# Eldar Craftworld questions



## Doelago (Nov 29, 2009)

I am writing a piece of fiction at the moment, and I would need some information about Craftworlds.

How large are they compared to Space Marine battle barges? 

What kind of weapons and shields do they have to protect themselves?

How would they fare against cyclonic torpedoes, or other Imperial space weaponry for the matter? 

What is there inside the craftworld?

Are all craftworlds "identical", or similar in most aspects?

Would a boarding torpedo penetrate the wall of one? Or would it be possible to just blast in with a drop pod somehow?

Is there breathable atmosphere in there, like everywhere in there?

What forces are there in there, and what kind of civilian population is there in there?

What do Dreadnoughts eat for breakfest? (*WTF?*)


Helpful person can look forward to some crack, erh, rep. :gimmefive:


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## Helsreach (Jun 2, 2010)

Well in once story line, a SM chapter cleared out an entire craft world and lived to tell the tale but in Path of the Warrior, they try to take a craft world and suffer thousands of guard casualties, lose dozens of ships, face titans inside, have entire sections of the craftworld cut off from the oxygen supply. The craft world also has ships to protect it and some pretty good defences. I think it would take a full crusade, with at least a good few thousand marines to even attempt to take a craft world. Then again, if a lone capter could then who knows, taking on a small craft world could be like taking on the PDF, far easier than the real thing.

As for the torpedos etc, I'd say to scrap that approach. It's like taking something the size of a hive city, you need to open the hangers up and pour troops and tanks inside ASAP. It is a self contained city so civillian housing, transport etc. You really need to read Path of the Warrior for all this because they have temples for training squads that seem to me to take up a vast space and can range from jungles to deserts. Civillians would mainly be the civillian millitia, or Guardians. The rest would be Eldar on the different "paths" so artists, waiters, writers etc.


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## Djinn24 (Jan 12, 2008)

From what I understand they can vary in size but are huge. If I was going to make a comparison to something visual I would say a Borg ship from TNG, maybe larger. If you play or look at the space game (brain fart) remember the ships can dock in a craftword. 

Fluff is not my strong point so I am sure someone will prove me wrong (waits for Spikey or Ploss).


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## Doelago (Nov 29, 2009)

djinn24 said:


> From what I understand they can vary in size but are huge. If I was going to make a comparison to something visual I would say a Borg ship from TNG, maybe larger. If you play or look at the space game (brain fart) remember the ships can dock in a craftword.
> 
> Fluff is not my strong point so I am sure someone will prove me wrong (waits for Spikey or Ploss And Child of the Emperor :grin.


Ouh, thanks for the comment man! So I can dock in there, no need blast the living crap out of it to get a hole in it. :grin:


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## Djinn24 (Jan 12, 2008)

Let me add an I think .


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## Phoebus (Apr 17, 2010)

Doelago said:


> I am writing a piece of fiction at the moment, and I would need some information about Craftworlds.
> 
> How large are they compared to Space Marine battle barges?


A Battle Barge is comparable to a battleship, which is several kilometers long.

A Craftworld can vary in size, but more than once (most recently in Codex: Dark Eldar) and they have been described as being the size of small moons. 

In "Prospero Burns", for instance, one of the Craftworlds is described as being as big as a city--which would still make it larger than a battleship, but not as large as a "small moon", though. It's important to note, though, that these are evolving ships/structures. "Prospero Burns" is set in the 31st millennium--a comparatively short time after the fall of the Eldar Empire. The Craftworld that was city-sized then could be "small moon"-sized ten millennia later.



> What kind of weapons and shields do they have to protect themselves?


Well, to begin with, they are protected by entire fleets of Eldar warships. They can also access the Webway to escape.

Beyond that, I'm not sure about specifics. You might try "Path of the Warrior", since the climactic arc of the story involves the Imperium invading a Craftworld. I would imagine that they have weapons of a type comparable to those found on their warships... but actual shields, as opposed to holographic defenses.



> How would they fare against cyclonic torpedoes, or other Imperial space weaponry for the matter?


A single Craftworld is stated to have ruined an entire sector fleet. I would say they are quite capable of handling such weaponry.



> What is there inside the craftworld?


An entire self-contained Eldar society. Cities, temples, museums, armories, Aspect Temples for Exarchs, the "graveyards" where "dead" Eldar's soul-stones are placed, parks, star-ports, you name it.



> Are all craftworlds "identical", or similar in most aspects?


Each is a unique place/vessel/city/state. They are similar in the sense that they achieve the same aim--originally, an escape from the destruction of the Eldar Empire, and, now, providing a home and a place of safety for the survivors.

But each is, again, different in look, feel, leadership, etc.



> Would a boarding torpedo penetrate the wall of one? Or would it be possible to just blast in with a drop pod somehow?


I believe all sorts of landing craft were used in "Path of the Warrior" to gain access to the Craftworld.



> Is there breathable atmosphere in there, like everywhere in there?


Yes. And it's worth mentioning that, being a psychic construct, the Craftworld can respond to the whims of its makers with deadly consequences for invaders.



> What forces are there in there, and what kind of civilian population is there in there?


Conceivably millions of civilians. Defenses vary from Craftworld to Craftworld (see the Codex for more on that), but Guardians are the most basic warriors. Then you have Aspect Warriors led by Exarchs, Warlocks and Farseers, tanks, jetbikes, and basically everything else the Codex says they can have. In essence, the Craftworld is where all their armies come from to begin with.

Cheers,
P.


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## Baron Spikey (Mar 26, 2008)

Phoebus said:


> Well, to begin with, they are protected by entire fleets of Eldar warships. They can also access the Webway to escape


I don't think they can escape into the Webway- the lack of mobility compared to most other craft is why Iyanden couldn't outrun the Hive Fleets.


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## Phoebus (Apr 17, 2010)

I was pretty sure that they can access it. Now, you may very well have a point as to whether that's something they can do in short notice or not...


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## Baron Spikey (Mar 26, 2008)

Phoebus said:


> I was pretty sure that they can access it. Now, you may very well have a point as to whether that's something they can do in short notice or not...


Maybe it's a case of size, Iyanden being one of the largest Craftworlds simply wouldn't fit through any of the Webway portals.

Or because every webway portal and passage is different maybe Craftworlds can only escape into the Webway if they do find an entrance vast enough, portals that would be quite rare I imagine.


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## Djinn24 (Jan 12, 2008)

We are also thinking about small cities on the scale of what we know. Cities range from planet sized to continent sized in the 30-40k.


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## Doelago (Nov 29, 2009)

Hmm... This is getting interesting... Is there any detailed account on the "Invaders" assault on that one craftworld, and how they fucked that one up into a dead piece of junk?


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## Phoebus (Apr 17, 2010)

Baron,

Actually, you were right. I looked over the latest Codex, and the Craftworlds are always referred to as "floating in the void", with Webway gates and tunnels connecting Craftworlds to other locations (and/or other Craftworlds), not allowing them to pass within. Eldar spacecraft and use the Webway, but not actual Craftworlds.

So, good call there!


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## Serpion5 (Mar 19, 2010)

If I may add to Phoebus` knowledge, it is worth a look in the BrB on the galaxy map, where you can see a vague image of what a craftworld resembles.


That`s basically what they look like. They have various domes over the surface and are able to dispatch entire fleets through the webway portal on their rear. Worth noting that this portal can also be used to receive aid from other craftworlds. :grin:

EDIT: Sorry, couldn`t load the image. Damn copyright...


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## Phoebus (Apr 17, 2010)

Yup, and they also have an illustration implying the same kind of scale in the Eldar Codex, as well.


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## Lord_Anonymous (Oct 13, 2010)

Now there's an interesting thought, if they can recieve reinforcements in short notice situations then why didn't one like ulthwe help iyanden against the tyranid hive fleet...

Anyway back to the original post, a craftworld is pretty much a amalgamation of the different kinds of imperial worlds like it would have training grounds, armouries and foundrys, civilian housing like a hiveworld etc.

As for defence, i read somewhere in the eldar codex that every eldar can stand in the defence of their craftworld so that is potentially hundreds of thousands of guardians to augment the aspect warriors already on the world, then you have the craftworlds fleet screening and attacking invaders, also eldar wraithbone is psychicly receptive so within a little amount of time more wraithguard and 'lords could be sung into being and filled with the craftworlds dead souls so potentially millions more warriors to destroy, each and everyone one equal to a space marine with centuries or even millenia of experience to draw from,

Add that to the fact that know one even knows where a craftworld is as they are ridicously well hidden and the eldar craftworlds turn into the equivelant of a fortress world on steroids.


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## Serpion5 (Mar 19, 2010)

Lord_Anonymous said:


> Now there's an interesting thought, if they can recieve reinforcements in short notice situations then why didn't one like ulthwe help iyanden against the tyranid hive fleet...


This happens at a point in the timeline where the shit was hitting the fan. I doubt any craftworld could spare any reasonable amount of reinforcements. And to counter the next question, they would never evacuate, it would mean leaving the spirit stones of their ancestors behind.


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## Aramoro (Oct 7, 2009)

Doelago said:


> Hmm... This is getting interesting... Is there any detailed account on the "Invaders" assault on that one craftworld, and how they fucked that one up into a dead piece of junk?


It would need to be an extremely small Craftworld. If you consider that a Craftworld will have a fleet docked in it and around it, including multiple Void Stalkers etc, each of which is capable of fucking up a Battlebarge (and getting fucked up in return) then Craftworlds must be vast. A single Battlebarge against any of the big Craftworlds would be obliterated before it got close. The small ones would be a batter target but then you still have the problems of the Corsairs who still turn up to aid Craftworlds when needed. 

When you actually got onto the surface expect it to be extremely hostile. Oxygen is only there because the Craftworld allows it to be, not that it matters for Space Marines. Because the dead reside in Crafworlds they are extremely valuable to All Eldar not just the ones from that world. If one came under threat you could expect intervention from travelling Harlequins or even Phoenix Lords travelling though the webway. But if you made it a small enough one, far enough away then you could probably destroy it with a fleet.


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## Doelago (Nov 29, 2009)

Is there any way that the psychic stuff (that spirit thing) could be royally fucked up by something? Psykers concentrating their mind to destroy it or something?


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## Aramoro (Oct 7, 2009)

Well the Doom of Malanti managed it, leeching power out of the world after sneaking on board. But he took ages to do it. The Infinity Circuit house the souls of every Eldar plugged ito it, and the psychic ability of them. If you did manage to avoid the Seers turning your brain inside out for trying I can only imagine it would be like trying to short circuit a house by licking a plug socket, hard to do and fatal if you succeed. Though if you're like the Doom it seems you can tap into the Circuit by some means and syphon power from it, though quite why the Warp Spiders didn't detect the Doom is a mystery. 

What are you trying to do and we can perhaps think of a feasible way for it to happen?


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## Doelago (Nov 29, 2009)

SPOILER ALERT! Ok, I am about to write a story (no shit), and in the begining the Space Marines will be attacking a Craftworld. I am just wondering, what is needed to make it reasonable, or sound realistic. What about ramming a battle barge right into it, World Engine style?


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## Aramoro (Oct 7, 2009)

Doelago said:


> SPOILER ALERT! Ok, I am about to write a story (no shit), and in the begining the Space Marines will be attacking a Craftworld. I am just wondering, what is needed to make it reasonable, or sound realistic. What about ramming a battle barge right into it, World Engine style?


It might work World Engine style, but remember that entire chapter was wiped out to a man. 

Does it have to be a Craftworld? Could they be attacking a Maiden World, those are much more isolated from the rest, smaller generally, and still have most things a Craftworld has.


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## Doelago (Nov 29, 2009)

Aramoro said:


> It might work World Engine style, but remember that entire chapter was wiped out to a man.
> 
> Does it have to be a Craftworld? Could they be attacking a Maiden World, those are much more isolated from the rest, smaller generally, and still have most things a Craftworld has.


Nope, and the Invaders did it, and my chapter is like at least 10 times cooler than them, so it must be a damned craftworld! You dont understand the improtance of this! Its about cleansing Xeno scum from the galaxy! :ireful2:


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## Aramoro (Oct 7, 2009)

You do know the Invaders got crushed like someone getting punched by the fist of an angry god for what they did? 

The fluff has no scaling of power, the Idharae fleet destroyed part of Hive Fleet Naga but was somehow impotent to stop the Invaders from destroying their craftworld. Leaving it to Alaitoc to come and push their shit in for doing it. So they're sometimes impenetrable fortresses and sometimes you can just punch them to death with your bare hands against no resistance. I would choose something in-between. 

In the end it's your story so go wild, if your chapter must destroy a Craftworld then do it. Perhaps the Eldar were all having a picnic or something.


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## Phoebus (Apr 17, 2010)

Lord_Anonymous said:


> Now there's an interesting thought, if they can recieve reinforcements in short notice situations then why didn't one like ulthwe help iyanden against the tyranid hive fleet...


The Ulthwe rely on their Farseers to determine the best course of action for their Craftworld (and often the Galaxy as a whole) by scrying the various strands of the future.

If they didn't go to the aid of Iyanden, it's probably because they couldn't divine a good outcome out of it.


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## Aramoro (Oct 7, 2009)

Phoebus said:


> The Ulthwe rely on their Farseers to determine the best course of action for their Craftworld (and often the Galaxy as a whole) by scrying the various strands of the future.
> 
> If they didn't go to the aid of Iyanden, it's probably because they couldn't divine a good outcome out of it.


It could be that they needed Yriel to return as he may serve some higher purpose at some point in the future.


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## Warlock in Training (Jun 10, 2008)

Its true a Single Chapter called the Invaders wiped out some made up no name Craftworld. BS but it happen. What most people seem to froget that A KNOWN Craftworld called Aloitec Easily beat the Invaders to near nothing as payback. A major chunk of Hivefleet Kraken was stooped dead by the might of Iyaden and Yriels Corsairs. Yet in another BS fluff story a Single DoM destoryed another Craftworld by its lonesome. Long story short No Name Craftworlds seem to be easily taken out but the bigger ones will decimate any SM Chapter by itself. It would Take 3-4 Chapters and a Sector Fleet to beat something like Ulthwe. Make it a Small Craftworld for your story. Its the only belivable way to go about it.


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## Baron Spikey (Mar 26, 2008)

Warlock in Training said:


> A major chunk of Hivefleet Kraken was stooped dead by the might of Iyaden and Yriels Corsairs.


Stopped after it had completely decimated Iyanden and consigned it to a slow extinction, and previous to that Iyanden was one of the largest and most powerful Craftworlds (if not the most powerful).


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## Phoebus (Apr 17, 2010)

To be fair, though, Yriel's departure was also a reason for Iyanden being weakened to begin with.


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## Warlock in Training (Jun 10, 2008)

Baron Spikey said:


> Stopped after it had completely decimated Iyanden and consigned it to a slow extinction, and previous to that Iyanden was one of the largest and most powerful Craftworlds (if not the most powerful).


And Kraken was the Second Largest Hivefleet. So That says alot of a Single Craftworld, and they're not out of the fight yet. Says alot. Also were did you get that Yaden was possibly the most powefrul. Ulthwe and Biel-Tan has always held those titles as far as I have read.


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## Baron Spikey (Mar 26, 2008)

Warlock in Training said:


> And Kraken was the Second Largest Hivefleet. So That says alot of a Single Craftworld, and they're not out of the fight yet. Says alot. Also were did you get that Yaden was possibly the most powefrul. Ulthwe and Biel-Tan has always held those titles as far as I have read.


_Codex: Eldar _Page.20.

Ulthwe have the most powerful psykers, and Beil-Tann is the most aggressive and militaristic but I've not read that either were the largest or most powerful.


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## Serpion5 (Mar 19, 2010)

Warlock in Training said:


> And Kraken was the Second Largest Hivefleet. So That says alot of a Single Craftworld, and they're not out of the fight yet. Says alot. Also were did you get that Yaden was possibly the most powefrul. Ulthwe and Biel-Tan has always held those titles as far as I have read.


Hive Fleet Kraken spread itself pretty thin though. Iyanden did not face the entire fleet, only one or two tendrils. Another tendril or two were stopped at Ichar IV by the Imperium, and the rest of the tendrils slipped through. 

Presumably this was a plot point to allow for player custom Splinter Fleets, but it also adds to the tyranid threat level, seeing as they`re spreading quickly by sacrificing a few splinter fleets anymore. 

Granted, Iyanden`s survival was an impressive feat, but it`s not as though they took on the full force of Kraken, only a small portion of it.


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## Warlock in Training (Jun 10, 2008)

Warlock in Training said:


> A major chunk of Hivefleet Kraken was stooped dead by the might of Iyaden and Yriels Corsairs.


I said Chunk, not the whole Fleet  Its a very impressive Feat. Just like the Invaders being crushed by the Ranger Craftworld.


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## Serpion5 (Mar 19, 2010)

Relax mate. I was just using your quote to expand on it, not trying to contradict you. I know what you said. 



Warlock in Training said:


> I said Chunk, not the whole Fleet  Its a very impressive Feat. Just like the Invaders being crushed by the Ranger Craftworld.


On this however...  

It`s worth pointing out that the "Ranger Craftworld" boasts a significant and very diciplined military force. The reason Alaitoc has so many rangers is because more citizens than usual choose the path of the outcast to get away from the extremely strict lifestyle there.

The Craftworld residents themselves follow the same tenets as any other, it is simply acknowledged that more eldar outcasts come from Alaitoc than anywhere else.


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## Pssyche (Mar 21, 2009)

You might want to research a game published by Games Workshop in the early nineties called "Doom Of The Eldar". 

It is about the Tyranid assault on Iyandan.
Its playboard is a map of the Iyandan Craftworld.

It's very simplistic, but may be of interest to you all the same.


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## ckcrawford (Feb 4, 2009)

Does anybody know what happened to these Craftworlds?

Anaen
Bel-Shammon


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## Aramoro (Oct 7, 2009)

> Anaen


Baharroth's Home Craftworld which was destroyed by a massive Chaos force lead by a Champion of Khorne. 




ckcrawford said:


> Bel-Shammon


Destroyed by Humans in the Shadowpoint, Imperial forces destroy it before the book starts as kind of a footnote.


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## ckcrawford (Feb 4, 2009)

Thanks I appreciate that. Some of these craftworlds have some interesting stories. Its too bad they perished.


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