# Heavy Weapons?



## Lucio (Aug 10, 2009)

Hey, I'm playing an 1850 pt tournament as the Dark Angels and I've run into a conundrum. I'm not sure whether to take more plasma cannons or swap them out with heavy bolters or go with one and one. Heavy weapons list: Multimelta x2, Missile Launcher x3, plasma cannon x2, lascannon x2, and a twin linked lascannon.

No one in my area plays Tau so I'm not worried about trying to outshoot them, but IG and orks are very popular with a few other SM and SoB players in the mix. 

I've got a pair of plasma cannons, a pair of heavy bolters, and a missile launcher to fit 2 spaces. Also I can switch out the twin linked lascannon for twin linked heavy bolters if need be.

My other question is whether to field a dreadnought or a deathwing terminator squad. The termies have 1 assault cannon and 3 storm/shield and the vet while the dreadnought has a multimelta, storm bolter, and ccw. 

Thanks in advance.


----------



## Dar'kir (Jul 11, 2009)

i d say go with more plasma, after all its the DA way.


----------



## Lucio (Aug 10, 2009)

Thank you. 
Would you consider plasma cannons a decent anti-horde weapon/transport killer?

Also is specializing the squads a good idea or bad? For the devs perhaps putting the missile launchers and and lascannons into one and the plasma cannons in the other?


----------



## Vaz (Mar 19, 2008)

Neither. It's an Anti-MC and TEQ unit.

However, it's far better than Heavy Bolters at Anti-Horde.

Combat works better with DA against all but Nob Hordes.


----------



## Lucio (Aug 10, 2009)

k thanks for the advice 

Any opinion on the termies vs dread?


----------



## Isafrehn (Dec 5, 2007)

i'd go with termies over a dread because it's about three termies to a dread points wise.
So the termies will get you more attacks in close combat and it can take one lascannon shot to kill a dreadnought or a termie and one termie is worth less than a dread. 
Judging by the fact your playing against guard and other human armies i would run terminators because they'll take more firepower to kill and they will rock the guard in close combat regardless of their strength.
So the Termies should have an easier time killing their points worth than a dreadnought unless the dreadnought has a twin'linked lascannon and manages to kill a tank or two before it dies.


----------



## Champion Auzias (Apr 30, 2009)

Personally, I'd take the dread with a melta and instead of fielding normally, DS him. That way, if there is a troublesome Land Raider or Leman Russ, and Artillery Piece hiding somewhere you can get close and flip it quick. A melta is alot more effective at taking out a tank than a T/L Lascannon. 

On top of that, it will give a second target, so what will they kill? The Dread? Or the rest of your army shooting them up or taking the objective?

Also, if the dread gets in combat with a guardsman, you've just tied down a unit for several turns, and a guardsman will be lucky to glance it. It's practically invulnerable in combat with anything Str3, unlike terminators, whom against a conscript mob with 30+ attacks WILL fail rolls. Not to mention in CC a Dread is a Str10 Murder machine.

The same with shooting, really. A dread is alot more resilient, and will force opponents to choose what to use Anti-tank on, whereas Lasgun bolts and Shootas & Sluggas should just plink off, unlike with Termies, who will be forced to take more saves. I've had Squads of termies torn up because they had to roll against THOUSANDS of damned Las-shots. 

But maybe it is a matter of opinion. Go with whatever makes you feel more comfortable with your army.


----------



## Lucio (Aug 10, 2009)

Interesting, they both seem to have their positives and one isn't necessarily better than the other. THanks for the help guys.


----------



## Siphon (Jan 17, 2009)

> Also, if the dread gets in combat with a guardsman, you've just tied down a unit for several turns, and a guardsman will be lucky to glance it. It's practically invulnerable in combat with anything Str3, unlike terminators, whom against a conscript mob with 30+ attacks WILL fail rolls. Not to mention in CC a Dread is a Str10 Murder machine.


You've also just tied down your Dread to a throw away unit for 2-3 turns or more. I think any IG player would thank you for sending your tank killing dread into a practially worthless squad of guardsmen and leaving their tanks alone.


----------



## exsulis (Jul 17, 2008)

I'd run Dreads in pairs as your foe then has to choose which one he wants to go after. That, and if one gets tied up with a unit you've got a second one to mess with them


----------



## Pearlay (Nov 26, 2009)

*Plasma Cannon vs Heavy Bolter*

:goodlasma Cannon 36"range 7str 2AP Heavy 1, Blast, gets hot
:ireful2:Heavy Bolter 36"range 5str 4AP Heavy 3

*Plasma Cannon Hits anything under the Blast template with AP2 so Spacemarines or Lesser Mobs Dead :taunt: if they don't have a Invul. Save!
... and a Heavy Bolter if Lucky will Hit all 3 targets and maybe wound 1 of the 3 and then they will probly save vs that. :ireful2:

I have (3) heavy Weapon 10 man Squads, each has (2) LasCannon & (2) Plasma Cannons :shok: Oh yeh, Gets Hot!, Plasmas on a Roll of 1 to hit takes a wound BUT, Normal saves apply means, Space marines 3+ will save them most the time :wink:


----------



## LimitingFactor (Jan 11, 2009)

"I'd run Dreads in pairs as your foe then has to choose which one he wants to go after. That, and if one gets tied up with a unit you've got a second one to mess with them "

i just used this config against a tau/ IG armoured company combined force.

one dread with missile launcher , spot lights and twin linked heavy bolter
the other dread with multi melta , extra armour and a close combat claw.

The long ranged dread shot up a kroot squad, disabled a leman russ for two turns of the game and survived a hit from a battle cannon. it took incoming las cannon shots but he used a fortification armour save against that and lived.

the other dread got bloodlust and charged a chimera wreaking it and killing half the storm troopers that bailed out. it then took a hit from a hammerhead rail cannon and expired :mrgreen:


----------



## Lucio (Aug 10, 2009)

I don't think the Dark Angels dreads can take spotlights... Anyway thanks for the help guys


----------



## Raptors8th (Jul 3, 2009)

Okay, here's my advice:

1. Use the standard marrine dex instead of the dark angles one, the dark angels one was basically an experimental marine dex to see how things worked before they released the actual marine dex and is thus slightly underpowered and uses some antiquated rules (like the old PotMS). So you can still field whatever chapter you want, but use the normal dex, especially if your just starting out.

2. Dreads would probably be better than termies in your case, giving you a good reliable take on all comers unit. However, you do need to make 2 modifications: it _needs a drop pod and it needs a HF. Pod is necessary because everything on the dread is close-range and the heavy flamer is just so much better than a SB that you can't afford not to take it.

Well, hope that helps. Good hunting._


----------



## Lucio (Aug 10, 2009)

What I've found to be working is one of each heavy weapon for the devastator teams, but only having 5 man teams and putting them in a building, with using tac squads as Seraphim bait and an assault squad with an Int.-Chaplain waiting to pop out and annhiliate whatever gets too close to the devs. Works much better than my assault squad generally does (ie. nothing) I've been taking out some of the plas pistols and having a pair of dreads for anti-transport duty and a termy squad to deepstrike with chainfists. I've only really gotten to fight SoB this way and it works really well. I'd kinda like to try and field 3 termy squads (very expensive I know) and deathwing assault 2 of them right into the enemies face giving my devastator teams more time to wittle down the enemy. 

With vehicles I've been wondering if it is a good idea to keep a tactical squad or scouts nearby one then after the vehicle has completed its shooting, run them to stand in front of it so it gets cover. Good idea?


----------



## FORTHELION (Nov 21, 2009)

just a quick question have you got ravenwing bikes. if you do they got free teleport homers so you can deep strike your deathwing terminators to within six inches of them and they dont scatter. so i usually go flat out with the bikes right up as close you can get then teleport in the termies.


----------



## Lucio (Aug 10, 2009)

I wish I did, they're my next purchase.


----------



## FORTHELION (Nov 21, 2009)

what is your full listed army for the tournament?


----------



## Lucio (Aug 10, 2009)

HQ:
Captain (115)
- storm bolter
Interrogator Chaplain (140)
- Jump pack

Elites: 
Dreadnaught (125)
Drradnaught (125)
Terminators (225)
-chainfist
-chainfist
- Assault Cannon

Troops
Tactical Squad (185)
+5
- Flamethrower
- sergeant power sword 
Tactical Squad (185)
-+5
-Flamethrower
-Sergeant Power Sword

Fast
Assault Marines (250)
- +5
- Power weap.

Heavy
Devastator (185)
- plasma cannon
- missile launcher
- Heavy Bolter
- Lascannon
Devastator (185)
-plasma cannon
- missile launcher
- heavy bolter
-lascannon

Predator (100)
- storm bolter
- heavy bolter sponsons


----------



## FORTHELION (Nov 21, 2009)

first up you got no armoured vehicles to carry your troops or drop pods, you might loose a lot of troops trying to get to the enemy.
2nd your terminators are 255 pts not 225 5pts each for the chain fists and 30pts for assault cannon.
i personally would dump the captain he doesnt add much to your squad and add 3 rhinos for your troops to run them up quickly.


----------



## Lucio (Aug 10, 2009)

Captain adds LD 10 to everyone which I like since it makes the Devs much less likely to run off the board. Against everything I've seen thus far a firebase setup has worked really well so I have yet wanted to run up and attack.


----------

