# How do Space Marines handle monstrous creatures?



## Pako (May 28, 2009)

Ive tried Dev squads with Lascannons, Assault Temrinators, Tanks, and concentrated mid-level strength fire against my friend's (growing) Nidzilla army, but nothing can handel those monstrous creatures. Any advice for a SM player who is out of ideas?


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## englhockey (Mar 19, 2009)

You can tie the creatures up with maybe small assault squads with a melta and power fist, heavy bolters do ok assault cannons, melta guns on sternguard will bring one down a turn.


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## Tim/Steve (Jan 25, 2009)

Shove a powerfist on all sgts, have a couple units of assault termies hanging around with TH/SS and have a few units of devys- 4 MLs will work great on the elite fexs while any heavy support sniperfexs can be ignored (venom cannon+barbed strangler)... which would normally only leave 1 max 2 for the termies and sgts to take out.

HQs with relic blades or libbys with relic blades for trying to ID any fex that leaves synapse are also good plans, scout snipers arent bad choices either. 3+ cover save and rending rifles are great.. but a nice cheap alternative to marines; leaves you vulnerable to gaunts though.


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## Katie Drake (Nov 28, 2007)

Dealing with them from a distance can be tough sometimes. Most of the weapons that can reliably wound MCs are single shot weapons, plus it's not unlikely that the MC will have a cover save.

I'd like some more information though. What sorts of Monstrous Creatures are giving you trouble? Are you coming up against a Tyranid army that's fielding a bunch of Fexes? Chaos Marines or Daemons with Princes and Greater Daemons? Maybe even Eldar with Wraithlords and Avatar? With that additional info we can give more than general suggestions.


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## MetalHandkerchief (Aug 3, 2009)

Take plenty of sniper rifle-equipped scouts and dig in 

Alternatively, stack up on Assault Cannons (termies, land raider crusader or land speeder tornadoes.)

Of course, this is guessing you are dealing with Tyranid monstrous creatures.


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## killmaimburn (Mar 19, 2008)

I think he mentioned nidzilla..
So: power fists on sargeants, concentrated melta fire, TH/SS termies really should be able to do the job especially. Lysander, sternguard shooting hellfire rounds, librarians using the power that gives S6 and then dropping ID if its out of synapse. Oh, and also dreadnoughts can deal with them with a little luck but its a risk, especially if the 'fex takes bioplasma and the initiative upgrade. Plasma guns tend to drop them quick, but are less preferable in the 5th edition game environment.


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## Orochi (Jan 28, 2009)

The thing to remember with MCs is they tend to be slow.

I cannot stress how important it is to remember that a Carnifex will kill 2-3 marines in CC, while a Broodlord will probably kill 4 or 5. Squads of genestealers will eat whole squads. etc etc.

Deal with MCs IF they are a major threat, otherwise, leave them.


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## Pako (May 28, 2009)

Katie Drake said:


> Dealing with them from a distance can be tough sometimes. Most of the weapons that can reliably wound MCs are single shot weapons, plus it's not unlikely that the MC will have a cover save.
> 
> I'd like some more information though. What sorts of Monstrous Creatures are giving you trouble? Are you coming up against a Tyranid army that's fielding a bunch of Fexes? Chaos Marines or Daemons with Princes and Greater Daemons? Maybe even Eldar with Wraithlords and Avatar? With that additional info we can give more than general suggestions.


Ah sorry guess I should say what he has (so far at least);
A Flyrant with whip, sword, and Terminator armor shield power (something else too pry but i forget).
A CC Carnifex
and a Dakka-fex with the pinning gun

sorry thats all i can ever figure. I'm not very good with remembering Nid biomorphs.


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## primeministersinsiter (May 31, 2009)

You need to defeat by details. You need to concentrate fire on one creature at a time. 10 man Sternguard in a rhino hit good and hard.
Devs with all missile launchers work ok, but I take two plasma cannons and las cannons.
Dreadnoughts are never a bad idea I find. Tool them up with an assault cannon or a multi-melta and away you go.
It's not a bad idea to shoot with tac squads either. The might wound on 6, but what odds? Shoot everything at them always.
Also, never advance. Shoot as many turns as possible.
Hope it helps.


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## SKITTLESKITTEN (Feb 12, 2008)

lol, you can also try this, take a rhino and before the MC reaches CC park the rhino in its path to let it waste a turn so you can kill all the other swarms with your rapid fire and what not. you can also try leaving the Fex alone sometimes because they dont count as scoring units.


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## killmaimburn (Mar 19, 2008)

Well for the tyrant it is more killy in CC than the fexes are, at least against MEQ and TEQ enemies. You can shoot it down quite quickly with sternguard, as said previously. TH/SS termies will chew them up, especially with vulkan.


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## Winterous (Mar 30, 2009)

Pako said:


> Ah sorry guess I should say what he has (so far at least);
> A Flyrant with whip, sword, and Terminator armor shield power (something else too pry but i forget).
> A CC Carnifex
> and a Dakka-fex with the pinning gun
> ...


I assume the Tyrant has the Sword, Whip, AND Scything Talons (the huge claws).
And the 2+ armour save power is called Warp Field.

Ok so, Assault Terminators with Hammers should be the main part of your army, they kill them easily and have awesome survivability, but the Tyrant will give them trouble, removing one of their two attacks.

Sternguard work well, the 2+ to wound shots are a great boon.

Scouts with Sniper Rifles are a solid choice, taking a Heavy Bolter on them is a no-brainer, 2+ to wound explosion? Hell yes.

Other than that, Power Fists, and little more.
If you have a Librarian, try and take out the Synapse first (Hive Tyrants), because they prevent Instant-Death within a 12" radius of themselves, preventing your Librarian from Force Weaponing some guys.

Good luck


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## Samir_Duran (Apr 6, 2009)

i remember my chapter master and his four men honour guard with auxilary grenades ( dunno how it's named in english) fired like 5 of them into the carnifex... it... well let's just say he swallowed all of the pancerschreck grenades and gave just a large burp... but then the team charged at him with artefactic ( or artificer??) swords... it was badass, i lost the master and two squad mates, then i broke out from CC and charged again when i could... they mashed the damn carnifex XD the squad is named Tyrant Vipers from now on ^_^ so my solution, a quad of ten honour guardians and a chapter master, a very good solution, even in CC ( my enemy was really pissed off for the resaults XD two useless dice-rolls for regen, only his weapons worked out good XD)

EDIT:
oh! and you wouldn't belive! my 5 scouts with two sniper rifles, two bolters and heavy bolter with hellfire managed to kill both the tyrant with his protector and the zoantrop! and the heavy weapons guy wasn't effective, i grinned them down with just the sniper fire XD


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## Winterous (Mar 30, 2009)

Samir_Duran said:


> oh! and you wouldn't belive! my 5 scouts with two sniper rifles, two bolters and heavy bolter with hellfire managed to kill both the tyrant with his protector and the zoantrop! and the heavy weapons guy wasn't effective, i grinned them down with just the sniper fire XD


That's some lucky rolling!
Why mix Snipers and Bolters though?
It's kinda pointless really.


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## Tim/Steve (Jan 25, 2009)

Luckiest Ive ever seen against my nid hoard-zilla list was 5 snipers rending 4 wounds onto my flyrant first turn... I was a little annoyed 

Terminators are the bane of Nid armies- without any decent AP2 weapons we have to rely on combat or massive weight of fire and/or pinning (I use the last 2). However getting the weight of ire needed to kill a unit of termies basically means the rest of the SM army is mostly toast and the termies are surrounded.. I manage this quite often but its still annoying (DS termies landing behind me always make me sweat.. never have beaten me but gives me serious pause for thought).
- Elite Nid or Nidzilla armies just cannot throw enough attacks at termies to kill through weight alone so have to rely on combat... but against TH/SS termies they wont have the attacks for that either (even the most upgraded fex needs an everage of 27 attacks to kill the basic 200pt TH/SS squad, in that time they should mush him to a pulp).


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## Lash Machine (Nov 28, 2008)

Have your TH/SS terminators in a crusader and go bug hunting. I also complment this with 7 sternguard in a rhino with 2 combi plasmas, 2 combi meltas and a power fist. The sternguard can averagely put three wounds on a T6 monstourous creature leaving the last to be taken off by my support units. There would also be four wounds from the hellfire shells so it is possible to down it in one turn from these guys. Boom fexs alos have less WS than the terminators and only two attacks which makes it very likely that you will get your full compliment of 15 attacks against them.


In one game I played earlier this year they took out two boom Fexes and then a Flyrant at the end of the game.

I feel that one of the worst mistakes to make with most armies when playing nids or Orks is to just sit there and shoot and wait for them to come to you. You need to dictate play and give them something to think about. Be aggressive and take down the big threatening units ASAP. Don't let them out manouver you by just sitting and waiting and then try some counter charge when they reach your lines. It will end badly.

Nids can also out shoot you if you sit and wait, especially if they have some Dakka Fexes.


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## Tim/Steve (Jan 25, 2009)

Boomfex have 3A basic.. but they still arent going to scratch TH/SS termies (massive average of 0.42 wounds a turn for a return of 8.3 if termies charge).

Land Raiders work great against nids, especially with TH/SS inside- only thing the nids can rely on to kill the LR is Fex CC (zoanthropes could if given enough time) and you have your fex hunters inside.... however, its a silly nid player that lets the LR have access to his fex- that what gaunt screens are for (move fex 15+" from LR and have gaunts in the way... if LR moves enough to let termies assault fex then it cant use its guns to clear the gaunts out of the way).
-biggest downside is points cost: 450pts for 5 TH/SS and a LR or LRC is 111 points more then my 3 boomfex!!!

Having said that taking the fight to the enemy is necessary for some missions, and nothing much besides a LR and termies can do that against nids... properly equipped devy squads are better in wound caused/cost but in a seize ground (or mebbe a C&C) mission just killing the MCs isnt enough


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## cybernomad (Oct 24, 2008)

For my white scars, its a command squad on bikes with Plasma guns. And a captain with a relic blade.


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## Samir_Duran (Apr 6, 2009)

Winterous said:


> That's some lucky rolling!
> Why mix Snipers and Bolters though?
> It's kinda pointless really.


Un, it's just i didn't even had the sniper models, and i made it from scrap but i ended without enough parts for five snipers ^^"


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## Winterous (Mar 30, 2009)

Samir_Duran said:


> Un, it's just i didn't even had the sniper models, and i made it from scrap but i ended without enough parts for five snipers ^^"


I thought of a really good way to make Snipers actually.
I mean, considering the Sniper Scouts kit is terrible, you can't pose it, and well, that's it really (not to mention the Scout HB is FAR better than the ML, 2+ explosion!)

Grab your Scouts with Bolters.
Put scopes on the Bolters, you get some in the Tactical Marines kit, not sure how many; you'll probably have some though, just not sure where.
Get a Plasticard rod that's slightly wider than the barrel of the Bolter, cut off most of the barrel, and glue a length of the rod to the end.

There you go, scoped and silenced Bolter with Stalker pattern rounds


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## Samir_Duran (Apr 6, 2009)

one prob: not much money, dunno where to get the plasticard... but yet, i did the snipers like this:

i took shotguns, then cut off four silencers from the bolt pistols and glued them by twos. then i fused it to the shotguns's barrels and i added scopes on top of the guns... it was my first conversion for which i got praised ^^'


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## Winterous (Mar 30, 2009)

Samir_Duran said:


> one prob: not much money, dunno where to get the plasticard... but yet, i did the snipers like this:
> 
> i took shotguns, then cut off four silencers from the bolt pistols and glued them by twos. then i fused it to the shotguns's barrels and i added scopes on top of the guns... it was my first conversion for which i got praised ^^'


Aah, never thought of doing it with Shotguns!
That's basically the same as I suggested with the Bolters though, I just forgot about the ends of the pistols :S
Anyway, nice work 

Fluff-wise, seeing as shotguns are probably not ideal for Sniping XD
In the game Inquisitor, there's a special ammo type for Shotguns, it's basically a homing bullet, it's called an Executioner round.


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## Samir_Duran (Apr 6, 2009)

Never knew what slaughtered them, eh? XD

I had many ideas, starting with using DA different power sword patterns as Artificer power swords, and making the Black Reach captain a chapter master ( although i still call him great Captain Serpus) in artificer armor... and also using many ork parts to turn a normal marine into an Dr. Octopus like Forgefather ^^" mainly from deffkoptas... once i have a good picture, I'll add it someday here or on my DA


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## Vanchet (Feb 28, 2008)

If this is against MC with 2+saves then the only answer I had was Plasmaguns and Lascannon troops-more often they're there just to soften it up if not kill it
Thunder hammer termies should easy cave it in (well like they do with near enough everything-Damn Storm shields)
If all comes to worse I say Lysander-best marine to take the job


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## Winterous (Mar 30, 2009)

Vanchet said:


> If this is against MC with 2+saves then the only answer I had was Plasmaguns and Lascannon troops-more often they're there just to soften it up if not kill it
> Thunder hammer termies should easy cave it in (well like they do with near enough everything-Damn Storm shields)
> If all comes to worse I say Lysander-best marine to take the job


Frankly against anything not a vehicle, I'd prefer 5 Assault Terminators any day!


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## Pako (May 28, 2009)

Thank you all very much for the responses so far.
Here's that I've noticed as a general trend;
1. TH/SS termis are not a bad idea to take against 'fexes, especially a dakka-fex.
2. Sternguard equipped correctly can really do some damage, more so if they're warping around with a Librarian.
3. Use big weapons to dakka MC's down, save the smaller guns for the swarms.
4. Sniper Rifles on scout squads with a HB could potentially put some SERIOUS hurt on MC's, swarms, and just about anything else.

Keep the ideas comin'. I have most if not all the models to at least try out some of these strategies.


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## Lash Machine (Nov 28, 2008)

geberally sniper scouts are rubbish for what they do and their points. What has been talked about on this thread regarding them is highly lucky rolls and you would be lucky to normally do one wound with a unit of them. To be fair MCs are perhaps their best target but their low BS and the unlikelyness of getting a rending wound, combined with the availability of cover sames makes them a bit useless.


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## duckfromhelll (Mar 25, 2008)

Use the rhino rush with meltaguns, Priority is to kill the flyrant though, i whould use landspeeders to get around behing them to give em somthing to think about. Give it melta or assault cannon weapons. Also you can get a speeder and drop scouts off behind them. Making slow moving nids choose a direction hurts them very much as they need to stay in synapsis range. and i agree with what has already been pointed out its better to have one carnifex on the board that hasnt been hit than two carnifexes with one wound left on each. (concentrate your fire)


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