# Battle Sisters vs. Chaos Space Marines



## Arcane (Feb 17, 2009)

Alright, I've got a friend who play Chaos Marines and I have no experience at all playing against them. I really want to give him a run for his money and he wins most games he plays in. Mostly, I am used to facing Orcs, in which case I just shoot the hell out of them before they get to me. I don't know much about Chaos marines so forgive my ignorance. 

I know he uses lots of Raptors and a Lord with a jump pack or some such, a Havoc squad, a couple rhinos full of normal troops. I believe he uses an Obliterator and I am pretty sure he uses a Vindicator too. Recall something about a force sword as well, and that he likes Sorcerers... 

For any matter, I know he likes to use tournie lists if that is any help. 

Myself, I usually run a Cannoness with Blessed weapon along with a Celestian squad with meltas in an Immolator (often outfitted with meltas as well to take out anything big). I favor a second HQ Inq Lord with shooty retinue from the Ordo Malleus. 

I like to run a large squad of Seraphim because of the flexibility, and a Calidus to get the jump on them. Also, I usually pack two Exorcists, a Retributor squad and two rhinos full of sisters with some more sisters to back them up (mostly with flamers). 

What can I do?


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## Inquisitor Einar (Mar 6, 2009)

First off.. let me tell you.. Divine Guidance is your Friend. :biggrin:
Hails of bolter fire and flamers combined with this act of faith kill marines easily.
Second, Force weapons are just expensive power weapons against Sisters, and psychic powers that hit a squad of sisters can be ignored on a roll of 5+.
So giving your Inq a hood to slow down his psy powers, and the fact that once they DO get through, and hit a squad of sisters, you have another roll to shut it down before it does anything makes them quite easy to deal with.

A Calidus in 5th isn't as usefull as they used to be. Because once you assault, All enemy models are moved into combat as well, making counterattacking a Calidus quite easy, also her jump out of combat ability has been reduced to useless because the unit that she jumps out of may assault her afterwards. ( it's in the FAQ )
Basicly, she's now too expensive, and too fragile with only a 4+ inv save and 2 wounds. ( and not immune to instant death )

Your retributors will be a valuable addition to your army, their long range bolter fire combined with divine guidance is an excellent way of dealing with incoming marines.

I'm personnally a very big fan of the solo jumping cannoness with a 2+ save that turns invulnerable to tarpit/deal with incoming enemy units. She probably can't take out a lord without having him softened up a bit first, but against regular marines, she can dish out enough pain and holy retribution to take them out and jump to the next group.

Seraphim should be a good way to soften up enemy assault units or finish them off once your regular sisters cut them down to a bite size. Give the superior an eviscerator and you should be set. Another good way to use them is to jump out of combat in his assault phase and use the squad you assaulted as a 'stepping stone' to get close to his heavy support ( vindi's, oblits )

I also generally avoid using Rhino's, mainly due to their price. for those 2 rhino's you can pretty much get another squad of sisters. or increase the squadsize of the sisters in them.

A squad of 5 stormtroopers with 2 plasma guns is only 70 points, put them in cover, and they're great to snipe off closing enemy troops. Since it's such a small squad, people tend to ignore it, giving you a unit that can hold an objective, and take out marines that get within 24".

Try to stay out of combat as much as possible with your sisters, using stationary fire to soften up units, concentrate fire, and then finish them off with rapidfire/flaming. The few that remain from such an attack generally can be dealt with in close combat, even by sisters.


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## hells_fury (Apr 17, 2008)

what can i say einer, brilliant advice, along the lines of what i would say so + rep for that.

as for me i will say this, stay out of cc as much as possible, space marines own there while sisters fall short. 

divine Guidance and a squad of dominions with flamers will go through a squad in a turn, make sure the squad is large enough and have a banner bearer, if you dont get divine Guidance then a few marines will live for revenge

if he likes to use psyker's powers then equip your lord with a psy hood, it gives you two chances to stop the psyhic power, once with the hood and once with the sisters shield of faith rule if they are targeted


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## LordWaffles (Jan 15, 2008)

Arcane said:


> he wins most games he plays in.
> 
> I know he uses lots of Raptors and a Lord with a jump pack or some such, a Havoc squad, a couple rhinos full of normal troops. I believe he uses an Obliterator and I am pretty sure he uses a Vindicator too. Recall something about a force sword as well, and that he likes Sorcerers...
> 
> For any matter, I know he likes to use tournie lists if that is any help.


...His army sounds terrible. Raptors are fearful, a lord you can dreadnought fist. Havocs suck in comparison to obliterators, normal nilla marines are awful, sorcerors get fisted...

I think your friend is a liar and a cheat. Nobody wins tournies with shitty chaos lists.

In all sincerity, I doubt he plays people of tournament quality with such an awful list. From what I've heard from you on the forum, you seem to have a good grasp of the game, what're you worried about?


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## Inquisitor Einar (Mar 6, 2009)

Just because he likes to play tournie lists, doesn't mean he doesn't like to use silly models in a fun game. After all, that's what fun games are about. Using cool models.

Besides, A: Sisters dont'have dreads, they have penitents, and they're like loose cannons. 
B: Sisters also don't have powerfists, they have eviscerators, which work like fists except are more expensive and have more armour penetration. 
C: Sisters base strength is 3, meaning that their double strength is 6, so unless you use hand of the emperor to get the other two, no instant deaths.
D: a lord with a jumppack is not going to get near a dreadfist if it can help it.


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## CamTheApostle (Oct 31, 2008)

Wow, Waffle. That's a pretty harsh assumption. Of course, we all know you were joking around. 

Anyway, Inquisitor Einar seems to have things down pat. Brilliant advice. Almost makes me fearful of the bolter bitches. Almost. :biggrin: 

Recommendation on taking out any obliterators. They may seem nasty and tough, and they are. However, hit 'em with a few melta shots and they die. Beware if he decks out his havoks for assault (as they can take special weapons as well as heavies). Four plasmas or flamers in a ten man can ruin your day. And repeat what Einar said, shoot the shit out of his army. You probably won't get very far in assault with your basic sisters.

Good-luck to you. And die, imperial scum. :laugh:


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## Necrosis (Nov 1, 2008)

If you do want to assualt however I suggest you take a squad of Arco-flagellants. They have a 4+ invulnerable save and D6 attacks with power weapons. Their toughness is 5 so bolters won't have much effect on them. They are expensive but their pretty powerfully. Just hope you don't roll to many 6's since they kills themselves when that happens. There also a good counter if your opponent decides to use Tsons.


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## Inquisitor Einar (Mar 6, 2009)

Those 4 havocs would be an ideal target to use a cannoness on


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## CamTheApostle (Oct 31, 2008)

Inquisitor Einar said:


> Those 4 havocs would be an ideal target to use a cannoness on


Well, as Havoks are a minimum of 5 per squad, they all have two attacks, and the squad is often padded out to a full 10-man, that Canoness may be in for more then she can handle. 2+ inv or not, 1s are always failures and there are a good many of them.


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## Arcane (Feb 17, 2009)

Thanks for all the help guys. I have heard lately he is running troop spam, which with enough shots shouldn't be too hard since my Sisters are basically tougher marines when using strength.



LordWaffles said:


> ...what're you worried about?


Childhood rival I like to stop dead in his tracks hehe. Should be interesting for any matter.


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## Inquisitor Einar (Mar 6, 2009)

CamTheApostle said:


> Well, as Havoks are a minimum of 5 per squad, they all have two attacks, and the squad is often padded out to a full 10-man, that Canoness may be in for more then she can handle. 2+ inv or not, 1s are always failures and there are a good many of them.


Assuming you're the one assaulting.. 20 attacks, should be around 10 his, which is around 6 saves ( WS4, S4 I assume? ), so that shouldn't be too bad.
you'll be able to hold them off for a while, and seriously hurt them back with a blessed weapon.
if she is ovecome by them, they'll be cut down enough for some heavy bolter mayhem on them. And you get 2 faith points to use that divine guidance for some payback.


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## CamTheApostle (Oct 31, 2008)

Inquisitor Einar said:


> Assuming you're the one assaulting.. 20 attacks, should be around 10 hits, which is around 6 saves ( WS4, S4 I assume? ), so that shouldn't be too bad.
> you'll be able to hold them off for a while, and seriously hurt them back with a blessed weapon.
> if she is ovecome by them, they'll be cut down enough for some heavy bolter mayhem on them. And you get 2 faith points to use that divine guidance for some payback.


True, she should take about 1 wound a turn, and probably deal out 2. Yet every turn she is in combat she is sucking up faith points if she wants to stay ahead of things (the Passion and Spirit of the Martyr). Otherwise, a simple power weapon champion will cut her down easy. And if these guys have a mark, the entire combat equation changes drastically. 

Is it really wise to waste that sort of asset on a single heavy weapon's squad?


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## oreomaster3 (Mar 13, 2009)

battle sisters are immune to force weapons :laugh:


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## Inquisitor Einar (Mar 6, 2009)

CamTheApostle said:


> True, she should take about 1 wound a turn, and probably deal out 2. Yet every turn she is in combat she is sucking up faith points if she wants to stay ahead of things (the Passion and Spirit of the Martyr). Otherwise, a simple power weapon champion will cut her down easy. And if these guys have a mark, the entire combat equation changes drastically.
> 
> Is it really wise to waste that sort of asset on a single heavy weapon's squad?


You don't need the passion really, she has initiative 4, so she'll hit at the same time as these guys. Yes, she'll soak up a wound a turn more or less. that means she'll hold out for about 4 assaults ( since she'll be cutting the unit down to size while doing this )
And I'm guessing these guys are fearless, meaning that for every bit of combat resolution you win, they have to make another save.
By the time they are through with her, she'll have reduced them from 10 to 4-5 members. Which should be easy pickings for a squad of sisters with flamer/heavy flamer.
As for high point cost.. a tooled up cannoness is only 137 points. That gives her all the stuff she wants, I'm guessing these guys are a lot more than that or equal.
Keeping them busy for 2 turns like that and then finishing them off should work fine imho.


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## Someguy (Nov 19, 2007)

I think you will be ok

You should worry more about army vs army than unit vs unit though. The cannoness will do fine against the havocs (which aren't fearless, by the way) unless something else shows up to spoil her fun. Equally, you could shoot them. The chances of the cannoness actually fighting the havocs, and that she would be unwounded and charging a full squad, are small. Usually, one side or other has taken damage by the time an assault happens - if it happens.


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