# Versus Space Marine/Chaos Terminators



## Galahad (Dec 21, 2006)

*Versus: Week Eleven​*
This week we have an opponent that's been a long time coming.
They're huge, they lumber so menacingly...they can appear out of nowhere and unleash heavy firepower or dish out terrifying assaults, and they;re almost impossible to put down.

That's right: Terminators, both chaos and loyal are deadly, though hay have their differences, they're also very similar. What takes one down will usually work against the other.

So how do you take down the Terminators?


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## Triumph Of Man (Dec 27, 2007)

I think it's a fairly rock/paper/scissors question.

What makes Termies tough? The armour save. Remove that and they're scurrying around in no better than a flak jacket for all intents and purposes.

So naturally you want to hit them with whatever respective item you have that removes their armour save from the equation.

For me that's las/plas combos.


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## The Wraithlord (Jan 1, 2007)

If they Deep Strike, Plasma Cannons. If not, plasma guns at range and massed fire to force the saves. In all honesty, Terms don't really scare me.


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## Estragon (Feb 25, 2008)

If your army happens to contain a monstrous creature then thats often a good bet, just don't expect it to come out alive if Power/chainfists are in the mix. Psyker powers are great-things like wind of chaos will absolutely toast 'em unless you get unlucky. 
Vindicare assassins and Mind War can be used to take out encroaching icons/teleport homers to good effect which leaves them vulnerable to materialising inside walls/different time zones etc. If you know you're coming up against them (and you're imperial) than an inquisitor with mystics and multi-melta servitors can make a real mess of them.


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## Hespithe (Dec 26, 2006)

I'm not really concerned about termies either... Even with IG.

Took out a squad of 5 NurgleTermies with 12 Guardsmen... 2 with power weapons with rerolls thanks to a Priest. The firepower bounced off (I don't use much AP2), but the melee was fun, lol.


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## Shadwell (Apr 29, 2008)

Wraithlord, brightlance and/or Starcannon.


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## Hespithe (Dec 26, 2006)

Wraithlords work, until the unit gets into melee... then the Wraithlord usually dies in a single turn. For the points, the edge woud go to a small squad of Terminators.

Really, any squad that can pump out 5+ rounds of AP2 goodness per turn will be the bane of most terminators...

SM squads with twin plasmaguns and a plasma pistol scare off most termie squads.

IG squads that are plasma-happy are often 1/2 the cost of a termy squad and can riddle them with holes. 10 Plasma shots from a single IG command squad usually means that several Termies are down, and usually a Guardsman or two as well.


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## Katie Drake (Nov 28, 2007)

The easiest way to take down Terminators is to hit them with the biggest, meanest guns that your army has to offer. Lascannons, starcannons, Shokk Attack Guns, dark lances, railguns, exorcist missiles and plenty more besides have an AP of 2 or better and the strength to easily cause wounds. A similar philosophy should be adopted for close combat. Power weapons, power fists, Rending and the like will also greatly aid you in cracking open that thick armor.

If you ever find yourself in a spot where you don't have the ideal weapons for the job, there's always the old fashioned way - fire saturation. Light them up with so many guns that they're forced to take tons of saves. Even the luckiest players have to roll some 1's eventually. When taking this approach, adopt and all or nothing way of thinking. It won't help much if you devote a single unit of Guardsmen with lasguns to taking out the Terminators. If you plan on overwhelming them with sheer number of shots, go big or go home. Two, three or more units getting in close with rapid fire weapons should leave an impressive dent in all but the toughest units.

Terminators tend to arrive on the battlefield in a few ways. They'll either walk like everyone else, grab a ride in a Land Raider or most commonly _Deep Strike_ onto the battlefield. If the Termies decide to walk, treat them like you would an AV14 battle tank. If they're riding in a Land Raider make it your top priority and destroy it ASAP, entangling the Terminators and taking them out of the game for a while. Deep Strikers are a bit harder to deal with since they're far harder to avoid but as long as their initial salvo doesn't deal your army crippling damage, you can just throw a large, expendable unit at them to hold them up in close combat for a few turns while you bring in some assault specialists to finish the job.

Katie D


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## Vanchet (Feb 28, 2008)

Anything with an ap2 in my diposal and/or a sleek lord and his bodyguards on them and hope that they get good ^^.
also if it's an apocalypse game Disrupter beacon and either plant them at the farset end of the game so they can get shot to pieces or if they're deep striking either on my troops so they land and crash or on a table corner and hope they fly off because I find it rare for a basic deepstrike to go off table but if I have the chance when they deepstrike I would send what forces are there and blaes them and hope they can distract them long enought ^^


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## Absolute035 (Jan 13, 2008)

So simple when you're Eldar

If they deepstrike: prism cannon
If they footslog: assault with a full banshee squad (and doom!)
If they ride: avoid the transport


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## Morgal (Sep 26, 2007)

well plasma is the clear winner here, but after that...lots of troops.
Conscripts..ties em up and kills some. 90 poits vs there 350


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## Estragon (Feb 25, 2008)

The difficulty of letting a land raider run around is that it has an effective 20" charge range for the terminators inside-and has enough firepower to beat down anything in a normal game as well. If an opponent puts a landraider on the board (even if its chaos in a non-deepstriking mission) then you can't be sure if it has the terminators in or not, and should be killed pronto.
I'd definitely go with the fire saturation, but beware (particularly low strength bods especially) putting all your eggs in one basket. Even twenty shots starts to look less than impressive if its _only_ lasguns-half miss, some wound, most-if not all saved. To be followed by a gory death.
And Hespith, how the heck did you manage that? Did they all have powerfists? One of the guys in my squad has a normal power weapon, another lightning claws just in case I run up against a squad like that.
Dealing with them in CC should be (if you have the choice) given to walkers or such if they have only power weapons, or to a squad with power weapons if they have fists.
It's gonna hurt, but hey, what can you do.
And no-ones mentioned tank shock yet.....


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## Steel Nathan (Apr 26, 2008)

Well I may as well talk about my opinions about termies before I give out some advice to kill them.. naw I'm going to just cut to the chase. 

(Chaos)Space Marines: Well anything that would have a high strength and low ap would work just fine, lascannons would probably be your best bet, basically land raiders, preds, devesators/havocs, 5 man squads with lascannons or plasma cannons. What you DON'T want to do is assault them, especially if your going for a suicide charge where you know that your not going to win, that's a big NONO. Even assaults( and our lovely Death Company) would have a tough time. Also try mass firing, they have to fail their saves sometime( probably won;t work though) 

(Dark) Eldar: ahhh soo many things to hurt them with. Shinig spears, lance weapons, DE good piercing weapons. Eldar Prism Cannons. Fire Dragons if you can get in close enough. Maybe Harlies and Howling Banshee's, if you doomed the termie bastards. mass shooting should do the trick, might work better for Eldar then Marines. 

Imperial Guard: MASS FIRING! That's really what I know about Imperial guards. I heard that Baskilisks(sp?) are also good termie killing, or is it MEQ's I', thinking of? Pretty much same as Marines, lascannon, lemen russes etc. 

Necrons: Sigh I really don't know about this one. I have a piece of advice here. NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER consider using heavy destroyers on Tzeench Termies, it never works. Other termies might be okay though. If the termies are troops then by all means fire like there's no tommorow  

Tau: Man I don't know alot about other armies, well railguns would work. Mass shooting is effective, maybe other weapons with ap2's? Not sure about this one. 

(Deamon/witch)hunters: Same as marines( there basically the same thing, don't argue with that please?) 

Orks: Mass charging is good, orks tend to miss alot, and the termies have good saves, but the orks RULE in combat. 

Nids: Same deal as Orks, except that they don't suck at shooting, there guns arn't really that great( there are a few exceptions) 

I have a feeling that I'm missing an army......


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## Galahad (Dec 21, 2006)

For Tau, I would say battlesuits. While Plasma-armed Broadsides are about the best option, firepower-wise, they're slow and not very mobile.

If you know for a fact you'll be facing terminators, then a squad of 'Helios' pattern battlesuits would be effective terminator-hunters. Fusion gun and plasma rifle with a multi-tracker, maybe a shield generator on the leader. It's very short range (12" is the ideal range), but can dish out three shots that completely bypass term armor. Rely on your mobility to jump in, fire and jump back behind cover.

If you're not planning on terminators, chances are you're still going to have some Fireknives running around. While a missile pod isn't as effective as a fusion gun against 2+ saves, two S7 hits is nothing to sneeze at. And it gives you greater range (though you still want to stay within 12" for rapid firing the plasma guns, at least yourre not suffering a huge drop in firepower for moving further out)


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## Xaereth (Dec 14, 2007)

When I play with my Blood Angels, if I see a squad of 5 terminators, I generally think "oh... a quick way for my Death Company to make their points back". With a full squad of DC, assuming you aren't charging Slannesh Termies w/ power weapons, you're going to wipe a 5-man termie squad in a turn. If you don't want to use DC, shoot them w/ melta bikes. Or use a Vet squad w/ 2 or 3 powerfists and 2 melta guns. You might lose a decent number of guys, but they'll lose all of theirs. 

Against deepstriking termies, I'd say that anything with a power weapon would be good to go, since most of the termie squads I've seen deepstrike only have powerfists. If you get to hit first and kill a few, the counter-assault won't be as bad.

Against 10-man term. squads, I just melta them down to 5 or 6 before charging. If they're in a landraider, I melta the shite out of the landraider, and make them footslog. The only real thing that scares me about terminators is when there are multiple squads of them. Death Company can take out one of them usually, but what'cha gonna do against the 10+ termie countercharge? 

When I use my dark eldar, I generally just try to shoot them, or I send a squad of wyches at them. Wyches will tie a termie squad up for a loong time, and actually have a decent shot at taking a squad out, all for much fewer points than the term. squad was worth. Incubi will also annihilate a termie squad.


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## Insanity101 (Jan 13, 2008)

You all are missing one thing. DS termies in PODS. How do you deal with those? Especially if there are more Pod Squads coming down with them, maybe even a Dreadnought? And what if someone is trying to use the big bro/ little bro tactic (hide termies behind Dreadnoughts)? Just wanted to get some questions out here to see responses.


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## Galahad (Dec 21, 2006)

Pods don't change the math much, except that it gives them something to hide behind. Still, fast moving units (meltabikes, VAS, DC, Crisis suits) should be able to handle them. 

I'd also refer you to Week Eight: Versus Space Marine Drop Pods for some general anti-pod advice.


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## Galahad (Dec 21, 2006)

Anyone else got some tips?
Harlequins or banshees could do a lot of damage charging them.


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## Engelus (Jul 26, 2007)

shoot it with vindicators, thats the only way I can ever handle them.

statistically a full squad of harlequins can go through about 3 times their points in terminators before being knocked below scoring. although I have only ever been on the recieveing end of this.


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## Steel Rain (Jan 14, 2008)

Demolisher cannons work well for both the land raider and the termies inside. Chances are whatever is mounting that demolisher cannon will be able to stand up to any fire the termies or land raider can dish out as it moves within firing range. It also works for deep striking too! Dropping a S10 AP2 pie plate on a group of termies is no fun for the enemy. Especially since it can insta-kill them if it's a commander. Nobody wants to lose a 500+ point command squad to a 140 point model.


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## Psyan (Apr 6, 2008)

With DE, I'd either shoot them to death with Ravagers (especially if they deep strike) or assault them with Wyches (it will be a long combat, but the terms can't kill wyches as easily as they can anything else in cc) or Incubi, who will definitely lose some models when the terms strike back.


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## royemunson (Apr 9, 2007)

I faced abbdon and a termie squad with my guard, dropped a plasma command squad next to them killed all the termies then got charged by the big man, four combat turns and four one's for his deamon weapon and he was dead, easy!!!:victory::so_happy::victory:


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## MindFreaky (Jan 24, 2008)

And your poor opponent probably was ready to smash an Abaddon shaped Hole into his skull in sheer disgust at the fact the Abaddon had personally just wiped a massively expensive model all by himself... pity it was himself. :shok:


Aah, well, that's the way it goes...


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## royemunson (Apr 9, 2007)

It was great, because it was my best mate i didn't feel bad about laughing so hard a little bit of wee came out!!


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## bishop5 (Jan 28, 2008)

For high-AP weapons; focus fire. Force them to take lots of saves.
Low AP, blast weapons like Plasma Cannons or Demolisher cannons work well.
For power weapon only armed Terminators, charge them with a walker! 

Charging in 5/10 man Death Company squads with Lemartes leading them seems to do the trick against my Terminators every single time. All those rending 6's mean a lot of 5+ Inv's and my Terms normally die before they get to re-roll the misses.


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## Son of mortarion (Apr 24, 2008)

A really simple tactic versus termies and any other nasty, expensive unit in the game: Swarms, or lacking that, conscrpits in an IG force, or a large grot mob in an ork force:. The termies can't do much but spend2-4 turns fighting in close combat if enough is fed to them. the low cost will ensre that the more expensive terminators are held up while still maintaining points economy. Taking such units will also pay off because they can also be used to tie up other things. :victory:


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## Bodyguard666 (Apr 14, 2008)

*easiest way to take out a termy? (GK Termy)*

what is the easiest way to take out a Grey Knight Terminator? They really give me hell in cc, and their 2+ save is crazy. i play eldar, and usually i use pathfinders to try to take em down before they get too close.

BG6x3


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## Brother Enok (Apr 17, 2008)

Plasma weapons can be quite effective against all types of terminators. You want a weapon with a low AP, AP 2 or 1. 
That said, lots of high AP, moderate strength weapons will take thier toll. You force your oponent to take enough saves and eventually hes going to start failing them. Ive seen a 5 man termie squad wiped out by a 4 heavy bolter Deve squad.

As for close combat, bring somthing with a higher iniative, say howling banshees and pray the Knights fail thier invulnerable saves.

March in fortune.


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## pyroanarchist (Feb 29, 2008)

If you can shoot 'em with a squad of firedragons(the melta guys... I think thats their name, but I'm not a big Eldar fan) you can force their invuln and maybe kill quite a few. I try to use anything ap2 or better or power weapons. Howling Banshees might be ok in CC with them, but it'd still be a tough fight.

Good luck, they are a pain to fight, but every one you take down is worth 2 of your models or more point wise.


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## Bodyguard666 (Apr 14, 2008)

i seemed to be able to take out a full squad +a GM with 9 dire avengers, an exarch, and Phoenix Lord Asurmen. Yay for Sword of Asur!!(Diresword that re-rolls cc misses)


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## bl0203 (Nov 10, 2007)

With Eldar your best bet is star cannons, meltas, or volume of fire(bladestorm). H2H like the others said Banshees or even Harlies. They're a tough nut to crack, but also an expensive one.


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## Absolute035 (Jan 13, 2008)

With Eldar, terminators are the least of my worries. Their power weapons aren't so useful against our mediocre armor saves, and we have plenty of stuff to AP them. 

Definitely the #1 way to kill them is Banshees, i load a full squad into a waveserpent. Exarch with Executioner + 9 banshees, and you should kill 4 Termies on the charge.


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## Galahad (Dec 21, 2006)

Merged with Versus Terminators


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## Sniper (Mar 9, 2008)

Inquistor with dual master-crafted lightning claws in artificer armour and 2 combat-servitors, lots of no armour save goodness with 2 power fists as back up:victory:

Sniper


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## dizzington esq (Apr 24, 2008)

From a necron point of view I would have to use heavy destroyers or a monolith, if I had some ! But my scarabs would have to be the trick. Just to tie the termies up for a few rounds at the right time will keep them out of the fight. A full squad of 10 scarabs probably would last 2 rounds, if lucky, and even luckier if they wounded something.

Did I mention that I like scarabs...


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## Absolute035 (Jan 13, 2008)

10 scarabs would last more than 2 rounds against most terminator squads, and they would need to because your Monolith won't be helping against Terminators.


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## -xecutioner- (Dec 23, 2007)

i use imperial guard melta teams or a demolisher shell.


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## Son of mortarion (Apr 24, 2008)

Bodyguard666 said:


> what is the easiest way to take out a Grey Knight Terminator? They really give me hell in cc, and their 2+ save is crazy. i play eldar, and usually i use pathfinders to try to take em down before they get too close.
> 
> BG6x3


A great idea, esprcially when you dont have something to kill them in cc or anything cheap to tie them down.


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## Son of mortarion (Apr 24, 2008)

dizzington esq said:


> From a necron point of view I would have to use heavy destroyers or a monolith, if I had some ! But my scarabs would have to be the trick. Just to tie the termies up for a few rounds at the right time will keep them out of the fight. A full squad of 10 scarabs probably would last 2 rounds, if lucky, and even luckier if they wounded something.
> 
> Did I mention that I like scarabs...


Had ten bases tie my termies up for 4 turns meself


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## dizzington esq (Apr 24, 2008)

See... it does work :biggrin: , go the mighty scarab, most underated model of the necron army.

Did I mention that I like scarabs...


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## Bobgenrut (Feb 5, 2008)

A 3 suit team of battle suits work well if armed with fireknife weapon set ( plasma rifle & missle pod). Usually take out half a turn if not all!


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## Asmodeun (Apr 26, 2009)

Well all this 2- AP is all very well and good but against Tseench termies they still shrug off litteraly half the wounds. necrons can allways use warscythes and c'tan phase blades will always kick-ass but how'd you take them out with a less specialised army?


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## mcmuffin (Mar 1, 2009)

Vindicator with demolisher cannon and combi-plasma pintle mounted always works for me. My chaos lord with a bloodfeeder daemon weapon can dish out an average of about 8 wounds per assault phase at initiative 5, enough to slaughter the termies. also a DP can rip them to pieces in most cases. termies are really not too much of a problem for me


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## Sniper (Mar 9, 2008)

A cheap Inquisitor with lightning claws and a familiar, extra ini. means he hits first and he costs aboout half as much as a five man termie squad, thats if you can get him close that is, if you have the extra points a couple of interrogators with powerfists assists well. if all else fails use a lance strike:grin:

Sniper


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## Inquisitor Einar (Mar 6, 2009)

For Sisters of Battle, they are easy to take care off. 
A squad with 2 flamers rapid firing under divine guidance will give you enough hits to get those 6s for AP1 hits. If that wasn't enough, use a second squad with melta guns and divine guidance and there should be nothing left.
Otherwise, a jumping Solo cannoness with a blessed weapon and her 2+ armour/invulnerable save assaulting them will also be a nice bit of hurt.

If they come in a land raider, you will have a spot of trouble, since blowing up one of those is a bit difficult for sisters unless you're close by. some inducted IG with lascannons might help in that department. Or a special weapons team with melta guns, since they are nice and expendable. Otherwise use a squad of penitent engines.

If they're footslogging, a heavy bolter team with divine guidance will reduce their numbers to manageable levels. A vindicare being able to have a nice field day sniping them should also help.


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## Korrogoth (May 2, 2009)

anything that can remove amour saves. hit em hard at range, in combat its luck of the draw


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## Flood_Reaper (Jul 19, 2008)

Deep-strike a unit of Vanguard and have them assault the unit of Terminators. As most Termies have powerfists I usually have them wiped out before they even get a chance to attack back.


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## Chaosftw (Oct 20, 2008)

Yes termies are a pain in the @$$ as we all know. But just like everything else make them roll enough saves and they will start to fail. Now what I will tend to do is use heavy weapons because yes, they have a inv save but its only a 5+ so like someone mentioned plasma cannons are always good. I sometimes fire Lascannons into them instead for the simple fact that you hit and then its an instant wound, its not a chance at scattering. Especially when there are 2-3 left I would much rather roll to hit and then take a chance at scattering. 

Also as a Chaos player it in range ill bring around a DP if it has Wind of Chaos and Warp Time or just Warp Time and first fire the flame template to hopefully chew a couple and then assult them. This denies the termies (if close combat) the charge as well as hopefully denying them shooting. Especially when your going in with a minimum 5 attacking DP with re-rolls meaning your probably going to kill anywhere on avg between 2-5 Termies.

Chaosftw


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## LukeValantine (Dec 2, 2008)

Ap 2 anything.
Ignores armor with a int above 4.
wonderful templates of pain with ap2.

Oh on a interesting side note Loyalist termies with storm shields only get that bonus save against Melee. So if you see them with shields you best have a shit load of ap 2 dakka. Ps. Damn loyalists


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## Flood_Reaper (Jul 19, 2008)

LukeValantine said:


> Oh on a interesting side note Loyalist termies with storm shields only get that bonus save against Melee. So if you see them with shields you best have a shit load of ap 2 dakka. Ps. Damn loyalists


Actually, new SM rules make Storm Shields 3+ invulnerable save against anything.


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## Captain Stillios (Mar 8, 2009)

Blood angels: DEAH COMPANY WITH CHAPLAIN AND JUMP PACKS!
I assaulted calgar and 10 assault termies with thunder hammers (of the ultrasmurfs:sarcastichand and calgar:headbutt: was killed by my chaplain and all but 1 termie who did nothing and failed his run away armour saves:biggrin:.

Eldar:Avatar and/or pheonix lords.

Space marines: orbital bombardment


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## Lash Machine (Nov 28, 2008)

I hav eplayed two games with my smurfs and the 5 man terminator close combat squad has proved effective. They only all got killed in game 2 and their storm sheilds were effective but it was volume of shots and close combat attacks that took them down over three turns.

My opponenet did pump everything at them for two turns to achieve this.


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## Winst0n (Mar 12, 2009)

i've had 4 scarab bases tie up 5 termies for turns once. got one wound against them which was nice. really i can only take them down by tieing them up with scarabs and then using the guass flayer at close range [rapid fire] and hoping for the best. the monolith has some use but will be decimated if they get it in cc as i've watched my monolith die many times at their darn power claws.


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## DeceivedRadek (Jun 4, 2011)

royemunson said:


> It was great, because it was my best mate i didn't feel bad about laughing so hard a little bit of wee came out!!


you should invest in a clothespin.:laugh:


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## Masked Jackal (Dec 16, 2009)

Depending on what they are, my tactics change. If they're regular terminators, they might be worth a Dark Lance shot or three once I've gotten rid of transports. For Storm-Shield Termies though, there's only one solution. Lots and lots of shots. 2+ armor save will be failed eventually.


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## mcmuffin (Mar 1, 2009)

this thread died 2 years ago


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## Masked Jackal (Dec 16, 2009)

mcmuffin said:


> this thread died 2 years ago


Oh. I'd just noticed a new post and thought it was a recent topic. XD Damn you, Radek!


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## Sephyr (Jan 18, 2010)

Assault Termies are a tough nut to crack, especially if serves in a Land Raider Variant.

One of the people I play uses them With Vulkan in a LR Redeemer. They get a re-roll on Thunder Hammers, divert a lot of fire to their ride (that usually doesn't cause much damage) and annihilate whatever they hit. It's quite hard to scrounge up enough low-AP fire to make them fail their 3++ save with any regularity, and if your enemy knows how to play, there'll often be obstacles betweem them and your best shooters.

As a result, I tend to try and ignore them. Box them and their ride in with Rhinos and murder the rest of the army. 

Shooty Terminators are another matter entirely. Melta/plasma chosen and even Berserker charges usually wipe them out, and as people said, Plasma Cannons greet Deepstrikers most nastily. 

Against Chaos terminators, things that mess with Deepstrike are a good defense against termicide. A friend of mine uses a disruptor on a Land speeder to discourage teleporting chaos termies with combi-weapons popping up behind his predators and vindicators.


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