# The 'Lost' Primarchs.



## Zooey72 (Mar 25, 2008)

On this forum there has been a lot of debate about the 2 that 'didn't make it'.

As far as game mechanics go I think they had the 2 lost legions because than you can create your own traitor or loyalist army and can say "I am the lost Legion". It sells minis.

That being said, in "Horus Rising" Horus confesses that each primarch was a reflection of their father. The Emp. signed off on killing 2 Legions and 2 sons. What did they do? More than that, what did they do that was a reflection on dad that the Emperor had to put a stop to it? Even more importantly, these 2 bastard sons are a part of what makes the Emperor the Emperor.


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## gothik (May 29, 2010)

i don't think you will ever find out what they did and unless GW change thier minds, they are as you said (correct me if i am wrong) there for the fan base to pain thier own models write thier fan fic, They get mentioned in the books as its part of GW Law but as for wether you find out anymore about them in the Cannon sense, thats probably not going to happen


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## ckcrawford (Feb 4, 2009)

The BL authors have entertained certain aspects, however it is important to note nothing is congruent. 

One of the most important pieces of lore on the Lost Legions that I don't think has been looked at enough in my opinion... in fact, in some ways it endangers what Gamesworkshop is using the lost legions for, is when Malcador thinks the statues of the lost 2 primarchs should be destroyed. The Emperor kind of laughs it off and thinks its ridiculous. I think it is referred to in the Lightning Tower Audio if my mind serves me correctly. I think this might be either very telling or too much information (depending how you view the legions) because the Emperor can be very cold when something is very serious. We view how he dealt with the Word Bearers for being what he believed as a failure of a legion, as well as Magnus' disobedience, it kind of removes many possibilities of the mystery of the Lost Legions.


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## gothik (May 29, 2010)

not got that one CK but will have to get it when things get better finance wise


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## Vitarus (Apr 9, 2012)

I don't know that it's possible for the Lost to have done anything worse than what Horus, Lorgar, et al, did. And I imagine the Emperor would've handled things the same way after the Heresy if it had been possible. But the Legions were too big, and word was spread too far and wide, by then to erase them from all record and memory. I assume the Lost tried to take over, or maybe tried to break away and form their own Empires. And it was early enough for the Emperor to eradicate them, and all possible witnesses.


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## Zooey72 (Mar 25, 2008)

My over all question though is if you take Horus at his word in "Horus Rising", than all of the primarchs represented a certain aspect of the Emperor. What was so horrid about the 2 that the Emp. sicked his wolves on them? And to go further, in "The First Heretic" Russ did not want to see Lorgar or his legion destroyed. Apparently it was messy work killing 2 of his brothers and he didn't want more blood on his hands, despite the fact that he probably didn't like Lorgar.


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## Khorne's Fist (Jul 18, 2008)

ckcrawford said:


> I think it is referred to in the Lightning Tower Audio if my mind serves me correctly. I think this might be either very telling or too much information (depending how you view the legions) because the Emperor can be very cold when something is very serious. We view how he dealt with the Word Bearers for being what he believed as a failure of a legion, as well as Magnus' disobedience, it kind of removes many possibilities of the mystery of the Lost Legions.


I think you might be a bit mixed up. The Lightining Tower is Dorn and Malcador ruminating on what's happened, and IIRC the two plinths are empty at that stage. 

Also, at the BL Live event in Dublin last year I'm fairly sure one of the writers mentioned that they had been told to rein in the Missing Legion Easter eggs that had been creeping in more and more.


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## F22Reject (May 2, 2011)

We are better off not knowing. Regardless of the author, there is no way that they can write a story on it and we, as a community, would be happy with it. Much better off being a mystery for all time.


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## Stephen74 (Oct 1, 2010)

I can't remember what books influenced my feelings on the lost legions but I get the impression that one had a genetic flaw that lead to the need for their destruction and the other didn't agree with what the emperor was doing. 

The first bit may have come from some things discussed about the Thousand Sons and why Magnus made his deals with the Powers to stop his legion mutating. The second may have come from a suggestion that another Primarch felt a bit like Angron but couldn't keep his mouth shut. 

I am probably way off but these are the two theories that have become stuck in my head. 

I'm also in two minds about whether we should have more info released about them, or keep it as it is. I don't see it as a great aid to sales on minis, but I could see it has a huge boost to book sales. I would like to see more subtle references to them. Just so we can feed our imaginations a bit more. Before they got mentions in the heresy books, I couldn't give a monkeys about the lost legions.


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## ckcrawford (Feb 4, 2009)

Khorne's Fist said:


> I think you might be a bit mixed up. The Lightining Tower is Dorn and Malcador ruminating on what's happened, and IIRC the two plinths are empty at that stage.
> 
> Also, at the BL Live event in Dublin last year I'm fairly sure one of the writers mentioned that they had been told to rein in the Missing Legion Easter eggs that had been creeping in more and more.


I'm pretty sure thats it. Either Dorn was "amused" or he was describing the Emperor's reaction. Either way it was a reference to the past if I remember correctly. I only remember it because I thought it was a bit considering what the "lost legions" are supposed to be.


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## gothik (May 29, 2010)

because no one knows anything about them its hard to say what aspect of the Emperor they embodied. I would hazard a guess as to say its GW's way of saying let your imaginations run riot.


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## Zooey72 (Mar 25, 2008)

I listened to the Lightning Towers but do not remember it very clearly. I have read "The First Heretic" several times though and I am sure what was said to Lorgar from Magnus about Russ. They were talking about who wanted to see Lorgar be the 3rd son/legion destroyed and when Magnus mentioned Russ was against the idea Lorgar was stunned "The Wolf King is on my side?" Magnus went on to say that the Word Bearers and Space Wolves have more in common than they think. On a primal level the Wolves were very spiritual.

I think we may see what happened to the 2 missing primarchs if GW profits go down. But money aside if they were going to do it I would do it at the conclusion of the HH.

I would make it the ultimate in teaser before the last battle. It would be a conversation between Sang, Dorn, and Malcador and the Emperor reflects back that he had thought that destroying 2 sons may have gone too far, but apparently he did not go far enough if 1/2 of his sons could do this (and that now he has to go up and destroy his favorite son). In the conversation I would have him mention the names of the 2 primarchs and maybe the names of their legions.

It would be a great way to end HH, and also start a new round of books that I am sure would sell like crazy. If they decide never to use the missing primarchs thats fine, but I can't think of a better time to introduce them than at the end of HH if they decide to go that route.


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## gothik (May 29, 2010)

Zooey72 said:


> I listened to the Lightning Towers but do not remember it very clearly. I have read "The First Heretic" several times though and I am sure what was said to Lorgar from Magnus about Russ. They were talking about who wanted to see Lorgar be the 3rd son/legion destroyed and when Magnus mentioned Russ was against the idea Lorgar was stunned "The Wolf King is on my side?" Magnus went on to say that the Word Bearers and Space Wolves have more in common than they think. On a primal level the Wolves were very spiritual.
> 
> I think we may see what happened to the 2 missing primarchs if GW profits go down. But money aside if they were going to do it I would do it at the conclusion of the HH.
> 
> ...


no i doubt it, they were put in i suspect as has been suggested, as GWs way of saying here you go, two unnamed Primarchs and Legions. they do not exist in main cannon except as two that were destroyed, but the general consensous is, as the UMs are the largest Legion both 30K and 40k the remaing elements were merged into the Ultramarines. 

Other than that i doubt GW will do an about turn and bring them in, they have never indicated they will and i suspect that they are getting a little fed up with the hints being put in the HH books as @Khorne's Fist suggested. They are to remain the unnamed Legions that the player can create if they so wish, or in lore, a warning to what happens when even the Emperor thinks you have gone too far.


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