# SM Land Raider, Redeemer, or Crusader?



## sphere830 (Aug 4, 2009)

Ok, I have finally freed the money that I need to invest in a big, bad, and ugly SM LR. The question is, which one? Essentially, this is the last transport for my 2250 collection of Crimson Fists and will be used to take my terminators into battle. What is your advice regarding which land raider variant to take? I'm looking for a generally all-comer use that will serve in friendly games as well as competitive games.

Thanks in advance!k:k:


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## Baltar (Aug 16, 2008)

I'm going to get my say in before every single competitive player decides to jump down your throat and claim that you MUST take a Crusader because ITZ TEH BEST ONE!

Personally, I think that the standard land raider is versatile, and it will fit your terminators nicely


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## Don_Keyballs (Jan 14, 2010)

The crusader / redeemer come in the same box. So technically you only have to worry about buy 1 or the other. One thing I managed to do is, I bought the regular Land Raider box, and bought the Crusader / Redeemer conversion kit off GW and I made the side spounces interchangable so I can use it as whatever tank I want. So if I want Las to deal with armor or if I want the crusader / redeemer for hordes. That way you get the best of both worlds without having to buy multiple LR's. As for what is better, it strictly determines what you are going against. Regular LR would be best if you need Anti-tank. Crusader for horde lists like orks or nids and for extra capacity, and I really like the redeemers str 6 ap 3 flame templates against Meq armies. You don't need to roll to hit with machine spirit with those template weapons . Hope this helps.


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## Epatus (May 17, 2009)

Sanguinius has it, It is generally accepted that a Land Raider Crusader with a Multi Melta is the best choice. This Crusader has the weapons to deal with whatever is put into front of it. And it has power of the machine spirit. For example, shoot a transport with the MM, blow the transport up, shoot whoever was inside with the assault cannon and bolters (and if they dont run away assault them with the terminators).

The redeemer is too short range.


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## Stella Cadente (Dec 25, 2006)

the best one to take is the one you prefer the look of.

no point owning something that you think looks shit


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## Baltar (Aug 16, 2008)

Epatus said:


> Sanguinius has it, It is generally accepted that a Land Raider Crusader with a Multi Melta is the best choice. This Crusader has the weapons to deal with whatever is put into front of it. And it has power of the machine spirit. For example, shoot a transport with the MM, blow the transport up, shoot whoever was inside with the assault cannon and bolters (and if they dont run away assault them with the terminators).
> 
> The redeemer is too short range.


Except that if you shoot at the transport with the MM, then you cannot shoot whatever was in it on the same turn, because you had to declare all of your shooting before you start to resolve it, and the models in the transporter were not on the table at the start of the shooting phase. You assume that the hurricane bolters are shooting at the same time as the MM, not one after the other - as with ALL weapons in the shooting phase.


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## gen.ahab (Dec 22, 2009)

I would go with the LRR but tbh it's whatever you think is the most fun to field.


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## Baltar (Aug 16, 2008)

Buy some magnets.


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## gen.ahab (Dec 22, 2009)

This is also true. Lol I wish they all just came in one damn box but OH no that would be convenient. God forbid GW actual somthing nice for their fan base. Lol


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## Baltar (Aug 16, 2008)

They DO sell the crusader sprue online, which is kind of _half_way_ cool, I suppose.


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## sphere830 (Aug 4, 2009)

Hey, thanks, I think I will magnetize this model and spend some time on customizing it since its such an investment anyway, right? So a regular raider it is, then picking up the sprue from GW and some Fists icon bits. Thanks again for the advice.


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## Baltar (Aug 16, 2008)

Exactly what I did, except with my BA's LR! :grin:


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## HOBO (Dec 7, 2007)

You should make use of the weaponry each varient comes with - If it's for transporting Assault TDA into c/c asap then go for either the Crusader and/or Redeemer...clear the immediate area of some of the enemy units, then disembark and assault what's left. If you want to hang back for a few turns sniping away at high AV targets/MC's, and then advance to drop off your Termi's then go with the Godhammer.

But yea, as far as the Redeemer/Crusader are concerned, Magnets are the way to go.


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## Ferik (Nov 5, 2008)

I find you should get one depending on what type of fire power you are lacking in your army.

If you need some more anti-tank a normal Landraider
Anti-troop the crusader
Both of which excell at those particular task and the troops the transport can then back them up in their particular task or if you like take on the opposite task of anti-tank or anti-troop.
as for the Redeemer like the others have said too short ranged so not overly effective in normal games.


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## sphere830 (Aug 4, 2009)

Thanks again for the valuable beta. Putting together a 1500 point list currently for a first 40k tournament!


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## Calamari (Feb 13, 2009)

*ahem*shameless self promotion*ahem*

In all seriousness though, this tactica got alot of contribution to it.


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## Barnster (Feb 11, 2010)

Going back the machine spirit allows the LR to split its fire between targets.

As far as the Redeemer goes, there is something incredable satifying about melting a rhino to then burn the traitors that stumble out


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## KingOfCheese (Jan 4, 2010)

Barnster said:


> Going back the machine spirit allows the LR to split its fire between targets.
> 
> As far as the Redeemer goes, there is something incredable satifying about melting a rhino to then burn the traitors that stumble out


I thought that all shots had to be fired simultaneously?


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## Baltar (Aug 16, 2008)

They do.

You can not shoot at the passengers of a transporter in the same turn that you can destroy the transporter - anyone playing this way is playing the game so wrongly that it hurts my face.


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## Ordo Xeno Commander (Jan 17, 2007)

Can someone please quote the new POTMS because I don't think it allows you to split fire anymore, just allows you to fire one weapon regardless of movement/stunned/shaken.

And Baltar, you forgot to include the crucial part of that. You CAN shoot at the occupants of a destroyed vehicle, just not with the same unit you just fired with. It is perfectly plausible to destroy a rhino with one unit and then kill the occupants with another. Your whole army doesn't fire at once, just each model within a unit shoots simultaneously.


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## Baltar (Aug 16, 2008)

It does allow you to split fire with one weapon.


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## Ordo Xeno Commander (Jan 17, 2007)

As I said, can you please quote the codex or FAQ on that.


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## Baltar (Aug 16, 2008)

Ok, here is the exact wording:



> A Land Raider can fire one more weapon than would normally be permitted. In addition, this weapon can be fired at a different target unit to any other weapons, subject to the normal rules of shooting.


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## Ordo Xeno Commander (Jan 17, 2007)

Ok cool. Simple. Use the melta to blow up a rhino, flame some other unit, and kill the occupants of the rhino with another unit.


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## Baltar (Aug 16, 2008)

You can't shoot at the occupants of the Rhino in that turn, because they were not on the table at the start of the shooting phase, and you must declare ALL of your shooting at the start of the phase before resolving it. IE: the models inside the rhino are not on the board to declare any shooting against them, so they can not be targeted during that turn.


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## XionXxen (Apr 27, 2010)

So from your standpoint, say I blow up a rhino with 1 unit, I can't then kill the occupants with a totally seperate unit? That seems a bit wrong to me and not how I've seen the game played.


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## Baltar (Aug 16, 2008)

XionXxen said:


> So from your standpoint, say I blow up a rhino with 1 unit, I can't then kill the occupants with a totally seperate unit? That seems a bit wrong to me and not how I've seen the game played.


EDIT:

My bad.

I am getting confused with the assault phase.

In the shooting phase you do take each units' turn to shoot seperately. So, yeah, you could completely battyrape some squad in a tank.


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## ChaosSpaceMarineGuy (Jan 29, 2010)

Well it all depends on what you want to do with the Land Raider. 2 main points.
1. I you want to get it into battle asap, then take the Crusader or Reedemer. The Crusader would be my choice because you can move 6 inches and shoot both hurricane bolters plus the assault cannon or multi-melta. 2. If you want to keep it a shooting platform then go regular LR.

The best thing to do since you are not sure is to proxy each LR option and find out which one you like the best. Also, when you go to buy a LR, the Crusader/Redeemer parts come in one box. _If_ you wanted to magnitized you could. The standard LR comed by itself.


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