# Chaos Grey Knights (something that makes sense)



## Lupercal101 (Jan 26, 2009)

I have wanted to make a chaos grey knight army 4 a while but it dosen't make any sense cince grey knights can't fall to chaos. So I thought what if they were dead Grey Knight who had been brought to life by a chaos sorcerer! their armour and bodies could be mauled (because they died of that on the batlefield) if people like that sort of thing, or someone might have planted a bomb where the air tanks were on a grey knight battle barge and let them off after the ship had left orbit. Then the weapons,armour,bodies would have been perfectly preserved if people want a normal grey knight force, just chaotic! it's just an idea but tell me what you think.


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## World Eater XII (Dec 12, 2008)

It would be good but i think using the GK codex and then use it as a basis of a uber elite chaos force with the same shite but with a chaos/daemonic twist..dead GK brough back to life seems a bit odd to me, even in the 40k 'verse


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## Eliazar (Jan 28, 2009)

I don't think that there was ever and incident when Grey Knights died in huge numbers and their gene seed was not recovered.

And I don't think that you can just secretly sneak onto their battle barge and blow up the whole oxygen supply so they all suffocate. Further, I wonder if Chaos can bring back sapient zombies in large numbers. If not, you'd have a force of grey knight bodies with damages brains (due to the cut off oxygen supply), so without being a real killer anymore.

Thus, I'd second the World Eater's advice - use the Grey Knights codes as an Elite force, like Black Legion CSM who were once upon a time members of the First Company of the Luna Wolves, for example.


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## Red Orc (Jun 14, 2007)

I wouldn't have a problem with it personally, as long as it was a Grey Knights legal list and the models were clear about what they represented... but I've been demoted from "Team Fluff" and had to go and play with the much less cool "Team Counts-As" (Coach, Galahad G. Galahad) recently, so you don't have to take any notice of anything I say.

:using Codex: Yoghurt to represent a cyclops:


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## normtheunsavoury (Mar 20, 2008)

I've always quite liked the idea of Chaotic GK, but I'm yet to come across a good reason for them fluff wise.
I suppose another reason could be they are a failed early experiment, thought destroyed but now they have resurfaced. A few thousand years of fighting in the Eye of Terror has made up for any deficiencies they may have had as 'not quite finished' Grey Knights, and although fluff wise they may be different stat wise they could be identical.

Chaos GK are always going to be difficult to pull off thanks to so many "I know that no Grey Knights have ever fallen to Chaos, these are the only ones." stories in GW and gaming clubs since the GK were invented.

Good luck with it though, I'll keep an eye on this one and see what people come up with.


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## revenant13 (Feb 15, 2008)

When GK die arent the bodies taken back to Titan? if not, then i see no problem with that reasoning.


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## Son of mortarion (Apr 24, 2008)

It does seem as if the reasoning is iffy, more an excuse to have grey knights that are servants of chaos because you want grey knights, than a real, "it could happen in the 40k universe" reason. 

Instead of trying to make a grey knight that serves chaos, how about making a servant of chaos that is equivalent, like Red Orc said. Instead of a nemisis force halberd, a minor daemon weapon, instead of psycannons, warp infused heavy bolter/autocannon/stubber type weapon, there is no reason that you can't take the rules, apply the "counts as" principle, and then create a good, fluffy unit. Just avoid any reasoning that requires a '"what if," that tends towards rationalizing bending/breaking fluff and or rules for who can ally with who.


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## Red Orc (Jun 14, 2007)

Yes. Exactly what Son of Mortarian said. That's what I _should_ have said, if I was being helpful instead of a doofus.

As pretty much everyone has suggested so far, in fact, the best way to go seems to be an elite daemon-infested force that has the same stats as GK, but a different justification.

It does get very very complex if you want allies though. Chaos marine allies have to be loyalist marines that 'count as chaos'... but you can take inducted 'traitor' guard, I guess... and crucially, your models must be clear if you're using the 'counts as' principle.

For instance, I use the Blood Angel Codex for my Chaos marines force. But my Chaos marines are red, except for my "Death Eaters" (Death Company World Eaters) who are painted black. My 'regular' berzerkers have bone helmets (like the BA yellow helmets) etc. So apart from the models being chaosy, the paintwork 'looks' BA (and colour, eg of helmets, is the main difference between BA units), so there should be no surprises for my opponent. 

As long as you bear in mind the principle that what you're representing should be obvious and/or logical (so things that look the same have the same rules), 'counts as' can be a really liberating way to play.

But, whether you decide to go down the 'somehow corrupted Grey Knights' route, or the 'elite Chaos force that just happens to use the Daemonhunter Army list' route, I'd be interested to hear what you come up with to explain these terrifying new servants of Chaos!

:agog cyclops:


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## Fester (Apr 15, 2009)

Well one way, least on Apoc games. Field Grey Knight models as your zombies, for the Plague of Zombies unit choice. Though you would lose any thing special about them, that way.


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## Lupercal101 (Jan 26, 2009)

Son of mortarion said:


> It does seem as if the reasoning is iffy, more an excuse to have grey knights that are servants of chaos because you want grey knights, than a real, "it could happen in the 40k universe" reason.
> 
> Instead of trying to make a grey knight that serves chaos, how about making a servant of chaos that is equivalent, like Red Orc said. Instead of a nemisis force halberd, a minor daemon weapon, instead of psycannons, warp infused heavy bolter/autocannon/stubber type weapon, there is no reason that you can't take the rules, apply the "counts as" principle, and then create a good, fluffy unit. Just avoid any reasoning that requires a '"what if," that tends towards rationalizing bending/breaking fluff and or rules for who can ally with who.


But then their not grey knights. If you combined normtheunsavory's idea with that it would make more sense, like the first grey knights were faulty so they decided to kill them but the faulty grey knights found out before they were killed so they ran away and gave their fealty to chaos because they felt they had been betrayed.I would also look cool, with a deamon halberd and stuff like that


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## World Eater XII (Dec 12, 2008)

I think a using the GK codex with a daemonic/chaos twist to represent say abbadon's elite termies/retuine, would be easier instead of trying to jump and break the "no GK has ever fallen to chaos" bandwagon.


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## Red Orc (Jun 14, 2007)

Lupercal101 said:


> But then their not grey knights...


...which is the point. Chaos doesn't have Grey Knights. Therefore, if you want to field them as a Chaos force, they're _not Grey Knights_.

We're all suggesting that instead of thinking "how can I justify Grey Knights falling to Chaos?" ie "how can I make something that's _explicitly never happened in the 40k universe_ happen?", a better way of looking at is "what could be a Grey Knight equivalent for Chaos?" and having an elite Chaos army with Daemonic Halberds and Warpcannons and Black Crusaders (actually, I really like the idea of Black Crusaders... yoink! - the sound of me stealing my own idea...) and such like.

:by the book cyclops:


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## Talos (Aug 4, 2008)

If you are doing count as I good count as for the psycannon would be the Old Kai gun which fires the hatred of the user at the enemy.
I dont believe at all that a GK cant fall to chaos.
In daemon world a GK very nearly does fall to Chaos and this guy is a badass GK. If a normal GK was put in his position it would have either died or turned.


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## Eliazar (Jan 28, 2009)

I agree with the notion that Chaotic Grey Knights are not possible, at least not in any numbers that you could field them as an army. I'd say, if you like the Codex, or the challenge of converting Grey Knights to Chaos, go for a "counts as" army.

Further, I think making up a cool theme for an individual "counts as" army is much better and much more rewarding than making up some super-strange, far off explanation just to use the Codex. If I was fighting, say the fallen First Company, I'd say "Hey, cool idea!", but if I was fighting a horde of Zombie Grey Knights killed by a mysterious bomb that left their bodies and equipment whole and resurrected by an evil space necromancer of Chaos, I'd say "OMG..."


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## Klomster (Oct 9, 2008)

The most simple thing to do is this.

Theese are my chaos dudes.
They are strangely similar to grey knights, with deamon halberds, knight style helmets and deamonic mutations.

They are not grey knights but have things that makes grey knights cool.

It's not even worth trying to get anyone to think "they are chaos grey knights" even chaos players would agree with loyalists in that scenario.

With the strangely similar way of doing it though, you can even use the gk models.
Just chaosify them enough and remove all gk heraldry.

I say this as an devoted grey knight player.


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## Lupercal101 (Jan 26, 2009)

I'm not trying to break the 'no grey knight has ever fallen to chaos bandwagon', but as i said before the first grey knights could have been faulty, so the Imperium tried to destroy them but the grey knights found out before that happened and ran away. they tried t re-enter the imperium but there was a 'exommunate tratoris' on them and they were attack every time they revealed themselves. 

it would kind of be like the whole eldar thing where the majority of the group stayed (eldar) true bt some of them went renagaed (dark eldar). Mabye they felt like the emperor had betrayed them by not doing anything to change this an if he was alive/kind/watching he would have seen they were pure. Maybe, like the dark eldar, they didn't devote themselves to chaos but became 'freedom fighters' or mercinaries or something. or maybe they joined chaos un-divided and started there own cult. so then in the game they could be leaders of a rebel army or part of abaddons peronal retinue and stuff like that.


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## Iraqiel (May 21, 2008)

I really think that having an association with fallen grey knights is only a good idea if you like butting your head against a concrete wall - take that as either metaphorical or literal, it doesn't really matter. 

It just seems to be an immutable law that grey knights, as a whole chapter, are the most bloody minded and infallible of the emperor's servants. Having said that, has a custodian ever fallen? What if you made your army a chapter of renegades led by a fallen Adeptus Custodes marine who has trained them personally?


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## Col. Schafer (Apr 15, 2008)

How about alpha liegon or someone equaly wierd impersonating grey knights?


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## Shugotenshi47 (Mar 2, 2008)

Talos said:


> If you are doing count as I good count as for the psycannon would be the Old Kai gun which fires the hatred of the user at the enemy.
> I dont believe at all that a GK cant fall to chaos.
> In daemon world a GK very nearly does fall to Chaos and this guy is a badass GK. If a normal GK was put in his position it would have either died or turned.


My take on it is that the only reason why he lived long enough to be put in that position was he was so badass anyone of lesser skill would have been killed a long time before (see spoiler bellow for reasoning). I think that because the only ones that can live long enough to be put in a position where they are broken down to such a level are stronger enough to overcome makes them incorruptible 

Spoiler:



such as his battle-brother who was killed in their first fight in the arena


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## Concrete Hero (Jun 9, 2008)

Lupercal101 said:


> it would kind of be like the whole eldar thing where the majority of the group stayed (eldar) true bt some of them went renagaed (dark eldar).



Just wanting to point out; Its sort of the opposite with the Eldar. The Dark Eldar are the ones who have stayed with their decadent ways and it is the 'Eldar' who have reformed themselves and changed, DarK Eldar aren't renegade


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## Talos (Aug 4, 2008)

I think if you really wanted to put a grey knight in your Army then you should only have one as your HQ. Maybe he was sent on a mission to cleanse a world but was captured and then tortured for thousands of years and finally cracked. Although it would be a bit pointless as by fluff he should not have his armour or weapons as they hurt daemons around him so he would have gotten rid of them.
I think its better just to let the whole Chaos grey knights rest.


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## Klomster (Oct 9, 2008)

I'm getting your thoughts here mr OP.

Your referring to your chaos grey knights as beeing grey knights MK 1, an experiment that failed.

It didn't meet the specifications (ie, all of them got corrupted at once, not very succesful)
So the imperium excomunicated them like the flame falcons.

The flame falcons was (for the ones that don't know) a cursed founding chapter that after a battle ignited with strange flames.

It didn't hurt them and the falcons thought it was a gift from the emperor and feasted in celebration.
The grey knights, did not. The grey knights followed their orders and exterminated the entire chapter.
A few flame falcons is rumoured to have gotten away, feeling betrayed by their imperium, and with burning bodies, theres no real way of coming back.

Anyway, you mean that your chaos grey knights would be grey knights MK 1, and the grey knights that have never suffered a single brother to fall to chaos are grey knights MK 2.

This thought isn't really that bad but the others didn't really think of it as soon as i did. (Or perhaps you did, i began thinking he meant it at my last post.)


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## Chaoz94 (Jun 17, 2008)

Lupercal101 said:


> I'm not trying to break the 'no grey knight has ever fallen to chaos bandwagon', but as i said before the first grey knights could have been faulty, so the Imperium tried to destroy them but the grey knights found out before that happened and ran away. they tried t re-enter the imperium but there was a 'exommunate tratoris' on them and they were attack every time they revealed themselves.
> 
> it would kind of be like the whole eldar thing where the majority of the group stayed (eldar) true bt some of them went renagaed (dark eldar). Mabye they felt like the emperor had betrayed them by not doing anything to change this an if he was alive/kind/watching he would have seen they were pure. Maybe, like the dark eldar, they didn't devote themselves to chaos but became 'freedom fighters' or mercinaries or something. or maybe they joined chaos un-divided and started there own cult. so then in the game they could be leaders of a rebel army or part of abaddons peronal retinue and stuff like that.


hm i made some fluff for units which were like "chaos grey knights" but theyre not exactly "chaos grey knights"

http://www.heresy-online.net/forums/showthread.php?t=33961


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## normtheunsavoury (Mar 20, 2008)

Chaoz94's idea is cool, I like it.
It gives you a great reason for Chaos Grey Knights and keeps things nice and fluffy by incorporating Bile and Abaddon. Cool Idea and worth some rep I think.


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## Chaoz94 (Jun 17, 2008)

normtheunsavoury said:


> Chaoz94's idea is cool, I like it.
> It gives you a great reason for Chaos Grey Knights and keeps things nice and fluffy by incorporating Bile and Abaddon. Cool Idea and worth some rep I think.


thanks im glad people like it 
infact im gonna make an army using the demonhunters codex with my chaos space marines (they will just be normal "counts as" spacemarines") so when that happens look in my sig

p.s thanks for the rep 

chaoz


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## lawrence96 (Sep 1, 2008)

strange idea here, 

perhaps they can be GKs that are still loyal to the emporer and believe he will resurect once killed (like certain members of the inq. are supposed to) and therefore tried to get to the emporer to resurect him, and as such were then deemed excommunicate.


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## Lupercal101 (Jan 26, 2009)

Concrete Hero said:


> Just wanting to point out; Its sort of the opposite with the Eldar. The Dark Eldar are the ones who have stayed with their decadent ways and it is the 'Eldar' who have reformed themselves and changed, DarK Eldar aren't renegade


Oh okay, but you get what i mean, right


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## Asmodeun (Apr 26, 2009)

I like lawrence 96's idea.
Death to the emperor! (if he reincarnated, I'd return to humanity's side, where I ought belong)


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## AntiPaladin (Jun 26, 2007)

Chaoz94 beat me to it, but that would be my suggestion. Create a force that can justify having all their abilities with your own fluff. Maybe Alpharius and Omegon decided they wanted their own elite uber unit and modeled it after what they saw as the perfect Imperial unit, the Grey knights? 

Very little fluff in 40k is totally immutable, but this happens to be one of them because it's specifically mentioned as having never happened. Just like you couldn't justify calling your home-brew chapter the 1st legion ever raised by the Emperor - that's the Dark Angels, and stated quite clearly.


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## Warlock in Training (Jun 10, 2008)

I still think the idea of Represented as a uber Chaotic Band with Deamon Weapons, Kai Guns, and Cursed Armore (Shrouding, Psy defense, ect.) is much more plausible, challeging and interesting approach to this delima.


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## Chaoz94 (Jun 17, 2008)

Warlock in Training said:


> I still think the idea of Represented as a uber Chaotic Band with Deamon Weapons, Kai Guns, and Cursed Armore (Shrouding, Psy defense, ect.) is much more plausible, challeging and interesting approach to this delima.


may i point you to my thread again  lol (annoying attempt at advertising but still)


http://www.heresy-online.net/forums/showthread.php?t=33961


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## PowerEncarnate (Apr 15, 2009)

but on a side note some GKs have been "lost" in the long fight with the dark powers never to be recovered but they were in small numbers and a fallen GK would debase there armor and weapons just as Word Bearers chaplains did with there croziuses. now the "no GK has fallen" Fluff should have a invisible "to the knowledge of the imperium" added and if one of these "lost" brothers fell to chaos whats to stop him from gathering a warband of his own maybe by inlisting the aid of fabius bile to be cloned several 100 times and training them himself and that could explain why we havent seen them as of yet. 

that being said its still weak at best unless you homebrew the codex for them 
as Daemonhunters codex is to anti-chaos as it stands even then still weak


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## Franko1111 (Jun 25, 2008)

the grey knights have ward under there skin that resistases deamons and so the chaos gods wouldn't like them


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## PowerEncarnate (Apr 15, 2009)

@Franko1111 
where did you come up with that? a ward under their skin? um...no. on their armor maybe but ive never seen anything even emplying "under the skin"


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## Lupercal101 (Jan 26, 2009)

it not under the skin, it's actually on their black carapace. (not sure if thats under the skin) i'm not saying that they turned to chaos, but Grey Knights have lost battle before right? so, say this powerful chaos sorcerer sees them fighting and thinks "wow, there really uber, i want one". so, the grey knights lost that battle and he goes out and removes all their warded crap, puts the bodys in stasis. them he collects grey knight bodies from heaps of battle fields for a couple of hundred years, uses favor fabious bile owes him, has black carapace from normal CSM and aromour put on 'em, resurrects them and hey presto! you've got a zombie grey knight force. yay.


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## Chaoz94 (Jun 17, 2008)

Franko1111 said:


> the chaos gods wouldn't like them


MADNESS 
THIS IS SPARTAAAAAA!!!! 
ok end randomness
seriously grey knights are amongst the best warriors the imperium has , 
there apparently stronger than the adeptus astarteres (sp?) 
and considering the chaos gods accept normal marines im sure grey knights would be wanted majorly by chaos



chaoz


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## Son of Russ (Jun 1, 2009)

Of all the advice given, I beleive that Red Orc stated it succinctly in the "how" and "why", in creating an elite Chaos Knight in the mould of the Grey Knights.....I believe that would be your best route.


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## giikbesouw (Jul 6, 2010)

sorry for reviving an old thread 

i found this on lexicanum

Grey Knights Chaplains fulfill the same functions as in other Marine chapters, albeit on a much higher level, as they have to minister to the spiritual needs of soldiers destined to fight the most horrible of foes. They are rare specimens indeed, and the Chapter has precious few of them. Yet, thanks to them, not one Grey Knight has fallen to Chaos.

so what if the chaplains get killed and the grey knights can be corrupted by chaos


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## gothik (May 29, 2010)

no mater what is done the GK wont fall as i think established history says it cant happen adn dont they get indoctrined and moind cleared or somethng to prevent such a thing happening. could be wrong but not being a table top player i am not sure how this would work stillgood luck with it.


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## Ravingbantha (Jan 9, 2009)

The whole idea that a GK cannot fall to Chaos is simply stupid. Everything that mankind does is imperfect and thus inhernt to being flawed. While I think it may be nearly impossible for a GK to fall, I think it is still possible. Tzeentch would be the most liekly to suceed in this, followed by Khorn, Nurgle, and Slaanesh (though I highly douby it). Though it may be an extremly rare occurance I would say it is possible.

However you could simply say that Abaddon or even Fabuis Bile got ahold of some GK potentials and turned them into an Evil GK using information they got from a tortured or even fallen Inquisitor.


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## GrizBe (May 12, 2010)

Inquisitors don't know how GK's are made though... GK's just work with the inquisition, in effect, they're there own Marine Chapter. 

GK's would NEVER fall though they're too far indocterined against chaos, plus warded against possession... Yes, there are wards on their black carapace, and this is under the skin.

Fluff-wise its been established as completely impossible to turn a GK.


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## Belthazor Aurellius (Jan 16, 2009)

Rubric of Xanthism? (Xanthite Inquisitors use Daemons against Chaos) Supposing an Inquisitor figured out the Rubric of Ahriman. Perhaps he/she managed to reproduce it against a force of Grey Knights, but failed to keep them loyal to the Imperium. Could be a relatively good fluff explanation for the squad's psychic powers. The squad leader channels the powers.

Seem to recall that if a Vindicare assassin killed a GK squad leader, the squad can't cast magic anymore. Fits with Rubric Marine squad fluff, as they are led by a psyker, though the difference might be that Rubrick GK might be enchanted to not lose their leadership when the leader dies.

I know it's a bit of a stretch, but if you want to go with the resurrection/corruption theory, that's one way to do it.

Just my two yen

EDIT: GW has stated in the past, regarding fluff, that anything is possible on a small scale. A single force of something pure might be corrupted, and since the Inquisition lies about everything, you can be sure you'll never hear about it on official channels.


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## normtheunsavoury (Mar 20, 2008)

Why would an Inquisitor want to turn GK into dusty automatons?
The Rubric of Ahriman was a spell to stop the rampant mutations that were destroying the TSons, it has nothing to do with Inquisitors binding Daemons or doing stuff to Grey Knights. 
There is no way an Iquisitor could figure out the Rubric of Ahriman and even if he did there is no reason what-so-ever that he would decide to use it on the Grey Knights, they would have chopped him into tiny pieces before he could even raise the idea.

As much as GW say anything is possible the idea of traitor GK's just doesn't stand up to scrutiny and will get torn to pieces at your local store/club. It's just one of the many cliches that is laughable at best. Go with what has already been said, use GK rules but say they are something else.


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## locustgate (Dec 6, 2009)

In the GK book there was time......what ever the main char's name is went in sane,in order to keep a powerful demon from possessing him, for a short time and became a berserker....or something..


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## MuSigma (Jul 8, 2010)

*chaos grey knights*

As GK's are specic to hunting daemons - they would have no purpose on the side of chaos. You would need a specific target type on the imperium side to set an elite csm chapter to hunt down, similar to gk's in purpose, but from the opposite point of view.

How about an anti GK counter CSM chapter - specifically trained to kill GK's.


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## gauntsghost025 (Apr 9, 2009)

If you want to paint your Grey Knights chaos colors, then so be it. They are your models. And the "no Grey Knight has ever fallen to chaos" line is one delivered by the Inquisition. Do you realy think they would be like "Ya, these guys are good, but just as susceptible to chaos as anyone else?" NO they are supposed to be bad ass and all that, but we would never know if in 10,000 years not 1 Grey Knight has fallen.

Almost every player does something "un-fully." Like a Space Puppy or Black Templar player taking pot shots at lone ICs, or Khorne players taking Warp-time. 

More power to ya, I think fallen Grey Knights is a great idea.


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## gauntsghost025 (Apr 9, 2009)

MuSigma said:


> they would have no purpose on the side of chaos.


An Astartes warrior can serve any purpose. Power weapons cut through flesh just as easily as warp stuff.


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## gen.ahab (Dec 22, 2009)

Its impossible to corrupt a Gray Knight.


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## Commissar Ploss (Feb 29, 2008)

gen.ahab said:


> Its impossible to corrupt a Gray Knight.


And it's "Grey" not "Gray" 

Gray with an "a" is just "Gay" with an "Rrrrrrr!"

CP


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## gen.ahab (Dec 22, 2009)

Commissar Ploss said:


> And it's "Grey" not "Gray"
> 
> Gray with an "a" is just "Gay" with an "Rrrrrrr!"
> 
> CP



Hey now, if a man has been awake for 24H he is allotted one spellig fuckup. Lol


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## MadMaxx (Jun 17, 2010)

"Flipping" a GK wouldn't actually gain Chaos much... as the force is designed to counter them. When pitted against any other foe, they're astartes with psi-weapons. A true counter to a GK would be a special unit forged by Chaos to be the anti-GK -- that is, a group designed to hunt the GK and counter their tactics. 

From fluff, probably easier to taylor yourself a custom squad of CSM and outfit them as a GK hunting group


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## Belthazor Aurellius (Jan 16, 2009)

Just one? Can't we allow for like... three, if the needs be there?

Anywho. I think the idea of the forces of Chaos having an elite saint-hunting task force of Grey Knight-like Chaos Marines could be cool. Saints are the enemy of Chaos, really, as they're living avatars of the Emperor's will...

Just like it's cool to see a Chaos founded, power armored all-woman army dedicated to either the pantheon or individual Orders Majoris dedicated to each of the four in turn.

I'm just waiting for someone to suggest a Chaos variant of Deathwatch. But I'm not expecting that soon, as Deathwatch isn't as badass, hence why they don't get a codex... =P


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## calon (Jul 12, 2010)

It's not impossible for a Grey Knight to fall to Chaos. In the Grey Knight Omnibus on several occasions you read about their purity runs burning their mind, blocking out all the Chaotic whispers. For their protective wards to fail, I would imagine you would need a combination of two or more greater daemons, and a horde of lesser ones. Not to mention, all the while being in an area warped by Chaos. 

That might be enough to rupture the wards, leaving them vulnerable to Chaos infection. But, a Grey Knight also lives with the burden of knowing none have fallen to Chaos before him, so, he would take his own life before succumbing to the darkness.

As far as being revived and corrupted, if a Grey Knight falls in battle and can not be recovered - unable to land transports into the combat zone - then they will be stripped of their armour, weapons, and tomes. The body will be burred several feet into the ground, where it can remain secret to the enemy, and still be recovered afterwards.


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## gen.ahab (Dec 22, 2009)

The presense of the greatest of tzeentch's champions haven't brought down the wards I doubt they can be. Even if they were, we know they can resist corruption without their psychic shields so I am fairly sure they can do it without the runes of warding. You cannot corrupt a grey knight.


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## gauntsghost025 (Apr 9, 2009)

gen.ahab said:


> You cannot corrupt a grey knight.


I love how you always just make statements like this. It may be hard to corrupt them, but they are mortals of the material universe. If Tzeetnch himself came down, I'm sure they wouldn't stand a chance. You look at fluff, of course its going to show the GKs resisting every temptation of chaos, because that's the point of the fluff!! You think there's going to be a book around that has them falling to chaos?? We would never know.

I doubt burring o body a few feet underground would make it all the difficult for Grandfather Nurgle to find I he really wanted to.


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## calon (Jul 12, 2010)

If a Grey Knight was brought back from the dead, and, in doing so, was a tool of Chaos, then he would be a shell compared to his former self. He would not have his force weapon, storm bolter/whichever weapon he carried, no aegis armour, no relics, nothing but himself. He would be a great warrior, one who knows no fear, but, everything that makes him a Grey Knight (his holy powers) would cease to be. 

If a Grey Knight's psyker runes were shattered by a (rather, several) daemons and fell to the promises of Chaos while alive, he would be an asset of great use. But, brought back from the dead, a far cry from special.


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## gen.ahab (Dec 22, 2009)

gauntsghost025 said:


> I love how you always just make statements like this. It may be hard to corrupt them, but they are mortals of the material universe. If Tzeetnch himself came down, I'm sure they wouldn't stand a chance. You look at fluff, of course its going to show the GKs resisting every temptation of chaos, because that's the point of the fluff!! You think there's going to be a book around that has them falling to chaos?? We would never know.
> 
> I doubt burring o body a few feet underground would make it all the difficult for Grandfather Nurgle to find I he really wanted to.


The fluff is what this section is about... WTF do you think I am arguing about? Of course everything is possible in reality, as long as it adheres to the physical laws of out universe, but not in fluff.... It's fiction but it has it's own laws. "You", I believe he is working with his legion or something, cannot corrupt them. Even a god couldn't because you have to allow them to corrupt you, a gray knight never would.

And even if you broke his wards and removed his powers all the psycho indoctrinate he has undergone would make him beyond anyones ability to sway. The only was to do it would be to destroy his mind and build it from the ground up and if you did that he would no longer be who he was and would therefore not be a grey knight.


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## MadMaxx (Jun 17, 2010)

In the spirit of the GK's design, I'd say their neigh uncorruptable. Is it possible? Sure, so is a bolter round turning into a pink bunny mid flight. Anything is possible, few things are probable - even in a fictional universe.

As such, following general rules - based on history or design - tells us GK's are probably not the best fit when trying to pull into a chaos formfactor. It would be badass however to take the GK models, thorow some CSM bits on them and give them a saint-hunting background as desribed. They aren't dead GK's, rather astartes forged into mocking GK's arrmor designation (and look good doing it...).

Psi for a Psi - 'tis a good philosophy.


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## aboytervigon (Jul 6, 2010)

u could have a grey knight that was funneled through the warp and reversed so his weapons strenghen deamons and hurt non deamons


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## shaantitus (Aug 3, 2009)

normtheunsavoury said:


> I've always quite liked the idea of Chaotic GK, but I'm yet to come across a good reason for them fluff wise.
> ........
> 
> Chaos GK are always going to be difficult to pull off thanks to so many "I know that no Grey Knights have ever fallen to Chaos, these are the only ones." stories in GW and gaming clubs since the GK were invented.


I agree with norm on this one. This keeps comming up and the response is usually the same. If you want chaos gk's then no-one is stopping you, but if the fluff you use seems 'contrived' for only the purpose of getting gks into your force then expect people to give you a hard time.

On the other hand there is no reason you cannot do a counts as army using the DH dex or create a chaos equivalent. Someone suggested minor demon weapons instead of nemesis weapons. Chaos sorcerers have force weapons too, use the Kai gun from the old dex instead of the psycannon. Demonic protection instead of the effects of the aegis suit. It can be done, it needs to be done thoroughly.

Out of interest i have a small force of dh who i use as a dark mech counts as force for my traitor guard. GK's= advanced combat androids with stealth systems(shrouding) using the old chaos android models. GKt's= heavy combat androids using warmachine Khador shocktroopers.
Inquisitors= Dark magos and their retinues.


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## Belthazor Aurellius (Jan 16, 2009)

Here's my take on what could work for you.

Black Knights
Pulled from almost every traitor legion, the Black Knights are one of Fabius Bile's successful modifications. The legionaires chosen had to pass new trials, and were pitted against rage, plague, sorcery and pain. The few who survived the indoctrination to Chaos Undivided, were genomodified to amplify latent psychic powers. Their black carapaces were etched with blasphemous runes of power. Thier armor was forged anew into a mockery of the Grey Knights of the Imperium, with unholy icons gleaming brightly along the edges of their shining sable armor.

These Black Knights appear unexpectedly at the height of Imperial Mass, when a living saint is raising her voice to the Emperor, or when a priest is raising his voice against heresy. Working in conjunction with traitor cults in the midst of these congregations, their timing is precise, their arrival unexpected and the endgame horrific for any martyr to the Emperor.

These highly trained warriors of the Undivided pantheon strike down those thought invulnerable with their modified Kai Guns, which cause rosarii to overload and iron halos to crack.

Yet, these Black Knights abhor their erstwhile allies. Those who are not as pure in their devotion to Chaos, the traitor marine legions. As such, they abstain from allying with them except in the most dire circumstance.

Black Knights may take disciplined traitor guard cultists as allies (inducted imperial guard), and may from time to time, be led by a Dark Master (Inquisitor)... These are feared men, as they often work for Abbaddon or his generals to weed out the impure followers of Chaos.


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## shaantitus (Aug 3, 2009)

Exactly the sort of thing i was talking about. Well written too. Have some rep for the cool fluff.


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## Doelago (Nov 29, 2009)

About the subject of turning a Grey Knight to chaos... Did not one deamon say to Justicar Alaric at one point, that he would make him the first Grey Knight to turn to chaos? I remember that from somewhere, and if a daemon says so, then it is probably true that no Grey Knight had turned to chaos, and at least Alaric is still a pure kick ass Grey Knight, and I am waiting for more novels about him, cause he is kick ass... 

And somewhere else it was stated that Grey Knights had silver runes and spells beneth their skin and on the black carapace to protect them from chaos... 

Also, a Grey Knights only wish is to have his body buried on Titan, below their fortress, so they would not turn to Chaos cause of fear or something... And they dont fear death, so they would probably do anything to prevent capture, probably blow up a nuke or something as well... 

And went out the air of a GK ship, probably not, as they have psychic runes all over the place, preventing chaos to enter, or something like that, and a stronger, more heavily armoured hull on their ship, making it harder for boarding torpedoes to penetrate it... And if, and it is a damn huge if, someone would be capable of venting out the air of every section of the damn ship, then the GKs would probably still survive, as the Power Armour has enough air for a moment in the cold emptiness of space, and if the enemy would capture their ship, they would probably blow up the main reactor and escape in drop pods somewhere, or in a Thunderhawk... 

And on the subject of rising their dead bodies from the dead, highly unlikely,as the Grey Knights dont leave their dead friends behind without a good reason, a very good one, so they would probably at least collect the geneseed from their dead Brother, destroy or hide his body or something like, so basically you wont find anything useful in a dead GK, or nothing at all, so that kind of screws the whole idea of rising the from the dead...

And as a Grey Knight player, I am straightly against everything that would make the GKs Chaos, as they are the purest things in the Imperium, and without them humanity would not exist anymore...


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## Primarch Lorgar (Jul 11, 2009)

if they could turn to chaos, they'd be in my army!


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## MadMaxx (Jun 17, 2010)

I want to pull a group of SoB's toghether, outfit them with some anti-GK fluff and call them Red Qeens. Whats worse than getting your ass kicked by Chaos? Getting your ass kicked by Chaos chicks, that's what.


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## Cruor99 (Mar 11, 2009)

Belthazor Aurellius said:


> Here's my take on what could work for you.
> 
> Black Knights
> Pulled from almost every traitor legion, the Black Knights are one of Fabius Bile's successful modifications. The legionaires chosen had to pass new trials, and were pitted against rage, plague, sorcery and pain. The few who survived the indoctrination to Chaos Undivided, were genomodified to amplify latent psychic powers. Their black carapaces were etched with blasphemous runes of power. Thier armor was forged anew into a mockery of the Grey Knights of the Imperium, with unholy icons gleaming brightly along the edges of their shining sable armor.
> ...


*That's* how it's supposed to be done! Well done, good sir.


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## KINKYWULFEN (Oct 22, 2015)

I personally have my own grey Knights in my chaos army and I love them. I have ten terminator and ten tactile. I just failed them and use grey knight codex for them as normal. I fight with myself if I should remove the agies hood or keep it and field them as sorcerers. I recently left a tactile grey knight in my garage and a rat got ahold of it (and the damn thing moved and hid another 94 of my infantry units) and well he broke off the arms of the grey knight and his power pack. (All the other figures were unharmed he just wanted to be an ass and move them to his nest) well I put a rapors power sword in his right hand and a space wolf power sword in left, then replaced his power pack with a chaos one. The repair was amazing and I actually used him as my leader and left my Deamon prince out in my last battle. The stance he's in makes him look massively buff and intimidating and right now he's my newest pride and joy. (I killed the rat the next day)


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## ntaw (Jul 20, 2012)

Woo! 5 years old, nice threadromancy @KINKYWULFEN! Be sure to check out the last post's date when searching through the forums. Some of the content is from pretty far back and many of the people are no longer involved with the forum.

Maybe start a new thread with some pics of your rat-eaten conversion over in the modelling and painting sub-forum? I'm curious to see what that looks like.

Welcome to Heresy by the way! :drinks:


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## Servant-of-khorne (Dec 31, 2015)

There is a traitor legion in the chaos space marine codex who's back story is that a brotherhood of gray knights were on a world and became enslaved to khorne after touching a tainted blood fountain or something like that anyway the point is that they were gray Knights and are now chaos so I don't see why you couldn't do that.


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## Gorthol (Dec 16, 2015)

Belthazor Aurellius said:


> Here's my take on what could work for you.
> 
> Black Knights
> Pulled from almost every traitor legion, the Black Knights are one of Fabius Bile's successful modifications. The legionaires chosen had to pass new trials, and were pitted against rage, plague, sorcery and pain. The few who survived the indoctrination to Chaos Undivided, were genomodified to amplify latent psychic powers. Their black carapaces were etched with blasphemous runes of power. Thier armor was forged anew into a mockery of the Grey Knights of the Imperium, with unholy icons gleaming brightly along the edges of their shining sable armor.
> ...


Great imagination! 

Could see this working fluff-wise! Have some +rep my friend!


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## ntaw (Jul 20, 2012)

^ that post you just repped was from 2010.


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## Gorthol (Dec 16, 2015)

ntaw said:


> ^ that post you just repped was from 2010.


My bad.

:suicide:


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