# Abbadon vs. Mephiston and other close matches



## Sephyr (Jan 18, 2010)

Abbadon the 13-times loser may run up the points, but he is also absurdly killy, what with his amazing stats, potential oodles of s8 attacks at I6 and so on. But after finally checking out the new Blood Angels codex, I think we can say his title at the top of the HQ pack is under direct assault. 

Has anyone seen these two face each other on the field yet? What were the results?

On that note, what other IC's do you think make a particularly bloody and even match, stats and play-wise?


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## fishywinkles (Nov 8, 2009)

Honestly I don't think you need to actually see Abaddon and Mephiston face off to know that Abaddon is going to be walking away at the end from a pile of red armor and some chopped up bits of meat. 

Seriously though, Mephiston is good but Abaddon is pretty damn killy. Mephiston would really need to rely on his psychic powers during this fight otherwise he is pretty much dead, not to mention his force weapon will do nothing. Though with that being said Chaos don't have any psychic defence so Mephiston just has to hope he take Abbadon down in the first round. However he would have a harder time against Lelith Hesperax or an Archon (both of whom admittedly seem designed for dueling other characters), simply due to his lack of an invulnerable save and the fact that they will have one that is 2+, but then it's all over if they fail it.

In my opinion Mephiston isn't really a character for duelling other insanely killy characters (well maybe except C'tan), but more for almost completely annihilating units by himself.

Though one close match I would throw out there would be the Nightbringer versus The Swarmlord. Sure the Swarmlord needs 6's to wound but if he manages it the Nightbringer has to pass his 4+ invulnerable while re-rolling if successful or just die outright, not to mention this all happens before the Nightringer gets to swing his scythe around. Also with the Swarmlords T6 he will be able to stick around after taking one wound from the Nightbringer's S10 attacks.

On the other hand though, this is the Nightbringer. He has enough attacks to potentially kill the Swarmlord right after the Swarmlord attacks (with decent rolls of course) and laughs at the Swarmlords invulnerable save while he does it.

Though I could be completely wrong about everything. :fool:


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## darklove (May 7, 2008)

The C'tan are definitely very dangerous in CC, especially vs single model units. Not that long ago someone fielded Abaddon against one of my Necron armies and there was a showdown with the Deceiver. Abaddon charged and had a lot of attacks, as you would expect, but it was the Deceiver that won. Wounding on 2+ and ignoring all saves has its advantages.

Abaddon is very killy, but don't overestimate his abilities.


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## shas'o Thraka (Jan 4, 2010)

I agree about Mephiston, he isn't that good against named characters, he can hold his own against other hqs,

But his real awesomeness is against elite squads, *cough* Emperor's champion + chapter master + honour guard *cough*


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## Chumbalaya (May 17, 2010)

Chaos has no psychic defense, Mephiston has fleet and wings, Abby walks.

No contest.


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## mcmuffin (Mar 1, 2009)

with S10 and toughness 8, i dont think that much can stand in the way of the C'tan. Abaddon is the daddy of HQ, although he is still underpowered for what he is supposed to be. mephiston is not an EW, but with T6, he cant be ID'd by abaddon. mephy has a possible 6 attacks while abby could have 11 depending on charge, hitting on 4s. Abby has re-rolls to wound, and he will not really be effected by transfixing gaze, so mephy wont be re-rolling. now mephy strikes first with 5 pw attacks. 3 hits, 2 wounds. 4+ invul, 1 save. abby is down to 3 wounds. now abby gets....8 attacks. hitting on 4s so 5 hits. wounds on 2+ so 4 wounds re-rolls so there is a 5th wound. no invul save!!!! that is mephy busted to bits.


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## fynn (Sep 19, 2008)

Chumbalaya said:


> Chaos has no psychic defense, Mephiston has fleet and wings, Abby walks.
> 
> No contest.


i dont know i happerly face him with kharn, as he totaly ignors all psychic attacks against him, and if kharn gets the charge................................


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## genesis108 (Jul 29, 2009)

I have actually seen this matchup a few times. Every time Mephiston wiped the floor with Abaddon because 1..he is attacking first, 2 he is re-rolling misses on 5(6 on charge) attacks, and 3, he is hitting at s10. Abaddon has to live through Mephs brutal onslaught first..and as I've seen it, it doesn't happen very often. Meph has ripped him apart and lept away to do more slaughtering in Sanguines name every time.


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## Aramoro (Oct 7, 2009)

Not sure how Meph would kill Abbadon in the first. Meph strikes first, assuming he charged with 6 Attacks, hits on 4+ rerollable so 4 or 5 hits, wound on 2 and Abbadon gets a 4+ invulnerable save. Most likely outcome is 2 wounds. Abbadon gets on average 7 or 8 attacks at Strength 8 so 3 or 4 hits which wound on 2's with re-rolls means 3 or 4 wounds. 

It's unlikely you'll kill each other in the first round of combat then Meph gets a go to murder Abbadon, one less attack so the most likely outcome is 1 wound, putting Abbadon on 1, he then gets a go, Same for him again, most likely outcome is 3 or 4 more wounds meaning a dead Meph. 

Statistically Abbadon should kill Meph every time, but Meph still has a chance as he strike first each round. Abby doesn't get away scott free from the encounter. 

Aramoro


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## Vanchet (Feb 28, 2008)

if Abbadon were to be faing Dante and Mephiston then They would clean him (only cause of the Death mask of sanguinus)


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## Warlock in Training (Jun 10, 2008)

On the Ctan again, Would Typhus using WoC, charge, and wounding with his poison attacks and D6+ Attacks stand no chance against the Deacever. Do Ctan have Eternal Warrior?


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## Chumbalaya (May 17, 2010)

Kharn walks and has a crappy invul, Mephiston messes him up (he's immune to psychic attacks, but Mephy's re-rolls aren't attacks).

Deceiver can jump out of combat to avoid assaults. C'tan are indeed Eternal Warriors.


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## fishywinkles (Nov 8, 2009)

C'tan are NOT eternal warriors. One little force weapon and thats it. However the trouble is wounding them to begin with to actually use the force weapon, except for Mephiston and his cheesy S10.

The only time C'tan are immune to instant death are vs. wraithcannons but in that case they don't get their invulnerable.


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## fynn (Sep 19, 2008)

kharn may walk in games you faced him, but he never does when i field him


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## Warlock in Training (Jun 10, 2008)

fishywinkles said:


> C'tan are NOT eternal warriors. One little force weapon and thats it. However the trouble is wounding them to begin with to actually use the force weapon, except for Mephiston and his cheesy S10.
> 
> The only time C'tan are immune to instant death are vs. wraithcannons but in that case they don't get their invulnerable.


So Typhus strolls in and uses his 3 attacks or whatever +D6 and wounds with his poison, then auto passes a Psy check = dead Ctan. I like it.


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## Aramoro (Oct 7, 2009)

Well not against the Deceiver who just runs away. 

Typhus only Auto-passes tests using his two powers not his Force Weapon so he has to take the test.

So against the Night Bringer he'll get on average 6.5 attacks. Hit with 3.75, wound with ~2 and the Night Bringers get 4+ invulnerable. If he fails that then you get to make a Physic Check to Instant death him. 

the Nightbringer strikes second if he get a chance 5 attacks, hitting on 3's, so 3 hits, wounding on 2's, Strength 10 no saves so instant death for Typhus. 

So you have a chance to murder him, it really comes down to your Daemon Weapon attack roll, a 1 obviously sucks, a 2 will get you ~60% chance of a wound, wheras a 6 should definitely score you 1 wound. The penalty for failure how ever is harsh as he'll almost certainly squash you in return. 

Aramoro


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## Chumbalaya (May 17, 2010)

fynn said:


> kharn may walk in games you faced him, but he never does when i field him


I never knew he had the option for a jump pack.


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## fynn (Sep 19, 2008)

Chumbalaya said:


> I never knew he had the option for a jump pack.


lol, he has his pimped out kitten mobile, sorry i mean land raider


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## Lash Machine (Nov 28, 2008)

What about Mephiston Vs a Wolf Lord on a thunderwolf with thunder hammer and storm shield, runic armour, Saga of the bear, (which grants him eternal warrior) and a wolf tooth necklace.

Statistically Mephiston will cause one, possibly two unsaved wounds on the charge in return for taking four wounds back and being reduced to I1 for round 2. In the following round Mephiston has again the same chance to put one and maybe a 2nd unsaved wound on the wolf lord before being turned into a red smear. It’s more likely that the wolf lord would walk away with one wound left than be left for dead with mephiston but a mild swing in probability could leave either player looking a bit sad.


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## maddermax (May 12, 2008)

Warlock in Training said:


> So Typhus strolls in and uses his 3 attacks or whatever +D6 and wounds with his poison, then auto passes a Psy check = dead Ctan. I like it.


He doesn't autopass force weapon checks. He only autopasses for his other powers. The rest is correct though. Of course, if Typhus rolls a one for his daemon weapon, it's all over...



Chumbalaya said:


> Kharn walks and has a crappy invul, Mephiston messes him up (he's immune to psychic attacks, but Mephy's re-rolls aren't attacks).


On the other hand, Kharn half the points of mephiston... and can't be picked out by shooting before he gets into the thick of things, assuming his whole squad isn't wiped out of course. While he might not stand up in a one on one fight, remember that he still will kill just as many average guys as mephy will, and actually kill more than mephy on the charge, all for his bargain price. 

And that's what Kharn is all about - wholesale slaughter at wholesale prices :laugh:


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## danation96 (Mar 9, 2011)

*well...*



Sephyr said:


> Abbadon the 13-times loser may run up the points, but he is also absurdly killy, what with his amazing stats, potential oodles of s8 attacks at I6 and so on. But after finally checking out the new Blood Angels codex, I think we can say his title at the top of the HQ pack is under direct assault.
> 
> Has anyone seen these two face each other on the field yet? What were the results?
> 
> On that note, what other IC's do you think make a particularly bloody and even match, stats and play-wise?


Well i played against mephiston at gw, and he got butchered, mephiston sturck and took away two wounds... BUT abbadon struck and killed him in one turn, but two a
gainst abbadon its reversed.... luck of the dice is also a big part. me and my friend also disagree whos the best as he thinks the swarmlord and lelith could beat abbadon in one turn which if the dice rolls a certain way may be true we will decide this later, most likely this weekend i will let you know how he goes!


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