# Rumor: Imminent Crimson Slaughter Codex & Helbrute Release



## venomlust (Feb 9, 2010)

Salt salt blah blah blah: I really hope this is true! Not the Khorne supplement I dream of, but I'll take whatever we can get!



> This just in, as we are getting a confirmation that this coming weekend will be the release of a new Helbrute kit, as well as a new codex........ Crimson Slaughter! It looks like new models are on the way, and March is going to be full of Chaos.
> 
> 
> Please remember that these are rumors, and I am hoping to get more confirmations of this as the week starts up. Basically we are looking at these becoming available for pre-orders this coming weekend.. March 8th for pre-orders and a March 15th release date.
> ...


http://natfka.blogspot.com/2014/03/helbrute-and-codex-crimson-slaughter.html


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

Very interesting indeed. I'm eager to see what this could be all about. 

Perhaps even a Chaos Knight in with all the chaos releases.


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## venomlust (Feb 9, 2010)

I'm really hoping for some rules for Kranon the Relentless.

The CSM codex seems to peg these guys as followers of Khorne (but not explicitly), which is great, but I think it could be interesting if he didn't have a mark, and made up for it with some interesting special rules. 

More than anything else, if they do have rules for him, I hope that badass daemon sword of his is more than just a power sword.


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

It's cool to see a lesser known legion get a nod. And I'm definitely very happy with the sculpts from the DV box, if that's the new look of khorne-aligned chaos, I am totally on board for it.


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## venomlust (Feb 9, 2010)

I'm just hoping that it isn't a detachment which requires you to use the units as they are in the Dark Vengeance box, i.e. that unit of Chosen with all the close combat weapons.

*edit*

Yeah I agree with the lesser legion thing. Lots of people on Natfka are pissed because it isn't one of the traitor legions or god supplements, but I like to think it's an opportunity to give us something new and unique. I still hope they release the other supplements, though. Might as well.


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

venomlust said:


> I'm just hoping that it isn't a detachment which requires you to use the units as they are in the Dark Vengeance box, i.e. that unit of Chosen with all the close combat weapons.
> 
> *edit*
> 
> Yeah I agree with the lesser legion thing. Lots of people on Natfka are pissed because it isn't one of the traitor legions or god supplements, but I like to think it's an opportunity to give us something new and unique. I still hope they release the other supplements, though. Might as well.


Let them be pissed, if it was X, they'd whine that it wasn't Y and Z, and so on.

The Lexicanum says the Crimson Slaughter is Chaos Undivided, so maybe there's more to them than meets the eye. And as for the detachment thing, let us hope not. As the Chosen models in DV aren't that viable, and I used all mine as Champions.


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## Ravion (Nov 3, 2010)

Yeah it would be nice if the crimson slaughter got there own codex or supplement but it would be nice if the aligned legions or the chaos gods got some love too.:wink:


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

Ravion said:


> Yeah it would be nice if the crimson slaughter got there own codex or supplement but it would be nice if the aligned legions or the chaos gods got some love too.:wink:


that Veterans of the Long War supplement we heard about sounded like that, but that sorta fizzled out.


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## Sir Whittaker (Jun 25, 2009)

venomlust said:


> I'm just hoping that it isn't a detachment which requires you to use the units as they are in the Dark Vengeance box, i.e. that unit of Chosen with all the close combat weapons.
> 
> *edit*
> 
> Yeah I agree with the lesser legion thing. Lots of people on Natfka are pissed because it isn't one of the traitor legions or god supplements, but I like to think it's an opportunity to give us something new and unique. I still hope they release the other supplements, though. Might as well.


I agree with them over on Natfka. Who cares about a CSM warband that didn't exist until Dark Vengeance? All us CSM players want is some way to add a little individuality to our army, something that separates us instead of just what colour we choose to paint our minis. The VOTLW supplement rumours gave us a little hope to personalise our army with legion suiting rules, but no, we (might) get this. 

CSM players have been crying out for legion rules for 40K since they introduced them in codex 3.5. The Black Legion codex once again gave a little hope that they were planning to release a codex for each legion, but GW (maybe) waste time and resources on a Crimson Slaughter codex, when it could have been an Iron Warriors, World Eaters, Word Bearers, etc. one. 

In an ideal world I would love to have a mini-dex for each legion. Nothing fancy, just one or two rules to represent how each legion wages war, maybe a couple of unique items or wargear. Please? I just want to be able to upgrade my Night Lords so that they all have fear, even if it would be useless against every loyalist marine army. 

C’mon GW, sort this out.


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## venomlust (Feb 9, 2010)

Sir Whittaker said:


> I agree with them over on Natfka. Who cares about a CSM warband that didn't exist until Dark Vengeance? All us CSM players want is some way to add a little individuality to our army, something that separates us instead of just what colour we choose to paint our minis. The VOTLW supplement rumours gave us a little hope to personalise our army with legion suiting rules, but no, we (might) get this.
> 
> CSM players have been crying out for legion rules for 40K since they introduced them in codex 3.5. The Black Legion codex once again gave a little hope that they were planning to release a codex for each legion, but GW (maybe) waste time and resources on a Crimson Slaughter codex, when it could have been an Iron Warriors, World Eaters, Word Bearers, etc. one.
> 
> ...


Yeah, I totally get where you're coming from and mostly agree with you. But what we want and what we get are two separate things (obviously, right?). I'll be uncharacteristically optimistic and say we may be pleasantly surprised by this codex/supplement, if it even exists.


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

I would love to get the Space Marine treatment, but I feel like that ship sailed. If they released a supplement that supported all the legions, or at least a bunch of them, all the CSM players would cry out "Why do we have to buy a codex and a supplement for our legion rules when all SM players had to buy was their codex!?" so GW is damned if they do, and damned if they don't.


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## venomlust (Feb 9, 2010)

Einherjar667 said:


> I would love to get the Space Marine treatment, but I feel like that ship sailed. If they released a supplement that supported all the legions, or at least a bunch of them, all the CSM players would cry out "Why do we have to buy a codex and a supplement for our legion rules when all SM players had to buy was their codex!?" so GW is damned if they do, and damned if they don't.


Might as well be damned for doing it, at least we get something out of it!


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

venomlust said:


> Might as well be damned for doing it, at least we get something out of it!


HA! After I finished my thought, I thought to myself "I'd happily buy it" Cause I mean, it would be awesome, haha, and probably rather substantial.


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## revilo44 (Sep 17, 2010)

some prices from a reader here on Faeit 212

http://natfka.blogspot.co.uk/2014/03/this-weekend-releases-with-prices.html


> via reader here on Faeit 212
> just seen this from a mate on Facebook:
> CODEX: CRIMSON SLAUGHTER (ENGLISH) 1 £30,00
> CHAOS SPACE MARINE SQUAD 1 £23,50
> ...


im not sure about the size of stuff being made in a week and some of the stuff they making eg raptors,forgefiend, and the codex itself


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## Sir Whittaker (Jun 25, 2009)

Einherjar667 said:


> HA! After I finished my thought, I thought to myself "I'd happily buy it" Cause I mean, it would be awesome, haha, and probably rather substantial.


I would too. The special edition. With a smile on my face as I did so. Let the loyalist scum have their stuff in one place, I'll take my expanded fluff, new artwork & sexily painted models thank you very much.


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## venomlust (Feb 9, 2010)

revilo44 said:


> some prices from a reader here on Faeit 212
> 
> http://natfka.blogspot.co.uk/2014/03/this-weekend-releases-with-prices.html
> 
> ...


Hmm very interesting.


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

"White Dwarf week #7"

Aren't we only on week 5


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## Sir Whittaker (Jun 25, 2009)

I'm also curious as to whether the new CSM squad is replacing the old one. There's no mention of 'chosen' on the list, so I'm a little worried.


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## revilo44 (Sep 17, 2010)

Title of feait says this is the release of second week of March 










The plan thickens


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

Sir Whittaker said:


> I'm also curious as to whether the new CSM squad is replacing the old one. There's no mention of 'chosen' on the list, so I'm a little worried.


Perhaps the Tactical Squad comes with options for Chosen?

that's a crapload of stuff for 1 week.


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## venomlust (Feb 9, 2010)

Increasing the prices here and there by a few dollars, don't think I didn't notice that GW!

I am at least encouraged (crazy as it might sound) that the codex is $50. This is on-par with Black Legion and Farsight, which hopefully means we'll get at least that many rules/artifacts/etc. to work with, as opposed to the smaller books like Knights and Legion of the Damned.


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## revilo44 (Sep 17, 2010)

I hope they make a good marine squad like the tactical kit 
Plus Guys do you think I should buy the raptors now or wait for the new ones.


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## venomlust (Feb 9, 2010)

Er, I was going to say wait, but there's no point:



> The red items are repackaged items with the new boxes, while the Helbrute and CSM Attack Force are new items. Codex Crimson Slaughter is a splash release, but is coming in a full hardback and of course there is a limited edition version. It appears the old CSM Battleforce is being replaced by this new CSM Attack Force.


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## bitsandkits (Mar 18, 2008)

None of the stuff on the list I red is new its just new format boxes possibly with a new decal sheet and new format assembly instructions


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## fatmantis (Jun 26, 2009)

yes i can also confirm this...and i also agree that most of this is repack


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

I am vibrating with excitement.


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## Adramalech (Nov 10, 2009)

If we're not getting updated models for any of those things, AND they're repackaging all of them, that means we're looking at easily another few years of the same old CSMs, lord, bikers etc. :\


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## venomlust (Feb 9, 2010)

Yeah, probably. I can live with that, but I hope sooner or later we get a Chosen kit because there isn't one, and Cultists in a pack of 10. Not like it's hard to buy them off of eBay, but 5 in a box is a joke, and GW would be making direct sales to people who don't want to buy secondhand or whatever.

Helbrute was a step in the right direction. I feel like people will give them a shot now that we'll be able to represent their gear without kitbashing or converting anything. I'll definitely pick one up when they come out. I don't care if it sucks on the tabletop, if it looks cool then I'm down. The price tag _hopefully_ reflects the inclusion of all possible gear combinations. Anything missing would be pretty lame, at this point. Gotta justify the price increases somehow, at least if they want my cash. Based on the cost of the old Chaos dread, anyway, since there was no kit to replace. Can pick up a DV Helbrute for less than 10 bucks shipped on eBay, so let's see what we end up with...


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## Bindi Baji (Apr 23, 2009)

venomlust said:


> Yeah, probably. I can live with that, but I hope sooner or later we get a Chosen kit because there isn't one, and Cultists in a pack of 10


I firmly believe we'll see both covered in some fashion this year


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## venomlust (Feb 9, 2010)

Have other new kits been pretty inclusive of wargear options? In other words, is the trend to include more or less bits in a box?

I haven't seen the newer Space Marine kits/sprues, but they do seem to contain a lot of options with all their grav guns, combi-weapons, and such.


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## Bindi Baji (Apr 23, 2009)

venomlust said:


> Have other new kits been pretty inclusive of wargear options? In other words, is the trend to include more or less bits in a box?


More seems to be the way, at least of the kits i've seen anyway


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## Adramalech (Nov 10, 2009)

venomlust said:


> Have other new kits been pretty inclusive of wargear options? In other words, is the trend to include more or less bits in a box?
> 
> I haven't seen the newer Space Marine kits/sprues, but they do seem to contain a lot of options with all their grav guns, combi-weapons, and such.


From the looks of it, the helbrute kit doesn't have anything to worry about in that regard, but we won't know for sure until we see it go up for preorder and can look at the sprues themselves.


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## venomlust (Feb 9, 2010)

Adramalech said:


> From the looks of it, the helbrute kit doesn't have anything to worry about in that regard, but we won't know for sure until we see it go up for preorder and can look at the sprues themselves.


Yeah, I'm really looking forward to a Thunder Hammer + Power Scourge combo, specifically. I know I saw that in one of the pics, so I'm good.


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

The new Dwarf Ironbreakers even include a great weapon that can be slung on the back of the musician. Definitely paying attention to detail it seems


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## Adramalech (Nov 10, 2009)

venomlust said:


> Yeah, I'm really looking forward to a Thunder Hammer + Power Scourge combo, specifically. I know I saw that in one of the pics, so I'm good.


I just looked at the photos and the power scourge and thunder hammer look like they're both left arms.

I mean, they're both in there, but they're also both left arms.


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## venomlust (Feb 9, 2010)

Adramalech said:


> I just looked at the photos and the power scourge and thunder hammer look like they're both left arms.
> 
> I mean, they're both in there, but they're also both left arms.


I think I could manage using the scourge on the right arm with some cutting and repositioning.


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

I wonder if the chosen, plastic obliterators, and zombies are the following week from this


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## Adramalech (Nov 10, 2009)

We can certainly hope so.


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## venomlust (Feb 9, 2010)

Adramalech said:


> We can certainly hope so.


Hmm, no. You, specifically, are not allowed to.


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## Adramalech (Nov 10, 2009)

venomlust said:


> Hmm, no. You, specifically, are not allowed to.


Whateva Whateva I do what I want


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## SonofVulkan (Apr 14, 2010)

This is on Facebook, not sure if it's on here yet. Looks like i'll be making a trip to GW this weekend.


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## Adramalech (Nov 10, 2009)

I can't help but feel that this crimson slaughter codex is supposed to be GW's way of fixing chaos marines without having to replace the old book, and therefore without having to admit they were wrong. Unless it's one of those little digital dexes like AS or LotD

I'm actually talking out of my ass right now. I'm too high to think.


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## Bindi Baji (Apr 23, 2009)

Adramalech said:


> I can't help but feel that this crimson slaughter codex is supposed to be GW's way of fixing chaos marines without having to replace the old book, and therefore without having to admit they were wrong. Unless it's one of those little digital dexes like AS or LotD


I think it's just a mini-digi-dexi like LOTD


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## Adramalech (Nov 10, 2009)

Bindi Baji said:


> I think it's just a mini-digi-dexi like LOTD


Alright. Well, hopefully some of the options presented therein are viable.


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## venomlust (Feb 9, 2010)

For 50 bucks it better not be a mini-dex.


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## DkMiBuch (Feb 1, 2013)

Einherjar667 said:


> I wonder if the chosen, plastic obliterators, and zombies are the following week from this


You mean plastic Oblits instead of those finecast ones?


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## Adramalech (Nov 10, 2009)

venomlust said:


> For 50 bucks it better not be a mini-dex.


When i say "mini-dex" I mean a comparable amount of content to a codex supplement, and since the black legion supplement is also $50, $50 seems reasonable. (I mean, reasonable for GW. Anyone else would get drawn and quartered for even daring to charge $50 for what is essentially a hardback magazine in terms of number of pages)


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## venomlust (Feb 9, 2010)

Yes, I see. Hoping for at least as much content as Black Legion, which I liked, but not enough to buy. Not difficult to memorize a handful of stats on some artifacts and bring Chosen as troops. :laugh:


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## Gret79 (May 11, 2012)

I'm really looking forward to this - I'm going to buy and use it to give my chaos marines another build.
As long as they release a paper copy too.
I've really been enjoying the BL supplement. Although mine has 72 pages compared to everyone else's 64. I love printing errors. GW offered to swap it, but I said no, I'm getting more value for money now :laugh:


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## venomlust (Feb 9, 2010)

Haha! Are the pages blank, or did you get some illustration page 8 extra times?


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

DkMiBuch said:


> You mean plastic Oblits instead of those finecast ones?



Yeah that was one of the rumors. 

Also, I believe theres a hardback version of the Crimson Slaughter dex coming out next week


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## Gret79 (May 11, 2012)

venomlust said:


> Haha! Are the pages blank, or did you get some illustration page 8 extra times?


I got the first 8 pages twice - My book is therefore worth 1/8th more than the standard supplement! :laugh:



Einherjar667 said:


> Also, I believe theres a hardback version of the Crimson Slaughter dex coming out next week


That would be awesome and surprising - all the other supplements have been direct order. 
I really hope this is the case - I'd love GW to take my money on release day and me to have a physical copy. Rather than the way it's been going - the BL supplement came out, I read all about it online for a while, then 3 months later I got to buy it in hard copy.

I want a release day read!


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

I know how you feel! I am keeping my fingers crossed, but, we will know on friday I suppose


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## Tawa (Jan 10, 2010)

SonofVulkan said:


> This is on Facebook, not sure if it's on here yet. Looks like i'll be making a trip to GW this weekend.
> 
> View attachment 959947682


Well, I'm off to interfere with myself for a while...... :spiteful:


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

Tawa said:


> Well, I'm off to interfere with myself for a while...... :spiteful:


Clearly you are a follower of Slaanesh.


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## d3m01iti0n (Jun 5, 2012)

I hope this thing falls flat on its ass. What a terrible idea.


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

I will never understand why people hope GW fails, especially before it's even been released.


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## Tawa (Jan 10, 2010)

Einherjar667 said:


> Clearly you are a follower of Slaanesh.


Nope, Nurgle.

It's a funny shade of yellow and smells funny, so it's ok :crazy:


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## d3m01iti0n (Jun 5, 2012)

Einherjar667 said:


> I will never understand why people hope GW fails, especially before it's even been released.


I wish GW success in most things, like updating their old codecies, giving BT its codex back, and getting Legion-specific rules to CSM. Not giving a dex/supplement to a completely irrelevant warband only created for DV.


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

Aha, BT player, you have earned your shoulder chip.

It's a weird choice for supplement, but who knows.


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## tu_shan82 (Mar 7, 2008)

TBH I think that a renegade CSM codex has a lot of potential, it could cover all renegade chapters, whilst using thge Crimson Slaughter as an example, maybe?


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## Tawa (Jan 10, 2010)

tu_shan82 said:


> TBH I think that a renegade CSM codex has a lot of potential, it could cover all renegade chapters, whilst using thge Crimson Slaughter as an example, maybe?


You mean in the way that Codex: CSM uses the Black Legion as the poster boys?


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## Gret79 (May 11, 2012)

That's exactly what I'm hoping for 

lol, if I'm really lucky, my night lords will aspire to be Crimson Slaughter - kidding:laugh:


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## Tawa (Jan 10, 2010)

That could work to be fair


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## MidnightSun (Feb 10, 2009)

Who gives a shit what name is on the front? If it's got rules for better Berzerkers and a bunch of Khorne bonuses, then it's Codex: World Eaters. I don't care what it says on the cover, it's the content I care about.


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## Bindi Baji (Apr 23, 2009)

MidnightSun said:


> If it's got rules for better Berzerkers and a bunch of Khorne bonuses, then it's Codex: World Eaters. I don't care what it says on the cover, it's the content I care about.


Right, Codex: Fluffy Kittens with chainswords coming up


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## MidnightSun (Feb 10, 2009)

Bindi Baji said:


> Right, Codex: Fluffy Kittens with chainswords coming up


If that's what GW has gotta call it to produce it, Fluffy Kittens with Chainswords sounds good. If it gets released a month earlier for being bound entirely in pink, go ahead. I can re-bind a book. I can't write official rules.


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## Gret79 (May 11, 2012)

I'm so making myself a new cover when I buy this now 
Codex fluffy kittens with chainswords needs to be a thing :grin:


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## tu_shan82 (Mar 7, 2008)

Tawa said:


> You mean in the way that Codex: CSM uses the Black Legion as the poster boys?


Yeah pretty much the same as how CSM's poster boys are the BL, SM's poster boys are the Ultrasmurfs, with the Eldar it's Saim Hann and the T'au sept for everyone's fave blue skinned commo fish-men.


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## venomlust (Feb 9, 2010)

This is what passes for an image teaser these days:










I don't know about you guys, but I want 50 of them.


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## Achaylus72 (Apr 30, 2011)

I am loving all this Chaos love at the mo' it makes me a happy chappy, gotta get the Black Legion Codex, and the Blood Slaughterers Codex.

Also noticed that on Faeit212 that there will be God Specific Codecies they are to be called.

Book of Khorne
Book of Nurgle
Book of Slaanesh
Book of Tzeentch

Apparently these allow you to ally CSM and Daemons and these new codecies have all the rules and fluff to field god specific armies. Also these are compatible with the current CSM Codex


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## venomlust (Feb 9, 2010)

Yeah, we'll see about those. There wasn't anything super substantial from those rumors that I saw, other than some cover art that may or may not be legit.

Separate from hardcover publications, I think we have a good shot of seeing all those supplements eventually in digital format. If this dataslate/supplement/digital codex trend continues as it has been for the past few months, we'll see plenty more. But who knows what GW will pull out of the hat next?


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## OIIIIIIO (Dec 16, 2009)

venomlust said:


> Yeah, we'll see about those. There wasn't anything super substantial from those rumors that I saw, other than some cover art that may or may not be legit.
> 
> Separate from hardcover publications, I think we have a good shot of seeing all those supplements eventually in digital format. If this dataslate/supplement/digital codex trend continues as it has been for the past few months, we'll see plenty more. But who knows what GW will pull out of the hat next?


Imp Guard .... DUH?!:biggrin:


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## venomlust (Feb 9, 2010)

COMMON KNOWLEDGE, GUYS! :laugh:


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## venomlust (Feb 9, 2010)

http://natfka.blogspot.com/2014/03/...howComment=1394031544965#c2153167673878461675

New rumor is that Crimson Slaughter can take Possessed as troops.


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## Gret79 (May 11, 2012)

Any chance of a copy/paste for the workblocked?

I have lots of possessed...


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## Tawa (Jan 10, 2010)

tu_shan82 said:


> Yeah pretty much the same as how CSM's poster boys are the BL, SM's poster boys are the Ultrasmurfs, with the Eldar it's Saim Hann and the T'au sept for everyone's fave blue skinned commo fish-men.


If it's got a tasty flavour, then I would welcome a Renegade Space Marines 'Dex :good:


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## venomlust (Feb 9, 2010)

Gret79 said:


> Any chance of a copy/paste for the workblocked?
> 
> I have lots of possessed...


Not with my shitty kindle, but it says there are warlord traits, artifacts, and possessed as troops. It's a very short blurb.


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## Gret79 (May 11, 2012)

venomlust said:


> Not with my shitty kindle, but it says there are warlord traits, artifacts, and possessed as troops. It's a very short blurb.


What on earth have you been doing with your kindle? :shok:

And in other news - that makes it very similar in format to the Black Legion Supplement and the Iyanden one. Thanks for the summary 

If this isn't Codex:'Counts as Khorne' but a new 'unwanted, unlooked for' supplement...I believe the incandescent nerdrage will be visible from space.
Ragardless of the fact Codex:Khorne was all based on speculation.


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## Orochi (Jan 28, 2009)

My guess is that GW could be hyping the Crimson Slaughter to be similar to the 'Blood Raven' bullshit to give CSM players a 'new' legion. Terrible games, cliche canon and a perfect anti-hero track record, are all on the horizon.

Guess I'll just have to deal with using Codex: Blood Angels to represent my Night Lords for now - The Sanguinor's rules make for a nice demi-Daemon Prince/Dracula portrayal, anyway.

Matt Ward needs a new chaos codex to demonise anyway... Preferred Enemy: Crimson slaughter based codex late this year?


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## revilo44 (Sep 17, 2010)

via a reader on Faeit 212
I managed to get a look at the new White Dwarf. The Crimson Slaughter have the usual relics, warlords traits and so on. The Force Org change is that you can take Possessed as Troops.

Well this solves all chaos's prolems.


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## DarkDisciple_Nahum (Oct 6, 2013)

Yay another codex/suppliment/digital BS that I don't want/need to buy! Thanx GW :good:

Lets do a test run. I'll sub bloodletters for possessed troops and use my actual possess as elites. And now run my children run across the board. Wait, they're all dead from shooting? Dang it I thought I could work...


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## Mokuren (Mar 29, 2011)

Possessed as troops? Wow! Talk about OP!

I always felt it was tremendously unfair to weather three turns of pitiful and pointless TauDar fire as I run across the board on foot with my uber-powerful S5 marines that cost twice as much as marines, good thing they don't shoot! If I could take potshots back at those firing at me I would table them turn two!

But now that I can take them as _troops_? Are you kidding, GW?

I can already see the next Las Vegas open lists: nothing but possessed spam! Six troops, 20-strong. Absolutely unstoppable.


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## Doelago (Nov 29, 2009)

Saw the following pop up on Facebook...


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## venomlust (Feb 9, 2010)

That cover is badass!

Via BoLS: http://www.belloflostsouls.net/2014/03/rumors-csm-march-wave-latest.html

NOTE THE TEXT IN BOLD:



> Home » warhammer 40k » RUMORS: CSM March Wave Latest
> RUMORS: CSM March Wave Latest
> Posted by Larry Vela at 3/05/2014 45 Comments
> 
> ...


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

I JUST remembered the plastic Havocs rumor this morning.


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## Words_of_Truth (Sep 20, 2007)

Always liked the idea of possessed but don't get why they are so poor and expensive.


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

Possessed are cool, but if that's the main thing about this supplement, I'd rather use the BL one and get Chosen as my troops, especially since they're supposedly new models coming out for them


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## Adramalech (Nov 10, 2009)

revilo44 said:


> Well this solves all chaos's prolems.


I'm not sure if you're being sarcastic or not...


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

Are all of you being sarcastic?! Are Possessed any good? i never see them used.


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## venomlust (Feb 9, 2010)

I fought against them once.

Juggerlord steamrolled them. 12 AP2 attacks. Neener neener neener.


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

*scribbles notes* thank you very much


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## revilo44 (Sep 17, 2010)




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## The Irish Commissar (Jan 31, 2012)

Is it just me or do the chaos space marines in the second picture beside the hellbrute look brand new. At least the heads anyway...... I think


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## Words_of_Truth (Sep 20, 2007)

Nah they are options in the current box.


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## neferhet (Oct 24, 2012)

So, thank you gw for all the shiny and fuck you gw for having released this shitty new "legion" codex, when you have a score of underused fluffy and canon true legions to explore/expand.
Basically i'm going to pay 39 € for fielding chosen as troops. yeah...
Let's hope the plastic crack is good. it looks good....


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## Gret79 (May 11, 2012)

Einherjar667 said:


> Are all of you being sarcastic?! Are Possessed any good? i never see them used.


Yes - if you take 15-20 with the MoS and the IoE for fnp , take a slaaneshy sorc to buff them and then grimoire them with allied demons. And then roll your grimoire on a 3+ for the entire game like a boss.

I'm buying this.

2K double FoC

1 Allied detachment for each FoC means I can bring both BL allies and CS allies.

I'm seeing an army of Noise marines, chosen and possessed where everything is scoring :grin:


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## Mokuren (Mar 29, 2011)

Gret79 said:


> Yes - if you take 15-20 with the MoS and the IoE for fnp , take a slaaneshy sorc to buff them and then grimoire them with allied demons. And then roll your grimoire on a 3+ for the entire game like a boss.
> 
> I'm buying this.
> 
> ...


Except you're going to spend 10 times as much as a Screamerstar, which is a lot more effective and much harder to kill and you can actually get it to assault whatever you want on turn 2 or move it anywhere on the table, and you actually cannot ally two different books.

Double FoC means you get two allied detachments but they must come from the same codex, unless it's a special non-ally detachment like Inquisition and Knights... OH!

_*CHAOS CAN'T GET THAT!*_

HOW DOES IT FEEL TO NOT BE SUPERIOR LOYALIST RACE, HUH?


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## Gret79 (May 11, 2012)

Mokuren said:


> Except you're going to spend 10 times as much as a Screamerstar, which is a lot more effective and much harder to kill and you can actually get it to assault whatever you want on turn 2 or move it anywhere on the table, and you actually cannot ally two different books.
> 
> Double FoC means you get two allied detachments but they must come from the same codex, unless it's a special non-ally detachment like Inquisition and Knights... OH!
> 
> ...


erm...What?

It looks like that post touched a nerve, cos the response was waaaay over the top.

Have you got a page number for having to take the same allies in both detachments? I've apparently missed that. Although luckily, you put it in capitals and bolded it :laugh:

The possessed part was a joke/fun army to run as a laugh, cos having your whole army depend on rolling a 3+ is a REALLY viable tactic. Especially without Fateweaver...I thought that was evident from the tone. But hey, perhaps I should've put a message at the end in capitals...


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## Mokuren (Mar 29, 2011)

Gret79 said:


> erm...What?
> 
> It looks like that post touched a nerve, cos the response was waaaay over the top.


Nah, it's okay, I always get like that when talking about chaos. I like it as much as I like my Sisters and since I pretty much started in 4th, I've been shat on at every edition, no exception, and then yelled at because I have no right to complain since chaos "dominated" 3.5 edition.



Gret79 said:


> Have you got a page number for having to take the same allies in both detachments? I've apparently missed that. Although luckily, you put it in capitals and bolded it :laugh:


_*PAGE 110*_



Gret79 said:


> The possessed part was a joke/fun army to run as a laugh, cos having your whole army depend on rolling a 3+ is a REALLY viable tactic. Especially without Fateweaver...I thought that was evident from the tone. But hey, perhaps I should've put a message at the end in capitals...


I have an Eldar player at my club that always places better than everyone else at tournaments and has done nothing but whining constantly how they made Eldar unplayable in 6th edition and how he's shelving them and taking Sisters out because seriously, Eldar are unplayable.

I have heard people whine and complain that daemon princes are too strong and need to be nerfed, even though their encounter with them was my own daemon prince, which is a 320 points monstrosity that would make any 40k player with common sense get into a projectile vomiting fit that will ultimately kill them.

I have heard people claim Necrons are underpowered and incapable of winning against anyone, and this was back between the end of 5th and the beginning of 6th edition, with all their flying circus shenanigans, and refuses to play them any more to this day.

I can really stretch my common sense to include a lot of shit to believe.


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## Gret79 (May 11, 2012)

Mokuren said:


> PAGE 110


:laugh: - cheers



Mokuren said:


> Nah, it's okay, I always get like that when talking about chaos. I like it as much as I like my Sisters and since I pretty much started in 4th, I've been shat on at every edition, no exception, and then yelled at because I have no right to complain since chaos "dominated" 3.5 edition.


Don't forget, CSM also can't complain because we get the Heldrake which negates anything bad about the army, at all, ever :grin:

Looks like I'll be running BL and CS then.


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## Mokuren (Mar 29, 2011)

Gret79 said:


> Don't forget, CSM also can't complain because we get the Heldrake which negates anything bad about the army, at all, ever :grin:


That part makes me extra sad because I like bikers and raptors, but taking them means I lose heldrakes, which are what win games.

Which is why I pretty much HAVE to bring two for the tournament at the end of March. However, to balance out for all that cheese, I'm also bringing 9 thousand sons with an icon of flame and bought gifts of mutations for every character in the army.


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## venomlust (Feb 9, 2010)

Well, looks like we don't get any new special characters, either. I forgot that technically they have rules from the DV set, so it makes sense not to re-do them. I could be wrong, but we'll find out soon enough.

Still trying to be excited... I'll buy the Helbrute, if nothing else.


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## Uveron (Jun 11, 2011)

venomlust said:


> Well, looks like we don't get any new special characters, either. I forgot that technically they have rules from the DV set, so it makes sense not to re-do them. I could be wrong, but we'll find out soon enough.
> 
> Still trying to be excited... I'll buy the Helbrute, if nothing else.


Now taking with a pinch of salt. The Manager of the GW store I spent my day at yesterday said that the Crimson Slaughter Codex, has a new rules for the possessed mutations that 'Make them much better'. Now if the codex is due this weekend then he is most likely correct (as he will have seen a copy). 

But as everyone is saying its two weeks away, I it makes the salt needed a bit much.


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## Words_of_Truth (Sep 20, 2007)

If that's true then maybe the crimson slaughter codex is a good basis for my sons of malice.


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## venomlust (Feb 9, 2010)

That's good. I don't own any Possessed, but eventually I hope to. Can always proxy my millions of Berzerkers. I'll definitely be trying them out in some fashion.


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

Grabbed some Possessed today!


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## Achaylus72 (Apr 30, 2011)

I have 5 squads of Possessed that makes 50 Possessed. Yippeeeeeee.


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## venomlust (Feb 9, 2010)

Achaylus72 said:


> I have 5 squads of Possessed that makes 50 Possessed. Yippeeeeeee.


You, sir, must be absolutely _possessed_ to own that many! ZING!


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

I have... One squad of five, Im making an uber MSU chaos marine army


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## Adramalech (Nov 10, 2009)

I'd still rather have noise marines. -shrug-


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

Then.... take noise marines


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## Adramalech (Nov 10, 2009)

Einherjar667 said:


> Then.... take noise marines


What? You'd rather have possessed troops and no access to the artifacts in codex: CSM?

...

...

I really don't know what to say.


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

I never said one or the other, I said take what you want.


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## Gret79 (May 11, 2012)

Adramalech said:


> What? You'd rather have possessed troops and no access to the artifacts in codex: CSM?
> 
> ...
> 
> ...


 
I'd say - we don't know what artefacts the Crimson Slaughter get yet. Reading up on them, they tried to summon a bloodthirster with a powerful artefact...




Not claiming thats what they'll get at all, just emphasising that we know very little about the CS and even less about what GW plan to do with them. They could be awesome, able to take down the knights in 1 turn as an apology for chaos not apparently getting them, or they could be worse than me writing a fandex...and no-one wants that.

Example rule - If Eldar are on the table, at the end of the game roll a dice. If the result is a number, the eldar win. Just as Planned.



Besides, if this is anything like the BL supplement - just take both NM's and Possessed


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## Adramalech (Nov 10, 2009)

Gret79 said:


> I'd say - we don't know what artefacts the Crimson Slaughter get yet. Reading up on them, they tried to summon a bloodthirster with a powerful artefact...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Point taken

and sorry, Einherjar, for the straw man.


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

Haha, no worries.


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## Gret79 (May 11, 2012)

Would love this if they made an artefact which DID summon a free bloodthirster though :laugh:


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## venomlust (Feb 9, 2010)

I was thinking the same, but you know it will cost 50 points and make you roll 2d6, and only a 12 summons the thing. :grin:


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

Its all up. Looks like red is the new black


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## d3m01iti0n (Jun 5, 2012)

40K Community: "We want Legion rules to give more personality to our armies and we promise to throw all of our money at you!"

GW: "Okay here are some rules for an irrelevant warband."

Shweet!


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## venomlust (Feb 9, 2010)

Einherjar667 said:


> Its all up. Looks like red is the new black


What is all up?


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

venomlust said:


> What is all up?


Preorder stuff on GW's website.


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## venomlust (Feb 9, 2010)

Einherjar667 said:


> Preorder stuff on GW's website.


Oooh, duh. Gotcha. k:


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## Lord of the Night (Nov 18, 2009)

I am getting one of those Helbrutes. Fricking gorgeous model, it'll look great in Abaddon's black and gold.


LotN


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

I can't freaking wait to see what the Chosen will look like


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## Lord of the Night (Nov 18, 2009)

Einherjar667 said:


> I can't freaking wait to see what the Chosen will look like


Is that the one with specialised armour parts for each God? I didn't know that was coming out soon, may be another CSM kit I need to get my hands on.


LotN


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

Lord of the Night said:


> Is that the one with specialised armour parts for each God? I didn't know that was coming out soon, may be another CSM kit I need to get my hands on.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



It's supposed to be. Rumors point to it being in an upcoming release


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## ntaw (Jul 20, 2012)

....is that the most weapon options a dreadnought has ever come with or what?!

Left arm:

thunder hammer
power fist
power scourge
missile launcher

Right arm:

power fist
twin-linked heavy bolter
twin-linked lascannon
reaper autocannon
multi-melta
plasma cannon

Are you friggin' kidding me?! Awesome.


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## Uveron (Jun 11, 2011)

ntaw said:


> ....is that the most weapon options a dreadnought has ever come with or what?!
> 
> Left arm:
> 
> ...


Sadly No Dual Thunder-Hammer Options! 

Or the even "better" Dual power scourge! :crazy:


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## ntaw (Jul 20, 2012)

Uveron said:


> Sadly No Dual Thunder-Hammer Options!
> 
> Or the even "better" Dual power scourge!


Awww, Muffin! :laugh:


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## Gret79 (May 11, 2012)

Hmmm...call me paranoid, but I'm now thinking chaos don't get the knights cos then they'd sell less helbrutes...
So I can buy a helbrute now, then later we can talk knights...

Well played gw :grin:


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## venomlust (Feb 9, 2010)

Haha, if that's true then it worked on me too.


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## Kreuger (Aug 30, 2010)

Uveron said:


> Sadly No Dual Thunder-Hammer Options!
> 
> Or the even "better" Dual power scourge! :crazy:


Just buy 2 with a friend and swap out the weapons. Or use a forge fiend for the tendrils.

Dual power scourge doesn't seem to do much. It isn't a specialist weapon, so the dread would still get bonus attacks with 2 different weapons. Based on how the rule is worded, being in base contact with a model with a scourge triggers the effect. Having 2 scourges wouldn't necessarily double the effect.

HOWEVER, adding in a mauler fiend with the reduced Attacks lasher tendrils and you could greatly reduce the effectiveness of another model in melee.

Unlike the power scourge, lasher tendrils DO stack. Each pair of tendrils reduces enemy attacks by 2 (1 per tendril) so 2 mauler fiends can reduce friends/enemy attacks by 4.


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## Adramalech (Nov 10, 2009)

I'm not sure if I should move forward with my plan to use the helbrute power fists on a daemon prince to represent the black mace, or if I should get the codex supplement on the off chance that it makes Kranon playable.


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## venomlust (Feb 9, 2010)

Adramalech said:


> I'm not sure if I should move forward with my plan to use the helbrute power fists on a daemon prince to represent the black mace, or if I should get the codex supplement on the off chance that it makes Kranon playable.


Wait 'til it comes out, nub. That's a box of new havocs/chosen, if they actually exist. Can always... er... look at a store copy of the codex or something.


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## Uveron (Jun 11, 2011)

Adramalech said:


> I'm not sure if I should move forward with my plan to use the helbrute power fists on a daemon prince to represent the black mace, or if I should get the codex supplement on the off chance that it makes Kranon playable.


If I recalled correct both the named guys from the box were in the codex... Which is a shame as I cut my one of him up!


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## Adramalech (Nov 10, 2009)

venomlust said:


> Wait 'til it comes out, nub. That's a box of new havocs/chosen, if they actually exist. Can always... er... look at a store copy of the codex or something.


The last thing I need right now is more choices D:


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## revilo44 (Sep 17, 2010)

So yea interesting 


> via the Faeit 212 comment section
> MAAksel March 7, 2014 at 4:19 PM
> Read through the book... only 2 pages worth of actual rules.
> 
> ...


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## Tawa (Jan 10, 2010)

Gret79 said:


> Hmmm...call me paranoid, but I'm now thinking chaos don't get the knights cos then they'd sell less helbrutes...
> So I can buy a helbrute now, then later we can talk knights...
> 
> Well played gw :grin:


Ditto.

Clever bastards...... :laugh:


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## Gret79 (May 11, 2012)

Did I just read that right? Divination?!

I want this. So much. Prescienced Forgefiend here I come!


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## slaaneshy (Feb 20, 2008)

So Possessd become shitter? WTF??!!


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## LukeValantine (Dec 2, 2008)

slaaneshy said:


> So Possessd become shitter? WTF??!!


Not really. Beasts is a huge boon that brings with it 12' movement and ignoring movement penalties for difficult terrain, and rending and with auto wounding is a huge boon in the wraith knight/riptide invested mess 40k has become. Also scoring is the single most important rule that can be attached to anything this edition.


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

Plus, ya know, you can bring more of them.


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## Mokuren (Mar 29, 2011)

Einherjar667 said:


> Plus, ya know, you can bring more of them.


Considering the cost per model? I hope you didn't want to have enough to last past turn two.

Them turning maybe beasts if you roll lucky at the beginning of the turn is only worth anything if they're alive enough to get anywhere, and don't start telling me you can bring more or cover their advance with the rest of your army: they're Possessed, they cost twice as much as a space marine, you won't have enough of them to be a threat and you won't have enough of a "rest of the army" to save them from anything.

Possessed were shit before, now they're just whipped shit with sugar topping.


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

I was adding to Luke's post, but ok. If you want to bring possessed, this book allows you to bring more. That was as far as my point goes.


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## venomlust (Feb 9, 2010)

My bad. Thought I was on a different thread when I posted.


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## Uveron (Jun 11, 2011)

Mokuren said:


> Considering the cost per model? I hope you didn't want to have enough to last past turn two.
> 
> Them turning maybe beasts if you roll lucky at the beginning of the turn is only worth anything if they're alive enough to get anywhere, and don't start telling me you can bring more or cover their advance with the rest of your army: they're Possessed, they cost twice as much as a space marine, you won't have enough of them to be a threat and you won't have enough of a "rest of the army" to save them from anything.
> 
> Possessed were shit before, now they're just whipped shit with sugar topping.


I am quite sure that the list in the post was wrong. I had a was present as a copy was being read and all the options were quite good. Their were options to re-roll and a few other things to help make them better. 

The view after looking at the book, was that it wasn't going to be great for an army but for an allies detachment two units of scoring Possessed, with a 'Possessed' lord, would be quite a nice bonus for a CSM or Deamon army.


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## Mokuren (Mar 29, 2011)

Uveron said:


> I am quite sure that the list in the post was wrong. I had a was present as a copy was being read and all the options were quite good. Their were options to re-roll and a few other things to help make them better.


They're still almost 30 points per model, marginally more durable than an ordinary space marine and don't shoot at all. The only way they're playable is if you bring a Dreadclaw and get a turn 3 assault into something, assuming your opponent isn't just hugging his side of the table and laughing at your hundreds of points sunk in stuff that will never reach him.

They're not good, they may be good in some kind of imaginary, fluffy vacuum where you can afford to pay for two and something marines that don't really do anything that any other choice of scoring models in your army can do better, but that world has nothing to do with reality.

It doesn't matter how cute their random rules get, it's still a one in three chance to get the only thing that will help them actually get into assault, which still doesn't really make them a good assault unit either.


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## Kreuger (Aug 30, 2010)

That's a bummer. More randomness is not a help here. Unless the player can purchase some basic upgrades and then have mutation for additional upgrades.

It's a bummer (and amazing) how many units remain unusable since the 3.5 codex


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## venomlust (Feb 9, 2010)

I suppose I'm going to withhold my ultimate judgments until I see the rules for myself, but I'm _slightly_ disappointed with what I've read so far. 

Feel free to think I'm a whiner and roll your eyes at me, because I'm sure I deserve it, but:

Divination: AWESOME, but... artifact to unlock a psychic table? So, we pay yet another tax? Does it only unlock Divination for one Sorcerer, or does taking the artifact unlock it for the whole army? I'd be fine with the latter, but I have a very strong feeling it's the former. Don't get me wrong, I'd pay it in a heartbeat because I love Divination, but it seems sort of... I dunno, lame, to need to. If more than 1 Sorc has access to Divination, I can see Crimson Slaughter replacing CSM as my Primary Detachment, but I'm just very skeptical that GW would give us that much Divination. I am dreaming of some very evil CSM/Daemon deathstars that will probably never see the light of day (which is probably a good thing :grin: we need less broken units, not more).

I guess if you were to compare the cost of bringing an allied detachment of Daemons with bringing a Tzherald with Divination, 25 points is a far cheaper tax. Also, a Sorcerer is waaaaay cooler, to be sure. So from that perspective, it's a great deal. I'd probably only be bringing 1 Tzherald anyway, so in the end I'd have more points and then not need the stupid unit of Pink Horrors that in ~5 games has yet to use a psychic power.

Possessed: I never use them, the changes are cool in theory, but I don't think I'll be buying any.

The AP3 kill-buffed weapon doesn't impress me, either. It's a neat idea, but 10 kills for a force weapon? Yes, there are other buffs along the way, but any number of things can go wrong that prevent you from even getting 1. A power sword is 15 points, so if this artifact is no more than 25 points I'd say it balances out. Perhaps my criticisms are a bit too negative about this item, but by the gods, PLEASE let there be more than 2 artifacts in the book.

Really, the big question I have is this: Do we have to pay a stupid tax for units in this book, like VotLW with Black Legion? Has that been answered in the rumors yet? Haven't seen anything about that yet.

Still very excited to see details about the (possible) Possessed Lord, the pretty pictures and read the fluff, and hopefully some cool artifacts aside from the 2 leaked so far.


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## LukeValantine (Dec 2, 2008)

I am personally going to take the divination sorc, but that's mainly because my typical CSM list has 10-16 heavy weapons in it on various platforms so any of the divination powers would be devastating in my force regardless of the initial cost of inclusion. Hell even 4 missile launchers that ignore cover is a god send for 25pts.


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