# Anyone else feel a little ripped off with Shadows Of Treachery?



## Angel of Blood (Aug 18, 2010)

As the title says, does anyone else feel ripped off a little?

I'm referring of course to the fact that 3 of the stories within the novel are in fact audio dramas I already own, and another story is actually just one from Collected Visions. Yes I probably should have noticed this on the buy page, but still a bit off.

Prince of Crows was excellent, but doesn't quite make up for the it.


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## Brother Subtle (May 24, 2009)

Kind of. Only Crimson Fist, Death of a Silversmith and Prince of Crows were new to me. I didn't even read the audio drama ones as I've heard them multiple times. I did however reread the Kaban Project as its a great short and really makes me look forward to when the Hardback version of Mechanicum is released. Can't wait to read it again. It was excellent!


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## ckcrawford (Feb 4, 2009)

I agree. It was pretty much a dissapointment in my eyes.

I was most disapointed by the Battle for the Phall. It didn't really explain what went down besides the Imperial Fists somehow being able to move parts of their fleet behind the Iron Warriors without weakening their center.


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## Giant Fossil Penguin (Apr 11, 2009)

Still, people are always saying how they want the audio dramas to be released as books. Doing this and adding some new stuff as well as the Kaban story, hidden away in HH:CV where many might not be able to see it, is probably the best way to do it. There's something for everyone.
In the end, for folks who would like to collect the whole series, what would be better- a book full of printed audio dramas that they already own, or a book that has some of them as well as some new stuff? Compromises are never great, but it could have been worse.
As for the IFs Phallian fleet; I just assumed that the IWs fleet was so big that it was getting in its own way, allowing the IF fleet to be a local match for the IWs in any area. At least until translation was complete and the IWs could spread out. 
That story really painted traitor-Perturabo as a dick. He was pissed off, so he kills the bearer of bad news. Maybe him and the Lion aren't too different, after all!

GFP


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## kickboxerdog (Jun 2, 2011)

i personally and like many people i think dont own the audios so it was actually really nice to get them in words on paper in my opinion and i just hope to see the garro audios put into a book so i dont have to buy the audios for them


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## Bane_of_Kings (Oct 28, 2009)

I'm not, I really enjoyed this collection. It gave me the chance to read _Raven's Flight_ without listening to the Audio Drama and the chance to explore the print version of The _Lightning Tower_ and the _Dark King_, both of which I felt improved as a result of it. _Prince of Crows_ and _Crimson Fist_ were brilliant novellas, with PoC being the best part of the Anthology as CF had a couple of things that I disliked in it. 

The other stories were not as strong as the above but were still an enjoyable read, although I can see why everybody has a whole issue with the fact that there's only two pieces of new material in the Collection.


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## Brother Subtle (May 24, 2009)

You can count me in on not loving Crimson Fist. Enjoyed the Terra stuff but the Phall battle got a little boring. Void battle writing is very hit and miss. You really have to know what your doing to make a battle in space fought over tens of thousands of kms sound fast paced and interesting. I just don't think John French hit the mark with CF. Now ADB in his NL books, that's how you wrote kick ass void battles!


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## Words_of_Truth (Sep 20, 2007)

Yeah I haven't got it, I already had the original printed versions of the lightning tower and dark king from the gamesday limited edition. Only one I haven't read or listening to is Prince of Crows and I'll get the audio for that sometime.


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## Brother Subtle (May 24, 2009)

I really enjoyed Prince of Crows. If you'd just read Void Stalker like I had, Sevatar is basically from First Claw  I'm a massive fan of ADB's night lords, he's made them the biggest anti-hero's of 40k. The imperium hates them, chaos hates them, their primarch hated them... They even hate themselves! Yet they still don't give a f**k! You get a huge First Claw vibe from Prince of Crows.


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## Angel of Blood (Aug 18, 2010)

I loved Prince of Crows. Sevetar is frankly hilarious, his humour is just my kind of thing. Best bits being, firstly, as LotN would agree:



> ‘The Blade in the Black just jumped in-system. Commodore Yul is aboard, alive and well.’
> ‘That makes him the new fleet admiral. Offer him my insincere congratulations on a rank he earned purely by being the last naval officer standing.'


And even funnier



> The first cell they’d thrown him into had been a more conventional trap of reinforced iron. Sevatar had spat his way through one wall in less than fifteen minutes, dissolving it with his acidic saliva. When a guard came to check on him, he’d merely pointed at the hissing hole in the wall, almost large enough for him to fit through
> 
> ‘I think rats did it,’ he’d said. ‘Big ones.'


It speaks volumes for his character that he doesn't try and escape or attack the guard, instead just stands back and makes a comment like that.


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## Phoebus (Apr 17, 2010)

I can't say I felt cheated. "Crimson Fist" and "Prince of Crows" add up to about 170 pages together. At least three other stories I never got a chance to buy on account of format (Games Day chapbooks), and the Kaban Project would only have been available to the die hard collector (Collected Visions).


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## Lord of the Night (Nov 18, 2009)

Angel of Blood said:


> I loved Prince of Crows. Sevetar is frankly hilarious, his humour is just my kind of thing. Best bits being, firstly, as LotN would agree:


Indeed, though my favourite parts were his opinion on discipline,

"This is why the Imperials always win. Discipline may be dull but it has undeniable military applications."

And what he said to Alastor Rushal aboard the Invincible Reason,

"You won't believe how I got here." :laugh:


And no I didn't feel ripped off but I got it for free as an ARC so how could I? Wouldn't say anything good about me if I felt ripped off by novel I didn't have to pay for. I only read _The Crimson Fist_, very good, and _Prince of Crows_, frelling excellent, so I enjoyed it.


LotN


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## ckcrawford (Feb 4, 2009)

Giant Fossil Penguin said:


> That story really painted traitor-Perturabo as a dick. He was pissed off, so he kills the bearer of bad news. Maybe him and the Lion aren't too different, after all!
> 
> GFP


Thats an interesting remark. I always thought it was weird that the Lion would use and trust Perturabo as an ally.


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## Mossy Toes (Jun 8, 2009)

I can't say I feel cheated, since I'm kind of the exact audience this book was aimed at. I haven't got Collected Visions or any of the audio dramas. I look forward to getting a whole bunch of stories I haven't yet read when I pick it up this weekend.


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## Lord Mephiston (Sep 16, 2010)

I feel ripped off too. But at least I got the ebook version, not the paperback. will have to be alot more careful next time I buy an anthology from BL.


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## darkreever (Apr 3, 2008)

Lets see...

The anthology comes with a couple of new stories, a few stories converted from audio dramas, and at least one short from collected visions.

So stuff I didnt have before, stuff I didnt have before, and stuff I didnt have before.

Nope, don't feel ripped off in the slightest about that purchase.


Having said that though, I did find myself largely unimpressed by The Dark King, The Lightning Tower, Raven's Flight, and underwhelmed and confused (at the ending) by The Crimson Fist. So at the very least I now know another reason why I did not spend the extra money on all those shorts and can feel better off for it.


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## Paceyjg (May 12, 2011)

Agree with the title :angry:


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## darkreever (Apr 3, 2008)

Paceyjg said:


> Agree with the title :angry:


And why is that? Why do you feel ripped off?

Were you one of the lucky few who got some of those stories that were sold in limited edition? Do you already have collected visions and the audio dramas?

Because if so, then keep in mind that there is always a price to be paid. You got some limited edition stuff, and in the end it was later released to everyone else and coupled with some other things.


To those who bitch and moan because they got the limited stuff and just ended up paying for it a second time, always remember that you got those years before the rest of us.


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## Brother Subtle (May 24, 2009)

Neither The Dark King, The Lightening Tower, Ravens Flight or The Kaban Project were limited. And could be had by anybody at any time years ago. The Kaban Project will set you back a pretty penny. But the art that comes with that book is sublime and worth it. The only limited story in the whole book was Death of a Silversmith which was ok because it was about as long as an extended fart and did nothing to advance the HH story arc.

I started to read some of the audio dramas in text and quickly realized that they were much better as audio dramas to be honest. I suggest some of you get those audio dramas cheap (if you know the right depository style website) and experience the media as it was intended. Huge difference.


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## ckcrawford (Feb 4, 2009)

I'm glad people liked it. I actually think its worse when the majority of people hate a piece throughout a good series. Kind of like Battle for the Abyss. In some ways it makes people question whats going on with the series and whether there are split ends. 

I have a bad perspective of on many of the newer novels, including this one. The good thing is that its mostly the newer authors that are pissing me off. I'm quite dissapointed in Gav Thorpe especially. I really expected a lot from him because I love a lot of the works he has done like The Sundering, and Angels of Darkness.


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## Lord of Ruin (Jul 22, 2012)

Crimson fist and Prince of Crows are worth the asking price, the rest are just nice little extras, though i must confess 'Ravens Flight' in audio format is sooooo much better than in written format.


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## forkmaster (Jan 2, 2010)

I liked the anthology! Do I feel ripped off? Nope, as yes I have 3 of the audios but I see it its nice to have them also in written form. And Ravens Flights ins extended AND changed to it ties better in with Deliverense Lost, such as giving unnamed characters actual names from the novel. Also the shorts I hadn't before.

Crimsom Fist was decent and good, I have slight problems with 1st person but it was alright. The ending when withdrawing in the middle of the fight was stupid choice from the loyalist (but not the authors fault then). I LOVED Prince of Crows, ADB shows he can make a fantastic story in only 100 pages which others need 400 for. I'm gonna make Kyroptera and Sevatar as model-characters when I get the time.

P.S: Did someone see the nod to the Emperors background in Ravens Flight? I think the Shamans are still official.


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## Shadow Walker (Jun 10, 2010)

I do not feel ripped off. I wanted to have all audio in printed form and after all it is first anthology that I like all stories from. They could still do better editing and change Valerius's father being dead when in Deliverance Lost he is alive.


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## Khorne's Fist (Jul 18, 2008)

I felt seriously ripped off. I had all the previously published stuff, including the HHCC with the Caban Project. I know, I could have looked at the index page and seen that I already owned these. The only good thing about this is that it means we will eventually see Garro and co in writing, because I'm no longer buying the HH audios because a short story is certainly not worth the price GW are charging for them.

P.S. Prince of Crows is one of the best HH stories, long form or short, to date. I hope we see more of Sevatar soon.


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## forkmaster (Jan 2, 2010)

Shadow Walker said:


> I do not feel ripped off. I wanted to have all audio in printed form and after all it is first anthology that I like all stories from. They could still do better editing and change Valerius's father being dead when in Deliverance Lost he is alive.


I never thought about that!


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## Garrak (Jun 18, 2012)

I don't own the audio books so this was a good purchase for me. One question to those who feel ripped off - and this is an honest question it's not meant to sound snide or whatnot. We've know for some time exactly what the book will contain. It wasn't a surprise - why buy it in that case? If it was to get the two new stories then ok but you shouldn't complain about feeling ripped off since you knew you'd only get two stories. Just my two cents.


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## Brother Subtle (May 24, 2009)

Khorne's Fist said:


> P.S. Prince of Crows is one of the best HH stories, long form or short, to date. I hope we see more of Sevatar soon.


I agree. I freaking loved it.


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## Thyr (Oct 25, 2010)

Garrak said:


> I don't own the audio books so this was a good purchase for me. One question to those who feel ripped off - and this is an honest question it's not meant to sound snide or whatnot. We've know for some time exactly what the book will contain. It wasn't a surprise - why buy it in that case? If it was to get the two new stories then ok but you shouldn't complain about feeling ripped off since you knew you'd only get two stories. Just my two cents.


I agree with you. It's not as if the stories in the book have been kept secret. To me all stories except the Kaban Project are new. I enjoyed the book a lot. PoC once again cemented my love for the Night Lords.


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## mal310 (May 28, 2010)

Khorne's Fist said:


> I felt seriously ripped off.
> 
> P.S. Prince of Crows is one of the best HH stories, long form or short, to date. I hope we see more of Sevatar soon.


You felt SERIOUSLY ripped off despite "Prince of Crows being one of the best HH stories to date"?

I'm not a defender of Black Library by any stretch of the imagination but I really think some people need some perspective on this. More than half the content was new material and many did not have the chance to get the limited edition stuff or do not like audio. I don't feel ripped off.


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## nate187 (Feb 2, 2009)

Yup three of the stories that I also had owned as audio books. (twenty fucking dollars) but I really wanted to read the prince of crows which I thoroughly enjoyed. ADB is the better writer IMO outta all the BL authors, FAN BOY LOL. Will read crimson fist next. I was expecting new stuff but oh well HH novels, SM battles and wheel of time are the only books I collect in physical form anyhow. 

Thank god for torrents ;0)


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## Alhom (Aug 17, 2012)

I can defend the BL on this point.
You, english people have access to novels AND Audio Drama.
Think about these frenchies (I'm one of them ah ah), spanish or germans people. A lot a fans cannot handle this language and cannot enjoy Audios or even limited editions.

So this book is a maybe a scam for you but think about the others, think about the audios like Garro, or the books like Aurelian or Bortherhood of the Storm that have never been translated.

So, the real scammed it's us, not you


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## Khorne's Fist (Jul 18, 2008)

mal310 said:


> You felt SERIOUSLY ripped off despite "Prince of Crows being one of the best HH stories to date"?


Yeah, SERIOUSLY ripped off. As I said, I had to pay the price of a 400 page for less than 200 pages of new material. Quality does not always outweigh quantity.



mal310 said:


> ...I don't feel ripped off.


Good for you.


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