# Fusion Blaster Vs Railgun



## anarchyfever (May 24, 2008)

I've been writing a few lists for my Tau at 1000pts for boards of 4x4 and 4x6. My current want is to make a list capable of about 3 troops in warfish for horde with Fireknifes to help against elites. 

The problem I keep hitting is the useability of the Railgun and the amount of points it takes in a list. Their are 2 types of Railgun you can take, the TL Broadside and the single shot Hammerhead. 

The main problem I have with these two is that the Broadside is easy to outflank and outrun while the Hammerhead can be very hit and miss with the damage chart.

My current thinking is to take a XV8 or 2 with a TL Fustion Blaster and Targetting array and deep strike it with Pathfinder support hitting the back of tanks instead. 

My reasoning for this is first the cheapness of the unit being about 50-60 pts which is already cheaper than and broadside and second has the ability to jump out of the way and move as fast as the tank for about 60% of the cost.

Anyway I would like to hear about your thoughts on this,

with the new trend of deepstriking units which pretty much hit center (Space Marines, Imperial Guard, Deamons etc) Railguns to me look a bit delicate when they can't look after themselfs. and thats not to count the terrian which can get in the way giving z target a cover save as good as yours


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## Bogg (Mar 2, 2008)

I always field a lone TL Fusion Kamikaze deepstriking Bravado, but only if I got that commander upgrade, which allows 1 reserve at 2+ , otherwise its a bit risky when he will show up. But having a Broadside with teamleader upgrade, HW drone controller,2 Shield drones and adv.stab "thing" is a good option too. You can always evacuate him in a fish ,since he is afterall Basic Infantry.....


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## Winterous (Mar 30, 2009)

Bogg said:


> I always field a lone TL Fusion Kamikaze deepstriking Bravado, but only if I got that commander upgrade, which allows 1 reserve at 2+ , otherwise its a bit risky when he will show up. But having a Broadside with teamleader upgrade, HW drone controller,2 Shield drones and adv.stab "thing" is a good option too. You can always evacuate him in a fish ,since he is afterall Basic Infantry.....


The Marker Drones for a Broadside unit CANNOT fire on the move.
All wargear drones adopt the unit type of their owner, and since the Broadside unit type is Infantry, they don't get Relentless, meaning they have to be still to fire.
So taking Advanced Stabilisers on a Broadside with Marker Drones is a waste of points.


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## Underground Heretic (Aug 9, 2008)

anarchy, both of you options are good. I've attempted to use two deep striking duos with tl-fb and ta, but to little effect. I generally play against marines, so that does color my opinion.

I propose that your best overall choice is a Railhead because it is your only unit able to bring down a Land Raider and deal very effectively with infantry. A fb team or monat will have a better chance of destroying the target, yes, but is generally assured to die in the next shooting or assault phase. You will gain a tactical advantage if you destroy your target, but will trade kill points. Broadsides are imo the most dependable vehicle killers because of their twin linking, but they rely on their smart missiles to kill anything else if the enemy's armor is gone. Railheads can lay down submunitions after all enemy armor is down, and against some armies it may be better to lay submunitions down the entire game.

Bogg: not a bad idea about evacuating the broadsides, except the devilfish states "It may not carry any troops in XV battlesuits." C:TE p. 36

Winterous: I don't know where you got the issue of markerlight drones from, but you are correct in saying they are not worth taking. The ASS's S&P bonus does not confer to the markerlight drones allowing them to remain infantry with heavy weapons. Also, broadsides should be a bullet magnet and shield drones are a better purchase for the same price as one ML drone.


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## maniclurker (Jun 12, 2008)

Broadsides... they look cooler (if you can describe anything Tau as cool) than the hammerhead.


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## Galahad (Dec 21, 2006)

remember, tau don't have great leadership, and even shield drones provoke morale tests when you lose them. A solo broadside with a pair of drones has to roll for moralle when the first one goes down, and if he loses them both he cannot regroup if he ends up falling back. Never put drone son a solo battlesuit, ever

When I do broadsides I do three in a group with ASS, and a hard-wired Target-Lock for the leader (so I can have him hit another target if need be)

Anything less than that and they'll just end up getting wiped out or risk breaking too easily

As for the fusion blaster: Fuck it.
They're good on piranhas, that's it. Everything else, stick to ranged.

Helios battlesuit (missiles and plasma) or Deathrain (TL missiles) are probably the best crisis configuration to go with. they;re versatile and can keep out of the wya of enemy fire.

Fusion on stealths is a total waste since the other suits will be wasting their insane anti-troop firepower whith their leader hunting tanks, meanwhipe a melta shot is overkill on one model when the others are husing down infantry by the pantload. And when stealth filed works better at a range, running up close is just a terrific waste. I like to give a pair of gun drones to each stealth suit. They add a lot of anti-infantry firepower for the points, precious extra wounds, and they can benefit from the stealth field and deep strike too. "Stealth Swarms" are a good way to wreak some havoc behind enemy lines if you don't mind spending the points (just watch out because they get pricey if you go full on)


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## Crimzzen (Jul 9, 2008)

Bogg said:


> I always field a lone TL Fusion Kamikaze deepstriking Bravado, but only if I got that commander upgrade, which allows 1 reserve at 2+ , otherwise its a bit risky when he will show up.



This is a good option, I would usually bring 1 suicide suit with fusion flaster and the HQ upgrade that brings reserves in on a 2+.

For me personally, hammerheads are a MUCH better choice than the broadsides.

Being able to move 12" and still fire that big gun, or 6 and fire both (multitracker) provides tau with much needed speed. Plus, the two round types on the hammerhead mean that your never shooting a railgun at a single ork model (switch to blast mode).

On top of all that, your vehicle has a 4+ cover save with 12 front armour - talk about tough.

Personally, I like fielding just hammerheads and devilfishes coupled with kamikaze suits (fusion guns). That much denial seems to be a great way to make Tau effective.


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## Winterous (Mar 30, 2009)

Underground Heretic said:


> Winterous: I don't know where you got the issue of markerlight drones from, but you are correct in saying they are not worth taking. The ASS's S&P bonus does not confer to the markerlight drones allowing them to remain infantry with heavy weapons. Also, broadsides should be a bullet magnet and shield drones are a better purchase for the same price as one ML drone.


Someone mentioned taking them together.
Interestingly enough, in the recently released Tau tactica on the GW site, it actually suggested that taking a Marker Drone in a Fire Warrior unit was great.
Moving them 12" in your Devilfish, dismounting, marking them with said Drone, and then letting loose.

I've emailed them telling them that it's illegal to do that, but have received no reply.


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## Galahad (Dec 21, 2006)

I remember they did a tau tactica back in 4th where they suggested using an unused devilfish to pick up sniper drone teams and move them around...back before you could use dedicated transports for units other than the ones they were bought for.

I always love when GW forgets their own rules.
This is why I roll my eyes when someone tries to setting a rules debate with "Well, I talked to a GW rep and they said..."


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## MaidenManiac (Oct 2, 2008)

Galahad said:


> A solo broadside with a pair of drones has to roll for moralle when the first one goes down, and if he loses them both he cannot regroup if he ends up falling back. Never put drone son a solo battlesuit, ever...


Not true:


> Drones under the command of a drone controller are counted when assessing if the unit they are with should take a Morale check for having taken 25% casulties. They are similarly counted when determining if the unit is strong enough to claim an objective(moot in 5th). If the unit suffers losses, drones are counted when determining if it is below 50% for victory point purposes.


Losing drones wont affect your ability of rallying. This is even quite fluffy, the real soldiers naturally ignores losses of drones for regrouping purposes, they are after all just machines


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## Winterous (Mar 30, 2009)

MaidenManiac said:


> Losing drones wont affect your ability of rallying. This is even quite fluffy, the real soldiers naturally ignores losses of drones for regrouping purposes, they are after all just machines


Wait, what?
I don't understand, if the Drones ARE counted for half strength, then how does that NOT affect your ability to regroup?
They are counted for taking a Morale check (makes sense, heavy fire is heavy fire whether you get hit or not)
Sure, it's an increase in unit size, but they still do have an effect.


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## Someguy (Nov 19, 2007)

MM's quote doesn't mention rallying at all. It could be taken to mean anything. In the past, GW have not included specific situations either because they didn't want them to be included in a rule or because they thought they were obviously included. This is why we have a rules section - for endlessly arguing over points that can never be resolved. Take this question there please, since it has nothing to do with either tactics or the relative strengths of railguns and fusion blasters.

Back to the OP. Hammerheads are excellent vehicles but work a lot better in numbers above 1. IF you just have 1 tank then it attracts too much enemy attention and never fires, but 2 can really start to make a difference, especially with devilfish and pirhanas to interfere.

On the subject of pirhanas, they are really quite serious vehicles and an excellent mount for a fusion blaster. You can make a pretty cool airborne tau army with pirhanas, a few squads of FWs in devilfish and some railheads. Looks either awesome, if you like Tau tanks, or crap, if you don't.


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## Galahad (Dec 21, 2006)

MaidenManiac said:


> Not true:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Says who?
That quote doesn't say a thing about them *not* counting towards rallying. In fact, if anything it supports the idea by underlining the fact that they're treated just like members of the squad.

And it's not more "fluffy" in context at all.
Remember, back in 4th you were also stuck with Last Man Standing if a solo suit lost its drone. So your guy freaks the fuck out when his drones die and starts running off because he's under such heavy fire...but he can ignore them and regroup because they're just machines and that somehow means he's not all alone under withering enemy fire?

They are models in your unit, they count for moralle and VP, just because it doesn't say they do count for regroup doesn't mean they don't.

Follow the normal procession of rules.
How many models in the unit? 3
How many are dead? 2
Under 50% Yes
Regroup? No

If you're going to be silly enough to give a solo suit Drones then give him a Bonding Knife at least so he can still be useful. He was obviously bonded with his old unit before becoming a monat and won't disgrace their memory by running away. There, super fluffy.


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## Winterous (Mar 30, 2009)

Or take an Ethereal so you just DON'T run away.


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## Joshau-k (Jan 31, 2009)

I don't see the problem with 1 drone on a monat,.


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## anarchyfever (May 24, 2008)

thanks a on for the feedback, I think i'll take a hammerhead+ and add a FB to my HQ and stealth team plus a single hellforge monat.

Now after I finshed my list I had 40pts left, enought to get another stealth suit and get that extra burst cannon, the second reason for this is that I have had great success with SS in destorying tanks, and I don't like the idea of only taking 2 tank killing weapons in a 1000pts list.

I took the single monat tank kill mainly for those "OMG your suit just landed right behind my line of sight tank and blew it up in one go" moments, also I'm still smarting from having my behind handed to me by a Ork looted tank, darn barrage(sp?) weapons. and I love the idea of a suit coming from the heavens and kill z tank, what I could do is give him a single gun drone so that he has a little more fire power.

That being said I like the idea of stealth drones, I could not take the extra stealth suit and take about 3 drones instead, leaving a drone for the monat or commander

That being said I only have 4 pathfinders, I could bolster their number to 5 so that 3 need to die for a Ld test, (my oppenent pulled this on me once, "lol don't need Lds test, 2 out of 5 is 20%", he was a jerk and I eat his liver anyway)

I can put a short version of my list down if ya want just so you can get a feel for how I work.

Thanks


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