# starting fantasy



## yamnosaj (Apr 3, 2010)

Hey guys, 

I have been playing 40k for a while, but have always been intrigued by fantasy. Could anyone tell me the big differences between the two in terms of playing style? 

Also, being the horrible person I am, (loving anything evil and sinister) I would like to start (if I did pick up fantasy) with either Vamp Counts or Tomb Kings, could you also give me a run down (pros cons, quick summary) of these two?


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## coke123 (Sep 4, 2010)

Go with Tomb Kings. They've got a shiny new book coming out next month, and VC are considered one of the weaker armies. Judging from the short look I had of it in my local GW, the new TK book is pretty good imo.

Differences

1) square bases means we have our units ranked up in blocks
2) much more infantry focussed
3) a more in depth combat resolution
4) Fantasy still uses VPs
5) next to no objective based missions- out of six BRB missions, only one is reliant on holding an objective
6) the movement characteristic, random charge ranges
7) a separate magic phase
8) Premeasure is legal

These are the main differences tha spring to mind. The best way to find out is to start playing!


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## Dave T Hobbit (Dec 3, 2009)

Charges occur in the movement phase.

You opponent can react to your charge by shooting or fleeing.


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## Drannith (Sep 18, 2010)

I did the switch to try fantasy a couple of months ago and to be honest I am enjoying it more than I do 40k. A few other differences that I noticed that haven't been listed yet:

1. shooting is much harder to do in fantasy, taking negatives to BS for moving, distance and cover
2. Ward saves act like invulnerables BUT can be taken after you fail an armor save (meaning you get two saves a wound!)
3. Strength negates armor values, thus that nice little 3+ can be modded down to 6+ with a strong enough hit (S6 I believe)

I have others but not enough time to type them all right now.

It's fun and a nice change from 40k.


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## Tim/Steve (Jan 25, 2009)

Fantasy requires more thought- you have to know what you are wanting to do several turns in advance, and a mistake in the movement of your army can come back to bits you 2-3 turns later.

40k you can react to changes much faster and rely on a superior army build to get you through, while fantasy is moving more and more towards powerful lists powering you through the game the tactics are still massively important, with a bad list played well normally being able to beat a powerful list played badly.


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## Angelus Censura (Oct 11, 2010)

Expect to be confused as all hell if you pick up an army book before doing any research. I started to feel like an idiot for posting all these random questions about fantasy like a fucking *n00b*  so I just went out and bout a WoC book thinking that would be much easier and answer all my questions.

Nope.

Just lead to more questions, but it was a badass read-through, not to mention the excitement of putting together a list for the very first time, as it is completely different than 40k. I'd check ebay for IOB rulebooks so you get a basic idea before you read your army book, especially if you have a month or so to kill before the Tomb Kings shit comes out.

I just started Fantasy 2 weeks ago (started building an army, haven't played yet) and so far I love it. Hell, I'm ready to sell my 40k shit and go completely Fantasy.


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## Tim/Steve (Jan 25, 2009)

There must be thousands of rules in WFB, but you only really need to know a handful to start playing.

How to move units, how to charge.
How shooting works
Generating power/dispel dice, how to cast/dispel magic.
Armour save modifiers and that armour+ward/regen can both be used against a wound.
Combat results and break tests

If you can learn the mechanics for those aspects then things like miscasts, march blocking, terrain etc etc etc can be learnt as you play because they aren't key to actually playing hte game and having fun.
TBH if you are learning you can drop magic from the game for a few games and it wont drastically effect the game.


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## Dave T Hobbit (Dec 3, 2009)

Tim/Steve said:


> There must be thousands of rules in WFB, but you only really need to know a handful to start playing.


I agree.

Fundamentally WHFB is about manoeuvring blocks of troops to gain an edge in CC; the rest of the rules make the process more interesting by adding an extra level of complexity.


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## Flindo (Oct 30, 2010)

Tomb kings arent evil tho  they are neutral


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## yamnosaj (Apr 3, 2010)

haha, they look evil and cool though. But so do the vamp counts. Thanks for the posts so far guys, really selling it to me. 

What are the big differences between vamp counts and Tomb Kings then (complete n00b so no idea about anything), play styles etc. 

Thanks again guys...


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## Akatsuki13 (May 9, 2010)

Since everyone is talking about the rules, I'll give you more in depth pros and cons of the TK and the VC.

First off, they share all the strengths and weaknesses of undead. Immune to psychology, cause fear, don't break, can't march, losses more causalities in lost combat resolutions and can be repaired via magic.

TK Pros:
-new release in less than a month so they're going to be much stronger than before
-unlike the VC, they have a Shooting Phase through skeleton archers, light cavalry, chariots, catapults and the Casket of Souls
-the Lore Attribute of the new Nehekharan Lore of Magic replenishes 3D+1 worth of wounds to undead units and 1 wound to constructs on units that have been affected by an augment spell which which they have four of out of seven spells
-they also have access to the Lores of Light and Death
-a considerably more versatile Core selection with standard warriors, archers, light/heavy cavalry and chariots
-Tomb Scorpions, Sepulchral Stalkers, Necropolis Knights, all solid ambushers that begin hidden underground leading to nasty surprises in later turns
-the Sphinxes, the new units what TK players love and others hate, for good reason too

Cons:
-can't march at all and only gain an extra move via their signature spell
-while they have strong support magic in their Lore their offensive magic is rather limited with two hexes and vortex spell
-I don't know if they will still have this rule in the new book but all Tomb Kings/Prince are flammable so watch out for fire magic
-Tomb Kings/Princes have some nice stats but their Initiative is among the worse of all the Lords and Heroes

VC Pros:
-Vampires are among the most diverse characters in the game, allowing you to have multiple vampires set to carry out wildly different roles
-undead units can march if within 6" of a vampire/12" of the general, and that includes Blood Knights, the Black Coach and the Varghulf
-while TK raise their fallen warriors, the VC are all about raising more undead, swelling their ranks well beyond what they started at, turning a weak bunch of undead into a flesh-gnawing horde
-their Core infantry isn't anything to write home about but they have some really solid Special and Rare units to choose from
-if a vampire has the Forbidden Lore power, they either take entire Vampire Lore or all the spells of one of the other eight Lore, save for Life

Cons:
-like I said above, their Core units are rather pathetic unless in mass and/or receiving magic support
-their Blood Knights are one of their best but most expensive units at 55pts a model, meaning that at the minimum of four units, you're spending 220 points
-no real Shoot Phase whatsoever
-unlike the TK who must take a TK/TP and LP/LHP as the General and the wizard keeping your army together through magic, your Vampire Lord is doing both. Lose him in combat or a dreaded Miscast, you'll suffer both from your army crumbling away and the loss of your greatest hero at the same time
-finally as others have mentioned, the VC have become weakened in their format

Both armies are great in their own ways. I recommend the Tomb Kings as I find they are more versatile and well-rounded than VC, better for beginners to get a handle on the game as a whole. And of course they're getting the new release next month.


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## Flindo (Oct 30, 2010)

yamnosaj said:


> haha, they look evil and cool though. But so do the vamp counts. Thanks for the posts so far guys, really selling it to me.
> 
> What are the big differences between vamp counts and Tomb Kings then (complete n00b so no idea about anything), play styles etc.
> 
> Thanks again guys...


tomb kings are getting a book next month so they may be ideal to start, they are sounding really competitive, and they have big monsters.


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## kain1989 (Dec 1, 2009)

I'd start with tomb kings, but I started tomb kings when their last book came out, and loved everybit of the fluff, so i'm biased. 

If you want evil, just say your particular tomb king is particularly enraged that he was brought back all decrepid and not beautiful like he envisioned. it sticks to fluff, and your own personal tastes. but that's just me.

but just a bit of warning, the new tomb king book while powerful, the tomb kings are still very much a finesse army, and you won't be steamrolling people just by charging in and takin names, you're gonna have to plan it out.


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