# Ultramarines & the Primarch's Curse



## Protoss119 (Aug 8, 2010)

Spoilers ahead!

I was reading over the Deathwatch rulebook last night and I found something about the Primarch's Curse and how it manifested in each chapter with Insanity points. For the Ultramarines, it was their pride in their Chapter being the pinnacle of the Codex Astartes taken to an extreme, to the point where it can blind them to reality, make them arrogant, etc. given a sufficient amount of Insanity points. Roughly paraphrased:

The first rank had the Ultramarine volunteer his kill-team for the most dangerous missions and try to get them into the thickest of fighting. It also stated that because the Ultramarines consider themselves the favored sons of the Emperor, it can lead them to consider others incapable of completing missions that should by rights fall to the Ultramarines.

The second rank made the Ultramarine unable to benefit from Squad Mode actions initiated by non-Codex marines in the kill-team; that is, Black Templars and Space Wolves. Being trained to follow the Codex Astartes to the letter, an Ultramarine can become distrustful of those who do not adhere to the Codex.

The third rank reduced the kill-team's Cohesion by 2 unless the Ultramarine in question or another Ultramarine was chosen as its leader. It goes on to state that though the Ultramarines are excellent battlefield commanders and natural leaders, their pride and training can lead to their scorning or disregarding the leadership of those from other Chapters or Imperial forces.

I found this interesting because it's the first time a flaw has been acknowledged in the Ultramarines' character, outside of the _Ultramarines_ novels by Graham McNeil, that hinders the Imperium in its own way, just like the Black Templars' intolerance of psykers can harm the Imperium in its own way. Either way, it's certainly a break from the "perfect" depiction of the Ultras as seen in the 5E Space Marines Codex.

I know ol' Papa Smurf banished Uriel Ventris to the Eye of Terror for breaking from the Codex Astartes, and I heard somewhere - I forget where - that Cato Sicarius was a pretty smug bastard in the _Ultramarines_ novels; is that true? I know it's all Insanity points and such, but to what extent do these character flaws present or could present themselves within the Ultras, in the novels or otherwise?

For example, Calgar is stated to be a proud man in the 5E Codex, and his pride has earned him many enemies, but he does not allow his pride to descend into arrogance. But it still stands that he's the one leading the Ultras, and his aforementioned banishment of Ventris...I'm not saying Calgar is bonkers, but it's something to consider.

Let me know what you think!


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## Gree (Jun 13, 2010)

The whole thing for pride as the Ultramarines weakeness is weird when in the same sourcebook it states that the Ultramarines gain bonuses because they are such good leaders and that they are good at mediating between Chapters and leading squads.

I mean, look at how they are earlier described in the book.

Deathwatch pg. 14



> "The Ultramarines are rightly held as exemplars of all that a Space Marine can and should be. They are noble and virtuous, self-sacrificing and stoic, and truthful and just in thought and deed. Unlike the Battle-Brothers of some other Chapters, they are not arrogant in their dealings with the common man, and have served and died alongside warriors of every other military force in the Imperium.
> This attitude is instilled in the Ultramarines from a very young age, long before consideration is given to recruitment into the Chapter. The people of Macragge in particular, and of Ultramar as a whole, are raised in a culture of discipline and service."





> In all of their duties, from battle to study, the Ultramarines are thorough, analytical, and attentive to every detail. They are slow to anger and rarely make a rash decision. By constant recourse to the articles of faith enshrined within the Codex Astartes, the Ultramarines are able to face any eventuality with well-practised battle drills and established doctrine.
> In their dealings with Battle-Brothers from other Chapters, Ultramarines often fulfil the role of facilitator and peacemaker. While Battle Brothers of some Chapters display extremes of character, from hotheaded to taciturn, the Ultramarines are balanced in their approach, and often able to broker agreements between wildly differing points of view. This is evidenced in the fact that a high proportion of Deathwatch leaders are drawn from the Ultramarines and their successors, a fact that has more to do with their outlook and character than it does with their numerical superiority.


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## Protoss119 (Aug 8, 2010)

I noticed that too, and it does seem weird to me that they're described as noble and good on one page and arrogant and even elitist on the other.

But if devotion to the Codex Astartes had both a positive and a negative end, then their pride would be the negative end, I believe. It's the same way with the other chapters described in the rulebook. Dark Angels are absolutely unyielding in combat but are distrusting and even paranoid towards outsiders; Black Templars are incredibly zealous and relentless but also intolerant of psykers; and of course the Blood Angels have their Black Rage. There's a good and a bad side to every chapter's ideology and demeanor listed in the rulebook; how much one falls towards the bad side is reflected in the insanity system.

But my understanding of the Deathwatch game itself is rudimentary, if even that, so feel free to correct me.


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## CJay (Aug 25, 2010)

Calgar in the UM book isn't really depicted as arrogant at all really, he is almost fatherly, if you will. Sicarius though is definitely seen as an arrogant jerk. Even the UM book kind of goes over the impracticality of following the Codex to its extremes.


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## BrotherArcadius (Jan 3, 2011)

Calgar did banish Ventris, for leading a Deathwatch team on Tarsis Ultra to attack a Nid hive ship, and this was against the codex that states every smurf has to stick with his smurf buddies, especially the captain smurfs, or they don't get a round with smurffete. Or some such bs. The point is, the Ultramarines view the codex like Christian's view the bible, it was written by their "father" and is therefore the "ten commandments". Oh and Sicarius is a smug SoB, I'd give him 3 Insanity Points. He pretty much insults all non-codex chapters constantly, and I wanna put him in the same room as Russ and watch what happens.


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## Baron Spikey (Mar 26, 2008)

BrotherArcadius said:


> Calgar did banish Ventris, for leading a Deathwatch team on Tarsis Ultra to attack a Nid hive ship, and this was against the codex that states every smurf has to stick with his smurf buddies, especially the captain smurfs, or they don't get a round with smurffete. Or some such bs. The point is, the Ultramarines view the codex like Christian's view the bible, it was written by their "father" and is therefore the "ten commandments". Oh and Sicarius is a smug SoB, I'd give him 3 Insanity Points. He pretty much insults all non-codex chapters constantly, and I wanna put him in the same room as Russ and watch what happens.


Except the Ultramarines have added stuff to the Codex over the millennia...oh right just like the Bible then.


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## Luisjoey (Dec 3, 2010)

Perfection obsession is a terrible flaw! 

ultrasmurf are wacco about the codex astartes, if you get a little of the codex there should be trouble. 

they are square minded! that´s their doom


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## Gree (Jun 13, 2010)

BrotherArcadius said:


> Calgar did banish Ventris, for leading a Deathwatch team on Tarsis Ultra to attack a Nid hive ship, and this was against the codex that states every smurf has to stick with his smurf buddies, especially the captain smurfs, or they don't get a round with smurffete. Or some such bs. .


And that makes sense. A commander's place is commanding his men. He could have easily sent Learchus and a squad of Ultramarines to support the Deathwatch.

Uriel himself even admits he's wrong.



BrotherArcadius said:


> The point is, the Ultramarines view the codex like Christian's view the bible, it was written by their "father" and is therefore the "ten commandments".


Actually not quite. The codex has been modifed and added to over the centuries.



BrotherArcadius said:


> Oh and Sicarius is a smug SoB, I'd give him 3 Insanity Points. He pretty much insults all non-codex chapters constantly, and I wanna put him in the same room as Russ and watch what happens.


Actually I don't think Sicarius has ever even commented on non-Codex chapters that much. He's arrogant, but focused on his duty, or at least that's what I've read in Assault on Black Reach and Chapter's Due.


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## TheSpore (Oct 15, 2009)

Well the ultramarines are just like the military in real life they think that the answer to each situation in a written instruction on how to handle it.(kinda like the rule book) Uriel did what few would do which is solve the problem in a non codex way to get the job done. he thought outside the box because not every situation can be solved from written instructions.

I would hate being an Ultramarine tring memorize the rules and regulations of the chapter... I would prolly say fuck it and join the closest chaos warband...


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