# How many people would like a wargaming/gaming pub in London!



## ZARDRA (Nov 12, 2008)

Hi guys 
im posting this as i am in the process of getting or rather attempting to get the funding for a pub in London, i've worked in pubs for many years but have always wanted a gaming pub were you can play our favourite game ( any system ) and have a beer without having to go all the way to nottingham. The idea is a simple one, make a pub which caters for the gaming community in north to central london, on site would be gaming tables, a studio for guest artists to come and show of there work and skills, a medium sized hobby/art store located on the top floor for any hobby needs and on the ground floor a pub offering food, beer and live entertainment during the week.
so what im looking for is some feed back, how many people would be interested in a pub that was aimed at gamers, and before you ask it wont cost a fortune ever for the beer 
if any one has any ideas or comments please leave them on this thread as we will consider every thing you all say.


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## The Irish Commissar (Jan 31, 2012)

I'm not from England, but I don't see why anyone wouldn't want this. It sounds fantastic. :good:


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## Nordicus (May 3, 2013)

The Irish Commissar said:


> I'm not from England, but I don't see why anyone wouldn't want this. It sounds fantastic.


This. I would kill to have something like this in my hometown!


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## Bindi Baji (Apr 23, 2009)

I love the idea and I would certainly go (as would the missus)
but having seen speciality pubs, bars and clubs fail far more often then not,
I can't say I would be convinced in anyones ability to keep it open a year.

That said,
if you do get it off the ground please message me and I will attempt to help drum up support and assistance for you.............


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## jondoe297 (Jan 6, 2010)

Sounds like an excellent idea!


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## ZARDRA (Nov 12, 2008)

Thanks guys 
Like I said I've worked in pubs for many years and have been building up to this for some time. I'm doing it as a kickstarter, once it's ready to go ill add the info for you all. As for it being a success it's going to take time going to take time to get every ones attention but once were established it should be fine. Plus it's not just a pub we will also have our own hobby stir with paints and other artist materials ect. 
Fingers crossed any way


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## bitsandkits (Mar 18, 2008)

Im gonna say no, personally i dont think its a good idea and i dont think that it will work outside of GW HQ.

I dont think there is enough of a concentration of gamers anywhere in the UK to warrant a public house catering for them, Pubs generally are having a terrible time getting people through the door without making a pub dedicated to our nerdy hobby, i admire that you want to mix your trade and your hobby passion, but somethings are not meant to be, you have a back ground in the licence trade, i would suggest opening or running a pub that caters for as many different diverse people as possible who have loads of disposable income and dont mind paying for over priced beer, most wargamers seem to be living in poverty, claiming that they regularly have to choose between grey plastic crack or eating/heating/rent, these are hardly the demographic to go after if you want to keep you pub business viable.
The other thing to consider would be the brewery's, i assume you would be a free house as no brewery would offer a tenancy for a pub via this route, and margins in a free/lease house are negligible and often come with strings attached and often require a significant investment and to be perfectly honest they may not be willing to supply to a pub for wargamers, not to mention its alot of graft for very little reward.

My advice would be if you want to run a pub, do it, but find one with a function room, and start a gaming club in the fucntion room, run the pub for the public and enjoy gaming nights in the function room for the gamers,but remember one is dying trade and the other is a niche business, if you try and puch them together you will likely end up with a dying niche .


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## venomlust (Feb 9, 2010)

From my perspective @bitsandkits has the right of it. I can't see a pub dedicated to tabletop gaming being your bread and butter, but a pub that has extra options could work. Of course I'm not from the UK, but it would be the same over here.


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## SwedeMarine (Jun 3, 2013)

Love the idea but i have to agree with B/K here. Focus on running a pub and if youre lucky enough to get a locale to have a function room then you can cater to wargamers more so on the side. The other route you could go (and i have seen this work) is to start with a comic book or hobby store and then expand and offer alcohol for sale. it just wouldn't be a true pub. 
Your Dream i think is everyone elses dream but its still a business and how you would make a living.


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## Old Man78 (Nov 3, 2011)

I'm with @bitsandkits mate, do not combine the two, run the pub as a pub but one that is gamer friendly, use the function room for gaming events, maybe run a local tourney out of it, let the place get a name as a "gamers" pub


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## LazyG (Sep 15, 2008)

It is a great idea but it calls for a very small demographic that is widely spread. Worse your target group are socially unpopular, and if they (the gamers) are in the pub then others are less likely to come in. Plus to make the pub work you want people drinking heavily, and i think the games would mean you'd have people drinking more slowly and taking up more space than you'd see in a regular pub. 

How about 'club pub' - a pub with a function room/salon which the bar extends into but that is somehow separated from the main room. Offer use of it to various clubs, wargamers, boardgamers, sports clubs, anything. Make the function room multifunctional and include tables of various sorts etc. 

I can see this working more than your initial idea at least. And as long as you maintain some separation between spaces and do not advertise solely with 40k miniatures then you should not drive away normal punters.


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## Adramalech (Nov 10, 2009)

venomlust said:


> From my perspective @bitsandkits has the right of it. I can't see a pub dedicated to tabletop gaming being your bread and butter, but a pub that has extra options could work. Of course I'm not from the UK, but it would be the same over here.


Seconded.


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## Bindi Baji (Apr 23, 2009)

LazyG said:


> How about 'club pub' - a pub with a function room/salon which the bar extends into but that is somehow separated from the main room. Offer use of it to various clubs, wargamers, boardgamers, sports clubs, anything. Make the function room multifunctional and include tables of various sorts etc.


Food/nibbles would be a necessity and some way to take money off gamers without taking the piss would be another difficulty.

Back in the nineties when there were lots of rock metaller pubs and sports bars this would have worked,
now it's pretty much only bar/restaurants and wetherspoons that survive.

Alternatively if you went back in time and killed a few dozen bankers on either side of the atlantic then the original plan would probably work.


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## ZARDRA (Nov 12, 2008)

ok guys i think i have not been very clear, when i say it will be a gaming pub i dont mean it will only be targeted at gamers! the site i have in mind already has a great trade and following as its also very close to a london football club and takes a lot of its trade through football, its also a 3 floor operation with only the ground floor being used at any one time, my plan would be to use the ground floor as a pub for any one and every one, dressing it to fit in with the idea of whats in nottingham, shields and dummy swords ect. the place i have in mind already looks like its from a dwarves city so just need tweaking, the first floor as a hobby friendly area with gaming tables available, a studio area for in house painting projects or guest artists to come and show of there work at any events we organise and host and finally on the top floor convert it into an art store/hobby centre were you can buy and even sell model sets and other bits and bobs along with a host of artist materials. i have worked in pubs a long time and i no that to think i could solely cater for gamers would be amazing but like every one has said it would be very difficult. the site i am after is vastly under used and has the potential to do so much more, gaming being the main aim to give people a place to go if there in london and want to have a few games with friends over a few drinks or even if they want to go some were and do some hobby ect.
so it is a gaming pub but NOT entirely driven by gamers, i have also spoken with the company who own the property and have already been given the green light to do what i have planned.
sorry if i have been a bit confusing with this, and thanks for the info so far 
Oh and one big thing!!! whe i say gamers and hobby i am not aiming soly at 40k or warhammer EVERY and i mean every gaming system is welcome, if i can even help promote new company's we will as there is soooooo much more out there than just GW.


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## bitsandkits (Mar 18, 2008)

ZARDRA said:


> ok guys i think i have not been very clear, when i say it will be a gaming pub i dont mean it will only be targeted at gamers! the site i have in mind already has a great trade and following as its also very close to a london football club and takes a lot of its trade through football, its also a 3 floor operation with only the ground floor being used at any one time, my plan would be to use the ground floor as a pub for any one and every one, dressing it to fit in with the idea of whats in nottingham, shields and dummy swords ect. the place i have in mind already looks like its from a dwarves city so just need tweaking, the first floor as a hobby friendly area with gaming tables available, a studio area for in house painting projects or guest artists to come and show of there work at any events we organise and host and finally on the top floor convert it into an art store/hobby centre were you can buy and even sell model sets and other bits and bobs along with a host of artist materials. i have worked in pubs a long time and i no that to think i could solely cater for gamers would be amazing but like every one has said it would be very difficult. the site i am after is vastly under used and has the potential to do so much more, gaming being the main aim to give people a place to go if there in london and want to have a few games with friends over a few drinks or even if they want to go some were and do some hobby ect.
> so it is a gaming pub but NOT entirely driven by gamers, i have also spoken with the company who own the property and have already been given the green light to do what i have planned.
> sorry if i have been a bit confusing with this, and thanks for the info so far
> Oh and one big thing!!! whe i say gamers and hobby i am not aiming soly at 40k or warhammer EVERY and i mean every gaming system is welcome, if i can even help promote new company's we will as there is soooooo much more out there than just GW.


Well in that case, sounds great crack on with it


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## InkedDnA (Jul 8, 2011)

Come to vegas and open that amazing shop here in sin city


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## Bindi Baji (Apr 23, 2009)

ZARDRA said:


> ok guys i think i have not been very clear, when i say it will be a gaming pub i dont mean it will only be targeted at gamers! the site i have in mind already has a great trade and following as its also very close to a london football club and takes a lot of its trade through football, its also a 3 floor operation with only the ground floor being used at any one time, my plan would be to use the ground floor as a pub for any one and every one, dressing it to fit in with the idea of whats in nottingham, shields and dummy swords ect. the place i have in mind already looks like its from a dwarves city so just need tweaking, the first floor as a hobby friendly area with gaming tables available, a studio area for in house painting projects or guest artists to come and show of there work at any events we organise and host and finally on the top floor convert it into an art store/hobby centre were you can buy and even sell model sets and other bits and bobs along with a host of artist materials. i have worked in pubs a long time and i no that to think i could solely cater for gamers would be amazing but like every one has said it would be very difficult. the site i am after is vastly under used and has the potential to do so much more, gaming being the main aim to give people a place to go if there in london and want to have a few games with friends over a few drinks or even if they want to go some were and do some hobby ect.
> so it is a gaming pub but NOT entirely driven by gamers, i have also spoken with the company who own the property and have already been given the green light to do what i have planned.
> sorry if i have been a bit confusing with this, and thanks for the info so far
> Oh and one big thing!!! whe i say gamers and hobby i am not aiming soly at 40k or warhammer EVERY and i mean every gaming system is welcome, if i can even help promote new company's we will as there is soooooo much more out there than just GW.


It's not in Tottenham is it? (shudder)


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## jondoe297 (Jan 6, 2010)

Could be, didnt specify good!


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## ZARDRA (Nov 12, 2008)

Please don't ever use that word again!!!!! And no it's most certainly not in that place!!! It's in a far better part of north london


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## Wookiepelt (Jan 29, 2013)

ZARDRA said:


> Please don't ever use that word again!!!!! And no it's most certainly not in that place!!! It's in a far better part of north london


Hampstead?!? :grin:


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## ZARDRA (Nov 12, 2008)

Islington


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## Wookiepelt (Jan 29, 2013)

ZARDRA said:


> Islington


Ooo... the new up & coming trendy sector of London... nice!


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## Kreuger (Aug 30, 2010)

It sounds like you have really thought your project through. 

It also sounds like you might be onto something, if only because the current business is leasing property/floors it isn't using, so you have an opportunity to do the same business with the pub and more business upstairs besides.

The one other part of this plan which might be difficult to manage is that you are planning 2 or 3 businesses in one. At any given time you would need to be managing a pub, a club, and a hobby store. Each is going to have different needs, stocks, and priorities. While you may know the pub business, you'll likely be managing several disparate inventories and different staff (I can't imagine pulling a waitress or bartender out of the pub to give painting lessons or sell art supplies). 

I'm not trying to be a nay-sayer, just a "think it all through and plan carefully"-sayer.

Best of luck and good fortunes!


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## jondoe297 (Jan 6, 2010)

I think it could be potentially be a nice mecca for gaming in the South East, I'd certainly arrange a trip up with some lads to check it out! 
Notts is to far to go on a reg basis


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## Bindi Baji (Apr 23, 2009)

ZARDRA said:


> Islington


Potentially the best place for it


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## LazyG (Sep 15, 2008)

Wait, you are going to kickstart it? What are you going to offer by way of inducement?


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## ZARDRA (Nov 12, 2008)

Kreuger said:


> It sounds like you have really thought your project through.
> 
> It also sounds like you might be onto something, if only because the current business is leasing property/floors it isn't using, so you have an opportunity to do the same business with the pub and more business upstairs besides.
> 
> ...


good question and im happy to say that the answer is that i have previously worked for GW, and have a team more or less ready to go, as well as that my fiancee runs an art store and will be coming into run the hobby / art store as well. ( i do love her ) all in all i have a team and support to make this happen all i need now is to make sure the comunity learns of what im doing and make any adjustments needed, then its time to launch the kickstarter! thanks for all the advice, also one thing to heresy-online it self, i would be more than happy to promote the forum if i can get some help passing the word around!


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## ZARDRA (Nov 12, 2008)

yes i am going to kickstart it, all that info will be up on the kickstarer itself, needless to say it will be worth every ones while who help get this of the ground. the basics and i mean basics would be life time free membership, pro painted armys for top backers, exclusive book signings. this is such a big thing to me that i want to make sure that every one that is involved no matter what level gets treated at a top level. 
i also plan live gigs for a range of music, big tournaments as well as helping new gaming systems a place to showcase there games. do what other company's wont do and give back to the hobby community that supports it!! with out peoples help this will not happen, and i learned a long time ago that you remember those that help you and help them when ever possible.


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## Kreuger (Aug 30, 2010)

It sounds like you are as prepared as anyone could be for this venture. Good luck!


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## morfangdakka (Dec 31, 2006)

I say go for it. I think it would be a good place to go for a drink and a game with my friends. I am not in London but it would be a worth while trip if I was close by. Best of luck let us know when the kickstart happens.


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## JAMOB (Dec 30, 2010)

I would love one! But... well... I kinda live in the US, so it wouldn't be very useful...


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## Zartosis (Oct 20, 2010)

Maybe you should have the shop on the first floor to help with suggestive selling when they go to the second floor.


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## The Irish Commissar (Jan 31, 2012)

Zartosis said:


> Maybe you should have the shop on the first floor to help with suggestive selling when they go to the second floor.


Nah he wants the pub on the first floor. If people want to go to a pub and have to go through a board games store you will loose people quick.


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## Zartosis (Oct 20, 2010)

The Irish Commissar said:


> Nah he wants the pub on the first floor. If people want to go to a pub and have to go through a board games store you will loose people quick.


I presumed he want the pub on the ground floor? :scratchhead:


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## The Irish Commissar (Jan 31, 2012)

Zartosis said:


> I presumed he want the pub on the ground floor? :scratchhead:


Sorry, I thought when you said 1st floor that you meant the ground floor. Sorry, heads not in the right place today. Ye what you said now makes sense.


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## NoHeresyOnlyTruth (Apr 20, 2010)

Well sad to say not really a good idea "in Canada at least" I think most people in this hobby are young and got a temper. Booze may help cause the temper lol.

I can see this 2 drunks playing a game falling all over the place if they don't throw up on the table or start a fight within 12 minutes it would be amazing. Not to mention the older pub club would not want the young people around "but hell if your older then 35 going to a pub to drink you need to rethink your life lol". Then there is the hole thing of parents not letting there kids to go to the shop because it is around a bunch of old drunks.

So young people keep away avid drinkers
Old drunks keep away the younger gamers

I see it like having a lazer tag group in a strip club. Well there may be a group who do both you will push a part of each group away.

But all my info is from Canada where we love a few things. To fight to drink and to..... adult content. Most people playing boardgames/games don't drink or other stuff like that. The guys who drink want to play hockey and knock a few teeth.


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## The Irish Commissar (Jan 31, 2012)

NoHeresyOnlyTruth said:


> "but hell if your older then 35 going to a pub to drink you need to rethink your life lol"..


I'm pretty sure that line offends my entire countries population :laugh:.


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## NoHeresyOnlyTruth (Apr 20, 2010)

ah none ment sorry lol. in my experince people older then 35 in a bar "not a pub and grill ect" are off. The tend to be drunks "with a drinking problem" or after youngers.

This is my experince in Canada. We all got booze in the fridge but not at a bar unless you are looking for trouble. Pub and grill usually guys night out where you get food and booze lol.

Strange thing is I never touched a smoke drank a beer or did a single drug in my life. But the boys like there booze so I always got some in the house.


btw would you ban all kids from your place like check id everywhere? If the club is on the second floor there would need to be a way to keep the id checker well in check.


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## Wookiepelt (Jan 29, 2013)

I think this is more specifically targeted at the grown-up gamers. Our local gaming club used to have the weekly gaming night arrangement with a local pub which has a large under-utilised dining annex. So 15-20 grown-up gamers would turn up from 5pm onwards on gaming night and have access to 8 6x4 gaming tables (that were placed on top of the re-arranged dining tables) and played away till 10:30pm when they ring the last bell. Everyone simply gets their refreshments from the bar (be it soft drinks or pints of Lager/Ale/Guinness) and get on with their 40k/x-wing/bolt action games. Quite a few members even order their suppers there as well and it works. The gaming tables were stored in the pub's facilities during the rest of the week so it was all very civilised and it was great.

Pity that we don't go there any more as the pub's annex started having issues with the roof and we were getting major leaks so had to make other arrangements for club nights now at a different venue.


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## Bindi Baji (Apr 23, 2009)

The Irish Commissar said:


> I'm pretty sure that line offends my entire countries population :laugh:.


rubbish, I have heard of at least one irish teetotaller, 
mind you he hadn't started secondary school at that point.........:biggrin:


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## The Irish Commissar (Jan 31, 2012)

Bindi Baji said:


> rubbish, I have heard of at least one irish teetotaller,
> mind you he hadn't started secondary school at that point.........:biggrin:


In Ireland if a child can't down a pint of Guinness by the age of 5 he was born in the wrong country. 
( imperial guard codex owners should get that .)


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## ZARDRA (Nov 12, 2008)

ok guys the kickstarer will be going live later this week, as for questions on people being drunk and abusive that will not happen or be tolerated in any shape or form, its going to be a place were you can come and enjoy yourself, with friends and family, not turn into a place were people think they are space wolves and can have a fight. its for older and younger people, there will be set days for different gaming experience levels so no 8 year old kids will be facing a 4o year olds beard army. well not unless they can kick some ass at that age any way 
just wanted to say thank you to every one for your feedback, its been a real help. ill post again once the kickstarter is up and running.


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## newt_e (Jan 1, 2008)

ZARDRA said:


> Islington


Ah, just a few miles from where I live so I'd certainly be interested...


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## Bindi Baji (Apr 23, 2009)

You missed the next line 


ZARDRA said:


> Islington
> But don't tell that newt_e fella, wouldn't want him here


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## Svartmetall (Jun 16, 2008)

If one of these opened in Nottingham it'd probably be my local*



* although it had better have San Miguel & Fullers ESB on tap :biggrin:


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

I'd go! hell, they have Starcraft bars.


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## ZARDRA (Nov 12, 2008)

T-4 weeks and counting the kick starter is going live in 4 weeks guys


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## ZARDRA (Nov 12, 2008)

well guys its finally on kickstarter so have a good look and back us if you can 
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/873465490/the-orcs-head-londons-premier-gaming-and-hobby-pub


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## slaaneshy (Feb 20, 2008)

Some honest feedback.

You will never raise £160k with what your are offering.
Selling memberships will not raise enough and quite frankly £100 for 8 months membership and entry to a couple of events is not worth it - especially for those people who are not that close to the venue to make use of regular membership.

Personally I would come and visit, but only a couple of times a year, so I have no incentive to buy in to your current deals.

Think broader, say a discount card for backers on drinks, meals, events, table hire etc, something I could use on an adhoc bases, not get used up in 8 months and will rarely use in that time?

I wish you luck, but I seriously doubt you will raise the type of money you are after on kickstarter, and you should look for proper investors willing to stump up big bucks.


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## ZARDRA (Nov 12, 2008)

If only it were so easy :cray: 
unfortunately kickstarter have rules that stop me doing a discount card but it does not say that i wont do them if were funded, its difficult to come up with things that you can use as rewards for a kickstarter like this one, there are a lot of things i would have done but i also have to consider the fact that its a bar and we need to earn money to stay open, doing discounts will happen once were open but it wont be every day. there is also a lot more that will be updated via kickstarter that will be going on. thanks for your comments guys


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## ZARDRA (Nov 12, 2008)

hi guys ive updated the rewards on the kickstarter as well as some adding some more information so please have a look!!! also we have a number of pro painters reaching out to us that also want to come on board to offer there services, a note on the studio, we will also have our own in house laser cutter were you can come along with your own design for scenery or buildings and we will be able to produce them at a high quality in laser ply wood. 
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects...-and-hobby-pub


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## Snokvor (Aug 3, 2014)

According to the law, beer and teenagers don't mix well but if you want to run an 18+ joint with hookers and Blackjack as well then more power to you.


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## Roninman (Jul 23, 2010)

There are gaming cafes at greece, which looks to be wonderfull places. Pub of course is little different, but idea is still the same.

Check this excellent Rahdo's video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J_NcWsQZxsk&index=6&list=PLmQverenaaqJi0a-R3Yi9vcBN1ZDrlnLr

If you want to start this thing go spread word at BGG and you might luckily get many people.


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