# Chosen chaos space marines?



## Tai (Dec 26, 2008)

Does anyone use them? they seem exactly like veterans in the old IG codex (super cheap, take lots of special weapons, infiltrate) and i see them as an incredible anti tank option (infiltrate within 18, move 12inches and shoot 4 meltas). or use plasmas (like vets in the old codex?)

do they just get outclassed by obliterators or normal marines? sure they're sort of expensive, but i imagine that if you set them up right, your opponent might only shoot back with one or two squads, which probably wouldn't kill even a 5 marine squad

i've heard lots of people talk about using havocs with lots of meltas in rhinos, but wouldn't chosen be way more effective and potentially even faster?


----------



## papercutdan (Oct 28, 2009)

chosen are good for haveing all special wepons for cheaper


----------



## Gul Torgo (Mar 31, 2008)

Chosen are the best Elite unit in the Chaos codex. I have never tried them tooled out for melee, but I have found the following quite useful.

-Outflanking meltas in a Rhino. Wonderful for ripping up Hammerheads and other big guns that like to hang back.
-Infiltrating meltas near the center of the map. A great way of controlling the field against mech players, who will usually try to give these guys a wide berth if they move at top speed on turn 1. Plasma can replace melta against armies with elite infantry, like Death Guard, or with monstrous creatures.


----------



## Siphon (Jan 17, 2009)

I use 5 with meltas. I also have a squad of 5 with 4 flamers and 1 power weapon. Great for that squad of 20 ork boyz right in front of you. 

I've considered the 5 plasma gun squad, but knowing my luck, I'd end up gets hotting myself to death, so I've stayed away for now.


----------



## Amra_the_lion (May 26, 2008)

I haven't seen the chosen work effectively. They don't score, if they infiltrate they are going to be target number one, and mounting 5 melta in a rhino is pointless, only one can shoot out anyway. There are too many powerful outflanking units to keep your vehicles near enough a side edge, orks can truck or fleet into your flamers pretty easy and you kill yourself with plasma rapid fire as fast as you take the enemy. It seems to me that they look like a great deal, but suicide squads don't win games. It looks like the examples above are lucky strikes.
just my two cents


----------



## Tai (Dec 26, 2008)

I just see them as one of CSM's only surgical strike units. IG had veterans and storm troopers, marines have orbital bombardment or whatever, nids have lichtors. deep striking only takes you so far, as usually you deep strike near your own units with icons

chaos just seems very oriented towards being 'predictably good', meaning you take insanely buff nurgle units and/or princes, stuff everything in rhinos, then charge with meltas and/or flamers. while it works great, i imagine it gets really predictable and cheesy

i suppose i want to know how CSMs can be more immediately mobile and reactive instead of just a brick you throw at your opponent. chosen marines seem like the start of that kind of list, and i'd probably run them as a diverse group on the outflank, in 6-7 man squad with 2 meltas for tanks, and lightning claws/fists to pressure back lined troops. yeah sort of expensive, but unique in their flexibility


----------



## maddermax (May 12, 2008)

Amra_the_lion said:


> and mounting 5 melta in a rhino is pointless, only one can shoot out anyway.


Two. Two can shoot out of the chaos rhino (see the Chaos FAQ/Eratta).

As for Chosen, well, they're situational, sometimes they're awesome, sometimes not. Personally, I think they're pretty good, only 3 points above a regular marine to get infiltrate and a few extra special weapons works well. Using outflank, you can usually get them into a good position to make use of their melta guns, 12" in, jump out 2 and have 6" melta range. 

They also are the best units if you have anything that needs an Icon to home in on, so terminators, daemons (if you have them) and oblitorators can all come down right where you need them. Admittedly, infiltration often makes them a pretty good target for the enemy, but if you keep them in cover, and don't just set them up infront of a firing line, you'll find they're reasonably survivable, just keep the unit reasonably cheap, and you'll be golden. 

Oh, and if you're looking for reactive, don't discout daemons out of hand, yes they aren't as good as regular CSM, but throwing 10 of them into a fight at the right time can work wonders., Or using them to tie up an enemy unit until another unit can assault it (like terminators, after they deepstirke) the next turn. Or tie up a walker with them, should keep him busy for a few turns.


----------



## Tai (Dec 26, 2008)

yeah i've heard people say that lesser demons aren't too great, but for 13 points i wouldn't mind taking a handful and assaulting on the same turn! 30 bs/strength 4 attacks isn't too bad. a good trick in the bag


----------



## Bushido (Sep 22, 2009)

im currently experimenting with a 5 man squad with 2 flamers and 2 meltas (would use 4 meltas but I dont have the points) and thus far im quite happy with them.


----------



## don_mondo (Jan 28, 2007)

Tai said:


> (infiltrate within 18, move 12inches and shoot 4 meltas).


FYI, this doesn't work unless you can find someplace to infiltrate them that is out of LOS of the enemy. It's infiltrate "more than 18"", not within 18".


----------



## Katie Drake (Nov 28, 2007)

Chosen seem to work best as a really cheap Greater Daemon delivery service. Taking a Chosen Champion doesn't confer much in the way of a bonus to the unit so the upgrade isn't too expensive, which means he's all nice and expendable like for a Greater Daemon to pop out of. Just don't try this and Outflank at the same time, lest you be forced to pop out of another Champ entirely.


----------



## MJayC50 (Oct 30, 2007)

i play with 3 plasma chosen in a rhino with a combi plasma. thats up to 6 shots a turn from the comfort of my rhino (as csm can shoot 2 weaps from the hatch, not 1) and the hardwired combi. they dont really work very well tho and i have tried quite a few. the only 1 i havent tried that i really want to is the all flamer chosen squad. seriously expendable but cheap. even against marines you are going to get a bucket load of forced saves. (as each template gets hits marked b4 rolling to wound) say you cover 5 marines with each. thats 25 hits. say 12 wound = 4 dead marines. or 2 dead termies... still cant take em seriously tho as they would just get eaten up in the next phase (after assaulting the target obviously!)


----------



## b.anthracis (Nov 18, 2008)

MJayC50 said:


> i play with 3 plasma chosen in a rhino with a combi plasma. thats up to 6 shots a turn from the comfort of my rhino (as csm can shoot 2 weaps from the hatch, not 1) and the hardwired combi.


Not really. Rhino has 1 hatch, which allows 2 guys to fire out of it. That makes 4 Plasma shots + the hardwired one.


----------



## Asmodeun (Apr 26, 2009)

Which equals six, no?


----------



## b.anthracis (Nov 18, 2008)

I did read it as 
6 shot from the comfort of the rhino (the marines)

+ the hardwired one

but I surley misread it. Sorry!


----------



## jesse (Sep 29, 2008)

i personally enjoy five:grin: plasma guys in rhino.

really really good anti infantry, that is, if your good about not getting hot


----------



## dougan_2 (Aug 27, 2009)

hi im new here and new to chaos aswell, I vs mainly space marines so I was gonna go all plasma squad and then chaos sorcerer with lash familiar and doombolt, shoot em at 18 inch range, doom em and then lash the survivors away from the squad.. On paper it works has anyone tried it though?


----------



## maddermax (May 12, 2008)

dougan_2 said:


> hi im new here and new to chaos aswell, I vs mainly space marines so I was gonna go all plasma squad and then chaos sorcerer with lash familiar and doombolt, shoot em at 18 inch range, doom em and then lash the survivors away from the squad.. On paper it works has anyone tried it though?


You can't actually use doombolt if you've already used lash for two reasons: you can only use one power a turn, unless you have the mark of tzeench, and doombolt counts as shooting, which you can't do if you use the lash. So, putting both on a single sorcerer isn't really worth it, as you'll always want to use the lash.

meanwhile, it's a good plan with the plasma, but plasma chosen makes it a pretty expensive unit, so you have to be careful with it. Keep them in cover, and don't let enemies get too close to them if possible. Best to make sure they have something to win close combat (a fist maybe) just in case, or at least some backup on hand, just in case.


----------



## Warlock in Training (Jun 10, 2008)

Anybody who says Chosen dont work for them Im very sorry to hear. Chosen as some pointed out are on of the 2 best Elite choices for CSM. Termies being first and Chosen second. I always run ethier 5 Meltas and a Icon or 3 Meltas and 2 Plasmas + Icon. I always outflank with them in a rhino. My experiance is ethier laugh with glee at smoldering Tanks, or feeling relief at killing those pesky HQs with Retinues. Cheap in points, weapons for Mech/Horde armies, and a Icon that has the potential to lead my Termies/Oblis/Daemons into a better attack position. 

Win, win unit .


----------



## dougan_2 (Aug 27, 2009)

oh, sorry. I will read it again then, sorry new to chaos. So just give him lash and take familiar off, makes it cheaper which is better then right? If you have 5 marines shooting with plasma weapons though one is bound to get hot killing your own men off quite quick. This would also be able to be done with havocs as they are cheaper.


----------



## Deus Mortis (Jun 20, 2009)

My opinion is that: Chosen are Chaos' answer to Vangard veterans. Now my point of view slightly squewed as I face a marine player who ALWAYS uses insane ammounts of Vangard Veterans. Baically they are good as protection for scoring units, either behind enemy lines, destroying their HS, of acting as a good CC sheidl for you're units camping on an objective, even it they only add a cover save!


----------



## Necrogoblikon (Jul 23, 2008)

yeah how would chosen work tooled out for close combat like 4 power weapons or something?


----------



## GiftofChaos1234 (Jan 27, 2009)

Necrogoblikon said:


> yeah how would chosen work tooled out for close combat like 4 power weapons or something?


probably suprisingly well considering they all get 3 attacks each on the charge which i can see hurting quite a few terminators especially if those terminators have powerfists


----------



## Skye (Oct 22, 2008)

jesse said:


> i personally enjoy five:grin: plasma guys in rhino.
> 
> really really good anti infantry, that is, if your good about not getting hot


I new I'd find you skulking around here.
Yeah...you'll never know true frustration until a squad of chosen hop out of a rhino and kill your best squad with 5 plasmas only to hop back in and drive to the next dead squad walking. I am going to paint the album cover of Seek and Destroy on your next rhino. :threaten:


----------



## Rye (Sep 22, 2009)

Necrogoblikon said:


> yeah how would chosen work tooled out for close combat like 4 power weapons or something?





GiftofChaos1234 said:


> probably suprisingly well considering they all get 3 attacks each on the charge which i can see hurting quite a few terminators especially if those terminators have powerfists


Lightning claws come either in pairs or in addition to a ranged weapon for Chosen. They're rather expensive, though.


----------



## Wraithian (Jul 23, 2008)

Rye said:


> Lightning claws come either in pairs or in addition to a ranged weapon for Chosen. They're rather expensive, though.


Power weapons are a better option for chosen, claws aren't really needed. Pure volume of attacks will see most small, hardened (ie, terminators) squads cleaned up on the charge.


----------



## jesse (Sep 29, 2008)

Skye said:


> I new I'd find you skulking around here.
> Yeah...you'll never know true frustration until a squad of chosen hop out of a rhino and kill your best squad with 5 plasmas only to hop back in and drive to the next dead squad walking. I am going to paint the album cover of Seek and Destroy on your next rhino. :threaten:


please do it will be oh so amusing as i kill you.
hey i can even sing as i do so.:biggrin:

anywho.....
chosen with power weapons are very useful.
you can get four attacks on the charge with MoK,
and for anti tank, you can give *all* of them melta bombs.
they are amazing


----------



## Rye (Sep 22, 2009)

Wraithian said:


> Power weapons are a better option for chosen, claws aren't really needed. Pure volume of attacks will see most small, hardened (ie, terminators) squads cleaned up on the charge.


Heh, true, Str 4 after all. 

But you could outfit a Champion with one seperately, right, or would that cut into the four specwep limit? The codex give no seperate options for the Champion.


----------



## Katie Drake (Nov 28, 2007)

Rye said:


> But you could outfit a Champion with one seperately, right, or would that cut into the four specwep limit? The codex give no seperate options for the Champion.


He counts toward the four special weapon limit.


----------



## Cruor99 (Mar 11, 2009)

Personally, I've found that a outflanking group of chosen with 2 flamers and 3 meltas works great for a take all comers list. Has worked great, both against Space Marines and Orks alike in the single unit. They can do it all, from the rear. So the opponent has to chose something to sacrifice at a board edge.


----------



## piemaster (Oct 9, 2009)

My CSMs are back in 4th ed (the way I like it) and one lieutant is on a bike with 4 chosen with some specials (think flamer & plasma ptl or something like that) and the other has a jump pack with 4 chosen all with cc wpns a power sword, sorcerer and that sort of thing. They're pretty sweet but I don't play so I don't know how well they'd perform plus some people would throw a hissy fit what with them not being from the current codex.


----------



## Ryuzaki (Nov 1, 2009)

Have daemons waiting in reserves and Infiltrate your chosen squad w/ champ, icon and whatever weapons combo you want. If you're playing on a small board, hold 'em in reserve to outflank. Provided you're alive by the time the reserves are coming in, you can watch in glee as a Greater daemon explodes into existance alongside squads of lesser daemons right behind enemy lines. The best part is they can assualt in the same turn. :victory:


----------



## LordWaffles (Jan 15, 2008)

don_mondo said:


> FYI, this doesn't work unless you can find someplace to infiltrate them that is out of LOS of the enemy. It's infiltrate "more than 18"", not within 18".


Infiltrate 18.0001 away, move forward twelve, swing around and dump out marines 2.9 inches, fire all meltas.


Chosen are pretty good in my book, reliable as long as you can roll reserves and table side. They're one of chaos' only cheap surgical units(beside oblits), and with guns they're very very hard to stop.

As for a CC bunch, they're awful. No fearless, and 2 attacks a piece makes them hurt something awful when handing them expensive weapons. I mean infiltrating them is nice to mess up an opponent early on, or take out a squad or two late game, but they just don't have the force of ten terminators/wolf guard/assault marines to break their points cost worth of junk.


----------



## maddermax (May 12, 2008)

LordWaffles said:


> Infiltrate 18.0001 away, move forward twelve, swing around and dump out marines 2.9 inches, fire all meltas.


errr.... you can't actually infiltrate in a rhino though. This makes it difficult for them to move 12" in a turn. All melta-squads work best I think when outflanking with the unit, giving you a couple of feet from each board edge you can threaten.


----------



## LordWaffles (Jan 15, 2008)

maddermax said:


> errr.... you can't actually infiltrate in a rhino though. This makes it difficult for them to move 12" in a turn. All melta-squads work best I think when outflanking with the unit, giving you a couple of feet from each board edge you can threaten.


Ah you can't? I thought they could, hurfdurf.

Then yeah, go with the outflanking, it's impossible to really feel safe from the chosen unless you gamble it all on one board edge, in which case go chosen in board control.


----------

