# The Official Matt Ward Hate Page



## The Sullen One

*Invent your own crazy Ward rules*

Well the new Necrons are almost here and Matt Ward has invented yet another crazy rule as well as having committed the almost unforgivable sin (and I say this because he isn't alone in reinventing the Necrons) of making souless robots designed to kill into a fascimile of what happens when Data's emotion chip goes bad while he's playing Sherlock Holmes and the case of the ancient Egyptian Terminator. Yes our souless Necrons now have feelings:suicide::suicide:

Anyway one character, Trazyn the infinite, can apparently kill entire units in one go (check out the Necron rumour section for more on this abomination). So to celebrate the latest craziness to come out of the Matt Wardrobe (sorry, no more stupid jokes from now on), I've decided to ask what all of you on Heresy think might be future crazy rules from dear Matt. Personally I hope he writes a Chaos Marine codex so we can see the following for Dreadnaughts.

Rolling a one - a result of one sees the Dreadnaught's pilot go berserk and fire at every enemy unit that is within range and line of sight.

Rolling a six - a result of six sees the Dreadnaught's pilot go berserk and assault in sequence every enemy unit within 12".


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## Djinn24

A new unit to the codex can now feel. That is not a rule anyways that would fall under fluff. Seriously if you are going to knock a guy, at least do it right.


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## Lord Sven Kittyclaw

djinn24 said:


> A new unit to the codex can now feel. That is not a rule anyways that would fall under fluff. Seriously if you are going to knock a guy, at least do it right.


Could you translate the first part of that?

And I think your new rule is pretty fantastic. Here's hoping, then my uber expensive but uber shitty FW dreads will be useful.


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## ThoseKrazyKasrkin

Lord Sven Kittyclaw said:


> Could you translate the first part of that?
> 
> And I think your new rule is pretty fantastic. Here's hoping, then my uber expensive but uber shitty FW dreads will be useful.


Hes Saying enough with the hating. Its just fluff it doesbt affect the game plus theres a whole team behind him helping him too so if your gonna knock anything, knock gw as a whole


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## Lord Sven Kittyclaw

Pfft. sorry fuck that. It's suddenly cool to stick up for GW? I think not.


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## ThoseKrazyKasrkin

Lord Sven Kittyclaw said:


> Pfft. sorry fuck that. It's suddenly cool to stick up for GW? I think not.


Hey i never said stick up for them just dont single people out. Plus we're all still here so somthing theyre doing is right.


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## unexpectedbill

The whole thing reminds me of the Forsaken. The scourge are mindless undead along comes Sylvannas and bam we have free will and call ourselves the Forsaken and want to build our own empire. Ward and his team must have had some influence from Blizz and thier fluff in WoW. It could also be that I have just been playing WoW too long and its corrupted my mind.


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## Lord Sven Kittyclaw

If it's possible, WoW has worse background than ANYTHING in existence.


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## Zion

Wait, so expanding an army to be able to have more options than undead shambling phalanxes is a BAD thing?

And this is why I don't get the internet. You get something nice, a new army that looks downright DEADLY on the table and instead of trying to enbrace the response is crying about giving them actual chaacter instead of looking at all the new this you can do. GW even pulled a rabbit out of the hat and decided that the old shambling ombies where still a completely valid army as well (it's always nice to see an update that improves on without invalidating old armies).

While I'm not planning on starting up Necrons again I'm glad to see they got some good treatment and hope Sisters get something like that. An expansion, maybe even a refocus without an invalidation of the old builds. In faxt, that's what I hope EVERY army continues to get.


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## lokis222

I liked the old fluff. Super old race jealous of a fellow race due to lifespan and such makes a deal with the devil. They become an undead horde of terminator robots out to wipe out life in the universe because they didn't read the fine print. You don't need much more. That's pretty cool.

As to the new fluff. Well Stargate aside, I am hoping to like it, but I think they gave up some very cool ideas to do this. Necrons working with Boy Scouts kind of .... sucks.

As to game play, I really hope there are lots and lots and lots of builds!


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## Achaylus72

Zion said:


> Wait, so expanding an army to be able to have more options than undead shambling phalanxes is a BAD thing?
> 
> And this is why I don't get the internet. You get something nice, a new army that looks downright DEADLY on the table and instead of trying to enbrace the response is crying about giving them actual chaacter instead of looking at all the new this you can do. GW even pulled a rabbit out of the hat and decided that the old shambling ombies where still a completely valid army as well (it's always nice to see an update that improves on without invalidating old armies).
> 
> While I'm not planning on starting up Necrons again I'm glad to see they got some good treatment and hope Sisters get something like that. An expansion, maybe even a refocus without an invalidation of the old builds. In faxt, that's what I hope EVERY army continues to get.


For some the amount of hate they have for GW, Matt Ward and (Insert any other reason) is deeply entrenched in their Psychie, for these sad individuals they are never ever happy.


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## Zion

Achaylus72 said:


> For some the amount of hate they have for GW, Matt Ward and (Insert any other reason) is deeply entrenched in their Psychie, for these sad individuals they are never ever happy.


And yet they pay money to play a game thwy act like they don't enjoy....I think I don't "get" people.


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## lokis222

Wow.... do I smell smug, self-satisfied condescension? 

So, you two trolls or just idiots? 

There are grounds for the hate. I play warmachine, chainmail, warhammer 40k/fantasy, battlefleet gothic, and I am learning infinity. 

40k is probably one of the worst written rule systems I have come across. It is designed to make money. The models are expensive compared to everyone else. The rules have more holes than a butterfly net, and the codexes are unbalanced. 

That said, they have by far the best fluff and some of the better models.

Being appolgists for a corporation is as silly as being a hater.


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## Lord Sven Kittyclaw

lokis222 said:


> Wow.... do I smell smug, self-satisfied condescension?
> 
> So, you two trolls or just idiots?
> 
> There are grounds for the hate. I play warmachine, chainmail, warhammer 40k/fantasy, battlefleet gothic, and I am learning infinity.
> 
> 40k is probably one of the worst written rule systems I have come across. It is designed to make money. The models are expensive compared to everyone else. The rules have more holes than a butterfly net, and the codexes are unbalanced.
> 
> That said, they have by far the best fluff and some of the better models.
> 
> Being appolgists for a corporation is as silly as being a hater.


Enjoy all the rep I can give. Exactly what I was thinking.


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## Zion

lokis222 said:


> Wow.... do I smell smug, self-satisfied condescension?
> 
> So, you two trolls or just idiots?
> 
> There are grounds for the hate. I play warmachine, chainmail, warhammer 40k/fantasy, battlefleet gothic, and I am learning infinity.
> 
> 40k is probably one of the worst written rule systems I have come across. It is designed to make money. The models are expensive compared to everyone else. The rules have more holes than a butterfly net, and the codexes are unbalanced.
> 
> That said, they have by far the best fluff and some of the better models.
> 
> Being appolgists for a corporation is as silly as being a hater.


Lokis, if it was a complaint about the rules as a whole, I wouldn't have blinked about it, but it's not. It's complaining about the updwtingnof a VERY outdated and underpowered army that is brought into the ability to handle the modern rulesets (as wonky as they are).

THAT is what I don't get. An army book that can play on equally footing with others, and actually get some table time AND isn't another Marine army AND they don't even take out the old corrupted zombie-Cron build that so many knoe and love if you want it.

And for the record name calling underminds any point you're trying to make.


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## Djinn24

Lord Sven Kittyclaw said:


> Pfft. sorry fuck that. It's suddenly cool to stick up for GW? I think not.


Sven if you hate the damn company so much why are you hanging out trolling on a forum that is dedicated to Warhammer 40K. Seriously you can be such a fucking tool at times, it is seriously as if you do not think before you puke crap on your keyboard and mash the keys.



lokis222 said:


> Wow.... do I smell smug, self-satisfied condescension?
> 
> So, you two trolls or just idiots?
> 
> There are grounds for the hate. I play warmachine, chainmail, warhammer 40k/fantasy, battlefleet gothic, and I am learning infinity.
> 
> 40k is probably one of the worst written rule systems I have come across. It is designed to make money. The models are expensive compared to everyone else. The rules have more holes than a butterfly net, and the codexes are unbalanced.
> 
> That said, they have by far the best fluff and some of the better models.
> 
> Being appolgists for a corporation is as silly as being a hater.


Come up with a product, market it, sell it for 30 years then come talk until then troll some where else. Name calling, that is so 3rd grade of you.

What I was saying to the OP is they said something about RULES when in fact their lame as shit complaint, bitch and moan session has NOTHING to do with rules, but in fact FLUFF. The Ward write crap fluff is so overstated at this point that even bringing it up is a flipping waste of time. In fact, I remember hearing he had nothing to do with the fluff on this codex... Guess we shall see.


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## CE5511

The fluff portion really didn't need to be stated in the opening post. But the rule stated next is something I slightly (slightly) agree with. Seems kinda cheesy right now to be able to kill a whole unit with just a single kill origonialy. Just like others have said in the past though, cheesy and over powered are just the cries of the ill prepaired. Ward does make some strong rules, but they are fairly well balanced I'm starting to think. His codexes have strong units and rules but aren't the top tier kill everything single build not gonna lose a single model in any game ever some people claim. 

I guess what I'm getting at is this, his rules are strong, but that just makes the game more of a challenge! It keeps you thinking and makes armies more balanced typically. Some characters rules are crazy, but there's always 10 ways to counter any character or army


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## SavageConvoy

I've never seen a problem with Ward hate. It's more or a running gag than anything else at this point. I don't think people honestly blame him and want him to die in a fire, but I just assume people are capable of reason. It's like he's Zoidberg. No matter how hard he tries, somebody will see something to rag on him about.

But I think we've all been there and done that. No need to take it seriously. Just laugh it up and make some damn funny overpowered/fluffy-beyond-reason rules.

Tau have a special leadership rule. When facing a Space Marine army each unit of firewarriors that can draw line of site to them take a morale check. If failed the entire unit is wiped out, stricken with such depression from knowing that they will never be space marines, let alone Ultramarines.


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## eyescrossed

"BAAAAWWW, THEY GOT RID OF MY LOVECRAFTIAN STAR GODS!!"
"Erm... Actually, the only thing Lovecraftian about them was that they were beings of immense power. As for looks and personality, they're more Roman or Gre-"
"SHUT UP WARD."
"...I'm not Matt Ward, I'm just pointing out that they weren't actually Lo-"
"SHUT UP NOW RAWR"

Yes, I saw this happen.


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## Stephen_Newman

I don't know why everyone is complaining about that guy (Trazyn)

I thought it was practically common knowledge that Ward writes dodgy fluff and good rules.

For example is it known that Trazyn does not have a power weapon? That the enemy has to fail their armour save? That then the player controlling Trazyn has to roll a 4+ for every model individually to affect them? Then to boot those armour saves have to be failed as well? So yes it can wipe out whole units but the chances of it doing so even against opponents such as Ork boyz are very low.

Units like Hormagaunts I grant may struggle. Although the question stands as to why are you sending such troops into combat with a model you know is capable of those abilities.

I am more concerned with the fact that he can capture objectives than this ability.


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## SavageConvoy

This is just a case of "Haven't seen it yet, but it's obviously too powerful."

I remember everyone in my area freaking out over the GK Dreadknight. It was the only thing that they would talk about, saying how unbelievably powerful it was and how it could take all these amazing upgrades. 

A week later, nobody fields them... EVER.

And also mentioning the damn Psyflemen dreads. Nobody mentioned that thing either, and now everybody in my area takes two at the least.

I'm waiting to see something off the wall in the codex that's getting overlooked or unmentioned right now because everyone is focused on one Big Bad right now.


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## Serpion5

This thread has gone to hell.


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## The Sullen One

Serpion5 said:


> This thread has gone to hell.


Sadly, yes it has. When I made the original post, I was really hoping you'd all come up with a bunch of daft rules for a laugh. Instead I have unleashed Ward Hate upon Heresy yet again suicide:time). Personally I don't hate Matt Ward, nor could I care about his fluff, I just wish he didn't write codices that seem so overpowered compared to the older books, but then again I think that's a GW thing rather than him personally.


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## maddermax

Stephen_Newman said:


> I don't know why everyone is complaining about that guy (Trazyn)
> 
> I thought it was practically common knowledge that Ward writes dodgy fluff and *good rules*.


I would debate even that. His latest books have been more balanced (though still with aspects of power creep, but that's GWs modus operandi, and not limited to Ward), but when he wrote the fantasy daemons rules, he made them the most powerful army through 7th edition, and power had to be ramped way up after that just because they were so dominant at that point that it was beyond a joke, and that was after releasing a woefully underpowered Orc and Goblin army book. He's very hit and miss on balance.


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## lokis222

Ward on Nids:

Shadow of the Warp:

10pts per synapse creature
Covers the entire board and effects things in vehicles.
Roll 4d6 on a psychic test. On a failure, roll a d6. On a 3+, remove the model from the game.


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## Ravner298

Why would you let him get into CC with your gaunts/orc mob? I'm more concerned over his ability to come back to life multiple times, and contest/claim objectives. Also, it's impossible to mention 'he who shall not be mentioned' on these forums anymore without people losing their minds.


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## C'Tan Chimera

Here's a rule- _The Ward Warding._ 

Anytime someone mentions Ward, roll a single die. On a 7 or up, you can bitch about him all you want- if its below a 7, you deal with it.


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## lokis222

C'Tan Chimera said:


> Here's a rule- _The Ward Warding._
> 
> Anytime someone mentions Ward, roll a single die. On a 7 or up, you can bitch about him all you want- if its below a 7, you deal with it.


Pulls out a d100

:victory:


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## Dave T Hobbit

C'Tan Chimera said:


> Here's a rule- _The Ward Warding._
> 
> Anytime someone mentions Ward, roll a single six-sided die. On a 7 or up, you can bitch about him all you want- if its below a 7, you deal with it.


Ambiguity reduced.

Excellent subversion of the topic!


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## Eleven

C'Tan Chimera said:


> Here's a rule- _The Ward Warding._
> 
> Anytime someone mentions Ward, roll a single die. On a 7 or up, you can bitch about him all you want- if its below a 7, you deal with it.


can I use a d20?

drat, I was too slow!


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## Vaz

Wait, so the entire Heresy Board has dissolved into "Put up or shut up" about Mat Ward, simply because it's no longer the popular thing to bitch about him?

Bollocks.

Mat Ward is one of the worst rules designers and fluff writers to have ever "graced" Warhammer.

He may have a team under him, but as he is the lead designer, he should have more control than prepubescent acne, which is about the closest analogy I can get to just how poor his quality control is. If they write shit, such as the Necron/Blood Angel Alliance and the Tyranids attacking a Necron Tomb World, all 3 of which go against all of their existing backgrounds in the same damn story, then he should put his hand down and stop them.

The main complaints oldies have had about the new games editions are the evolving fluff - and I never really understood it. I've been in the scene for more than 10 years, and have watched Space Marines turn from highly skilled Warrior Monks/noble Knights to brutal murdering xenophobes, with a distinct split between themselves and humans. Expanding new fluff sees things like the Salamanders Forgefathers, or the Thunderfire Cannon, the rediscovered STC's for the vehicles - the Ares, the Achilles, the Helios, the Prometheus, and the Redeemer. All of these add to the flavour of the armies. Not complete changes of fluff.

People may remember the Necrons as Chaos Androids. For myself, I only came into Necrons upon their release, the first White Dwarf I purchased was the one before their release (with the Dual sided High Elf Silver Helm and Balrog) cover), and so I go with their 3rd edition background as "canon". 

Now, he's just going into the books he has access to, and just scrawls inanity (that's not insanity, I actually mean utterly inane drivel) all over them, simply so that he can leave his mark.

He's like a cross between acne and a homeless dog pissing on what it sees as its property.

His rules are rarely thought out particularly well aside from "what would be cool" - although that's not unique to Mat Ward, it doesn't exactly add to his appeal - and his fluff is even worse.

I've spent over £3,000, which is around $5000, purely on books since I've started playing Warhammer. I don't spend that money simply because I enjoy reading drivel.


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## Samules

Vaz said:


> Wait, so the entire Heresy Board has dissolved into "Put up or shut up" about Mat Ward, simply because it's no longer the popular thing to bitch about him?



No, it's because I am sick to death of hearing the same complaints wherever I go if Matt Ward is mentioned. I have posted my complaints about him once. There is now no reason to continue restating the points. Everyone now has a general Idea about the problems of ward and if they want to know more they can search. Still angry about him? I got the thread you need right here. Now can we PLEASE move on to making jokes and stop complaining.


Assassins: Due to them being complete ninjas assassins may start the game in assault with any unit, even if they are in transport. The assassin starts inside the transport and fights in there. Should an opponent complain about the rule the assassin gains +6 attacks and +6 strength.


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## Stephen_Newman

Moving back on topic:

Codex Eldar gets redone.

This was mentioned by the user Cyclown once and seems applicable here:

At the end of the game roll a single die. On a 5+ regardless of the battle outcome the Eldar always win because they planned it to happen that way all along. This is increased to a 4+ if the Eldar were not even playing.

One of my rules:

Eldrad is a dick: When the opponent wishes to attack Eldrad or the unit he is with must roll a dice after calculating saves etc. If passed any damage they cause are negated and the player controlling Eldrad may allocate exactly on which model in either force these shots or blows now hit.

The dice roll is a 2+ that is rerolled until a 2 or more is rolled.


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## Zion

Vaz said:


> Wait, so the entire Heresy Board has dissolved into "Put up or shut up" about Mat Ward, simply because it's no longer the popular thing to bitch about him?
> 
> Bollocks.
> 
> Mat Ward is one of the worst rules designers and fluff writers to have ever "graced" Warhammer.
> 
> He may have a team under him, but as he is the lead designer, he should have more control than prepubescent acne, which is about the closest analogy I can get to just how poor his quality control is. If they write shit, such as the Necron/Blood Angel Alliance and the Tyranids attacking a Necron Tomb World, all 3 of which go against all of their existing backgrounds in the same damn story, then he should put his hand down and stop them.
> 
> The main complaints oldies have had about the new games editions are the evolving fluff - and I never really understood it. I've been in the scene for more than 10 years, and have watched Space Marines turn from highly skilled Warrior Monks/noble Knights to brutal murdering xenophobes, with a distinct split between themselves and humans. Expanding new fluff sees things like the Salamanders Forgefathers, or the Thunderfire Cannon, the rediscovered STC's for the vehicles - the Ares, the Achilles, the Helios, the Prometheus, and the Redeemer. All of these add to the flavour of the armies. Not complete changes of fluff.
> 
> People may remember the Necrons as Chaos Androids. For myself, I only came into Necrons upon their release, the first White Dwarf I purchased was the one before their release (with the Dual sided High Elf Silver Helm and Balrog) cover), and so I go with their 3rd edition background as "canon".
> 
> Now, he's just going into the books he has access to, and just scrawls inanity (that's not insanity, I actually mean utterly inane drivel) all over them, simply so that he can leave his mark.
> 
> He's like a cross between acne and a homeless dog pissing on what it sees as its property.
> 
> His rules are rarely thought out particularly well aside from "what would be cool" - although that's not unique to Mat Ward, it doesn't exactly add to his appeal - and his fluff is even worse.
> 
> I've spent over £3,000, which is around $5000, purely on books since I've started playing Warhammer. I don't spend that money simply because I enjoy reading drivel.


Out of curiousity Vaz, what do you field when you play 40K? Because I would like to contend that Ward, while not the best fluff writer (or at least not the best at conveying his ideas) is hardly the worst codex writer GW has ever had. I play Sisters of Battle, which got some piss-poor rules on a fair number of units (a couple great example is how the Canoness and Sororitas Command Squads have no synergy despite the Command Squad only being available if you take the Canoness, or the 65 point slow Immolator with Heavy Flamer (a direct copy of the Razorback with Heavy Flamer, which no one uses because it costs too damned much and isn't worth it's cost)). This is from the same man who gave us the watered-down mess that we got from Tyranids. Some good auto-include choices but a lot that isn't good, is over costed, and often underpowered even if you lowered its cost.

My secondary army is Chaos Marines. And if you've looked at that thing you'll know that Gav Thorpe wasn't exactly a brilliant writer either.

Ward may not explain why he does stuff well, but you can't blame him for releasing watered-down messes that look more like something you'd get as a result from paper-training your dog with the armies.

But here's the deal about Necrons, as the rumors go, Ward was the THIRD designer brought on board for them to finish the job and had nothing to do with the fluff (there is actually a somewhat recent Black Library book if I recall that had Necrons with some personality traits if I recall, as well as a peice of fluff with a Necron who spent time disguised as an Inquisitor by WEARING THE DEAD INQUISITOR'S SKIN, so Necrons with personalities isn't a Ward thing). I'm willing to bet that the change in fluff is GW trying to get interest in the army. Their still undead robot masters of space and time but now they have more motivations outside of being broken (still viable if you want though) and destroying all sentient life in the universe (also still viable if you want too!). Nothing was removed in this book, but a LOT was gained.

So your pinning the blame on someone who was most likely brought on to wrap up the project and tighten up the rules for the oncoming 6th edition despite it being someone else's mess. Not cool.

Additionally, for anyone who wants Ward gone because of his weak writing skills I'd like to point out there are only two other lead codex writers for 40K right now. Kelly, who does a pretty good job most of the time but only puts out books every once in a while (I assume he spends longer polishing the final product that Ward and Cruddace), and Cruddace who needs to stop writing bottom tier rulesets all the time. And if we lose Ward, then the books will be mainly written by Cruddace. And don't get me wrong, I think Cruddace has great potential if he learned how to internally balance a book better (I shouldn't have auto-includes in any army list unless it was because of personal taste.) but until he gets there we'd get 1-2 Kelly books a year and the rest would be Cruddace, and then EVERYONE would spend their time being pissed off at how watered down the books are (lets NOT have a repeat of the Dark Angels and Chaos Marines from 4th).

So before you put his head on a pike, consider the reprecussions first. That's all I'm saying.


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## eyescrossed

Vaz said:


> Wait, so the entire Heresy Board has dissolved into "Put up or shut up" about Mat Ward, simply because it's no longer the popular thing to bitch about him?
> 
> Bollocks.
> 
> Mat Ward is one of the worst rules designers and fluff writers to have ever "graced" Warhammer.
> 
> He may have a team under him, but as he is the lead designer, he should have more control than prepubescent acne, which is about the closest analogy I can get to just how poor his quality control is. If they write shit, such as the Necron/Blood Angel Alliance and the Tyranids attacking a Necron Tomb World, all 3 of which go against all of their existing backgrounds in the same damn story, then he should put his hand down and stop them.
> 
> The main complaints oldies have had about the new games editions are the evolving fluff - and I never really understood it. I've been in the scene for more than 10 years, and have watched Space Marines turn from highly skilled Warrior Monks/noble Knights to brutal murdering xenophobes, with a distinct split between themselves and humans. Expanding new fluff sees things like the Salamanders Forgefathers, or the Thunderfire Cannon, the rediscovered STC's for the vehicles - the Ares, the Achilles, the Helios, the Prometheus, and the Redeemer. All of these add to the flavour of the armies. Not complete changes of fluff.
> 
> People may remember the Necrons as Chaos Androids. For myself, I only came into Necrons upon their release, the first White Dwarf I purchased was the one before their release (with the Dual sided High Elf Silver Helm and Balrog) cover), and so I go with their 3rd edition background as "canon".
> 
> Now, he's just going into the books he has access to, and just scrawls inanity (that's not insanity, I actually mean utterly inane drivel) all over them, simply so that he can leave his mark.
> 
> He's like a cross between acne and a homeless dog pissing on what it sees as its property.
> 
> His rules are rarely thought out particularly well aside from "what would be cool" - although that's not unique to Mat Ward, it doesn't exactly add to his appeal - and his fluff is even worse.
> 
> I've spent over £3,000, which is around $5000, purely on books since I've started playing Warhammer. I don't spend that money simply because I enjoy reading drivel.


I still hate Ward for things like Draigo.

I hate him for the Ultramarines.

I hate him for Daemons.

But Newcrons? The Newcrons seem promising. Very promising. The fluff actually gives them personality now instead of "Hurr durr a C'tan did it, and all Necrons are mindless. Except Lords but they still answer to the C'tan."

Seriously, what did the C'tan do in the previous book?
-Gave Abaddon an extremely powerful weapon
-Created the Mechanicum directly
-Imprinted the FEAR OF DEATH IN ALL SENTIENT CREATURES BUT ORKS
And that's just several examples!

I'm glad for the change. The most bland army (both on the TT and fluffwise, IMO) finally has some flavour, and while it still reeks of Ward in some parts, it seems to be a solid change.

I'll... Take my Ward/Newcron posts elsewhere now.


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## lokis222

Stephen_Newman said:


> Moving back on topic:
> 
> Codex Eldar gets redone.
> 
> This was mentioned by the user Cyclown once and seems applicable here:
> 
> At the end of the game roll a single die. On a 5+ regardless of the battle outcome the Eldar always win because they planned it to happen that way all along. This is increased to a 4+ if the Eldar were not even playing.
> 
> One of my rules:
> 
> Eldrad is a dick: When the opponent wishes to attack Eldrad or the unit he is with must roll a dice after calculating saves etc. If passed any damage they cause are negated and the player controlling Eldrad may allocate exactly on which model in either force these shots or blows now hit.
> 
> The dice roll is a 2+ that is rerolled until a 2 or more is rolled.


That eldar rule is still the best. :laugh:


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## ArchangelPaladin

Wow this thread makes me said. What should have been an epic thread of creative tongue in cheek rules degraded into a matt ward hate fest in record time. 

Look we get some of you don’t like Matt ward, we get why you don’t like him, some of us agree with some of your points, but why can’t we just move on? Stop hijacking every post that has even the slightest reference to the guy. I mean the topic could be “Fat guy at GW wins Buffalo Wild Wing’s 5 min Challenge” and you Matt Ward haters will be “OMG Matt Ward iz the sux! Hiz fluf is so lamez! But I Luv Wings!” By the way, do you hear how dumb you sound?

As for the OT: Ork Boyz Blood Frenzy – For every ten orks killed add 1 to the toughness & strength of all ork models. Haha go forth my mighty green tide, die by the dozens so that by the end of the game my 6 pt model will one shot your Land Rader.


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## Djinn24

Vaz when you sit down and can draw up a balanced expanded rule book that is playable but not broken then I might take what you have to say seriously. Want to talk about fluff shift then those of us who played in second edition will have shit to complain about when half of our armies stopped being playable. This set of rule books have been some of the best I have seen ever come out of GW and it seems that all armies might have a chance and it will be more about playing the army well then buying 4 uber squad and killing everything.


----------



## Jack Mac

Grey Knights universal rule - Ascent of Angels
Every time a Grey Knight is killed, roll a d6. On a 6, that Knight's soul is so pure and admirable that it stays on to fight. 
The angel has the model, and stats, of the Sanguinor.


----------



## the_barwn

Necron ruling- Upon killing any opposing model if it is within 48" of a monolith on a d6 roll of 5+ it ressurects & assaults its own unit


----------



## Serpion5

Cryptek upgrade: Supercron emitter. 

If a cryptek joins a unit with at least fifteen necron warriors in it, he may immediately combine them ionto a supercron monstrous creature. It has a similar statline as a necron warrior, but is double the strength and toughness. 

Instead of being wounded normally, you must kill the necron warriors making it piece by piece. They are still subject to Reanimation Protocols. 

:grin:

Also I agree with what djinn said.


----------



## humakt

Please take the Ward bitching to another thread. This thread has the potential to have some funny rules and I dont want it to be derailed anymore by a frenzy of slagging off or sucking upto Ward. Beside he may be reading this and I'm sure he will be taking notes of the better rules ideas.


----------



## jaysen

Ward rewrites the TAU codex:

Fire Warrior EMP-218 device. At the beginning of the Tau player's assault phase, role a die. On a 4+, all enemies with powered weapons or armor are disabled and cannot attack or move in any way (treat as fearless) until the beginning of the Tau player's next turn.

Fire adept phoenix warrior. Fire warrior or Stealth suit leader upgrade. BS4 WS4 S3 T3 I4 A2 Ld9, cost +10pts, options power weapon +10, power fist +15, psychic miasmic scrambler +5 (creates a psychic null zone within 18" of the Fire Adept Phoenix).

Sgt Cailil, Premier Fire Adept Phoenix. Wargear: Master-crafted power fist that only has 1 attack and attacks on initiative of zero (yeah after all the regular powerfists), stealth suit, EMP-218, hit and run, fleet. In any assault phase, if in close combat, after moves have been made, but before attacks, Cailil can summon D6 phantom ghost genestealers to help him in his greatest need. These only last till the end of the turn, then are removed from play.

Also, the Tau become bestest friends in the whole wide world with the Tyranid, forming an ultra-alliance. The Tyranid are cool with this because they've been hankerin for some bros to throw down some brews with.


----------



## Dicrel Seijin

Well, here's my contribution....

Drop Pod Monolith (Recovered STC): After deployment and all models have disembarked, on the player's next turn the drop pod may engage its anti-grav thrusters, rise, and center itself above the unit that deployed from it (or nearest friendly unit). The drop pod may then activate its void shields. It is no longer considered an open-topped vehicle. 

Any model or vehicle in a 12" radius of the drop pod is effectively shielded (models receive a 2+ invul, vehicles are AV14 F/S/R). 

On a roll of 2+, any energy weapon fired at the shields is absorbed and increases the radius by 12" minus the weapon's AP rating. 

On a roll of 3+, enemy models are pushed back from the encroaching edge of the shield. Should an enemy model make a save then subsequently fail, it will take 1 wound per 6" moved back as it placed away from the shield edge. Enemy vehicles are unaffected. If enemy models are caught between two or more encroaching shields and there is no place to go, the instant death rule will apply. Models pushed to the board edge are considered to have fled the battle.

On a roll of 6+, any projectile weapon fired at the shields penetrates, but the models still have their improved invul, the vehicles their improved AV.

Any template weapons are ignored.


----------



## Ravner298

All daemons can now assault after deep strike. 

/wet dream


----------



## jaysen

All space marine bolters now wound any daemon on a 2+ and do 2 wounds.


----------



## Vaz

djinn24 said:


> Vaz when you sit down and can draw up a balanced expanded rule book that is playable but not broken then I might take what you have to say seriously.


I'm not necessarily talking balance. I'm talking inane decisions about the rules, like the Blood Angels, for example. Why do Blood Angels get Assault Marines as troops rather than fast attack? Why do they get Descent of Angels? Because they use them a lot - but they don't, because it's already stated they have no more Assault Marines than any other chapter. And then we have the Ultramarines Characters - all of whom, IIRC, frequently break the laws of the codex astartes by bringing in different rules variants to the armies.

This isn't just raging against "that army has what I want" - it's just senseless daft decisions such as that which make me question "why?". 



> Want to talk about fluff shift then those of us who played in second edition will have shit to complain about when half of our armies stopped being playable.


"Unplayable"? in what way was it unplayable? You mean that you could no longer field a Librarian and 2 5 Man Space Marine squads to make up a 1000point army, or that your armies simply needed to evolve to a new edition?

I'm talking about Fluff Shift, when Necrons were Chaos Androids, not Necrons. And now we have Chaos Androids > Necrons > Space Marines in Skeletons. It's a case where giving them character has reduced their character. 40K is a heavily typecast environment, ranging from your Space Marines and Imperial Guard with distinct attributes related to real life, while things such as the Necrons and Tau are allegories to popular culture.

Necrons are your Skeletal Hordes of the Vampire, the Vampire being the C'Tan. The Necrons having some sentience is fine, I'm perfectly happy with that - relating to the Ghoul, or some other Vampire dependant non-Undead creature. But when they start having a personality, that confuses me, considering that they have been hibernating for such a long time in a metal shell, and yet when they suddenly awake, they're all unique?

Writers complain about the Tyranids, Necrons and Orks being armies about which it's almost impossible to write for - not having any real character whatsoever, and being utterly one dimensional, as opposed to Humans, Marines and Eldar. I don't see why that is a problem. it's a game for children, and the writers of the background and novels are generally of a poor calibre with a few noted exceptions, meaning that it's unlikely to actually ever get too mainstream or noted for many literary awards - niche ones like the Gemmel award for Sigmar is strange - the books are shite, with no character developement, and an utterly cliched storyline, and the NYTB list for the Heresy novels - that's simply popularity - and fuck me the X Factor is popular.



> This set of rule books have been some of the best I have seen ever come out of GW and it seems that all armies might have a chance and it will be more about playing the army well then buying 4 uber squad and killing everything.


Poorly written rules with inane reasonings behind purely to sell more models is my complaint with Mat Wards rules. The game is about fun, I admit that. But since when does sloppy rules writing have to be the hallmarks of fun? You can have a clear concise set of rules which are fairly balanced without being limited to not having fun. And what about those of us who play tournament style games - Mat Wards core Fantasy rules makes games rely on stacking a load of modifiers onto high risk, high reward strategies, and using those modifiers so that there's very little risk, for the most part, and the new rules just aren't coming out quick enough to counteract that.

As for the new ones, yes, I can easily put a list together how I want, and not worry too much about how it plays, and just let fun dictate. But for those of us who want more out of it, Mat Ward doesn't cut it.

For those of us who love the lore as it was, there's no excusing his bullshit.


----------



## Djinn24

@humakt: At what point was this anything but a Ward hate thread, the thread title itself is hateful?

@Vaz: In second ed there were a LOT of items you could take that where no longer viable in third edition. How long was it before DAs got the Mortis dread back? SM can't take Shuriken Guns. There are a ton of examples where models that had been modified to fit the rules where no longer playable at all when second edition went out and third edition came in. 

The point about his rules is he is consistent and works well with the other writers to make the codexes balanced against one another. Yes the 3rd/4th edition codexes are weak compared to them but slowly they are bringing it all up to speed.


----------



## jaysen

The Blood Angels have a whole company of assault marines, the 8th. So, yeah, they do have more, get more practice, and develop unique techniques and tactics for employing jump pack troops.

If you want a good reason, then, it's because they are all painted red, which obviously makes things faster in the 40k universe.


----------



## Vaz

Standard Space Marines can take Paired Autocannon Dreadnoughts, and Dark Angels still have access to the Mortis Dreadnought from Imperial Armour Volume 2 Update 1.3, which is something like 6 or 7 years old now, I think possibly before 4th Edition Space Marines, even - and the FAQ is completely free, might I add.

As for the Shuriken Guns - that's precisely what I was talking about, however - in that with the constant new evolutions to the fluff. Admittedly, Space Marines now have Bolters and are always armed with that.

While I cannot talk about evolutions from before mid way through 3rd, I'm simply lamenting the fact that Mat Ward feels its right to shit on what other people worked on, simply to piss all over it like a homeless dog marking its territory, or completely change it for no real reason whatsoever.

When I look at Dawn of War, they were the first IIRC to include talking Necrons - and that was limited to the Pariah's, or even just one Pariah, the least Necron of them. And then we get the Fall of Damnos, and Nick Kyme - who's one of the worst writers I have read - Salamanders Firey Firing fire Guard of Fire and Grimblades of Grimness and stubborn dwarfs of stubborness - who ruins what could have been a decent story, but also includes characterful Necron Lords, which is as incongruous as a talking donkey.

And in a way, it is basically a talking donkey. It's not genre breaking and new-era defining appreciation, it's a travesty, considering that there's so much more rich fluff.

When people attempt to prove rules queries by using the fluff, they get shot down in flames, yet here people are correlating the two in reverse.

Space Marines are not true to lore, with strike forces which have saved entire worlds getting destroyed by 2 platoons of imperial guardsmen in the rules - so when you say "the new fluff is good because it gives us new weapons to use and new vehicles and new units" is utter bollocks - the Necrons are always awakening, and newly risen units and wargear is is all well and good, as well as updated rules to allow more than warriors as troops without resorting to "Tomb World Tactics".

@Jaysen - so do all other Codex chapters, and other chapters larger than the Blood Angels like the Black Templars and Space Wolves are likely to have more Assault Marine equivalents than the Blood Angels.

As for things going faster - I have no problem with the Overcharged engines - but what makes the Blood Angels "Lucifer" Pattern engines so much more powerful than the White Scars modified Overcharged Engines? As for the "Red Wuns Go Faster", it's not so much about the laws of Physics here, and not even about the rules - the Ork Mentality is simply that if they want it to work, it will do. That has little to do with why Blood Angels mechanics and all their secondary foundings are so much better at making faster engines while the rest of the galaxy is stuck with their relatively shitty engines.


----------



## Samules

Vulkan Hestan Special Rule:

Fire of Vulkan: Any model in an army including Vulkan may take a combi-melta or -flamer at no additional cost.

Nid Special rule:
The Munchers From Below: The nids may remove d3 units or vehicles before the game starts as their creatures beneath the surface swallow them up.

And Vaz go start your own thread somewhere else if you have that many complaints, you get to argue and we get some peace. Win-Win.


----------



## thenoobbomb

I dont have any problems with ward


----------



## lokis222

Bloodlust:

Any time a unit of orks wipes out another unit, it may immediately engage any unit within 6 inches. The unit of orks gets an additional assault phase and hits at initiative 10.

Fluff: So enraged and frenzied, the unit smashes through the unit and continues its rampage in such a manner as to shock into inaction the next unit who are still picking bleeding bits off their armor when the orks hit.

In Vaz's defense, he isn't doing this in a vacuum. But I agree, Vaz and Dijinn, please make your own thread.


----------



## bitsandkits

Eldar are better than you 

"Eldar army commander rolls 2d6 at the start of his turn, result 1-11 Eldar win the game ,but on a roll of 12 roll another 1d6 for the number of bare bottom spanks you can give your opponent as punishment for daring to take the field against Eldar"


----------



## Vaz

Samules said:


> And Vaz go start your own thread somewhere else if you have that many complaints, you get to argue and we get some peace. Win-Win.


Why? What would be the point, when there's a perfectly relevant thread here to discuss the problems with Ward.

"Get some peace" - christ, you sound like I'm shouting at you while I'm sitting next to you.


----------



## effigy22

The Fury of Vaz - "He gets to come and shout at you at any time he wishes, whether your asleep, at work or in the middle thornication. If the latter, he gets to join in"


----------



## Samules

Vaz said:


> Why? What would be the point, when there's a perfectly relevant thread here to discuss the problems with Ward.
> 
> "Get some peace" - christ, you sound like I'm shouting at you while I'm sitting next to you.


I disagree with the perfectly relevant part. While I may have over reacted a little bit it is just because I am sick of decent threads being jacked by ward hate. This thread is for making jokes about ward. Other threads are for having serious debates about weather ward is a good codex writer. It really kills the mood when you mix them. If you really don't want to make another thread then just rez one from a month ago or something. There are places to debate on ward without annoying anyone else who does not want to be involved.

And back on topic!

Enhanced tau weaponry:
For 2 pts per model any firewarrior team may purchase higher power weapons. AP is decreases to two and they gain the gets hot special rule.

Flee! Flee in terror smurfs of the emperor! :taunt:


----------



## the_barwn

bitsandkits said:


> Eldar are better than you
> 
> "Eldar army commander rolls 2d6 at the start of his turn, result 1-11 Eldar win the game ,but on a roll of 12 roll another 1d6 for the number of bare bottom spanks you can give your opponent as punishment for daring to take the field against Eldar"


Ha ha love it...........:biggrin::yahoo:


----------



## MidnightSun

*Death to the False Emperor!:* Any Chaos Space Marine model painted in the colours of the original Legions (Black Legion/Sons of Horus/Luna Wolves, Emperor's Children, Death Guard, Thousand Sons, World Eaters, Word Bearers, Iron Warriors and the Alpha Legion) gains Preferred Enemy: Imperium (Any model from Codex: Space Wolves, Space Marines, Blood Angels, Black Templars, Dark Angels, Sisters of Battle, Grey Knights or Imperial Guard) to represent the roaring flames of hatred that have burned since the Horus Heresy.

If GK get Preferred Enemy: Daemons, then CSM should sure as hell get this rule.

Midnight


----------



## lokis222

Venomthrope:

First, its WS becomes higher than its BS. (No gun and all.... stupid, lazy copy and paste rules)

Second:

Spores Cloud:
Enemies assaulting into the veonmthrope sporecloud take a Toughness test. If the test is failed, the unit suffers one unsaveable wound. If the test is passed, a spore incubates inside the model. Every turn after this a Toughness test is taken at a cumulative -1. Once failed, d3 Ripper swarms replace the model. Models with multiple wounds create one d3 ripper swarm per wound remaining on the model and the model is removed from play.


----------



## Nave Senrag

djinn24 said:


> @humakt: At what point was this anything but a Ward hate thread, the thread title itself is hateful?


To be fair, there is a bit of a difference between a joke at Ward's expense being used to create a forum game, and three consecutive pages of Ward hate.


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## Samules

Indeed! One is humorous, one is not!

Straken special rule:
Instead of killing the shark in wards version he tamed it! He gains a mound using the same stats as a carnifex.


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## spanner94ezekiel

The Spirit of the Lion: All Dark Angels units become fearless and gain preferred enemy: everyone. Furthermore, they roll auto-hits and wounds on space puppies and consequently beat the crap out of the little dogs, whilst ignoring all effects of weapons, wargear and pychic powers that have the word "Wolf" in it.

Great Strategist: The Lion's way was to always plan to maximum potential, so at the beginning of the game, a D6 is rolled. On a 2+ they aoutomatically win due to their superior strategy. On a 1, they tactically withdraw, and then annihilate the enemy forces from an unseen quarter, and therefore destroy all enemy units on the battlefield.


----------



## Amoeba Bait

Nurgle: Prior to the game, keep a dog turd off the table. Roll for it as per reserves. If arrives, thud down on table as close to the oppositions most pristeenly painted model. Yell NURGLES ROT!! The radius of the splatter now counts as difficult and dangerous terrain for all non-Nurgle units.


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## eyescrossed

What I'm more interested in is why people hate Ward more than Tom Kirby and Mark Wells. At least Ward likes the hobby...


----------



## Zion

eyescrossed said:


> What I'm more interested in is why people hate Ward more than Tom Kirby and Mark Wells. At least Ward likes the hobby...


Most of the haters are recent into the game (4th or later) and Ward is still a pretty newcomer. I'm starting to think every edition has writers that people don't like.


----------



## eyescrossed

That's not what I mean though. Tom Kirby is the reason why you can't buy GW stuff from the UK when you're in Australia, why the prices of Finecast are so high, why Space Marines get more attention than anyone else, etc.


----------



## HatingYou

Lastchancers

The sexual predator
Get in the van: Rapists sent to the lastchancers may force an enemy ind character in b2b into their van on the roll on a 4+ at the start of the assualt phase(removing it from the game) the lastchancer is also removed from play.


----------



## Zion

eyescrossed said:


> That's not what I mean though. Tom Kirby is the reason why you can't buy GW stuff from the UK when you're in Australia, why the prices of Finecast are so high, why Space Marines get more attention than anyone else, etc.


Ah, fair enough. I have a fun job dealing with looking at names all day so outside of some of the writers and sculptors whom I read about regulaely names don't stick for me all to well unfortunately.

However, that would be someone to be more upset with for a better reason than needing to take a few writing classes.


----------



## Samules

HatingYou said:


> Lastchancers
> 
> The sexual predator
> Get in the van: Rapists sent to the lastchancers may force an enemy ind character in b2b into their rape van on the roll on a 4+ at the start of the assualt phase(removing it from the game) the lastchancer is also removed from play.


That, that is very disturbing. :shok:


----------



## HatingYou

Samules said:


> That, that is very disturbing. :shok:


Just reading Wards notes...


----------



## Djinn24

Space Marines Dreads could take paired weapons in second that was phased out 13 years ago. Not until a few years ago could you take a dual weapon aka Mortis pattern dread in a standard game. There are a ton of examples of that going from 2nd to 3rd. What I have been trying to point out to you is since then they have tried to keep everything pretty much on the same page so people would stop having useless models.

Beginning to wonder if you grew up around Ward and he touched you in your no no spot for all the hate you have for the guy, shit fluff, got it and I agree. But his 40k rules have been solid and balanced with what has been published in the last few books.

Silly rule: Create a thread that mentions Matt Ward and roll a 1D6 on a 1-6 get ready for a flame war, on a 7+ it will all be ok.


----------



## eyescrossed

Zion said:


> However, that would be someone to be more upset with for a better reason than needing to take a few writing classes.


Exactly. It pisses me off to no end. Yes, Ward can be a horrible writer but at least he's not in it for the money and tries to make the hobby better (although he doesn't succeed a lot of the time).

Some shit that really pissed me off (both found in last year's annual report):
-Mark Wells mentions that in finding the right employees: "The politically correct need not apply."
-Tom Kirby gave himself a 20% pay rise.

And people bitch about Ward. 

Really people, are you ignorant or just stupid?


----------



## Wusword77

Farseer Special Rule; "No you fool!!!"

When the Farseer of an Eldar army is killed roll a 1d6. On a roll of a 4+ the game ends, with the Farseer stating "No you fool! We were trying to prevent their attack!" At this point a new army of a different appears on the board that is 1000 points higher then the base games point values. Restart at turn 1 and continue play.


----------



## jaysen

Vaz said:


> @Jaysen - so do all other Codex chapters, and other chapters larger than the Blood Angels like the Black Templars and Space Wolves are likely to have more Assault Marine equivalents than the Blood Angels.
> 
> As for things going faster - I have no problem with the Overcharged engines - but what makes the Blood Angels "Lucifer" Pattern engines so much more powerful than the White Scars modified Overcharged Engines? As for the "Red Wuns Go Faster", it's not so much about the laws of Physics here, and not even about the rules - the Ork Mentality is simply that if they want it to work, it will do. That has little to do with why Blood Angels mechanics and all their secondary foundings are so much better at making faster engines while the rest of the galaxy is stuck with their relatively shitty engines.


Blood Angels have been close combat specialists for a long while, it's nothing new. In 3rd edition, they all got what was equivalent to furious charge and they randomly charged forward each turn. Since that got nerfed, they needed an advantage to fill the gap, so they gave them more assault squads and assault tactics. In order to sell more models, they added the fast vehicle rule and got rid of the extra "overcharged" engines special rule. I think that has been a trend to get rid of codex specific rules and replace them with something out of the main rulebook. So, out with overcharged engines, in with "fast" vehicles. I have no idea where the Sanguinor, Astorath, and Storm Ravens came from, but they do bring some interesting stuff to the army choices. None are game changers or especially good for their points.

What is a potential game changer for Blood Angels is the ability to remove jump packs and get discounted transports. This makes them so much more pt efficient, that you will rarely see a tactical squad in a BA competitive list.

Now, can we get back on topic? Got any funny homebrew rules or characters?


----------



## jaysen

Ward writes Codex: Space Sharks

Carcharadons Astra
Home planet: Great White
Planet type: Ocean world
Hammerhead staff: works like a thunder hammer but has a shark's head
Chapter Master: Mako Sharkstein
Special chapter rule: Blood in the water, whenever blood is spilt within 12" of a Space Shark, he will go made with feeding frenzy, gaining Rage special rule, and +1 attacks. The Space Shark cannot make ranged attacks for the remainder of the game.
Space Sharks have a new vehicle called the Storm Shark, very similar to a Storm Raven, but it's much more bad arse cause it looks like a shark.
Space Shark Chaplains are called Shark Priests.
Shark Priests have Littanies of Jaws, instead of Littanies of Hate.
Command Squads of the Space Sharks have the option of upgrading one veteran to a Shark Champion, that is in every way exactly like a Company Champion. But, he's very sharky.
All Space Sharks have jet black eyes, with no white parts. They all have oversized triangular shaped and wickedly pointed teeth. Veterans are called Bulls, Assault squads are called Mako squads, and Devastators are called Great Whites.
Elites choice: Loan Shark, can be upgraded with a Landshark Mount, which gives the Loan Shark +2S, +2 attacks made at initiative 6, cavalry.
Shark Priests double as psychers and have the psychic powers: Ancient Dynoshark (Priest does a wound to every model with a toughness attribute within 12" on a 4+), Call to blood (Priest douses the battlefield with the scent of blood, causing all Space Sharks to go into feeding frenzy as described in special rule "blood in the water"


----------



## Durant

> Farseer Special Rule; "No you fool!!!"
> 
> When the Farseer of an Eldar army is killed roll a 1d6. On a roll of a 4+ the game ends, with the Farseer stating "No you fool! We were trying to prevent their attack!" At this point a new army of a different appears on the board that is 1000 points higher then the base games point values. Restart at turn 1 and continue play.


LOL Brilliant, should also include a mandatory "take a picture of your opponents face as you field a brand new 1000PT army mid battle" rule. :laugh:


----------



## Stephen_Newman

New rule in Codex: Necrons!

Phone a Friend:

If at the beggining of any turn in which the Necron player is behind on kill points or captured objectives (Not contested) then on a 3+ the Necron player may summon Commander Dante and a unit of Blood Angels Assault Marines (tooled as the Necron player wishes) by deep strike. The Dante and Blood Angel models are now controlled by the Necron player for the rest of the game. These do not come out of the Necron players points allowance.

Phone a Friend (Blood Angels edition):

This works exactly the same as the Necron version except that the Silent King (Use the profile of a Necron Overlord-may be tooled as players wishes) and a company of Priarch Praetorians deep strike in.


----------



## Achaylus72

New Ork Codex


BBQ Boyz.

BBQ Boyz consists of four Ork Boyz and one Gretchin.

Wargear:

Weber BBQ
Brewskis
Various BBQ implements.

BBQ Boyz must be randomly deployed within the battlezone. BBQ Boyz can receive hits and wounds but can not be killed, although if BBQ Boy is hit and suffers a wound the BBQ Boy is allowed to seperate from the rest of the BBQ Squad and is entitled to a free glassing on each of the opponents scoring unit. This automatically causes 1 wound to targeted Glassee. 

Each turn on a single D6 Each member of the BBQ Squad consumes the amount of Brewskies. Once a BBQ Boy reaches 24 Brewski points, they are allowed the much vaunted URINATION on the ROSES rule, they then roll a single D6 to indicate how many Brewskis they can urinate on the roses. The Brewskis have no purpose but to annoy opponents

Also the BBQ Boyz must once per game have an all in brawl with opponents HQ, this is covered by the much anticipated "What the fuck you looking at" rule. Intoxicated BBQ Boyz don't like to be stared at, especially when we introduce the BBQ WAGS (Wives and Girlfriends), and we all know that BBQ Boyz get jealously protective of their main squeezes. This rule is enacted with a roll of 2D6, regardless of what is rolled the BBQ Boyz get their arses smacked and return back to their BBQing and drinking.

After the game is finished the BBQ Boyz end the game by shagging their WAGs.

Any thoughts


----------



## Vaz

eyescrossed said:


> Mark Wells mentions that in finding the right employees: "The politically correct need not apply."


That pissed you off?



> Really people, are you ignorant or just stupid?


I think the same applies here.

@jaysen - please, don't comment any more on what I've said. You obviously don't have a clue about what I'm talking about, so please don't muddy the water.

For the characters, like Astorath etc - that's well and good (despite what i personally feel about Special Characters inclusion in the 40K skirmish level games), but there's no actual reason as to why Blood Angels *should* have Assault Marines as troops, or Fast vehicles, as other Chapters have that - it's explicitly stated the codex chapters have an 8th Assault Company and that each battle company has at least 2 Assault Marine Squads, and it specifically states that Blood Angels have no more Assault marines than other chapters, and it specifically states that the White Scars overcharge their Rhino chassis to support their bike mounted troops.

I can remember the initial incredulity as to why bike Mounted Space Marine Captains could have Bike Mounted Command Squads and allow bikes as Troops in 5th Edition, but not the same for Jump Pack Captains to have a Jump Pack Command Squad and Assault Marines as troops.

I'm a space marine player, for christs sake, and I get pissed off at the amount of different rules that are renamed, or slightly tweaked so as not to be direct copies.

The differences between the armies are in their fluff, and very little more - the rules can, and should be able to reflect that.

And now you mention in Djinn, it's just suddenly come back to me, Matt Ward tried to "press the doorbell" when he was a babysitter for my parents way back when. Been repressed all these years.

No - the reason I "hate" Mat Ward is the fact I can see very little that he has actually done well at. All I have been able to see is failure among the mediocre.

Sorry for not celebrating mediocrity, folks.

I'll be sure to give my friends a "Well Done, you participated" medal next time they come last in anything they do.


----------



## jaysen

I'm sorry if you didn't like my comments. I, personally, don't like how you continually try to hijack this thread and turn it from its purpose. The board can do without another mediocre "I hate Matt Ward" blathering.


----------



## lokis222

Now, please stop hijacking other threads!


----------



## lokis222

http://www.heresy-online.net/forums/showthread.php?p=1098180#post1098180

Here, The Official I Hate Matt Ward Page. Now, please take your bitching somewhere else. This is a great thread and doesn't need this bickering.


----------



## lokis222

The Zeno Rule:
Any time a Zeno Army plays an imperium army and the imperium army loses, the imperium army roles 2d6. On a 4+, exteminautaus is declared and the planet destroyed. Imperium wins.


----------



## lokis222

Orks

*Flames and fuzzy dice:*

Any vehicle that buys the red paint job upgrade may upgrade it with flames and fuzzy dice for an extra 3 points.

Any vehicle with flames and fuzzy dice can move up to 24 inches and doesn't not count as having moved at all. 

*Don't scratch the paint:*

Any vehicle with the flames and fuzzy dice upgrade also gains a 3+ invulnerable save.
*
Flammable:*

Orkz embarked on vehicles upgraded with flames and fuzzy dice are susceptible to fire due to all that grease in the hair. All orkz on a vehicle with flames and fuzzy dice are hit by flame weapons even though embarked and when rolling to wound, the flame weapon counts as S + 1.


----------



## Vaz

jaysen said:


> I'm sorry if you didn't like my comments. I, personally, don't like how you continually try to hijack this thread and turn it from its purpose. The board can do without another mediocre "I hate Matt Ward" blathering.


It's not about me liking your comments.

You don't have fucking scooby about what I'm saying, and it's plain english.


----------



## Wolfbane

Cansomeone please point out the confirmed Matt ward codexes, so that I can make an informed decision, on wether to get behind the hate wagon or not.


----------



## Vaz

Grey Knights, Blood Angels, Space Marines, Necrons, Warhamme Fantasy 8th Edition, Warhammer Fantasy Storm of Chaos, that I can remember off the top of my head.

Also, all discussion about Mat Ward should be contained within one thread - why do people who don't like Mat Ward and his lazy/poor attitude to Background, and rules design have to be limited to one thread, while those who do like to celebrate mediocrity get to write whatever they like.

You're free to your opinion, but fuck off if you think that other people are not allowed to voice their opinion on Mat Ward and his decisions in the threads about them.


----------



## Samules

You know what? I give up. Go ahead, ruin this thread. It's not like you will care if I tell you to go to a more aporopriate thread one more time.

Special Rules:
The Ringbearer: At the beginning of each game roll a die for each game roll a die for each ratling in your army. If ten sixes are rolled then one ratling has the one ring. He and his squad gain invisibility which forces all units choosing to fire at them to roll for night fighting. In addition they gain +3 I and WS in cc as they are invisible. However this rule does not affect necrons and should a necron be within 12" they suffer -3 leadership.

The Black Knight: Should a black templars emperors champion take a wound that would kill him he may instead choose to lose an arm. He loses the benefit from anything carried in that arm and suffers -1 attack to a minimum of one. Should both arms be lost he can choose to lose a leg to survive additional wounds. For each leg lost his movement is reduced by 3 in all cases. Should both legs be lost he cannot move. Should at any point the opposing player quote monty python the champion regains all limbs and wounds.


----------



## Samules

It is allowed naturally just like thread jacking but we will hate you for being horrendously inconsiderate as in all cases of thread jackery. I dislike ward but I don't need to hear about it in more than one thread. That is why this is here.


----------



## the-ad-man

Vaz said:


> Grey Knights, Blood Angels, Space Marines, Necrons, Warhamme Fantasy 8th Edition, Warhammer Fantasy Storm of Chaos, that I can remember off the top of my head.
> 
> Also, all discussion about Mat Ward should be contained within one thread - why do people who don't like Mat Ward and his lazy/poor attitude to Background, and rules design have to be limited to one thread, while those who do like to celebrate mediocrity get to write whatever they like.
> 
> You're free to your opinion, but fuck off if you think that other people are not allowed to voice their opinion on Mat Ward and his decisions in the threads about them.


theres voicing an oppinion, then there is derailing a thread. i think this thread is more about stopping people from taking over threads with ward hate


----------



## effigy22

You forgot Warhammer Fantasy Daemons. Under 8th they arent as brutal as they used to be, but back in 7th? OH BOY were they cheese... and not even cheddar!


----------



## Wolfbane

Hmmn not read any of the new ones of those yet.
So I am going to assume I dislike him until I read the new necron codex. Purely because of what he has supposedly done. I shall confirm or deny my distaste towards him closer to the time.


----------



## Durant

> The Black Knight: Should a black templars emperors champion take a wound that would kill him he may instead choose to lose an arm. He loses the benefit from anything carried in that arm and suffers -1 attack to a minimum of one. Should both arms be lost he can choose to lose a leg to survive additional wounds. For each leg lost his movement is reduced by 3 in all cases. Should both legs be lost he cannot move. Should at any point the opposing player quote monty python the champion regains all limbs and wounds.


:laugh: Love It! And its like a spell or something, I am trying really hard not to state the obvious (kudos for not naming the rule *Tis B* ... No, must resist) :laugh:


Trained by The True Imperium. A die is rolled at the start of every attacking round, the lowest rolls side has any units using ranged attacks not hitting shit for the next turn.


----------



## effigy22

Nom Nom Nom Nom: Tyranids that destroy a unit in close combat can instead of consolidate, eat the remains of their foes. Doing so gives the tyranid unit any special rules the enemy had.


----------



## lokis222

the-ad-man said:


> theres voicing an oppinion, then there is derailing a thread. i think this thread is more about stopping people from taking over threads with ward hate


This wasn't aimed at Vaz. It was aimed at, as you say, stopping threads from getting derailed by hate, but it takes two sides to get a proper derailing on the go. So, it is also aimed at people trolling the hate and people who oppose the hate. (appologists and lovers of...) 

I think that if you think it is important enough to debate, then do so, but please keep it in its place. 

Personally, I am indifferent to Mr. Ward. He has gone from being absolute crap in the overpowered Demons and pathetic old Orks and Goblins to slowly getting his balance in later and later editions. He doesn't have the finesse of the guy who wrote Dark Eldar, but at least he puts out better books than the Tyranids writer. 

Anyway @Vaz: I find the other thread really funny, so I made this one in the hopes that it doesn't get wreaked. I don't blame you or Dijinn for your opinions. Wasn't personal. It was just a hope that it would work. 

Peace.


----------



## Xela

He's getting better though, god I remember those Daemons in 7th...my poor Bretonnians *sniff*


----------



## effigy22

Xela said:


> He's getting better though, god I remember those Daemons in 7th...my poor Bretonnians *sniff*


It was getting silly with Daemons, the last GT i went to (qualifier) out of the top 10, 8 were Daemons of Chaos. it was INSANE! Although i did take Daemons myself i remember getting a lot of kudos / funny looks because i had absoloutly no magic! i relied on the normal 2 dispel dice and magic resistance!


----------



## James Tiberius

Xela said:


> He's getting better though


yep what he writes has gone from "OMFG MY EYES ARE BLEEDING FROM RETARDNESS"
to 
"OMG MY EYES ARE BLEEDING FROM RETARDNESS"


----------



## Durandal

Baaaaaaw matt ward
Im wealthy enough and have enough free time to maintain a hobby like 40k.
I will now spend a great deal of my time on the internet complaining endlessly about this hobby, while doing nothing good for it.


----------



## Digg40k

Durandal said:


> Baaaaaaw matt ward
> Im wealthy enough and have enough free time to maintain a hobby like 40k.
> I will now spend a great deal of my time on the internet complaining endlessly about this hobby, while doing nothing good for it.


:laugh:

Does it count as thread jacking or derailment if I say that I quite like the guy? Yes? Damn. In that case his sideburns are stupid.


----------



## James Tiberius

Digg40k said:


> :laugh:
> 
> Does it count as thread jacking or derailment if I say that I quite like the guy? Yes? .


yes, it is quite impossible to like a man who writes about blood angels allying with necrons, no matter how brief, or about a chapter than spends more time being rescued by the ultramarines than actually fighting.

or to actually like a man who wrote the autowin knights codex


----------



## lokis222

Power of the Machine Spirit FAQ:

With power of the machine spirit you may always shoot one weapon more than you could normally shoot. If you could shoot all weapons, you may shoot one weapon more than once and if your vehicle is wrecked or destroyed, you can still shoot one weapon. The Emperor Protects. :wink:


----------



## Durandal

James Tiberius said:


> yes, it is quite impossible to like a man who writes about blood angels allying with necrons, no matter how brief, or about a chapter than spends more time being rescued by the ultramarines than actually fighting.
> 
> or to actually like a man who wrote the autowin knights codex


see to me, this reads as

"im a scrub, who doesnt actually understand how the game works, so ill just complain about things i dont understand like a 4 year old."

Come on stella cuntdente, youve been doing this since time began


----------



## Djinn24

Top Heavy: When one of your Wraithguard models falls over, Roll an initiatize check, if you succeed remove all models of your opponents that is knocked down, if you fail move all models that where knocked over to be in base to model contact. It required 1 turn to stand up and your toughness takes -2.


----------



## James Tiberius

Durandal said:


> see to me, this reads as
> 
> "im a scrub, who doesnt actually understand how the game works, so ill just complain about things i dont understand like a 4 year old."


1: I would return to school and improve your reading ability
2: did you see the title of the thread?, your going to bitch and whine about people bitching and whining in a thread designed for bitching and whining?...truly your an idiot
3: not liking 1 person in a thread about this 1 person means I have no idea how the game works?, also complaining about his fluff also means I have no idea how the game works despite the fact the fluff has no bearing on the game at all.

please, if your going to pretend to act like your in possesion of some form of moral high ground it would be best if you did so by not looking like a completely retarded ape

either that or I would dismount matt ward, as obviously the movements of the two of you slowly making love as he writes his next tragedy of a codex on your back is distracting you from actually using your brain


----------



## Ravner298

I play daemons. I have spent alot of time painting and modeling the army. The amount of people that picked up GK at my local spot have made this army completely unuseable, save 1 tyranid player (I hate doom and transfixing gaze). I have pleanty of hate for Ward and it is justified. 

Ill lay low, paint and do other things until chaos legions comes out. It'll be fun to be at the top of the codex creep wave and you better believe I'm going to make all those GK waacr's pay.


----------



## James Tiberius

Ravner298 said:


> Ill lay low, paint and do other things until chaos legions comes out. It'll be fun to be at the top of the codex creep wave and you better believe I'm going to make all those GK waacr's pay.


it will only be top of the codex creep for a short time though, until matt ward writes another space marine codex "codex: yet another chapter rescued by ultramarines"


----------



## Farseer Darvaleth

If Mat Ward had personally offended/assaulted you (ie: the man himself hit you, not some figurative bullshit) then I'd perhaps understand dislike. But hate? Do you know how strong an emotion that is? If you met the man would you spit in his face, kick him, and leave him on the floor? If he was dying in the street, would you walk past? Would you go so far as to kill him?

I understand many will simply be too tempted by the ease the internet brings to express hyperbolic emotions. I realise that you don't truly hate the poor man, but simply dislike the changes he has made, are frustrated, and in the heat of the moment say "I hate". At least in that situation you are only a coward and there is nothing fundamentally amiss. I confess I too will once have expressed dislike towards Mat Ward in a manner which did not truly reflect what I actually felt, but instead was overblown "internet speak". I've seen that the more I think of him as a person, not this distant figure who is seemingly ruining people's lives by writing little novelettes in books about toy soldiers, the less I've disliked him and the more I've understood him. This was very liberating for me.

Now, sitting on my high horse, I have turned and seen truly for the first time the rabid horde of "haters" that I have left, and I'm horrified. I'm horrified that humans are capable of such unconditional, unreasonable, and unjustifiable hatred. It is simply not right. 

I understand you're all entitled to your opinion. I do not understand how civilised opinion can devolve so catastrophically into something as inhumane and vulgar as hatred. Please, if you take nothing else from what I've said, at least understand that hate is not something to be tossed around lightly. We're talking about a human being here. A designer in a toy soldiers company. Not a bloody tyrannical despot. Why the hate?



EDIT: Please note the great pains I took to restrain myself in this post. Any unnecessarily provocative replies or trolling will not be met with much enthusiasm, and I will not restrain my rebuttal as I have this post.


----------



## Zion

Prone: Any model with this rule increases their cover save by +1, and may still fire while pinned. However it takes them a turn to stand up and may not move the turn they do so (they may still shoot though) and they go at initiative 1 when assaulted while prone.


----------



## James Tiberius

I think some people really need not look too deeply into the word "hate", this is a forum, not a meeting of world dictators, the use of the word hate does not mean we all want to kill him, it is just a word not to be thought over or looked into with a hope of finding some deep inner thought or meaning.


----------



## comrade

Ok. I dislike the man alot. Not hate. But dislike. Strongly. 

Mainly the fluff crap he has written. I like ...most..... of his rules. But his fluff is shit. Absolute shit.


----------



## lokis222

James Tiberius said:


> 2: did you see the title of the thread?, your going to bitch and whine about people bitching and whining in a thread designed for bitching and whining?...truly your an idiot


Okay, this thread is getting pretty funny too. :laugh:


----------



## C'Tan Chimera




----------



## Farseer Darvaleth

> I think some people really need not look too deeply into the word "hate", this is a forum, not a meeting of world dictators, the use of the word hate does not mean we all want to kill him, it is just a word not to be thought over or looked into with a hope of finding some deep inner thought or meaning.





comrade said:


> Ok. I dislike the man alot. Not hate. But dislike. Strongly.
> 
> Mainly the fluff crap he has written. I like ...most..... of his rules. But his fluff is shit. Absolute shit.


Right, ok. So you guys don't really hate the poor man, just dislike changes he has made to fluff etc. I can understand that perfectly. You fall into the category I mentioned which was those who are either too tempted or just don't think of the full implications of writing "hate" on the internet. As long as you aren't physically hateful human beings then I respect your opinion.  (EDIT: Even then I still would, but I would have no respect for you as people. And no, I would not "hate" you....)


Whilst I respect it, it doesn't mean I won't try and change it. :laugh: Just take a step back and look at the situation. I put it in slightly derogatory terms, that he has "written novelettes in a book about toy soldiers" which everyone seems to be so angry about. I realise that ours is a diverse hobby and many of us will no doubt feel passionate about it. I love the fluff side of 40k especially. And yes, you guessed it, I don't particularly like having the C'tan overthrown. So why don't I "hate" Ward?

I don't have to obey the fluff. It isn't affecting my life. I don't have to go into GW, and hang my head in shame because I teamed up with BA that one time. Heck, no. My army is still ruled by C'tan and would certainly not hum-drum with humans. I'm picking the bits of fluff I like (which is quite a lot of it) and just watering down the bits I'm not so keen on right now. If you don't like any of the fluff at all, maybe you're being just a tiny little bit stubborn? We have to accept change at some stage. 

But I can see neither of you, at least, truly hate the poor guy. My qualm is with people who seem to systematically destroy the man over the internet, but not in person, I hasten to add, and obliterate everything he has ever done and labelling it with that repulsive umbrella term "crap". Maybe you do have strong feelings, but do they really need to be expressed so violently? All it does is incite more "hate" towards Ward. Within this very thread I've seen a member join the "haters" simply because somebody else said so, and without actually having their own opinion on the matter! I find this appalling. Viciously vocal people should not have the power to sway the judgements of other people.

Moderators, I am of the conviction that this thread should be closed. If I found such a thread on the forum where I moderate I would not hesitate to have it shut immediately. Our hobby should be a positive thing, not something to brood over and for "haters" to collaborate their "hate" over, whether face-to-face (where I suspect the majority of "haters" will no longer be quite so opinionated) or over the internet. The hatred of another human being should be frowned upon, not encouraged in forums!


----------



## lokis222

Farseer Darvaleth said:


> Moderators, I am of the conviction that this thread should be closed. If I found such a thread on the forum where I moderate I would not hesitate to have it shut immediately. Our hobby should be a positive thing, not something to brood over and for "haters" to collaborate their "hate" over, whether face-to-face (where I suspect the majority of "haters" will no longer be quite so opinionated) or over the internet. The hatred of another human being should be frowned upon, not encouraged in forums!


Everyone's a critic.  Personally, I think it should be stickied. Then, when thread hijacking occurs, people can just tell the person to take it to the place that has been created for that purpose. People gonna hate and people gonna hate the haters. Give 'em a forum to get it out of their systems.


----------



## gally912

Farseer Darvaleth said:


> Moderators, I am of the conviction that this thread should be closed. If I found such a thread on the forum where I moderate I would not hesitate to have it shut immediately. Our hobby should be a positive thing, not something to brood over and for "haters" to collaborate their "hate" over, whether face-to-face (where I suspect the majority of "haters" will no longer be quite so opinionated) or over the internet. The hatred of another human being should be frowned upon, not encouraged in forums!


A gram is better than a damn! 



Really, if it detracts from the number of people posting about it in other threads, it will only be good for the forums. People are going to be doing it regardless, so unless you enjoy being negative-thought police... it's a fine thread and I hope it lives forever.


----------



## Farseer Darvaleth

gally912 said:


> Really, if it detracts from the number of people posting about it in other threads, it will only be good for the forums. People are going to be doing it regardless, so unless you enjoy being negative-thought police... it's a fine thread and I hope it lives forever.


If I believed that this thread could serve as a scapegoat for all things "hateful" concerning Mat Ward, then I would let deluded pessimists come here and slander the poor man away until the cows come home. I do not believe, however, that such a scapegoat can be successful, what with "hating" Mat Ward seemingly "in fashion" for wargamers these days. As you say, "People are going to be doing it regardless."

But then even if to begin with it serves as a fully functional "hate" thread, the very existence of such a thread will only condone the "hate" which goes on within it! By saying "yes, this thread exists, and should continue to do so" you are allowing the "hatred" to continue its miserable existence. One could even go as far as to say Heresy is encouraging members to "hate" Mat Ward, which I am certain is not truly the case, of course. If you lock this thread, and amend Heresy's rules so that they read:



> Personal attacks will NOT be tolerated! If you lash out personally against another user *or person* you will receive our full attention, and trust me, you don't want that. ... Attacks against people outside of Heresy are *equally* discouraged, *and are* as serious as attacks against other users.


To continue, if you lock this thread and change Heresy's rules so they read thus then you will be performing a great moral act and making the world that much better a place to live in.



> so unless you enjoy being negative-thought police...


Believe me when I say that I take no joy in showing people their horrific, inhumane, and savage capacity for hatred. Unless you are implying that I shouldn't be trying to put a stop to hate? Whilst I would not "hate" you for that, as it would be a rather ironic hypocrisy, I would certainly be filled with rage that such people can exist in a world which has already seen too much hate.


----------



## Wolfbane

Wait, wut?
Blood angels teamed up with necrons?
Bwahahahahahahahaaaaaaaaa
What garbage!
Mind made up rofl.


----------



## Doelago




----------



## gally912

Farseer Darvaleth said:


> If you lock this thread, and amend Heresy's rules so that they read:
> 
> Personal attacks will NOT be tolerated! If you lash out personally against another user or person you will receive our full attention, and trust me, you don't want that. ... Attacks against people outside of Heresy are equally discouraged, and are as serious as attacks against other users.


Have...have you ever met Jez?


----------



## Wusword77

James Tiberius said:


> it will only be top of the codex creep for a short time though, until matt ward writes another space marine codex "codex: yet another chapter rescued by ultramarines"


Codex Creep? You mean the idea that every time a new codex comes out it's the most powerful codex available? I thought that was disproved once Space Wolves and Imperial Guard remained the most powerful codices after the release of Blood Angels and Dark Eldar. Now, with the release of the Grey Knights codex, we have a book that people consider "on par" with Space Wolves and Imperial Guard.

It wouldn't surprise me one bit if the Necron codex wasn't as powerful as SW, GK, or IG.


----------



## Farseer Darvaleth

gally912 said:


> Have...have you ever met Jez?


I know Jezlad is the forum administrator, yes. Why would that be a cause for terror, unless I have misunderstood you?

Perhaps you mean I should bring up this issue with him? I may just do that if I feel the moral calibre of people on this forum has fallen to such depths that an amendment of the rules warrants it. Not that any action will necessarily be made as a cause of my raising the issue, but I shall nevertheless raise it if the aforementioned criteria are, in my opinion, met.

And I apologise for my style of writing. I tend to alter the general order of words and leave verbs to the end because Latin is something I, with great gusto, study. 

EDIT: Yes, that was a little Latin joke...


----------



## James Tiberius

Doelago said:


>


if it is matt ward you could have a hundred hate threads and it would still not be enough


----------



## Doelago

Farseer Darvaleth said:


> I know Jezlad is the forum administrator, yes. Why would that be a cause for terror, unless I have misunderstood you?


... You have never met Jezlad then?


----------



## Wusword77

Imperial Guard and Sisters of Battle Special Rule; All Guts, no Glory: On the final turn of the game, if you have more KP on the table then your opponent roll a 1d6. On a roll of 2+ 1000 points of Space Marines arrive to finish off the enemy army. This counts as a Draw for you and a victory for the Space Marine army. 

Additional rule; Beware the Taint of Chaos: This rule functions as above but only applies if you are facing Chaos Space Marines or Chaos Deamons. If you are Grey Knights show up instead of Space Marines. Fearing that your remaining forces are tainted by Chaos they will kill all your units after winning the game. The game counts as a loss for your records and 2 victories for the Grey Knights :biggrin:


----------



## Farseer Darvaleth

Doelago said:


> ... You have never met Jezlad then?


Not personally, no. And he's never posted in a thread I've taken part of either, not that I'd expect him to, of course.

Why all this mystique? Does every power-figure have to be this mysterious, distant stereotype? Unless I'm getting the complete wrong end of this stick.


----------



## lokis222

Farseer Darvaleth said:


> I may just do that if I feel the moral calibre of people on this forum has fallen to such depths that an amendment of the rules warrants it. Not that any action will necessarily be made as a cause of my raising the issue, but I shall nevertheless raise it if the aforementioned criteria are, in my opinion, met.


Seriously? :shok: 

You really need to unwind and get over yourself. This hurts nobody, saves headaches, and Matt Ward doesn't give a shit. Fanboyz getting angry about something is what fanboyz do. Its called Nerd Rage for a reason.


----------



## lokis222

We all suffer at some point.


----------



## gally912

Jezlad said:


> 1 less crack whore in the world. Rot in pieces skank.


Fearless leader, on the death of Amy Winehouse.

<3 Jez :king:


----------



## Katie Drake

Honestly I'm all for this thread.

If there's even the slightest chance that all the retardation could be kept in a single ignorable thread then I say we take that risk.


----------



## gally912

Sisters of Battle Special Rule;

Purity Blood
If fighting Chaos Daemons, Grey Knights come and slaughter your army for their Purity Blood. You must replace all units in your army with a unit from Codex Grey Knights. Each unit may have a point total of the unit it replaces+ 100, and the Grey Knight unit will inherit the Act of Faith of the unit replaced- except that it will be considered always on/always successful.


----------



## Lubacca

Traitor's Blood: 
If Blood angels are fighting Chaos in any form they gain Sanguinius might, where all troops in the BA army now have the stats of the Sanguinator, flight and power hammers. Also the moment that a member of the BA army is killed, Dante comes down from wherever he is and can one shot entire troops for the rest of the game.


----------



## James Tiberius

Katie Drake said:


> Honestly I'm all for this thread.
> 
> If there's even the slightest chance that all the retardation could be kept in a single ignorable thread then I say we take that risk.


oh you mean reduce matt ward to computer generated data and keep him locked away in a thread?, if only, then we could be rid of a man doing GW more harm tha good


----------



## Samules

Nice intentional misunderstanding.

I think Mat Ward writes some over the top fluff (If it is him writing Draigo)

Although that is a good point up there about codex balance. Each edition is internally balanced and power creep could very well be editions designed to take full advantage of the rules beating older ones that aren't.


----------



## Zion

James Tiberius said:


> oh you mean reduce matt ward to computer generated data and keep him locked away in a thread?, if only, then we could be rid of a man doing GW more harm tha good


You mean like half the company? It seems there is a lot more harm coming out of the decisions being made in the top of the company than good as of late.


----------



## lokis222

Zion said:


> You mean like half the company? It seems there is a lot more harm coming out of the decisions being made in the top of the company than good as of late.


Welcome to the dark side.


----------



## Zion

lokis222 said:


> Welcome to the dark side.


Nah, no hatred here, just someone who wants GW to live up to the potential it shows. Well that and pointing out that Ward isn't the only person people could be complaining about. Complaining about Ward is becoming so overplayed that I don't even feel ire about seeing it all thetime, just boredom.


----------



## ThoseKrazyKasrkin

Farseer Darvaleth said:


> I understand many will simply be too tempted by the ease the internet brings to express hyperbolic emotions. I realise that you don't hate the poor man.......


Its also easy to take the moral high ground on the internet.
You know full well your moralising wont change anything and your simply filling the forum with words.

Plus hate means different things to different people. The same way holocaust means nothing to me but everything to those touched by it. Personally, hate is a very loose word for myself and everone i know. Its simply a throw away word


----------



## Moonschwine

God I'm glad this thread finally came up. It's been brewing for some time; it is quite a surprise to see the community voicing it's opinion this way but needs must I guess. 

Anyway I hate Matt Ward for the Following Reasons.

1. He stole my Girlfriend.

2. His name is an Annogram of Tat Ma Wrd which is Dutch for "He who brings the cheddar." And no one in the world could ever like a man like this.

2. He has on several occasions photo-bombed major celebrities. Including Jay-Z, Heath Ledger and that guy from that film, you know the one, with the robots and the cats.

3. His house is made of Gingerbread and he lures children there to eat them.

4. He consistently poisons the town well.

5. He put two #2's in this post.

His only redeeming feature is he writes painfully powerful rules; however he's writing so many books now eventually it will all even out. Remember once everyone is a special super-unit of death then no one is.

Amidoinitrite?


----------



## Insanity

*Matt Ward Hate?*

So I was away from 40K for awhile and have only just recently gotten back into it and something i've noticed is that a lot of people seem to have a hatred for Matt Ward.

So what is it that Matt Ward has done that is so terrible? I know he's written the new Necron Codex but thats about it. Is he somehow ruining the Necrons as a playable race?


----------



## Moonschwine

Go here to join the band wagon:

http://1d4chan.org/wiki/Matthew_Ward


----------



## SynthNine

This guy is now my hero.


----------



## Zion

To sum up: Ward doesn't write the best fluff and some people take It very personally. And depending on how you view the game you may find his work unbalanced, or not too bad. A lot of it's subjective, and most of it leads to a lot of angry people on the internet.


----------



## MidnightKid333

I always thought ward was hated mostly for making overpowered codices. I'm just glad Cruddace wrote the Tyranid codex. The fluff is beautiful and makes alot of sense. Cruddace should write more codices in my opinion. If not, the fluff for other codices


----------



## Nicholas Hadrian

Forget 1d4chan, it's just bluster and hatemongering.

For the most part, Mat Ward is disliked because people use him as a simple scape goat. They blame him for the following;

They claim that he writes terrible unbalanced rule sets. He does not, they are in fact well balanced and unique against other 5th ed rule sets. It's just that they destroy things prior to that due to them not being designed against each other.

They claim that he is an Ultramarines fan who loves Ultramarines so much that he offended every other space marine player with claims like "3/5ths of the Space Marine chapters veiw Marneus Calgar as their spiritual leige." and the fact that the Codex:Space Marines contains primarily UM fluff. This all could have been easily avoided by naming it Codex: Ultramarines, but I digress.

They claim that he ruined the Space Wolf and Blood Angels codexes by creating the phenomenon of "Blood Angel captains using blood bolters with blood rounds and bloody blood blood of blood." or the Space Wolves with Canis Wolfborn, thunderwolves and wolfywolfwolf mcwolf. THe fact is there are only 4 things with "Blood" in their name in the Blood Angels codex, and he did not even WRITE the Space Wolf codex, but he is of course, still blamed with for this.

He is blamed for the fairly silly look of Dreadknights, which he likely, not being a concept artist OR sculptor, had no control over.

He is blamed for a peice of fluff of Necrons and Blood Angels forming a breif alliance of convienence (and mentioing the blood angels found the idea of turning on the necrons DISTASTEFUL, this I will put at his feet, if he had stopped a sentence earlier, everything would have been fine, but NOOO he had to keep going.)

He is now being blamed for the changes in Necron fluff, but once again, this was likely GW mandated, so he can hardly be blamed for that one.

And finally, he is an, at best, mediocre writer. TO which I say, "eh, get the man a better editor."

And that is why people hate Mat Ward.


----------



## Zion

midnightkid333 said:


> I always thought ward was hated mostly for making overpowered codices. I'm just glad Cruddace wrote the Tyranid codex. The fluff is beautiful and makes alot of sense. Cruddace should write more codices in my opinion. If not, the fluff for other codices


If Ward would do the crunch and Cruddace the fluff I think the complaints would die down, we'd have a bunch of books that all would perform well, and have excellent fluff to work with.


----------



## lokis222

Tau Conversion Beam:

At the beginning of every Tau turn, nominate one enemy unit. That unit takes a leadership test. If the leadership test fails, it joins the Tau for the greater good.


----------



## lokis222

Moonschwine said:


> Amidoinitrite?


Nournot! Needsmorebile. :laugh:


----------



## Grokfog

I don't have too much of a problem with Ward.

My issue is with the young, impressionable kids that read his fluff and instantly decide that Ultramarines are the be all and end all of 40k. Or that Draigo is going to stamp all over everything he comes across because he battered a daemon primarch.

Then, said kids inevitably lose because they're too busy trying to get their super hero to do something spectacular instead of learning to use their army, they get upset and quit, and become jaded internet trolls hating on random individuals because they were involved in something they don't like.

Ever decreasing spiral.


----------



## Moonschwine

> If Ward would do the crunch and Cruddace the fluff I think the complaints would die down, we'd have a bunch of books that all would perform well, and have excellent fluff to work with.


I do feel bad for Ward. One thing GW basically did to try cut the Hatred towards Ward was an interview and stressed that although one "main" authors name was put on a codex, it was a team of people who wrote the thing.

As for his ruleset. I don't think Ward can be criticized too harshly. I mainly do it in jest more than anything. After-all 40K is cyclical. No doubt we'll be hearing "OMG Necrons are so OP" and "So your a Necron Player, GJ Powermonger" in the coming month. Furthermore I often feel Ward is not given credit where its due; when he makes changes, they are felt and impactful, and thats what this game needs - to keep it fresh and keep the cash flowing into GW so they can create more products, more controversy and so fourth. Also We cry out over and over "oh move stuff forward" and when they do the GW team get lynched. New Necrons are prime examples of this. Yes yes, things get a bit silly but there have been cases of bad codex making in the past (Tau Devilfish Chevron); I just feel its unfortunate Ward happened to have his name on the front of many controversies.



> Forget 1d4chan, it's just bluster and hatemongering.


I have to disagree with you in a Gentlemanly fashion. /tg/ and by association 1d4chan perpetuates alot of criticism of GW on a very popular website so to just outright ignore them is folly. For all their hatred they do raise valid points - I can see why elements of 40K are sacred for the fanbase, and Wardian fluff has openly stepped on toes. I'm not saying follow them blindly, but any thinking man can see merit to their arguments.


----------



## lokis222

Zion said:


> If Ward would do the crunch and Cruddace the fluff I think the complaints would die down, we'd have a bunch of books that all would perform well, and have excellent fluff to work with.


Your an optimist I think. GW honestly has a few issues and Mr. Ward is the face that people seem to have put to those issues. 

Issues:
Bad rule set. It has a lot of holes. Though, it is only when you play with rules lawyers that it usually becomes an issue.

A new rule book every few months. Personally, I am a fan of how Privateer Press did it. Release all at once and FAQ as necessary. 

Power Creep. It is an issue for people who are in the game to play and not as a painting hobby.

FAQs are inconsistent and often far too slow in being produced.

Personally, Matt Ward has gotten better, but for people who have had their armies ruined in Fantasy by him and who are into the fluff, it will take a lot of hard work on his part to make people give him half a chance again. Hopefully, shit will die down soon and we can get back to not being at each other's throats.


----------



## Nicholas Hadrian

Moonschwine said:


> I do feel bad for Ward. One thing GW basically did to try cut the Hatred towards Ward was an interview and stressed that although one "main" authors name was put on a codex, it was a team of people who wrote the thing.
> 
> As for his ruleset. I don't think Ward can be criticized too harshly. I mainly do it in jest more than anything. After-all 40K is cyclical. No doubt we'll be hearing "OMG Necrons are so OP" and "So your a Necron Player, GJ Powermonger" in the coming month. Furthermore I often feel Ward is not given credit where its due; when he makes changes, they are felt and impactful, and thats what this game needs - to keep it fresh and keep the cash flowing into GW so they can create more products, more controversy and so fourth. Also We cry out over and over "oh move stuff forward" and when they do the GW team get lynched. New Necrons are prime examples of this. Yes yes, things get a bit silly but there have been cases of bad codex making in the past (Tau Devilfish Chevron); I just feel its unfortunate Ward happened to have his name on the front of many controversies.
> 
> 
> 
> I have to disagree with you in a Gentlemanly fashion. /tg/ and by association 1d4chan perpetuates alot of criticism of GW on a very popular website so to just outright ignore them is folly. For all their hatred they do raise valid points - I can see why elements of 40K are sacred for the fanbase, and Wardian fluff has openly stepped on toes. I'm not saying follow them blindly, but any thinking man can see merit to their arguments.


Hmm... *thinks*

I agree.


----------



## OIIIIIIO

I think it's funny. Fuck him ... fuck him right in the mouth. I hope he goes to a bar and gets a bit tipsy, decides to walk home and gets picked up for public intox. I hope that when they put him in the jail cell that there is a large black man, roughly the size of that guy in the Green Mile, that thinks its cool to have him some white manpussy to play with. But that is just me and I only barely dislike the guy as I have never met him!:biggrin:

BTW: that beard that Ward sported is just a shock absorber for a high speed cocksucker ... just sayin.


----------



## Moonschwine

OIIIIIIO said:


> I think it's funny. Fuck him ... fuck him right in the mouth. I hope he goes to a bar and gets a bit tipsy, decides to walk home and gets picked up for public intox. I hope that when they put him in the jail cell that there is a large black man, roughly the size of that guy in the Green Mile, that thinks its cool to have him some white manpussy to play with. But that is just me and I only barely dislike the guy as I have never met him!:biggrin:


Made me think of this! It seems that this is the Ballard of Matt Ward at the moment!


----------



## Wusword77

James Tiberius said:


> oh you mean reduce matt ward to computer generated data and keep him locked away in a thread?, if only, then we could be rid of a man doing GW more harm tha good


As opposed to Cruddace who gives us the worst 5th ed codex (Nids) and the top end Imperial Guard codex, where half the units are pointless because the other units are HYPER point efficient.


----------



## Wusword77

Nicholas Hadrian said:


> They claim that he ruined the Space Wolf and Blood Angels codexes by creating the phenomenon of "Blood Angel captains using blood bolters with blood rounds and bloody blood blood of blood." or the Space Wolves with Canis Wolfborn, thunderwolves and wolfywolfwolf mcwolf. THe fact is there are only 4 things with "Blood" in their name in the Blood Angels codex, and he did not even WRITE the Space Wolf codex, but he is of course, still blamed with for this.


You forgot that the Space Wolf Codex came out first.


----------



## ShadowMatt

"Let's Be Friends"
Whenever Blood Angels are playing against Necrons, instead of attacking either player may give their opponent a bunch of flowers. Everybody loses.
"Ward Save"
If your name is Matt, all of your models gain a 2+ Ward Save. If you lose the game, roll a d6: on a roll of 2+ the game is declared void and your opponent must immediately play you again or they automatically lose and must give you 5 dollars.

New Wargear: "Hammer of Profit"
Any model in the game may take a Hammer of Profit for no points cost. Any model killed by a Hammer of Profit must be immediately smashed with a hammer, and repurchased from your nearest GW store.


----------



## Durandal

No, do not mention Cruddace, for that is the rational counter argument to the extreme amount of Ward hate.


----------



## lokis222

Wusword77 said:


> As opposed to Cruddace who gives us the worst 5th ed codex (Nids) and the top end Imperial Guard codex, where half the units are pointless because the other units are HYPER point efficient.


My poor 'nids.  

I will say though, they are still good. It is the fact that to have any decent anti-tank, you have to give up so many very cool elite choices. That and the FAQ.... if they deleted the FAQ (cept the doom stuff) it would be on par with everyone else.

Though, in their defence, they are still very playable and you can win a lot. They are just not plug and play.


----------



## Katie Drake

lokis222 said:


> My poor 'nids.
> 
> I will say though, they are still good. It is the fact that to have any decent anti-tank, you have to give up so many very cool elite choices. That and the FAQ.... if they deleted the FAQ (cept the doom stuff) it would be on par with everyone else.
> 
> Though, in their defence, they are still very playable and you can win a lot. They are just not plug and play.


Tyranids are fine at a casual level. It's when you start playing in tournaments that their flaws start to really matter.


----------



## eyescrossed

Vaz said:


> That pissed you off?


Not really, but it's a revelation as to why most GW employees aren't politically correct.

EDIT: No seriously, it's them basically saying "We don't care if you offend people, we just want you to sell models."


----------



## maddermax

I certainly don't Hate mat ward, but I do dislike a lot of his work. I think this mainly comes from my experiences with him in fantasy, where the 7th Ed daemons were so ridiculous that you could expect entire winners tables filled with daemons, while the 7th ed O&G army he wrote was so underpowered it was pants. That and the 8th Ed rule book essentially invalidated my army. The 40k stuff he's done seems to pale in comparison, rules wise at least. Fluff wise... well, I'll leave that to others.



Farseer Darvaleth said:


> Moderators, I am of the conviction that this thread should be closed. If I found such a thread on the forum where I moderate I would not hesitate to have it shut immediately. Our hobby should be a positive thing, not something to brood over and for "haters" to collaborate their "hate" over, whether face-to-face (where I suspect the majority of "haters" will no longer be quite so opinionated) or over the internet. The hatred of another human being should be frowned upon, not encouraged in forums!





gally912 said:


> Have...have you ever met Jez?





Farseer Darvaleth said:


> I know Jezlad is the forum administrator, yes. Why would that be a cause for terror, unless I have misunderstood you?
> 
> Perhaps you mean I should bring up this issue with him? I may just do that if I feel the moral calibre of people on this forum has fallen to such depths that an amendment of the rules warrants it. Not that any action will necessarily be made as a cause of my raising the issue, but I shall nevertheless raise it if the aforementioned criteria are, in my opinion, met.


Now this... this is comedy!

/Sexy Bacon!


----------



## lokis222

Katie Drake said:


> Tyranids are fine at a casual level. It's when you start playing in tournaments that their flaws start to really matter.


Kick a guy while he is down. :wink: 

Their my only army currently. Allow me some illusions.


----------



## Zion

lokis222 said:


> Your an optimist I think.


Sometimes. I just hope for the best with each book but prepare myself for books with the fluff of Draigo and the rules of the Nid codex (and the faq).


----------



## Azkaellon

lokis222 said:


> Kick a guy while he is down. :wink:
> 
> Their my only army currently. Allow me some illusions.


Want to buy an Eldar army then? lol!


----------



## Nicholas Hadrian

Wusword77 said:


> You forgot that the Space Wolf Codex came out first.


My apologies. And besides, the way the trend is going we're prolly going to have a new Dark Angels codex and see alot of references to "Dark dark darkmcdarkydark" Or considering the number of references to it, "Lionlion mclionylionlion."

... Does that mean a combined army of Dark Angels and Space wolves using drop pods makes it so that it's raining cats and dogs?


----------



## jaysen

ShadowMatt said:


> "Let's Be Friends"
> Whenever Blood Angels are playing against Necrons, instead of attacking either player may give their opponent a bunch of flowers. Everybody loses.
> "Ward Save"
> If your name is Matt, all of your models gain a 2+ Ward Save. If you lose the game, roll a d6: on a roll of 2+ the game is declared void and your opponent must immediately play you again or they automatically lose and must give you 5 dollars.
> 
> New Wargear: "Hammer of Profit"
> Any model in the game may take a Hammer of Profit for no points cost. Any model killed by a Hammer of Profit must be immediately smashed with a hammer, and repurchased from your nearest GW store.


Love it! The Ward Save made me LOL, serious. 

Ward rewrites Tau, part 2. Any Tau army can include the Goodbringer as an HQ choice. The Goodbringer is a special enlightened ethereal that has the following profile.

WS10 BS3 S5 T6 W3 I6 A5 Ld10 Sv2+ invulnerable, jet pack, haywire grenades, power weapon, stealth, fearless, Inspiring Aura (gives all Fire Warriors the counterattack ability)


----------



## jaysen

It's occasionally worth a laugh to listen to nerdrage. But, every friggin thread? No thanks.


----------



## Overbeing

Yeah, my only problem with Ward is that he makes the codex's he writes to epic and GW need to make all the other armies just as good. (Although I'm probably the only person on the face of the earth who thinks that!) :biggrin:


----------



## SavageConvoy

He's done some goofy stuff fluff wise, but I think that's all he can really be blamed for.

GW as a company is the one that decided to have a rotation cycle measure in decades, demands more models be introduced, and even try to direct a lot the flow to what they think will be "Hip with all the cool cats down at the confectionary establisment" 

But that's the problem with business in general. The higher ups become focused on numbers and keep sticking their fingers into the mix to try and help. It happens with comics, movies, and countless other projects.

So in summery, we will hate him.
Because he's the writer Warhammer deserves, but not the one it needs right now (We need 6th ed dammit)...and so we'll hate him, because he can take it. Because he's not a story teller. He's a fanboyish fluff writer, a maker of crunch...a Dark Kni...Wait who are we talking about again?.


----------



## Stephen_Newman

Love that Black Knight reference!

New Wargear for Black Templars

The Holy Hand Grenade of Antioch!

This is a one-shot weapon and only one may be chosen per army. In the shooting phase the Holy Hand Grenade may be thrown with the profile below:

Range: 24 inches, S:10, AP:1, Type: Assault 1, Blast, one-shot

This attack may be used to single out models and any model wounded by the holy hand grenade must re-roll successful invulnerable saves and the Grenade inflicts instant death. Even against targets with Eternal Warrior.

In addition if the target wears any fur, has fur or has clothing that could resemble fur (such as robes or cloaks such as those worn by Space Wolves) then the model gets blown instantly with no saves whatsoever!


----------



## Nicholas Hadrian

SavageConvoy said:


> He's done some goofy stuff fluff wise, but I think that's all he can really be blamed for.
> 
> GW as a company is the one that decided to have a rotation cycle measure in decades, demands more models be introduced, and even try to direct a lot the flow to what they think will be "Hip with all the cool cats down at the confectionary establisment"
> 
> But that's the problem with business in general. The higher ups become focused on numbers and keep sticking their fingers into the mix to try and help. It happens with comics, movies, and countless other projects.
> 
> So in summery, we will hate him.
> Because he's the writer Warhammer deserves, but not the one it needs right now (We need 6th ed dammit)...and so we'll hate him, because he can take it. Because he's not a story teller. He's a fanboyish fluff writer, a maker of crunch...a Dark Kni...Wait who are we talking about again?.


WARD! We're talking about Mat Ward!


----------



## Lord Sven Kittyclaw

Moonschwine said:


> Go here to join the band wagon:
> 
> http://1d4chan.org/wiki/Matthew_Ward



Ok so I've been reading this for about an hour, and have been laughing my ass off the whole time. Clearly I'm not spending enough time in the company of geeks, to not know this existed.


----------



## Farseer Darvaleth

ThoseKrazyKasrkin said:


> Its also easy to take the moral high ground on the internet.
> 
> *If trying to stop hatred is anything, it is certainly not easy. Each time I try it seems a new batch will sprout up later in the thread or elsewhere.*
> 
> You know full well your moralising wont change anything and your simply filling the forum with words.
> 
> *It saddens me to hear that. I hope you will change your outlook on things.*
> 
> Plus hate means different things to different people. The same way holocaust means nothing to me but everything to those touched by it. Personally, hate is a very loose word for myself and everone i know. Its simply a throw away word
> 
> *Hate effects everyone in this world. Heck, the example you gave is a direct result of hatred, can't you see that? And quite how "hate" can be a "throw away" word for you is beyond my comprehension.*





> I think it's funny. Fuck him ... fuck him right in the mouth. I hope he goes to a bar and gets a bit tipsy, decides to walk home and gets picked up for public intox. I hope that when they put him in the jail cell that there is a large black man, roughly the size of that guy in the Green Mile, that thinks its cool to have him some white manpussy to play with. But that is just me and I only barely dislike the guy as I have never met him!
> 
> BTW: that beard that Ward sported is just a shock absorber for a high speed cocksucker ... just sayin.


This saddens me to no end. I don't even know if it's meant as some kind of sick joke. If it is, then I pity you for your tactless, coarse humour. If it is not, then I do not pity you at all, but again am sad that such people can exist and call themselves human beings.


----------



## Farseer Darvaleth

So it seems all my efforts were for nothing. Not only this I was proved indisputably right in that I felt "hate" couldn't be contained to one thread. It has spread to an entire new one within one day!



> If there's even the slightest chance that all the retardation could be kept in a single ignorable thread then I say we take that risk.


Myself on the matter:


> If I believed that this thread could serve as a scapegoat for all things "hateful" concerning Mat Ward, then I would let deluded pessimists come here and slander the poor man away until the cows come home. I do not believe, however, that such a scapegoat can be successful, what with "hating" Mat Ward seemingly "in fashion" for wargamers these days. As you say, "People are going to be doing it regardless."


This is exactly why I pushed for a rules amendment and locking of "hate" threads.


----------



## LukeValantine

Someone needs to build a hate containment dome to protect the forums from imploding from the hate emissions its giving off..


----------



## Durant

I think we may just spawn Slaanesh's EVIL little brother from all this hate :laugh:


----------



## maddermax

Farseer Darvaleth said:


> So it seems all my efforts were for nothing. Not only this I was proved indisputably right in that I felt "hate" couldn't be contained to one thread. It has spread to an entire new one within one day!
> 
> Myself on the matter:
> 
> This is exactly why I pushed for a rules amendment and locking of "hate" threads.


Nah, it's not nearly as serious as you make it sound, mostly it's just people having a bit of fun. At any rate, it's better to have somewhere where people can vent about it rather than have all that nerd rage pent up inside, spilling into random threads k: 

Take it with a laugh, because most are posting here tongue in cheek, and as long as it doesn't derail other unrelated threads (and these threads have been on topic - the topics being Mat Ward), it'll sort it self out in a short while, as people get bored of making fun of Ward. At least until the Newcrons codex arrives that is


----------



## maddermax




----------



## the-ad-man

i dont understand why people get so butthurt about the stuff ward does? ok he goofs every now and again, but who doesnt?

i agree with someone earlier in the thread, get the man a damn editor!! haha

it isnt ward that makes older codicies redundant, but gws release cycle, its far too slow, having a complete cycle of a decade is far too long! however i do understand WHY it takes so long, it cannot be helped.

to those that bitch and whine at the ba/'cron love up: if you dont like it, DONT READ IT!! haha its pretty simple XD
its the same as looking thru the coloured pages of a codex, finding a colour scheme you dont like and telling a forum 'rabble rabble!! they ruined my army with this rubbish colour schem!! why would you ever wear that?! boohoo!!' XD


----------



## fynn

what makes me laugh though, is the hate ward gets for changeing fluff, but then GW have been doing that for years (since 2nd ed), even before ward was doing codex writing
but then a geek'sgota rage about something


----------



## Katie Drake

The thing with hate (not just Ward hate, but bitching and moaning in general) is that it tends to lower the quality of the site as a whole as it becomes more and more difficult to find useful tidbits of information. This is a large part of why Warseer and to a similar extent Dakka and BOLS are often thought of as cesspits of the 40k community.

It also tends to influence newer members of the community or even hobby into thinking things that are common knowledge on the internet but uh... blatantly wrong in reality which can't be a good thing.


----------



## elmir

Matt Ward is by far the best codex writer for one simple reason:

He can really piss off hardcore nerds!


----------



## Haskanael

elmir said:


> Matt Ward is by far the best codex writer for one simple reason:
> 
> He can really piss off hardcore nerds!


GW gave the hardcore nerds that rage a lot on the current GW stuff.. a nickname. they call them beards


----------



## eyescrossed

the-ad-man said:


> i dont understand why people get so butthurt about the stuff ward does? ok he goofs every now and again, but who doesnt?


Excuse me, I nearly died laughing. A few? More like at least three every book he writes.

I'm also surprised nobody has mentioned Kaldor Draigo, the Grey Knight who even the Chaos Gods can't touch (OP, if you're reading this, I'm not even exaggerating).




> to those that bitch and whine at the ba/'cron love up: if you dont like it, DONT READ IT!! haha its pretty simple XD
> its the same as looking thru the coloured pages of a codex, finding a colour scheme you dont like and telling a forum 'rabble rabble!! they ruined my army with this rubbish colour schem!! why would you ever wear that?! boohoo!!' XD


It's not that simple, though. Established background is there to stay unless it gets retconned in a later codex (which takes a minimum of 3-4 years) and is part of the fluff through and through. That's like saying "Oh just ignore that the Night Lords are a Traitor Legion if you don't like it XD".

Although your example doesn't actually matter, given the change to Necron fluff.


----------



## James Tiberius

eyescrossed said:


> Excuse me, I nearly died laughing. A few? More like at least three every book he writes.
> 
> I'm also surprised nobody has mentioned Kaldor Draigo, the Grey Knight who even the Chaos Gods can't touch (OP, if you're reading this, I'm not even exaggerating).


your forgetting the whole "slaughtering sisters of battle" bullshit as well, to say thats a little OTT would be a major understatement

and the great new necron fluff, which from what I get from the GW site is basically them going around the galaxy making friends with everybody and inviting them to there battles to chill with them for a while.

what happened to the "WE HATE FLESH, KILL THE FLESH THINGS, WIPE OUT ALL EXISTING LIFE FROM THE GALAXY!!!!!"


----------



## the-ad-man

eyescrossed said:


> Excuse me, I nearly died laughing. A few? More like at least three every book he writes.
> 
> I'm also surprised nobody has mentioned Kaldor Draigo, the Grey Knight who even the Chaos Gods can't touch (OP, if you're reading this, I'm not even exaggerating).
> 
> 
> 
> It's not that simple, though. Established background is there to stay unless it gets retconned in a later codex (which takes a minimum of 3-4 years) and is part of the fluff through and through. That's like saying "Oh just ignore that the Night Lords are a Traitor Legion if you don't like it XD".
> 
> Although your example doesn't actually matter, given the change to Necron fluff.


his fuck ups are never as big as 'an entire legion' is things like 'this one guy(draigo)' or 'this one time for 5 minutes...'(ba/necron love up)


the change to the necrons is so much better than their old fluff that boiled down to 'metallic tyranids', instead of gathering biomass, they are gathering souls... 
did someone say souls!?









now they are a fully fleshed out race(see what i did there?) that have alot of character.


[edit] so what if they are seemignly 'tomb kings in space'?(before someone says) tomb kings are awesome, after all 40k has; eldar, dark eldar, orcs and goblins, warriors of chaos, deamons and probably even more at a streach 'in space'. whats wrong with bringing anoter race into the 41st millenium, personaly i'd welcome skaven, or lizardmen into 40k.


----------



## Serpion5

Katie Drake said:


> The thing with hate (not just Ward hate, but bitching and moaning in general) is that it tends to lower the quality of the site as a whole as it becomes more and more difficult to find useful tidbits of information. This is a large part of why Warseer and to a similar extent Dakka and BOLS are often thought of as cesspits of the 40k community.
> 
> It also tends to influence newer members of the community or even hobby into thinking things that are common knowledge on the internet but uh... blatantly wrong in reality which can't be a good thing.


This. 

And my addition to the thread: 

Get over it. :wasntme:


----------



## jaysen

Squats! I vote that Matt Ward writes a Dwarves in space codex. It'd be awesome. They could be the we hate all races that are over 4' tall, except when they bring lots of ale to the battle, then we're cool.


----------



## Durandal

Katie Drake said:


> The thing with hate (not just Ward hate, but bitching and moaning in general) is that it tends to lower the quality of the site as a whole as it becomes more and more difficult to find useful tidbits of information. This is a large part of why Warseer and to a similar extent Dakka and BOLS are often thought of as cesspits of the 40k community.
> 
> It also tends to influence newer members of the community or even hobby into thinking things that are common knowledge on the internet but uh... blatantly wrong in reality which can't be a good thing.


you forgot heresy and 40k online


----------



## Serpion5

Don`t BT already have the holy Orb of Antioch?


----------



## Machiavellismx

Katie Drake said:


> The thing with hate (not just Ward hate, but bitching and moaning in general) is that it tends to lower the quality of the site as a whole as it becomes more and more difficult to find useful tidbits of information. This is a large part of why Warseer and to a similar extent Dakka and BOLS are often thought of as cesspits of the 40k community.
> 
> It also tends to influence newer members of the community or even hobby into thinking things that are common knowledge on the internet but uh... blatantly wrong in reality which can't be a good thing.


Well said.

I'm actually a bit disgusted to find this thread on here. Before joining Heresy I looked around at the other forums (Dakka, Warseer, Bolter etc) and thought that they seemed to have a lot of die-hard fanboys and close minded people who preferred to moan about anything and everything rather than actually enjoying the game.

I've refrained from posting on this thread until now but it's gone on and on, this whole Matt Ward thing is a total joke, not in the good kind, and pathetic. Before Heresy I never even knew that each codex had different writers, I just believed it was all the same team, and I think I was better off in that ignorance and the rest of the moaners would be to. When something like the codex's has a face or figure like Matt Ward behind them, people will blame him no matter what, and won't let a stupid thing like reason get in their way.

Best example is the BA's. I've heard many times "he used the word Blood for equipment wayyy to much!" Yet other people comeback with "He used it on four items. Four" get over it.

As to his codex's are overpowered? First, they're re-doing them all one by one, making them all stronger. Sucks if your army like Tau is behind, but give it time, and view it as a chance to make yourself play better against stronger opponents. Secondly, the good rules vs. bad fluff idea, well the codex's are designed to BE rulebooks with SOME fluff to support each units background, characters etc, for the real pure fluff read the novels and short stories. No one is forcing you to sit down and ONLY use the codex fluff, I can't believe how people get so hung up on codex fluff. 

Thirdly, and finally, in all my experience of gaming from tabletops to consoles, when someone claims something is "over-powered" what they _really _mean is "use something else, so I can beat you" . The amount of crap I've had on Gears of War for - literally - every weapon is untrue. "The chainsaws so noobish...Shotguns are for wankers, use the lancer ... omg stop using the lancer everyone uses shotguns ... boomshots, really? ... retro lancer is such a joke your crap" go figure. This mentallity applies to the tabletop to. YES some things are stronger than others, but its swings and roundabouts, and it will all, mostly, balance out. Learn to counter-act something if it is powerful rather than moaning and throwing your toys out of the pram because you can't 'beat' it. There's also a strong element of luck in this game don't forget.

Back to the original point, I love 40K, I like the idea we have strong rules and codex's and they're all being updated, codex fluff doesn't bother me as no one forces me to swallow it daily (except on here ironically, with the Necon-BA alliance, I've heard that brought up far to much). This is my first real rant post on Heresy, and it's because I'm surprised that such a chilled forum and good community would let such a thread exist or be blinded by such matt ward hate that there is THREE topics in this section alone with his name in them. Yeah ones a joke, maybe make this a sticky to keep the retardness of the whole Matt Ward hate in one place, but mostly...just get over it.


----------



## Serpion5

Agreed. Stop being angry bunnies people.


----------



## bitsandkits

Katie Drake said:


> The thing with hate (not just Ward hate, but bitching and moaning in general) is that it tends to lower the quality of the site as a whole as it becomes more and more difficult to find useful tidbits of information. This is a large part of why Warseer and to a similar extent Dakka and BOLS are often thought of as cesspits of the 40k community.
> 
> It also tends to influence newer members of the community or even hobby into thinking things that are common knowledge on the internet but uh... blatantly wrong in reality which can't be a good thing.


Katie makes an excellent point, one of the "selling" points of heresy (if one was needed) is that generally the people here play nice, currently the top three threads in general 40k (the second most popular section of the site) are matt ward hate threads, which though 40k related by the skin of the teeth really dont need to be in this section or posted at all.


----------



## Ravner298

1. There are enough bronies on heresy now to make me uncomfortable

2. Tyranids aren't all that weak. I despise the Doom.

3. I don't think anyone actually 'hates' that who shall not be named (except maybe that guy above who thinks his beards purpose is to act as a 'cock bumper'). It's a lose term to use over the internet that simplifies it. Expressing discontent with someone =/= hatred.

4. I don't think anyone would complain about armies being brought up to speed and getting buffed if GW pumped out more than a few codexes a year. (yes, necrons, tau, dark eldar and sisters I know). Hell even a FAQ/chapter approved every now and again would be nice.

5. Let the hatred fuel you to beat these shiny new OTT codexes with your 4th edition mono build crap pile, so when you finally do get your new book, you'll know what it feels like to be a Grey Knight.

6. Heresy is (for the most part) an intelligent and mature community. If you want to spew your pile of stupid, warseer is that way ------>


----------



## maddermax

bitsandkits said:


> Katie makes an excellent point, one of the "selling" points of heresy (if one was needed) is that generally the people here play nice, currently the top three threads in general 40k (the second most popular section of the site) are matt ward hate threads, which though 40k related by the skin of the teeth really dont need to be in this section or posted at all.


Three threads is definitely excessive. 

I'm still of the mind that it's better to let people get it out of their systems, rather than bring it to other threads, so maybe a single GW rant thread, and then let the mods roll all other rant threads into it as they occur, containing the griping to a single thread. Sort of like the Venting/Griping thread in Off Topic, but specifically for GW related stuff. Call it the Bitch-and-MoanHammer thread or something.


----------



## Zion

Serpion5 said:


> Don`t BT already have the holy Orb of Antioch?


Yes they do. 40K needs more fun equipment like that.


----------



## Vaz

midnightkid333 said:


> I always thought ward was hated mostly for making overpowered codices. I'm just glad Cruddace wrote the Tyranid codex. The fluff is beautiful and makes alot of sense. Cruddace should write more codices in my opinion. If not, the fluff for other codices


Because "yo, Ima evolve and make your ammunition utterly useless" is excellent fluff. 

And I respectfully disagree with Necrons becoming "Fleshed out" and getting more character - the more character they have, the less characterful they are. They are now little more than Skeletons in Space attempting to do something that every one else does.

The fluff could have been expanded, not changed.

I mean look at the stuff about the Celestial Orrery - basically, it contains a small light thing for every star in the galaxy - snuffing out that light will destroy the star in question just because. Then there are mercenary necrons.


----------



## Khorne's Fist

People need to remember that just because it says on the inside of a codex "By Matt Ward" doesn't mean he wrote every rule or piece of fluff in the book. Go to the contents page of every codex, and at the bottom is a list of all the people who worked on it. They are all pretty much the same in every codex.

Whoever the name is on the book, be it Kelly, Ward or Cruddace, all it means is that they were supervising the overall project, as any project like these needs a top man. That individual did not play test every rule in the book on their own in a locked room; they were tested, refined, adjusted and tweeked over months of gaming by probably dozens of people. Some of those involved have been with GW from the very start, and would have had a huge input into what goes into a book and what doesn't. I have the DE and SW codecies in front of me, and some of the names involved include Phil Kelly, Jervis Johnson, Andy Hoare, Jeremy Vetock, Allesio Cavatore, Cruddace and Ward. The same names appear in pretty much all the recent books. 

Whether it's rules or fluff that people have a problem with, the end product has to be passed at the very highest level of GW, meaning they are obviously happy with it. Anybody willing to stick all the blame on one individual is being extremely selective, and, to be frank, extemely fucking stupid.


----------



## C'Tan Chimera

Aw hell, why not?


_Necrons_- *Combustible Lemons*
When it comes to science, Necrons are above all others. As such, they have the technology to accomplish anything imaginable. Such was the case when the C'Tan enslaved the Necrons in their great deception. Most said 'Oh well, when life gives you lemons, make lemonade' . 

But a couple stood above and said 'No, when life gives you lemons, make life take the lemons back! Get mad! I don't want your damn lemons! What the hell am I supposed to do with these?! Demand to see life's manager! Make life rue the day it gave the Necrontyr lemons! Do you know who we are?! We're the Necrons who are gonna burn your C'tan down! With the lemons! I'm gonna get my crypteks to make a combustible lemon that burns your C'tan down!"







And they did. All Necrons get combustible lemons. If any unit desires to assault the Necrons, the unit gets hit with a large S8 AP3 blast template.


----------



## Durant

Mat Ward = Jar Jar Binks of the W40k World.

People need to put a name to their misdirected anger and Mat is it!


----------



## Vaz

@Khorne's Fist - if he's in charge of the project, it's down to him to take responsibility for those who turn in shit in his name. To give it his agreement for publishing is worse than actually writing it.

I'm wondering if it's some scribblings done by an executives child brought in for "bring your kid to work" and they've lent on the design team to include them. Because they're as childish and pitiful as a 5 year old.

When I look at the Peter Jackson movies and compare the LotR to the Books, there's some differences, but done for ease of translation into a 9 hour set of films, and there's an attempt at least to keep the lore accurate for the most part.

The writers these days are basically coming in and changing what has worked for two editions at the least and then changing the entire status quo for what has worked, and worked well for at least 10 years - in a game with a background that is essentially clearly delineated for that same period, it's pitiful.


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## Commissar Ploss

I've combined the three threads here in Gen 40k about "Matt Ward" into one single thread. I swear, if i see another useless, retarded, pointless, dumb, asinine thread about how much Matt Ward sucks at this, or how Matt Ward blows these, or how Matt Ward fucks these various farm animals, so help me god, i'll delete it and infract the offending party. Get over it, move on, and reserve your judgment until the next codex comes out. 

we're done here.

Commissar Ploss


----------



## Zion

Vaz said:


> @Khorne's Fist - if he's in charge of the project, it's down to him to take responsibility for those who turn in shit in his name. To give it his agreement for publishing is worse than actually writing it.
> 
> I'm wondering if it's some scribblings done by an executives child brought in for "bring your kid to work" and they've lent on the design team to include them. Because they're as childish and pitiful as a 5 year old.
> 
> When I look at the Peter Jackson movies and compare the LotR to the Books, there's some differences, but done for ease of translation into a 9 hour set of films, and there's an attempt at least to keep the lore accurate for the most part.
> 
> The writers these days are basically coming in and changing what has worked for two editions at the least and then changing the entire status quo for what has worked, and worked well for at least 10 years - in a game with a background that is essentially clearly delineated for that same period, it's pitiful.


I wouldn't put the lead designer soley at fault for the problems we have with the codices though, it's been established in the past that exectutive meddeling does happen and the designers are often pushed to accomplish paticular goals or design benchmarks in their books (Gav Thrope has mentioned it in retrospect to his work on the Chaos Marine codex back in 4th).

As for people who keep bringing up the rumor that GW is going to fire Ward lets consider how many of "his" armies we see on the tables and how much money GW is making off them. You don't fire a money maker, even if they aren't considered popular by a very vocal minority in the community. IN FACT, I wouldn't be surprised that all the complaints of his books being overpowered is what drives new players to pick up his stuff, generating MORE sales and encouraging GW to continue this trend.

So basically: the more people complain, the more money they make, and the more "OP" the new books are.


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## lokis222

Crap.

The make your own rules is combined with the bitching again. Failure.


----------



## Vaz

The rules he has designed are hardly grand successes.

Space Marines and Blood Angels are staples of the game - they would be bought anyway.

Grey Knights and Necrons are niche armies that are brought up to most current edition after a hiatus of support for around 10 years.

8th Edition Warhammer Fantasy is the core game rule. His only real success can be counted in the number of 40K players giving it a try after its dumbed down over simplified rules and OTT rules favouring massively random results. Aside from that, it's among the people who regularly played Fantasy I personally know, it's almost universally hated for its reliance on dice rolls rather than actually having a learning curve.

7th Edition Daemons - yeah. Just look at the amount of abuse they recieved from people on the recieving end of them, and the overuse of them. In addition, with the removal of them from the Hordes of Chaos, and their inclusion in the Storm of Chaos lent them a popular air among the community.

Storm of Magic - the first real expansion of the Warhammer Fantasy game since Generals Compendium aside from the Campaign books as well as the possibility of expanded army lists lent it to be well selling first of all, but since its release weeks, it has never been played among people I know.

None of those are particularly innovative money spinning ideas that only generate money through gaining an ever more popular crowd - ranging from the ever expanding computer game branch to the increase of recognition, however well deserved, of the Black Library books.

As for the "wildly OP" - its a self reciprocating rumour on forums. Those who regularly read the forums will see the "wildly OP" stuff become soon after release as they play people who take it, or read the rules to find out what makes them so "OP" - look at the Dreadknight - it's ability to 1st Turn assault and high toughness mean many people were whingeing about it - yes, it renders Daemons useless bar none really, but many units are useless anyway against other targets. 

There's no correlation between sales and Mat Ward, or rather, there's no correlation between Mat Ward's codex designing and sales, aside from the one notable occasion I can think of - the Blood Angels Assault Marines, conciously leaving the possibility for them to be taken as Troops out from SM for no reason other than to actually make Blood Angels simply differently named and painted SM.

His flaws are in his judgement and decision making, if it's not him who writes the background in his books.

It seems like only yesterday that people were ranting about how bad Draigo's fluff was, the Necron and Tyranid alliance, almost boardwide, and now everyone's his best buddy, because it's more bandwagon to join everyone else in jumping off the bandwagon. Ironic and depressing.


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## maddermax

lokis222 said:


> Crap.
> 
> The make your own rules is combined with the bitching again. Failure.


It's as bad as if Mat Ward wrote this thread 

Seriously though, you do seem to be having some bad luck on the rules thread front, every time you get it going a little bit, it gets kicked back down. Perhaps wait a few days, and make a similar thread, without mentioning the words "Mat" or "Ward", and you'll be right


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## Commissar Ploss

i'll be watching.


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## effigy22

Commissar Ploss said:


> i'll be watching.


All the time? Even while im in the shower? If no need to watch, come join me :grin:


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## lokis222

maddermax said:


> It's as bad as if Mat Ward wrote this thread
> 
> Seriously though, you do seem to be having some bad luck on the rules thread front, every time you get it going a little bit, it gets kicked back down. Perhaps wait a few days, and make a similar thread, without mentioning the words "Mat" or "Ward", and you'll be right


I think it almost ran its course anyway. There were some pretty funny and quite inventive suggestions by people. 

Kudos to the guy who started it though.


----------



## gen.ahab

The Sullen One said:


> Well the new Necrons are almost here and Matt Ward has invented yet another crazy rule as well as having committed the almost unforgivable sin (and I say this because he isn't alone in reinventing the Necrons) of making souless robots designed to kill into a fascimile of what happens when Data's emotion chip goes bad while he's playing Sherlock Holmes and the case of the ancient Egyptian Terminator. Yes our souless Necrons now have feelings:suicide::suicide:


Its Matt Ward...... What the hell did you think was going to happen?:laugh: The man is the Michael Bay of Codex writing. 

Expecting good writing from Matt Ward is like sticking your dick in a blood covered blender, pushing the button that says "happy ending," and expecting the best BJ of your life. 

God speed, gentlemen.


----------



## ThoseKrazyKasrkin

Farseer Darvaleth said:


> So it seems all my efforts were for nothing. Not only this I was proved indisputably right in that I felt "hate" couldn't be contained to one thread. It has spread to an entire new one within one day!
> 
> 
> 
> Myself on the matter:
> 
> This is exactly why I pushed for a rules amendment and locking of "hate" threads.


So does it also sadden you that words change and evolve? That for some people words mean less than to others? Gay for example. People at my work say all sorts of rude hatefull words as a matter of course and no one cares. Altgough id never ever say it, it doesnt matter to me because you must take it in context and i know tjey dont mean it in the true sense.

But then, you knew that of course, oh whise philosopher.

I know no one truly hates him in the sense you mentioned at the start and you do too. So get over it.

If it bothers you so much, go out and change the world, spread the joy and make a difference.


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## Stephen_Newman

gen.ahab said:


> Its Matt Ward...... What the hell did you think was going to happen?:laugh: The man is the Michael Bay of Codex writing.
> 
> Expecting good writing from Matt Ward is like sticking your dick in a blood covered blender, pushing the button that says "happy ending," and expecting the best BJ of your life.
> 
> God speed, gentlemen.


There might be poorly written fluff but Matt Ward's work does not have enough EXPLOSIONS!!!!! and SPECIAL EFFECTS!!!! to warrant comparison to Michael Bay. Admittidly Michael Bay would be one of the few I reckon could make a 40K movie. That does have plenty of explosions.

As for my Matt Ward dislike.

Yeah I would be lying if I said that I have no questions about any of Mat Ward's work. I admit I find that his fluff is silly and he does lack the knowledge in a fluff story sometimes to know "when enough is enough". I find that characters overstay their welcome or become so blown out of proportion that they lose all semblance to the original.

Take Draigo for instance. For all intents and puropses he is now a daemon samned to forever wander in the warp (cool) all because he held utmost devotion to the Emperor and did all he was tasked to do (cool). However he was cursed after singlehandedly defeating an entire daemon incursion singlehandedly (retarded. If you are going to make him that powerful then at least give him rules to match) where he goes to the warp and like any other Grey Knight starts destroying stuff (some parts cool) including destroying vast parts of the Chaos realm and even carving his predecessor's name into the heart of Mortarion (retarded) even daemons have become afraid of him (retarded. This does not even make sense. Daemons are the manifestations of the Chaos Gods themselves. This means they share parts of what their God is feeling at the time and obey commands. In other words they are slaves to the Chaos Gods. So for them to be afraid of Draigo that they refuse to fight him means that they fear Draigo more than the Chaos Gods? No sense or it could even imply that the Chaos Gods themselves are afraid of Draigo which is even more fucked up.). However everything he does is repaired and in vain (cool).

So you can see some parts of even the worst of Ward fluff has positives. If he had stuck to the idea of a Grey Knight who could destroy large parts of the Warp but only for it to repair itself making his efforts invalid would be grimdark and cool (effectively based off that Greek legend with a similar story).

As for his rules I find that they are solid and mostly well written. Yes I know that some people might jump on me for making Orcs and Goblins (7th ed) underpowered whilst making Daemons super powered but bear in mind he is only human and also that we all make mistakes.

As for the article where he claimed Daemons should be the best lets be honest about it. It's probably not what he is thinking or what he even believes but is instead saving face for some reason. Not too long ago I aw a bus that was just leaving its stop and I ran to catch it, chasing it half way down the road before the driveer stopped. However I realised that this was the wrong numbered bus. Now when I boarded did I tell the driver the bus was the wrong service and make the run I just made pointless whilst pissing off th other passengers? Hell no! I went on that bus to save face and I believe it is similar to what Matt Ward did to daemons.

As I said most of his rules are sensible and just require you to actually have some tactical sense to beat rather than just going for some moronic pointless practice such as "shoot the closest one!". As I can agree not every rule is perfect but this is hardly the fault of Matt Ward.

Take the Dreadknight came out for instance. When one could fins it could take a teleporter and become jump infantry there were arguments about whether is changed classes and therefore could do different things. Gamers lack a surprising amount of common sense at the best of times. I know for a fact that when the Dreadknight came out the issues with it being jump infantry led people to ask stupid questions such as whether it could now fit in a Stormraven and whether is could claim cover saves easier which my little 8 year old brother could tell you the answer but because some heavy tournament players (waac's) tried to bend the rules because they need every single word spelt out for them.

I therefore believe that gamers themselves are just as responsible for making Matt Ward codexes "overpowered" at tournaments as he is himself. Whilst one could argue he could close up some loopholes better rather than write an FAQ several months later one could argue that gamers should use common sense more in queries rather than trying to bend the rules to their advantage.

End of my part. Make of it what you will.


----------



## Minizke1

I'm gonna say what I always say.....If you've got beef for the game or the people behind it, stop playing, and spare us the whining. You sound like one of the 11-year-olds at my FLGS that gets brought to tears when his beloved dreadnought dies. I'm pretty sure we stopped making hate pages after grade 7.

Edit: Grey knights have never been impossible to beat, and never will be, and the same will go for Necrons. Also, Stephen_Newman deserves, if not rep, at least some recognition for his input.


----------



## Weapon

Say what you want about his bad fluff, but he makes the rules more interesting and has proven before that he can cultivate a pretty sweet beard.


----------



## jaysen

You mean this "sweet" beard? Are you crazy.


----------



## Weapon

Hells to the yeah mofo.

I'll admit that the sideburns are too much, but he's got a good stache to chin ratio.


----------



## SilverTabby

Complain all you like about his work and your opinions about it. 

Direct actual vitriol against Matt himself and I start taking issue. Matt's a lovely bloke who I've known for years. Lets keep any hate pointed where it should be - at the work, not the writer.


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## gen.ahab

Stephen_Newman said:


> There might be poorly written fluff but Matt Ward's work does not have enough EXPLOSIONS!!!!! and SPECIAL EFFECTS!!!! to warrant comparison to Michael Bay. Admittidly Michael Bay would be one of the few I reckon could make a 40K movie. That does have plenty of explosions.


Really? He produces poorly written material which is designed specifically to sell well. Nope, I'm happy with that comparison.


----------



## Samules

Minizke1 said:


> I'm gonna say what I always say.....If you've got beef for the game or the people behind it, stop playing, and spare us the whining. You sound like one of the 11-year-olds at my FLGS that gets brought to tears when his beloved dreadnought dies. I'm pretty sure we stopped making hate pages after grade 7.



That is precisely why this thread is here. It is a funnel for Wardhate into one ignorable thread! Because of this you will hopefully never have that feeling of stepping on a lego in the night as you discover an otherwise decent thread corrupted by haters!


----------



## lokis222

SilverTabby said:


> Lets keep any hate pointed where it should be - at the work, not the writer.


Second that. We might not like the work, but we don't know the person.


----------



## Wusword77

I just wish people could explain why Cruddace gets a free pass on his shit work for the current edition but Ward does not.


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## Katie Drake

Wusword77 said:


> I just wish people could explain why Cruddace gets a free pass on his shit work for the current edition but Ward does not.


Because it's more fun to not think and just blindly join in on what everyone else is doing even if it's retarded.


----------



## notsoevil

Who the hell is Matt Ward?

God I love being new to the game. No hate built up.


----------



## Farseer Darvaleth

Commissar Ploss said:


> I've combined the three threads here in Gen 40k about "Matt Ward" into one single thread. I swear, if i see another useless, retarded, pointless, dumb, asinine thread about how much Matt Ward sucks at this, or how Matt Ward blows these, or how Matt Ward fucks these various farm animals, so help me god, i'll delete it and infract the offending party. Get over it, move on, and reserve your judgment until the next codex comes out.


Thank goodness.



ThoseKrazyKasrkin said:


> So does it also sadden you that words change and evolve? That for some people words mean less than to others? Gay for example. People at my work say all sorts of rude hatefull words as a matter of course and no one cares. Altgough id never ever say it, it doesnt matter to me because you must take it in context and i know tjey dont mean it in the true sense.
> 
> But then, you knew that of course, oh whise philosopher.
> 
> I know no one truly hates him in the sense you mentioned at the start and you do too. So get over it.
> 
> If it bothers you so much, go out and change the world, spread the joy and make a difference.


Of course, I understand that what people can say is often meant in jest. I would be a fool to think that everything is absolute, that there is only good and evil and no grey area. I'm not suggesting that. I am suggesting this:

1) Across the internet, we can't understand that something is meant in jest. Emoticons can help this in a little way, but when they're not included we have no idea how the things you write are supposed to be read/said, or which parts carry emphasis, or anything which makes human interaction so superior to modern technology. Whilst this may not be a problem for you, it affects other people. As somebody mentioned earlier, hate threads and hate in general sully forums, and Warseer has become, as they put it, a "cesspit" for the 40k gamer. Not only this, but other people will come on, see these blocks of text insulting and "hating" Ward which could be meant as a joke, but interpret them as sincere. This is not something we want to be happening on Heresy, I think you'll agree.

2) Whilst many people are claiming what they say is "tongue in cheek", which is a tad unsavoury considering how harsh some of the insults are, there are people who seem to truly "hate" the poor man. It is posts detailing how particular members would like to see him harmed that set me at unease. Posts describing how they'd like to kill him. Such posts are unacceptable. "Thou shalt not kill". And don't even start saying "I'm not religious", 'cause it doesn't matter for shit. Killing is wrong, end of fucking story. Joking about killing is filthy and unfit for public viewing. And the fact that some of these disgusting posts are so maliciously crafted, so meticulously planned out and executed to cause, it seems, the most distress possible in the reader, is simply outrageous. Such posts should be deleted, not collaborated together.



Whilst it is good to see that we have thinned down the number of these blasted "hate" threads, I am still not satisfied. The mere existence of such a thread will only incite further "hatred".


----------



## Durandal

I just wanted to share that, I got a read through the new necron codex, and everything about it kicks ass.


----------



## Katie Drake

Durandal said:


> I just wanted to share that, I got a read through the new necron codex, and everything about it kicks ass.


Pretty much this.

I do have a couple of issues with the new fluff (just small things) but the difference is that I'm mature enough to not lose my fucking mind over it and curse someone's name who I've never met and haven't the first clue about.

Funny how that works.


----------



## Azkaellon

Its Matt Ward......I think every person who plays 40k (besides ultramarine players...) Hates him pretty much!


----------



## Necrosis

Azkaellon said:


> Its Matt Ward......I think every person who plays 40k (besides ultramarine players...) Hates him pretty much!


You sir would be wrong, Matt Ward at least writes rules that are fun to play. Cruddace on the other hand writes crappy rules that aren't fun to play. Fluff be damned.


----------



## lokis222

Necrosis said:


> You sir would be wrong, Matt Ward at least writes rules that are fun to play. Cruddace on the other hand writes crappy rules that aren't fun to play. Fluff be damned.


I really like the new nids codex... other than the faq and an elite slot issue. 

Anti-tank for the win.


----------



## Dave T Hobbit

Azkaellon said:


> Its Matt Ward......I think every person who plays 40k (besides ultramarine players...) Hates him pretty much!


No player of any GW game I have met in person has ever expressed even mild annoyance at him.


----------



## Serpion5

Dave T Hobbit said:


> No player of any GW game I have met in person has ever expressed even mild annoyance at him.


It`s an internet fad started by whiny cunts and perpetuated by even whinier cunts. It happened with Goto, it`s happening with Ward and it will happen with someone else soon enough.


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## Achaylus72

Today was a great day, went into a local GW store in Sydney for a bits trading day.

Not only did i pick up some great stuff but the new Necron stuff was on sale, and i looked at the new codex, one of the best codexes i have had the honour to read, i want to personally thank Matt Ward for an Excellent Codex.

Not only that but there were at least 10 Necron players in the store and they had orgasms over the new Codex, not one Necron player could find fault with any part of the Codex.

We all agreed that those who hate Matt Ward are genetic defective fucktards with no lives of their own, and.....

Could never write a Codex to save their miserable sad pathetic lives.


----------



## maddermax

*Achaylus72:* While I can understand the backlash from people who like Wards work, I would say that what you have said goes too far, and I think you need to reconsider what you are saying about other heresy members here. That's far more hate than I've seen from any of the "Haters" in this thread, and directed at people, rather than at a body of work that others dislike. 

*For Everyone: *If you go through the thread, most of the comments of the "haters" have been stating legitimate gripes with or opinions on Wards body of work (not blind hatred), or been having tongue in cheek fun about it. 95% of the comments have been quite benign, and very few posters have actually had enough vitrol to be worth the label "hater" - a distinct minority. Some of the comments from the other side have been, at least to my reading, even more rage-y and far more detrimental to the thread than many on the side that dislikes ward (I'll give you one or two that that have too much pent up frustration). Seriously - go read it from the start, the complaints about raging anti-ward hatred started before there even were any raging anti-ward comments.

So look, some of you might dislike Ward, and some of you might dislike people disliking Ward, but that's life. Let people have a bit of a bitch and moan about this or that new change, there's a reason the Pointless Griping thread became one of Heresy's most popular - because people like to let it out occasionally! But as long as it's contained to an appropriate thread and not wrecking other threads, let it be, and people will have their say, and get over it. If you can't leave it alone, then at least keep your comments constructive, saying about why you LIKE wards work, rather than turning on those who are (for the most part) just sharing their legitimate opinion.


TL/DR: Just be cool to one another, let people have a bitch and moan to let out their opinion, as long as they're not personally attacking anyone (bodies of work are fair game), if you must reply be positive and thoughtful.


----------



## Digg40k

maddermax said:


> *Achaylus72:* While I can understand the backlash from people who like Wards work, I would say that what you have said goes too far, and I think you need to reconsider what you are saying about other heresy members here. That's far more hate than I've seen from any of the "Haters" in this thread, and directed at people, rather than at a body of work that others dislike.
> 
> *For Everyone: *If you go through the thread, most of the comments of the "haters" have been stating legitimate gripes with or opinions on Wards body of work (not blind hatred), or been having tongue in cheek fun about it. 95% of the comments have been quite benign, and very few posters have actually had enough vitrol to be worth the label "hater" - a distinct minority. Some of the comments from the other side have been, at least to my reading, even more rage-y and far more detrimental to the thread than many on the side that dislikes ward (I'll give you one or two that that have too much pent up frustration). Seriously - go read it from the start, the complaints about raging anti-ward hatred started before there even were any raging anti-ward comments.
> 
> So look, some of you might dislike Ward, and some of you might dislike people disliking Ward, but that's life. Let people have a bit of a bitch and moan about this or that new change, there's a reason the Pointless Griping thread became one of Heresy's most popular - because people like to let it out occasionally! But as long as it's contained to an appropriate thread and not wrecking other threads, let it be, and people will have their say, and get over it. If you can't leave it alone, then at least keep your comments constructive, saying about why you LIKE wards work, rather than turning on those who are (for the most part) just sharing their legitimate opinion.
> 
> 
> TL/DR: Just be cool to one another, let people have a bitch and moan to let out their opinion, as long as they're not personally attacking anyone (bodies of work are fair game), if you must reply be positive and thoughtful.


This is a fair and constructive comment and if only it were in this spirit that the anti-Ward venting took place originally. Unfortunately it didn't, raging anti-Ward antagonists took to thread after thread derailing them and generally making Heresy a bit of an boring place to spend a time browsing.

Which brought us to the creation of this thread so it could be contained. Now with the advent of as you say the anti-anti-Ward camp becoming more rage filled than the anti-Ward camp we have completed a full circle of rather pointless hate filled conjecture. It's worth mentioning that outside of the internet I'm yet to meet anyone who has a bad thing to say about Matt Ward or his work and generally it's not even on the radar until I mention. So on that note, congratulations internet.

Heres to hoping what Max said makes people realise the ridiculousness of what is going on. :drinks:


----------



## Vaz

Wusword77 said:


> I just wish people could explain why Cruddace gets a free pass on his shit work for the current edition but Ward does not.


Not by me.

Achaylus - your comment reeks or idiocy. Necron players not finding fault with having the first Codex in what, 10 years means it's any good? It's space marines in skeleton armour. Stormshields, and mercenary necrons indeed?


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## Lord Sven Kittyclaw

Vaz said:


> Not by me.
> 
> Achaylus - your comment reeks or idiocy. Necron players not finding fault with having the first Codex in what, 10 years means it's any good? It's space marines in skeleton armour. Stormshields, and mercenary necrons indeed?


100%. Also agrees with Max. These days its the "I don't have a problem with Ward" guys who seem to start all this shit as soon as he is mentioned. But hey, im just a defective fucktard, amirite?


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## maddermax

Sven: That's less my point than we should just try to get on with one another, even if we disagree on a topic. I also think that repeating inflammatory things isn't going to make things any better, it's just adding to the pile. Just leave it be, and hopefully he'll get the message, and edit it out himself when he calms down, or let mods address it as needed. It's probably good advice for everyone actually.


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## gen.ahab

Achaylus72 said:


> blah












Really though, I don't think anyone hates the man as a person. I personally don't, and I am sure he would be a great guy to meet, but I have not been happy with some of his work. 

HOWEVER, I have been reading over my copy of the codex for the past two days and I have to say...... it is pretty good. Given, Ward didn't write the entire codex and there are many others who deserve credit for this, but good job Mr. Ward.


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## the-ad-man

oh look, this is still here ¬.¬

can i start the 'matt ward hate thread hate thread'?


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## Sworn Radical

No, please ... don't.

This thread alone has 25 pages of BS to offer ... and there's more in other threads.

Granted, the guy *has written* some terrible fluff (it's true) and some people debate if some of his _creations_ aren't a little bit overpowered ... of course this latter point entirely depends on one's perspective.

But, that's not a reason to seek him out and burn down his house and car (No, merely taking off his beard would suffice :wink: ) really. 
We should rather do that to _Achaylus72_'s house ... 

Peace.


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## Doelago

Ward aint the one to take all the blame for everything in his Codexes. 

He has written a lot of stuff, some of which all of us dont like, but remember that the whole development team is credited in the Codex, meaning that they are to take as much of the blame as he is if they dont have the balls to stand up and say "No" or something to stuff that seems out of place.


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## Agarwaen

what the hell is wrong with you guys?? Matt Ward does what fans want him to do as far as im concerned.


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## James Tiberius

Agarwaen said:


> what the hell is wrong with you guys?? Matt Ward does what fans want him to do as far as im concerned.


when did the fans ask for shit fluff?, when did the fans ask for the blood angels to ally with necrons?, when did the fans ask for blood angels to spend every other sentence rubbing in how awesome ultramarines are?, when did the fans want blood angels saved by ultramarines?, when did fans want draigo to be more stupid than chuck norris jokes?

with allot more things I really really REALLY want to know when you heard any fans want all this?


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## Wusword77

James Tiberius said:


> when did the fans want blood angels saved by ultramarines?


When did this happen? In what book? I want source for this.


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## Katie Drake

Wusword77 said:


> When did this happen? In what book? I want source for this.


It didn't, it's Stella exaggeration. He does it a lot.


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## James Tiberius

Wusword77 said:


> When did this happen? In what book? I want source for this.


I'm sure one of the little timeline battles has the angels being beaten about like bitches until "the greatest chapter alive" saves there sorry asses, and there all kissing calgars ass while dantes rims him and strokes his dollar sign and gets spat on by his sister of battle hoes


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## Katie Drake

James Tiberius said:


> I'm sure one of the little timeline battles has the angels being beaten about like bitches until "the greatest chapter alive" saves there sorry asses, and there all kissing calgars ass while dantes rims him and strokes his dollar sign and gets spat on by his sister of battle hoes


It doesn't.


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## Samules

Indeed, the only mention of the UM in the timeline are the cleansing of Ultramar when the BA helped save the UM and the battle for armageddon.


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## James Tiberius

Samules said:


> Indeed, the only mention of the UM in the timeline are the cleansing of Ultramar when the BA helped save the UM and the battle for armageddon.


meh, haven't read it since buying it, probably someone else then, but still, shitty fluff = not asked for by fans


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## Achaylus72

Sworn Radical said:


> No, please ... don't.
> 
> This thread alone has 25 pages of BS to offer ... and there's more in other threads.
> 
> Granted, the guy *has written* some terrible fluff (it's true) and some people debate if some of his _creations_ aren't a little bit overpowered ... of course this latter point entirely depends on one's perspective.
> 
> But, that's not a reason to seek him out and burn down his house and car (No, merely taking off his beard would suffice :wink: ) really.
> We should rather do that to _Achaylus72_'s house ...
> 
> Peace.


Yeah sure why not, go ahead burn my apartment down, and make me and three other families homeless while you are at it, what a fucktard. Or at least do it at night just to make sure you burn us to death.


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## Zion

James Tiberius said:


> meh, haven't read it since buying it, probably someone else then, but still, shitty fluff = not asked for by fans


Maybe I'm missing the point, but should you be complaining aput fluff you actually now about? I mean, forgive my rudeness, but complianing about something you're not even sure of weakens your overall arguement and makes you look foolish.


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## Durandal

James Tiberius said:


> meh, haven't read it since buying it, probably someone else then, but still, shitty fluff = not asked for by fans


wwrofl owned.

I hope Matt Ward writes the new eldar codex, the fluff for that beast will be amazing.


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## Farseer Darvaleth

James Tiberius said:


> haven't read it since buying it, *probably* someone else then, but still, shitty fluff = not asked for by fans *-OPINION ALERT*


Forgive my crude method, but do you see what I mean? Your argument is made up of poorly supported assumptions, heavily biased by your own opinion. I have no problem with you having such an opinion, but it cannot and should not be used as the solid basis for an argument, I feel. Because you feel Ward writes "shitty" fluff does not mean that everyone does, but still you make the logic jump that the whole community does not ask for this "shitty" Ward fluff.

Sorry to pick apart what is really only a short post quite so violently. No personal offence is meant, of course.


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## Samules

Achaylus72 said:


> Yeah sure why not, go ahead burn my apartment down, and make me and three other families homeless while you are at it, what a fucktard. Or at least do it at night just to make sure you burn us to death.


You have to learn how to take a joke mate.


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## James Tiberius

Zion said:


> Maybe I'm missing the point, but should you be complaining aput fluff you actually now about? I mean, forgive my rudeness, but complianing about something you're not even sure of weakens your overall arguement and makes you look foolish.


it would if it was all wrong, but thats 1 piece of fluff, hell its not like I'm listing 600 pieces of fluff incorrectly like what people regularly do but don't get a second glance about it.

in fact its allot more foolish that people have spent so much time complaining about me posting 1 bit of ill-remembered fluff instead of complaining about all the piss poor fluff already written by a codex writer who shouldn't be writing stupid fluff, and a company who approves of such pathetic fluff

as I said before, 1 set of rules for some of us, another for the rest of you


Durandal said:


> wwrofl owned.


how am I exactly owned for getting something wrong and not really feeling that bad about it because it was just a mistake?...or do you just like to pretend to be 5yrs old sometimes and go around saying owned like it still actually makes you cool or popular or has some meaning in this modern age?


Durandal said:


> I hope Matt Ward writes the new eldar codex, the fluff for that beast will be amazing.


oh yeah, you'll have eldar allying with necrons and tyranids to fight squat remnants, while inscribing ultrmarine symbols on there faces in honor of the greatest chapter to exist and being such awesome opponents, hell ward would probably have them worshipping daedric gods with a farseer named shepard while on an adventure to destroy a ring of power and fighting against an empire to destroy a giant grey ball in space.


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## Durandal

James Tiberius said:


> oh yeah, you'll have eldar allying with necrons and tyranids to fight squat remnants, while inscribing ultrmarine symbols on there faces in honor of the greatest chapter to exist and being such awesome opponents, hell ward would probably have them worshipping daedric gods with a farseer named shepard while on an adventure to destroy a ring of power and fighting against an empire to destroy a giant grey ball in space.


Sounds a lot better than what they got now.


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## Stephen_Newman

Pretty much true. At the current situation the Eldar are pretty much relegated to being punching bags for a lot of fluff.

Also its quite likely that Ward could be writing Eldar.

Think about it. Eldar are rumoured to be coming around the same time as Tau, Chaos and themselves.

Common rumours indicate that Kelly is writing Tau and that Cruddace is apparently writing Chaos. This means that Ward is the only one left to write Eldar.


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## MrPete

I'm not a fan of Wards fluff at all, but ruleswise he's not *too* bad. Some of the Grey Knight stuff was a bit dodgy in places, but then they *are* supposed to be the elites of the Imperium.

If there was a joint book where Ward did the rules side and someone else did the fluff side I reckon it'd be good, but a lot of the fluff i've read of his seems to end up being Wardhammer 40k, rather than expanding on any previously established background. Case in point being the new 'crons - I can kind of understand veering a bit away from the whole soulless killing machine concept, but then throwing in a bit about how, deep down, every Necron longs to be flesh again? Bit silly if you ask me.


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## Doelago

MrPete said:


> If there was a joint book where Ward did the rules side and someone else did the fluff side I reckon it'd be good


*cough*Codex Sisters of Battle*cough*


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## Durandal

Stephen_Newman said:


> Common rumours indicate that Kelly is writing Tau and that Cruddace is apparently writing Chaos. This means that Ward is the only one left to write Eldar.


No way, Dar have been Kelly's baby since forever, so I would expect him to write them, and Cruddace to do tau. But Cruddace is arguably the worst codex writer, so lets get rid of him. And ffs, with Ward's marine book record, why not let him do chaos?


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## Stephen_Newman

Durandal said:


> No way, Dar have been Kelly's baby since forever, so I would expect him to write them, and Cruddace to do tau. But Cruddace is arguably the worst codex writer, so lets get rid of him. And ffs, with Ward's marine book record, why not let him do chaos?


Sorry to disappoint but Kelly wrote the last one and at a recent games day this year he stated that he did not want to write the next Eldar codex. He wants to be known for something apart from Eldar related stuff.


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## SilverTabby

James Tiberius said:


> it would if it was all wrong, but thats 1 piece of fluff, hell its not like I'm listing 600 pieces of fluff incorrectly like what people regularly do but don't get a second glance about it.
> 
> in fact its allot more foolish that people have spent so much time complaining about me posting 1 bit of ill-remembered fluff instead of complaining about all the piss poor fluff already written by a codex writer who shouldn't be writing stupid fluff, and a company who approves of such pathetic fluff
> 
> as I said before, 1 set of rules for some of us, another for the rest of you
> 
> how am I exactly owned for getting something wrong and not really feeling that bad about it because it was just a mistake?...or do you just like to pretend to be 5yrs old sometimes and go around saying owned like it still actually makes you cool or popular or has some meaning in this modern age?
> 
> oh yeah, you'll have eldar allying with necrons and tyranids to fight squat remnants, while inscribing ultrmarine symbols on there faces in honor of the greatest chapter to exist and being such awesome opponents, hell ward would probably have them worshipping daedric gods with a farseer named shepard while on an adventure to destroy a ring of power and fighting against an empire to destroy a giant grey ball in space.


*Blinks* In the -same post- you complain about someone jumping on you for getting something wrong, then later on spout the same mistaken and hugely exaggerated nonsense. 

People have applied more emphasis to certain parts of the fluff than Matt ever did, and have blown it up to ridiculous proportions, and then perpetuated the trend until everyone believes it to be true. Seriously, some of the rubbish I've read on these threads makes me think over 75% of the posters are going on hearsay rather than having read the codeces themselves.


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## Zion

Doelago said:


> *cough*Codex Sisters of Battle*cough*


With the rumors I heard it seems more like Ward wrote the fluff and Cruddace did the rules. The rules look like Cruddace's work...but the fluff is actually _decent._ So I don't know for sure.


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## Serpion5

Stephen_Newman said:


> Common rumours indicate that Kelly is writing Tau and that Cruddace is apparently writing Chaos. This means that Ward is the only one left to write Eldar.


I spoke to Phil Kelly at Games Day AU (as a fellow xenos enthusiast). He told me that he has little interest in tau, and when I asked if he would ever be involved with them he simply shrugged.


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## ThoseKrazyKasrkin

SilverTabby said:


> *Blinks* In the -same post- you complain about someone jumping on you for getting something wrong, then later on spout the same mistaken and hugely exaggerated nonsense.
> 
> People have applied more emphasis to certain parts of the fluff than Matt ever did, and have blown it up to ridiculous proportions, and then perpetuated the trend until everyone believes it to be true. Seriously, some of the rubbish I've read on these threads makes me think over 75% of the posters are going on hearsay rather than having read the codeces themselves.


Its called hearsay online for a reason ; P


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## James Tiberius

SilverTabby said:


> then later on spout the same mistaken and hugely exaggerated nonsense. .


if you really believe that what I said about the eldar was real and I was being or taking it seriously, and it wasn't sarcasm, then you must be pretty damn dense, or just stupid


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## Serpion5

Wow, now the Matt Ward Hate thread is devlving into a hate fellow heretics thread. 


Classy.


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## Sworn Radical

Holy Emperor ... I love these forums ... :smoke:


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## ThoseKrazyKasrkin

I hate you all you all suck life is gay i hate pie i dont like raymond and i want food waaaaaaa....


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## James Tiberius

Serpion5 said:


> Wow, now the Matt Ward Hate thread is devlving into a hate fellow heretics thread.
> 
> 
> Classy.


well it is similar to me saying that france is made of cheese and germany eat babies and chinese people are robots and someone actually taking it seriously and moaning about me being wrong, it takes a special kind of stupid to believe massively obvious sarcastic claims


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## ThoseKrazyKasrkin

Its a hate thread and haters gonna hate so dont hate on the haters rightiously hating on ward. It is what this hate thread was designed for yes?


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## Serpion5

Wasn`t singling anyone out JT, just making the observation that it is happening.  

And you got that all wrong. China eats babies, France is full of robots and Germany is made of cheese. 

Sheesh. :scratchhead: 


@TKK: I don`t like Raymond either.


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## ThoseKrazyKasrkin

Well we here in the great south land consume our mothers upon birth and slay any rivals to our ascendancy, to ensure the dominant genes will progress.

Since people on here have a hard time seeing blatant sarcasm, ill point it out, im possibly being sarcastic?

Edit: we also like poorly draw ponys made of auto-shapes for our avatars ; P


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## Serpion5

TKK, you are proving somewhat resourceful as of late. 

I may have to slay you before you rival my ascendancy. :security:


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## Legiomortis

Serpion5 said:


> I spoke to Phil Kelly at Games Day AU (as a fellow xenos enthusiast). He told me that he has little interest in tau, and when I asked if he would ever be involved with them he simply shrugged.


When we had the lounge chat with Graham Mcniell and Dan Abnett I asked Graham if he would ever like to see Honsou as an Iron Warriors HQ, he replied that he had been begging Phill Kelly to put him in the new codex but he wont, I simply smiled and said "So Phil Kelly is writing the chaos codex" to which he replied almost sheepishly " I didnt say anything "

Thats good enough for me tbh.


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## bitsandkits

Phil Kelly has moves like jagger


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## SilverTabby

James Tiberius said:


> if you really believe that what I said about the eldar was real and I was being or taking it seriously, and it wasn't sarcasm, then you must be pretty damn dense, or just stupid


Well, when someone says the same bollocks in multiple different places, it's hard to tell if they're being serious or not when they repeat it yet again. 

You know, this kind of crap is why I left Heresy for several years. I don't want to spend what little spare time I get trawling through reams of vitriolic crud. I think I may just go back to my usual forum which isn't full of this, and leave you to it.


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## James Tiberius

SilverTabby said:


> I think I may just go back to my usual forum which isn't full of this, and leave you to it.


what bolter and chainsword you mean?, thats the only site I know that if you say bother you get perma banned for harsh language, so everyone goes around like a bunch of hippies praising out there buttholes


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## SilverTabby

James Tiberius said:


> what bolter and chainsword you mean?, thats the only site I know that if you say bother you get perma banned for harsh language, so everyone goes around like a bunch of hippies praising out there buttholes


Actually, I've never been to B&C, and never intend to. My usual haunt is populated by actual adults who like proper discussions rather than trolling and personal insults. The rules state things like using proper grammar and punctuation, and its a lovely place to discuss my hobby. 

This forum could be just as nice, if it weren't for trolls deliberately trying to irritate and insult for the hell of it.


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## Doelago

SilverTabby said:


> The rules state things like using proper grammar and punctuation, and its a lovely place to discuss my hobby.


Its in Heresy`s rules as well if we are to be precise here, and a certain person in this thread should start adhering to that rule.


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## Katie Drake

Just report him if he pisses you off, it's the only way to bring it to the attention of the moderators. It's pointless trying to have a conversation with him.


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## lokis222

Looks like the Anit-Ward shit has been finally flushed from most people's systems at least. Now it is down to a fight for a fight's sake. opcorn:


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## kavyanshrike

exterminatus- let your opponent deploy then on a 2+ his entire army dies


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## Praevarus

kavyanshrike said:


> exterminatus- let your opponent deploy then on a 2+ his entire army dies


You found that leak too?  I think we should all cut ward some slack... hating is bad.


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## gen.ahab

Achaylus72 said:


> Yeah sure why not, go ahead burn my apartment down, and make me and three other families homeless while you are at it, what a fucktard. Or at least do it at night just to make sure you burn us to death.












Jesus people. :laugh: Every time GW releases something, or says anything in general, people go at each other. Calm down and relax. No point getting pissed off over toys.


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## Praevarus

By the great machine god! Enough! Cease your angers immediately, put your adversities aside and come together to face a much greater threat than the recent outbreak of wardhatiusmaximus.....face your doom!


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## Samules

I wonder if wardhate will be reversed eventually with the new ward fan page. With people expressing a slight dislike of wards work to be the targets of huge angry posts and hijackary rather than the other way around (as it is now). Maybe he will be given all the credit for work that was clearly not just his rather than blame. 

Personally I don't see the fan page as a good thing as all it is is hate redirected. It is not a fan page truth be told since its creator only created it because he was sick of hate threads. Granted this thread isn't so great either but at least now everyone has this out of their system and we can let it die.

And who knows the fan page might turn out to be decent after all.


----------



## MetalHandkerchief

lokis222 said:


> Super old race jealous of a fellow race due to lifespan and such makes a deal with the devil. They become an undead horde of terminator robots out to wipe out life in the universe because they didn't read the fine print.


Richard Castle, is that you?

...

EDIT: Oh, and I hate Ward, but not as much as I hate the editors at GW.


----------



## lokis222

MetalHandkerchief said:


> Richard Castle, is that you?
> 
> ...
> 
> EDIT: Oh, and I hate Ward, but not as much as I hate the editors at GW.


:drinks:


----------



## lokis222

Samules said:


> Granted this thread isn't so great either but at least now everyone has this out of their system and we can let it die.


It served its purpose.


----------



## Vaz

Samules said:


> I wonder if wardhate will be reversed eventually with the new ward fan page. With people expressing a slight dislike of wards work to be the targets of huge angry posts and hijackary rather than the other way around (as it is now).


Really? Looking through the thread, it's essentially "I don't like xxx, it's a pile of wank, and it's a consistent pile of wank" - followed shortly by bandwagon-hopping-member-2002424 posting that we're insulting Mat Ward personally and that it's misdirected, and that we're all evil, and that we ourselves are twats for expressing dislike in something that's already known to be disliked, and hence we're bandwagon hopping.

Oh the irony, of someone who joined the bandwagon to call out those who "jumped on the bandwagon".

I'm gonna write you a chit to take down to stores, and find yourself a pair of adult male shoulders and some minerals. Christ, stop getting so offended on the behalf of someone else.

You're not from London, are you?


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## SilverTabby

Out of curiosity: What's wrong with being from London? :wink:


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## Durant

> You're not from London, are you?


:laugh: :laugh:

+1



> Out of curiosity: What's wrong with being from London?


Its funny that a thread about hating a guy who writes fantasy wargaming rules still finds room for a friendly dig at the UK North South divide.

Lets focus on whats important people, we northerners have flat caps and whippets and southerners are nancys... :biggrin:


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## troybuckle

Wow this hit 30 pages fast


----------

