# Harlequin/Deathwatch battle (SPOILER)



## MontytheMighty (Jul 21, 2009)

I dislike Eldar
I'm a space marine fan 
therefore I am biased 

I've recently read _Atlas Infernal_
there's a scene in which 

harlequins effortlessly slaughter Deathwatch marines
 
so do you think that 
1) the author is [email protected] the harlequins too hard or 
2) the scene is a reasonable portrayal of how incredibly good the space clowns are



*The harlequins easily dispatch two marines. One of the harlequins then takes on the Deathwatch captain...*
_This one dropped into reality right next to the captain. A female of the race, the Harlequin trouper wore a half mask bearing a single, theatrical tear and a tail plume that reached down her back. She held up a tapered, tubular fist spike in one clenched gauntlet and a set of twin, razored riveblades in the other, assuming the appearance of a carnival-like scorpion. She was as fast as she was eye-catching, the riveblades coming straight down on the captain’s elbow, severing the Space Marine’s pistol, gauntlet and forearm. With a savage roar, Quesada went to reach for her, but the Harlequin moved with blinding speed and economy, sweeping underneath his expected animal lunge and smashing the captain in the face with a double-jointed, boot-heeled back-kick.
Out of his mind with pain, frustration and wrathful abandon, the Deathwatch Marine swung his elbow back at the dancing vision. By the time the battle-brother’s comparatively sluggish manoeuvre played through, the Harlequin had vaulted and back-flipped immediately above Quesada’s head and landed behind the captain. Then, with every muscle taut, driven and focused on the tip of her tubular fist spike, the slight creature drove the tapered end straight through the Space Marine’s pack, ceramite and all.
The wide-eyed captain was facing Klute and Czevak as he was stabbed from behind and the two men were privy to the Deathwatch captain’s spine-snapping end. Some kind of horrific monofilament wire-weapon had uncoiled inside the Space Marine’s body and, just as with his Excoriator brother, it proceeded to whip and lash around, liquefying bone, carapace and internal organs. Klute watched, sickened and entranced by the way the wire’s tip frantically needled out of the captain’s ruptured eyeball and face, until finally, as the wire retracted and blood and brain matter emptied from the Space Marine’s gaping mouth, the hulk toppled like a felled statue._


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## Giant Fossil Penguin (Apr 11, 2009)

Why shouldn't these gaurdians of something so terrible, aweful and wonderful, be absolute monsters in war? How long might they have lived, how experienced might they be, how perfect examples of the superiority of the Eldar must they be if they have been chosen to guard the Black Library?
Astartes are hard-arse, bad-arse and Captains almost Human avatars of death; _but_ they're not perfect. I see it as perfectly reasonable. Now if the Harlies were fighting some Custodes at the height of their power, it might be a different story.

GFP


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## DeathJester921 (Feb 15, 2009)

Well, Deathwatch are, I'd say, more badass than regular marines. But keep in mind that the eldar are more agile and quick, the harlequins more so than the rest. However, I haven't read of that kind of weapon the harlequin used to liquify his insides as it describes. Unless thats the Harlequins Kiss. 
It sounds reasonable, especially since they were good enough to become guardians of the Black Library


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## Rems (Jun 20, 2011)

I don't see a problem with the harlequins being faster, they are an eldar after all, eldar chosen to guard the Black Library itself. They've always been famous for their grace and agility. One does seem a bit iffy to me is how she stabbed through his powerplant into his chest. That's a lot of ceramite for a unaugmented being to get through with a non powerfield based weapon. I just don't think she'd have the strength to do it. 

Nor do i think the marine captain would be out of his mind with pain and anger. This is what they are specifically trained not to do, but rather channel their emotions.


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## Mindlessness (Dec 22, 2009)

Rems said:


> I don't see a problem with the harlequins being faster, they are an eldar after all, eldar chosen to guard the Black Library itself. They've always been famous for their grace and agility. One does seem a bit iffy to me is how she stabbed through his powerplant into his chest. That's a lot of ceramite for a unaugmented being to get through with a non powerfield based weapon. I just don't think she'd have the strength to do it.
> 
> Nor do i think the marine captain would be out of his mind with pain and anger. This is what they are specifically trained not to do, but rather channel their emotions.


Totally agree with this one. They did guard the black libary and all, and they are extreamly good at fighting, but the backpack AS WELL as his chestplate?

Authors licence :wild:


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## gen.ahab (Dec 22, 2009)

Rule #432 of the marine's guide to not getting his ass kicked in:
NEVER get into CC with a Harlequin. You WILL die.


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## Malus Darkblade (Jan 8, 2010)

Rems said:


> One does seem a bit iffy to me is how she stabbed through his powerplant into his chest. That's a lot of ceramite for a unaugmented being to get through with a non powerfield based weapon. I just don't think she'd have the strength to do it..


When you have a super-sharp weapon, it doesn't take a lot of force to do damage with it.


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## MontytheMighty (Jul 21, 2009)

I guess I was annoyed that the marines never managed to even wound an Eldar
again, I'm a space marine fan so yes, I am biased



*here's the rest of the fight (preceding the captain's demise)*:


_A shower of colour appeared in the chamber like a kind of spectral revenant and streamed at the Crimson Consul from behind. It appeared as though a stained-glass window had materialised behind the battle-brother and had then been blasted out with a shotgun. The spectrum of fragments flew and then reformed into a humanoid visage that stood behind the Deathwatch Space Marine.
. . . 
With the Crimson Consul still listening through the wraithbone door and his back to the Harlequin Shadowseer, he neither saw his attacker appear nor witnessed the elegant sword swipes that criss-crossed his pack and back armour. The blade cut through each of his calves – ceramite, muscle and bone, as though they were nothing.
The Crimson Consul stifled a wail and both Quesada and the Deathwatch heavy bolter answered the call. A storm of explosive death flew at the alien attacker, only for the creature to vanish in a spectral shower. The bolt-rounds blasted into the doorway and the mauled back of the Crimson Consul, one blowing the side of his helmet and its contents over the wraithbone wall.
. . . 
The Scythes of the Emperor Space Marine tumbled to one side, rolling off his Chapter shoulder plate and onto his back, the bulk of the heavy bolter brought around to face his materialised attacker. The Death Jester’s movements spoke of solidity instead of the dancer’s grace of the Shadowseer – its murderous agility manifested in the way it swung the blade that decorated the end of his elongated shrieker cannon. The wicked attachment smashed through the heavy bolter, ripping both the weapon and the bionic arm clutching it from the body of the battle-brother.
The Scythes of the Emperor battle-brother’s reaction was instantaneous. He kicked out at the Harlequin, but the figure was gone – a black mist dissipating to nothingness. The Space Marine got to his feet, slipping a little in the blood gushing from his empty shoulder socket. Bent double like a wounded animal, the Adeptus Astartes tore his bolt pistol from its holster. His enemy had reappeared some distance away – the cannon now aimed squarely at the blood-splattered Space Marine. The horrific whine of the weapon filled the shrine chamber as the cannon spat a single shot at the battle-brother from the Scythes of the Emperor. The round found its mark through the Space Marine’s ruined shoulder. Another kind of screech echoed around the chamber; pressure was building, seals were giving and armour cracked. It did more than crack. It expanded, then exploded under the biological force of what the terrible weapon had done to the Space Marine’s genetically-enhanced body. The power armour shattered and rained ceramite gore covered fragments in all directions, leaving a bloody haze where the Space Marine had been._


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## DeathJester921 (Feb 15, 2009)

Hmm. Since when can Eldar disappear and reappear? Was there some sort of webway gate near by with another webway gate 5 feet away? I don't understand that aspect of the Eldar that well (aspect as in webway gates). If someone could clear this up, then that would be great.

But Deathwatch marines not being able to kill even one eldar? Come on, thats a bunch of bullshit. At least ONE of them should have died, the battle wasn't that lopsided, even if it was taking place at the Black Library with a bunch of Harlequins and a Death Jester (which, as you guys probably couldn't have guessed, was the inspiration for my name. Not an eldar fan, I just like the name )


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## kwak76 (Nov 29, 2010)

I would say the author is bias. These are astartes not guardsman. I could see the Eldar winning the battle but to win that lop sided?


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## hailene (Aug 28, 2009)

DeathJester921 said:


> Hmm. Since when can Eldar disappear and reappear?


Holosuit. Look to the Dawn of War 2 opening to see'em in action.

Question about earlier in the fight, it says something about the heavy bolter headshotting one of the marines. Was said marine already dead or did some friendly fire occur?

Also I'm rather surprised that they'd be able to cut through a Space Marine's leg armor (both sides, nonetheless) and his reinforced skeleton. That'd take a lot of strength for someone using a non-powered weapon.


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## MontytheMighty (Jul 21, 2009)

wasn't the fact that SM lost that annoyed me
SM lose plenty

twas the fact that it was so lop-sided
I mean these were Deathwatch...the Imperium's best xeno killers and they died like total chumps


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## hailene (Aug 28, 2009)

It's not even that they lost horribly. Fights are a bit random. You can train for them, but shit happens.

It's how they died like dogs. Swinging clumsy out of pain and frustration. That's not how a Space Marine fights.


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## Aramoro (Oct 7, 2009)

Harlequins are not just Eldar dudes, they're not even the lowest rank of Harlequins (that's Mines). Harlequins are your elite fighters of an elite force who specialise in murdering people up close. One on one, or even small group on Small group the Deathwatch do not want to be fighting them. 

For the people who don't know what the equipment is, Riveblades are basically lightning claw style forearm mounted power weapons, which can cause instant death strangely enough. The mono-molecular weapon is a Harlequin's Kiss, a microscopic sharpened tube which uncoils metres and metres of mono-molecular inside someone, liquefying them. As well as Holofields, they have Phase Fields which some have which lets them phase in and out of reality.

And that's all before we get onto Solitaires who guard the Black Library. Harlequins roam the webway, it's Solitaires who guard the Library. You do not want to mess with Solitaires.


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## hailene (Aug 28, 2009)

I have never heard of a River Blade. I peeked at the Lex entry for Harlequins and their codex entry in the Eldar codex.

Could you provide a link for'em?


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## Aramoro (Oct 7, 2009)

You'll find the stats for them in the Experimental Harlequin codex that was produced.


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## hailene (Aug 28, 2009)

Are they found anywhere else outside the _unofficial _, beta codex?


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## HUMYN HYBRID (Aug 9, 2011)

now, i dont know too much bout eldar, i aint a fan of either, but dont warp spiders have the ability to teleport? and also, yeah, i know how fast, agile and skilled the eldar are, but not even a single scrath from the space marines? to make it worse, the deathwatch? seriously, i dont care how good the eldar are, deathwatch should at least have made even a tiny scratch... thats just absolute bull, and i dont even like space marines... (gonna make alot of enemies by saying that)


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## Aramoro (Oct 7, 2009)

hailene said:


> Are they found anywhere else outside the _unofficial _, beta codex?


I keep typing Riverblades when it's actually Riveblades, but yeah they're in the fiction, in fact the Harlequin in this story is using them, as for a description of what they are there's less of that other than what's in Gav Thorpes book.

Bizarrely the basic Melee weapon for a Harlequin in DoW is a Riveblade.


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## MontytheMighty (Jul 21, 2009)

HUMYN HYBRID said:


> not even a single scrath from the space marines? to make it worse, the deathwatch? seriously, i dont care how good the eldar are, deathwatch should at least have made even a tiny scratch


I think the author went a bit overboard in his effort to show how super awesome the harlequins are
to be fair, SM often make their enemies look like chumps in their fluff

here, the tables are turned and the SM are made to look like chumps


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## MontytheMighty (Jul 21, 2009)

The main gripe here seems to be that the SM acted angry, shocked etc.
losing their calm a bit too easily 

EDIT: on a side note, has does the harlequins' invisibility work? is it similar to that of the predator (as in the movie _Predator_)? does it use the warp or webway? 
I ask because it seems to defeat the sensory capabilities of the space marines' helmets. 



Aramoro said:


> but yeah they're in the fiction


could you list a few titles 
they show up in the beta codex, Atlas Infernal...what else? I'm assuming DoW and "Gav Thorpe's book" (what's the title of this book?)


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## Aramoro (Oct 7, 2009)

MontytheMighty said:


> The main gripe here seems to be that the SM acted angry, shocked etc.
> losing their calm a bit too easily
> 
> EDIT: on a side note, has does the harlequins' invisibility work? is it similar to that of the predator (as in the movie _Predator_)? does it use the warp or webway?
> I ask because it seems to defeat the sensory capabilities of the space marines' helmets.


A bit of his arm had fallen off, so I think being miffed is quite justified, it's probably never happened to him before. 

Holofields break up your outline, in the description you break up into thousands of shards of an image and recoalesce when you stop moving. As with all Eldar technology it is far in advance of anything the Imperium has, so it defeating the sensors of Space Marines is not surprising. 

If they're using Phase Fields they vanish into the Webway and back out again, essentially phasing in and out of reality. 




MontytheMighty said:


> could you list a few titles
> they show up in the beta codex, Atlas Infernal...what else? I'm assuming DoW and "Gav Thorpe's book" (what's the title of this book?)


In short no, Riveblades have been in the background for a while now, hence why they made it into the DoW game. There's just so little fiction featuring Harlequins it make pinning down what they have hard. I have no reason to disbelieve what we do have though. Check out the Warhammer 40K Compendium however and you'll see the Neruo-Disruptors etc etc and you can see Riveblades refered to as Power Glove, with a diagram and everything. It has the Rictus Masks in it as well.


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## DeathJester921 (Feb 15, 2009)

hailene said:


> Holosuit. Look to the Dawn of War 2 opening to see'em in action.


That was a warp spider with the eldar version of a teleporter pack. Nothing else seemed to disappear and reappear.


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## MontytheMighty (Jul 21, 2009)

Aramoro said:


> Holofields break up your outline
> in the description you break up into thousands of shards of an image and recoalesce when you stop moving


that's a very good description...very striking to visualise, but it seems quite visible
I guess the holofield makes it harder to aim at the harlequin while he/she is moving, but wouldn't some form of actual invisibility (as in transparency) be even more effective? 

I suppose the harlequins' ability to teleport around is the real trump card, but I always thought that power was reserved to warp spiders


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## HUMYN HYBRID (Aug 9, 2011)

MontytheMighty said:


> I suppose the harlequins' ability to teleport around is the real trump card, but I always thought that power was reserved to warp spiders


i agree... i thought teleportation, or however you wantto call it, was always and only used by the eldar warp spiders... i have heard of nothing else of this capability till now


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## MontytheMighty (Jul 21, 2009)

I don't really see how fragmenting light is going to throw off a deathwatch space marine 
the teleportation on the other hand would be a problem


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## Biellann (Sep 6, 2010)

The Warp Spiders make short jump's into the warp itself, while the Phase Shield of a Harlequin shifts them between realspace and the webway.

For the Holo-field, it is described pretty well in the first paragraph/section in the second set of "spoiler" tags you posted (post #8).

As for a Harlequin's "invisibility", it is more then likely a combination of their Holo-Field as described above, the presence of the shadowseer mentioned (Veil of Tears), and the Harlequins phasing in out out of reality with the Phase Shield.

Edit: In Gav Thorpe's experimental codex the holo-field doesn't give an invulnerable save like in C:E. It gives a cover save from shooting and halves the WS of attackers in CC. There is also a more powerful version called a domino-field that causes the attackers to require a 6 to hit in CC. Just to give a table top example of what these can/could do.


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## kwak76 (Nov 29, 2010)

Ok..so let say that these Harlequins are the elite hand to hand specialist for the Eldars .

Who can beat them than? If not Astartes...than who?


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## Mindlessness (Dec 22, 2009)

A tank!


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## hailene (Aug 28, 2009)

How Orks and Tyranids get stuff done--A hell a lot of them, maybe?


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## Zakath (Feb 23, 2011)

Who ever said they have been beaten  

No really, hailene has it right. In Gav Thorpe's codex (God I miss that piece of work) the holo-suits were quite easily overcome by flamers... As it should be, really. I searched but couldn't find the old Codex: Harlequins from anywhere but my library (printed PDF) so sadly I can only reassure you that everything Biellan and Aramoro have said is true. 
You guys just have to cope with the fact that the universe is a big place and whatever happens.. There will always be a bigger fish - bigger even than the Astartes.


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## MontytheMighty (Jul 21, 2009)

Zakath said:


> There will always be a bigger fish - bigger even than the Astartes.


true but I just didn't think harlequins were that much bigger


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## Zakath (Feb 23, 2011)

> true but I just didn't think harlequins were that much bigger


Yes, well you can perhaps imagine my shock when I saw how weak their rules were in Codex:Eldar! 

Maybe it comforts you to know, btw, that the Harlequins are _rare_. Space Marines are so rare that most Imperial planets only receive a visit once in a century or even less. Harlequins are so rare that Space Marines outnumber them propably ten to one.. So they won't be taking over Terra anytime soon


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## cegorach (Nov 29, 2010)

Look, to be honest, Space Marines visit that kind of treatment on every other race hundreds of times over (don't want to even mention some of the things they have done to poor chaos) but the point is, win some lose some. there are so many thousands of writers out there who are in love with space marines and think one space marine can outsmart and single handedly kill hundreds chaos marines. (*cough* Ben Counter *cough cough*)
That really you have no right that just because this one fight was slightly over balenced in a way that wasnt in your favor, that you go into a flying all caps rage about it. If anyone gets done over most in the novels its the Dark Eldar. Dont get me wrong im not a huge fan of the DE but I have read about three books with them in, every single time they injure about 4 space marines, and lose about 3000 DE. 

But hey, maybe its because im an Eldar player, and used to a little having my own side being the shite ones. Losing a hundred for every one they kill. 
Maybe I am just incredibly happy about that fact that not all Eldar are slower than space marines. As they seem to be sometimes. 
But it boils down to, someone published it so .... na na na na na:laugh:, we killed loads of people and you killed no one na na na na na:victory:


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## ThatOtherGuy (Apr 13, 2010)

the real reason why the marınes lost was that they were laughıng so hard over how bad the Harlequın Rules were that they couldn't fıght back.

There, that should satıate every space marıne fan for now.


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## Zakath (Feb 23, 2011)

So cegorach has read the Wolves of War (or something) the short story in Tales of Heresy where I think it was 4 Space Wolves assault a tower full of Dark Eldar, including the Archon and his Incubi bodyguard and come out on top, not losing a single guy in the process?  I think the sergeant got injured in his fight against the Punisher wielding, Shadowfield carrying Archon who was aided by two Incubi flanking the sarge.. So yeah, a tough match for them Space Wolves! 



> the real reason why the marınes lost was that they were laughıng so hard over how bad the Harlequın Rules were that they couldn't fıght back.


Well, that could also be true... It is just described as confusion and rage in the book


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## Cyleune (Nov 10, 2010)

> So cegorach has read the Wolves of War (or something) the short story in Tales of Heresy where I think it was 4 Space Wolves assault a tower full of Dark Eldar, including the Archon and his Incubi bodyguard and come out on top, not losing a single guy in the process?  I think the sergeant got injured in his fight against the Punisher wielding, Shadowfield carrying Archon who was aided by two Incubi flanking the sarge.. So yeah, a tough match for them Space Wolves!


Thats just sad...Incubi are one of - if not the best - CC unit in the entire game, they shit on berzerkers and eat assault marines for breakfast.


On the topic, you have to remember that ever Eldar unit is REALLLLLLY REALLLLY REALLLLY good at what it does but not good at much else. Harlequins are made to munch munch munch armor 3/4/5/6+, likeFire Dragons are made to om nom nom tanks.


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## Aramoro (Oct 7, 2009)

Zakath said:


> So cegorach has read the Wolves of War (or something) the short story in Tales of Heresy where I think it was 4 Space Wolves assault a tower full of Dark Eldar, including the Archon and his Incubi bodyguard and come out on top, not losing a single guy in the process?  I think the sergeant got injured in his fight against the Punisher wielding, Shadowfield carrying Archon who was aided by two Incubi flanking the sarge.. So yeah, a tough match for them Space Wolves!
> 
> Well, that could also be true... It is just described as confusion and rage in the book


Don't forget when some no-name space marines destroyed and entire Craftworld for a laugh. 

The Eldar Fleet cruised out and destroyed Hive Fleet Naga, then out of no where The Invaders cruise in and destroy the Craftworld for no know reason. So they can beat a Hive Fleet, but not some random Marines. Alaitoc later cruised by and destroyed their Homeworld but still. 

That's one of the most annoying things about the fluff really, people do things for no reason. There was no reason to attack that Craftworld, and they suffered catastrophic losses in the process, and then had their Homeworld assploded. Space Marines are supposed to be tactically astute but they seem to have negligible strategic sense. Were they just sitting back wondering, hmm wonder what happens if you go destroy a world belonging to one of the most vengeful races in the Galaxy at random?


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## Carna (Mar 13, 2008)

Aramoro said:


> Don't forget when some no-name space marines destroyed and entire Craftworld for a laugh.
> 
> The Eldar Fleet cruised out and destroyed Hive Fleet Naga, then out of no where The Invaders cruise in and destroy the Craftworld for no know reason. So they can beat a Hive Fleet, but not some random Marines. Alaitoc later cruised by and destroyed their Homeworld but still.
> 
> That's one of the most annoying things about the fluff really, people do things for no reason. There was no reason to attack that Craftworld, and they suffered catastrophic losses in the process, and then had their Homeworld assploded. Space Marines are supposed to be tactically astute but they seem to have negligible strategic sense. Were they just sitting back wondering, hmm wonder what happens if you go destroy a world belonging to one of the most vengeful races in the Galaxy at random?


"Purge the alien" doesn't count as a reason?


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## kickboxerdog (Jun 2, 2011)

LOL i love the weapon the Harlequins Kiss , the way it can liquifiy your insides , to think about it eldar are faster than marines especialy harlequins with there holo suits make them very hard to hit, then with a weapon like the kiss thats a wire , theres lots of times that a marines armour has been penertrated in a joint and this is all it would take for the Harlequins Kiss wire to enter the marines body after all the marines are just flesh and bone inside, so bye bye marine ,


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## Warlock in Training (Jun 10, 2008)

SMs cant always win. If they did then it wouldnt be a dark grim futur now would it?


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