# Orks...too cheap?



## Sternguard VETRAN (Apr 29, 2009)

does any one else think ork units dont cost enough points.. i mean come on a squad of lootas for 75pts a killa kan for 35pts 

yes they might be a swarm army and couldnt hit a barn door at 2ft away but i no some ork players that are very lucky on the dice and when 15 sluggas can take down a devestator squad in one shooting phase i start questioning the pts


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## bishop5 (Jan 28, 2008)

How did 15 sluggas get near enough to a Devastator squad to shoot them? :shok:

Orks are silly easy to shoot and the large mob sizes (on foot) mean they are easy prey for frag missiles, whirlwinds, etc.


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## humakt (Jan 2, 2008)

Orks are cheap, but in a normal gaming enviroment they still have problems. Template and multi dice heavy weapons, and high armour tanks can decimate them. So if you know you are playing greenskins you can tailer your special weapons and armour to take them on.

They do have an advantage in tournaments where thier numbers can prove problematic to smaller armies that are built to take on all comers, but thats the way it goes sometimes.


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## Khorothis (May 12, 2009)

1. Its your fault for allowing the Sluggas to reach your Devastators on the first place.
2. Bad luck, shit happens
3. You're taking it too seriously, this is just a game, not your life.
4. Space Marine players shouldn't whine about others being strong. If you're beaten it is either because you're doing it wrong or you just had bad rolls. 
5. When playing against Orks, you have to be prepared for anything. Hell, if my Termies would have been shot by those Sluggas I would have laughed my ass off on the spot. Just like that Necron player the other day when a Fire Warrior killed his Destroyer Necron Lord in *melee*.


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## Winterous (Mar 30, 2009)

Yes, Orks are one of the cheapest units in the game when you consider their potential harm.
Their average harm in shooting however is quite low indeed, with normal Boys at least.
In melee is where they shine.

How to stop them getting there?
Pie plates, and anti-transport guns.


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## Creon (Mar 5, 2009)

Orks tend to win when the mass gets to HTH. How to win? Mass of fire.


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## Grimskul25 (Feb 17, 2009)

I don't see what you have to complain about, its just one of the Orks advantages, the reason why Lootas cost so little is because they have basically no armour, Low Ld, and low BS. Yes their gun is really good but if you look at it most of the time they need at least a 3 or 4 to get results and if you don't take more than five they normally wont have much of an output of fire. As for 15 Orks apparently slaughtering your devastators with sluggas, firstly outrageous things can happen, its a game of chance, get used to it. My fully kitted Nobz got raped once in cc with Berserkers due to poor rolls and in one sweeping advance *POOF* there goes my unit, things happen. People could just as easily say that TH Termies are the hot sauce and cheese and rant and scream at you because they killed his uber HQ of despair. Each army has its own advantages; Orks have their incredibly cheap infantry, IG have an amazing array of tanks, SM have great versatility and different builds, Chaos has great troops...I could go on but I hope you get the point, before you complain about another army, instead ask yourself, what could you do next time to try to improve so that doesn't happen again?


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## Chocobuncle (Feb 5, 2009)

Khorothis said:


> you're doing it wrong.












I think thats wrong enough

And yea dude its kinda funny/sad how they got close enough in the first place. How they killed them, thats even more funny/sad

But yea blast the **** out of them if you want to win


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## Winterous (Mar 30, 2009)

Oh yeah, by the way, against Orks, take a Whirlwind.
I cannot stress enough how good they are, they set aflame things like Lootas and Heavy Weapon Squads, and destroy hordes out in the open.


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## SKITTLESKITTEN (Feb 12, 2008)

Orcs are pretty cheap but also consider this, who really wants to be the guy who fields over 150 models? its just so cumbersome to move them all


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## morfangdakka (Dec 31, 2006)

Orks are cheap that is one of their advantages so you should not have let them get that close to your devastor squad. 

You have to expect to lots of troops when playing orks so you should take blaste templates and multi shot weapons to chew up those big mobs.


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## darklove (May 7, 2008)

Orks are way to cheap for units that always have a 4+ cover save - every ork player I know mixes their units so they cover each other.
I'm not playing vs orks anymore until there is a big change in either the ork codex, the Necron codex, or the next edition of the BRB.


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## Winterous (Mar 30, 2009)

darklove said:


> Orks are way to cheap for units that always have a 4+ cover save - every ork player I know mixes their units so they cover each other.
> I'm not playing vs orks anymore until there is a big change in either the ork codex, the Necron codex, or the next edition of the BRB.


Er, maybe you should tell those players to move according to the rules then.
It is _practically impossible_ to have 2 units covering each other AND move them at the same time, for it to work you need ideal conditions and some fucking steady hands.

Basically, they can't just move forward as a clump, they have to move each model individually and CANNOT move it through any other models or a gap smaller than their base.
Alternatively, you could just tell them to fuck off because they're exploiting the rules.


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## darklove (May 7, 2008)

They move each model individually and they do it all the time = not playing vs orks anymore.


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## Winterous (Mar 30, 2009)

darklove said:


> They move each model individually and they do it all the time = not playing vs orks anymore.


How do they do it?
We could probably pick a hole in it anyway.


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## Khorothis (May 12, 2009)

I sense treachery afoot. Though I think the Necrons do have trouble with hordes in general (which is ridiculous, we're talking about a genocidal race here) since they don't have too many templates. Ever tried fielding three Monoliths to channel their numbers, so that the Warriors behind could shoot them to bits?


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## Winterous (Mar 30, 2009)

Khorothis said:


> I sense treachery afoot. Though I think the Necrons do have trouble with hordes in general (which is ridiculous, we're talking about a genocidal race here) since they don't have too many templates. Ever tried fielding three Monoliths to channel their numbers, so that the Warriors behind could shoot them to bits?


Actually, a unit of Flayed Ones with a CC-equipped lord could do very well against Orks.
Take the Lord with:

Chronometron (means you're much more likely to win a Sweeping Advance roll, either way it's going)
Gaze of Flame (means if they charge you and the Lord is able to attack, they're much worse off, and the -1Ld works in conjunction with the Flayed Ones special rule)
Lightning Field (means that any unsaved wounds inflicted upon the unit cause a S3 hit, this will absolutely DESTROY Orks, as they do lots of damage and on a 5+ will practically die from this)

That's 50 points of Wargear, you could spend the other 40 on anything.
But an Orb is usually the best choice, and since the Lord can be singled out, he's very likely to die a horrible armour-ignoring death, and so wants to be able to revive.


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## englhockey (Mar 19, 2009)

it doesnt matter how cheap they are when you orbital bombard them with 2 chapter masters, whirwind, vindicator and thunderfire them as well then use my tac squads to thin them out and finish them off.


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## Stella Cadente (Dec 25, 2006)

nope there not undepriced

and if your having troubles with orks getting into groups to give each other cover saves there are easy ways to solve this

Flamers
Barrage weapons
Ordnance weapons

job done, if you don't take either of these kinds of weapons against horde armies when every army can take at least 1, and complain about them afterwards, well its not the Orks with the problem



darklove said:


> They move each model individually and they do it all the time = not playing vs orks anymore.


yeah I hate it when people move each model 1 at a time, damn those Marine/guard/necron/tyranid/Ork/chaos/eldar/Dark eldar and Tau players, moving each model individually, who do they think they are


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## Sternguard VETRAN (Apr 29, 2009)

Khorothis said:


> 1. Its your fault for allowing the Sluggas to reach your Devastators on the first place.
> i no it was dumb but i was more concerned with the squad of nobs and the looted tank behind them. besides i had shrike protecting them ready to charge next turn


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## Sternguard VETRAN (Apr 29, 2009)

tahnks for the ideas guys ill be sure to try some


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## Sebi (Mar 3, 2009)

Sternguard VETRAN said:


> does any one else think ork units dont cost enough points.. i mean come on a squad of lootas for 75pts a killa kan for 35pts
> 
> yes they might be a swarm army and couldnt hit a barn door at 2ft away but i no some ork players that are very lucky on the dice and when 15 sluggas can take down a devestator squad in one shooting phase i start questioning the pts


Whine on . Whine off.

I see my Orks get shot down often enough :laugh:
I see my Lootaz miss often enough
I see my Nobbikers torn apart by darn big templates often enough
btw
Vindicators are WAY too cheap 

Whine on Whine off


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## Pauly55 (Sep 16, 2008)

Winterous said:


> Er, maybe you should tell those players to move according to the rules then.
> It is _practically impossible_ to have 2 units covering each other AND move them at the same time, for it to work you need ideal conditions and some fucking steady hands.
> 
> Basically, they can't just move forward as a clump, they have to move each model individually and CANNOT move it through any other models or a gap smaller than their base.
> Alternatively, you could just tell them to fuck off because they're exploiting the rules.


Actually, its really easy to move two units so they grant cover to each other. There's a great picture in the BRB that shows how cover is determined for intervening squads. you basically outline the squad in front, and any squad with 50% of their members with any part of them behind that outline, they get the 4+. This means that you can space each member of the intertwined squads more than 1" apart, so its easy to move between the bases, and cover is still granted.


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## englhockey (Mar 19, 2009)

Or just induct grey knights into your list and use a vindicare assasin to pick off nobz with claws now you have a buch of useless boyz that should be easy to take care of works for me anyways.


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## Orochi (Jan 28, 2009)

Gonna be honest with you, a Botler is an orks nightmare.

You can field 50+ in 1500 points. Not to mention bin units of sterguard get special ammo that can decimate orks (Hellfire rounds).

Another flaw is orks will ALWAYS try and get you in CC. Where they aren't the best army there either.

I think orks are fun, either to play with or against.


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## buckythefly (Mar 16, 2009)

Listen guy, Listen, you need to look at the bigger picture, my point costs are lower then yours, but I am the guy who is spending 70 bucks for a battle force that adds 370 points fully kitted out.

Anyhow, Yeah don't worry about crazy stuff happening, Orks excel at making stuff you wouldn't expect happen. Theirs no such thing as a sure thing. I had a squad of 'ard boyz who marched straight at a sister of battle squad that was firing the whole time and only lost two guys. Wicked strange things can happen.

But, as an Ork player, if you want to make up for Orkish low point values, hit em where it hurts, in the armor save, most orks only have a 6+ so bolters and most guns can actually kill them with no possible save.

Also, @ Orochi I agree to disagree! Orks Is Biggest! Orks is Strongest! (Hehehe all in fun)


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## SKITTLESKITTEN (Feb 12, 2008)

so wait, how does that make any sense for a two squads to screen each other? thats like saying, OMGZ we are needing to survive more rounds of bolter fire! hurry everyone get close to each other and bunch up in a big target of meat!


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## Sebi (Mar 3, 2009)

GW made the rulez ... ask them

once something is covered by another squads model you have cover
the double banana and such stuff imho is not worth considering as it is even for tournaments not in the sense of the game ... though strictly legal

now back to topic:

our standard is cheap ... yeah.... but also weak against certain tactics and weapons ... really vulnerable!
use templates... use flamers .... ist big gunz .... use lots of firepower....

I have seen my friends mass orks decimated by my SAG easily as there simple was no was to miss
walking orks are slow ... avoid them and "bolter" them down
speed freaks often have weak vehicles or expensive ones - shoot em down!
We have no weapons stronger than 8 and AP2 and a lousy BS!

If you are dumb enough to let us catch you in CC ... YOU DESERVE IT!
Even Nob Bikers have their flaws: point costs and heavy flamers ..


so stop here
start thinking
if you know your opponent is an Ork-Warboss .... think what your Dex offers you to get the masses or Vehicles down ... everyone has such weapons.
don't tell me you don't cause thats a straight lie

so... I'm outta here
CYA


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## SKITTLESKITTEN (Feb 12, 2008)

a big thing with orcs is, if you know ur opponenet is playing them then you can easily wipe them out, but if you dont load your list to fight them specifically they should be able to give you a pretty good fight, also too, if they get u into CC with their foot sloggers you can kiss ur army good bye.


Orc boys--- ugh squads of 30 is so many models to deal with

lootas--- you mean these aren't space scrap? wtf

commandos--- love them but GW wants to charge u a million dollars to own some

Burnas/tank bustas--- lots of fun, its fun to shoot out 8 rokkits or spill out 8 templates(take burnas if you are facing against orcs)

Nobs--- really cool units, they can get a painboy and if you give them a warboss they get ld 9

Nob bikers--- hate them too many pts

Orc Bikers--- I hate all bikes but of the bikes these are best

Gretchin--- dang not much cheaper than a regular orc squad

Storm boys--- always a fun unit

Deffkoptas--- who said orc units were cheap again? these things cost a fortune

Battle wagons--- Really fun unit, I like the kill cannons too, probably cuz though I just hate MEQ with a passion and passing up a large ap3 blast is too hard

Deff Dread--- can be taken as troop choices with big mek, good over all orcy unit

Killa Kans--- pretty cheap unit, definitely a good over all unit

Flash gits--- never heard of them

Big Gunz--- ugh why?! lol sometimes you probably need these badly

Looted Wagon--- wth is this thing? completely lost

MegaNobz--- kick some serious ass, a terminator with 2 wounds, but they are pretty expensive to buy, its like 15$ ea


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## Khorothis (May 12, 2009)

Wow, I've never seen a QQ thread turn into a tactica.


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## hells_fury (Apr 17, 2008)

buckythefly said:


> Anyhow, Yeah don't worry about crazy stuff happening, Orks excel at making stuff you wouldn't expect happen. Theirs no such thing as a sure thing.


that would have to be the best response :victory:

EDIT: oh, and dont complain about stuff bieng cheap MR SM gets rhinos that are better cheaper then my sisters


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## Vrykolas2k (Jun 10, 2008)

englhockey said:


> it doesnt matter how cheap they are when you orbital bombard them with 2 chapter masters, whirwind, vindicator and thunderfire them as well then use my tac squads to thin them out and finish them off.


How do you get two Chapter Masters on the field?
Since each Chaper only has one...


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## Lord Sven Kittyclaw (Mar 23, 2009)

Vrykolas2k said:


> How do you get two Chapter Masters on the field?
> Since each Chaper only has one...


By the magic of The space marines, Why does Vulkan Hestan Fight alongside Marneus Calgar, Because he can of Course! God I miss chapters with custom rules.


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## englhockey (Mar 19, 2009)

Just use a generic chapter master and another one or calgar or whoever youd like. Its a bit pricey but the 2 templates can really hurt at the beginning of a game or even end


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## o muddy o (Aug 22, 2009)

i recon it is great for ork plays cos if it is a 2000point battle orks how probly win cos the beepin lot of orks so its a good thing....:shok:


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## Crimson_Fist_7 (Nov 28, 2008)

I think Orks are the right amount of points.


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## darklove (May 7, 2008)

Some armies don't have any flamer template weapons, and Ordnance doesn't ignore cover as far as I know.


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## Crude (Mar 15, 2009)

most orks have a 6+ save - most weapons have an ap value...


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## MetalHandkerchief (Aug 3, 2009)

SKITTLESKITTEN said:


> Orcs are pretty cheap but also consider this, who really wants to be the guy who fields over 150 models? its just so cumbersome to move them all


Oh, I just love plonking 100 Kroot on the table as Tau in 1500 points battles. It's just so fun to see the look on their faces as they realize "I didn't plan for this..." :grin:


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## Winterous (Mar 30, 2009)

MetalHandkerchief said:


> Oh, I just love plonking 100 Kroot on the table as Tau in 1500 points battles. It's just so fun to see the look on their faces as they realize "I didn't plan for this..." :grin:


Bwahahahhaah!
That's gotta be painful in melee.
Easy to kill though, only T3.


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## MetalHandkerchief (Aug 3, 2009)

Winterous said:


> Easy to kill though, only T3.


Not now that they get 3+ invul save in forest


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## Sebi (Mar 3, 2009)

and Kroot have a high initiative ... painfull ... though I rather fight a bunch of kroot than another mob of Boyz


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## Winterous (Mar 30, 2009)

Sebi said:


> and Kroot have a high initiative ... painfull ... though I rather fight a bunch of kroot than another mob of Boyz


Uh, no?
They have I3, not particularly high.
Kroot Hounds have I5, which is a good one for Sweeping people, but unfortunately you need majority, and Hounds don't have a rule that overrides that :\


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## MetalHandkerchief (Aug 3, 2009)

Winterous said:


> Uh, no?
> They have I3, not particularly high.
> Kroot Hounds have I5, which is a good one for Sweeping people, but unfortunately you need majority, and Hounds don't have a rule that overrides that :


Remember that Kroot are more useful defending little crops of woods close to the action - and can just stand there picking off from afar. If they get charged, worst that can happen is they strike at the same initiative as their foes.

Kroot will usually make up for their points cost, especially in large battles where they don't become a top priority for the enemy.

EDIT: What does this have to do with Orks? Nothing I'm afraid, sorry for off-topic


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## Stella Cadente (Dec 25, 2006)

darklove said:


> Some armies don't have any flamer template weapons


Tau do, Marines do, Guard do, space elves do, orks do, I'm sure nids do somewhere, daemonhunters do, witchhunters do, dunno about dark space elves since I've never looked but nobody plays them anyway.


darklove said:


> and Ordnance doesn't ignore cover as far as I know.


it forces them to make allot of saves, thats the point in it, of course you could just shoot targets out of cover, shocking I know.



I love fighting kroot too, so easy to kill in combat, even with guard


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## Winterous (Mar 30, 2009)

MetalHandkerchief said:


> worst that can happen is they strike at the same initiative as their foes.


That was 4th ed (and probably 3rd ed), now Frags just make cover do nothing to Initiative order.



Stella Cadente said:


> Tau do, Marines do, Guard do, space elves do, orks do, I'm sure nids do somewhere, daemonhunters do, witchhunters do, dunno about dark space elves since I've never looked but nobody plays them anyway.


Nids don't, but in the new rules they'll have blast weapons that do.


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## Sebi (Mar 3, 2009)

I3 is faster than my Orkboyz which ha I2 which means I have to charge to get to strike at the same time ... if I let me get caught I will suffr a lot of wounds before I can strike back

the forest special rules are crap imho as it depends strongly in the battlefield how good a unit is whcih imho is off balancing the game ... maybe my oppion is wrong but I feel that way.

Other than that back to the original discussion:
even a 30 model stron Boyzmob can be stopped if you play your cards right.... a lot of models mean you just have more room to miss with your blast and ordnance and now tell me one race that has no "pie plate" ... even the NEcrons have one ... ok ... just this one an no flamer ... no blast ... but they have a lot of fire-output which is just as good.

One can do it ... send in a sacrifice fly ... let them huddle into a nice position and place your plates over them and see them die.

I once deep striked a bunch of Stormboyz and scattered right into the fire-alley of two barbed stranglers ... needless to say that shortly after I put the Boyz on the table I already packed them away again ... all dead.

so stop whining about point costs...
you have the firepower? ... use it!


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## jakkie (Dec 21, 2007)

Sebi said:


> I3 is faster than my Orkboyz which ha I2 which means I have to charge to get to strike at the same time ... if I let me get caught I will suffr a lot of wounds before I can strike back


Orks rely primarily on their Furious Charge... Its what gives them their I3, Str4 attacks, otherwise theyre just banking on numbers to see them through. Not that thats not a good idea for them


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## deathbringer (Feb 19, 2009)

jakkie said:


> Orks rely primarily on their Furious Charge... Its what gives them their I3, Str4 attacks, otherwise theyre just banking on numbers to see them through. Not that thats not a good idea for them


I think we have discovered why they are cheap!
No but when i see orks in trucks i laugh immediately think i have a chance
I play tau so railguns and trukk normally= boom
I'm only worried when i see big mek's with KFF's grot screens and loads of boyz.

Without numbers or mobility orks are nothing. They cant hit a barn door and they are pretty easy to avoid whilst they fall like flies to almost any weapon. Also if you charge ork boys without powerclaws (a rare occurance but it has happened) you have a great chance of winning the combat simply because of rubbish armour saves

On kroot... they suck shit. I've got rid of mine though i wish i could take kroot hounds only... i would love that


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## MetalHandkerchief (Aug 3, 2009)

deathbringer said:


> On kroot... they suck shit. I've got rid of mine though i wish i could take kroot hounds only... i would love that


Wait...

They are str 4, WS 4, have 2 attacks on the profile, a str 4 rifle + infiltrate and fieldcraft...

They cost 7 points each. Up to 20 in a squad.

To me, that is more than just points efficiency. It's totally pants.

Envision this list:

1 Commander, nvm the layout
2 Hammerheads
2 10 Man FW squads
2 Devilfishes
4x20 Kroot, 4x4 Kroot Hounds

The opponent is going to concentrate on the Devilfishes and Hammerheads (by extension, FW's) leaving 80 infiltrated Kroot pretty much free to storm the board.

Note: It's not enough to just toss them in and see how they work. YOU have to work to make Kroot work. You have to want to hug cover, have patience in positioning and ABOVE ALL pacing; going "too far" in a single leap will often leave them sitting ducks.

Anyway, playing against a "choose your poison" army list like this is very difficult and inexperienced generals will have trouble coping. This is also very enemy dependant. The Kroot will not do much against SM Bike/Assault armies or other very fast hard-shell builds.

Just try once, to really want to get an untouched 24 model kroot squad into CQC with a Carnifex (Usually, they are equal in points) or the SM command squad / Terminator squad. You will be surprised at what 50-72 strength 4 attacks will do.


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## darklove (May 7, 2008)

Stella Cadente said:


> of course you could just shoot targets out of cover, shocking I know.


I think you missed the earlier part of the conversation: Orks make their own cover so you can't shoot at ones that are 'out of cover'. Every Ork player in my area uses the intermingled units exploit to get cover saves on all Orks regardless of where they are standing.


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## Stella Cadente (Dec 25, 2006)

darklove said:


> I think you missed the earlier part of the conversation: Orks make their own cover so you can't shoot at ones that are 'out of cover'. Every Ork player in my area uses the intermingled units exploit to get cover saves on all Orks regardless of where they are standing.


well round here the ork players we do have don't do that, cus there not jerks, so I do not take that into consideration because of personnel experience, if I met someone who did I'd load up on redeemers, flamers and blood claws, and make that cover save worthless as you cut orks to pieces with a sword, not a bullet.

although it does mean Dark Angels finally have a useful option, the incendiary on there whirlwinds.


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## deathbringer (Feb 19, 2009)

MetalHandkerchief said:


> Wait...
> 
> They are str 4, WS 4, have 2 attacks on the profile, a str 4 rifle + infiltrate and fieldcraft...
> 
> ...


I know. Honestly I do. I'm not some dipshit making a statement trying to be cool. I've played with kroot alot and i used to love having a squad to infiltrate but i had several bad experiences where they just failed. Yeah I'm going to leave my unarmoured squad out of cover for everyone to shoot at, i'm dumb but i'm not that dumb.

The absence of power weapons and though they make alot of attacks against marines they just loose out to the superior armour save and that its 4's on 4;s meaning only 3/4;s hit if your lucky... which i must admit im not. Whilst marines are wounding and killing on 4's and then 3's with no saves. In the end the kroot loose out due to poor leadership despite that mountain of attacks. Plus the marines go first so only the kroot hounds strike first. 

So i will refine my statement kroot suck shit against anything with ap3 and ws4 s4 and with the new space wolves codex your going to facing alot of those armies.


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## darklove (May 7, 2008)

Stella Cadente said:


> well round here the ork players we do have don't do that, cus there not jerks, so I do not take that into consideration because of personnel experience, if I met someone who did I'd load up on redeemers, flamers and blood claws, and make that cover save worthless as you cut orks to pieces with a sword, not a bullet.


Which was also my point: Necrons don't have any flamers at all, and the very last thing they want is to get into CC with Orks. And all the Ork armies around here are very rude.


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## vo2 (Mar 31, 2008)

as said before orks are cheap because they are generally a lower quality of units then other army's troops but if used correctly can decimate the enemy you have to be stupid or have bad luck to lose to orks in a shooting round especially when you are space marines so pumped up in stats thats funny situation that you got there


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## Winterous (Mar 30, 2009)

darklove said:


> I think you missed the earlier part of the conversation: Orks make their own cover so you can't shoot at ones that are 'out of cover'. Every Ork player in my area uses the intermingled units exploit to get cover saves on all Orks regardless of where they are standing.


What they're doing is cheating.
Yes, the rules don't specifically disallow it, but that doesn't make it legal.
First of all, go the "Fuck you" route, make them move every model individually, and find out that they'll barely be able to move at all; if they spend enough time deploying and can actually move, go to the next option.
The "Fuck you again" route, where you yell at them for being a cheating little fuckwit, and not play against them.

Hopefully enough people will catch on that they'll stop doing it, because they're never getting to play.


Oh, and Stella, normal SM Whirlwinds have incendiary rounds too, not just DA ones.


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## darklove (May 7, 2008)

Yes, I have announced to all Orks players I know that they will not get a game until there is a big shift in the game (either changes to core rules, codexes, FAQs, or whatever).


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## Sebi (Mar 3, 2009)

I just don't understand why people always have to be jerks and nerds when it comes to "losing and winning" darn little games ... how small has one's self-esteem be to be able to lose a silly evening game?

I will keep away from such things .... I even once got angry as my friend tried to catch me at a silly situation demanding that my model was in basecontact with both of hiy Tyra-gards reducibng his attacks to zero while I had moved it close enough to one and blocking the other with a boy ... but those models are so big you cannot even make basecontact!

talking a bout clear rules and the releasing a model that is unplayable by the rules.

So: It's a game ... noones forcing you to play those guys ... exploiting the rule's little holes is imho the wrong way to win and cowardly.


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## Winterous (Mar 30, 2009)

darklove said:


> Yes, I have announced to all Orks players I know that they will not get a game until there is a big shift in the game (either changes to core rules, codexes, FAQs, or whatever).


...
Shouldn't you just say you won't play them until they stop being twats?


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## Stella Cadente (Dec 25, 2006)

Winterous said:


> Oh, and Stella, normal SM Whirlwinds have incendiary rounds too, not just DA ones.


I though space marines had those stupid retarded mine rounds, or is that BA's


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## Carnivore (Aug 4, 2009)

Winterous said:


> Oh, and Stella, normal SM Whirlwinds have incendiary rounds too, not just DA ones.





Stella Cadente said:


> I though space marines had those stupid retarded mine rounds, or is that BA's


As always, a Stella Cadente in her best constructive and mature mood... Shouldn't you consider having an hobby instead of an outlet?


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## Stella Cadente (Dec 25, 2006)

Carnivore said:


> As always, a Stella Cadente in her best constructive and mature mood... Shouldn't you consider having an hobby instead of an outlet?


I have no idea what your on about, and *her* best?.

anyway, as I said I'm sure someone has those stupid useless retarded mine rounds, worthless things.


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## MetalHandkerchief (Aug 3, 2009)

Stella Cadente said:


> and *her* best?.


I would guess he assumed as usually only females have PMS.


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## Carnivore (Aug 4, 2009)

MetalHandkerchief said:


> I would guess he assumed as usually only females have PMS.


Well, admit he's confusing... and/or suffering from constant PMS... :mrgreen:


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## Crude (Mar 15, 2009)

ur getting a little off topic folks...

anyway, concerning the orks, im pretty sure if you make them move each unit individually, as i believe the rules require (though im not going to swear on it). having them move around the other units will slow them right down, and hopefully prevent them from ending up in that convenient cover. 

i really dont like it when people exploit rules like this. it even says in the BRB that:
"it is important to remember that the rules are just a framework to create an enjoyable game. Winning at any cost is less important than making sure both players – not just the victor – have a good time"

i rest my case..


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## Winterous (Mar 30, 2009)

Stella Cadente said:


> I though space marines had those stupid retarded mine rounds, or is that BA's


That was the old ones, and yes I agree, those were too complicated and flimsy rules.
And nope, BA have the new ones too.


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## buckythefly (Mar 16, 2009)

I feel the need to weigh in on the Kroot vs Orks initiative battle, If you go before I1 your going to fast.


EDIT: Also, I don't use "Self-cover" for my boyz, else, what are Gretchen for, I mean I painted a fuckdozen of those things and I'll be damned if I'm not going to use them.
(Also I don't think its very fair)


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## Stella Cadente (Dec 25, 2006)

Winterous said:


> That was the old ones, and yes I agree, those were too complicated and flimsy rules.
> And nope, BA have the new ones too.


ahh yes now I remember, its hard to keep track when marines get a new codex every 5 minutes


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## CerberusDWR (Jun 12, 2009)

I'm in staunch agreement about intermingling units for cover saves: the idea of it is silly. If sixty boyz are rushing a bunch of Tau or anything else for that matter, if you target 'one' group of them and the same exact walking green fungus from the other group happens to be slightly in front of the first, at least one of the boyz is in the front and is going to get shot.

Granted, realism in GW rules is a silly notion. Still, I consider that kind of rules twisting, even in(especially in) tournaments to be a real douche move. However, you really have no room to whine playing the Necrons who we all know need a serious buff. Don't blame the Orks, blame your army's lack of options. Or just find some Ork players who aren't douchebags.


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## SKITTLESKITTEN (Feb 12, 2008)

u would think an Ork player would be more fluffy, damn though thats jacked, so unspirited for them to try to claim that cover save


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## Stella Cadente (Dec 25, 2006)

SKITTLESKITTEN said:


> u would think an Ork player would be more fluffy, damn though thats jacked, so unspirited for them to try to claim that cover save


depends, if there claiming it off Gretchin it is fluffy, very fluffy, off boys though unless its an accident, then no, no boys cares aout protecting the boy next to him, he'd probably just hit him


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## Azkaellon (Jun 23, 2009)

There is a simple way to deal with ork's now days....Fire...Lots of Fire......They burn very well.......Plasma and Large Explosives also do a great job of dealing with this Oil and Vinger Lacking Thread!


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## Carnivore (Aug 4, 2009)

SKITTLESKITTEN said:


> u would think an Ork player would be more fluffy, damn though thats jacked, so unspirited for them to try to claim that cover save


For every "fluffy" 40K player, you'll find 5 or 10 un-fluffy, and among them, a good half Rule-Lawyers... But, don't mistake "un-fluff" with personal fun and trying new ideas or approach to one's army...


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