# An Appraisal of Orks



## Cole Deschain (Jun 14, 2008)

If you're in no mood to listen to someones' personal unit by unit rant, read no further.

We'll start with the HQ choices (but skip special characters, as my opinion of them sinks lower with every passing day)

Let's start with the guy who used to be mandatory- the Warboss.

Honestly? I like the guy. Good statline (especially for an Ork), solid Leadership (in an army where it disappears rapidly in small units), and enough options for him to fill almost any role that's needed (although he really IS wasted in a shooting build, since his weapon skill is excellent and his number of attacks is likewise.) It's VERY hard to build a Warboss who doesn't add something to the ranks.

Moving on, let's address my absolute favorite choice- the Weirdboy.

First and foremost, even with the only upgrade he can buy, he's mercifully cheap, leaving lots of free points to spend... wherever. For this, you get what is essentially a Nob with no gear options, BUT- his powers are phenomenal. Provided he stays in a Mob large enough to provide high leadership for most of the game, and keeps his nose clean, he generates all kinds of fun. Warpath is the only power that you're unlikely to find a use for early in the game, and depending upon deployment, sometimes even then. He's not the fighter that the Warboss is, and his leadership is crap when he's on his own, but his ability to boost MASSIVE mobs is worth its weight in gold.

Wrapping up the HQ selection, we come to the guy who I, for the life of me, cannot understand the fetish for.

That's right, the Big Mek.


Like the Weirdboy, he's essentially a Nob, statswise (his leadership is ONE better. Wheee). He sells himself (apparently) by wargear, and by vehicle repair.

Allow me to address the latter first-
Very seldom, in my years of playing 40K, have I seen dedicated vehicle repair units prove worthwhile. Even the staunchest Techmarine advocate usually slaps a few Gun-Servitors with the guy and uses him as a firebase as his actual primary duty.

So, let's look at his wargear.

The vast majority of it makes him an inferior (albeit cheaper) Warboss. That said, it stands to reason that tricking out a Big Mek for close combat is rather silly, when a Warboss is BETTER at it...

The two Holy Grails, the things that make people bring this guy, are the Shokk Attack Gun and the Kustom Force field.

Let us begin with the SAG. While it IS "Orky" in its randomness, it's also incredibly unreliable. Unlike the Weirdboy, who has a five in six chance of doing something useful, a SAG Mek has a 4 in 12 chance of doing something almost guaranteed to annoy, to say nothing of the MANY combinations that end up in a low Strength hit. Is it fun?
Yes, in a hilarious kind of way, but it's horribly unreliable. It's like a Zzap Gun with the possibility of ATOMIZING your HQ on a bad roll. And I don't see ANYBODY pushing for Zzap Guns the way they do the SAG.

Then we have the Kustom Force Field. The KFF is, at least , moderately useful, although in this day and age of claiming cover saves from intervening DUST MOTES, not what it used to be. I suppose it works well enough if you're fielding several large, slow-moving foot mobs, but the way Run results tend to stagger advancement, to say nothing of varied unit speeds, inevitably means that the KFF can't be everywhere. And it's worth two Power Klaws elsewhere in the army.

I suppose I can see why some people MIGHT take the Mek, but honestly, the other two options are a lot more useful in general play, because they don't rely upon set-piece maneuvering OR the Mek himself holding perfectly still.

Up next, Elites...


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## Cole Deschain (Jun 14, 2008)

*Ork Elites*

Ah, Ork Elites. THIS is a section I really enjoy, because most of the options are at least entertaining. However, some stand out more than others, truth be told.

Let us begin with the "humble" Nob.

I love these guys... _I_never field a Nob Mob, but that's a question of play style. Multi-wound, hard-hitting suckers, they can field a truly intimidating array of Wargear, to say nothing of the ability to bring along a Painboy.

You COULD trick them out for shooting, but at that point, they really should become Flash Gitz. My only objection to Nobs, as such, is that they're a bit of a Points sink, with a Squad Cap that keeps their leadership easily brought down to size- provided your foe can actually KILL them.

Meganobs merit mention, because I don't like them. WERE I to field such an expensive unit, I'd want more bang for my buck.Their armor save, while commendable, is NOT backed up by anything else, and they're slow as molasses.
They CAN be loaded into a Trukk or Battlewagon, but really, it's just chasing good points with bad at that juncture. If you REALLY want a durable Nob Mob, stick 'em on Bikes, give 'em a Painboy, and tighten your belt, because those points have to come from somewhere.


Now we come to Burna Boyz... and while Fifth Edition has made them more viable, I have to say, they usually come out as the ugly stepchildren of the Ork Elite bracket. Sure, they all have flamers. Sure, they pack the only reliable "power weapons" in the Ork Army. They're also a short-range unit who has to borrow someone else's ride to get up the field, and you can't bring enough to make the walk in any way safe.

It's a shame, too, because I like, them, I like them a great deal. Sadly, I like the other options available better.


Among those options? One that makes me chortle with malevolent glee?
Tankbustas.

Hilariously, while they're decent at hitting tanks, the way these guys actually earn their keep in my army is in trashing MEQs. That many Rokkits going off, even with Ork accuracy, can give even the most hardened Space Marine Tac Squad pause.

And they're hands-down the cure for the Death Guard.

In all honesty, I mostly bring these guys because I'm too cheap to replace them with an extra squad of the next choice, the apple of my eye, the creme de la creme.

Lootas.

Ah, Lootas. I cannot praise them too highly. Fantastic guns, random rate of fire that USUALLY gets you enough shots to make it hurt, and a range to make a Devastator Squad weep. They're useful against ANYTHING short of a Land Raider, in terms of fire power, and frequently spam out enough shots to achieve the desired end.

Wrapping up the list of choices, we have Kommandos.

I don't bring 'em, but I have to say, they're aces. Sneaky, capable of bringing along Burnas if you dread Armor Saves, and they fight every bit as well as the rest of the army. Their only handicap is their relatively small squad size, but honestly, you can have more than TEN Orks infiltrating VERY close to the enemy.

Up next- Troops.


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## Cole Deschain (Jun 14, 2008)

*Troops*

A nice short category.

Boyz- Oh, what can I say? The regular Ork Boy is a superb killing machine. The more you bring, the happier you usually are with the results. Just make sure that each squad has a Nob and that that Nob carries a Power Klaw. Big mobs are usually preferable, but a smaller Mob in a Trukk is an asset you'd be a fool to ignore. These days, Shoota Boyz are preferable to Slugga Boyz, but in the final analysis, you can't go far wrong with either variety.

Gretchin- GOD they're horrible. They're also absurdly cheap. They make a fine expendable screen as of 5th Edition, and the fact that you can bring PILES of the sniveling little cretins has a certain charm.

However, beware of relying upon them do much more than soak up bullets, because their Leadership is a bad joke, even with the Runtherds along.

Coming up- Fast Attack.


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## Cole Deschain (Jun 14, 2008)

*Fast Atack*

Now, THIS section is a mite more contentious for me. For the most part, Orks have excellent options, but in fast attack, they have two that I don't care for one bit.


For example, Stormboyz. For twice the cost of a regular Boy, you get a... Regular Boy. With a jump pack... and a chance of dying outright each turn. If you want to ignore terrain, Orks have better options. If you want to move fast, they have better options. About all I can say for them is that they're among the cheaper possible fast attack options, and the one that lets you bring the most bodies.

Next, we have Warbuggies. Ugh. At least they're cheap. Yes, they have the potential to race forward, spraying fire... but I've found that a Trukk Mob can do the same thing, AND count as a scoring unit. Oh yes, they also don't get killed as easily. I suppose they'd do if you want to fill in leftover points, but really.... I fail to see the appeal.


Moving on, we come to a personal favorite... Bikers. 5th not only revived the Biker Screen, it made it better. Their twinlinked guns, increased toughness and good saves make these guys a mainstay in my army. They're expensive, but almost always worth it. The amount of fire they can absorb before they're wiped out in incredible, and often buys time for the rest of the army.

And last but not least, Deffkoptas.

Gotta admit, I was lukewarm on them. Their squad cap insures that putting your faith in full squadrons of them is likely to be severely punished because they WILL run away. However, if you keep your squadrons small OR if you max them out, they can pull their weight. Just don't indulge in half-measures.

Their ability to pack twinlinked Rokkits is a major plus, and the Bigbomm upgrade lets them strike a blow even if they turbo-boosted. They're also incredibly mobile. I gotta say, I'm a fan.

We'll conclude with Heavy Support.


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## Cole Deschain (Jun 14, 2008)

*Heavies*

Another decidedly mixed bag... Ork Heavy Supports are partly a matter of taste, and apparently partly the result of some units that didn't find a home anywhere else.

Battlewagons- Okay, okay, I get it, they can carry GREAT BIG MOBS. They also fall apart in assaults because of piss-poor rear armor, and the new rules mean that the rolling Big Shoota Pillbox is no longer viable. In fact, MANY of their upgrades will require that they either sit in one place, or never fire all those juicy guns. The Deff Rolla is all well and good, except that even a Guardsman with a Krak Grenade has a chance of stopping the thing via Death or Glory. They're too expensive to be so fragile. Their front armor, at least, is solid.

Deff Dreads- Ohhhh, I LIKE these guys. Furioso, eat your heart out. Really, I haven't got gripes with 'em. Love 'em to death.

Killa Kans- ALSO like these guys. Yes, they're thin-skinned. Yes, their WS is Grot-based. They can hit with their guns, and still manage with average rolls in CC. Field them in squads and watch the fun. They are, after all, still mini-dreadnoughts.

Flash Gitz- *sigh* I have no idea why they ended up in Heavy Support when Lootas and Tankbustas are both Elite. They're just Nobz with very nice guns. They're worth taking if Nobz are your thing, although their inability to take Power Klaws could lead to some amusing situations in Assaults.

Bug Gunz- Not... BAD... as such. A cheap way to add some moderately ranged firepower to your army. Just don't loose your cool when the fighting moves beyond their effective range. Time was, Zzap Gunz were good because they always hit. Now they're rather erratic, and really best used against MEQs, rather than vehicles. Lobbas, like IG mortars, are something you have to commit to, leaving Kannons as the clear front-runners.


Looted Wagons- As transports? Ugh. A glitchy Rhino, when all's said and done. How the mighty have fallen. I use one as a Boomgun platform, mostly because I still had my old Looted Basilisk. Honestly, they're not really worth investing a lot of effort in these days. If you're gonna Ork out a vehicle, just make it a Trukk. That said, mine has killed at least two Chaplains in its career, and it's VERY cheap.

But you get what you pay for.

This concludes my long and at times senseless rant. God, the things being sick at home all day does to your mind.


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## Concrete Hero (Jun 9, 2008)

Very nice. An interesting read


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## Mr Day (Jan 23, 2008)

Informative and well written.


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## morfangdakka (Dec 31, 2006)

I do agree with your assement on most of the units. However, a lot of what gets fielded and used is dependent on the players style and what works for them.

I just can't seem to get my weirdboy to do anything useful or be in range when needed. The weirdboy has killed more orks with Eadbang than he has killed enemy models. So he has been retired. Same with my mek and his KFF. Whatever he is supposeto be protecting gets blown up so he has been benched. 

It is a shame that burna boyz are in the elites section as they are one of my favorite units. Lootas and tankbustas are two solid and good choices that usuallly get top billing. I have found an interesting use for burna boyz though as a rear guard unit. I usually will place them back with the lootas and mek with SAG to protect those units from deepstriking terminators or infiltrators. Kommando's without Snikrot just aren't really useful they can take two rokkits to try and take pot shots at enemy armor but they are on their own unit the rest of the army comes racing up. 

Deffdreads are another item I just can't seem to get to work for me and instead take killa kans that just rock in my army. 

Big guns I have a new love affair with kannons and lobbas and zzap guns are a close second. Big guns really shine in low point games as a cheap heavy unit. However, most people seem to just place them in a spot like stationary fixtures and forget that they can move. If mine have nothing to shot at move them to a better spot, they can't shot when they move but if they have nothing nothing in range to shot at they aren't going to shot anyway. While they can't waagh since they are crewed by gretchin they can run to get into a better firing position. This way they increase their effective range and can follow the battle and they can still contribute to the fight.

The rest of your assesment I agree with you if I didn't mention it but this should help the new warboss looking to put together an army. Although this should probably go into the tactics section instead of general.


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## Galahad (Dec 21, 2006)

Excellent writeup, though I'm sad to see you didn't review any of the Ork Special Characters. They can really change up the way an army works.

Also worth noting: Death or Glory attacks are *always* resolved against *front* armor, even if it's an assault hit. Which means unless the guardsman is packing Meltabombs or a meltagun, he becomes a pancake.

Also, I find the Rolla is very effective in a ramming situation...that S8-ish ramming attack might not do much to a land raider, but the extra d6 S10 hits will certainly make a dent. Plus most vehicles can't assault you back if you fail to kill it.

And though it's a sort of an all eggs in one basket sort of scenario, slapping your bustas in a wagon is some great mobile firepower in the era of stationary tanks.

Though I think I should move this to Tactics since it's very much about which units are best and how to use them effectively.


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## beenburned (May 15, 2008)

Yeah agree with Gal here, would be nice to see a special character appraisal, but that was really interesting and will help me in my bid to start an ork army (at some boint).

Bookmarked...


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## Cole Deschain (Jun 14, 2008)

All right, since people seem to be demanding the bloody special characters- plus, a note on an option I didn't even MENTION earlier.

We'll begin with the Characters

First off, the only one I think is worth a damn, the Beast of Armageddon, Ghazghkull Thraka

Yes, he's about as pricey as a Land Raider.
Yes, his statline isn't THAT much better than a regular Warboss (superior WS, an extra wound, an extra attack).

Yes, for all of his vaunted prowess, he himself is basically a slightly upgraded Cybork Warboss in mega-Armor with a better gun and a couple of bells and whistles.

But his Waaagh! Oh, saints preserve us, his Waaagh!

Ghazghkull epitomizes what I demand out of an HQ choice above a certain points value... he can buff the ENTIRE ARMY, albeit only for a turn. But oh, what a turn. Ideal for Turn 2 when your foot mobs aren't there yet but are getting shot to pieces. Alas, it's not a "bonus" Waaagh!, but that's what you bring a Weirdboy along for. All told, he's pricey, but coudl be worth it in a "vanilla" Ork list.


Next on the agenda is Kaptin Badrukk. A Flash Gitz upgrade option, he's really not that much better than his men- and a LOT more expensive.

His gun is a nice one, but also has a potential to overheat. His armor is good, but he's not going to get to use his save until his squad has been decimated, at which point... yeah, he's going to be a mite lonely. His Leadership is a nice boost, but hardly justifies his high cost. Add this to my annoyance with Flash Gitz in general, and you've got someone I simply cannot recommend at all. Bring him if you're in love with the fluff or have the perfect model, but... eesh. An expensive addition to an expensive unit. Use with caution.


Moving to slightly happier pastures, we have Mad Doc Grotsnik. Now, he's an HQ choice, and his stats are somewhere between a Warboss and a Big Mek. As an extremely advanced Painboy, he offers similar durability benefits, and allows the entire army to improve its saves... at a steep cost. He's also a frenzied madman, as is any unit he joins. Now, most of his "drawbacks" are something most Orks are trying to do anyway (get into assault), but the fact is, he ELIMINATES other options, and cannot leave a unit until he's the last Ork standing. Couple his high personal cost with the steep cost of the army-wide upgrade he offers, and you've got another character I'm more than happy to pass on. Oh well. He's better than Badrukk.


Next on the list is Wazdakka Gutsmek. Given my infatuation with all things Bike related, you'd think I'd adore this Speed Freek's Speed Freek. Nope. He's halfway between being a Boss and a Nob, and while his bike is a nasty piece of work... he starts out THREE TIMES as expensive as an un-upgraded Warboss. Sure, he lets you field Bike Mobs as troops... but given how expensive bikes are, that's really not such a hot idea. Any all-Bike Army is going to be VERY small. He's got decent guns, and can almost always fire them, even if he Turbo-boosted, but that only helps him if he's out on his own- and if he is, he's asking to get shot full of holes. I like the guy, but I'd never bring him outside of an Apocalypse game. If you mainstay with him... you're braver than I.

Next up is Old Zogwort. He's a Weirdboy with lower Strength, higher toughness, an extra wound, and slightly better base Leadership. His Strength issue is mitigated somewhat by the poisonous snakes he totes around (which also have a temper of their own), and he's in all ways a Warp'ead Weirdboy... except for his personal touch, Zogwort's Curse. Its biggest selling point is that if he chooses to use it, he doesn't need to roll randomly, and if it works, Independent Characters tend to end up... Squiggy. All of that said, he costs nearly DOUBLE what a "regular" Warp'ead does... and he's by no means twice as effective. Bring him if you must, but he's really only worth it if you KNOW you're fighting an army that relies heavily upon its Characters.

Then we've got a guy who's rather highly thought-of hereabouts... Boss Snikrot. An upgrade character for Kommandos, he provides a couple of nice buffs to a squad... namely, a bonus in combat resolution, a pair of what are effectively Mastercrafted CCWs, and the ability to come in like Wolf Scouts, which can be a handful. His statline is also excellent, better than a Nob, although not on par with a Warboss.. All of that said, he costs as much as a Warp'Ead or slightly-upgraded Warboss, and adds no bonus vs. armor, either vehicular or personal, without even the OPTION of taking a Power Klaw. However, if you love Kommandos, or you're just tired or rear-echelon gunlines chewing you apart, he might be worth a look. Just be aware of how much he costs.


Wrapping things up, we have one last Upgrade character... the Stormboyz leader, Boss Zagstruk. He's an improved Stormboyz Nob in most respects, with a couple of bells and whistles. He allows his Mob to act a bit like Vanguard Veterans on Deep Strike (although this causes automatic casualties PRIOR to combat), and can also act like a COmissar to make the Boyz stick. Oh, he has a "Power Klaw" that's not bad...

Except that Stormboyz are ALREADY a bit of a drag. Taking Zagstruk ups their body count while doing NOTHING to negate the OTHER way they can just randomly die. And Stormboyz are too expensive to throw away like that. Avoid unless you're a die-hard fan. If you've got a model... just make it a Nob. Seriously. He costs as much as Snikrot, and is so much worse it hurts to think about.



As a final note, I neglected something in the basic Boyz writeup... namely, the option to turn one Mob into 'Ardboyz. Honestly, forgot all about it... because in my experience, it's not worth it. Your Boyz get Fire Warrior armor saves, sure. They also cost nearly DOUBLE what they did. If you're fielding a large foot mob, this isn;t much of a boost, since the raw number of Armor Saves you'll have to roll will almost certainly nullify much of the advantage. Oh well, at least you'll GET Armor Saves. Not an option I endorse, but if you REALLY want to, it's not a HORRIBLE idea.


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## DaemonsR'us (Jan 25, 2007)

As a note for Ghazghkull hes a 4 wound beast thats immune to instant death and thats huge with the protection that it gives in 5th, as well his waaaaagh, it lasts EVERY turn after he calls it, oh and turns his mega-armor save into an invul so yeah...what you get for his points, i think thats pretty worth it, dont forget he gets +2 to his attacks on the charge instead of just 1, thats SEVEN S10 power claw attacks on the charge


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## Galahad (Dec 21, 2006)

One complaint about Gaz (besides cost) is the pointless Slow and Purposeful, which only serves to make him utterly unreliable when charging into assault.

Nothing like falling 1" short of the enemy and getting slaughtered on their turn ebcause you rolled poorly on your S&P assault move.

Oh, and Daemons R Us, you misread Gaz' waagh. It lasts the turn he called it and all of the opponent's following turn, but after that it's gone.


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## Cole Deschain (Jun 14, 2008)

Yes, well, my low opinion of special characters should be pretty evident.

The most I'll say for SOME of them is that they aren't a COMPLETE waste of time.


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## comrade (Jun 30, 2008)

I found this quite interesting, looking into getting into Orks actually,... but a Shooty Ork mob.... yes.. shooty, like IG.. but more Green


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## The Riddler (Jan 2, 2008)

Some good stuff in this thread. 

My notes:

Always take a Bosspole when fielding mobz. Ork Leadership sucks.

It's vital for the Weirdboy to have the Warphead upgrade, as the op pointed out, he still comes in cheap as chips. I attach mione to a squad of 20+ Shoota Boyz and he has accounted for more tanks than the powerklaws in my army. 
Deepstrike a mob of 20+ boyz 10 inches away from your opponent and watch the sparks fly....a great HQ choice.

I'm experimenting with the Bog Mek with KFF the last few games....he's going alright but to make it worthwhile ihave at least 2 squads and a dread getting the benefit of the save....SAG has been appalling for me...my Big Mek equipped with that white elephant has killed more of my orks than the enemy, deepstriked into hand to hand twice and blown himself up at least once.....rubbish. The only time he rolled the elusive double 6, it scattered off the table.

Currently fielding a Nob squad (W/ Painboy and Cybork bodies) and although expensive, are an absolute monster unit. Single handedly won a 1500 pt game for me yesterday against the Death Korps of Krieg....ploughted through the ranks for the loss of one Nob and held an objective to win the game.'
(Don't consider taking them in smaller games though....too much of a sink.)

Lootas are terrible for me (but then again, i only have a small unit painted.)
they are good for their cost i suppose but that being said, i've rolled below average everytime i've fielded them....only got one Eldar tank on their belt so far...they usually die/rout on turn 1/2.

Ahhhh, the Looted Wagon with Boomgun.....it'll either be awesome or do nothing. Great against Guard or Horde armies when you don't mind a big scatter though. I use a Leman Russ and pretty much field it every game to keep opponents honest.


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## DaemonsR'us (Jan 25, 2007)

So i did, so i did :laugh:


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## Gannon (Mar 13, 2008)

Excellent write-up here. A biased opinion, but all of your arguments have sound judgement behind them. Thanks for the input!


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## Galahad (Dec 21, 2006)

My take is much the same as Cole's, though I do see a little value in the KFF Mek, being that now his force field works when he's mounted up, you can slap him in a wagon and give it and any transports racing alongside it a 5+ save, which is nice, if specialized.

Similarly, if you're packing a lot of Koptas, then Grotsnik isn't necessarily a bad investment. 5 points to give an invul save to your koptas isn't a bad investment of points, if you can spare it.


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## The Riddler (Jan 2, 2008)

Doesn't the cover save give vehicles the "Obscured" status? Is that not a 4+ not a 5+?


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## Galahad (Dec 21, 2006)

Obscured vehicles get a cover save equal to the cover save granted to infantry by whatever is obscuring the vehicle, OR a 4+ if no save is given (like a disruption pod, or skimmers moving fast)

The KFF says it grants a 5+ cover save, so therefore vehicles obscured by it gain a 5+ cover save


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## The Riddler (Jan 2, 2008)

Thanks for clarification mate. k:


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## The Riddler (Jan 2, 2008)

Hey Galahad, i just had another look at the rulebook.....the reason i thought it was a 4+ is below that stuff that you were talking about. (about getting the save equivalent to what it is that's obscuring the vehicle)

It says something along the lines of if the Vehicle is granted conferred "obscured" status by a piece of wargear or similar (which the KFF is), then the save is a 4+. 

Your thoughts?


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## Galahad (Dec 21, 2006)

It says on p62 that the cover save works exactly as it does for infantry models (5+ save for hedges, 4+ for woods, etc). It does say that if a special rule or bit of wargwear grants obscured then it is 4+, but it also says "Unless specified otherwise by the codex."

The codex specifies a 5+ save.


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## Timesplitter (Oct 11, 2008)

New to Orkz, but a great write up, a lot of info with reasonable arguments for each. I learned a lot about each unit as well as how to and when to use them, thanks for taking the time to write this up :victory:


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## Flakey (Sep 24, 2008)

The Riddler said:


> Doesn't the cover save give vehicles the "Obscured" status? Is that not a 4+ not a 5+?





Galahad said:


> It says on p62 that the cover save works exactly as it does for infantry models (5+ save for hedges, 4+ for woods, etc). It does say that if a special rule or bit of wargear grants obscured then it is 4+, but it also says "Unless specified otherwise by the codex."
> 
> The codex specifies a 5+ save.



Been some debate over that due to the vague wordings of GW, the trouble is while the codex specifies a +5 save for infantry, it then goes on to say it gives vehicles obscured target status, and as it writen pre 5th does not specify for the vehicles. I think the 5th edition ruling was meant to reference KFF but just muddied the waters, but in a recent White Dwarf battle report the KFF was giving the ork truks a 4+ save. So baring a eratta posting on the issue I am going to side with a 4+ save as the only offical guide we have to go on is that WD reference.


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## MaidenManiac (Oct 2, 2008)

Flakey;208280...So baring a eratta posting on the issue I am going to side with a 4+ save as the only offical guide we have to go on is that WD reference.[/QUOTE said:


> Relying to WD battlereports for rulings is like trusting a starved rat not to eat the cheese you put infront of its mouth befor walking away :laugh:
> 
> In a recent WD they managed to make a defiler have a shot from its battlecannon scatter 18 inches(3d6 - maxroll). The only weapons that can scatter 3d6 are barrageweapons during nightfights shooting on targets they rolled to low to see, aka fireing indirectly into the dark. Defilers battlecannons can not fire barrages anymore...
> 
> Id say that the vehicles only will get a 5+ obscured save. The scenario refered to in the BRB is a "general" scenario, the KFF is a "specific" one and those tend to take prejudice.


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## jax40kplyr (Sep 15, 2008)

Something else to add on about Boss Snikrot that I find makes him invaluable as a special character (if your allowed to take them) - his infiltrate ability allows you to pop in on the opponent's table edge. With the new rules randomizing the table edge (left, right, etc), Snikrot lets you choose the table edge. Combine this with their move (come in off 6"), almost guarantees that you'll be getting into combat with something. Of course, you could always get unlucky and they don't come in for several turns, but thats the price of reserves.
I used a squad of him and a 15 kommandos at a tournament - happened to play bugs. The way this guy set up with dawn of war rules, at the start of turn 2 he brought in his termaguants, warriors and other baddies in 6" from the table edge, all nice and bunched up. My turn rolled around - brought in the Kommandos right behind them - 2 skorchas took out a crap load of termis and warriors, followed up by a charge from the mob. Even though they got decimated, they disrupted the entire advance of the bugs, not including taking out a Carnifex (gotta love those 6's to wound), 2 warrior squads and lots of termiguants.


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## Hellskullz (Jul 24, 2008)

I have a question about normal boyz.
Why are shoota boyz more preferred then slugga boyz?


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## Cole Deschain (Jun 14, 2008)

Hellskullz said:


> I have a question about normal boyz.
> Why are shoota boyz more preferred then slugga boyz?


To wit-

A shoota boy, with an Assault 2 gun with a longer range, is more tactically versatile.

A Slugga Boy isn't BAD, bear in mind. As every Ork has at LEAST two attacks, adding a third (meaning _*Four*_ on the charge) is not in any way a waste of space.

But Two attacks, three on the charge, is usually plenty, really, and the OPTION of firing multiple shots helps make up for the piss-poor BS of Orks- as well as letting you get more out of them against those rare foe foes you DON'T want to tangle with in CC (almost nobody these days).


As I said before, most of my army is Slugga Boyz, and they do just fine, but a Shoota Mob or two is really quite delightful.


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## Cole Deschain (Jun 14, 2008)

*An addendum, based upon some sober analysis*

I'm going to SLIGHTLY revise my stance on Stormboyz. I still hold they they aren't worth quite what you pay... BUT, you can bring twenty of 'em.

And if you do so, if you commit and bring a maxed-out squad, they should serve nicely.


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## Ascendant (Dec 11, 2008)

Oy, I have few questions about Ork tactica, since I am getting back into the game, and have played a total of two games with them. Aside from this, I only play casually, and thus do not have a flawless grip of strategy. I figured the presumably simple questions of a wretchlike me didn't merit a whole 'nother thread, so here goes.

1. Why big shootas? doesn't this make it run or waste points? Wouldn't it be better to just run?

2. What shoota boys over slugga boys? Although shootas are more orky now, actually shooting the damn things makes it so you reach your foe slower. Just seems counterintuitive to me. 

3. Why are lootas so beloved when they're so easy to kill as well? Same goes for tankbustas. 15 points for an ork with no save seems harsh.

4. If tankbustas can see a vehicle, but are out of range, do they have to try to move towards it as fast as possible? Glory hogs seemed like a poorly worded rule. 

5. What do you suggest against a Tau firewall? Or an highly mobile eldar force (shining spears, guardian jetbikes, swooping hawks, wave serpent etc.?


Thanks much. ( Also, what does the acronym MEQ mean?)


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## Cole Deschain (Jun 14, 2008)

Ascendant said:


> 1. Why big shootas? doesn't this make it run or waste points? Wouldn't it be better to just run?


You'd be surprised at how LITTLE you run on a standard-sized table.

And the Big Shootas are so cheap, if you DO decide to run, you aren't out much... and their long range and decent firpower, coupled with a high volume of fire, makes them worthwhile.



> 2. What shoota boys over slugga boys? Although shootas are more orky now, actually shooting the damn things makes it so you reach your foe slower. Just seems counterintuitive to me.


Read my prior post on the subject, about one page back. 



> 3. Why are lootas so beloved when they're so easy to kill as well? Same goes for tankbustas. -- points for an ork with no save seems harsh.


Lootas can hang back so far that killing them is a chore. And their guns are dead killy. Stick them in a well-fortified spot of cover and they last forever.

Tankbustas pull their weight by raw firepower.



> 4. If tankbustas can see a vehicle, but are out of range, do they have to try to move towards it as fast as possible? Glory hogs seemed like a poorly worded rule.


If they can see a vehicle, they have to shoot at it. Which means that would be the only assault they could declare. So in answer to your question, no. They DO waste shots firing at it, but if they can't reach it with their rokkit launchas, they can't reach it to assault and thus stay put.



> 5. What do you suggest against a Tau firewall?


Prayer. And fast stuff. Just make sure you focus on their Fire Warriors, 'cause that's what hurts Orks the worst.



> Or an highly mobile eldar force (shining spears, guardian jetbikes, swooping hawks, wave serpent etc.?


Kick them in the junk. They're faster than you, but you have WAY more Boyz to throw at them. Just run them down with some of YOUR fast units and tarpit them for a turn or two. Even if you lose the assault, you should have enough Boyz to keep them in place while reinforcements slog up to finish them off.




> ( Also, what does the acronym MEQ mean?)


Marine Equivalent.

Mostly used to denote anybody who wears power armor.


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## Ascendant (Dec 11, 2008)

Ah, thanks for clearing all that up. And, now that I think about it, there was a game where I had a mob of boys standing around holding an objective and looking like goons. It would have been much nicer if they had shootas and could have been plugging away at guardsmen....

And the MEQ makes sense now. Thanks again.


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