# Belial vs Sammael



## CallumM27 (Mar 20, 2008)

Whos do you think is the better HQ choice? I think they are both great for what they do, Sammael for his amazing jetbike Plasma Cannon combo plus Land speeder option. But I think Belial is a great option to just for how cheap he is and weapon choices :shok:


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## Vanchet (Feb 28, 2008)

It's really hard because Sammy is harder but hs troop trick alrite and Belial is weaker but has a fab troop trick
Why not both? 8D


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## Syko515 (Jan 22, 2008)

I face a dark angels army that focus's om Sammy. often enough everything in this army is a push over EXCEPT for sam. Belial, however imho is more durable, if waeker statwise, and proved the army with an impressive boost in troops. i would go straight death wing .


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## CallumM27 (Mar 20, 2008)

I plan to use both, I already have Sammael and want to make a Belial with Lightning Claws for my army, I was just wondering what everyone else thought about them as HQs and also does anyone have experience using them/tactics because I'm new to DA and haven't managed to find time for a game to play test them myself


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## Vanchet (Feb 28, 2008)

Make Belail his command posse :biggrin: it is truly effective (medic ansd banner really do help) for your terminators I reccomend that though you can mix weapons only mix them for the special weapons, everyone else has the same stuff (so 4 claws an a assault cannon for example) the bikes (though I haven't used any)Pick plasma guns, your attack bike and sgt should be armed with melta gear.


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## Lord Sinkoran (Dec 23, 2006)

i would go for belial becuase a all terminator army is more durable than a all bike army.


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## Syko515 (Jan 22, 2008)

having had them used agenst me i can tell you their quite effective. with the bikes all abble to turbo boost off a scout movement before the game and then terminators being able to control their deepstrike on the 1st turn instead of waiting until turn 2 is huge. to have several squads of bikes and terminators in your lines before the 1st shooting/assault phase is supremely outragously powerful and highly recommended.


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## CallumM27 (Mar 20, 2008)

Syko515 said:


> having had them used agenst me i can tell you their quite effective. with the bikes all abble to turbo boost off a scout movement before the game


How does this work? Can I turbo boost 24" in the scout move and then still move and assault normally at the start of the turn and have the 3+ invun save?


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## cco12 (Jun 30, 2008)

I do not think that you would get the 3up save but hey look at it, a bike squad moving 24" before the game even begins, free objective baby. You should really look over the DA fluff and attack the way that the fluff has them. First send your bikes turboboosting into their lines, then on turn 1, Terminators deepstrike on without scatter. Combined with a heavy flamer this can be devastating. I would reccomend divising term squads like this

Assault termie squad
Heavy flamer
3 Lightning Claws
1 Thunder Hammer

Shooty Terms
Assault Cannon
Stormbolters/powerfists


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## TheUnmarked (May 19, 2008)

Although never discount the effectiveness of Ravenwing bike squads, or a pure ravenwing force, Especially as they will tear Tau, and Imp guard to shreds very quickly.
I should know I have never lost yet with a bike heavy army (and it has been 10 games where I have used mostly bikes so its not just luck)


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## spike12225 (Aug 21, 2008)

i like the bike termie combo thats nasty beacon on bikes perfect deepstrike all in first turn


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## CallumM27 (Mar 20, 2008)

I think I would deepstrike them in 1500 point games but in 2000 with the extra point I'd consider stick them in a land raider crusader. I just don't like the idea of dropping them right in front of the enemy line to be shot at though tactically putting them behind the bikes for the first turn to get a 4+ cover save would be quite cool and then next turn assault.


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## CallumM27 (Mar 20, 2008)

I've just read the codex and it says that you can not make a turbo boost in the scout move.


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## gabool (Apr 3, 2008)

yea the turbo boost after a scout move in your first turn puts u 30" closer to the enemy with a 3+ cover save against shooting the following enemy shooting phase. so come turn 2 you are in a good position to attack. the 3+ cover save instead of the 4+ is the new edition changed it to a 3+ cover save.


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