# Question re: Chaos Marine Terminators



## Optimus (Dec 26, 2014)

Hi everyone, I have this question, there's no right or wrong answer, that's caused a bit of a debate with me and my friends recently.

Chaos Marine Terminators, T4, 2+ save, 5+ Invulnerable

To help them last longer/be more durable would you give them 
a) Mark of Nurgle to make them T5, 2+ save, 5+ Invuln or 
b) Mark of Tzeentch to make them T4, 2+ save 4+ Invuln?


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## Vaz (Mar 19, 2008)

Depends.

Mark of Nurgle is more resilient vs AP3, S6 or lower weapons. Mark of Tzeentch is more useful if you're facing lots of AP2.

The truth is, they don't become especially more resilient either way. A 50% chance to save against a S10 AP2 Vindicator shot or S7 AP2 Plasma fire is better than a 33% chance to save, sure. But it's not going to turn it into something that can reliably tank hits - you're still on the bad side of the RNG.


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## darkreever (Apr 3, 2008)

Between the two, I would choose mark of Nurgle. The boost in toughness is good at wasting small arms fire and regular close combat attacks.


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## Mossy Toes (Jun 8, 2009)

Tzeentch. Not only is it cheaper, but Termis already specialize in surviving small arms fire... and most stuff that's AP2 or lower is high enough Strength that the shift from T4 to T5 is negligible. Basically: MoN helps them survive what Termis are already designed to survive, while MoT helps them survive attacks designed to kill Termis.


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## Nordicus (May 3, 2013)

Mossy Toes said:


> Tzeentch. Not only is it cheaper, but Termis already specialize in surviving small arms fire... and most stuff that's AP2 or lower is high enough Strength that the shift from T4 to T5 is negligible. Basically: MoN helps them survive what Termis are already designed to survive, while MoT helps them survive attacks designed to kill Termis.


This. If I finally decide to use Chaos Termies one day, I would most likely always run them as Tzeentch.


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## Creon (Mar 5, 2009)

It depends on your enemy's anti-terminator tactics. If your enemy is counting on lots of STR:3/4 fire or HTH wounds to give you many save attempts, use Nurgle, as it cuts down the number of saves. If he counts on ap:2 weaponry, use the Tzeentch mark.


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## Gret79 (May 11, 2012)

I know its not a choice offered, but I've found slaanesh to be best so far. 2+,5++, 5+ fnp with enough maces to use the init 5...

If I had to go tzeentch or nurgle, then I'd go nurgle. Iirc, you don't lose t5 if you lose the banner whereas the 4++ goes if the bearer gets taken out.


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## venomlust (Feb 9, 2010)

The mark of Tzeentch is what gives them the 4++, not the lame banner (fortunately).


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## Gret79 (May 11, 2012)

venomlust said:


> The mark of Tzeentch is what gives them the 4++, not the lame banner (fortunately).


Cheers 
I've completely forgotten what the banner of tzeentch does in that case


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## Squire (Jan 15, 2013)

I'd take tzeentch for the reasons given, but for me preferable to both tzeentch and nurgle would be adding an extra unmarked terminator. Obviously with a unit of five in a land raider that isn't possible and a unit of three taking a defensive mark is much cheaper than adding a fourth termie, but in other cases I'd just have a standard axe/combi bolter term. 

But anyway, between nurgle and tzeentch I'd go tzeentch


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## Chaos40kAD (Apr 25, 2009)

Yes, I agree Tzeentch is the way to go in my opinion. Cheaper, and as others have stated ends up saving more wounds.

-Brett


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## Dallas_Drake (Jan 26, 2009)

Optimus said:


> Hi everyone, I have this question, there's no right or wrong answer, that's caused a bit of a debate with me and my friends recently.
> 
> Chaos Marine Terminators, T4, 2+ save, 5+ Invulnerable
> 
> ...


c) More bodies? They are pretty cheap without upgrades so a few extra 2+ wounds isn't bad if you are running them on foot.

However, I'd say Tzeentch as most above have said, it gives you a 4++ against AP2. That said, T4 is not great when you have a blob of guard unloading first rank/second rank fire on you.


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## neferhet (Oct 24, 2012)

Mossy Toes said:


> Tzeentch. Not only is it cheaper, but Termis already specialize in surviving small arms fire... and most stuff that's AP2 or lower is high enough Strength that the shift from T4 to T5 is negligible. Basically: MoN helps them survive what Termis are already designed to survive, while MoT helps them survive attacks designed to kill Termis.


This. Altough i prefer unmarked terminators or slaanesh + banner if feeling kinky


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## Optimus (Dec 26, 2014)

The most expensive, though possible way I've thought of, is make them Mark of Slaanesh and give them the Icon of Excess. That would then also give Abaddon a FnP roll as well, if he was part of the unit...


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## MidnightSun (Feb 10, 2009)

The only real way I'd run them would be in small groups with Combi-Weapons, to be honest, but if I wanted a big unit I'd definitely go Mark of Nurgle with Axes or Mark of Slaanesh with Claws. As a Deathwing and subsequently Grey Knight player, I must say the usual way I lose Terminators is from massed small arms, not from AP2.


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