# How do you deal with Knight Titans?



## chaos vince (Jun 10, 2008)

since knight titans came out it seems like every imperial player wants to field one. how do you guys deal with them? what about the new spam? grav stars, serpents, riptides, and wraith knights? what are your answers to these Mcnasties?


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## Uveron (Jun 11, 2011)

chaos vince said:


> since knight titans came out it seems like every imperial player wants to field one. how do you guys deal with them? what about the new spam? grav stars, serpents, riptides, and wraith knights? what are your answers to these Mcnasties?


Lascannons and Meltas from all sides.


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## chaos vince (Jun 10, 2008)

melta's from all sides. old school termicide squads?


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## Uveron (Jun 11, 2011)

chaos vince said:


> melta's from all sides. old school termicide squads?


I will expect some more of the 'Pros' will speak up.. but Termicide could work. The fact is that a single Kinght can only use his ion shild on one side, so the art will be threaten him with enoth firepower from a number of directions that no matter how he places the shild you can hit it on an unprotected side. 

Now personally I have always brought the firepower on Helbrutes, Preds and Meltas from Rhinos... which is a very movable force.. overwhelm and envelop have always been my mantra with 40K, and its something I have found Chaos does very well, and it works on kinghts just like 90% of the Armour on the table.

EDIT: OH and using Crimson Slaughter to get divination is also a great help! Missfortune is very fun to use on AV12 as you can glance it to death with cultists!


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## chaos vince (Jun 10, 2008)

makes sense. I've been using either vindicators with termicide squads for the cheap high strength hits or havoc and chosen suicide squads loaded down with melta and crimson slaughter for the prescience goodness.


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## Uveron (Jun 11, 2011)

chaos vince said:


> makes sense. I've been using either vindicators with termicide squads for the cheap high strength hits or havoc and chosen suicide squads loaded down with melta and crimson slaughter for the prescience goodness.


My plan as I move into the future will be a cheep allies detachment from IA:13, because a group of 6 lascannons, will look quite scary


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## Vaz (Mar 19, 2008)

An Ion Shield halves incoming damage. Knights die to HP damage, so causing HP damage is the deal. Haywire - Crons with Storm Staffs deal 20 12" Haywire shots. Ace.

Melta with Armourbane needs a 4+ to penetrate side AV, which is 92% chance of occuring - if it hits - with the shield, that's 46% chance - and requiring 3 Melta to effectively remove 1HP. Normally, that would mean about 18 Meltahits to kill, and with 66% accuracy, that's 27 shots.

However, Ion Shield only effects one side. Sandwiching with melta squads gives you better chance of damage on one side - so there's a 150% multiplier on damage - rather than needing 18 meltahits, you'll need 12; or 18 shots. 2 Suicide 5 Man Terminator Squads is what 350pts with Combimelta, and 10 one shot meltas - for 7 hits, and 1 HP (50% save chance) + 1-2 hull points of damage for 3 HP damage. It's not brilliant, but the next turn, if you aren't shot to death (i.e have something else to distract), popping a couple of chainfists for an assault will strip a further number of HPs.


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## chaos vince (Jun 10, 2008)

Lash princes with biomanCy havehave been doing work for me as well. Usually at least one gets iron arm for the 2 d 6 s9 shots


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## Nordicus (May 3, 2013)

(CSM) Helbrute Mayhem Pack (Dataslate formation), with 3 multimeltas. Kills a knight outright in almost every game I've used it either in the turn they come in or the turn after. Alternatively throw some Maulerfiends at it with lasher tendrils to reduce it's attacks. 1 can be lucky and get it down. 2 of them will definitely take it down.

(Daemons) What Chaos Vince said.


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## Squire (Jan 15, 2013)

This is the core of the list I've been working on. Super expensive but the terminators were designed with knights in mind and with four attacks each on the charge even a knight can be hacked down with average dice rolling. The lord would stay in the land raider if the first unit is charging a knight, one unit of terminators should be enough


HQ *Lord* with MoK, TDA, Axe of Blind Fury, veterans 155

E *4 Terminators* with MoK, chainfist (champion), chainfist, 2 fists, 2 combi meltas 189 

*Land Raider * 230 _(574)_


E *5** Terminators* with MoK, chainfist (champion), chainfist, 2 fists, h. flamer 223

*Land Raider * 230 _(453)_


There'll also be two melta bike units and a multimelta/fist dread (mostly for the beautiful FW model) to help take off a hull points or two before the termi charge

The new wraithknights are a bigger problem now. A similar strategy with some high strength low AP shooting to take wounds off before one of the termi squads charges will be enough to kill a wraithknight even with FNP, but realistically optimised eldar, all knight lists and some of the new SM builds are too powerful for me to compete with and I'll just have to accept that. In a casual setting I'll let any list annihilate me once but the next game they can nerf their own army to make a fairer game or it's not happening. I'd do the same against a fluffy opponent because one sided mismatches aren't what I play the game for


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## Serpion5 (Mar 19, 2010)

Why not take a McNasty of your own? Field a Chaos Knight. Allies rules shouldn't bother you too much, you won't want it standing too near your squads in case it goes boom.


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## Squire (Jan 15, 2013)

A chaos knight model is coming out some time soon too. Tempting.


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## Xabre (Dec 20, 2006)

Am I the only one who wants Chaos Knight rules without something covered in gibbering maws? 

Haywire tends to be the very easiest way to deal with Knights. I've heard horror stories of the Y'Riptide that FW produced with that scary haywire flamer. It makes me cry.


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## Vaz (Mar 19, 2008)

Just use the imperial knight models then.


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## Old Man78 (Nov 3, 2011)

Xabre said:


> Am I the only one who wants Chaos Knight rules without something covered in gibbering maws?


Just add spikey bits!


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## Mossy Toes (Jun 8, 2009)

Xabre said:


> I've heard horror stories of the Y'Riptide that FW produced with that scary haywire flamer. It makes me cry.


No no, it's a Heavy 2 AP2 flamer with 6" torrent.

It's the OTHER gun that is 3(+D3 if Nova Charging) S8 shots that _also_ inflict Haywire rolls.


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## chaos vince (Jun 10, 2008)

Arc rifles have it covered if you want to Play skitarii


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## R_Squared (Mar 24, 2013)

3 Gunwagons filled with Tankbustas should do the trick.


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## MidnightSun (Feb 10, 2009)

chaos vince said:


> knight titans what about the new spam? grav stars, serpents, riptides, and wraith knights? what are your answers to these Mcnasties?


Knights are easy - AV13/12 vehicles are something you gotta deal with if you want to be any good at the game, and a Knight is simply an AV13 vehicle with more hull points. If you can kill a Necron vehicle, you can kill a Knight (and if you can't kill a Necron vehicle, you might want to reconsider your list).

Grav Stars, can't say I've faced one. Something with a high strength low AP weapon that can scoot around Draigo to kill all the Centurions, or a Culexus Assassin to stop them getting powers off.

Wave Serpents aren't a thing anymore.

Riptides come in two flavours, with Drones or without. With Drones, you just kill the Drones and let it run off the table. Without Drones, or if it doesn't run away, you kill it with Plasma Guns, Grav Guns, Power Fists/Thunder Hammers, Psychic Shriek or whatever else you generally use to kill 2+ save dudes. Note the Riptide isn't Fearless, so you can totally run it down in combat. Terrify also works wonders.

Wraithknights, Grav Cannons with Grav Amps seems the reliable way to do it for me. Other armies have their own good counters (Voidreaper relic, Warscythe Lychguard and Furious Charge Flayed Ones if you're feeling sassy for Necrons, Warp Spiders or Wraith-guys for Eldar, basically the whole Harlequin army, Thunderwolf Cav for Space Wolves, Monster Hunter HYMP for Tau etc. etc.)


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## R_Squared (Mar 24, 2013)

I came across an unexpected counter to Knights today. Playing a pick up game in my local GW store against a regular AM player with a Stormshadow Super Heavy Tank and a Knight, I managed to scrape up an unoptimised 1850 of Orks to face up to the tank heavy beast opposite.
Luckily I had enough Tankbustas with me to hopefully give my opponent pause for thought, however, it wasn't them that did the most damage.
It was my Lootas.
Whilst the TB's dealt with the horde of Leman Rus' and the SH tank, My Lootas spent every moment blasting chunks off the knight. Chucking out enough Str 7 hits over 2 rounds of firing to knock all but one hull point off the bugger before he got finished off in an astonishingly lucky round of melee by my Morkanaught.
So, Lootas, basically worth their weight in plastic gold. Able to blast troops, light vehicles, Flyers, MC's and now Super Heavies off the table. :good:


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## MidnightSun (Feb 10, 2009)

Lost my Knight in two of three games today, once on turn 1 and the other on turn 4 (it killed 10 Chaos Marines and a Chaos Terminator in those turns - I had a cunning plan that I would keep it out of range of my opponent's Havocs, at which point it stood on the sidelines in my deployment zone, with a Techmarine doing a terrible job of fixing it and plinking away with a Melta Cannon doing very little damage indeed until it got a chance to charge a squad of Chaos Marines that got too close to my deployment zone, at which point it promptly got melted by a lone Chaos Terminator with Combi-Melta). Lascannons and especially Meltaguns really do a number on them. A random 24pt dude with a Meltagun can get into a non-Ion Shield arc and is a considerable threat to it. 6 hull points isn't an awful lot for something that costs 370+pts and is only AV13/12/12, and when a random AP2 or better weapon can take 4 of them off in a turn? That's scary.


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## chaos vince (Jun 10, 2008)

Thanks guys, I appreciate the thoughts


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## Woodzee316 (Sep 11, 2010)

one of the groups I play with has all of the big guys in it. an elder player with a wraithknight, a mechanicus and a marine army with a knight. I play Fateweaver with my daemons and use the new Prismatic Gaze "D" weapon AP1 spell. The wraithknight is no drama as it is only 2+. With the imperial Knights I just wait until I know what direction is protected by the shield and fly to the opposite side and blast it with the spell from that side. that's how I've been able to deal with it just recently, well since the new wulfen supplement came out with all the new spells. When I fight against the riptides I use my screamers to lock it down and then tarpit with a unit of horrors.


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## loki619 (Mar 28, 2013)

my local store had a little torny the other week 750 pts 1 super heavy allowed (which ment nearly every person had a knight ) i guy fielding chaos whipped out a kharn and every1 laughed at him till he walked up to a knight and killed it in 1 round of combat so just get a knight in combat with somthin that I5 and watch it go boomboom


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## R_Squared (Mar 24, 2013)

I can believe the bit about Kharn killing a knight, but a tourney at 750pts that allows superheavies? Bonkers.


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## Iraqiel (May 21, 2008)

R_Squared said:


> a tourney at 750pts that allows superheavies


I kind of like that actually. It implies many short games, duelling super heavies and only a little bit of squishy side army.

Except that I don't like tournament play, that sounds alright!


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## Nordicus (May 3, 2013)

Fateweaver and his STR D spell. 3 matches with knights so far and 3 kills.

Gotta love the Chaos Parakeet.


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## Iraqiel (May 21, 2008)

Nordicus said:


> Fateweaver


Playing him unpainted?


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## Nordicus (May 3, 2013)

Iraqiel said:


> Playing him unpainted?


Aye I had to find out if I wanted to paint him or not xD


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## Iraqiel (May 21, 2008)

Nordicus said:


> Aye I had to find out if I wanted to paint him or not xD


Hahahaha
Nordicus: "Here is my army of the god of change! Tremble before its awesome painted might!... except for the leader. He's still a blank canvas. Chaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaange!"
Opponent: "... WTF do you mean strength D?"


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## DaisyDuke (Aug 18, 2011)

Nordicus said:


> Aye I had to find out if I wanted to paint him or not xD


Surely the wings are not giving you that much grief?
Though I don't own the model to offer you anything.


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## Nordicus (May 3, 2013)

DaisyDuke said:


> Surely the wings are not giving you that much grief?


This entire model has been a visionary hell to get through - I'm not good with vibrant colours on the scale of The God of Change it would seem.


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## Woodzee316 (Sep 11, 2010)

the way I went about painting Fatey was to leave him unassembled and then blend the joins later. the wings were a bitch to put on and hold till the glue was strong enough to set.


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