could probably fill the entire book just having them talk...


And yet you know its likely to be more of what we've gotten before.

I would have loved it if the Fall of Cadia had been a hybrid of the old black crusade campaign from years and years ago, with additions. Like Abaddon has a strong foothold on Cadia, the pylons are gone, he lost his blackstone fortresses thanks to the work of an emissary of Eldrad, and so on.

GW turned the clock back from that event, wish they could have nodded back to it rather than ignore it completely.


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## Tawa (Jan 10, 2010)

Warhammer 40,000.
Age of Guilliman.​

:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:


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## Brother Lucian (Apr 22, 2011)

Imgur: The most awesome images on the Internet

Found this large lump of White Dwarf Rise of the Primarch scans over on B&C, juuuuuuuicy! I am now even more eager to see the info in the full book!

Edit: Definitely an image full of portents to see Guiliman in his gilded armor, posed with Custodian guard, no? Certainly would give a reason to Legio Custodes to be active again. And coupled with the comment that they made Guiliman's armor gilded to look like the Emperor's.


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## koosbeer (Feb 25, 2008)

Im a Chaos fan. I love the whole look and feel of chaos but man, this whole Guiliman thing is giving me chills! Very excited about this!


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## Old Man78 (Nov 3, 2011)

The way I read this situation is "Guillman spent several millennia taking a career break ", I wonder what the primarch union reps got him to come back?


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## Haskanael (Jul 5, 2011)

Brother Lucian said:


> Imgur: The most awesome images on the Internet
> 
> Found this large lump of White Dwarf Rise of the Primarch scans over on B&C, juuuuuuuicy! I am now even more eager to see the info in the full book!
> 
> Edit: Definitely an image full of portents to see Guiliman in his gilded armor, posed with Custodian guard, no? Certainly would give a reason to Legio Custodes to be active again. And coupled with the comment that they made Guiliman's armor gilded to look like the Emperor's.


"Thousands of years. And look what has become of them. Of us. Idolatry. Ignorance. Suffering and squalor, in the name of a god who never desired the title." - Roboute Guilliman

a pretty daunting judgement on current affairs and the current leadership of the Imperium


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## Shandathe (May 2, 2010)

Old Man78 said:


> The way I read this situation is "Guillman spent several millennia taking a career break ", I wonder what the primarch union reps got him to come back?


Full back pay for his time injured in the line of duty, plus cumulative interest.




Haskanael said:


> a pretty daunting judgement on current affairs and the current leadership of the Imperium


And also an interesting acceptance of the Emperor's divinity. 

Admittedly, with Celestine RIGHT THERE that one's probably hard to deny.

I REALLY want to see a long discussion between those two.


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## Brother Lucian (Apr 22, 2011)

Spotted this crazy rumor over on BoLS
40K RUMORS: The Fragmented Emperor - Bell of Lost Souls


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## Haskanael (Jul 5, 2011)

Shandathe said:


> Full back pay for his time injured in the line of duty, plus cumulative interest.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


with greyfax interupting "BUT she is an ab.." "shut up" -Guilliman


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## Lord of the Night (Nov 18, 2009)

http://www.belloflostsouls.net/2017/03/rumor-control-rise-primarch.html

Ok so the three main rumours that have been confirmed to be crap are;

Neither Abaddon or the Emperor are dying, and we are not going to find out who Cypher is.

All of which I am quite happy with as I felt all three of those things wouldn't have been very good changes, particularly the first one.


LotN


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## jin (Feb 20, 2014)

From what I can tell from the pattern of info coming out, the types of propaganda coming from pro-corporate sites like BoLS and the reactions on various forums, the over-riding feeling is that many of the neckbearded long time loyalists are not gonna be happy with something about 8th ed rules... Not simply that the "fluff could've been written by Blizzard". My money is that this ends up with Girlyman leading a new range of Thundercastes that are much killier than mahweens and fatter too all fighting on the side of Order to hold the empire together, some Eldarini following suit (even the Dark ones apparently) and other factions fighting for their own influence filling in Destruction and/or Chaos slots, with the Death faction the usual suspects. The new models are nice but they are not miniature wargames pieces, really, they are collectibles first of all, and I am afraid the 41stK will reflect this attitude, with rules reinforcing the collectible card game feel and bad-comic book narrative loosely holding it all together.


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## ntaw (Jul 20, 2012)

Here's a nice (albeit old leak) zoom-in from Atia which (I think) highlights the course of the book:










Terra here we come...?


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## Lord of the Night (Nov 18, 2009)

Guilliman is not happy with the state of the Imperium.


LotN


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## ntaw (Jul 20, 2012)

Gret79 said:


> Hi, I finally got my copy of the shattering of biel-tan last night - this does work for Eldar.
> 
> 
> Any eldar taken in a SoBT formation gain the 'Ynnari faction'. So it skips the whole BB can't go in each others transports by making all the eldar the same faction.
> It doesn't change the unit options so you can't take DT raiders for CWE units, but you can choose to take a raider as a fast attack choice and put a craftworld or harlequin unit in it.


So GW released a FAQ today shooting this shit to the ground pretty hard. You can almost hear them say "c'mon guys, stop trying to put units into transports from different Codices" :laugh:



> Q: How do the models/units with mixed Factions work? Can units that share at least one Faction start the game embarked on a Transport?
> 
> A: Ynnari models have two Factions (except in the case of Yvraine, the Visarch and the Yncarne, who only have one). You must consider both of their Factions to determine their levels of Alliance and which Transports they may be embarked on at the beginning of the game. For example, an Eldar/Ynnari unit shares the same Factions as other Eldar/Ynnari, but is of different Factions from (though Battle Brothers with) Dark Eldar/Ynnari and Harlequins/Ynnari. An Eldar/Ynnari unit can therefore only begin the game embarked if it is embarked on an Eldar/Ynnari vehicle. Note that Yvraine and the Visarch can begin the game embarked on Ynnari vehicles (regardless of those vehicles’ other Factions).


Link to GSII FAQ


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## Gret79 (May 11, 2012)

ntaw said:


> So GW released a FAQ today shooting this shit to the ground pretty hard. You can almost hear them say "c'mon guys, stop trying to put units into transports from different Codices" :laugh:
> 
> 
> 
> Link to GSII FAQ


 
Came here to post the link to the faq and an acknowledgment that you were right - but you beat me to it  


Yep, back to no more Banshees on the table :laugh:

That's saved me some dusting..


(Edit - although you can still start on the table and then embark onto a battle brothers transport as per the brb. You just can't start embarked which is what the faq addressed)


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## ntaw (Jul 20, 2012)

Gret79 said:


> Came here to post the link to the faq and an acknowledgment that you were right - but you beat me to it
> 
> 
> Yep, back to no more Banshees on the table :laugh:
> ...


I really hope this is clearly addressed in any new ruleset that may or may not be coming out this year.


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## Brother Lucian (Apr 22, 2011)

https://1d4chan.org/wiki/Roboute_Guilliman#SUDDENLY.2C_THE_STORM.21

4d chan have a posting of rules. And theres an ongoing leak discussion of his rules over on B&C
Roboute Guilliman rules - + NEWS, RUMORS, AND BOARD ANNOUNCEMENTS + - The Bolter and Chainsword


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## ntaw (Jul 20, 2012)

A snipped from the end of GSIII via Atia's blog:



> Incoming transmission
> 
> The Gathering Storm is over.
> 
> ...


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## Brother Lucian (Apr 22, 2011)

ntaw said:


> A snipped from the end of GSIII via Atia's blog:


With the above snippet about a second Great Crusade, I am feeling increasingly certain that the space marine legions of old will return. Especially if more primarchs returns and the successors flocks to their founders. Would be a significant twist to 8th edition, but it would give Guiliman the leverage to truly change the Imperium.


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## Roganzar (Feb 16, 2014)

So part 3 of this whole Gathering Storm thing is up to look at.









This little box comes with Roboute Guilliman, Grand Master Voldus and the Fallen Angel Cypher. 
Right I have a question, this question might even get me to blow some cash on the book. That question is, WHY IN THE NAME OF THE EMPEROR'S BONEY ASS IS CYPHER HERE?????????????????????????????????????
*clears throat*
I know they haven't really done anything, I mean anything, with Cypher other than him whispering to Luther on Caliban during the Heresy. They kept Cypher "enigmatic." (Please read "enigmatic" as spookily and sarcastically as possible) I've wanted a good Cypher figure for ages now, and this one is damn nice. So thank you GW for this. 
Seriously, though why? Did Trazyn just show up throw a pokeball, yelling "Cypher I choose you!" Then pop away again. I'm betting Cypher is somehow responsible for Guilliman's awakening, and if Guilliman doesn't immediately act exasperated at all the people worshiping him, I'm gonna be disappointed. 
I'm going to be disappointed aren't I?

Anyways, sorry this just got under my skin.

So here's big blue,








Not Kaldor Draigo,








and, *grumble grumble* Cypher.








Also, why does Cypher have the Lion's Sword strapped to his back? Someone? Anyone? As long as its going to the revived Lion el'Jonson I'll be okay. That's got to be it. Right. Right?


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## Brother Lucian (Apr 22, 2011)

Cypher have always been hinted to be carrying around the Lion sword. And from what I heard, the fall of cadia was causing severe warp storms in the galaxy and making travel dangerous. But the fallen angels approached guiliman, offering to take him to terra through secret warp routes known to them, in exchange for being taken to Terra. Fluff have also had Cypher wanting the Emperor's forgiveness for the fallen angels.


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## Khorne's Fist (Jul 18, 2008)

There was also talk back in the day that the sword may have been more than just a sword, something about it being a data storage device, like a very big, very sharp USB stick. What that data might be that it contains is another question altogether.


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## Brother Lucian (Apr 22, 2011)

Khorne's Fist said:


> There was also talk back in the day that the sword may have been more than just a sword, something about it being a data storage device, like a very big, very sharp USB stick. What that data might be that it contains is another question altogether.


Might you not be thinking of the Sword of Secrets used by Azrael? Its pretty much the master key to the Rock.
Sword of Secrets | Warhammer 40k | Fandom powered by Wikia


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## Khorne's Fist (Jul 18, 2008)

Yeah, I knew about that, but when Cypher was first introduced there was talk that he had to get the sword to Terra because of what it was or what it contained, rather than he just happened to be carrying it whilst on his way to Terra.


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## Shandathe (May 2, 2010)

I'm just glad it's finally looking to be CONFIRMED that it's the Lion's Blade. Don't know what will happen to the Dark Angels with the Fallen becoming a more open secret, but it's unlikely to be TOO bad given that Dark Vengeance has brought them a ton of players


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## Roganzar (Feb 16, 2014)

Brother Lucian said:


> Cypher have always been hinted to be carrying around the Lion sword. And from what I heard, the fall of cadia was causing severe warp storms in the galaxy and making travel dangerous. But the fallen angels approached guiliman, offering to take him to terra through secret warp routes known to them, in exchange for being taken to Terra. Fluff have also had Cypher wanting the Emperor's forgiveness for the fallen angels.





Khorne's Fist said:


> There was also talk back in the day that the sword may have been more than just a sword, something about it being a data storage device, like a very big, very sharp USB stick. What that data might be that it contains is another question altogether.





Brother Lucian said:


> Might you not be thinking of the Sword of Secrets used by Azrael? Its pretty much the master key to the Rock.
> Sword of Secrets | Warhammer 40k | Fandom powered by Wikia





Khorne's Fist said:


> Yeah, I knew about that, but when Cypher was first introduced there was talk that he had to get the sword to Terra because of what it was or what it contained, rather than he just happened to be carrying it whilst on his way to Terra.


I apparently missed a bunch of this. Wondering where these snippets are at in the hive-city sized pile of lore, as I'd be interested in seeing how they put all this. As I'm sure it's all scattered. 

This does explain some of it. And I can totally see the Fallen wanting redemption from the Emperor, or well most of them. 
This cushions the disappointment I fear GW are going to cause me with how they explain this. 
Quick question, does this all feel rushed to any one else or is it just me? These events are huge and I think they require deeper insight into what's going on here. Especially the craziness with the Eldar and Guilliman getting back in the game.

And why isn't the Grey Knight of this Kaldor Draigo? You'd think with all the crazy Warp stuff going on his warp-dust snorting ass would be in the middle of this. Or is he to busy hanging out with Leman Russ in the Eye of Terror?


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## Shandathe (May 2, 2010)

Roganzar said:


> And why isn't the Grey Knight of this Kaldor Draigo? You'd think with all the crazy Warp stuff going on his warp-dust snorting ass would be in the middle of this. Or is he to busy hanging out with Leman Russ in the Eye of Terror?


Presumably the Grey Knights needed some people that actually Got Shit Done while Draigo's off at the Tzeentch School for Learning (that you're Completely Ineffective). Draigo's current status is a tragic horribleness that one wouldn't wish on their worst enemy, despite his original entry selling it as a heroic epic. 

He might actually show up for a bit, the Warzones/GS books do seem to take joy in pulling faction-appropriate Special Characters in (and offing some of them).


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## Gret79 (May 11, 2012)

I don't know if I'm late with this but Guillimans rules have been leaked.
He seems cheap for what he can do 


Edited to remove Link - Khorne's Fist has posted the pic beneath


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## Brother Lucian (Apr 22, 2011)

Shandathe said:


> Presumably the Grey Knights needed some people that actually Got Shit Done while Draigo's off at the Tzeentch School for Learning (that you're Completely Ineffective). Draigo's current status is a tragic horribleness that one wouldn't wish on their worst enemy, despite his original entry selling it as a heroic epic.
> 
> He might actually show up for a bit, the Warzones/GS books do seem to take joy in pulling faction-appropriate Special Characters in (and offing some of them).


From what I hear, Draigo actually makes a cameo, promoting Voldus to grandmaster, then off again he goes.


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## Khorne's Fist (Jul 18, 2008)




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## Roganzar (Feb 16, 2014)

He's impressive stat wise. A bit hard to read all that. Let's see, Str 10/AP1 sword (that does D damage), a IWND that Iron Hands are jealous of (looks like a 4+ and he gets back up next round with a bunch of wounds restored), and either 6 or 8 attacks (not clear there) at Initiative 6 or 8.
Costs way less than Magnus (as the only other Primarch in 40K to compare against). In fact, he costs less than the Horus Heresy version of himself, (400 pts. by the way).
Edit: just found these


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## ntaw (Jul 20, 2012)

Have some clarity:










EDIT: oo this is fancy too. Wonder what the bottom half says:


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## Roganzar (Feb 16, 2014)

ntaw said:


> Have some clarity:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Clearer, thank you.
Now with the Fallen, do they count as Imperium or Chaos?
If Imperium than I think it's safe to say GWs plan will be to start a new Great Crusade, with Cypher releasing the Emperor from his undead stuck-on-the-toilet state.


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## Brother Lucian (Apr 22, 2011)

Word is that Fallen Angels is an entirely new faction, that can battlebrother with the imperium, sans Dark Angels, and Chaos Space Marines. But hating Daemons.


Scroll down.


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## darkreever (Apr 3, 2008)

Mind bringing the info here Lucian, rather than have people go to another site?


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## ntaw (Jul 20, 2012)

Currently digging for more Fallen stuff. I saw a ton of pics, gotta remember where.

EDIT: Well, that was easier than I thought. Someone took screenshots of the BoLS video, so it's pretty blurry. I can read them pretty clearly when I'm on my desktop and zoom in on the images in Imgur but on my phone they're nearly unreadable. 

Linky


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## Brother Lucian (Apr 22, 2011)




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## ntaw (Jul 20, 2012)

Brother Lucian said:


>


:laugh: well that's pretty friggin' clear!!


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## Haskanael (Jul 5, 2011)

looks like I will be building and converting myself some units of fallen


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## Serpion5 (Mar 19, 2010)

Is anyone else perturbed by the fact that Fallen Angels can ally with Chaos Space Marines AND the Imperium at Battle Brother level? 

I find that most perturbatory. Most perturbatory indeed... The theories are swirling in my head... 

Redemption?


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## Brother Lucian (Apr 22, 2011)

Well if you remember past fluff, Cypher and company have played the switcheroo with both the Imperium and the Traitor legions for millenia. Running their own long game.

Some of the Fallen are fully fledged chaos space marines as the nurgle corrupted ones seen in the Legacy of Caliban series. Others are merely renegade.


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## ntaw (Jul 20, 2012)

Legion of the Damned show up in GSIII it seems. There's other pics but they're muy blurry and in French as well.


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## Khorne's Fist (Jul 18, 2008)

Cypher is a beast. Hit and Run, BS10 even on overwatch, I8, Plasma pistol never gets hot and fires 2 shots, bolt pistol has extended range and 2 shots, can use his plasma pistol for half his attacks in CC. Looks like all he's missing is an invulnerable save.


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## Old Man78 (Nov 3, 2011)

Really want that cypher mini!


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## Roganzar (Feb 16, 2014)

Old Man78 said:


> Really want that cypher mini!


Same here.
I liked the old one too, but never got around to getting it. This one however has a great pose. Plasma out and reaching for the bolt pistol. The tattered cloak with those big thick stitches in it. Looks awesome. I've thought of doing a Fallen warband a time or two in the past. Might do one after I finish other projects that I need to complete.


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## ntaw (Jul 20, 2012)

Once I finish (lol, start) painting my Deathwing army I may just have to do a contingent of Fallen for them to hunt right proper. Can't wait for that story arc to be hashed out!


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## Khorne's Fist (Jul 18, 2008)

ntaw said:


> Once I finish (lol, start) painting my Deathwing army I may just have to do a contingent of Fallen for them to hunt right proper. Can't wait for that story arc to be hashed out!


I'm gonna do the same. I had a look at their stats, and it seems I can make the exact same unit using a Deathwatch veteran squad apart from the LD10, just paint it up as Fallen. I have a heap of MkIII and IV plastics lying around. Any excuse to get Cypher onto the table.


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## Old Man78 (Nov 3, 2011)

Roganzar said:


> Same here.
> I liked the old one too, but never got around to getting it. This one however has a great pose. Plasma out and reaching for the bolt pistol. The tattered cloak with those big thick stitches in it. Looks awesome. I've thought of doing a Fallen warband a time or two in the past. Might do one after I finish other projects that I need to complete.



My first legion love, was the Dark Angels, but GWs making them a caricature of themselves put me off. I have a squad of RT ere marines in DA colours, I should post a pic of them up, they are awful! I could always paint up a few DA, just for old times sake, nothing to do with the plastic crack addiction


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## ntaw (Jul 20, 2012)

Khorne's Fist said:


> I had a look at their stats


What stats, these stats? :grin:










Whoa just noticed they can take an autocannon. Maybe this means GW will release plastic autocannons some time?? I mean, DA just gotta be revisited with a campaign book of their very own dealing with them and the Fallen.


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## Khorne's Fist (Jul 18, 2008)

ntaw said:


> What stats, these stats? :grin:


Yeah, weren't they up here already? That's how I knew about the LD10.


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## Roganzar (Feb 16, 2014)

Neat.
There is a lot of mix and match available there. These guys seem ideal for a cobbled-together armor/wargear look. Just want to get a bunch of different marks, robed armor, and kit-bash Fallen together. 

Arg. Damnit GW stop making me want more projects.


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## Haskanael (Jul 5, 2011)

Roganzar said:


> Arg. Damnit GW stop making me want more projects.


I know the feel, I'm gonna be putting together an alied force of fallen for 40K soon enough :laugh:


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## ntaw (Jul 20, 2012)

Khorne's Fist said:


> Yeah, weren't they up here already? That's how I knew about the LD10.


I posted the top half of the picture when I found out there were rules for the Fallen in the book, just found that one prior to coming here to post it. Maybe it was in a link someone tossed up? I dunno. There it is for reference anyway k:

EDIT: This looks to be all the rules from the book spoiled.

Linkzilla


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## Khorne's Fist (Jul 18, 2008)




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## gen.ahab (Dec 22, 2009)

That WS and BS, doe. 

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


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## shaantitus (Aug 3, 2009)

I have been off the clock for a while with life and other things, and holy shit, a primarch has come back while I was gone. Really liking the developments and feeling motivated, which has been a bit lacking of late. My only gripe is that guilliman looks like he was put into a coma by ferrus mannus or vulkan. Looks like he had is lights punched out rather than being poisoned. He was revived with the uglystick. What happened to his noble countenance? He looks like Micky Rourke.


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## Shandathe (May 2, 2010)

shaantitus said:


> I have been off the clock for a while with life and other things, and holy shit, a primarch has come back while I was gone. Really liking the developments and feeling motivated, which has been a bit lacking of late. My only gripe is that guilliman looks like he was put into a coma by ferrus mannus or vulkan. Looks like he had is lights punched out rather than being poisoned. He was revived with the uglystick. What happened to his noble countenance? He looks like Micky Rourke.


That's mostly the paint job. No idea why the painting guide has you paint walls under his eyes, but meh. Put the head with the helmet on, it looks better in all respects.


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## Entarion (Oct 25, 2009)

Last few months I have been checking hobby very irregularly so I have completely missed that storm is gathering in warhammer world. Until, by a chance, I visited GW shop during my business trip and shop assistant showed me Guilliman and Cypher. Of course, I was like "WOAAA". Not because I care about UM but Cypher making appearance may lead to resurrection of Lion as well. So from that time (about the end of February) I was in hobby instantly.

Since then, I have read Fenris, Cadia and Biel-Tan supplements. I noticed that there were other "parallel" events happening like Damocles and Baal.

My questions is: Are there any other events or list of them which are somehow tied to Time of Ending timeline? What about Sanctus reach and so ? I would really like to catch up on those events before 8th edition drops all the new stuff.

I might be even happy for any comprehensive summaries as I don't plan to buy Damocles or Baal.


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## Kharn The Complainer (Aug 19, 2015)

Entarion said:


> ... may lead to resurrection of Lion as well.


Yeah, it'll be interesting to see him finally join the traitor marines. Where he belongs.


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