# A question of Sportsmanship?



## squeek (Jun 8, 2008)

Hi all,

There is a guy at our local who consistently forgets about the magic phase (don't ask me why ), he is methodical as you like about almost all details, but for some reason has a total mental block when it comes to remembering to cast some spells. More often than not someone will shout "Jake, magic phase!" with added expletives as the game goes on, or his opponent will cough pointedly and hint that he has forgotten something _pretty damn _important!

So the question is, do you feel that it is sporting and other people's duty to remind him of his magic phase in friendly play, or should everyone let him get on with it considering how many chances he is given to remember for himself for once!

I guess this also applies to other less important things like forgetting the odd rule here and there, though of course forgetting an entire phase is obviously more serious as far as the game goes generally. I am of two minds personally, as people are quick to point out when their opponents 'forget' a rule that works against themselves, so should they be as quick to point out favourable rules too? Is it really a win if your opponent has forgotten most of his magic phase?


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## Tha Tall One (Aug 16, 2008)

Hmmm, I once was a bastard who kept silently waiting till my opponent forgot his magic phase. (Because my first opponent was the same...) But now I change, and think you should keep reminding him. I now think a battle should indeed be played without forgetting any rules, thus reminding eachother of every rule they forget.


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## kungfoomasta (May 8, 2008)

depends, if its a friendly game tell him; but if its a competition or tournement then let the mistake go through.


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## Ascendant Valor (Jan 3, 2009)

It seems half-past ridiculous not to tell someone in a friendly game of the things they may have forgotten. I could never hope to count the number of times I've been reminded, or have reminded someone else, of some important rule (stupidity, regeneration, frenzy, etc), and earlier in [my] Fantasy career, even the order of the phases. After all, both (or all) players are only trying to have a fun time. Being a rule Nazi is probably not worthwhile.

For competitive play, things change. People should be held accountable for their choices if they feel they are prepared for competitive play (namely tournaments, GTs, etc). I doubt I could let someone play a game without playing an entire phase, however, so I would kindly remind them.

I guess my big thing is this: I treat people the way I would like to be treated in WFB. If I made a mistake, I'd like to know of it. If they made a mistake, I will tell them. Call it a "Code of Honor."


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## neilbatte (Jan 2, 2008)

I nearly always forget the magic phase, It's a throwback from earlier editions from when the magic phase came after the shooting phase.
I have to write it on a piece of paper if I wan't to remember it.
I never expect people to remind me and knowing that I'll forget it in advance I usually adjust my list to cover for this in advance which seems to work.
If people do remind me I appreciate it and I let them know in advance that at some stage I'll probably forget and try to do it in the wrong place but its my problem and I never get upset or act a tit if someone fails to let me do it out of sequence its just 1 of those things 
That said I've always played in an informal relaxed atmosphere so when I screw up its all part of the fun.


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## HorusReborn (Nov 19, 2008)

I think it's important to help a player along sometimes. Most people I've encountered will only remind you of a rule you forget that does infact work against you. Some would say you're doing it on purpose, but the reality is I plain forgot. Now to forget a phase, that's a little odd. I would remind anyone of whatever they've forgotten even if it would affect my game play. You could reason that a general who forgets should pay for his mistakes, but man, these are plastic men LOL I'm pretty chill in a game so a little nudge here and there is ok.. I'd be more annoyed having to remind the same person over and over again about something, especially as important as the magic phase


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## newsun (Oct 6, 2008)

I think it all depends on how receptive the guy is. Sometimes me and my opponents go on about what the best tactic is in a situation and it does not matter so much who's advantage, more figuring out where the best application of force would be.


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## JokerGod (Jan 21, 2009)

You should remind him. I played 40K for a year before Fantasy, and a few others locally are new to fantasy as well so we often forget that just because we move charges, doesn't mean we attack right away...

Its always funny when some one forgets "Wow, so your charging, and ignoring the rest of my army. thats nice of you "


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## Amra_the_lion (May 26, 2008)

I'd remind him even if it was a tournament. I want a complete game, and when I win its a complete win with no blemishes


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## zabo (Dec 19, 2008)

well, I might sound rude, but the first 4 or 5 times I would remind him, but after that it gets ridonculous, after playing 5 games with you after that he should be accountable, and should take into initiative his own actions.


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## Darktheos (May 9, 2008)

Since it is friendly Play yeah give him the reminder. I have had times in friendly play where I had the other player remind me of missing something, then later go "oh #@#$% I forgot my magic oh well" and its like you were cool to me go ahead. I have lose games because of it. In a tourney, it really just depends on the other player there are some local I will and some local I won't because they are douches I want to choke over the table.


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## MaidenManiac (Oct 2, 2008)

zabo said:


> well, I might sound rude, but the first 4 or 5 times I would remind him, but after that it gets ridonculous, after playing 5 games with you after that he should be accountable, and should take into initiative his own actions.


There is a hidden point here...:read:
If one constantly reminds/helps the opponent out he will most likely not start to learn/remember things ever. This is a bit counter-productive, what happens when that dude/girl goes of to a tourney of his/her own? He/She will most likely not recieve the same treatment there...

I totally agree with Zabo:scare:
There are two ways of learning, by doing the misstakes yourself _or_ watching other players do them, almost all players prefer the first way for some unknown reason:dunno:
I do help new players out yea the first bunch of games, but there is an end to it somewhere. Fucking up a fun game now and then thanks to forgetting things is something all players will do sooner or later, and almost all will learn something from it too:fool:


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## neilbatte (Jan 2, 2008)

Every one seems to be aiming this just at the newer players, They're lucky all they have to do is learn 1 rule set its the old people like me who have to forget some rules learn new ones and try and remember which rules set is current that I've found are the worst at remembering the finer points. I still remember the overly complex rogue trader rules, then had to learn the simpler second edition before it all got mixed up and the magic phase moved this is what confuses me its not so much that I can't remember the magic phase more that I can't remember that it comes after movement and not the combat phase as before. 
That being said I am aware of the problem and make sure that if I do forget the magic phase my army list is built to minimise its effect.
unless your playing undead or a magic heavy build(a bit stupid if you know you'll forget)then it doesn't really matter spell caddies rarely get a spell off dwarves don't need to worry and warrior priests can fight and give other benefits without their spells.


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## Stella Cadente (Dec 25, 2006)

I'd remind them a few times, but after that its just getting silly and I'd stop, I'm not there to babysit


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## Vaz (Mar 19, 2008)

If they're knew, let them know there's a rule, then just get less and less with the instruction. Afterwards, let them know if they forgot a rule.


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## Dafistofmork (Jan 9, 2009)

this actualy happened over the weekend-in a friendly(since that is all i play) i was vs newts, and he had just charged my cannon with 4 jungle swarm bases. he forgot the combat, i remainded him, i lost the game.(although haveing a steggy rollup your flank through two units in one combat phase didn't help)


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## Franko1111 (Jun 25, 2008)

I would never let my opponent forget but I just belive in being and good sport and at my game club there isn't anyone who would make you skip it


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## Bolshavic (Dec 8, 2008)

I think the answer is a simple question, 1 that only you can answer and regardless of the game being friendly or competitive.
The question is would you like to win only because u know some1 you where playing against forgot a rule. IMO no I like to know I won because I was the luckiest, best general on the day ect ect, I would remind them and if the phase passed and both forgot allow them to freeze the current phase to do it/ rewind to do the phase over again/ or replace the phase till later on as long as it was no major advantage/disadvantage to any player.
On a friendly side my regular opponent Haekmo and myself are normally to pissed( drunk, to non-Aussies) when we play we would forget half the game if it was not for a more lax approach.
On a competitive stance ffs it still is only a game that we are spose to be playing for fun, a hobby away from more stressful things in life.
A game is more enjoyable on both friendly and comp lvl when both ppl have fun, and are not niggling over every interpretation of the rules


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## Lord Sinkoran (Dec 23, 2006)

I would remind them in a friendly game but not in a tournement.


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## Vorag of Strigos (Feb 25, 2009)

well, on the gaming table Im very sadistic like, despite the fact I'm fighting plastic and metal models, and take any and every advantage I can get, if a dice rolls off the table during a cast, and the one on the table is a 6, I make them do it again regardless, I also have to be careful I don't do the same thing, If someone forgets about the magic phase I'd probably stay silent, after all, I don't get a shooting phase do I? Nothing in my army can shoot! if they forget to cast spells then its pretty damn even for me. If you want the nice feeling that comes with helping someone out, such as reminding them of their magic phase, then do so, you feel a bit better when you win, but if not, prepare to feel a little guilty afterwards, not me though, oddly enough I don't feel anything when I win, just that the game is over and I need to find someone else to beat, usually someone stronger, Like a Chaos Daemon player


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## Red Orc (Jun 14, 2007)

I think the idea that a game is so important that you'd allow another player to accidently disadvantage himself and not point it out is... bizarre. Who needs to win that badly? 

It's already been said, quite rightly, that you'd be all over them if they 'forgot' a rule that disadvantages _them_, so why not do the same if they forget a rule that disadvantages _you_? That's hardly a level playing field is it? You're deliberately deciding which rules should and shouldn't be played, by chosing not to insist that his magic phase be played. The rules aren't 'optional' - not without a discussion first. He's not excercising a choice to skip the magic phase, because that isn't legal, any more than chosing not to remove casulaties is legal.

Seriously; it's toy soldiers we're talking about. I think anyone who takes it seriously to the point of, let's face it, cheating, by not playing to the rules, needs professional help to sort out their self-esteem issues. 

:really not seeing it cyclops:


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## Stuntiesrule (Mar 22, 2009)

I have been playing for some time now but play so many miniature games that simple rules like the order of phases confuse me. Also since I played dwarfs first the magic phase never happened on my turn. However if faced with a gamer such as the ones forgetting the magic phase I would most likely point it out for a turn or two and after that it is up to them to remember I will remind them since I know with multiple games it can sometimes become hard to remember everything necessary to play.


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## Captain Galus (Jan 2, 2008)

If someone forgot something as important as an entire phase, I always remind them. If i forget it myself an someone reminds me, I just continue the game; I was stupid enough to forgot the magic phase or w/e and hopefully the pain of losing will make sure I never forgot again.


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