# Primarchs Vs. Primarchs



## Lux (Apr 17, 2010)

All six teams are dropped onto a massive world, each on different parts of it all equally spread from one another. The world is hospitable for human life and has a wide range of climates depending upon which part or hemisphere you are on. Each team is working together to the best of their abilities, while still maintaining the strengths of their expertise. 

Goal: Each team is striving to be the last team standing, while all other times are eliminated. Each team is aware all 18 primarchs are involved but nothing else. 

Note: each team can utilize the planets resources to their fullest, including raw resources, weapons they find, create, the many varying citizens and governments of the planet they can also attempt to rally, enslave and or indoctrinate. This scenario stays exclusive to the planet, no leaving the atmosphere.

Equipment: each primarch has their custome top of the line wargear, and whatever else they choose to equip, armor type, weapons, gear, etc.

Argument: which team in your opinion will be victorious, provide your answer in a thought out well written description of how you think things would play out, ultimately leading to your teams victory.

Team 1. Night Haunter, Horus, Corax

Team 2. Sang, Angron, Lion

Team 3. Guilliman, Dorn, Perturabo

Team 4. Ferrus, Vulkan, Mortarion

Team 5. Khan, Fulgrim, Russ

Team 6. Magnus, Alpharius/Omegon, Lorgar


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## Chompy Bits (Jun 13, 2010)

Dude, this really doesn't make sense. First you say four vs four, then you make six teams of three but then only give five choices. I don't mean to sound rude but WTF?


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## Lux (Apr 17, 2010)

You know...I need a mod to fix the title and the poll,I forgot to add the sixth team to the poll..


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## Chompy Bits (Jun 13, 2010)

Lux said:


> You know...I need a mod to fix the title and the poll,I forgot to add the sixth team to the poll..


Try sending one of the moderators a PM for assistance because, apart from the few errors that need fixing, I think this could be an interesting discussion.


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## Lux (Apr 17, 2010)

Could you send a msg to baron for me chompy bitz? I'm posting this from my phone, and when I click on his profile the send msg icon isn't there. I won't be home for hours.


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## Chompy Bits (Jun 13, 2010)

Lux said:


> Could you send a msg to baron for me chompy bitz? I'm posting this from my phone, and when I click on his profile the send msg icon isn't there. I won't be home for hours.


Just sent Baron a message. Hopefully he can be of assistance sometime soon.


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## ckcrawford (Feb 4, 2009)

I went with Dorn and Perturabo. My favorite primarchs plus the poster boy? This team can't go wrong.


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## Words_of_Truth (Sep 20, 2007)

Master of defence master of siege attack and master of tactics? team 3 imo.


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## Vaz (Mar 19, 2008)

Team 1 - Master of Horror, Greatest of the Primarchs, and Master of Secret Attacks?

Nearest threat I see is Team 5 - Berserker, the Perfect Primarch, and the Huntsman of the Primarchs.


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## Bloody Mary (Nov 6, 2009)

I'd go with Team 3. Dorn and Perturabo will be doing their best, because if they don't the other might look better. And Guilliman is there to coordinate them. Plus it's the team with best strategical skills.

Team 1 would get in trouble, since Night Haunter would be just doing what he wants and Horus would be dividing his attention between being frustrated with him and trying to come up with a good strategy. And, if I remember right, Corax might just refuse to work with Horus.

Team 2 seems pretty good, but that's until Angron rushes blindly into battle. It's likely Sanguinius and Lion would just exclude him from their plans and work in tandem.

Team 4... Would be stubborn. They'd probably get along okay-ish, which would give them an advantage over the more conflicted teams. 

Team 5 seems okay. Russ and Khan got along well, but would rush into battle, most likely. Fulgrim would have to keep an eye on their backs, I guess?

Team 6 looks like proper threat. If Magnus and Lorgar let Alpharius think of their plan, they could end up doing something nasty and underhanded.


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## shas'o Thraka (Jan 4, 2010)

Bloody Mary said:


> Team 6 looks like proper threat. If Magnus and Lorgar let Alpharius think of their plan, they could end up doing something nasty and underhanded.


I think though, Magnus and Lorgar would have extreme arguements over who'se in charge, and they would NEVER let Alpharius have a say in anything, so this team would probably be the worst.

I would say team 2, because Angron would be a beast and could easily hold his own, while the other two build up a hench army and Lion picks a second-in-command named Luther


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## Bloody Mary (Nov 6, 2009)

shas'o Thraka said:


> I think though, Magnus and Lorgar would have extreme arguements over who'se in charge, and they would NEVER let Alpharius have a say in anything, so this team would probably be the worst.
> 
> I would say team 2, because Angron would be a beast and could easily hold his own, while the other two build up a hench army and Lion picks a second-in-command named Luther


Hm, I thought Lorgar and Magnus got along? But yeah, poor Alpharius never gets a chance to prove himself.

Angron would hold his own, until Night Haunter starts wearing the intestines of his man as a hat, or Corax sneaks up on him, or it turns out half his men are now actually Alpharius.


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## ckcrawford (Feb 4, 2009)

Team two has too many contradicting personalities. Angron as we all know is too brutish to work well with those two much more calmer personalities. Then we got Sanguinus the more trustful of the primarchs who I don't think would get along with the paranoid schemer the Lion. "Sanguinus wants to drink my blood... I'm going to send him to Caliban so I don't freak out."


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## gen.ahab (Dec 22, 2009)

Personally, I would have put horus, and russ in a team because they have a similar fighting style. Makes more sense.

However, goes by threats:

Team 2 (wins it because it has two of the three best fighters.)

Team 1

Team 5 (trumps teams the next team due to russ' ability to nullify Magnus's advantage)

Team 6 

Team 4

Team 3


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## ckcrawford (Feb 4, 2009)

I have a question Lux, besides for the resources and normal men being used from the planet, does each Primarch have their legions?


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## sethgabriel1990 (Sep 21, 2010)

if you'd have had russ, vulkan and horus together, i would have said them 3 would dominate


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## gen.ahab (Dec 22, 2009)

My question: how were some of these teams made? Many of them don't make any particular sense.


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## shas'o Thraka (Jan 4, 2010)

I suppose it was just random.

Atleast its not Mortarion, Alpharius and Guilliman:grin:


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## Khorne's Fist (Jul 18, 2008)

Team 5 ftw. From what Lorgar says in _The First Heretic,_ we know that Fulgrim and the Khan are two of the finest swordsmen amongst the primarchs, and we already know Russ is a beast in CC.


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## Lux (Apr 17, 2010)

To answer a previous question, the primarchs do not have their legions, they are only by their own selves, with their elite wargear.

The objective is to eliminate all others and be last man standing, so they can choose to use assassination, deception, full frontal assault, raise an army from the planets many societies and populace, etc. Take over governments, make arms, etc


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## shas'o Thraka (Jan 4, 2010)

And also as mentioned in the First Hereti we can expect Lorgar to floor Guilliman yet again.


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## Khorne's Fist (Jul 18, 2008)

shas'o Thraka said:


> And also as mentioned in the First Hereti we can expect Lorgar to floor Guilliman yet again.


I think that's in the same category as the Lion and Russ. You can take anyone down with a sucker punch.


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## Androxine Vortex (Jan 20, 2010)

I say Team 3 because Guilliman is a tactical genius. 
Dorn could defend anything:laugh:
And I dont know too much about the last Primarch but from what i know, it would be a good match.

Next in line I said Team 6


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## Words_of_Truth (Sep 20, 2007)

Androxine Vortex said:


> I say Team 3 because Guilliman is a tactical genius.
> Dorn could defend anything:laugh:
> And I dont know too much about the last Primarch but from what i know, it would be a good match.
> 
> Next in line I said Team 6


Pertrubo is like the opposite of Dorn, he was a siege attack specialist and was behind the siege of the Emperor's Palace, he and Dorn didn't get on, Dorn once said he could defend the Emperor's Palace against anyone, even Petrubo.


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## gothik (May 29, 2010)

and if anyone can break one of dorns fortress's then it is Perturabo so i would go team three.
Dorn, Perturabo adn Gulliman


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## CJay (Aug 25, 2010)

Team 3 has it. The rules say they can create armies. Im pretty sure the ones best qualified to do that successfully would be team 3. Guille was great with bettering systems, and improving societies, so he'd probably get a good size army, and unlike the rest he has Dorn and Pert who's gona have a sound defense to keep the rest out from ruining their plans. The other teams that would have a good chance for raising an army would probably be team 2, with Sang, using pretty boy looks to raise troops, but without a staunch defense, you have Corax, Magnus, etc rollin around messing things up.


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## Hired Goon (Sep 16, 2009)

Had to go with team 3.
siege, fortification, and direction.

team 5 was a close second. all of them are great fighters. raw aggression, tactical, perfect.


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## Chompy Bits (Jun 13, 2010)

I actually voted for team six.
Magnus is a raw power brute, plus he possesses high intelligents and vast amounts of knowledge on a wide variety of subjects. Remember that Horus considered him a major potential threat to his plans at the start of the heresy. Just imagine being the enemy forces if Magnus is leading his army's assualt. A giant red-skinned cyclops obliterating everything in his path without even lifting a finger. I don't know about you guys but I might just scream like a little girl and soil myself. Plus, his enormous mental powers would probably allow him defeat most other primarchs in combat fairly easily (just fling some of those titan destroying blasts at them) with the exception of Russ (though I still think Magnus can beat Russ if he fights more intelligently than he did at Prospero).

Lorgar also possesses an extremely devious mind. Let's not forget that he was a major player in kicking of the heresy in the first place. He has shown himself to be able to weave intricate long-term plans. Also, his masterful oratory skills wil result in a fanatically loyal and determined army. Plus he also has some degree of pregonitive powers.

Alpharius and Omegon are a particularly dangerous threat. Their ability to create intricate webs of a spies, assassins and informants will lend them a major advantage if the primarchs engage in any large scale campaigns. Imagine having all your generals assassinated on the eve of a major battle or half your troops turning traitor at a critical moment in combat. Plus, as I assume the other primarchs still don't know that they're twins, I could see them luring various primarchs expecting one-on-one combat into a trap and then double teaming them.

I think if these three (well, actually four) can establish a solid working relationship then the other primarchs are gonna be in for some nasty surprises.


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## Alpha Legionnaire (Oct 15, 2010)

Team six, they have an additional primarch, and you're matching two of the greatest legion builders(Lorgar/Alpharius) together. So you'd have a half fanatical, half hidden army, and with Magnus' support capabilities it'd be incredible.

Plus you have three primarchs that all turned to chaos, maybe for different reasons but the end result is that they are all on the same page and none of them ever displayed any aggression towards one another, they just synergize perfectly. Alpharius can get the cultists to magnify the power of the spells Magnus will cast to raise more daemons that Lorgar commands. They'd have this planet down solid.

Combine that with the fact that each is sneaky, and they have an additional primarch and it's GG. Giving the planet a populace was a grave error for the others. And the Alpharius/Omegon team would easily best any other single primarch(And they'll make damn sure they fight on home turf.)


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## D-A-C (Sep 21, 2010)

Khorne's Fist said:


> Team 5 ftw. From what Lorgar says in _The First Heretic,_ we know that Fulgrim and the Khan are two of the finest swordsmen amongst the primarchs, and we already know Russ is a beast in CC.





shas'o Thraka said:


> And also as mentioned in the First Hereti we can expect Lorgar to floor Guilliman yet again.


You know most people haven't read _First Heretic _and some (like me) haven't read the excerpt and so what both of you have just said could be interpreted as slight spoilers. If the two of you are making any more references maybe consider adding a small spolier warning. Thanks.


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## Lux (Apr 17, 2010)

Just to clarify..no daemons in this...it is pre heresy primarchs/pre daemon primarchs.


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## Bane_of_Kings (Oct 28, 2009)

I voted for team six.

You've got Magnus, who is a wise taction, and a powerful sorcerer. Then you've got Lorgar, who would probably be able to get the local populace into a fanatical fury to support his cause, and then you've got Alpharius, who'll go to the enemy and infiltrate, whilst Omegon will stay at with the others to make every other Primarch think that Alpharius is with the other two Primarchs.


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## LukeValantine (Dec 2, 2008)

Team two after all unless their is a full army behind each it will break down into three on three combat, and the 2 of the best warrior primarchs are in team two so meh.


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## Alpha Legionnaire (Oct 15, 2010)

D-A-C said:


> You know most people haven't read _First Heretic _and some (like me) haven't read the excerpt and so what both of you have just said could be interpreted as slight spoilers. If the two of you are making any more references maybe consider adding a small spolier warning. Thanks.


Horus kills Sang with Dumbledore riding Rosebud.

Also the Emprah is fatally wounded in the swirling melee of dead characters and plot devices.


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## TRU3 CHAOS (May 21, 2010)

I think that the biggest problem with how effective the teams would be is how well they would work well together. Its not really adding all their talents together will create a better team.

Best Three

Team 3. Guilliman, Dorn, Perturabo
Competition, Genius, and tactic. The only problem would be Perturabo's distrust
Team 4. Ferrus, Vulkan, Mortarion
Specialists with machine and weapons. Since this is a war fought by humans and not astartes, this probably is the best advantage. The only problem maybe dispute over preference of methods. 
Team 5. Khan, Fulgrim, Russ
This team probably works best with normal humans. I think this team doesnt really have any disadvantage but it doesn't have any great advantage that would increase their advantages with the other teams.


Worst Teams

Team 1. Night Haunter, Horus, Corax
Unselfish character along with Horus' personality. This force has both Gorilla warfare and direct and has good rhythm. The only problem is that Corax may have a problem with Night Haunter's tactics and that may cause future problems. So though Corax and Night Haunters tactics would work awesomely together Corax being the honorable man would ruin their form of fighting due to his disagreements.

Team 2. Sang, Angron, Lion
Of this team the only one who would cooperate smoothly with everyone else is Sang. Angron would charge into the melee by himself like a freak without anyone following him because he doesn't have any World Eaters just normal human beings. The Lion has a cold logic in terms of human life. I think he would use both Sang and Angron to get personal gain before letting either of them gain any of the glory.


Team 6. Magnus, Alpharius/Omegon, Lorgar
Lastly, this team has too many scheming bastards. If these primarchs weren't selfish, I would say this would be the best team as it has two daemon prince primarchs. However, Magnus doesn't really care for battle as he is trying to find the ultimate secrets. So he would be searching the whole planet during this was to find some crazy non-existant spell that would make him reign supreme. Alpharius likes to do things his way and doesn't really care about how his allies do things. Magnus and Logar having their own agenda would hate Alpharius for trying to sneak into their agendas. And since Magnus and Logar have more pride now that they are Daemon Princes they would probably kill him for his scheming. And Logar... this Daemon Prince cares too much about how his followers think about things. He would spend too much time making sure his army and followers worship chaos undivided. He might also do a little too much of weeding out much needed men and women for this war. Worst team if you ask me.


Further note: 100 posts!!!:drinks:


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## Lux (Apr 17, 2010)

You all know this is non daemon primarchs right?


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## High Marshall Mendark (Jan 25, 2009)

Haha, i just picked randomly, and it just so happened to be the team i would've voted for anyway! hahah Crazy!!!

Anyways, I voted for team 3:

Pro's:

Dorn: Master Of Defense, very patriotic (great for raising moral and troops), very loyal to his followers, brothers and cause that he is fighting for.

Perturabo: Master Of Siege Warfare, very cunning and quick to make decisions, but also level headed and down to terra (pun intended ) 

Gulliman: Master Tactician, very decisive, extremely doctrinated and bureaucratic (good for getting government and wealthy support, very important)

Cons:
Perturabo+Dorn have a nasty history
Dorn+Gulliman have different views on how things are done...a lot, but dorn, instead of fighting submits, the problem with this is that if gulliman gets blinded (not physically) somehow, dorn will have a fair bit of trouble on his hands
Dorn is too proud
Perturabo is very persistent, to the extreme
Gulliman is too orderly to think outside the box

Tactics:
Find local population, construct a base of operations, launch scouts and build up forces, organise an efficient production line, as territory is conquered, defences are erected until all are defeated, very strict screening processes and laws.


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## Words_of_Truth (Sep 20, 2007)

As I said I went for team three due to their superior tactics etc, but if it just came down to pure one on one combat I think team 1 would be the best.


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## Chompy Bits (Jun 13, 2010)

I still don't see why people think that team three would be so awesome. Sure they've got some good planners and army builders but the fact remains, Dorn and Perturabo hate each others' guts, so solid teamwork between them is extremely unlikely. Not to mention the fact that Guilliman will probably name anyone who disagrees with him or doesn't want to adhere to his plans a rebel and a heretic. Also, none of those three are noted as being any of the best fighters among the primarchs so when it comes to a primarch showdown I don't think it'll end well for them.


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## ckcrawford (Feb 4, 2009)

Chompy Bits said:


> I still don't see why people think that team three would be so awesome. Sure they've got some good planners and army builders but the fact remains, Dorn and Perturabo hate each others' guts, so solid teamwork between them is extremely unlikely. Not to mention the fact that Guilliman will probably name anyone who disagrees with him or doesn't want to adhere to his plans a rebel and a heretic. Also, none of those three are noted as being any of the best fighters among the primarchs so when it comes to a primarch showdown I don't think it'll end well for them.


Its not a primarch one on one duel though. This scenario is basically who would be able to use the planets people and sources better in a battle.

Dorn doesn't hate Perturabo pre-heresy. When listening to the audio _The Lightning Tower_, Dorn states that his rivalry with Perturabo as being "comical." It is probable that Dorn was oblivious to Perturabo's growing despair. The two don't hate each other guts, though Perturabo probably is jealous over Dorn's favor to the Emperor. And though Perturabo's distance with his brothers, the Iron Warriors have been known to fight as ally the most unlikely legions; Warhounds (World Eaters), Thousand Sons, Space Wolves, White Scars, and Word Bearers and been highly regarded despite unease of their cold logic and methods.


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## Chompy Bits (Jun 13, 2010)

ckcrawford said:


> Its not a primarch one on one duel though. This scenario is basically who would be able to use the planets people and sources better in a battle.





> Each team is striving to be the last team standing, while all other teams are eliminated. Each team is aware all 18 primarchs are involved but nothing else.


Well, considering that each team's aim is to be the sole survivors I would say that at some point they will have to face off against each other, coz' I really can't see some vanilla humans doing the job.



ckcrawford said:


> Dorn doesn't hate Perturabo pre-heresy. When listening to the audio _The Lightning Tower_, Dorn states that his rivalry with Perturabo as being "comical." It is probable that Dorn was oblivious to Perturabo's growing despair.


Dorn seems to have been oblivious to a lot of things.


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## Words_of_Truth (Sep 20, 2007)

Chompy Bits said:


> Well, considering that each team's aim is to be the sole survivors I would say that at some point they will have to face off against each other, coz' I really can't see some vanilla humans doing the job.
> 
> 
> 
> Dorn seems to have been oblivious to a lot of things.


Not really, Lightning Tower provides a great deal of insight into what he thinks about, which is basically everything.


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## ckcrawford (Feb 4, 2009)

Chompy Bits said:


> Well, considering that each team's aim is to be the sole survivors I would say that at some point they will have to face off against each other, coz' I really can't see some vanilla humans doing the job.


Possibly. But I think it would be concerning the more close combat type primarchs. And again it also depends. Primarchs can get killed by inferior beings depending on the circumstances. Now of course if you got a scenario where a normal human being is charging at a primarch with a pitch fork than obviously unlikely. 
Considering that Perturabo has the most technological intellect from almost all humans including the primarchs, I would say that the weapons and material that would be within team 3's ranks would be far superior to the other teams.


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## Lux (Apr 17, 2010)

Primarch versus primarch should be taken into consideration...

For though team dorn/gul/pert would likely choose to utilizie the planets people and resources, other teams would likely be more like to go for direct combat and use their own powers and skills more directly...such as team 3.

Also keep in mind that team one, and team six would be devastating against team the favored team right now, due to that they specialize in assassination, guerilla warfare, and most importantly disruptive tactics and civil uprising (corax, haunnter, alpharius)


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## gen.ahab (Dec 22, 2009)

Team one wouldn't be able to even function properly... Tbh, few teams would.


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## Baron Spikey (Mar 26, 2008)

Aye in Team 1 you've managed to put Corax with the only Primarch he refused to work with, even came close to brawling with- Horus.

I'll have to go with Team 3 as well, Perturabo's intellect was almost unmatched, Dorn shared his abilities in siege craft, and Guilliman was the ultimate strategic master and organiser.


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## gen.ahab (Dec 22, 2009)

Tbh, I would switch out Horus for grumpy gills and put in with dorn and smurfy and put the lion in with Russ. Some of thes teams just need some tweaking.


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## gothik (May 29, 2010)

D-A-C said:


> You know most people haven't read _First Heretic _and some (like me) haven't read the excerpt and so what both of you have just said could be interpreted as slight spoilers. If the two of you are making any more references maybe consider adding a small spolier warning. Thanks.


yeah just started it so it would be good to do that


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## Lux (Apr 17, 2010)

I figured team one would work well, with Corax, haunter, and Horus working together out of survival and neccesity rather then want. I theorized Corax and Haunter together would be an amazing pair of assassins, and for causing internal conflict and strife among the other primarchs infrastructure they create. Horus has a deep understanding of psychology, as well as being a good tactician, and fighter. I figured these three in combination would be able to clinch a victory under the right circumstances...as for corax and horus I figure they could put their differences aside for survivals sake.


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## MuSigma (Jul 8, 2010)

Team 6 surely 
Magnus could take out all eleven other primarchs single handed and the Emperor with two hands, then destroy the whole planet and its population, and maybe need a rest after.

Surely you can see that = its the only sensible solution.


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## gen.ahab (Dec 22, 2009)

Lux said:


> I figured team one would work well, with Corax, haunter, and Horus working together out of survival and neccesity rather then want. I theorized Corax and Haunter together would be an amazing pair of assassins, and for causing internal conflict and strife among the other primarchs infrastructure they create. Horus has a deep understanding of psychology, as well as being a good tactician, and fighter. I figured these three in combination would be able to clinch a victory under the right circumstances...as for corax and horus I figure they could put their differences aside for survivals sake.


It would simply have dreadful sinergy. It wouldn't work. Haunter would do some truely horrible things that not even Horus could overlook and Corax hated Horus beyond any other. Simple want for survival is not an adiquat replacement for true teamwork. They would fail.... As would team 3. Grumpy gills would hate being forced to work with Dorn, it would be easy to force a wedge in the team break it appart. The lion might be a weak link in team 2 and the alpha twins in team 6.


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## Chompy Bits (Jun 13, 2010)

MuSigma said:


> Team 6 surely
> Magnus could take out all eleven other primarchs single handed and the Emperor with two hands, then destroy the whole planet and its population, and maybe need a rest after.
> 
> Surely you can see that = its the only sensible solution.


If you're being sarcastic, LOL. If you're not, then just no. Granted, Magnus would be a match for if not superior to any of the other primarchs when it comes to a one-on-one, no holds barred duel (I did vote for team six after all) but there is NO WAY IN HELL he'd ever be a match for the Emperor in his pre-heresy form (even his daemon form probably wouldn't be up to it). We saw in _A Thousand Sons_ that at Nikea that even mere mental scrutiny from the Big E made Mags look like he was about to shit himself.


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## TRU3 CHAOS (May 21, 2010)

gen.ahab said:


> Tbh, I would switch out Horus for grumpy gills and put in with dorn and smurfy and put the lion in with Russ. Some of thes teams just need some tweaking.


I think that would work well in another thread. This is interesting. But to be honest, I would have done the opposite and made the worst teams in this one. Most of these teams aren't very well, but I think its actually an interesting thing to think about how these primarchs would have worked with others during the Great Crusade.



gen.ahab said:


> As would team 3. Grumpy gills would hate being forced to work with Dorn.


I think your thinking more post heresy in terms of the codex and Dorn's rage. Before the heresy I think Dorn looks to be a cooperative and calm guy. I actually disagree with the idea that Perturabo would be grumpy with the team as someone else mentioned early in this thread. If we are talking pre heresy Perturabo took a lot of shit to bear on his legion and himself. In a more disrespectful outlook to Perturabo, I think he could be the most cooperative in the team.



Chompy Bits said:


> If you're being sarcastic, LOL. If you're not, then just no. Granted, Magnus would be a match for if not superior to any of the other primarchs when it comes to a one-on-one, no holds barred duel (I did vote for team six after all) but there is NO WAY IN HELL he'd ever be a match for the Emperor in his pre-heresy form (even his daemon form probably wouldn't be up to it). We saw in _A Thousand Sons_ that at Nikea that even mere mental scrutiny from the Big E made Mags look like he was about to shit himself.


Well thats an interesting discussion on its own. Its also hinted in Thousand Sons that the Chaos gods helped in the creation of the primarchs. The only way I can think of them helping is by using warped energies. So in a sense I think all the primarchs have a psychic immunity to some level. I think its redicolous to think Magnus could obliterate the other primarchs.


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## Words_of_Truth (Sep 20, 2007)

Perturabo would just be happy with being involved lol


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## Chompy Bits (Jun 13, 2010)

TRU3 CHAOS said:


> I think its redicolous to think Magnus could obliterate the other primarchs.


Who ever used the word 'obliterate'? I simply said I think he could beat them. Remember, psychic resistance doesn't count for shit if someone rips open the ground beneath you or turns the armour you're wearing into acid. All Magnus has to do is use his abilities cleverly and not target the other primarchs directly, and again, that's only if they have any psychic resistance, which other than Russ, has never been confirmed.


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## gen.ahab (Dec 22, 2009)

We already know he can't beat one of the primarchs. 

Grumpy gills is simple so because he is always grumpy. He always hated Dorn.


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## Chompy Bits (Jun 13, 2010)

gen.ahab said:


> We already know he can't beat one of the primarchs.


If that's a reference to Mags & Russ, then it's debatable. Like I've said numerous times before, Magnus could've won but he didn't coz' he fought stupidly. Shit, telekinetically flinging Space Wolves at Russ would've been a better strategy than what Magnus was pulling.


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## gen.ahab (Dec 22, 2009)

There wasn't any other way to fight him. He had no room to move and Russ wasn't just going to sit there and let him take pot shots at him. Hell, Magnus has lost to marines. He ain't all that scary.


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## gothik (May 29, 2010)

i dunno i got the impression he let it happen, he let russ win cause he felt so bad for what he percieved as his sins and the way i see it, it wouldn't have mattered what he did russ was determined to see the TS wiped out


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## Chompy Bits (Jun 13, 2010)

gen.ahab said:


> There wasn't any other way to fight him. He had no room to move and Russ wasn't just going to sit there and let him take pot shots at him. Hell, Magnus has lost to marines. He ain't all that scary.


I think we're just gonna have to agree to disagree on the Russ vs Magnus thing because neither of us is gonna change each other's mind. As for the marines beating him, when did that happen? As I recall Ironhelm was the one who died while Magnus got wounded when they faced off and when Ragnar faced him the ritual for his manifestation was incomplete plus Ragnar was using the weapon of a primarch to do the job (plus, it wasn't even a real fight, anyone can throw a spear into a portal). So, unless there are other examples of marines beating him that I'm unaware of (and please, correct me if there are) saying Magnus losses to marines simply isn't true.


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## gen.ahab (Dec 22, 2009)

I consider it a moral victory for the marine. He severly wounded him... For a marine I consider that a win. This was the wolf lord.


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## Chompy Bits (Jun 13, 2010)

gen.ahab said:


> I consider it a moral victory for the marine. He severly wounded him... For a marine I consider that a win. This was the wolf lord.


Then we must yet again agree to disagree because I consider any loss just that, a loss. If a marine fights an avatar of khaine and manages to blow of one of its legs before dying does that make him the winner. No it doesn't. Also, I don't take 'moral victories' into account because otherwise you might as well say that Kurze won after he let his head get lobbed off by an assassin, which clearly wasn't the case (I mean, just look how fucked the Night Lords are now).


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## gen.ahab (Dec 22, 2009)

Its really more of a victory because he accomplished his goal. I very much doubt his goal was to kill the primarch. Never the less, it diminshes the threat level I would put him at.


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## ckcrawford (Feb 4, 2009)

Chompy Bits said:


> Who ever used the word 'obliterate'? I simply said I think he could beat them. Remember, psychic resistance doesn't count for shit if someone rips open the ground beneath you or turns the armour you're wearing into acid. All Magnus has to do is use his abilities cleverly and not target the other primarchs directly, and again, that's only if they have any psychic resistance, which other than Russ, has never been confirmed.


Its not confirmed if Magnus has enough power to destroy a product created by two of the most powerful identities of the Galaxy; both the Emperor and the Chaos Gods. 

I imagine the other primarchs do have some sort of psychic resistant if they were created by the warp and emperor. This would mean something even if they wore power armor because the power armor acts like a skin to its wearer. Much like librarians using their powers, their armor doesn't melt. 

Fluff wise, I have to be fair and say that Magnus has not been considered a fighter. Corax's account along with he account in which the primarchs were battling and only 3 were able to beat Horus, there is not even mention of Magnus.


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## Lux (Apr 17, 2010)

From horus's perspective, three primarchs beat him in combat, sang, russ, and the third I don't recall. However I do know that the third was not angron, or magnus. I think it was either corax, or some other primarch I didn't expect, so from horus pov...
1. Russ
2. Sang
3. Primarch whose name I don't remember, maybe corax (was not angron)
4. Horus
Note - horus comments that besides those 3 primarchs who beat him in combat, kurze is an unknown to him as he states he is the soleprimarch he never trained or fought.

From corax's perspective, he said he was one of the best fighters, but in combat angron would kill him. He then added that the only one he believed could soundly beat angron was horus and maybe sang. So from corax pov...
1. Horus
2. Angron
3. Corax/sang

Dorn had his own rankings too, he viewed himself superior in combat to horus and all other primarchs except for kurze.
1. Kurze
2. Dorn
3. Horus


So each primarch had their own opinion on who the best fighters are .


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