# Gunslinger



## Hessian813 (Nov 8, 2011)

I was thumbing through the BRB and stumbled across the gunslinger rule. Im wondering if anyone had kitted out there capt., Sargent, or vets with a pair of infernus pistols(for the other blood angel players) or plasma pistols.

If you have how did it work out?


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## mmcneely (Jan 6, 2013)

I haven't tried it yet, but it does look cool. I've noticed that the Honor Gaurd can take dual plasma rifles... maybe broken, but I'm gonna try it out before they "fix" it.

Having dual pistols of some kind, does that give you +2 CC attacks?


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## HOGGLORD (Jan 25, 2012)

I think it just counts as an additional CC weapon, you can only use two hands after all. _Very_ fun with Wolf Guard Battle Leader & duel plasma pistols. Scares the living crap out of termie squads.


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## iamtheeviltwin (Nov 12, 2012)

I usually run a few of my Vanguard vets with dual pistols. My five man unit has 2 PlasPis/BoltPis and a 2xPlasPis sgt. Gives me 4 plasma shots before charging anything. The other two are geared for assault. A plasma/bolt pistol troop is the same cost as a CCW/plasma pistol, performs the same in assault, but has a small added functionality in shooting.

I think you can run some of the Sisters of Battle as 2x Hand flamers....which is a bit frightening.


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## ntaw (Jul 20, 2012)

iamtheeviltwin said:


> I think you can run some of the Sisters of Battle as 2x Hand flamers....which is a bit frightening.


Oh no!! Purifying fire!!! That's S3 AP6 :biggrin:

BA can use these as well....they're a cooler idea than of much real use unless you're specifically playing against a horde army and need lots of hits. I've proxied them in a bunch of times 'cuz I think they are really cool, but they've never worked out.


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## MidnightSun (Feb 10, 2009)

They're pretty awful. You pay twice the price of a Plasma Gun for 1 less shot at long range and the ability to assault after shooting. 30pts for 2 Plasma Shots is not ever worth it. Plasma Pistols are pretty bad on their own, and buying twice as many doesn't make them better.

Midnight


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## Necrosis (Nov 1, 2008)

ntaw said:


> Oh no!! Purifying fire!!! That's S3 AP6 :biggrin:
> 
> BA can use these as well....they're a cooler idea than of much real use unless you're specifically playing against a horde army and need lots of hits. I've proxied them in a bunch of times 'cuz I think they are really cool, but they've never worked out.


But blood angels can't make them reroll failed to wound and that's what makes it scary.


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## ntaw (Jul 20, 2012)

Though that does make a slight difference, they're still a little too particular for my liking.


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## Necrosis (Nov 1, 2008)

Two Hand Flamers rerolling failed to wound will kill more marines then a rending heavy flamer.


Two Hand Flamers rerolling failed to wound


> *Shooting*
> 
> *Attacker Group 1 vs Defender Group*
> 
> ...


Rending Heavy Flamer



> *Shooting*
> 
> *Attacker Group 1 vs Defender Group*
> 
> ...


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## Suijin (Aug 11, 2011)

Necrosis said:


> Two Hand Flamers rerolling failed to wound will kill more marines then a rending heavy flamer.
> 
> 
> Two Hand Flamers rerolling failed to wound
> ...


So they are pretty close to even, but you pay an extra 23 points for that slight advantage and heavy flamers aren't even cheap either (meaning that paying 23 extra points over something that is already overpriced is kinda bad).

You can buy almost 4 Seraphim with 2xbolt pistols for the same price and they will kill more MEQ and have 4 bodies/wounds to your 1 with a slightly greater range, although no wall of death if you get charged.

If you want to make yourself cry compare them to a GK purgatation squad member with an incinerator. Sure you still don't get quite as many wounds as the 2xhand flamers TL, but you are paying 40% the amount of points.


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## darkreever (Apr 3, 2008)

Yeah, Necrosis you do realize those numbers do not actually help you right?

With half as many shots the rending heavy flamer caused nearly as many wounds. 2 from the heavy flamer vs the 2.2 from the hand flamers does not favour the hand flamers.


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## Necrosis (Nov 1, 2008)

A heavy flamer will only get half as many shot as two hand flamers cause it only has one template. Even if its a slight advange how many heavy flamers have the rending rule? Two hand flamers cost just the same amount of points as a heavy flamer.

@Suijin: Your first two points aren't making sense to me. A seraphim with a hand flamer cost 35 points while 4 seraphims cost 60 points. Also let's compare 4 seraphims with bolt pistols to a two hand flamers:


4 Seraphims with bolt pistols


> *Shooting*
> 
> *Attacker Group 1 vs Defender Group*
> 
> ...





As for the Grey Knight Purgation Squad if your taking incinerators that means your not making use of their astral aim and your using a heavy support squad. Not to menition their not as manuverable. But I think were going off topic. My orginal point was that Seraphims with duel hand flamers are very good. Two S3 AP6 flame templates that reroll failed to wound is not to laugh at.


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## Suijin (Aug 11, 2011)

Necrosis said:


> A heavy flamer will only get half as many shot as two hand flamers cause it only has one template. Even if its a slight advange how many heavy flamers have the rending rule? Two hand flamers cost just the same amount of points as a heavy flamer.
> 
> @Suijin: Your first two points aren't making sense to me. A seraphim with a hand flamer cost 35 points while 4 seraphims cost 60 points. Also let's compare 4 seraphims with bolt pistols to a two hand flamers:
> 
> ...


Bleh, brain fart on my part, and copy/paste error. 

Redoing the comparison: A Dominion with a regular flamer comes out about 0.19 wounds/point while the Seraphim get about 0.17 wounds/point. This is somewhat variable based on how many models you can actually hit in a game (those numbers are for 6 hits with each template against T4, so 6 hits with Dominion and 12 hits with Seraphim). A basic trooper with a regular flamer gets 0.18 wounds/point and Seraphim with 2x bolt pistol get 0.15 wounds/point. The GK Purgatation get 0.25 wounds/point for comparison, and heavy flamer SoB gets 0.13 wounds per point.

So you can see that on a points basis most things work out fairly well by GW, except for heavy flamers end up being pretty low.

As far as the Purgatation squads, people sometimes recommend taking Retributors with heavy flamers to get the rending heavy flamers. Comparing to the Purgatation squads probably isn't fair to really compare price-wise to other codices.


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## Magpie_Oz (Jan 16, 2012)

Just a note?

A Purgation squad with Incinerators and Astral Aim is an excellent tool against an emplaced enemy. You can shoot through walls without worrying about the cover save.


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