# Sticky  Monthly Conversion Deathmatch - Announcement and Questions



## Dave T Hobbit

Greetings Heretics.

Announcing the Heresy-Online Monthly Conversion Deathmatch​ 
Starting in May Heresy Online will be offering the same opportunity to display your converting skills and shape your reputation as a renowned converter (to get the pun out of the way as soon as possible ) that we already offer painters.

Draft Rules​ Format
Each month there will be an entry thread.

Before you start the conversion post a picture of the model (the before picture) in the entry thread before the end of the month. Then post a picture of the model after the conversion (the after picture) thread before the end of the month. Entrants are also permitted to post a short (no more than two sentence) description of what the conversion represents (e.g. my chapter are a fusion of the Space Wolves and the Minotaurs so I converted a Doombull to be Chapter Master).

Voting

At the end of the month a voting thread will be created containing the before and after pictures of each entry.

To vote for winners simply post in the voting thread.

There are two categories:

Most Innovative IdeaThis category covers the pure imagination that fuels conversions so is for the cleverest idea irrespective of technical execution
Best Executed IdeaAs well as ideas conversions are works of technical skill, so this category covers the ability to make a converted model look as if it has always been that way irrespective of how ambitious the change was.

Each member may vote once for each of the two categories stating who they think should win. Entrants must cast a vote for each category and cannot vote for themselves; anyone who does not vote cannot win.

After one week the votes will be totally and the winners announced.

Reward
The primary reward for this contest is knowing your conversion skills are admired. However there will also be a small Rep award to both winners.

FAQ​ Are there any categories or themes?
Currently any model or unit can be entered. However, there might be themed contests for special events or holidays (e.g. Christmas).
Can I vote for the same person in both categories?
Yes. Although they are separate categories so entries should be considered for concept and realisation.
I am extensively converting a model so it will take longer than a month. Can I still enter?
If your conversion can be broken down into sub-parts (e..g arms, legs, head) then each distinct sub-part can be entered as a separate conversion.
I have just started a conversion. Can I still enter?
If the before picture makes it clear exactly what has already been done then this is not different from a longer conversion that it split across more than one month so is acceptable.

As many people did not know the competition was coming this decision is designed to not penalise converters for converting so will be closely reviewed during the first month and might change.
Do I need to post progress pictures?
As taking pictures can take time progress pictures are not mandatory; however, they will show people how you did the conversion so could both help you win the Best Executed Idea and give your fellow heretics pointers on how to improve their own skills.
How much of a conversion does it need to be? Can I enter a kit-bashed model?
Anything that is not out-of-the-box (including kit-bashing) can be entered. however, the winners are chosen for clever ideas and dexterous work so more complex changes might receive more votes.
Does the before picture need to show the model I am converting or can I post a picture of the sprues?
The before-after pair can be viewed as the same as the before-after shots on slimming and exercise advertisements, so the before picture should show the base upon which the work was done just before the conversion starts.

In most cases this will be the single underlying model onto which the putty/other parts are added, e.g a Minotaur torso.

If there is no underlying majority model because, for example your conversion is made from many kits, the conversion work begins before any assembly is done or is even made from scratch, then a picture of the parts is acceptable.
How does rules versioning work?
The rules will be reviewed through out the contest. If any of the rules need to be changed then the changes will be announced and the new rules confirmed a few days before the end of the month and will apply from the following month. For example, the rule set for May 2012 will be set on 28 April 2012 after which no changes will apply until after May.


Hopefully this is clear; however, if there are any queries post them in this thread and we will clarify the Rules or FAQ.


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## Boc

Will models posted be required to be completely paint-free?

For example, people assembling models that have been primed or bits of those converted models have been primed.


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## Red Corsairs

This will be great for the modellers to have a chance to show off their skills in competition.

I'll also add here that the Monthly Painting Challenge has now been renamed the Monthly Painting Deathmatch to run alongside this event as well as avoid further confusion between that and humakt's Army Challenge.


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## Dave T Hobbit

Boc said:


> Will models posted be required to be completely paint-free?
> 
> For example, people assembling models that have been primed or bits of those converted models have been primed.


As painting is sometime easier before assembly is completed the after picture does not have to be bare plastic/metal. However, this competition is for conversion not painting so any painted areas should be there to avoid difficulty painting the model later. If anyone attempts to abuse this then then the rules may change in the future.


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## Svartmetall

As someone who's a deeply mediocre painter (and therefore would never consider entering a painting competition) but thrives on converting things, I welcome this! 

Roll on May...


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## Boc

Svartmetall said:


> As someone who's a deeply mediocre painter (and therefore would never consider entering a painting competition) but thrives on converting things, I welcome this!
> 
> Roll on May...


I don't know if you're really experienced enough Svart... having seen your works, I dunno :laugh:

Edit: Self-deprecating humour doesn't come across typing, the man is a god.


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## TheKingElessar

If I enter a kit-bashed model, does the before picture have to be of an empty base? :grin:


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## ItsPug

TheKingElessar said:


> If I enter a kit-bashed model, does the before picture have to be of an empty base? :grin:


Why? You thinking of kitbashing a tau stealthsuit? :laugh:

To be fair I think you'd need to show the parts as well. unless it is a stealthsuit


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## Dave T Hobbit

TheKingElessar said:


> If I enter a kit-bashed model, does the before picture have to be of an empty base? :grin:





humakt said:


> If I am building a conversion straight from the box, can I just take pics of the box or boxes used or di you want sprue pictures?


The before-after pair can be viewed as the same as the before-after shots on slimming and exercise advertisements, so the before picture should show the base upon which the work was done just before the conversion starts.

In most cases this will be the single underlying model onto which the putty/other parts are added, e.g a Minotaur torso.

If there is no underlying majority model because, for example your conversion is made from many kits, the conversion work begins before any assembly is done or is even made from scratch, then a picture of the parts is acceptable.

To ensure that the playing field is level the rules for May will be fixed on 28 April, after which changes or amendments (if any) will only be considered for later months. So make sure you post any questions here as soon as possible.

Remember that the before picture is the starting point for voters to see how impressive the after picture is.


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## Moriouce

This sounds great! I'll se what I can have in store for May. I know I have a couple of Looted wagons my meks just eager to lay their hands on.


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## Dave T Hobbit

"I have just started a conversion. Can I still enter?"

If the before picture makes it clear exactly what has already been done then this is not different from a longer conversion that it split across more than one month so is acceptable.

As many people did not know the competition was coming this decision is designed to not penalise converters for converting so will be closely reviewed during the first month and might change.


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## Dave T Hobbit

Red Corsairs has asked whether he, as organiser of the Monthly Painting Deathmatch, can enter the Monthly Painting Deathmatch.

As the same question applies to me entering this Conversion Deathmatch I would appreciate any feedback on whether it is fair for me to enter the Conversion Deathmatch. I will not take offence if anyone objects for any reason.


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## Turnip86

Why not? It's judged by a poll after all isn't it so really you have no influence over the result. And lets be honest, the more the merrier.


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## Dave T Hobbit

Turnip86 said:


> Why not? It's judged by a poll after all isn't it....


As there are two categories I was planning to do voting with by posting your votes in a thread rather than a poll.


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## Turnip86

Dave T Hobbit said:


> As there are two categories I was planning to do voting with by posting your votes in a thread rather than a poll.


Well if everyone's vote posts say 'last edited by Dave T Hobbit at [time]' and they all vote for you then we'll know something's up


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## TheKingElessar

Dave T Hobbit said:


> Red Corsairs has asked whether he, as organiser of the Monthly Painting Deathmatch, can enter the Monthly Painting Deathmatch.
> 
> As the same question applies to me entering this Conversion Deathmatch I would appreciate any feedback on whether it is fair for me to enter the Conversion Deathmatch. I will not take offence if anyone objects for any reason.


I would have no issue with it, but I can equally understand why some would.

I would, if it were me, not enter this first one, even though all of us got plenty of advance warning, simply because I by definition knew about it first, granting me an advantage albeit an insignificant one. But then, the appearance of impropriety to me is hard to overstate. I always take great pains to make it obvious I was not acting improperly.


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## Dave T Hobbit

The rules for May 2012 onward are now set.

The entry thread will be up in a few days.


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## Dave T Hobbit

In case you missed it the May thread has been posted.


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## TheKingElessar

Thanks, I actually HAD missed it. Still, I shall have to abscond this time, I fear...


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## Dave T Hobbit

TheKingElessar said:


> I shall have to abscond this time, I fear...


What could possibly be more important than getting your tool out?


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## humakt

Dave T Hobbit said:


> What could possibly be more important than getting your tool out?


Using your tool?


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## Dave T Hobbit

humakt said:


> Using your tool?


Good answer.

Althuogh, as you said you were going to post a before picture yesterday, you should probably be using your camera first.


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## TheKingElessar

Dave T Hobbit said:


> Good answer.
> 
> Althuogh, as you said you were going to post a before picture yesterday, you should probably be using your camera first.


Nono, I learned the hard way that photographing my tool wasn't to be taken lightly...Stupid stupid stupid...


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## Dave T Hobbit

TheKingElessar said:


> Nono, I learned the hard way that photographing my tool wasn't to be taken lightly...Stupid stupid stupid...


I was actually directing that at humakt not you; as a Mod he has the special tool.

Anyhew, I should probably stop spamming my own thread.:laugh:


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## TheKingElessar

Yeah, I guess I should stop spamming it too...:wink:


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## humakt

I inadvertantly made myself busy and have neither got my tool out or used it. I shall attempt to take before pictures before I get my tool out.


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## Dave T Hobbit

Remember the May contest closes midnight GMT on 31 May so there is still time to complete your entry for this month.

I will be confirming next week whether any rules changes are occurring for next month, so if you have any comments or suggestions can you post them here before Monday.



Iron Angel said:


> Reading through the rules, it seems the emphasis is on not-painting the model.


The emphasis is on displaying the conversion work done; whilst a picture of an unpainted model definitely gives a "pure" view of the conversion, painting that does not hide the work done does not disadvantage either the entrant or voters.


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## Dave T Hobbit

The May Deathmatch is now over and the Voting Thread is up.

The June Deathmatch Thread is up, with no changes to the rules.


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## Dave T Hobbit

If I convert a model I have previously painted is it eligible to enter?

If you converted the model without stripping the paint then you do not need to strip the model just to enter the contest. However you do accept the risk that the conversion might seem less impressive if the model is painted.


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## Dave T Hobbit

This Deathmatch is about celebrating our attempts to convert models; so if the work has been done then the mechanism of the contest should not get in the way except where necessary:

I finished my conversion but was unable to post a photograph before the closing date. Is there anything that I can do?

Voting will not always start immediately after the closing date. Whilst the organiser makes no warranty, after photographs posted in the entry thread before the voting thread opens may still be accepted.

If you know in advance you will not be able to post an after photograph of the conversion in time then contact the competition organiser as soon as you know explaining your situation; at the organiser's discretion the closing date can be extended. For the sake of fairness this extension will apply to all entrants.

If you do not post an after picture then the organiser may choose to count a progress picture displaying significant progress as an after photograph.


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## Dave T Hobbit

The September entry thread is now open.

And Voting for August is now open.


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## Mossy Toes

I started one conversion that turned into something entirely different (well, spawned soething different, while the original idea was changed substantially and completed in a different way). My "before" picture is now only partially valid, whether I post up the original idea (which I accomplished in a different way and not entirely to my satisfaction) or, like I would prefer, the off-shoot project. I understand that it's expected that changes will occur as conversion exposes certain realities about the kits being bashed, but thought I would float this question:

Can I post the "before" of the original project and the "after" of the off-shoot, with only partial picture documentation of the change-over, or am I constrained to an "after" of the initial project, though some aspects of it changed in the process?

For clarification, the initial project was a scratch-built Thunderfire Cannon with Techmarine. While I was unhappy with the initial cannon for the purposes of a TFC, I thought it would make the barrels of an excellent quad gun, so I entirely scratch built an Aegis Defense Line with a quad gun. May I post the ADL as my conversion project for this month?


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## Mossy Toes

Coda question: if I post one of those projects this month, may I also post the other next month? I realize this would be a violation of the "a project that you've done *this month*" guideline and would be totally fine with a "no" for an answer.


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## Dave T Hobbit

Mossy Toes said:


> Can I post the "before" of the original project and the "after" of the off-shoot, with only partial picture documentation of the change-over, or am I constrained to an "after" of the initial project, though some aspects of it changed in the process?


The "before" picture is there to help people see what changes have been made, so you are fine to use the photograph of the original starting point if the plan changed mid-project.



Mossy Toes said:


> Coda question: if I post one of those projects this month, may I also post the other next month? I realize this would be a violation of the "a project that you've done *this month*" guideline and would be totally fine with a "no" for an answer.


While planning can can be done in advance, the actual construction must be done between the start date of the entry period and the end date, so you could not enter any work done this month in next month's deathmatch.

However, if you do more work on an existing project it is acceptable to use a photograph of the project as-is as a "before" photograph and enter just the additions made.


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## Dave T Hobbit

The September/October Voting thread and the November Entry thread are up now


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## Dave T Hobbit

Two more additions to the FAQ:

Do all the parts have to be GW? If not is there a minimum percentage that have to be GW parts?

There is no requirement for the conversion to be for a GW game or to use any GW parts.

I converted several areas around the model; therefore my conversion looks better in three-dimensions. Can I submit several photographs of the finished product from different angles?

If you do not have the time or ability to make a photo montage you can post as many photographs in the entry thread as you wish.

To avoid voters potentially being overwhelmed by photographs of entries at the top of the list up to two photographs will be displayed in the voting thread. If you have a preference as to which photographs are displayed it should be indicated in the entry thread.


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## Mossy Toes

Another question: may I change entries? I'm working on several projects at once (as you might have seen on my Plog) and one is turning out rather more impressively than the entry I posted up initially in the December entry thread. I really think that the Daemon Prince I'm working on is a much stronger entry than my Fateweaver model.

*May I drop my initial entry, then post a picture of a different project as it was at the beginning of the month?*


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## Dave T Hobbit

Mossy Toes said:


> Another question: may I change entries? I'm working on several projects at once (as you might have seen on my Plog) and one is turning out rather more impressively than the entry I posted up initially in the December entry thread. I really think that the Daemon Prince I'm working on is a much stronger entry than my Fateweaver model.
> 
> *May I drop my initial entry, then post a picture of a different project as it was at the beginning of the month?*


Yes.


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## Dave T Hobbit

What is the maximum amount of models one can present for a "Squad based" conversion?

There is no upper limit for the number of models in a squad. However all models have to be converted between the start and end dates of the competition.


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## Dave T Hobbit

An addition to the FAQ:

I just discovered the Deathmatch and would like to enter the conversion I started a few days ago. Can I use photographs of identical parts to those I used as my before picture?

Yes. The primary purpose of the before picture is to let voters assess how much inspiration and graft has gone into the conversion. It also lets people who want to try a similar conversion see which parts you used. By entering the competition you assert that you started the conversion in the relevant month anyway.


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## Words_of_Truth

Could I enter my Squat(s) in this?


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## Dave T Hobbit

Words_of_Truth said:


> Could I enter my Squat(s) in this?


Any work done after the start date (usually the first of the month) is eligible, so the original Squat for the tutorial would not be eligible but if you built more then they would probably be.


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## Words_of_Truth

Ok thanks  will get started on the last two of the command squad.


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## Wookiepelt

I've recently signed up the daughter here (BlindRedFury) and she is interested in taking part with a scrap build she has in mind. Is there a minimum post requirement before she is allowed to enter the challenge?


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## Dave T Hobbit

Wookiepelt said:


> I've recently signed up the daughter here (BlindRedFury) and she is interested in taking part with a scrap build she has in mind. Is there a minimum post requirement before she is allowed to enter the challenge?


There is no minimum post requirement.

Looking forward to seeing her entry.


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## Drohar

Should we change the rules, so that the model has be finished by the deadline? 
Doesn't matter if it is started 6 months ago or yesterday. Some people might have 10 days to paint in 6 six months and some might have 10 days to paint in 15 days. This would enable all to enter their finished models in the competition. (as long as it fits the criteria)
Also if you started it this month and fully finished it you could get a bonus point or something like that?


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## Dave T Hobbit

Drohar said:


> Should we change the rules, so that the model has be finished by the deadline?
> Doesn't matter if it is started 6 months ago or yesterday. Some people might have 10 days to paint in 6 six months and some might have 10 days to paint in 15 days. This would enable all to enter their finished models in the competition. (as long as it fits the criteria)
> Also if you started it this month and fully finished it you could get a bonus point or something like that?


Interesting idea.

I can see advantages and disadvantages each way, so I'll mull it over for a bit.


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## madfly-art

Hi all.
After some time off from competing against You fine lads and ladettes, I plan to enter in May 2017 in free for all category and so I invite You all to partake. Both conversion AND painting deathmatches. It seams to me as You need a jolt of fresh competitiveness and I'd be glad to oblige. And yes I already know I won't get most votes but it's the spirit of this great forum that I miss. So see You all May and bring Your A-game in both conversion and painting!


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## Dave T Hobbit

So that casual browsers get to see the awesome, the entry and voting threads will now be in the Painting and Modelling forum.


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