# Emperor Vs The God Emperor



## wd6669 (Feb 27, 2008)

okay lately i've been thinking and I was wondering if the Emperor is really the god or did belief in him make another chaos god? my reasons behind this is the miracles and psychic abilities some Imperials have. I know the emperor was like a Mega psychic but I doubte he even had the power the current "God Emperor" has now. I have also heard about the Star child theory but I thought GW took that out now


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## Lord Lucius (Sep 18, 2008)

the "GODEMPEROR" and the emperor are one and the same(I think)


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## Israfil (Jul 6, 2008)

yep the emperor has always kinda been the God Emperor. since he was a super powerful psyker, and during the Great Crusade some dudes called him a god and after he was put on the throne these groups all formed into one group creating the Adeptus Ministorum and the Imperial Creed


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## Huffy (Nov 25, 2008)

well, if the emperor fought the god emperor, the emperor would win since the GE is a corpse, but they should have the same power, i don't think eating psykers make you more powerful, otherwise abbadon would have gobbled all the psykers in the galaxy


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## steck (Feb 12, 2009)

they are the same, while he was alive he discouraged worshiping him (from one of the heresy books, the DA one). when he died the imperium decided to start worshiping him, but the marines didnt because they had known him, thats why the marines say emperor and the IG say god emperor


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## Lord of Rebirth (Jun 7, 2008)

The emperor is not a god or even close though he is generally considered the most powerful human psychic of all time. Either way he can't even leave a stasis throne so I say he auto-sucks.


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## dtq (Feb 19, 2009)

The "God Emperor" line is a creation to hold the empire together. to keep the local populations under control etc. The Emperor himself though was no "normal man" he was not even a normal psychic. 

As far as I know he is coming up 48 thousand years old by the "current timeline" His creation dates back to around the beginning of human civilisation, when tribal shamans (first psychics) started to realise they were losing their powers (including reincarnation) they eventually all got together to determine what to do about their weakening bond with the warp. What they decided on was a mass suicide and to all choose to reincarnat in one form, to bond their power \ souls together together they would have the power to continue to reincarnate and could maintain their link with the warp.

The emperor is not one man with one soul, he is one man with thousands of souls. Down through the ages he has watched over mankind continuing his position as "shaman" quietly and in the back ground up until the time of the age of strife when he finally decided it was time to step up to the front. 

He may not be "A God" He did not see himself as a god, but he was also far from a "normal man" he was immortal and holds a huge pychic presence and 48000 years of wisdom.

However to say the Emperor is not a "God" you have to define what a God is, He was immortal with a huge range of power, he may well have been the equal of any of the other "Gods"


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## Micklez (Nov 22, 2008)

Very good reply mate +rep i think (hopefully it works XD). Until now i had just thought of the Emperor as a man that had a region built around him (ie. like the roman empire with the ceaser's and the japanese with their emperor). But what do we class as a god??? Again, very good post :biggrin:


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## G_Morgan (Mar 3, 2008)

Strictly speaking the Emperor is not a god but neither are any of the other entities that claim to be gods. According to fluff the Emperor is actually older than any of the chaos gods. Khorne was born in the 14th century AD while the Emperor was 8k BC. So the Emperor is at least 9k years older than the chaos 'gods'.

The oldest entities in the universe are far and away the C'tan but even these are not really gods. To be a god your power needs to come from outside of ordinary existence (ordinary existence being composed of the materium and the immaterium). Since all these entities derive their power from one, the other or a combination of both it is safe to say that none of them are gods.


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## 1001st Son (Feb 28, 2009)

I agree with dtq in that the divine aspect of him may be an aid for keeping the human race united in belief if not anything else, but I had never heard that story of his creation, so it brings to light another interesting take on the situation.
While being one and the same, I think the Emperor and God Emperor are powerful in different ways, most notably that the Emperor could walk around and, if need be, kill things. I've never heard of an instance where the God Emperor has reached out with his psychic power to kill anything since he was interred into the Throne. Then again, aside from Horus, I don't remember him killing much anyway. But meh, I still prefer to call him the Corpse Emperor. XD

-1001


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## dtq (Feb 19, 2009)

1001st Son said:


> I agree with dtq in that the divine aspect of him may be an aid for keeping the human race united in belief if not anything else, but I had never heard that story of his creation, so it brings to light another interesting take on the situation.
> While being one and the same, I think the Emperor and God Emperor are powerful in different ways, most notably that the Emperor could walk around and, if need be, kill things. I've never heard of an instance where the God Emperor has reached out with his psychic power to kill anything since he was interred into the Throne. Then again, aside from Horus, I don't remember him killing much anyway. But meh, I still prefer to call him the Corpse Emperor. XD
> 
> -1001


Its strongly suggested that the emperor caused the warp storms during the age of apostasy. Objecting to the way the general citizens of the empire were being mistreated by the ecclisiarchy for personal greed of the cardinals. Also its suggested that the emperor took some more direct intervention action at times such as destroying an entire war fleet of the frateris templar when they went to destroy every living creature on a world which had rejected the ecclisiarch of the time (vandire) as a traitor to the imperium. 

Its also suggested that Sebastian Thor who eventually reformed the church received visions \ revelations direct from the emperor.

A further possible intervention from the emperor around the same time was that the sisters of battle who at the time had been seriously corrupted by the ecclisiarch (he had renamed them brides of the emperor....) The adeptus custodes Took the head of the sister to a secret meeting, and when she came back she personally took the head of the ecclisiarch. Its suggested that she was taken to the golden throne where the emperor in someway intervened to show her the error of her ways and how far the sisters had been corrupted.


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## chrisman 007 (Jan 3, 2008)

The Emperor is the God Emperor. Suggesting anything else is HERESY!!!!


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## 1001st Son (Feb 28, 2009)

dtq said:


> Its strongly suggested that the emperor caused the warp storms during the age of apostasy. Objecting to the way the general citizens of the empire were being mistreated by the ecclisiarchy for personal greed of the cardinals. Also its suggested that the emperor took some more direct intervention action at times such as destroying an entire war fleet of the frateris templar when they went to destroy every living creature on a world which had rejected the ecclisiarch of the time (vandire) as a traitor to the imperium.
> 
> Its also suggested that Sebastian Thor who eventually reformed the church received visions revelations direct from the emperor.
> 
> A further possible intervention from the emperor around the same time was that the sisters of battle who at the time had been seriously corrupted by the ecclisiarch (he had renamed them brides of the emperor....) The adeptus custodes Took the head of the sister to a secret meeting, and when she came back she personally took the head of the ecclisiarch. Its suggested that she was taken to the golden throne where the emperor in someway intervened to show her the error of her ways and how far the sisters had been corrupted.


I see. Thanks for the backstory. It still seems that after he was interred, he stopped actually harming anyone with his power. I suppose that's because, even if he did want to, he'd have to redirect his power from doing other Emperor-y things. It's pretty amazing how much he can do with only a few living cells left.


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## Cpt. Grice (Feb 27, 2009)

The emporer set out from terra on the great crusades
One of the aims was to free mankind from the shackles of religion but some idiots started Lectio Divinitus against the emporer's will. After he defeated Horus those idiots could openly be thankful and started raising shrines after him. Eventully hte entire imperium in the grip of these madpersonal. The emporer was just an incredily powerful human who turned himself into a primarch. he also had an incrediple amount of phyic power which so far has prevented the chaos gods from taking this realm


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## Sanguine1 (May 9, 2009)

Yes once the emperor sat upon the throne after Horus broke his body to to speak, he really doesn't do much now but that's because he's not really able to. The throne is all that is keeping him alive. Now whether or not he is a "God Emperor" is another crap sandwhich that the order of man has been eating for a long time. 

I'm not too familiar with the emperor's story about his rise to power, i do know he is the reincarnation of countless shamans who commited a mass suicide. 

However he strongly opposed anyone worhsipping him as a god. There is evidence of this when he chastises Lorgar for setting up shrines to him while the word bearers conquer in his name. 

However in the Horus Heresy novel "False Gods" there is a small example of the emperor's power which may lead many to believe he is a god. The instance happens when a remembrancer on the 63rd expedition uses an imperial double eagle insignia to drive a monster back to the warp from which it was summoned.


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## BloodAngelsfan (Jan 22, 2009)

The Emperor is the "God Emperor", even though he never proclaimed himself a god. Some other idiots did. :nono:


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## Inquisitor Einar (Mar 6, 2009)

The God Emperor is the same as the Emperor, except now his body lies in shambles and sits on the golden throne. His Mind and psyche reach out and protect humanity from the horrors of corruption by chaos.
Those that are truly faithfull to Him, receive his blessings and visions to help guide humanity on the course of righteousness. Sebastian Thor was such an individual, as were the heads of the brides of the emperor, who were indeed taken to the hall of the golden throne by the custodes and spent a night there, after which they declared Vandire a heretic and a traitor to humanity, and promptly executed him on the spot.
After this, the brides of the emperor reformed into the Adepta Sororitas, who as the God-Emperor's most faithfull receive his visions and blessings.
Hence they are able to do the many acts of faith that surpass the power of mortals, yet are not psychic phenomena. They are also quite well shielded against psychic powers.
( rules wise, they can negate any psychic power aimed at them on a roll of 5+, and treat force weapons as regular power weapons against them )


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## Khorothis (May 12, 2009)

G_Morgan said:


> Strictly speaking the Emperor is not a god but neither are any of the other entities that claim to be gods. According to fluff the Emperor is actually older than any of the chaos gods. Khorne was born in the 14th century AD while the Emperor was 8k BC. So the Emperor is at least 9k years older than the chaos 'gods'.
> 
> The oldest entities in the universe are far and away the C'tan but even these are not really gods. To be a god your power needs to come from outside of ordinary existence (ordinary existence being composed of the materium and the immaterium). Since all these entities derive their power from one, the other or a combination of both it is safe to say that none of them are gods.


Very well, said, +rep. This pretty much settles the question in my opinion, even if you say, as Inquisitor Einar did, that he is able to grant powers to whomsoever he deems fit, because both the Chaos Gods and the C'tan are capable of doing the same. However, being able to lend someone your power could very possibly be the consequence of you being so powerful its not worth measuring, which is the case if you're talking about any "deity" in the WH40K universe.



1001st Son said:


> I see. Thanks for the backstory. It still seems that after he was interred, he stopped actually harming anyone with his power. I suppose that's because, even if he did want to, he'd have to redirect his power from doing other Emperor-y things. It's pretty amazing how much he can do with only a few living cells left.


He doesn't need to kill things personally. There are the SM and the IG for that, plus the Ordos and Tzeentch knows what. If you consider the deaths he is responsible for, the only ones who are at his level are the C'tan and the Tyranids; even the Chaos Gods combined don't have as many frags as he does. "For the sake of Humanity", eh? You gotta be kidding me.


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