# Fighting Against Dwarves



## The Son of Horus (Dec 30, 2006)

Dwarves have always given me a massive headache. I've never been able to beat the little stunty jerks. The next round of the local league game is against Dwarves, at 2500 points. A loss will knock me out of contention to win the league. So, it's actually an important match. In 8th, Dwarves are slightly more susceptible to magic, but as I'm playing Warriors of Khorne for the league (and consistency in composition and fluff is a league component) magic is out of the question, too.

So, I call out to my fellow Warriors of Chaos players, and ask how you might go about handling a Dwarf army? My opponent is very sharp, tactically speaking, and that's a hurdle I'll have to address on my own; but as far as the army is concerned, there's typically the usual base of artillery backed up by elite infantry units which are fairly immovable.


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## Arli (Mar 4, 2010)

I do not play WOC, but don't you get some type of unit that can come on the field behind the dwarven forces? That would seem to be the way to go.


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## Whizzwang (Dec 31, 2008)

Depends on his dwarf army really. Does he actually intend to play WFB? or is he trying play 40K instead?

Dealing with gunlines is harder than dealing with infantry based dwarf armies


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## The Son of Horus (Dec 30, 2006)

It's a balanced mix. Like I said, there's artillery, there are thunderers, but they're supported by units of things like Slayers and Ironbreakers. By the time stuff gets to them, it's been shot up to the point where it's outfought in close combat.


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## Whizzwang (Dec 31, 2008)

I'd go with a "OH SHI....." unit to scare him. Dump a lot of points in a massive unit of warriors. maybe even go so far as to use a Horde formation. He HAS to target them with everything as they move across the table or they'll destroy him. This frees up your knights, horsemen, chosen etc to move fairly unmolested.

You want you "target" unit to be as scary as possible. The bigger the better, even if it's a 750-900 point single unit. He needs to kill it

a) It's worth 0 victory points unless he kills the whole lot.
b) It will annihilate anything it comes across if left untouched


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## sir_m1ke (Dec 7, 2008)

The Son of Horus said:


> Dwarves have always given me a massive headache. I've never been able to beat the little stunty jerks. The next round of the local league game is against Dwarves, at 2500 points. A loss will knock me out of contention to win the league. So, it's actually an important match. In 8th, Dwarves are slightly more susceptible to magic, but as I'm playing Warriors of Khorne for the league (and consistency in composition and fluff is a league component) magic is out of the question, too.
> 
> So, I call out to my fellow Warriors of Chaos players, and ask how you might go about handling a Dwarf army? My opponent is very sharp, tactically speaking, and that's a hurdle I'll have to address on my own; but as far as the army is concerned, there's typically the usual base of artillery backed up by elite infantry units which are fairly immovable.


Initial thought is that you should grab a couple of heroes w/ ward saves and throw them on discs of tzeentch and hit those war machines hard and fast. some marauder horsemen should be able to distract and tie up thunderers, and just hit those slayers with warriors. no armour save for them= fail


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## The Wraithlord (Jan 1, 2007)

> It's a balanced mix. Like I said, there's artillery, there are thunderers, but they're supported by units of things like Slayers and Ironbreakers. By the time stuff gets to them, it's been shot up to the point where it's outfought in close combat.


Story of my life SoH. My main opponent is a Dwarf gunline player and with the new shooting rules in 8th I am starting to think I don't have a prayer in hell of beating him. Wulfric and a big Marauder unit popping up in the back to hit the machines may be the only way to go. One suggestion I do have however is the Hellcannon as those big blocks of Ironbreakers will truly suffer to non partials templates. Hell, I plan on bringing two myself. We don't need to outshoot the army, just whittle down the numbers so that even with our own numbers chipped away we can still kill off his units. Dwarfs rarely win combat against me by wounds, just SCR. With the cannons taking out fairly large chunks of those blocks..... might be possible.


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## Putch. (Jul 13, 2010)

I must say I like whizwang's plan! Wulfrik is also an option, as are hellcannons, marauder horsemen might even find a place, just to help when you do make it to those elite blocks.


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## Whizzwang (Dec 31, 2008)

There's a guy in our local store who plays the "INSANE POINTS COST YOU CAN'T KILL IT" unit. He does it with Skaven though.

13x13 Clanrats, pushing a bell with a tooled up seer, joined by the warlord, additional support from assasins, BSB etc.

It basically comes down to, how fast can you kill it before you run out of orcs, dwarves, elves etc. Generally it WILL make it across the table and mess you up.


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## Orochi (Jan 28, 2009)

Gonna have to be honest. I'd take Archaon. His 10 Str5 armour ignoring attacks will put any Ironbreaker in his place.

Take plenty of hounds, you need that Screening.

If Archy is a no no, a Khorne Lord on a Jugger with Ranged protection and a Sword that ignores Armour is a must.

Marauder horsemen may also have a place in your army, with flails, you can use them to silence those guns!

Thats all from me, but I stress Archaon. If this match is important, whip out all the cheese you can. There is no rule against it.


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## The Son of Horus (Dec 30, 2006)

As much as I'd love to break out Wulfrik and give that method a try, Wulfrik is deceased for the remainder of the campaign. A local rule for leagues is that once a character is dead, he's dead for the remainder of the league... and another Warriors of Chaos player got him killed game 1.

I've never put a lot of stock in the hellcannon, but I may give it a try. Another possible use for it might be returning fire on the artillery. I can outfight the Dwarf units, but making sure I make it into combat is the real trick.


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## Khorothis (May 12, 2009)

Hmm... It might be just me being a dick, but I'd get two Hellcannons, shoot him up, sit back for a turn or two and charge only then. Our Hellcannon can fire even if its crew is dead, so even if he manages to hit it its not going to be too much of a problem. However, the same is not true the other way around, especially since how our big boy still laughs at armour saves if the crew happened to have any, and the rest is too far away to do any damage.


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## NagashKhemmler (Apr 28, 2009)

Generally you face two cannons with dwarves, with the new rules you don't have to guess, which makes hellcannons reliable against those cannons, I run with a chaos dragon and two hellcannons. Hellcannons will reliably beat a cannon in a duel for two reasons: Cannonballs don't go through fences or buildings or any other type of solid stone based terrain, you can use that to your advantage, especially in the first turn. 

**hellcannons are still a monster with handlers, which means there's a 33% chance the cannon hits a dwarf and wastes a turn of shooting, even if they get the hellcannon itself they need to do 5 wounds.

Terrain now reduces the effectiveness of shooting, but doesn't hinder movement, this means that shooting through a forest will give him a -1 penalty to hit, but give no disadvantages to you.

Giving bloodcurtling roar is great now, S1 ignoring armour, use it to knock war machines out with a steed of slanesh and the vanguard move, combine that with a chaos dragon and you have enough fast moving weapons to really hurt their guns straight off of the bat.


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## blackspine (Jun 9, 2010)

*khorne options.*

As someone with lack of ranged options ( beastmen) I can empathize.

"The Wraithlord" had some very good ideas. Create an 'oh sh*t' unit that will inevitably draw all his fire...or at least for 1-2 rounds. A large block of Chaos Warriors w/ shields and a banner or some sort of ward save should draw attention to the unit. Toss in a powerful lord/ hero and it's too good a target to pass up. 
*too bad you can't take Tzeentch themed units for their defensive nature*

Double Hellcannons is giving him a taste of his own medicine. Good. Take 2 and just let them loose on him. Unrelenting batteries of demon fueled madness. Let them devastate the thunderers and let your own units survive to make it to the lines and hack their bones into the ground.

With both these options, you have less points for your other units, but gauging from your well written posts, you are most likely fairly adept at maneuvering your troops and can wreak havoc on the stunties.
________________________________________
another option is to *force him to march. * :shok:
I don't know Chaos mortals as well as Beastmen, but his troops are notoriously ponderous. Why not stock up on 2x Hellcannons, and sit back and unleash hell on him. (3 cannons if at all possible)
When he has to march out to you, let loose Maruader horsemen with throwing axes to harry the ranks and ride through the ranks to the cannons.
or, Harpies and the "Valkyrie" lord. With that flight, after the thunderers are reduced, you can fly and utterly destroy the war-machines and harry them while your units maneuver. 

I very much detest the 'sit and shoot and lolz' tactic, and would love to hear how this goes. I hope you slaughter his static gunline.

edit: yes, and lots of screening hounds to absorb some shots.


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## NagashKhemmler (Apr 28, 2009)

In the new cover rules, you get hard cover from friendly units IF a MAJORITY covers it, because hounds are so low to the ground, I fear they won't cover any cavalry or infantry....at least not warriors are they're so large.


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## The Son of Horus (Dec 30, 2006)

I suppose that just depends on what you define as "majority." 51% has always been my rule of thumb, and the warhounds do come up to slightly past the waistline of the Warriors.


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