# Stasis Field on an injured Horus on Davin



## waltzmelancholy_07 (Sep 30, 2008)

Ok this was mentioned in False Gods... 

That the group of Abaddon brought the Warmaster to Davin in a stasis field to keep him alive before they gave him to the Serpent Lodge...

My question is... Why didn't they brought him instead to Terra?... If the stasis field does keep Horus from dying...

I mean haven't the Ultramarines done the same thing?... Guiliman was fatally wounded by his brother and his sons placed him inside a stasis field to keep him from dying....

And lo, ten thousand years later, he's still alive, though an inch from death.

Why did the Sons of Horus not think about this?... Keep him alive, though barely, whilst they travel to Terra where the Emperor could have saved him.

Can someone illuminate me?...

Tnx!... Cheers!....


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## Rems (Jun 20, 2011)

Plot necessity. 

That aside i doubt Abaddon et al were thinking very clearly at this point. It was the closest a primarch had ever been to death, and whats more it was the greatest primarch. Something like this had never happened before, the thought of primarch dying was unthinkable. The whole legion was distraught and thrown into disarray. Bringing his body back they cut through a crowd of civilians after all. Indeed the fact they were willing to turn to Erebus and superstition, going against everything they had been tought and previously believed shows the frame of mind they were in.


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## Angel of Blood (Aug 18, 2010)

Just for reference, Guilliman is in actual fact dead, not on the brink.


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## Over Two Meters Tall! (Nov 1, 2010)

I would also add that the 63rd Expedition was waaaaay out on the edge of known space and having to travel several months through the warp to get back to Terra probably wouldn't have come to mind... or they thought it would have taken too long.

While Guillaumin's death was an inevitability without the statis field, I didn't think it was a 'already' done and gone.  Is this fluff fact from one of the codex?


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## Angel of Blood (Aug 18, 2010)

Space marine codex specifically refers to him as a corpse and dead.


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## Lux (Apr 17, 2010)

It does not in any way mention him as a corpse, nor does it state in any line he is dead.

What it does say is this "Upon the moment of demise, he was entered into Stasis".

In his dying moment he was put in stasis, when the apothacaries could no longer aid him and they had run out of time.

So yes....he is alive...currently locked in the moment of dying though, but alive....none the less...


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## scscofield (May 23, 2011)

Page 15 of the current codex, in the box about the shrine 'and upon that throne sits a regal corpse. Though the best part of ten thousand years have passed since his death, the Primarch's body is perfectly preserved. Even his death wounds are visible upon his throat.' 


He is dead Jim......


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## Warlock in Training (Jun 10, 2008)

Angel of Blood said:


> Just for reference, Guilliman is in actual fact dead, not on the brink.


*Correct*



Over Two Meters Tall! said:


> While Guillaumin's death was an inevitability without the statis field, I didn't think it was a 'already' done and gone. Is this fluff fact from one of the codex?


*Yes*



Angel of Blood said:


> Space marine codex specifically refers to him as a corpse and dead.


*Correct*



Lux said:


> It does not in any way mention him as a corpse, nor does it state in any line he is dead.
> 
> What it does say is this "Upon the moment of demise, he was entered into Stasis".
> 
> ...


*Incorrect and your wrong*



scscofield said:


> Page 15 of the current codex, in the box about the shrine 'and upon that throne sits a regal corpse. Though the best part of ten thousand years have passed since his death, the Primarch's body is perfectly preserved. Even his death wounds are visible upon his throat.'
> 
> 
> He is dead Jim......


*Bingo*


So in answere to your question the reason they didnt keep him in the stasis feild is beacuase he would end up like Guilliman in the end.


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## Lux (Apr 17, 2010)

Warlock in training....correction if I am mistaken...but in other sources it directly states they put the ultramarines primarch into stasis on the verge of death, specifically in his dying moment.

Thus there is a contradiction in varying fluff sources.

Additionally though the newest UM codex describes their primarch as a corpse, it can be interpreted as a figure of speech, or shall I take that the Emperor is dead, since he is plainly labeled as a corpse upon a throne, the corpse god even.

As far as I know, the canon stance is that the UM primarch is alive, forever frozen in temporal stasis on the verge of death, frozen during his dying moment.


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## scscofield (May 23, 2011)

Usually the most current 'fluff' would be what you base your input on. Much like the most current rules are in effect for the game itself. The Emp is not in a status field, and the only thing keeping his 'soul/mental state' in place is the golden throne. The body in many of the pics floating around is a skeletal corpse (its decayed to the point its pretty much a mummy) strapped to a machine. The UM Primarch is a dead body held in a status field so it does not rot.
_
If you want to get all technical on the Emp's status, at this point I would not be shocked if it was actually a demon sitting in that spot. Every year it is fed a whole pile of psykers, pretty plush job considering all he has do is be a giant psychic compass point. (this statement is my personal thought on the matter and has no real fluff or fact to back it)_


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## Warlock in Training (Jun 10, 2008)

Lux said:


> Warlock in training....correction if I am mistaken...but in other sources it directly states they put the ultramarines primarch into stasis on the verge of death, specifically in his dying moment.
> 
> Thus there is a contradiction in varying fluff sources.
> 
> ...


The SM Codex states hes dead. Also the TWO Ultramarines Omnibus make mentions of Guilliman being Dead and how interesting it is of the Pilgrims to act like silly twats of Guilliman coming back. The Stasis Field is their to preserve his body and that only.


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## Rems (Jun 20, 2011)

Warlock in Training said:


> *Correct*
> So in answere to your question the reason they didnt keep him in the stasis feild is beacuase he would end up like Guilliman in the end.


No, he would not have ended up like Guilliman. A statis field completely stops time within it. Horus being sick and slowly dying would have been preserved in that state had he been kept in the statis field. He would not be dead if they took him out. Guilliman is in the state he is in because thats when they put him in his field.


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## Warlock in Training (Jun 10, 2008)

He would be dead. Nothing would have saved him. Or you _could_ leave him alive in stasis forever. Nice picks.


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## Rems (Jun 20, 2011)

Your presuming that the Emperor would be unable to save Horus then? i would think that if anyone could it would be the Emperor,l either though his unparalleled understanding of Primarch physiology and biology in general or his psychic abilities.


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## scscofield (May 23, 2011)

I think the whole, far side of the universe, freaking the fuck out legion covers why the Emp didn't get a shot.


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## Malus Darkblade (Jan 8, 2010)

Distance wasn't the issue, especially when they could just freeze him in place using stasis technology but like others have said, they panicked and wanted to try anything in the immediate vicinity.


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## kickboxerdog (Jun 2, 2011)

wasnt it all to do with the lodges aswell, wanting to keep it all in house and also you had erburus manipulating things in the shadows, wasnt it his idea to try the ritural to bring horus back


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## Malus Darkblade (Jan 8, 2010)

It was his idea but it was probably mostly the legion's fear and panicky emotions that led to them accepting Erebus's idea. I doubt they would have if their minds were not clouded.


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## kickboxerdog (Jun 2, 2011)

i think all in all it was a very well thought out plan by chaos , well planted and exacuted.


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## Warlock in Training (Jun 10, 2008)

Rems said:


> Your presuming that the Emperor would be unable to save Horus then? i would think that if anyone could it would be the Emperor,l either though his unparalleled understanding of Primarch physiology and biology in general or his psychic abilities.


My thoughts. 

1) The Astartes and defiantly the Primarchs DID NOT view their father as a God or some magical miracle worker. He was a brilliant powerful Psyker. Nothing more and the Primarchs/Astartes knew this!

2) Even during the Great Crusade Horus and his Legion (As well as many others Legion/Primarchs) was under the impression the Warp was a very big unknown. See Horus Rising.

3) The Legion was offered a possibility of saving him and was close by without risking the Primarchs life by getting lost in the Warp from a Long Journey.

Three reasons why they made their choice and not the Emperor. The Emperor was not a guarantee life saver, they had no clue what they were dealing with and panicked, and finally they would be risking Horus life (whether he was in Stasis or not) by making a long Warp Jump to Terra and never reaching their destination all the while a immediate closer location might help him just the same.

So with this in mind its completely reasonable that they chose to forget the overrated Emperor and turn to the Lodges.


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## Deadeye776 (May 26, 2011)

Why didn't they bring him back to Terra? Because Chaos (like everything that happened since the Primarchs were stolen from Terra) had outmanuevered the loyalists again. Why go all the way to terra when these guys say they can fix him right here.Your distraught and in pain? Don't worry pal we'll have him as good as new in no time and you won't have to bother your Emperor.It was all apart of the Ruinous Ones plans.Get him nice and diseased (Nurgle),make the marines desparate (Sons of Horus),then offer salvation and while they fix him turn him (Chaos Gods). The Gods wanted to make sure Horus became more and more estranged from the Imperium before they got to him. Like a husband hearing his estranged wife he hasn't seen in years is a gutter whore.


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## shaantitus (Aug 3, 2009)

On the subject of the stasis field. Someone hs mentioned previously in this thread that a stasis field stops time completely. Now I am sure that i have read somewhere (but cannot remember where) that a stasis field slows time to a crawl. Has anyone else read this? Sources? If they do merely slow time rathere than stop it then that would change things a little.


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## BLvice (Mar 20, 2009)

Shaantitus, you are correct. A stasis field does not stop time entirely. However, if I am understanding this correctly, even 10,000 years in stasis would amount to little more than millionths of a second or even millisecond. The rate of time in which events occur in stasis are ridiculously slow. 

On another note, the emperor could have easily saved Horus had the Sons of Horus decided to transport him back to Terra. Their own emotions were played upon, causing them to make the choices they did. The thought of their own primarch being laid low, the primarch of the famed and superior Luna Wolves, wounded their pride considerably. It is no wonder they allowed themselves to be manipulated in the way in which they did.


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## 777swappamag777 (Jul 15, 2011)

alright the ultramarines keep him in stasis field deat but so he cannot rot and so he will ever be an reminder of sacrifice and the reason to repent in past sins and to always belive in the god emporer and stand against his enemys and that you will be rewarded by him in the end :biggrin:


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## BlackGuard (Sep 10, 2010)

If Games Workshop had hired me to deal with this -- I'd have let them bring Horus back to the Emperor. Only for him to realize what had happened to him, and kill Horus himself -- thus putting the Sons of Horus on a road of revenge, setting off the Heresy that way. As brothers are torn between supporting their father whom killed their brother, or killing their father for killing Horus in a bought of vanity.

That would have been far more interesting to me. But meh.


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## Rems (Jun 20, 2011)

Warlock in Training said:


> My thoughts.
> 
> 1) The Astartes and defiantly the Primarchs DID NOT view their father as a God or some magical miracle worker. He was a brilliant powerful Psyker. Nothing more and the Primarchs/Astartes knew this!
> 
> ...


This is pretty much what i was saying before. That is is entirely understandable why they didn't keep Horus in a stasis field and take him back to Terra. I merely said that they could have, but were in the wrong state of mind to, which was the point we were debating over. You made the assertion that putting Horus in a stasis field would not have worked period and he would have turned out like Guilliman.


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## Warlock in Training (Jun 10, 2008)

Rems said:


> This is pretty much what i was saying before. That is is entirely understandable why they didn't keep Horus in a stasis field and take him back to Terra. I merely said that they could have, but were in the wrong state of mind to, which was the point we were debating over. You made the assertion that putting Horus in a stasis field would not have worked period and he would have turned out like Guilliman.


Yes, the Stasis field would have froze Horus in his state of dying indefinatly. However he would have been a Guilliman (a LIVE version) if they did that.


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## MontytheMighty (Jul 21, 2009)

Lux said:


> Thus there is a contradiction in varying fluff sources





Warlock in Training said:


> *Incorrect and your wrong*


I think everyone should just list/cite a bunch of quotes to support his position
and then we can decide which side has the weight of the evidence


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## Child-of-the-Emperor (Feb 22, 2009)

IIRC the reason Horus was treated on Davin (rather than shipped to Terra) was due to the influence of the lodges/Erebus and to avoid the sheer amount of widespread panic and fear (and perhaps even rebellion?) that would have spread throughout the Imperium if it was learnt Horus had been felled.


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## Sephyr (Jan 18, 2010)

I still don't quite see how even lodge members would favor a completely unknown near-human small moon settlement over the Emperor. In the books, even the corrupted half of the Mournival was having a hard time coming around to that plan and Erebus had to really push it. 

The stasis thing is a bit of a hole in the books, I think. Even a long trip to get treatment from a beloved and familiar powerful figure would be better than a long shot with primitive witch doctors. If I was the writer, I'd at least have resorted to some technical difficulty, such as stasis fields becoming unstable during long warp-travel (it makes sense in a way, since perfect order (zero decay) should not exist in the dimension of pure change and possibility.


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## SoulGazer (Jun 14, 2009)

Even regular humans IRL can be revived from death after a minute or two has passed. So long as the brain doesn't die from lack of oxygen, being dead for a few minutes is medically possible.

Yes, Guilliman is dead. The Emperor is also dead. The Warp, however, really doesn't give two craps what the state of one's physical body is. Big E's soul is still alive and anchored to Terra via the Golden Throne, thus at some point he may be able to be revived after ten thousand years of being fed psyker souls and the prayers of countless trillions. 

When he gets up, being powerful to a godly level, if not a new warp god entirely, I have no doubt what so ever that he will be able to easily revive and heal Guilliman, who is far beyond a regular human.

So in all honesty, both debates are moot points. They're dead, but they probably won't stay that way. 

OT: Because the Primarchs and the Astartes were man children. Beings born into great power who hadn't had the experiences to give them any sort of great wisdom. Thus, they screwed up just like any other child would who didn't know any better. Also lolChaos.


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