# Plot Holes



## Ryuzaki (Nov 1, 2009)

I was thinking, with all the books and codecies of 40k, that there must've been at least one plot hole in the fluff (e.g. codex says Mr. X was fighting on Terra during the heresy, but a black library book says he was on another world at the time, or dead). I haven't found any myself, but I'm interested to see if anyone else has.


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## shaantitus (Aug 3, 2009)

To be honest i cannot think of any off the top of my head. Only the usual one. There are squats in Inquisition War but there are no squats any more. What to do?


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## Nfreris (Oct 9, 2007)

Most of the fluff is pretty good in the whole no plot holes. If they come up they are fixed with another book or codex for a new edition. There is so much 'room' in the 40k universe that its easy too fix them.


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## cafel (Dec 21, 2008)

Yeah, the loose, uncertain timeline and vast scope of the 40K universe hard to fanthom. Things can contradict each other and it's just a question of who's right, or that possibly they're both wrong. One I can think of off the top of my head is a refrence in the 5th edtition rulebook to The Blade of Infinity which emerged from the warp in 38k after 15,000 of traveling. This puts it's departure several thousand years before the development of warp travel. Still it's a single line of throw away fluff so it's easy to see why it was overlooked.


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## Baron Spikey (Mar 26, 2008)

Human Warp Travel existed before the Imperium of Man, the Warp Storms surrounding Terra are the reason Terra was isolated- because they could no longer traverse the Immaterium in that sector without being destroyed.

A pretty big Plot Hole would be Torgaddon, Loken's friend and fellow Captain in the HH novels. In Horus Heresy: Collected Visions he falls to Chaos and is one of Horus' bodyguards, in the novels he stays Loyal...


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## deathbringer (Feb 19, 2009)

There is one that Child of the Emperor (in my opinion heresy's fluff encyclopaedia) told me about.

After Magnus broke the wards the emperor was supposed to be consigned to the golden throne until Horus arrived however in tales of heresy he is said to be found sitting reading a book. 

In general GW is pretty good at tying itself together though.


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## Carnivore (Aug 4, 2009)

deathbringer said:


> There is one that Child of the Emperor (in my opinion heresy's fluff encyclopaedia) told me about.
> 
> After Magnus broke the wards the emperor was supposed to be consigned to the golden throne until Horus arrived however in tales of heresy he is said to be found sitting reading a book.
> 
> In general GW is pretty good at tying itself together though.


1)I second that. Most impressive! :mrgreen:
2)Hell, if you were stuck on a throne waiting for Horus to arrive, wouldn't you do something to ease your wrath? :biggrin:

As for plot-holes in 40K background, I'm sure you could find some and more, but what's the beef? You can already find some in OUR Hirstory. It always depends of who's telling the story.


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## Child-of-the-Emperor (Feb 22, 2009)

deathbringer said:


> There is one that Child of the Emperor (in my opinion heresy's fluff encyclopaedia) told me about.


Thanks Man :grin:

Another one I can think of currently is to do with Constantin Valdor.

In 'Blood Games' hes present on Terra (which is set following Horus' treachery). Yet in the established fluff (and in the upcoming 'Prospero Burns'/'A Thousand Sons') He travels with Russ to Prospero prior to Horus' treachery being revealed, and Russ doesn't return to Terra until after the death of Horus and the ascension of the Emperor.

So hes in two places at once?


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## Vaz (Mar 19, 2008)

Khorne Sorcerors.

Dark Angel Deathwing wearing Green.

Dark Angel Deathwing wearing Power Armour.

Space Wolves being Retards

Metal Boxes.

Orks retreating and then just not fighting back.

Anything that spews out of the tripe infested room and mind of Lee Lightner (both of them) Ben Counter, and CS Goto.


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## tadhg546 (Nov 19, 2009)

Baron Spikey said:


> A pretty big Plot Hole would be Torgaddon, Loken's friend and fellow Captain in the HH novels. In Horus Heresy: Collected Visions he falls to Chaos and is one of Horus' bodyguards, in the novels he stays Loyal...


lol i noticed that yesterday lol


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## tadhg546 (Nov 19, 2009)

Vaz said:


> Khorne Sorcerors.
> 
> Dark Angel Deathwing wearing Green.
> 
> ...


lol amazing list and i agreee lee lightner should be burnt at the stake


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## Carnivore (Aug 4, 2009)

Vaz said:


> Khorne Sorcerors.


In 1st Ed 40K you had World Eaters librarians who didn't use their powers to show their devotion to Khorne, pal.



Vaz said:


> Dark Angel Deathwing wearing Power Armour.


I fail to see the error... Space-Marine armors ARE Power Armour...



Vaz said:


> Space Wolves being Retards
> Orks retreating and then just not fighting back.


1)When? Where?
2)Well, that's what morale is here for... And i recall many shorts and novels where Orks retreat... Let's just pick one of the last, "Salamanders"...


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## Baron Spikey (Mar 26, 2008)

The Deathwing dont wear Power Armour- they exclusively wear Tactical Dreadnought Armour.


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## BloodAngelsfan (Jan 22, 2009)

In regards to Lee Lightner x2, Ben Counter and the Great Enemy of the Eldar, the Ravager of Fluff and the destroyer of (craft)worlds C.S. Goto; I don't think Ben counter has done much wrong with the fluff. Sure the Soul Drinkers were idiots but since when was being intelligent a requirement for being a Space Marine? (sarcasm doesn't travel well through writing)


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## cafel (Dec 21, 2008)

Baron Spikey said:


> Human Warp Travel existed before the Imperium of Man, the Warp Storms surrounding Terra are the reason Terra was isolated- because they could no longer traverse the Immaterium in that sector without being destroyed.


Actually I noticed I put down the wrong year, it emerged in 33K after 20,000years of travel with a departure date in 13k which is two or three millenium before the usual quoted dates for the development of warp travel and the start of the dark age of technology.


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## dtq (Feb 19, 2009)

Baron Spikey said:


> The Deathwing dont wear Power Armour- they exclusively wear Tactical Dreadnought Armour.



Not necesarily true... I have GW pictures in a catalogue of Deathwing in normal power armour from old catalogues etc. 1st Edition Rogue trader allowed for Deathwing in power armour as well. Although the Deathwing have the honour of wearing the terminator suits, they have in the past worn power armour as well.

The fact that apparantly in later times the chapter has decided to field deathwing only in terminator armour doesnt mean that fiction depicting deathwing in power armour is necesarily wrong, as long as the fiction is based before the chapter made their change in policy (a relatively recent policy that I would guess would be reversible at any time, how many years have passed betwen rogue trader and the 4th edition Dark Angles codex release?

I also have early GW material (About the time Deathwing terminator armour turned white from black) with Dark Angel Terminators in green armour...


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## Carnivore (Aug 4, 2009)

Baron Spikey said:


> The Deathwing dont wear Power Armour- they exclusively wear Tactical Dreadnought Armour.


Which are... Power Armors... :mrgreen:

(But thanks dtq - charming name by the way -)

I might have found one:
_ The now Red Corsairs from Huron were either the Tiger Claws or the Astral Claws.


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## the_unchanged (Nov 17, 2009)

Throne this list would be never ending. 

Dark Eldar only existing in Commoragh (The City must be the size of a system). Which I suppose has been alleviated somewhat by the creation of Shaddom, Commoragh's sister city. 

The two missing legions.

The colour of Ork blood.

The dreaded dare I say it - *Whispers*..........StarChild.

CS Goto. - A decent writer but he has no interest in fluff in the slightest only what he can make up.

The Praetorian Guard and their powers/size.

Squats and their legacy inheritors the Demiurg. 

Zoanthropes (sp)

If you read enough of the BlackLibrary novels you'll quickly discover that there is no GamesWorkshop Fluff marines who enforce the fluff, instead it pretty much is left up to the author to get it right (hence Goto). 

GW's stance on this is that there is no definitive answer everyone's perception of the fluff is right. Sucks but its true.


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## Child-of-the-Emperor (Feb 22, 2009)

the_unchanged said:


> Dark Eldar only existing in Commoragh (The Sity must be the size of a system). Which I suppose has been alleviated somewhat by the creation of Shaddom, Commoragh's sister city.


Its been established for a while that the Dark Eldar inhabited more than one city (before the revelation of Shaddom). The Eldar codex states that the furthest depths of the Webway is infested with Dark Eldar cities and Nests of Warp creatures.


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## the_unchanged (Nov 17, 2009)

nice point C.O.T.E I can see why your considered the voice of Fluff around here. 

haha I've just realised I've spelled City - Sity in that point, I really should try not to be reading a short story and posting at the same time.


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## dtq (Feb 19, 2009)

Carnivore said:


> (But thanks dtq - charming name by the way -)


Eh? 

Not sure what you're reading into the name to call it charming. Boring perhaps would be better :laugh: but where it comes from is explained here :- http://www.heresy-online.net/forums/showthread.php?p=366584#post366584


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## shaantitus (Aug 3, 2009)

Good point about torgaddon. Reading the visions of heresy he is depicted as a full on chaos marine.


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