# What's the single most important tip you could offer to help me win games of 40k?



## Jezlad (Oct 14, 2006)

Hi guys,

I've drifted so far away from the gaming side of the hobby, if I'm being honest a fact I'm ashamed to admit is that I haven't played a game of 40k since before the new Imperial Guard Codex came out! Back in 4th I'd say I was top 50 in the Uk, now... nowhere near. 

Anyway, as a sore loser and someone without the time to lose game after game while I feel my way back into the carnage I'd like a little assistance.

*
What's the single most important tip you could offer to help me win games of 40k?*


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## OrkByTheGraceOfGork (Jun 9, 2010)

Other than saying, "Play, Play, Play", creating a list tailored to your style of play and what's natural to you is important. Good sound tactics are more important than the most competitive list out there too. :victory:

P.S. Oh, and green is da best!


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## Midge913 (Oct 21, 2010)

I would agree with OBGOG. Having a list that plays to your strategic strenghts is much better than having a list full of killer units that you are uncomfortable playing in unison. That and target priority. Making sound decisions as to what is the most important thing to do first in each game.


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## Imperious (May 20, 2009)

Use loaded dice.


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## Doelago (Nov 29, 2009)

Faith in the Emperor... He will guide your hand, and he will lead you to victory...


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## Dave T Hobbit (Dec 3, 2009)

Read the rule book repeatedly.

I read 5th Edition when it came out but did not play it straight-away and was shocked at how often I misremembered simple rules.


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## Unforgiven302 (Oct 20, 2008)

Well, if you thought of yourself as one of the top 50 in the UK a while ago, jumping back in shouldn't be too big of a problem. Obviously knowing the 5th ed rules is top priority, so I would read, reread and become familiar with the nuances and differences between 4th and 5th as the basics such as the "to hit" and "to wound" charts are the same and other core things are the same. 

5th ed has become vehicle heavy with the costs of transports and their availability being so prominent now. So being able to cope with all the high AV tanks and vehicles on the tables these days are a fairly high priority.

I would check the army list section and read up on the competitive lists for each army and build your list to be capable with and around those types. You will also get a good idea of what your list will eventually look and act like.

Depending on what army you will/are using, a lot of the newly released codex/armies have a bit of "power creep" so choosing one of those may give you a competitive advantage.

Play against better players in competitive games. You can only become the best by beating the best.


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## Kinglopey (Sep 10, 2008)

Always remember the Objectives and what you need to hold them. I often find myself distracted by a unit that looks ripe for killing then a turn later I realized that I should have moved closer to the objective. Play like this is your last round, because variable turn length can kill your plans.


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## Son of mortarion (Apr 24, 2008)

the two most important things to know: yourself, and your enemy.

study opposing codices and the main rule book, and pay attention to your habits, such as, if you assault every time an opponent sticks out a squad, note it, they certainly are.


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## Bane_of_Kings (Oct 28, 2009)

Doelago said:


> Faith in the Emperor... He will guide your hand, and he will lead you to victory...


That will be useful if you play Space Marines, Imperial Guard or Inquisition. 

Dark Eldar, Eldar, Orks, Chaos Space Marines, Chaos Daemons, Tau and Tyranids on the other hand, I'm not so sure. .


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## LukeValantine (Dec 2, 2008)

1)First look at your armies fundamental strengths, and weaknesses.
2)Then look at what the local tournaments, gaming centers armies are comprised of.
3)Using this information design a list that suits your play style, and will be effective against the majority of army compositions you are expecting to play against.
4)After you have gained practical experience using your army then tweak, and redesign it to enhance the strong points of the list/play style you use.


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## MidnightSun (Feb 10, 2009)

Play to your strengths, and surprise your opponent.

Midnight


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## aboytervigon (Jul 6, 2010)

bring your army?


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## Stella Cadente (Dec 25, 2006)

aboytervigon said:


> bring your army?


buy an army?

there really is no single way to win at 40k, other than practice, practice, practice, and to do so you gotta lose fuckloads before you win.

or just do what most people do, copy the most popular army list off the net that requires 0 brain power to win with, claim it entirely as your own, and repeat for each new list, and if you lose blame GW for powecreep, or your opponent cheated and accept no responsibility for your losses.

hell thats how the self proclaimed "best" do it.

oh and don't forget to cheat and argue about every little rule like its going out of fashion, you can't be a winner if you don't cheat like a fat essex chav girl whos idea of safe sex is not fucking a strangers dog.


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## Nyustukyi (Jul 10, 2010)

Remember that if you are playing Dark Eldar you have a special rule that, after defeating your opponent, it is perfectly ok to hold you roppoent down and tell them "It puts the lotion on it's skin or it gets the hose again."

Also, remember that Monsterous Creatures get a 2d6+Strength Penateation on Vehciles. I seem to have forgotten that and it messed me over.


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## search116 (Aug 9, 2010)

Always and I mean always know whats on your squad you have no idea how many people lost because they forgot one squad had a melta gun or other


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## ChugginDatHaterade (Nov 15, 2010)

Always play challenging armies. Dont turn down a game that you will lose, you dont learn anything clubbing seals. If you are beating people, encourage them to use more points than you. I frequently encourage friends who never beat me to run 500 extra points on their armies. Build a very tough all comers list. The best armies in the game are all comers builds, not spam lists. Dont feel bad about netlisting, its often a safety net for new guys to competitive play, and once/if you get good enough you wont even need internet advice on armies.


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## D-A-C (Sep 21, 2010)

Tell you what I figured out recently that has made me a hell of a lot more competitive ..... planning two / three moves ahead.

This may sound silly for everyone who does this naturally, but what I used to do was this:

'Here is my Rhino with 10 CSM and x2 Melta, I want it to take out enemy vehicles, so I'm going to move it 12" in their direction'. That's it lol

Then in the next turn I would try and figure out what to do with it after I'd moved it previously. 

Now what I do, is plan how I'm going to move all my units over multiple turns and try to imagine where my opponents going to move his units. 

That might sound simple, but it helps lol.


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## Wusword77 (Aug 11, 2008)

Stella Cadente said:


> buy an army?
> 
> there really is no single way to win at 40k, other than practice, practice, practice, and to do so you gotta lose fuckloads before you win.


Good advice. This is the best peice of advice you can give any player in a tabletop game, as they need to discover their own individual playstyle.



> or just do what most people do, copy the most popular army list off the net that requires 0 brain power to win with, claim it entirely as your own, and repeat for each new list, and if you lose blame GW for powecreep, or your opponent cheated and accept no responsibility for your losses.
> 
> hell thats how the self proclaimed "best" do it.
> 
> oh and don't forget to cheat and argue about every little rule like its going out of fashion, you can't be a winner if you don't cheat like a fat essex chav girl whos idea of safe sex is not fucking a strangers dog.


Not so good advice.

you just have to keep playing against quality players and you'll get back in the game real quick.

Don't be a sore loser and cry everytime you lose.
Don't blame "Net Lists" for the reason you lost.
Don't blame "power gamers" or WaaC players when you lose.
Don't think you're the best player to ever grace the tables, and anyone who beats you is cheating.
Finally, keep your rule books on with with the updated Errata and FAQs. It's very hard for someone to argue with you on a rule when you have a print out of it.


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## Stephen_Newman (Jul 14, 2009)

Have an important target priority scheme. For a gunline army I would consider taking stuff out in this order:

1. Fast stuff (since people like transports this can take a while-preferably take out fast stuff you expect to close in like assault troops or bikers and the odd cheeky meltagun)

2. The heavy shooting stuff (Things like the Leman Russes or annoying shooting units like dark reapers and devastators)

3. The rest!

I always remember to upgrade your units so they become better at the job-not multi purpose (for example I find taking a tempest launcher is better for the dark reaper exarch as this makes him better at killing 3+ or worse units which his unit specializes in).

Hope this can help in some regard.


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## Katie Drake (Nov 28, 2007)

Pick a 5th edition Codex as your army of choice.

Since you're a competitive player and will be playing in tournaments (at least I assume) pick one of the newest, most balanced books. Imperial Guard, Space Wolves and Dark Eldar are three top picks, though any 5E book can do well in a competitive environment with the right player behind it. I advise staying _far_ away from any of the 3rd or 4th edition books as they tend to be mono-build armies that suffer badly against certain lists and roll over others - in a tournament, you don't want rock, paper, scissors.


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## DestroyerHive (Dec 22, 2009)

Can't win, don't try. That's what my daddy always taught me. 

No wait, that was my great-aunt...


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## Trudge34 (Oct 23, 2010)

Don't forget to shoot those meltaguns that you deep strike within 6 inches of the opponents Land Raider. You will regret it.


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## deathbringer (Feb 19, 2009)

Stella Cadente said:


> oh and don't forget to cheat and argue about every little rule like its going out of fashion, you can't be a winner if you don't cheat like a fat essex chav girl whos idea of safe sex is not fucking a strangers dog.


why the lack of love for essex stella? brilliant but why?

As for the original topic, I'd say playtesting. Tweeking your list over time to suit your strengths. Start with a basic list that you think is good. Play with it and remove units that irritate you or underperform in each game. try and play against a variety of opponents and thus find a balance that beats all comers.


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## Uilleam (Nov 23, 2009)

One thing that helped me enormously was to sit back and watch other how other people play. I do this frequently when there's 3 or more of us and only 1 table to game on. You can learn how other people play certain armies. The tactics and strategies they employ. Then when you face a similar army you know what to expect and can put some thoughts into countering it. Then enjoy all the moaning and bitching when your put those armies to the business end of a chainaxe! :victory:


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## Crimzzen (Jul 9, 2008)

Play the mission, not the opponent.


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## Hellados (Sep 16, 2009)

Stephen_Newman said:


> Have an important target priority scheme. For a gunline army I would consider taking stuff out in this order:
> 
> 1. Fast stuff (since people like transports this can take a while-preferably take out fast stuff you expect to close in like assault troops or bikers and the odd cheeky meltagun)
> 
> ...


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## Flindo (Oct 30, 2010)

practice makes perfect my friend.


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## ChugginDatHaterade (Nov 15, 2010)

Stella Cadente said:


> or just do what most people do, copy the most popular army list off the net that requires 0 brain power to win with, claim it entirely as your own, and repeat for each new list, and if you lose blame GW for powecreep, or your opponent cheated and accept no responsibility for your losses.
> 
> hell thats how the self proclaimed "best" do it.


the part about losing lots before you win is great advice, but you lost me at this point. What if both players run these popular netlists that require 0 brain power to win with? What determines the winner then? Dice rolls? The hand of god?

Theres nothing wrong with running a netlist or a power build. Just understand that running a netlist alone doesnt make you a good player. You still need to know the army in and out, have a solid rational thought process, and pay attention to win. Ive ran some pretty bad off the wall armies and beat up on netlisters. Ive also ran power builds and beat up on netlists. 

40k isnt a trading card game. Theres no autowin power combo you need to pull off to win. The nice thing about power builds is you have no real bad match ups, so you can always compete. You get a guy running razorspam wolves vs jumper blood angels and its gonna be a hell of a fight, and the most fun I have is when I run a solid army against a friends solid army. 

Finally, what stella fails to understand is that the 'best' are the ones making the powerbuilds :sarcastichand:. Big player x goes to a tournament, beats everyones face in, and suddenly kids who want to get better buy a carbon copy army of his. In a year hell bring something different, and win again, repeating the cycle. I used to netlist too, but Ive risen above it, to the point where I only seek online advice for tactics and pointing out a lists weakness, rather than having my army built. I took a nid list id played 10 practice games with tops to a 40+ person tournament and got 3rd. Had no internet advice other than what I already knew, "hive guard are good, use them". And im not nearly as good as your top 40k players. 

When you start off in college you take classes, where other people tell you stuff. Later on when you go for a graduate degree you can start doing your own research. Thats what 40k is like. When you are new to competing you need tutors and people to help raise your skill level. When you hit the top 5% or 10% or 2% or whatever of players it becomes more like a circle of peers, and you bounce ideas off each other as opposed to just absorbing from others.


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## Stella Cadente (Dec 25, 2006)

ChugginDatHaterade said:


> the part about losing lots before you win is great advice, but you lost me at this point. What if both players run these popular netlists that require 0 brain power to win with? What determines the winner then? Dice rolls? The hand of god?


the usual, whoever has the biggest dick waving ego wins in those situations.


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## Sethis (Jun 4, 2009)

As a couple of other people have said; Target priority.

The aim is to create as large a power gap between the two armies as fast as possible.

Always neutralise the strongest threats to your own army first. For example: Yes, that Death Company in a Rhino looks scary, but if you're playing mech then the Rifleman Dreadnaught sat at the back is actually a bigger threat, because it's going to pop your transports so the DC can assault the soft squishy interior. If your tanks aren't popped, the DC can't do anything. Target the Dread first.


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## mynameisgrax (Sep 25, 2009)

The single most important factor in any 40k game is movement. Think very carefully about how your opponents will move through the game, and where they'll be by turn 5. Using fast units never hurts either, as it increases your options.


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## Arkeoptrix (Oct 8, 2010)

Stella Cadente said:


> the usual, whoever has the biggest dick waving ego wins in those situations.


Speaking of dick waving - it's very hard for your opponent to remember all the rules when you have some of that going on.


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## Orochi (Jan 28, 2009)

Forward planning.

40k is basically chess. Albeit a bit fancy.

Always plan ahead. Always make sure you have room to both advance and fall back. Establish what is a more reliable plan, even if it goes against your initial plan.
Work out Odds, and follow that. If X shoots at Y and will do Z amount of kills, are you happy with that?
Moving is important to forward planning. What will unit A do if it loses it's transport? Where will it go? Will your opponent seek to destroy it? Could it accomplish something else?

Never stop asking yourself questions. Always consider what'll happen next. Try and remain (in your head) 2-3 turns of what turn it actually is. And don't lose sight of where you want to be by those turns.


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## ROT (Jun 25, 2010)

Don't give up. When things look bad, it's probably nowhere near finished: Anything can happen.

Believe in the heart of the dice! (As Yu-Gi-Moto would say. :laugh


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## Stella Cadente (Dec 25, 2006)

deathbringer said:


> why the lack of love for essex stella? brilliant but why?


its hard to give love to something that looks like a shit stain on a map of britain.


Arkeoptrix said:


> Speaking of dick waving - it's very hard for your opponent to remember all the rules when you have some of that going on.


I have to be careful, I usually have someones eye out with my wang.........what?.....its true


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## Imperious (May 20, 2009)

Orochi said:


> Forward planning.
> 
> 40k is basically chess. Albeit a bit fancy.
> 
> ...


Actually in this case backgammon would be a more accurate comparison than chess. Chess is great if you live in a perfect world, where it's just about you and the opposing commander. 

Backgammon is more like real war in the sense that there are forces beyond your control. In this case... dice.


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## jaws900 (May 26, 2010)

I never thought it would be Jezlad who made this topic! I thought it would have been a newbie with less than 100 posts or something.

Anyway for the answer....cheat! :victory:
Ok so maybe not that but it would help to know what army you play as i could tell you a million things aobut various armys but none of them being relivent.


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## Wusword77 (Aug 11, 2008)

ROT said:


> Believe in the heart of the dice! (As Yu-Gi-Moto would say. :laugh


He just used magic to get whatever card he needed, by reshuffling the deck. IT WAS ALL A LIE! :ireful2:


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## ChugginDatHaterade (Nov 15, 2010)

Stella Cadente said:


> the usual, whoever has the biggest dick waving ego wins in those situations.


Are you kidding me? Thats your response? Ill remember whos opinion is completely irrelevant from now on.


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## Stella Cadente (Dec 25, 2006)

ChugginDatHaterade said:


> Are you kidding me? Thats your response? Ill remember whos opinion is completely irrelevant from now on.


that should be easy to remember, after all, your typng it.

ZING


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## DeathJester921 (Feb 15, 2009)

Don't think of it as a game. Think of it more as a real battle. Study your enemies tactics, and think of how you can best counter them. Study the army and what types of units it consists of, and think of what units you could best use to defeat them. Right unit for the job applies here.


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## Then there were none (Nov 20, 2010)

Imperious said:


> Use loaded dice.


lol But that's cheating:grin:


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## jaws900 (May 26, 2010)

Wusword77 said:


> He just used magic to get whatever card he needed, by reshuffling the deck. IT WAS ALL A LIE! :ireful2:


you dare dis childrens card game. That it i'm totaly opening a can of Blue eyes white dragon on your ass


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## Abomination (Jul 6, 2008)

Think!

Do not rush or make decisions and judgments in haste or despair as that is when you will make the wrong call. Always take a moment to just step back and breathe.


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## Imperious (May 20, 2009)

Then there were none said:


> lol But that's cheating:grin:


I guess it really depends on how badly you want to win. :spiteful:


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## HOBO (Dec 7, 2007)

Know your Codex..inside out, back to front, and sideways even.

Most other things will flow from there.


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## Stephen_Newman (Jul 14, 2009)

It also helps to get a faint idea of what every unit from other codexes do. Just so you know what to kill first. Sounds simple but new units like the new beastmasters simply confused me at first


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## Serpion5 (Mar 19, 2010)

I`d say you need to lose your current mentality. Playing purely to win is not gonna be fun, especially if you`re out of practice.


But... If you insist.

Do some research beforehand. Particularly the newer codexes and the current rulebook. Take note of what will work in particular scenarios and what won`t, and if you can strive to put your opponent in a no win situation.

1: "Wow, so your terminators can rip apart a Land Raider? That`s fantastic!" _Serpion grins malevolently..._ "Here, termies. Have thirty hormagaunts." 

2: "Really? Your termagants shot down a squad of space marines?" _Serpion narrows gaze..._ "War Walker, Charge!" 

3: "So you`ve never lost to necrons before?" _Serpion laughs..._ "Well, let`s see what we can do about that..."


But no matter how good a player you are, you _will_ lose games now and then. Especially in scenario 3...


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## Jezlad (Oct 14, 2006)

Thanks for all the advice guys. I'm surprised there wasn't more deployment type advice.

Anyone got a few simple tips on deployment?


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## ROT (Jun 25, 2010)

Pray that you get to deploy second! That's my advice.

I have never, ever, ever benefited from deploying first..

When deploying; you can sometimes try and avoid nasty things completely. :laugh:

My Eldar mate deploys the Avatar and 2 Wraithlords in 1 block; a lot of the time I can deploy around that, and render them useless.

- Don't be afraid to deploy as far back as you can; it's not always beneficial to deploy as far forward as you can (all-be-it that I do, because of how wrecklessly I play), but just think about it.

- Try and picture how the turns will play out, if you think you're opponent will move some TH/SS termies, in a certain path - Don't put a Dreadnought there. J

Sometimes just thinking, and re-thinking, then re-thinking your 're-thoughts'- is the only advice I can offer. You'd be surprised how easy it is to make a stupid mistake when deploying - which can drastically ruin your chances.


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## Hellados (Sep 16, 2009)

ive learnt to keep similar things together, ie both my baals or vindicators close together. the reason for this is that it concentrats my enemy on one seemingly easy goal therfore making it easy for me to counter this 

keeping all or atleast 10-15 Assault marines together therefore chargning in on one turn is always good for a laugh


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## ROT (Jun 25, 2010)

Another thing:

If you're flanking; try to keep both prongs of the assault balanced; to make target priority tough for the opponent.

If you have one side with 4 Abaddon the despoilers, 20 Land Raiders and 600 Terminators - they're going to choose to move to the side with 1 rhino of Noise marines. (Yes, ok that's exaggerating a bit, but you get my point).


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## shas'o Thraka (Jan 4, 2010)

Don't forget your models when you're gunna play a game.


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## Khorothis (May 12, 2009)

I found that when you deploy you should always take time to check who sees who because there can be lots of bitching about cover saves, which can be used to your advantage. For instance, on one occasion my opponent deployed his Predator so well I couldn't see it... or thats what he thought.  My Oblits moved some 2-3" to the left and I could see the turret's right side. We checked it a few times and we agreed that I can only see a handful of pixels of it, so he gets a 3+ cover save. Which he failed of course and then I blew up the tank on Turn 1. Crazy shit, thats all I can say about that game.


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## Ascendant (Dec 11, 2008)

Only one tip?

Play imperial guard.


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## Serpion5 (Mar 19, 2010)

Deployment is easy. Keep your guys within reac of each other, but not so close as to give your opponent a double charge oppurtunity he could exploit.


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## Aramoro (Oct 7, 2009)

My advice would be have a quick flick through your opponents list and codex so you know what all his shit does. Things like Kharn gets 2D6 Armour Pen, Harllies ignore terrain, Disruption Pods give a 4+ cover save from over 12" etc etc. Just make sure you know the army specific and unit specific rules then you can play appropriately and not get any nasty surprises.

Also note what your opponent doesn't have, Genestealers don't have grenades is a good example.


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## LordWaffles (Jan 15, 2008)

Listen to LordWaffles' posts.


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## Styro-J (Jan 20, 2009)

definitely good to be able to anticipate your opponents. If have a good idea what oh they'll be doing then you should be able to adjust accordingly. 

Or just do what i do and pick a theme. I adjust my lists to accommodate the theme and typically as long as i keep changing it up regularly my opponents have trouble keepin up.


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## MaidenManiac (Oct 2, 2008)

Read through each codex, specially new ones and dont hesitate asking about stuff that "sounds a little too good". The reason to read all books at least once is to have a half'n'half insight about whats right or wrong. People are still quite good at misinterpreting the rules...


Deployment tip of the day:
Spearhead deployment means that you only can deploy in your quarter, but reserves can come in on the whole table edge. Keep that in mind both when placing objectives and when deploying your army. Its quite often closer to the opponent from your table edge on your quarter that is adjacent to his


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