# High Elves, the Warriors of Ulthuan



## Ascendant Valor (Jan 3, 2009)

Hey once again, guys.

The idea for this thread is a place to collect any and all information regarding Tactics and High Elves. This can either be tactics for playing as or against High Elves. After all, the idea is to help everyone, the gamers!
:grin:

So, let me create a rolling Table of Contents here, just for reference. If you guys would like to hear anything regarding High Elves, just post it right here and I'll incorporate it!


0.0 Introduction to the High Elven army
1.0 The units of the High Elves
2.0 High Elven Movement
3.0 High Elven Magic
4.0 High Elven Shooting
5.0 High Elven Combat


This is just tentative, so don't think it has to be the way it currently is. For now, that's just some of the things I'd like to cover.

Oh, and remember that this is all just my (or the respective poster's) expressed opinion. Anything and everything here is up for debate, comments and critique. This is to help all the players, so if you feel something needs to be said that I bypassed, fill everyone in!


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## Ascendant Valor (Jan 3, 2009)

0.0 Introduction to the High Elven Armies

Okay, so the introduction to the High Elves.

Things I plan on covering:
-High Elves - Are they competitive? If so, what makes them so?
-High Elves - How to make an effective Army
-More to come!

*Are they Competitive?*

So, with all the nasty ideas on "Army Tiers" and the hierarchy of armies, where do High Elves fall? That's a difficult question, given a limited context of comparing them to Daemons of Chaos (who _seem _to be the ultimate in power-armies). They are certainly more substantial than Orcs and Goblins (in terms of shear competitiveness), yet less-so than their dark cousins, the Dark Elves. I would therefore have to say they're somewhere in the middle, with the likes of the Empire and Brettonians.

Now, what makes the High Elves competitive? 
High Elves do have a lot of good things going for them: Army-wide Always Strikes First, high Weapon Skill, high Initiative (in addition to ASF, of course), high Leadership, High Movement. 
It makes sense, then, that they have some drawbacks: each individual model is expensive (often several times the cost of an analogous unit), all elves are Toughness 3, a general lack in armor.

So, how to capitalize on these pros and cons? Often times, the most capable armies of the High Elves are very focused, and hence create a Glass Cannon of sorts (they can dish out the damage, but can't take it). As such, they have two main builds: The Prince on Star Dragon build, and the Archmage/uber magic build.
_
Prince on Star Dragon_
As this name implies, this list revolves around the powerhouse that is a Prince on Star Dragon. These guys are just as nasty as they can come; one of the most devastating Dragons in the Warhammer universe, with a considerable Prince in tow. These lists emphasize the use of fast movers, namely the two varieties of Chariots and plenty of Dragon Princes of Caledor in support. A scroll caddy often accompanies these forces, so they tend to have minimal magic support.

How to combat this list? If you can somehow neutralize the Dragon (not the rider, just the dragon), you'll cut off a lot of the army's offensive power. Or, if you can neutralize the benefits of the Charge, namely by preventing the High Elf cavalry from decimating things, you will often find success. Odds are, movement and Close Combat will be the realm of this type of army. Magic and Shooting, however, will often be the bane of such a setup, especially under an unlucky general.

_Archmage, uber-magic_
These armies employ a finely-kitted Archmage, combined with a pair of Level 2 mages, and sometimes a BSB. They emphasize defensive troops like Phoenix Guard and White Lions to hold the lines while the Mages do their deeds. Archers and RBTs tend to buffer any remaining fast movers who can threaten the mages, who are often bunkered within an Elite unit. Obviously, these armies tend to favor the ability to whittle down the opponent's forces rather than face them in combat (since Combat units tend to be more expensive).

How to tackle this list? Again, an emphasis has been placed on Magic here. Odds are you won't stop the nasty spells, or at least the ones you would otherwise need to stop. Instead, you should just focus on taking down the mages in some way. If that won't work, you can always focus on taking down the relatively small accoutrement of troops that protect the mages.

There are also the Balanced lists. These armies tend to be less competitive, yet more fun all around. Since these lists are far more open, I can't generalize them too accurately. But we know that High Elves do have the capacity to bring more Special and Rare choices to the board, so that should say something.
:so_happy:



*How to make an effective High Elf army.*

I'll carry on with what I had described above, for simplicity's sake.

Prince on Star Dragon
-Emphasize Fast Movers that can keep up with the Dragon. This includes cavalry and Eagles.
-Focus on Offensive Power. Since the Magic Phase is essentially non-existent, you'll have to tie your units in combat to lessen the effectiveness of your opponent's magic and shooting.
-Your primary unit is the Dragon. Everything else is to ensure that it remains in play.
-The Prince and Dragon should be able to take down anything your opponent offers. If necessary, take down monstrous mounts before the riders and run them over in Combat Resolution (if the opportunity presents itself).

Archmage
-Take the Banner of Sorcery, and other Offensive magic items. Your ability to pump out the magic and overwhelm your opponents is your biggest weapon. Use it well!
-Archmage with a Book of Hoeth will do wonders. Two Lvl2's can carry the +1 Power Die and +1 Spell to keep the rest of the magic phase in line.
-You won't need too many Dispel Scrolls if you know how to use them wisely.
-You MUST keep all the Mages alive. Bunker down and get ready for them to come to your lines.
-Harrying the opponent's flanks is nice, but don't put too many points into it. March Blockers on the other hand can do wonders. Keeping those Marauders pinned for three turns under the fire of your Mages? Beautiful! (albeit unlikely)

Balanced
-Remember your ridiculous Elite units. Making an infantry army is easy, but will need some strong flank-charging units.
-As good as the Core units are, don't worry too much about them. Keep them at the minimum number of units; Spear Elves can be kept in units of 15+, but archers should be in naked units of 10, while Lothern Sea Guard are often too expensive to be put into large units (though detachment units of 10 are apparently effective).
-Use your Rare slots effectively! Eagles and RBTs are both very useful. Don't worry about defending them too much, though. Your main force should usually advance forward, leaving them to their own devices.
-Characters should be left as support. A Noble or two, with a Mage or two is often adequate for a strong army.

Overall, High Elves have a tendancy to thrive in large games. At 2000pts, they aren't top notch, and are often fighting a slight uphill battle. At 3000pts, High Elves really begin to shine. At this point, they can fill our ranks of Elite Troops and can finally bring those numbers to bear. However, at too grand a game, their advantage of greater numbers of Special and Rare units begins to deminish (only slightly, though).


Okay, this is what I have thus far. If you guys have questions, comments, or critique, fill everyone in!


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## Ascendant Valor (Jan 3, 2009)

*1.0 The units of the High Elves*

1.0 The units of the High Elves

Next up, a brief synapsis of the many elite units of the High Elves.

1.1 Introduction to the Units of the High Elves
1.2 The Units of the High Elves
1.3 How to Use the Units of the High Elves


*1.1 Introduction to the Units of the High Elves*

So, by now we probably all know that the High Elves are a league of Elite Warriors, capable of eradicating enemy units on sheer ability alone. That's good, considering the High Elves have no other tricks in their book.
:scratchhead:

Since they're so elite, it only makes sense that they can field more Special and Rare choices than other armies, too (+1 each at any point limit, I do believe). Unfortunately, the High Elves lack Core and Rare troop choices where they gain a prodigious selection of Special Troops, meaning you may have to under-utilize your Army Composition limits...

So, the clue here is that you want to emphasize your Special Units, while minimizing your use of Core troops to make more room for those all-so-important Special Forces! Granted, I love to see some Spear Elves tear apart any weak-ish units more than anyone, but the High Elves have far more interesting units to throw around. You interested to see what they're capable of? Here we go!


*1.2 & 1.3 The Units of the High Elves and How to Use them.*


First, let's go over the Characters:



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Lords:
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Tyrion
_This is the ultimate Combat Character of the High Elves. He has a solid damage output and absolutely fantastic staying power. He has all three types of Saves, several WS9 S7 flaming attacks, and Malhandir dishing out a few extra hits to top things off. He's go more stuff, but his kitting is rather irrelavent to the topic here.

So, how to use him? With his great Movement, he's great at Hunting mages, war machines, scouts, and so on.
As for fighting other Characters, he's decent. He can dish out the damage just well, and can take just about any blow put upon him. However, Killing Blow attacks are his bane, stripping his use of his amazing saves. Aside from that, he can cause Havoc against just about anything save for a Vampire or a Chaos Mortal Lord.
Putting him in a unit is also a good idea. With some Dragon Princes, you'll have a rock-solid unit capable of devastating your opponent's lines or flanks._

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Teclis
_By far, the greatest living mage in all of Warhammer, Teclis is a monster in the Magic Phase.

Magic is a completely different ball-park, so I'll cut to the rest here, and go on with Magic at another time.

With Teclis, you have to realize he is absolutely ATROCIOUS in combat. His sword is fantastic on any other character, but with Teclis it's a joke. Don't be fooled, if he ever gets into Combat, he will fall with an ease that would make a Tumbler envious.

That tragedy revealed, he needs protection. Now, I don't mean he needs to be put in a unit, or left alone in the backfield. I only suggest that you try not to present him as an easy target! 

Like I said in my Phoenix Guard post (here), the Phoenix Guard can create a great Bunker for Teclis with their High Leadership and survivability. Now, White Lions are another good choice, but I prefer Phoenix Guard. Spear Elves don't have the Leadership nor survivability, and Cavalry units are negatively affected with Teclis amongst their ranks.

Aside from that, he will need LoS most of the time, so you'll want to consider that. Again, avoid combat at all costs!_

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Eltharion
_I can't say that I'm too experienced with him, but I do love the concept. He can cast spells, shoot, and demolish things in Close Combat! All around, he's nasty!

The problem: his skill set is very sporadic. He doesn't have much focus, so he isn't as killy as a Prince on Star Dragon, can't cast like a Level 4 Archmage, or shoot like Alith Anar. I know he's meant to be a kind medium, and he pulls it off well, make no mistake.

What does that mean? Well, it just means that he'll need support with whatever he does. His shooting alone, for instance, won't be enough to turn ranks. His combat prowess might be able to make a unit flee, but I'd rather see him take to combat with a unit of Dragon Princes or Sword Masters (I'm a jerk, I know).

Altogether, he's a great support Character. Since he has no focus, he'll probably find his niche in a Combined Arms (Balanced) army, where are phases are represented equally in the army._

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Alith Anar
_This guy is pure anti-Dark Elf. His plethora of special rules makes him a considerable threat, especially in a Themed or Campaign Battle against the dark kin.

Again, I'm not too well versed with him, but again I like the concept. It seems that he'd do well to support your forces while another unit or two of Shadow Warriors scouts ahead. That way, his high Leadership and amazing skills will serve him and the bulk of your forces well._

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Archmage
_Archmages are the generic high-level casters of the High Elves. Since High Elves have a decent selection of things to outfit them with, they can be quite a nasty threat to the opponents of Ulthuan.

As with Teclis, this is more of something that belongs in the Magic seciton._


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Princes of Ulthuan
_The generic Combat Characters of the High Elves. As with Archmages, they have a long list of items to equip them with to make them very powerful. There are a few basic ones that seem to fit most builds, however. I'll cover those more elsewhere, since that doesn't entirely apply here.

Now, how to use your combat character? Odds are, a Prince will be used as an Offensive Tank. That is, he'll often have some nasty gear and will be atop a Star Dragon. This makes for a combat powerhouse that can rip apart just about anything in Warhammer Fantasy. They are incredibly tough, too. The problem is that this single unit costs around six hundred points or more! That's a lot of points for anything less than a 2500pt game. If you chose to do that, you'll have to be exceptionally careful with that model.

Other builds often involve the Prince as being a missile platform with one of the magic bows. He'll often ride a Great Eagle, too, just to get around better. This tends to be rather nasty, but expensive for what he does all the same.

As a defensive Leadership Beacon. This is the guy that just sits in the dead center of your battle line, along side your BSB, making sure your units don't run away from anything. This setup usually isn't taken, since it's rather involved for such a simple thing, and within an army where high Leadership is common._


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Heroes:
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Caradryan
_Captain of the Phoenix Guard. Hence, he's one of my favorite characters.

He's fantastic at dealing with any of the worst units around. Hydras? Send Caradryan in. He does multi-wound flaming attacks against them. If all else fails, he'll probably bring down whatever killed him just out of spite!

He's great at leading a unit to confer his Fear and Fear-immunity, as well as Magic Resistance. He's decent in combat, too. The idea with him is to send him headlong into the nastiest thing you're going to face._

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Korhil
_Much like Caradryan, Korhil is great at buffing your own units. He's rather tough to kill, and is great at dealing damage all the while. He's great at making units stick around.

Since he isn't immune to Fear or Terror, he can easily be defeated causers of said psychological effects. You'll have to be careful with him in respects to such things. Still, his damage output is impressive, and Killing Blow makes him a threat to just about anything._


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Nobles of Ulthuan
_Just your basic Combat Hero. You can give them a variety of equipment, and they can be your BSB.

Nobles are rather potent in combat, and can significantly boost the combat effectiveness of just about any troop with an appropriate build. Your Spear Elves lacking some stopping power? Toss one of these guys in with a Great Weapon. Silver Helms need a slightly more forgiving Leadership? Mount a Noble on an Elven Steed and let him tag along. 

These guys aren't too fantastic, but they do deliver a lot in terms of helping your forces. Honestly, they won't stand a chance against a WoC Hero, but they can still boost the effectiveness of your army as a whole._


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Mages
_Your basic Level 1 or 2 casters. High Elf mages receive +1 to dispel attempts and have access to High Magic and all other common lores. They are both versatile and effective.

Since most High Elf magic items are significantly less expensive than other races' items, it's possible to create a scroll caddy that can still contribute to your own Magic Phase. Two dispel scrolls and the Silver Wand (I do believe that's the combo) can still create a strong scroll caddy.

Obviously, cost is an issue, as it is for all High Elf troops. It's not very economical to fully equip your Level 1 or 2 mages when your Archmage or Prince could use those points more, for instance. It comes down to a matter of balance when kitting out your characters and units with respect to your army as a whole. Such an ideology is easily applicable to the mages. Consider what their purpose in your army is, and kit them accordingly!_


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Dragon Mages
_Often, these guys are seen as over-rated. The mage on the Dragon is little more than a basic mage (save for an awesome rule!) and the dragon is sub-par as far as monsters are concerned. Still, the package as a whole is still interesting.

What the Dragon Mage does is provide a "Mobile Oppression Palace," of sorts. The idea is to create a mobile offensive platform; you fly around and burn your enemies to the ground with magic and breath attacks. Normally, I would have to say not to get carried away with the Flaming Sword of Rhuin; a mage with an awesome sword is still a mage. The mage is too fragile to use effectively in combat, while the dragon is too expensive to be left out of combat. You're faced with a tactical conundrum! Basically, you'll just have to decide how to use your Dragon Mages as things come up._




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Core Troops:
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Spear Elves
_These guys are just about the only units High Elf players can get Static Combat Resolution from. They are the cheapest units available to us, yet they are not slouches in combat. They can fight in an extra rank to the front and have a reasonably high Leadership to boot. They can still be problematic to any army.

Still, they're often seen as under-rated and over-priced within the contexts of the book. Why pay so many points for this unit when a unit of Special troops can do far better? Frankly, the Spear Elves are amazing at what they do (give SCR and can tackle hordes) and the Special choices often are focused on some other part of the game (sword Masters are support units, Phoenix Guard are meant to hold the line, White Lions are a powerhouse/tarpit)._

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Archers
_The second cheapest unit Available to High Elves. They are often taken in naked units of ten to fulfill minimum core requirements. The idea is that they're cheap yet still effective in such small units.

High Elf archers tend to be over-priced. They can take down hordes, but are not very effective against anything with a decent Toughness or Armor Save. Frankly, Repeater Bolt Throwers are far more threatening than these guys. Still, they make good guard units for RBTs or support units for your Flanks._

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Lothern Sea Guard
_These guys are the combination of Spear Elves and Archers, and you pay for it too. They are the most expensive Core troops High Elf players have, and are almost as expensive as some of the Special choices.

Still, they are not to be sniffed at. They can give themselves some supporting fire, and are devastating to anyone wishing to charge them (stand and shoot, fight in three ranks). They can often be seen in units of 10, 15, 18, or 20 models, though most players prefer small units of these guys to maximize their effectiveness as Archers who just happen to also carry spears._


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Special:
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Sword Masters of Hoeth
_These are the bane of any Horde Army. They deal out punishment in droves, and are perfect for toppling any kind of Heavy units.

The best way for these guys to lose their effectiveness is through ranged attacks. Shooting and Magic are often what does these guys in. As such, any High Elf general would be wise to keep them from losing their prodigious effectiveness for as long as possible. Either keep their unit size small (more than 5, less than 11), or keep them shielded. Often, doing both is the best alternative.

Remember, though, that these guys belong in combat. That's what they are meant for. They thrive on Active Combat Resolution, so won't need any Static Combat Resolution to be effective. +5 SCR before blows are struck? Big deal; even if I fluff my attacks, odds are I can take down 7 of just about anything shy of Heavy Cavalry._

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Phoenix Guard
_Phoenix Guard tend to be very difficult to bring down. They have a decent armor save, but have a fantastic Ward Save. To top it off, they cause Fear. It's pretty clear these guys love to stick around.

They won't deal out significant damage, though. Where they shine is holding off units for as long as possible. How to take them down? That's a hard decision. The best answer is to probably focus your attention elsewhere. These guys won't win games on their own; they'll just tie up your units long enough for the rest of your army to get taken down by Sword Masters or RBTs._

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White Lions
_White Lions act as the bodyguards of the high-ranking elves. They're known for their strength and bravery, which is represented on the table very well. They dish out only one attack a piece, but what an attack it is! They are also Stubborn on Leadership 8, so that's pretty tough. They also come with a 3+ armor save against any attacks in the shooting phase.

The problem with them is that they die in droves unless given proper circumstances (a flank attack, wiping the attacking models, etc). They have Heavy Armor in Close Combat, so they'll likely take the attacks given to them. Their Stubborn rule accounts for this, though. The best way to drop them is to where them down._

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Shadow Warriors
_I'm not too familiar with these guys, so I'll be extra brief with them. They are the scouts of the High Elves. They have a modest BS5 and Hate all enemies. Other than that, though, they are pretty basic._

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Silver Helms
_These guys are often knocked as being a poor special choice, especially when compared against the Dragon Princes. Make no mistake, they're rubbish compared to the DPs. But for what they're worth, they can make a nice and cheap flanking unit. They're fairly tough and have ASF, so they can do fairly well in extended combat (if they have support, that is!).

As with most other cavalry, you won't see the Silver Helms in large units or them acting as a main strike force. Instead, they'll be a part of a larger battle tactic, so if you can stop them you'll likely weaken your opponent's plans. Otherwise, you may want to bog them down, or otherwise make them useless. Even though they aren't fantastic, they still have some strong potential._

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Dragon Princes
_You want a cheese unit? You got it! These guys are rock solid; they dish out the damage and can take it, all while ignoring anything having to do with fire. They're the stronger cousins to the Silver Helms, if you want to see their relationship that way.

As tough as they are, they're still susceptible to War Machines or getting bogged down. They are truly effective on a charge, but after that they are significantly less so. Again, they won't likely form the bulk of a force but will rather be a flanking unit, so if you can stop them you'll likely limit your opponent's plans._

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Ellyrian Reavers
_These guys are another unit I'm not familiar with. They would make a great flanking unit, though they'd be better put to mage and war machine hunting. They can peel away an enemy unit's rank, charge a flank, or otherwise help out the rest of your forces._

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Lion Chariot of Chrace
_This is one vicious chariot. It always dispenses Strength 5 attacks and impact hits, and can peel away the fighting ranks of just about any unit on a charge. As long as they are supported, or support another unit, they will remain very effective.

Taking them down is rather easy, unfortunately. As a chariot, they're vulnerable to Strength 7 attacks. They are also T4 and have a 4+ Armor Save, so aren't too tough either. You can deny their charge or just shoot it away. Even if it charges you, it won't fair too well in protracted combat._

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Tiranoc Chariot
_This is the lighter variation to the Lion Chariot. It has the potential to pop off a few bow shots in transition, so it can be dangerous from Turn 1. It's also very fast and still hits rather hard.

It has the same problems as the Lion Chariot, though the Tiranoc Chariot is still weaker. It has a 5+ Armor Save and is T4. They are cheaper, so you'll likely have to deal with more of them. Still, shoot them or otherwise deny them their role (typically as a supporter for another unit) and you'll be ahead of the game._



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Rare:
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Great Eagles
_They are one of the best units around to misdirect and march block. They're fairly resilient and are cheap to field. They can even fight well and so make decent War Machine hunters.

They aren't hard to shoot at, and are T4 with a few wounds and no armor. They'll fall to some decent shots. If they get hit by any kind of combat unit they'll be torn asunder. Odds are they'll just inconvenience your units._

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Repeater Bolt Throwers
_These are just about required in any army you'll see fielded. I always have at least one!

Regardless of my own impression, they are strong against anything heavily armored or against large Rank and File units, thanks to the RBT's ability to shoot a single bolt or a volley.

They suffer from all the weaknesses of any War Machine, so you can take them down fairly easily if you tried. Still, RBT's are dangerous and should be taken into account as necessary. After all, they can tear apart your heavy cavalry like cheesecloth._


Okay, that's all the units. I'll likely toss in some more detailed information, but this covers the bases I sought to cover initially.


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## Digg40k (Sep 7, 2008)

Very nice thread man, I'm really enjoying reading it. Looking forward to your opinions on the other unit choices from characters!


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## Ascendant Valor (Jan 3, 2009)

Thanks for reading, Digg. I appreciate an audience. :grin:

I do tend to update this, just as an edit, though. So it won't show up in the recent posts unless I add in another section.

So far, the progress is slow. I apologize for that, guys. I'm in the midst of final examinations for school right now, and it's a doozy of a semester for me here. Hopefully after that I can keep this running.

Oh, and Comments and Critique is always open!


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## squeek (Jun 8, 2008)

I am impressed so far as I said the other day!  If you need any help with locked posts, etc, just let me know.


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## Captain Galus (Jan 2, 2008)

Very nice write-up, my friend! Looking forward to seeing more of this :victory:


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## Green Knight (Feb 25, 2008)

sweet work mate, +rep from me


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## Lord Sven Kittyclaw (Mar 23, 2009)

great stuff man! i dont even play high elves but its still a great thread and very interesting.
and its pretty helpful for beating those pesky defenders of ulthuan!


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## Ascendant Valor (Jan 3, 2009)

2.0 High Elven Movement

Here's what I'll cover here:

2.1 Deployment
2.2 Maneuvering your units
2.3 Terrain
2.4 General Tactics

*2.1 Deployment*

Since the High Elves tend to be rather mobile, Deployment may seem to be rather unimportant. However, as you've seen elsewhere (such as Vaul's Deployment Tactica), you'll have to be cognizant of the manner in which your units start. I'd rather not see my Silver helms stuck behind a long line of Sword Masters, after all.

Since it's hard to say any concrete principles, I'll just cover some generalizations, in an easy-to-read and understandable bullet list:

2.1.1
Understand the varying roles of your units. As High Elves, each unit will have its own dedicated purpose in the game, so try to optimize their functionality from Deployment on through to Turn 7. That's right, 7.

2.1.2
Be willing to use your maneuverability to your advantage. It's rather easy for elven units to deploy on one side of the table and waltz over to the other side faster than you can truly counter. Since that's rather absurd though, just be willing to think further ahead in the game than you normally would to account for your speed.

2.1.3
While thinking ahead, imagine just how your units will react to your opponent's units, the terrain, and so forth. Try to consider the different stimuli that can dictate their performance and adjust your deployment accordingly. Your Dragon Princes may seem to be foolishly placed behind a forest from your opponent's most precious units, but once the Banner of Ellyrion rears its ugly head and his unit is torn apart, he'll realize just how genius (or diabolical!) you really were.

2.1.4
Understand how your units are going to interact with one another. Phoenix Guard standing side by side with Sword Masters is an obvious Hammer-Anvil setup, while Spear Elves and Ellyrian Reavers is less so. By simply cocking your forward units at an angle (and allowing the flank charge for a rear-ward supporting unit), you set up a nasty line where your opponent has to make some tough decisions.



*2.2 Maneuvering your units*

So, High Elves can move well. And if used together, they can be vicious. But sometimes it comes off as obvious, and can lead to a weakness in your battle plan.

Frankly, the idea with the High Elves, as I've said previously, is to optimize the specialization of your units and combine their strengths with another unit to maximum effect.

This is usually accomplished through setting up your flank charges in some way, or luring units away from their line. There's plenty of ways you can pull this through, so think about it!

I personally like to pair up my units and combo-charge them into relatively isolated units to the front. Often times this works will, though it does tend to thrown those two units off in a random direction. Ideally I'd be able to hit a combat and carry through into a fresh unit to tear it apart, but that's a rarity.
What has worked well for me was a Lion Chariot and a unit of Spear Elves into some weaker units. My troops ran through, and were ready to join in later in the game while being relatively safe from the bulk of the enemy forces. Thankfully War Machines weren't a serious consideration...



*2.3 Terrain*

White Lions are great, since they can move through difficult terrain with ease. This makes them vicious, except against Wood Elves (if I recall...). Just remember to allow them to see the unit you seek to charge once they emerge.

Terrain is often less lovable for your other units (save for the Banner of Ellyrion). You'll have to deeply consider how you intend to cope with that hill in front of your units, or how you'll use that cliff to your advantage. Or the tower where you could park your ten Archers.

Terrain often can provide cover for your units to safely advance along, though it can also deny that oh-so-important Line of Sight, denying crucial charges or attacks in the Shooting or Magic Phase.

... more to come.


*2.4 General Tactics*

I'll use this space as an outline for my previous statements:

-Understand the potential of your units
-Optimize the potential of your units in deployment
-Focus on carrying through a master plan during the movement phase
-Plan ahead, considering the speed at which your forces need to move to succeed


... more to come.


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## The Shadow Veil (Jul 26, 2008)

Firstly, I'd just like to say, great post here, Valor, you've gotten alot of the fundamentals and essentials of HE down, it was about time someone did it.

Secondly, inspired by your post i thought i'd take a few moments to get down some of the assorted pearls of wisdom I've aquired through my years of playing HE, and favour you with a few annecdotes from my battles. I'll keep it brief though, as your doing such a great job here anyway, Valor.

1) General army set up/tactic: I almost always plump for the defensive, magic/infantry heavy HE army. This usually features 2 blocks of spearmen and one of PG. The PG take the centre with the spears to either side, forming the battleline. The PG usually contain the BSB with attle banner banner and take on the foe's toughest unit, either beating it or hoolding long enough for support to arrive. The Spears are each supported by either a small unit of WL or SM, the spears take the charge, often held in place by courage of anearion, the elites counter and kill. 
Several RBT and a unit of archers take a hill at the back of my deployment and bombard.
Shadow warriors marchblock and go mage-hunting.
A unit of Dragon Princes take the banner of Ellyrion and run up one flank, supported by a Dragon Mage. The Mage often peels off elsewhere but when there is strong resistence on the flank this combo rarely fails to see them off.
Archmage with highmagic sits in the middle of the battleline using a combination of the suppoortive and defensive magic.
Obviously the tactic is to destroy the enemy from afar with magic and shooting then take the charges with the infantry block and counter charge with elites. One the whole its a solid plan and rarely fails.

2) My thoughts on some units: 
Spearmen: despite the plethora of elite infantry these guys are still my bread & butter, the mass of attacks can see of most other core choices, and bolstered by a noble with a great weapon they do good damage.

Archers: Not as effective as RBTs but good for guarding a flank or taking out the pesky units that you dont want to waste yout bolt throwers on. I would actually aargue that its worth giving them at least a standard bearer, a unit of ten on a hill with a banner can easily see of units of scouts or fliers, outnumbering, extra rank, a standard and high ground meaning that the foe doesnt get the walkover he was hoping for. This setup actually saved me from the charge of a blackcoach once, he rolled poor impact hits, then my archers went on to kill it.

Shadow Warriors: These guys are very effective, they make great marchblockers and the hatred is exceptionally useful. If u throw in a noble with the armour of scoutiness and a greatweapon you can make for some amusing flank charges. A basic unit of these once flanked a unit of knights of khorne, the champion challenged me, i accepted and killed him with the SW champ, the other SWs went on to kill two more knights, break 'em then catch 'em.

Dragon Princes: Ye gods, they're great...but when i use them, its as though they couldnt hit a barn wall from two foot away, a really big barn wall...

Dragon Mage: This guys is absolutely fantastic, his special rule means i dont need a third mage two get an incredible magic phase and the dragon is great. Obviously dont throw this guy into combat willy nilly, he's not a melee machine, primarily he is a mobile artillery platform, his magic is what will do the damage.But the fliyin g dragon does mean that you have the option to throw a dragon and a mage witha flaming sword into almost any comabt where he's needed. The key is to be aggresive with this character but not foolhardy. Finally, don't underestimate terror, flying around your enemy's lines spaming fireballs, panin tests and terrror tests is highly effective. I once charged a unit of chaos knights with him, they failed their terror and fled of the table, and once a chaos lord, admitedly from the transitionary White dwarf army list, tried to charge him, failed the terror test and, you guessed it, fled off the table. :biggrin:

Thanks for reading and i'm looking forward to more great stuff from you Valor, keep it up.


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## Ascendant Valor (Jan 3, 2009)

3.0 High Elven Magic

Here's what I'll cover here:

3.1 Mages
3.2 Spells
3.3 Magic Items
3.4 General Tactics



*3.1 Mages*

High Elf mages are pretty well rounded. They cost a bit, but they receive a free +1 to Dispel, something that most other armies usually have to buy. High Elf mages also have access to all the Schools of Magic and their own lore High Magic. Hence, it's fairly easy to say that High Elf mages are rounded. Full circle, no?

The problem with High Elf mages is that they're weak. T3, no armor, and they cost an arm and a leg. They need some kind of protection, something that usually isn't easily afforded in such an elitist army as the High Elves. Often times you'll see High Elven mages stuck in Spear Elf, Archer, or Phoenix Guard bunkers. Here they're afforded some respite from being sniped and assassinated, though it's easily worked around. 



*3.2 Spells*

Since High Elf mages have access to all the common Lores of Magic as well as High Magic, I'll be brief here.

It's easy to understand that each Lore can be used to a different effect. We all know the Lore of Metal is great against anything with a high Armor Save, or Lore of Death or Lore of Shadows is good at debuffing enemy units while Lore of Light or Lore of Heavens can buff your own.

High Magic is a bit different. It has a lack of focus, meaning it has buffing spells (Shield of Saphery, Courage of Aenarion), debuffing spells (Vaul's Unmaking, Curse of Arrow Attraction), and damage spells (Fury of Khaine, Flames of the Phoenix). It also comes with the fabled Drain Magic, which tends to neuter magic phases. High Magic is great for high level casters, namely Level 4 Arch Mages and the like, since they'll be able to benefit from the plethora of spell types. Level 2 Mages could get stuck with buffing spells when they need damaging spells, after all.



*3.3 Magic Items*

High Elves have a decent array of magic items, much like every other army. What makes theirs a bit nicer is the costs of common magic items is decreased. 

... more to come.



*3.4 General Tactics*

Since the High Elves are a finesse army, it's important to understand what the crucial spells are and when to try to apply them. There's a lot of factors that go into deciding when and how to go about casting a spell, and it's hard for me to give anyone an idea on how to go about it (or how to counter it in the case of someone opposing the High Elves).

What I can say, though, is that the best times to cast (or try to dispel) High Elven spells is around Turn 3 or Turn 4, maybe even Turn 5. This is because that, more often than not, this is when the High Elves need to hit combat. The spells are meant to help the troops in some way so that their odds of success, or at least holding out in combat, are increased significantly. (Peeling off a rank bonus, reducing the Weapon Skill of a unit, granting a Ward Save are common spells that are needed for the High Elves to succeed.) Turn 6 usually just sees players trying to scrape together as many Victory Points as possible, so it's usually down to denying or attempting those spells that can actually pull that off. Turn 1 and 2 are more about weakening units in general, maybe even creating havoc in the ranks or misleading the opponent. Here, you'll just want to trust your instincts.

Now, remember that not all High Elf builds need to include magic. High Elves are quite capable of producing decent armies that have, at best, a single scroll caddy; these are the armies that will either have Magic Resistance, or will suffer to enemy magic. Wink wink. Regardless, such a dislocation in magic will usually mean that the other phases of the game for the High Elves are significantly more potent.


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## Ascendant Valor (Jan 3, 2009)

4.0 High Elven Shooting

Here's what I'll cover here:

4.1 Shooters
4.2 Deployment, Movement
4.3 General Tactics



*4.1 Shooters*

The High Elves have a variety of shooters, all with decent Ballistics Skills but with average weaponry.

_High Elf Prince, Noble_
They're probably the scariest shooters, since they can have a potent magical bow and ride a fast moving mount at the same time. If this is the case, though, they will usually be a one-trick pony or they will be a points sink. They will likely target War Machines and lone Characters, or may opt for a Flank Charge or harrying units. To shut them up, shoot them down.



_Archers, Lothern Sea Guard_
These guys are about average. They have Ballistics Skill of 4, making them average for an Elf but above average otherwise. They'll have a tendency to hit things, but wounding is more difficult. Strength 3 bows aren't too dangerous, and getting massed missile batteries from High Elves is not easy (and would be quite laughable!). Still, they can be dangerous to Horde Armies; low T and low AS can mean a decent number of casualties from High Elven Archers. They should focus on helping out their own units though, March Blockers and Harriers are usually the best targets. Oddly enough, Fast Movers are more than capable of dealing with Archers, but not so much LSG. They may not even be worth taking down.


_Shadow Warriors_
Picture these guys as beefed up Archers. They have S3 bows, but are BS5 (if I recall). They are usually seen as disruptors, and nothing more. Since I'm not familiar enough with them, I'll keep it short.


_Ellyrian Reavers_
These guys can be formidable with the average bows. They're typical Fast Cavalry, but they are good at it. The best bet to take them down is to just shoot them, since they'll be targeting flanks and War Machines.


_Repeater Bolt Throwers_
These are the ones to really watch out for during the Shooting Phase. A battery of RBTs can just as easily whittle down any Rank and File infantry as they can topple a Dragon Ogre Shaggoth in a single turn (ideally). Either stay out of sight or take them down, but don't expect them to be nice to your troops!


*4.2 Deployment, Movement*

Deploying on hills is obvious. There's usually no reason to hide that fact either, unless a greater scheme is afoot. Deploying a unit of Archers on a Hill right off the bat is a good way to tell the opposing player to anticipate a RBT to show up adjacent to the Archers and to avoid that lane of fire at all costs. Such a process could also lend to dictating your opponent's movement at the same time. Nifty, eh?

As for movement, it's usually best for the Shooters to focus on supporting the rest of the army in whatever way they can. Archers and RBTs will likely stay within the deployment zone while LSG, Ellyrian Reavers and Shadow Warriors can move around and harass anything they can find.



*4.3 General Tactics*
High Elven shooting is usually left as supplementary to the rest of the army at hand, so they'll likely be weakening key combat units for the High Elf infantry to engage with and finish off. That said, they should focus on weakening those key units as early as possible. Once that directive is taken care of, they should move on to weakening other units until the game is about up. At that point, they can start to mop up units to get some cheap victory points.


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## Ascendant Valor (Jan 3, 2009)

5.0 High Elven Combat

Here's what I'll cover here:

5.1 Specialization
5.2 Challenges
5.3 Ideal Roles
5.4 General Tactics



*5.1 Specialization*

High Elves are considered a finesse army because each unit is more or less specialized, having a specific function(s) in which to perform in order for the greater part of the army to succeed.

White Lions, for instance, are great Can Openers; they love to crack open thick armor. Sword Masters are more for taking down any of the weaker units with stylish and enviable ease. Phoenix Guard are great at withstanding anything. Dragon Princes can maul most opponent's units, while Silver Helms are good at flank support and flank protection.

Obviously, none of this is written in stone. It's easy to make any High Elf unit fulfill the typical role of another unit. Not many units can stick around as well as Phoenix Guard, but White Lions will likely not run away nor will Cavalry be wounded!



*5.2 Challenges*

Challenges are a major part of High Elven combat. They should be carefully considered before accepting or issuing.

I like to consider the effects of losing my issuer in combat while negating an enemy character or champion. How about this example: I have a unit of Spear Elves with a full command versus a unit of Warriors of Chaos with an Exalted Champion with a boatload of attacks. I'd rather see my Champion get cut down before I see the rest of my unit get thrashed by a single character, so I'd accept his challenge (just so long as it's not with the unit champion).

When able to issue a challenge, consider that you'll lose that character's fighting prowess from your RnF troops. Unless you're dealing with Sword Masters you'll likely miss those extra high WS and S attacks! If it means negating a tough Character, though, I'd go for it. Typically.



*5.3 Ideal Roles*

This goes more in line with the Specializations. As I had stated, each unit has a certain role while being able to apply itself to a series of other uses as well. Here's a list of potentialities:

Anvil Units:
-Phoenix Guard (ideal)
-White Lions, Spear Elves (with Character support), Silver Helms

Hammer Units:
-Chariots, Sword Masters, White Lions, Cavalry (ideals)
-Phoenix Guard, Ellyrian Reavers, Spear Elves

Flank Units:
-Cavalry, Chariots
-Any

Shock Units (break in a turn)
-Chariots, Cavalry (ideal)
-Spear Elves, Phoenix Guard, Sword Masters

Again, these are just my opinions. Be creative and figure out what works for you!



*5.4 General Tactics*

This is where the High Elves thrive. Sword Masters are born for Combat, and have earned a reputation that seats them next to any Demons of Chaos for raw power and potency.

The main idea with any combat is to stack the odds in your favor. With High Elves, a good frontal Charge and a Flank Charge are usually all it takes to win just about any combat. For every combat, though, be sure to weigh the odds and understand that things may not work as well as you should like. Dragon Princes don't like being stuck with a never-ending unit of Zombies, after all.


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## Duke Vorian (Jun 21, 2008)

Sorry if this is the wrong section but I figure this thread is for offering and asking for tactics when using HE. One army that is just nasty out right is a maxed out Stegadon list with a couple (maybe a few) Engines of the Gods. How do you combat this with HE?

Also, while I'm here: Ring of Hotek and VC in general


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## Ascendant Valor (Jan 3, 2009)

Duke Vorian said:


> Sorry if this is the wrong section but I figure this thread is for offering and asking for tactics when using HE. One army that is just nasty out right is a maxed out Stegadon list with a couple (maybe a few) Engines of the Gods. How do you combat this with HE?
> 
> Also, while I'm here: Ring of Hotek and VC in general


As for any hard-core monsters:
RBTs for the win!

If you're toting a strong magic phase, Curse of Arrow Attraction should offer significant help for taking down those pesky monsters. A S6 bolt offering D3 wounds is nothing to take lightly. Otherwise, BS4 is still stable enough to help out considerably.

If Shooting isn't your gig, then I would then suggest some White Lions or Sword Masters of Hoeth. They offer high Strength attacks that ASF (after impact hits, unfortunately). With that said, they should hopefully deal with most heavy beasties.

If regeneration is a problem, bring along Tyrion. His flaming attacks should make short work of anything too nasty. If that's not a possibility, opt for some magical support. Lore of Fire should render some use, then close in with the elite infantry of the High Elves.

Then, there's always the Dragon Prince unit with a Noble carrying the Battle Standard, specifically the Battle Banner. With a high damage output and enough Static Combat Resolution from the Battle Banner and BSB, you're talking a true power house.

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High Elves aren't known for their spam defense. The +1 to Dispel isn't spectacular, nor is the total number of dispel dice that the High Elves can generate. You'll just have to be sure to weigh the impact of the spells being cast. If that's the case, do consider that Movement is the High Elves (or any Elves) strong suit. If your High Elves cannot out-maneuver the enemy, you're at a significant disadvantage. Be sure to stop those spells that reduce or negate the strong movement of the High Elves.

From there, I can only say that you'll just have to be very careful and judicious in your use of Dispel dice. That Van Hels' Danse may seem rough by putting the Blood Knights so close to your infantry, but is it any worse than making that puny Skeleton unit a force to be reckoned with? The key is: know what will impact your ideal battle plan, and respond accordingly.

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If you'd like, DV, fill us in on any situations you've come across in your battles that have caused you fear or doubt. There's plenty of experience to go around from the trials and errors of all the Heretics here to benefit you, DV, and anyone else in your situation!

I hope that offers some light, and I look forward to hearing some input! :victory:


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