# More grimdark than 40k ever could be - Sigur does the Thirty Years' War



## Sigur (Dec 9, 2010)

Hello people! I'm Sigur, I build/paint miniatures and for my latest project I decided to do something historical. When I started this project in May last year it was my first historical project done for myself exclusively (I'd done a bunch of commission projects for historicals before) and eversince then it's been kind of my own little pet project. 

*Introduction*

For the longest time I've had an interest in the *Thirty Years War (TYW)* mostly because of the kind of warfare of the period being in a transition phase from what most people would call medieval warfare with the classic swords, armoured knights, longbows and so on to the mass line battles of the Black Powder era with the musket or rifle having become the weapons to dominate the battlefields. Then, there is the scale and madness. Historians are known to call the war "the very first world war" or "one of Europe's history's grand tragedies". Over the course of a third of a century the territories which now are Germany, parts of Bohemia, parts of the Netherlands and some more were completely ravaged and bled out by mercenary armies and warbands either plundering and looting whatever they liked or being allowed to do just that by contract for their services.









_TYW order of battle in a nutshell_

It was the time of the great military entrepreneurs. Kings and Emperors wouldn't have standing armies but hired mercenary generals who brought ready-made armies with them already. This brings us to the next interesting thing: There was a handful of larger-than-life personalities, each of them with a huge reputation and dramatic stories. Wallenstein, Gustav(us) Adolph(us), Mansfeld, Tilly and so on.









Gustav II. Adolf, King of Sweden and "Lion of the North"

Today there are numerous accounts of horrible atrocities committed during the course of the war, mostly against civilians. Towards the end of the conflict whole of Germany was a battlefield and death was prevalent. In the end, no winner emerged but the Peace of Westphalia shaped the future of Europe for the centuries to come. The Thirty Years War is one of those historical events which show the utter destructiveness of prolonged war in which no quarter is given.

On the moral implications of historical wargaming I suggest looking into Episode 2 of the "A View from the Veranda" podcast in which two chaps who know what they're talking about discuss this very interesting topic.

As a wargaming period, the Thirty Years War is strangely underrepresented it seems. That's mostly because of the UK being so pivotal in Wargaming but never having been directly involved in the TYW. Instead, there was the English Civil War. Obviously a subject closer to UK rules and miniatures designers, outfits, tactics and equipment were very similar to what was going on on continental Europe, just on a smaller scale. The battles of the TYW had huge armies for the time which naturally requires lots of miniatures. The ECW gives a similar experience and tactical challenges but with fewer models required. However, as a period to wargame, I just find TYW more interesting and grand a spectacle.









_17th century wargamers officers_

What's next: The general fashion was big beards, even bigger hats and pretty glorious trousers. 



*So what am I going to do with it*

Last year Warlord Games, makers of fine 28mm plastic and metal miniatures, released a set of rules to cover the 16th and 17th century called Pike&Shotte (because pikes were important back then and shooty things were as well, see). Once the rules were released I got them. They are a variant on their prior release Black Powder, written by Rick Priestley, with some fundamental changes though. Both systems themselves are loosely based on Warmaster so it was going to be good. If you're interested in a review and the battle report of a tiny test game, look no further!










After long and tiresome consideration I decided that I wouldn't go with the very pretty and affordable 28mm plastics Warlord sell (if you're interested in what those look like exactly check out mrtn's plog on the same subject) but instead go with 10mm scale models. In my opinion this scale is better suited for the mass battle look I wanted to go for. Apart from that units in Pike&Shotte are potentially very mobile so I felt that going with 28mm my 6'x4' table would get a bit cramped.

Because there is no way in hell I'd find somebody else to play 10mm TYW with me I decided to do two armies. One of the practical things about the period is that there were no uniforms as such, equipment was essentially the same on all sides and whole regiments would change sides several times during the course of the war so if needed I could just turn the bunch into one big army. I wrote up two army lists (P&S is using a points system and army lists and all that familiar stuff), one for Catholics (Imperials) and one for Protestants (Swedes and Saxons).

Here are a few random shots of units I had in the works over the past 19 months:

Here are the two armies in August 2012. The Imperial-Catholics:









And the Protestants:










Some cuirassiers:


















Early group shots of a few bases with flags:









Swedish Yellow brigade:










On September 6th 2012 I did a little write-up on the Battle of Nördlingen which took place on September 6th 1634:











It was one of the most decisive battles of the "Swedish phase" of the war, ending in the first real defeat of the Swedish armies (now under Gustav Horn) and their German allies under Bernhard of Saxe-Weimar. Gustav and Bernhard had an ongoing rivalry for the high command of protestant troops in Germany.









_Bernhard of Saxe-Weimar_









_Gustaf Horn_


The Imperials were led by Ferdinand, king of Hungary (later emperor Ferdinand III.) and now commander in chief of imperial troops after Wallenstein's death in Febuary 1634 along with a spanish army led by his cousin cardinal infant Ferdinand of Spain. If you wanted to be someone (like emperor Ferdinand II.) in the holy roman empire of the Habsburgs you had to bring the right name I guess.









_Ferdinand of Hungary_









_Ferdinand of Spain_


Very much contrary to their protestant counterparts the imperialist-catholic and Spanish chief commanders were relatively inexperienced but had the numerical superiority on their side as well as fresh troops, especially in the form of Spanish and Italian regiments. The Swedish and German protestant troops were battle-hardened but weary after years of campaigning and despite a series of victories and being just about to enter imperial Habsburg "core lands" morale had started to dwindle after the loss of the beloved king Gustavus II. Adolf of Sweden. Apart from that the protestant commanders in chief were more rivals than brothers in arms and underestimated the numbers of the imperial catholic troops. In the Swedish-protestant side there were 16,300 foot, 9,300 horse and 54 cannon while the imperial catholics brought 20,000 foot, 13,000 horse and 32 cannon.

*Prelude to the Battle*
Seeing how protestant troops were threatening Bohemia, Ferdinand of Hungary decided to march into southern Germany to regain territory and to draw the enemy armies away from the core lands of the empire. Both sides knowing of the Spanish reinforcements en route the Swedish-German armies hurried to southern Germany to meet Ferdinand of Hungary's army in battle before they would unite with the Spanish army. However they are too slow and the two Ferdinands meet and prepare for battle.

The more seasoned commanders on the imperial side were at odds about their predictions of the outcome of the battle that was to come. They had numbers on their side but the protestant troops and commanders for the most part were much more experienced from previous battles. On the other hand the Habsburg side had the highly trained professional soldiers from Spain and Italian mercenaries on their sides now. Those units were trained to fight in the Old Tercio formations which were regarded as outdated for more than a decade.


*The Battle*
Spanish troops took the Albuch height on the 5th of September and built field fortifications after a small skirmish for the heights the night before. On the day of the main battle several things went just wrong for the protestants. First, chief commander Horn took a trip up a hill to get a better overview. One of his colonels viewed this as the sign for attack, charged his cavalry into the imperialist lines and were destroyed. At the start of the battle, Swedish infantry charged up the Albuch height from two sides and drove the Spanish defenders out of their fortifications. The fact thatthe Swedish units met on the hill unexpectedly led to some confusion. Maybe in the course of these events, maybe it was a trap or just an accident, but several barrels of the black powder the Spanish had stored in their fortifications cought fire and exploded.










With the Swedish troops on the height disordered and bruised, the imperials started a cavalry counter-attack and drove them off the hill. The fortifications were immediately retaken by strong Spanish units with the orders to hold the Albuch to the death. With the commanders on both sides being aware or the tactical value of the Albuch height, Swedish commander Horn launched thirteen to fifteen attacks against the hill but all were repelled by the Spanish tercios. An attempted flank attack by Taupadel's cavalry against the imperial lines was fought off as well while imperial Croat light cavalry managed to outflank the protestant lines and attack their flank and baggage train.

Soon the protestant commanders, after several cases of bad luck or communication breakdowns and heavy losses at the Albuch had to realize that the battle was lost and that they had to command their troops to retreat during which Bernhard of Saxe-Weimar's horse was shot dead under him and a captain of Taupadel's cavalry had to leave his horse to Bernhard. Commander Horn, along with several other officers and 4,000 troops were captured and of the fleeling troops most were killed by pursuing Croats.









_Imperial troops charging down the Albuch (in the background you can see the three fortifications on the hill)_

*
Aftermath*

The Battle of Nördlingen was remarkable in several ways. First, it broke the common perception of the nigh-invincibility of the Swedish army and led to the repelling of protestant forces out of southern Germany and the imperials regaining the initiative in the war. The Treaty of Prague which was signed soon in 1635 lead to most German princes siding with the imperial cause (for now). The Swedish position of power in Germany was diminished. With the Habsburg empire seeming to grow stronger than before the situation finally pushed Cardinal Richelieu France to actively join the war on the side of the Swedes which would lead to the bloodiest phase of the 30 Years War.

The battle itself has some interesting thing to look at in regards to "fog of war", command and control and sheer bad luck. Apart from that, it's one of those battles in which the Spanish troops showed that the "old tercio", even though outdated, worked incredibly well in certain situations. I'm by no means a military historian but it was very interesting reading up on this battle which before I had dismissed as "not being as easily applicable to the tabletop as others". Inspires one to build some fortifications and such. 



For an EXCELLENT copper engraving print of the battle from 1670, have a look here: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/f1/Schlacht_Noerdlingen_Mattaeus_Merian.png

.,,


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## Sigur (Dec 9, 2010)

On we go with pictures!

Two light artillery pieces with limbers:









A unit of Pikemen from The Palatinate:


















First I mistook the flag for being Bavarian but was corrected so the unit quickly switched sides (as close as the colours were, the positions on religion and affairs of state couldn't have been more different when it comes to Bavaria and the Palatinate then).

Here's a unit of Gallas' Dragoons:










...and of course here they are dismounted:









Dragoons were a very modern thing then of course - basically infantry with horses for rapid redeployment, scouting, raiding and so on. Cheap, too. There are several accounts from the time which show what a weird concept they were to the more established "arms of service", especially to the cavalry.

Army shots from October 2012:

Imperials









Swedes and allies









Two medium artillery pieces:









The famous Swedish Blue Brigade:









Some Swedish light horse (Västgota regiment):


















Next I got cracking on some characters (which in Pike&Shotte are very important figures of course):

Let's start with the Swedes. Here's Count Ni(e)ls Brahe, commander of the Yellow Guards Brigade at Lützen:



















The fact that he actually wore a yellow-ish doublet at the battle is purely coincidential. Or the thing used to be white and turned yellow-ish over the centuries. (nowadays the doublet is kept at the Bielke Armoury in Sweden). He was only 28 when he was made general of infantry and commanded the first line four brigades at Lützen. Along with him on the base we got a drummer and a sergeant, both from the King's own lifeguard (as shown by the light grey uniforms).

Next up is King Gustav Adolf's third in command, the gloriously named Dodo von Innhausen und zu Knyphausen (Dodo of Innhausen and Knyphausen):



















At Lützen he was the commander of the infantry center's rear line and played a big part in keeping the army together and helping the Swedes and their allies to win the day after the Swedish king got killed in battle. At this point he already was about 50 years old which at that time was quite an age, especially for officers on campaign. He was probably the oldest and most experienced high ranking officer in Gustav Adolf's army and as such was a welcome counter-pole to the hot-headed young king and his second in command Bernhard von Sachsen-Weimar. Dodo, being of old north german nobility, is also notable for never having changed sides for the whole time of his service. Keep in mind that during that time, colonels were "war entrepeneurs" and many well known figures changed sides during the course of the war. Dodo was born a Protestant and stuck to his cause, even after it didn't really mean much any more. Being employed and well regarded (and most likely well paid) by the most important representative of that cause surely didn't hurt either of course. Dodo had witnessed the crushing defeats of the Protestant armies in earlier phases of the war and was more cautious about enganging the enemy in pitched battles but was known for being daring when it mattered. The model I painted up for him wears mostly blue and yellow. Blue was somewhat of a preferred colour to wear for Protestant forces in Germany and it's a remainder of his service for "Mad" Christian of Brunswick and others whose armies, at least in large portions, were issued blue or dark blue coats. The coat of arms of the Innhausen-Knyphausens is black and yellow so these colours also play a part in his outfit. Protestant armies generally made more use of uniforms than their adversaries so the two fellas he shares his base with, a sharpshooter and again a drummer, also wear blue coats (albeit of lesser quality of course). Note how Dodo studies a map whereas all the other officers either stand and look or charge into battle, showing his more cautious and reflected approach rather than charging head-long into battle.




Speaking of "the other side", here's the first of the commanders of the armies of the holy roman empire, the one and only Field Marshal Gottfried Heinrich Count of Pappenheim:


















Surely one of the most notorious commanders on the Imperial-Catholic side. Pappenheim, being dauntless in battle himself, using raiding tactics and operating behind enemy lines whilst often displaying a mind of his own which bordered insubordination, was the archetypical cavalry commander. At Lützen he basically did what the Prussians did at Waterloo except that he led his cuirassiers in a wild charge against the Swedish right flank as soon as he showed up on the battlefield, was killed and this way deprived the Imperial side of much of the momentum the arrival of his heavily armoured cavalrymen could have brought to his army's battle. Pappenheim was known to fight "with an open visor"which either meant that he fought without a helmet at all or with the helmet's visor open. This lead to several nicknames, all of which are variations of "scarface". Other than most commanders of the war, especially on the Imperial side, he wasn't an entrepeneur or manager of logistics and grand strategy but a soldier through and through. The miniature shows him as wearing a hat alongside with one of his cuirassiers (who are said to have worn these eastern-styled helmets rather than the more common German or Italian styles). He wears a big red scarf, the field sign of Wallenstein's troops at the time, along with other red and yellow details which are typical for Imperial troops. I tried to give him a colourful appearance to reflect how Imperial officers tended to look more gaudy than their Protestant counterparts.



Well, I have a rather big 40k project coming up and didn't really feel like starting on it tonight so, after uselessly wasting two hours on some computer game, I looked around on my desk, looking for stuff to finish. I found the casualty markers lying around which I based properly and basecoated and while that was drying I decided to do some more painting on that fourth officer. Things went pretty well, the miniature is finished and - well, say hello (and wave back to him if you want) to Bernhard, Duke of Saxe-Weimar:



















The Saxon state and army was Sweden's most important German ally and had fought for the Protestant cause Since the very start of the war (which had started in 1618, the Swedes didn't set foot on German soil until 1630). Other than many other later or temporary allies, Saxony-Anhalt joined forces with the Swedes as soon as they showed up on stage. Bernhard, born in 1604, had fought Imperial-Catholic armies since his 18th year, first under the command of Mansfeld, lateron under the Danish King and in the Netherlands where he fought the Spanish army and studied fortification and siege engineering. [very interesting conflict there too - the 80 years war between the Netherlands and Habsburg-Spain. The very uneven power level of opponents led to hardly any battles but lots of siege stuff and the Netherlands developing the first concepts of the professional officer rather than nobles putting on their commander's hat] 

Bernhard, a young and hot-headed commander, probably got along very well with the Swedish king Gustav II. Adolf and in his service quickly became the king's second in command at the age of 28. At Lützen, his first independant command, he led the left cavalry wing into battle (as by the Swedish combat doctrine, supported by units of "commanded" shot, independant musketeers who advanced along the horse to give supporting fire or cover retreats). After Gustav Adolf's death, he took over command and despite Dodo von Knyphausen's suggestions, decided not to retreat in an orderly fashion but to turn the moment of the Protestant cause's greatest loss into their greatest victory. Knyphausen, who wisely had kept the reserves outside of enemy cannon and well rested, managed to rally large parts of the retreating main battle line, Bernhard formed them into an attack force again and led the final assault against the Imperial lines.

In the combined Swedish-German Protestant army, Gustav Adolf was well regarded by both sides and respected as their commander. As victories piled up in 1631 and 1632 and the Swedish king got a bit foppish, Bernhard became an increasingly important leader figure at least for the German armies under Protestant command.


Technically, this guy should have been an Imperial commander so that I'd have an equal number of both. The problem is that the Imperial German armies had a big problem - lack of capable generals. Many of the Imperial officer corps was of Italian origin (and I plan to have a model for Piccolomini of course and possibly one for Grana) but the "big names" on the Protestant side are somewhat more appealing and easier to find information on so I went for Bernhard on this model. The raised hand makes him look really enthusiastic which fits Bernhard's character and youth. The cornet his staff officer is carrying shows a design based on one of the flags carried by Bernhard's "green" lifeguards regiment. The colours, green, yellow and black, are the ones of the traditional coat of arms of Saxony.


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## Sigur (Dec 9, 2010)

casualty markers!










Eight infantry, four cavalry, way too few for a full battle but enough for ...well, one larger mêlée?  The thing is that as the game goes on and units get damaged, they accumulate those casualtiy markers that count against their Stamina which is basically anything between 1 and 4 IIRC. However, it can easily happen that during a round of combat, a unit ends up with way more than what their stamina allows for. At the end of the combat, they have to roll on a sort of morale check table and deduct the total number of casualty markers. If they pass and stand, only retreat a little but stay in order etc, the number of counters is reduced to the maximum the unit can handle and ...oh well, what I mean to say is that I need a LOT more markers.

I modelled those myself and cast them up in resin.

Next I did two more imperial pike units (the one with the yellow flag possibly being Spanish):





















Straight back to characters because I had my first proper game of Pike&Shotte coming up and still didn't have enough battalion commanders:
Let me introduce to you, from left to right, Johann Ludwig Hektor Count of Isolani (sometimes Isolano), an unknown imperial commander (hence the full helmet) and Octavio Piccolomini, Duke of Amalfi.


















(I only from the picture noticed how Isolani and his lancer were leaning towards on side. They're bent to stand straight up now)










_Johann Ludwig Hektor Count of Isolani_

Isolani, originally of Cyprian nobility, served in the imperial army just like his father. After spending some years fighting the Ottomans in Croatia he was active during basically the whole length of the war up until the French phase and was present at all big battles during that time. He served unter Tilly first but only "made it big" under Wallenstein who appointed him commander of all Croat units which was more of a general term for light skirmisher cavalry, irregular at first, from south eastern Europe. Those formations for fierce horsemen who were feared for their savagery against the enemy, proved a very effective a weapon on and off the battlefield. As with almost all soldiers of the time, the acts of savagery were directed against the civilian population equally (at best) than against the enemy and the Croat horsemen were especially dreaded in this regard.

In military terms Isolani's Croats served important roles in the imperial army as flank guard on the march, as scouting parties, as a disruption to enemy maneuvers and as light cavalry - usually on the far right flank - in battle. They became such an integral part of imperial warfare that the French army lateron made Croat cavalry an instituion as well. They used to wear their scarves in a very particular fashion that was then uncommon to the French people but in the late 17th century made its way into everyday fashion. Wearing your neckerchief "á la Croate" turned into "cravate".










As you can see, the model I used looks very different to the other commanders to make sure Isolani would get recognized as the commander of the Croat horsemen quickly. He's accompanied by a lancer because, just like Wallenstein himself, Isolani had a lifeguard of lancers which was pretty uncommon at the time. The models are not converted apart from the fact that I had to cut off the big moustache on the model I used for Isolani. The fella didn't have a hair left on his body due to syphilis which went rampant through Europe at the time. Other than Pappenheim, Piccolomini and his other superiors, Isolani had no university education and by one source was described as an old, dim-witted man but that, if true, is probably the result of his sickness. He died in the winter of 1640 in Vienna, at the age of 54.















_
Octavio Piccolomini_

Piccolomini is one of the prime examples of the kind of career some people made during the 30 years' war. Like many of the multinational officers' corps of the imperial army, he was of Italian nobility who were held in high regard for their competency and education (other than Italian soldiers at the time). He participated in the war from beginning to end and made quite an impact. Starting out as Rittmeister in a cavalry regiment, he soon came under the command of Pappenheim and made Lt.Colonel in his cuirassier regiment. When Wallenstein was made high commander of the imperial army Piccolomini stepped up in rank once more and became commander of Wallenstein's Lifeguard, a close confidant and part-time diplomat of Wallenstein's. The fact that Piccolomini, a well-connected Italian nobleman helped of course. 









_The Piccolomini Coat of Arms_

At Lützen, Piccolomini took over command of the reinforcements directly after Pappenheim's death and kept the assaults up during which five horses were shot under him but Piccolomini was only lightly wounded during the course of the battle and took great part in making the battle only a slight victory for the Swedish army.

After Lützen Piccolomini continued performing well as a cavalry commander and ultimately was made general of the cavalry. When Wallenstein made plans of taking up secret, unsanctioned peace talks with the Swedes along with the swearing-in of soldiers and officers to himself rather than the emperor, especially the Italian and Spanish officers under his command regarded his actions as treason. Piccolomini, knowing that this would be rewarded greatly, was one of their leaders in siding with the emperor on this thing. They informed the emperor of Wallenstein's plans and were ordered to bring him to the emperor dead or alive. After the assassination of Wallenstein in early 1634, Piccolomini was awarded a large sum of gold, the order of the golden fleece and large portions of land in Bohemia which earlier belonged to the family of one of Wallenstein's closest allies who was also assassinated.









_Wallenstein's assassination in Eger 1634
_
Piccolomini took part in almost all successful actions of the imperial side for the rest of the war, from 1635 on he fought in the Spanish army against the French. In 1636 he led his army into northern France and threatened to take Paris, in 1639 he destroyed a French army in one of the last big battles of the war. He was made high commander of the imperial army for several years but quit after a series of defeats late in the war to serve the Spanish army again. In 1648 he returned to the Austrian side of the army as high commander and field marshall but there was hardly any army left to command. After the war he coordinated the demilitarization of the mercanaries, made some more career moves towards the top. He died in 1656 in Vienna.

Due to his leading role in the assassination of Wallenstein and his depiction in Schiller's work about the whole story Piccolomini is often viewed as a sinister character. Without a doubt he was one of the most capable imperial commanders of the war though, a clever politician and commissioned a fortune's worth of paintings which is a thing that I condone. 


Some in-between musketeers:


















...and another Protestant character:
Lt.Col. Hans Georg aus dem Winckel, by 1632 commander of the Blue Batalion (which of course is why he's got two guard musketeers to send forward to the front):




















He's not that much of a super-important historical figure but he was known to dress very well and for having a big moustache and chin beard and long hair which went a bit against the fashion of the time due to which with the time officers started to wear their hair longer and cut the beards smaller. Hans Georg decided to go with best of both worlds and have the long hair AND the big beard. Apart from that, he was a somewhat capable commander and kind of a drunkard, but that can be said for almost all of the commanders of that time (apart for Tilly probably. Maybe Wallenstein too.).









_Aus dem Winckel's Coat of Arms_

In between, I had a little solo game to get into the rules once more:









After that I was tied up with several other projects for the months to come but returned this fall with a unit of Hessians:










...and some fellas from Saxe-Anhalt:


















On top of all of this protestant goodness, I added another unit of Swedish light cavalry, the Upplands Regiment light cavalry:




















After that I had to get back to the Catholic side of things. With some Cossacks (no flag though, sorry):



















Okay, they may look a bit like gnome cavalry at this scale (and colour scheme) but they're seriously scary. I promise. :/


More characters!

*Heinrich Holk (1599-1633)*









_it's the guy in the left with the huge sword_

This guy was a child of his time so to speak. He started out on the protestant side in the Danish army (remember, Denmark was the big foreign protestant power in the war before they were forced to sue for peace and Sweden joined the fun in their place), moved up in the ranks and proved to be a competent commander, especially in organizing the defence of the city of Stralsund against Wallenstein's army. After Denmark and the empire had signed a peace treaty Holk switched sides and joined Wallenstein's army.









_There he is. You can see his left eye missing. That probably happened during battle with imperial troops in the late 1620s._

He got command of a regiment of cuirassiers. The "Holkschen Reiter" (Holk's Horsemen) and Holk himself quickly acquired a reputation of great cruelty in plundering and ravaging the lands, even by the standards of the time. Other sources say that all these stories are either exeggerated accounts or the doing of his superiors lateron. Wallenstein held Holk in high regards and he was one of the few who dared speak his voice against the generalissimus. By 1632 he had become Wallenstein's closest advisor and second in command at the battle of Lützen. This of course led to lots of bile between him and other envious generals which might be part of why Holk's always painted in quite grim colours. Between 1629 and 1632 his main job was to roam Saxony and lay devastation so keep the economy in shambles or show up whenever the Saxon army would attack imperial lands somewhere. He was also part of the force that sacked Magdeburg, both things surely not the tasks to do for a 'clean' reputation. 

At Lützen he commanded the left wing as a replacement until Pappenheim's corps would arrive. Seriously nasty reputation aside, he was an able and daring tactician and logician and kept the imperial army from suffering a bigger defeat on the day. He was spared all the trouble surrounding the conspiracy and murder of Wallenstein as Holk went sick with the plague in early 1633 while having started truce negotiations with Saxony. Because none of the Saxon representatives were willing to see him, talks were ended. On his way back Heinrich Holk died alone by the side of a road at age 34 as the coach driver had run off to fetch a priest.

Just today I realized the parallels between the biographies of so many of these officers and US gangster films.



*Ernst I. "the Pious", Duke of Saxe-Gotha (1601-1675)*










Ernst was Bernhard of Saxe-Weimar's brother and, as it seems, quite different to Heinrich above. Like most of his brothers and many other protestant nobles he was part of the Fruitbearing Society, a kind of mix of renaissance thinker's club and order of knights with the aim of furthering thinking, language and literature. Every member got a society addenum to their name. In Ernst's case it was "the Bittersweet". It's a really interesting thing with the societies of that time. Something between enlightened charity, ambitious furthering of humanism and a big boys club.









"Hi, I'm the bittersweet Ernest"

Like most of his brothers, Ernst served as an officer in the Swedish army. At the battle of Lützen he had command over the left wing's reserves. To be honest, I couldn't find much remarkable details about his performance on the day of the battle itself.

However, he really came into swing after the end of the war, bringing the dutchy of Saxe-Gotha up to snuff after having been ravaged by the war. He introduced efficient and hardly corrupt institutions and legal system, lowered taxes, brought the economy back on track and so on. All the good stuff. He even laid groundwork for some theorists lateron who based their idea of how a unified German nation should be run on Ernst's reign.


So this bumps the total number of battalion commanders up to five per side. At some point I'll have to look into making proper Wallenstein and Gustav Adolf figures too.


This is the current state of things. At the moment I'm working on getting some terrain done and do another army shot, all together for the extra impressive look.  Hope that you like the models so far and maybe it got you interested in this very interesting period.


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## iamtheeviltwin (Nov 12, 2012)

Awesome log. I got my gaming start with historicals and still have a fondness for them. I really like the look of the Warlord's mini lines and am posts like this are making me really take a long hard look at the rules as well.

I like the creating two armies approach. I think it would be easier to draw someone else into the game that way.

and it goes without saying, your painting is impeccable.


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## Khorne's Fist (Jul 18, 2008)

Damn, I'd love to get that level of detail on 28mm models, never mind 10mm. I find it difficult to give even my 15mm Flames of War stuff that kind of attention. Great work.


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## Tawa (Jan 10, 2010)

Christ on a unicycle! That's a great log so far Sigur!

Have a cookie! :so_happy:
Don't forget the so-called "English Phase" of the TYW, and of course there was always a ready supply of Scots willing to fight in Europe 


I've found a 15mm company that do "characters" for TYW/ECW. Such as "Musketeer with Chicken" :laugh: So I'll be picking up a few of their figures to mix in here and there when I get around to the English armies....


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## neferhet (Oct 24, 2012)

This is just great. Love the hystorical info and the painting. Also, the sheer amount of models you painted makes me doubt of your mental sanity. I like that. keep it coming , oh Great Master of Armymen!


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## humakt (Jan 2, 2008)

That is an amazingly painted army!

I have enjoyed reading this with all the history. Not a game style I have ever wanted to play, but does make me want to play epic again with the little 6mm marines.

Have a cookie!


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## Jacobite (Jan 26, 2007)

What an amazing start to the log, really one of the most well thought out and researched collections I've ever seen and to add onto that your painting is awesome, especially at such a small scale. Great work.


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## Ddraig Cymry (Dec 30, 2012)

I love military history, so seeing both that and very well painted models made my day  Is that freehand on the banners?


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## Sigur (Dec 9, 2010)

@iamtheeviltwin: Thanks very much. Warlord's models are mostly very nice. I'm still on the fence about their WW2 plastics and some of their metal models are kind of bad but they keep on buying other (very pretty) ranges. For Black Powder/Hail Caesar/Pike&Shotte I would advise against going 28mm scale on the models though. The game depict large battles and require (in my opinion) a lot of models to look well as well as a lot of space to work because units have the habit of moving rather fast. I'm a great fan of 10mm scale. If you're interested, just check Pendraken Miniatures or Old Glory. Makes the games look like proper battles. The two armies thing is handy indeed if you're not sure if people are going to play with you. My regular gaming buddy got a bunch of armies for several periods as well so everybody gets his turn to play a lot more than they have models for.
@Khorne's Fist: Thanks very much. 
@Tawa: Yay, cookie! Not really aware of the English phase of the TYW though.  Of course there were quite a few Scottish and Irish mercenaries around though. Oh yes, there are some great 15mm scale ranges around. At a local historical wargames show there was a great TYW demo game in 15mm with all kinds of small dioramas. You can do similar stuff in 10mm but it requires some sculpting/conversion. Very happy I got some 10mm scale sheep though. 
@neferhet: Thanks very much.  To be honest, I doubt my mental sanity myself. Painting a small scale army isn't a too grand task in itself. However, choosing a period which had no uniforms to speak of was a bit of a bad idea. 
@humakt: Cheers. Last year I also got meself the Tomorrow's War rulebook (SPLENDID RULES. I love them utterly.) and painted up a bunch of models from my Epic collection for solo gaming. Good stuff, I've really taken a liking to small scale stuff. Oh, and of course the whole thing developed into a small Epic:Armageddon Space Marines army as well.
@Jacobite: Many thanks. As I said, this is my own pet project and I put a lot of time into the research and finding out all kinds of fitting models from across the interweb. This is a thing I really love about historical wargaming: It basically changed my whole outlook on the hobby (which to me is quite a bit more than a hobby of course). At this point in time I'm way more sceptical about miniatures lines directly connected to a rules set and very much prefer getting models from diffferent manufacturers rather than from the people who sell the rules. I got to appreciate companies who sell rules rather than doing rulebooks to sell their miniatures lines because these rules sets have to be good on their own.
@Ddraig Cymry: Thanks very much. It is a rather fascinating period even though I really gotta take breakes from it every now and then because it's also such a barbaric and vile period of German/middle European history. Combine this with the scale and timeframe of the barbarism. It's really impossible for us to imagine what life must have been like back when. There are studies which analysed scources from after the war and they discovered that not only during but also for centuries after the war (which led to up to 50% and more of all people in large regions just having been killed) that the whole society's outlook on life and death and the "worth" and impact thereof had gotten very apathetic simply because of the horrors the past conflict had brought upon the lands. Anyway, as for the flags: Oh no, they're bought from Maverick Models. Outstanding service. After you order you can email the guy for custom resizing of each of the flags.


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## Tawa (Jan 10, 2010)

Sigur said:


> Yay, cookie! Not really aware of the English phase of the TYW though.  Of course there were quite a few Scottish and Irish mercenaries around though. Oh yes, there are some great 15mm scale ranges around. At a local historical wargames show there was a great TYW demo game in 15mm with all kinds of small dioramas. You can do similar stuff in 10mm but it requires some sculpting/conversion. Very happy I got some 10mm scale sheep though.


Here you go  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anglo-French_War_(1627-1629)

It was mostly a case of snotting the French Navy to be fair :laugh:


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## Sigur (Dec 9, 2010)

Interesting. No idea why it's considered to be part of the Thirty Years War really as neither France nor England were in the war then (at least not openly in the case of France) but oh well.  Thanks for sharing.


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## Tawa (Jan 10, 2010)

English ships were involved in the battle around Re Island (1625) and then the Duke of Buckingham initiated a landing on the island 1627 which kicked off the Anglo-French War


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## Sigur (Dec 9, 2010)

Hey fellas! Last night I had a smashing game of Pike&Shotte again. It's a bit problematic how I only get to play about once or twice a year so a lot of time was spent looking things up but the way movement works in P&S alone is saving so much time. The minis are all my armies, the setting as always is the Thirty Years War, Swedish phase, some time around 1631 close to Stade in Lower Saxony. Count von Tilly and his Catholic League troops had taken the city a few years prior off the Danish army. Now a Swedish army showed up to liberate the city for the Protestant cause. An Imperial-Catholic army was dispatched to drive the attackers off. 

The scenario was just a regular pitched battle so we'd get back into the rules. We diced off to see who would play which army. I got to play the Swedes, just like last time. It was basically a "put the models I have on the table and play". As luck would have it the armies I had more or less randomly painted up amount to roughly the same points costs according to the army lists in the P&S rulebook even!

Here are the army lists:

Imperial-Catholic Troops:

Heinrich Holk (General, Command Rating 8)


Ottavio Piccolomini (Command Rating 8)

1 unit of Pike
2 units of Musketeers
1 unit of Pike
2 units of Musketeers
1 unit of Swordsmen



Hans Heinrich IX. Freiherr von Reinach (Command Rating 8)

1 unit of Pike
2 units of Musketeers
1 unit of Pike
2 units of Musketeers



Count Johann Ludwig Hektor von Isolani (Command Rating 8)

1 unit of Croat light horse
1 unit of Cossacks light horse
1 unit of Dragoons



Count Gottfried Heinrich zu Pappenheim

3 units of Cuirassiers
1 unit of Arquebusiers



Swedish and Allied Army:

General Bernhard von Sachsen-Weimar (Command Rating 8)


Nils Brahe (Command Rating 9)

1 unit of Pike (Yellow Brigade, Elite, Guard)
2 units of Musketeers (Yellow Brigade, Elite, Guard)
1 unit of Commanded Shot (Yellow Brigade)
1 unit of Pike (German Veterans from the Palatinate)
2 units of Musketeers
1 unit of light gun



Hans Georg aus dem Winckel (Command Rating 9)

1 unit of Pike (Blue Brigade)
2 units of Musketeers (Blue Brigade)
1 unit of light gun
1 unit of medium gun



Ernst von Sachsen-Gotha (Command Rating 8)

1 unit of Pike (Saxon)
2 units of Musketeers (Saxon)
1 unit of Pike (Hesse-Kassel, counts as Saxon)
2 units of Musketeers (Hesse-Kassel, counts as Saxon)



Dodo zu Innhausen und Knyphausen (Command Rating 8)

1 unit of light horse (Uplands regiment)
1 unit of light horse (Västgöta regiment)



The Swedish Lines, centre and left flank. 








From bottom to top: In the very bottom left on the round base we got Nils Brahe, commandeering the Yellow Brigade, right above him the overall commander Bernhard von Sachsen-Weimar, atop and slightly ahead of them the Blue Brigade and some artillery under Hans Georg aus dem Winckel. In the very top (and rather blurry) it's Ernst von Sachsen-Gotha's Saxons and Hessians.









Swedish right flank - Dodo zu Innhausen und Knyphausen's light horse









Catholic left flank: Isolani's light horse









Illustrating the different strengths of cavalry. Cossacks and Croats are pretty bad news already but three regiments of Cuirassiers and a regiment of Arquebusiers are something else entirely. I guess I was a bit too enthusiastic with painting Catholic Cuirassiers. Maybe I should convert one of them to Protestantism. Or at least give them money so they fight for the Protestants.


















Freiherr von Reinach's Imperial-Catholic centre









This probably was the most bizarre scene of the game. A unit of Imperial Dragoons (infantry on horse, light harassing troops) had gotten off their horses, took a cosy position in a small patch of forest and about to start their their disruptive fire. When all of a sudden a command blunder happened and the brave fellas in their red jackets stormed out into the open and attacked the closest enemy unit in sight! The cannon's crew fought bravely and nobody quite came out on top. Eventually the Dragoons took a lot of casualties and were driven back into the forest but they had kept the artillery from firing for two turns and diverted a yellow guard pikes for a turn.

We had to cut the game short at some point (mostly because we spent a fair amount of time looking rules up. As I said, last game had been a year ago) but it was rather clear that things looked grim for the Swedes, mostly due to the massive cavalry superiority on the Imperial side. That's nothing bad per se because Imperial cavalry is more or less supposed to be but not to this degree I think. I really should get some Finnish Cavalry done and maybe some Cuirassiers or Arquebusiers too. And some Musketeers. And some Imperial pike and musketeers as well. 

Game was good though. The point was raised that the rules do basically what Impetus does but with some more detail. We decided to repeat the game with Full Impetus Baroque once it's out (supposedly at some point this year). It's cool seeing my little dudes all out on the table. Sorry about the bad pictures by the way. I had some problems with my flash for some reason.

Oh well, good times, hope to play again soon and I hope that you enjoyed the little report.


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## iamtheeviltwin (Nov 12, 2012)

Thanks for the battle report. Love this period and your minis look great.


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## neferhet (Oct 24, 2012)

Thanks for the report. The battlefield and the armyes are looking epic and inspiring!


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## Tawa (Jan 10, 2010)

Awesome stuff mate! :good:

Look forward to seeing more


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## Sigur (Dec 9, 2010)

@iamtheeviltwin: Thanks. 
@neferhet: Cheers, I really enjoy the sight of these armies on the table myself.
@Tawa: Thank you, I hope to add to the armies in the near future. The funny thing is that with the armies as they stand space is getting a bit tight on a 4' by 6' table already. However, I keep seeing these orders of battle of Lützen, Nördlingen and such in front of me any I want to see that on the table.  But then I guess that's wargaming for ya.


Inspired by the uneven situation of cavalry, I painted a first unit of Finnish cavalry:



















Hope that you like them. Finnish cavalry of course are one of those highly iconic formations of the conflict. Finnish cavalrymen first were established during the late 16th/early 17th century in Sweden's wars against the Poles and Russia. During the Thirty Years' War they went by various names based on their war cry _hakkaa päälle_ (meaning something like "hack them down")_. _The Hakkapeliitta, as the name was formalized later on existed on into the late 17th century and participated in all of Sweden's campaigns. From the founding of Finland as a country the memory of these cavalrymen have been conjoured to instill a sense of national pride or for propaganda reasons. 

In terms of warfare during the Thirty Years War the Finnish cavalry roughly were Sweden's equivalent to the light cavalry from Eastern Europe and the Balkans employed by the Empire. However, the constant lack of battle cavalry in the army along with Gustav Adolph's knack for aggressive tactics soon saw the Finnish cavalry not only filling the role of scouts and marauders but also a stand-in for the lack of heavy cavalry. The Finns are described by contemporary sources of both sides as rather shoddily equipped fellows on small, scruffy horses. However, Finnish troops especially weren't too highly regarded by the Swedes (and often used for especially dangerous missions or to lead attacks on which large losses were expected) and neither the Imperial-Catholic troops so these accounts might be exaggerated to an extent. Especially as it's known that Gustav Adolph put some effort in having the army he brought with him to Germany to make a good first impression for Sweden to be taken seriously as a major power in Europe (same reason you won't turn up to a wargaming event for the first time with unpainted minis). 

The equipment was rather mixed but the heaviest armour to be seen on a Finnish cavalryman would be plate on breast and back, maybe a helmet, but probably mostly hat and buff coat so I painted the models to wear a mix of all of this, some even just wearing a shirt. As by the standards of the time they were armed with sword and pistol(s). The latter was only to be shot by the first one or two ranks at close range right before the charge but preferably the shots were to be saved for close combat. It is possible that these troops used less pistols than their equivalents in the Swedish army or most other armies at the time.

So between the fact that they were often thrown into battle where it was the thickest, the fact that the were struggling with a language barrier due to not talking Swedish for the most part, not being highly regarded by their superiors but proving to be hardy fellas, some historians being amazingly favourable towards them and some funky stories about them riding into battle on reindeers and such the Hakkapeliitta, either by a natural prowess or by lack of any other choices, became an institution within the Swedish army of the time, fiercely attacking by Gustav Adolph's ideas of the head-on cavalry charge with sword in hand.

So yeah, another unit of cavalry added. Next on the list: Two more units of musketeers (Mercenaries, to be used by both sides) and after that a unit of Cuirassiers for the Swedes. Hope you like the models!


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## JAMOB (Dec 30, 2010)

Son of a nutcracker! Those are some nice looking models mate, and the number of them :shok: I might have to get into some historical gaming... Though I assure you that 40k _can_ be much more grimdark :victory:


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## Sigur (Dec 9, 2010)

@JAMOB: I got into historical wargaming almost two years ago and never looked back. Of course I play the occasional game of 40k but getting into historicals (and some smaller sci-fi games along with that) changed my whole outlook on wargaming. Got me back into gaming too. If you're interested in wargaming off the path of the big 'uns like GW, PPP, Battlefront and the like I strongly suggest giving the Meeples and Miniatures podcast a listen. This podcast is the main thing I blame for getting interested in miniature wargaming again (aside form painting) and enjoying it more than ever.


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## Old Man78 (Nov 3, 2011)

Great painting and history lessons to boot, +rep


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## Tawa (Jan 10, 2010)

Good stuff yet again! :good:

Any plans for doing Poles or Tatars etc? :wink:


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## Sigur (Dec 9, 2010)

@Oldman78: Thanks very much. 
@Tawa: Cheers. Nah, nothing Polish or more eastern planned as for now. For a while there were plans for some Vienna 1683 things which of course would include more Poles (and Ottomans of course!) but not sure if they will happen any time soon.


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## Tawa (Jan 10, 2010)

Fair play :good:


I may drift onto the Continent once I've got my ECW stuff done


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## Sigur (Dec 9, 2010)

@Tawa: Sounds cool. I mean most you have to do is change a few flags around (unless you painted all the guys to wear uniforms).


Last week my gaming nemesis and I had another go at Pike&Shotte. Differently to the usual gaming night which runs for about three hours we started in the afternoon and played the game from start to finish. Here are a few impressions:

The setup. Lines indicate battalia, the unit descriptions are somewhat hovering above/underneath the respective unit.









As I provide both armies we rolled for who would get to play which side. This time it was my turn to take the imperial-catholic side. Other changes we made from the last game is that one of the cuirassiers units joined the protestant side who also got a brand new unit of Finnish cavalry. They also brought most of the available artillery.

The catholic troops in the bottom of the picture set up pretty much in a linear (one could call it a protestant) fashion, with the light cavalry to their left, a centre of pike and shot, swordmen and the medium artillery and heavy cavalry in the right along with some Cossacks for support.

The Swedish and protestants set up in two lines (more or less), light cavalry on their left side, cuirassiers and Finnish cavalry in their right on a hill, along with the medium cannon and their general. And in the far right they had placed a powerful flanking force of veteran Swedish Blue and Yellow Guards regiments.









The light guns, according to Gustav Adolph's orders, were used as 'regimental guns' and stuck with the infantry centre.









A colourful mix of the protestant alliance's troops. Swedish light cavalry wing, mercenaries from Hesse-Kassel, the Palatinate and Veterans from Saxony.

The imperial-catholic troops were no less colourful and had even dug up an old formation of swordsmen:



























The catholic right flank certainly looked the most dangerous with two units of cuirassiers in black (ehem) armour and a unit of Harquebusiers, all under the command of nasty old Heinrich Holk:









Here's a lovely shot of the clash of light cavalries on the left side:









Due to Swedish light cavalry being a bit more squishy than Croats, fire support by the Dragoons on the imperial side and some poor dice rolls things were settled rather fast on this side the the imperial-catholics got a lot more freedom of movement on their left flank.

On their right the heavy cavalry attempted to charge right into the enemy cavalry (who were outnumbered almost two to one) before the Swedish blue and yellow regiments would hit home. 










Of course the plan failed and things ground to a halt as catholic cuirassiers got ground up in a horrible crossfire between Swedish and Palatinate regiments to their sides and enemy cavalry to their front.










In their defence, they did a really good job not breaking and bound half the protestant army in place for quite a while.


In this picture you can see another problem the imperial-catholics had to face - the idea was for the infantry centre to rush forward and hit the inferior protestant German troops hard and fast. However, half the infantry didn't get the memo and as the centre left rushed ahead the centre right barely moved at all.










Lateron the imperials actually made it over, a unit of Bavarian veterans immediately started a push of the pike match against Hesse-Kassel troops and disintegrated. However, in the end the catholic side were able to take away a very close victory.

The game took us roughly seven hours to finish but it has to be said that in the beginning we took some time with looking up rules and taking photos, calibrating the cameras and so on. It was the first time we used this fleece blanket to cover the table and it came out rather weirdly in some pictures. In the flesh it's more green. Still, not a bad blanket at all. The game wasn't bad at all either. Each time I play Pike&Shotte I get renewed faith in the rules set. It's a brilliant compromise between "realism" and "speeding things up" where it counts.


Hope you enjoyed the report.


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## Tawa (Jan 10, 2010)

Sounds like a good, hard battle :good:


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## iamtheeviltwin (Nov 12, 2012)

One of the greatest reasons to play with smaller scale minis is that you can field these larger armies that actually look and feel like a real army.

Nice write-up and pictures. If I was still living near my Dad, I would pick up Pike and Shot...its the kind of game he would love.


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## Sigur (Dec 9, 2010)

@Tawa: It certainly was and very, very close.
@iamtheeviltwin: Great, I arrived at developing "dad tastes".  Pike&Shotte is a really entertaining game for any wargamer I'm inclined to say.  That aside, I absolutely agree with you on the smaller scales. 10mm is so painfully overlooked as a scale and it works (in my opinion) SO much better for proper battles than 28mm or even 20 or 15mm.



Hey, not even three months and yet another update!












These buildings I got last October at Vienna Model Expo. N-Scale toy train houses from Vollmer. Amazing kits. The church is the most complex plastic kit I built in a long time. 
I bought them a little overpriced and actually i'm afraid they won't fit the minis. I mean they are the correct scale to my minis. The thing of course is though that one mini in my armies depicts between 10 and 20 men (due to varying sizes in units at that time) at least and if a unit of minis walks by a house in the correct scale...well, it's like 60 dudes running around a house instead of a thousand dudes. The scale is correct but the size is wrong if you know what I mean. Which is problematic. I'll have to give it a try, maybe it looks alright on the table. Honestly, I doubt it but oh well. We shall see. Hope you like the look of the little "village" though. No cross on the church tower as of yet because I wasn't sure wether to put it on there or make it removable because storing and transporting a plastic church with a thin plastic cross on top isn't something I like the sound of.


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## elmir (Apr 14, 2011)

Awesome combo of awesome painting and history! Keep it up!


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## dragonkingofthestars (May 3, 2010)

Now: i may know just enough to be dangerous, but I always assumed that games set in this time frame would either be pretty boreing and non historical.

Given the dominance of Terico pike and shot tactics I would think that the only choices that would matter would be the exact ratio of Pike to Shot to cannon to Cuirassiers, and that most of the tactics regardless of side would reduce to aping Gustav and bringing lots and lots of cannon to blow the other sides Terico apart. 

Further with Calvary being useless in a direct charge against the front of a Pike formation you would be limited to A: Caracole the front before charging home or B: flanking the formation, and the person who won the battle on the flanks deciding the battle by being able to smash his Calvary into the side of your pike men.

I'm not saying it can't be fun, but you have to sell it to me a bit more with mechanics before I jumped, especially when I can have all the fun of playing 30 year war Germany and still be able to shoot a cannon ball into a dragon that Warhammer's Empire gives.

Have to say though, love your models. You did a really nice job on them, the cotton ball smoke really adds to the game. Does that have a in game effect or is it just for looks?


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## Sigur (Dec 9, 2010)

@elmir: Thanks very much. 
@dragonkingofthestars: Thanks for your comment. First off, I don't intend to "sell" you on wargaming the period, so I certainly don't sense any danger there either.  It's about tastes, that's all. My interest in the period is based on several different things beyond the particular kind of warfare. It's an interesting conflict on so many levels from the very top of monarchs, realms and systems wrestling to keep the upper hand, each one for their own interests, with this paper-thin coat of religious struggle, right down to the civilian population who lived through this seemingly endless period of total war. Even worse - a period of war and barbarism, becoming the norm, right at the time of Enlightenment. There's a lot of ambiguity going on, between war being fought with a seemingly rational and well-researched approach, yet being as barbaric as it can get. At the same time warfare changed a lot over the time of the conflict as well. There's a ton of very fascinating stuff going on and last but not least Europe was shaped for the centuries to come.

You're raising some valid points in terms of the warfare of the time possibly being static. However, anything can be boiled down to a very basic level. And even there the very basic challenges of battle remain (command, control, communication). This is very important, as always. And this alone I enjoy about games. Of course this isn't a specific strength of the period either but certainly a factor. However, getting through the enemy lines, creating a weak spot by the use of combined arms and pushing through (or getting repelled and dying horribly  ) poses an interesting challenge. Coordinating units on a battlefield of course is a thing in itself. Also, if we're looking at the later battles of the war, the ratio of cavalry to infantry was surprisingly high which can make for very dynamic battles. And certainly the "shock" cavalry tactics wouldn't have been used more frequently again if cavalry was completely useless. Especially in terms of cavalry tactics (including the whole thing about the caracole) I think that there is a lot of additional research to be done because it's one of the bigger mysteries of the period. I'm currently looking for German or Dutch literature on the subject. As for aping Gustav Adolf and bringing lots of cannon - not sure if setting up a number of a certain formation counts as tactic. If you mean bring to bear at a certain point of the battlefield - sure, that was done by all sides involved as far as I know, at least of course with pieces larger than "regimental cannon". The goal after all is doing battles, not using a points list to get "the most" our of an army list. That's not really the kind of game I aim to play.

If you prefer to play fantasy battles that's cool (you mean actually playing Warhammer Fantasy I assume? Or do you play warmaster? Or something else entirely?). I wouldn't dare to say either was better than the other but me, I prefer to keep it historical and with the TYW. Which set of rules one uses is a whole different additional question. So in terms of mechanics, that's up to you and to what rules set you want to use. I'm happy with Pike&Shotte. I got the Father Tilly rules lying around too, hope I get to give them a go some day.

Thanks for the compliments on the minis.  The cotton is only for looks and so we know which units shot and which haven't. What periods and rules sets for them do you like?


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## dragonkingofthestars (May 3, 2010)

@Sigur: oh no, I don't play warhammer fantasy just 40k, I just know how much the Empire copies from the real world 30 year war Germany and how similar they are in tactics, just replace "terico" with "detachment".

And my problem with 17th century warfare when used as for a game was not that it as static, (See my next point), but that it was limiting, there are not a lot of tactical options for units, you have your pike, your shot, your Calvary and your cannons. That be ya lot as most army's had the same armaments of units. The only exception to that rule are the British who exchanged the Handguns for there famous Longbows. From your battle report you said that the units have varying quality's, such as veterans VS rookies which I suppose is where the game gets it's tactical depth.

My other issue is that one would think an accurate depiction of the Swedish army would be able to run circles around almost any catholic army. the Sweds used flatter formations then the Catholics did more kin to the later Neoplonelic line infantry tactics then the then dominate Tericos, and as Breitenfeld shows the Swedish infantry were able to move at astonishing speeds and managed to execute a perfect refusing the line and turn the table on the far more slow moving Catholics, add to that the sheer number of cannons Gustav favored, (even when he does not steal his enemies as he did at Breitenfeld) and I would think that the Swedes are either non historically accurate or over powered.

Bah, in any case I can understand your fascination with the 30 year war, it's an interesting time and I would like to say it was important to the modern formation of Germany, except after the war nothing really changed. IT was one of those " full of sound and fury" moments in history, I would say that it was tragic, but it was a tragedy that happened slightly less then 400 years ago, it's so far back it's kinda hard for me to empathize in any way other then in an abstract sense.


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## Moriouce (Oct 20, 2009)

As a Swede the TYW are one of my favorite times in our history. How Sweden, a backwater country of 1,5 milion took on the Holy roman empire of 20 milion and shook the known world. Emeging like a greater power of Europe. 

Now Gustav II Adolf had the favorit of superior tactics with his smaller units making manouver easier and higher morale due to regional regiments. Sweden was also payed by france, a catholic country, to continue the presens in germany. 

I would also like to lift the name of Axel Oxenstierna here. He was responsible for govern swedens economy and domestic affairs. He built the logistic system that made the whole wareffort possible and also laid the foundation for the swedish empire for the century to come. Ending at Poltava in 1709. 

Great to follow this project!


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## Sigur (Dec 9, 2010)

@dragonkingofthestars: Well, the Warhammer Empire is based mostly on earlier stuff. Think 16th century. And Warhammer and tactics of course is always a thing in itself.  As for little options. If you look at ancient warfare (which of course is something many military theorists of the 16th/17th century drew from) say Greece you got your Hoplites, your Psiloi, a little cavalry and that's it. Napoleonic Warfare you got line infantry, artillery and cavalry. But this is what it's all about really. Making these brances work together. (British didn't do much in the TYW at all except for a bunch of mercenaries who pretty certainly did not use longbows in the 17th century). Different levels of combat effectiveness is always a big factor in all battles throughout history I'd pair that with Command and Control as the most important factors. The 'hardware' I believe is often a bit overvalued in its importance in combat.

The oft-cited "Swedish Brigade" is one of these typical things Gustav Adolf did to turn a deficit (manpower) into a boon by reading Maurice of Nassau's treatises very, very closely. I'm sure it worked pretty well at the beginning, but catholic forces adapted to cope. Not that catholic commanders didn't read Nassau's works of course but it seems like it was harder to implement with the mercenaries on the imperial-catholic side. The drill Gustav Adolph liked to use certainly was more complicated than the traditional drill (which I wouldn't call "tercio" because the tercio is more of a military formation or administrative unit within the Spanish army rather than a tactic of any sort) but was nothing like line tactics employed in the 18th century or beyond. Gustav Adolf did not approach cannon as "get lots of them". Both sides used as many cannons as possible of course. What some historians attribute to Gustav Adolf is the wider introduction of the "regimental cannon", a very light gun not concentrated in batteries but rather than that dragged around by infantry formations to enhance firepower. No new idea either of course but he had the means of doing it. 

I really suggest you read the Pike&Shotte rules (or others) before you claim that Swedes have to be either historically inaccurate or overpowered. The Swedish army successfully employed some innovations mostly prepared by the Dutch but I don't think that the balance of power was that much askew as you might believe, not only due to the fact that of course catholic commanders adapted. All these ideas of "the tercio" and the caracole are a little too prevalent with too little evidence in how and if they actually were employed beyond the mid-16th century at all. 

The peace of Westphalia changed quite a lot of stuff around but it's less qiuckly visible on a map (in that say half of it is coloured blue all of a sudden) but it shaped the political landscape in quite a remarkable way and cemented trends that developed before the war. Reading any of the horrible accounts it's hard not to emphasize with the people who suffered under the war.
@Moriouce: Thanks very much and thanks for your comment.  Yup, between the Polish-Swedish war and the TYW the Swedes did make a name for themselves. Of course they had a little help from their friends (France, massively so as you said, Danish and German protestant states, some less willingly so than others). The France thing I think shows how paper-thin the whole religious reasonings behind the whole thing were especially. Keep in mind that the HRE already was in a state of constant war since 1618 before the Swedish army landed. Yup, Oxenstierna seems like a capable chancellor (was that his title?) and administrator, turning Sweden from a bckwater place with a rather backwards economy and very little manpower into one of the big players in the 17th century.


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## Moriouce (Oct 20, 2009)

@Moriouce: Thanks very much and thanks for your comment.  Yup, between the Polish-Swedish war and the TYW the Swedes did make a name for themselves. Of course they had a little help from their friends (France, massively so as you said, Danish and German protestant states, some less willingly so than others). The France thing I think shows how paper-thin the whole religious reasonings behind the whole thing were especially. Keep in mind that the HRE already was in a state of constant war since 1618 before the Swedish army landed. Yup, Oxenstierna seems like a capable chancellor (was that his title?) and administrator, turning Sweden from a bckwater place with a rather backwards economy and very little manpower into one of the big players in the 17th century.[/QUOTE]


Yes he was a chancelor but his swedish title was 'rikskansler' which tranalate as statechancelor which implice he was one step above all other chancelors.

His main duty was to be the chairman of the parliment and work as a foreign minister and diplomate. He also was the governor of all the swedish overseas territory that the army occupied during the war and had the main responsability for the army's logistics. Many of his legacies are still in work today in Sweden like the swedish post-service that was his initiativet.


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## Sigur (Dec 9, 2010)

Ah right, rikskansler, Cheers. I knew what he was doing but couldn't think of the term.


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## Sigur (Dec 9, 2010)

Behold, I managed to take those army shots!


First, houses along with just my Imperial-Catholics:




















...and not just everything I've got (Imperials, German Protestants, Swedes) because I can. Mwahaha!























































Not sure what you think of the scale of the houses in comparison to the scale of the figures but for me my fears have been confirmed - the buildings just look way too big. I think for one the buildings are meant to depict contemporary houses and of course the ground scale/terrain scale/model:man-ratio and such applies. I think I will have to go get some new (properly too small) 10mm buildings now and use these here for 15mm gaming for which they look about spot on. Pretty crazy, isn't it? Another crazy thing is that I don't really play anything 15mm set in middle Europe/Germany. These houses work for a lot of periods at least, from the mid-late 17th century on up to 20xx. Shame I decided to go 20mm on my Cold War 1980s stuff.  But hey, at least I got army shots done!


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## Tha Tall One (Aug 16, 2008)

Those look awesome! I love that period. Great work as always.


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## Sigur (Dec 9, 2010)

@Tha Tall One: Thanks!  I'm considering getting "proper 10mm" buildings from Pendraken or the likes. Glad you like the pictures though!


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## Sigur (Dec 9, 2010)

Okay, seeing as Warlord are actually going to release that TYW supplement for Pike&Shotte, I was "inspired" (as they say) to paint stuff up for that. The two missing units of musketeers:










...and three bases of dudes with petards. What's a petard then? 










Basically it's a kind of bell shaped, massive cast iron container filled with black powder (like a short mortar), sealed off with wax, hemp and a plate of wood or lead. The idea is to create a shaped charge with the explosive power directed against the surface the petard is affixed to. Usually it was used against havy gates (such as city gates) but they were also used against fortifications, palisades and ships. The Petardiers were especially trained guys who would carry or otherwise transport via wheeled devices the petard against the enemy's fortifications, firmly (to get the full power out of the explosion) attach (usually by screws and additional buttresses) the petard on the surface they wanted to blow a hole into and trigger the explosion. First via a fuse, later on by wheellock automaton. Running through enemy defensive fire right up to their positions carrying a huge and heavy explosive, then taking out some big screws and start attaching said heavy explosive device to a game or somesuch and THEN get this big explosive to go off without blowing yourself up of course doesn't sound like the most fun job in the world and I'm sure it wasn't. Losses amongst petardiers were comparatively high.

Petards were used from the 16th to the 18th century, from when on they were replaced by more modern weapons.


I decided to base those guys on round bases (two on five euro cents pieces, one team on an english penny) because they wouldn't really work as a unit per se. In Pike&Shotte they are a unit upgrade for storming parties/forlorn hope formations. Not sure I'll ever use them.  I guess I would have to build a section of city walls. But I've been hoping to do something siege-like with my TYW figures some day because sieges were a really, really big thing back then (and quite a lot more popular with commanders than open battle. Lower risk and much, much higher reward) and they worked out some fascinating techniques for laying siege and of course for fortress building at the time. And I just like the idea of having additional scenario layers by not only having to fend off an assult but also taking care of several petardier markers closing in with the plan to blow up your gates.


Also finally started putting together the baggage train bases.









Maybe it would have been more clever to keep a few of the wagons and such for making a camp but oh well. I'd rather have a bunch of proper bases of baggage train than a few of that and a half-decent camp. These seven bases also should be enough for both armies. I also sculpted a 10mm woman and a kid and they look really, really bad. So no pictures of those for now.  Would look weird though having a baggage train without any women.


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## Tawa (Jan 10, 2010)

More nice stuffs! :good:



Sigur said:


> Okay, seeing as Warlord are actually going to release that TYW supplement for Pike&Shotte....


This makes me warm and fuzzy in my special place.


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## alasdair (Jun 11, 2009)

I love Sigur plogs because not only do I get to see lovely miniatures but I always learn something.


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## Sigur (Dec 9, 2010)

@Tawa: Yeah, let's see how it'll end up being. But it's nice that they're finally getting to it. 
@alasdair: Hey, where else could I be a show-off AND a smartarse both in one post? 

Yesterday I sculpted another little woman who I am much, much happier with than with the first one. Pix to follow soon I hope!


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## Tawa (Jan 10, 2010)

Personally, I'm looking forward to seeing what they do with the smaller forces involved


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## Sigur (Dec 9, 2010)

I assume that it will be army lists with points for each period of the war mostly. Bohemian (catholic league, protestant states), Danish (danish and protestants, catholic league/HRE), Swedish (Swedes, HRE [updated for Wallenstein]), French phase (French, HRE). Of course there'd be quite the overlap of course, especially in terms of the protestant armies, some Swedish and some HRE too.

I guess there should be a Spanish list in there as well, even though they probably weren't that different. Maybe a Dutch list even though that might be similar as the early Swedes.

Hope to see plenty of scenarios in there. I'm not that hot on points systems anyway so this is what I'm more interested in.


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## Tawa (Jan 10, 2010)

Don't forget the Scots! :laugh:

Yeah, scenarios and maybe some form of campaign rules etc :good:


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## Tha Tall One (Aug 16, 2008)

Nice! A friend of mine is collecting a Spanish and Dutch army for the eighty years war, in which I'll hope to bring in some Landsknechts myself.

Those petardiers look nice as well.

Weren't sieges always preferable to open battle?


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## Sigur (Dec 9, 2010)

@Tawa: Riiiiiight. How could I. 
@Tha Tall One: Oooh, nice. What scale are you doing that in again? Have you backed Pro Gloria's plastic Landsknechts kickstarter? As for sieges - sure, probably so. Maybe less so between the late 17th to early 19th century in Europe as warfare got more reglemented (technically) and formalized. I think in the TYW especially though with all the war entrepreneurs around and horrendous losses in battle.

Did a horse holder for my wee TYW dragoons (at last):


















Saddles, bedrolls, gun holsters and bags and such on the brown horses I sculpted meself.

Happy first Advent Sunday too!


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## Tha Tall One (Aug 16, 2008)

Yes, 28mm. I did indeed back Pro Gloria. I really hope they're gonna make it, but as of now it's looking rahter grim. Their metal Landsknechts are very pretty as well, though not as cheap.

Sieges did of course decline as artillery advanced technologically, you are completely right. I do believe sieges dominated the middle ages as well. I gleefully await your battle-report of a grand siege in which you've put those petards to good use!

Your 10mm horses all look masterfully painted. I can't imagine how hard it must be to sculpt at that scale.


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## Sigur (Dec 9, 2010)

@Tha Tall Man: Good man. I really hope for them that this plastic set is happening (I advertised the campaign on the Battle Brush Studios facebook page and in other places multiple times). I really like their metals. I was SO hyped when the set was announced some time around November last year because I'm hugely into that period (obviously  ). One of my pipe dream projects is a late 15th/early 16th century ImagiNations campaign with Landsknechts and all of that using Impetus rules. Oh well. Maybe some day. 

So I was incredibly hyped. Then the prototypes popped up and - despite all the goodness that lies in the intentions of Pro Gloria - I just couldn't get over the design. Maybe my expectations were weird, but I was expecting something along the lines of what the Perrys do. I'm sure they'll look really nice when ranked up and painted and all and they look like they're great quality, but I just can't get over the fact that these look like Warhammer figures in terms of proportions and in a way in terms of sculpting style. Nothing wrong with that, of course. It just went in a very different direction than what I had worked up hopes for. But as I said, would love to see this project happening, would love to paint a set (or multiples thereof) of those models some time.


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## Sigur (Dec 9, 2010)

Roight, to celebrate the release of Pike&Shotte's Thirty Years War supplement book - Devil's Playground (good title I think) - I decided to get those baggage train bases finished and painted! In that book you'll find photos of some of my 28mm and 10mm TYW stuff, so make sure you all buy several copies of the book, but not without letting the publishers know that it's ONLY because you can see pictures of my minis in there. That's important. 










Due to photobucket's anachronistically small picture size limits the picture's got to be rather small. But so are the figures anyway.  The bases are 45mm by 40mm in size if I remember correctly.

Earlier today I sculpted some more stuff like ...well, baggage to put on the carts, a little girl sitting on one of the carts and some more details. Hope you like it so far!


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## Tawa (Jan 10, 2010)

Great work! :good:


I may actually get back into my 6mm stuff at some point :laugh:


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## Sigur (Dec 9, 2010)

@Tawa: You should! I'm actually just waiting for the currently silly Euro-Pounds exchange rate to drop to more sane levels again to order a bunch of 6mm Napoleonic French from Baccus to play some Blücher. 


Update:


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## Tawa (Jan 10, 2010)

Sigur said:


> @Tawa: You should! I'm actually just waiting for the currently silly Euro-Pounds exchange rate to drop to more sane levels again to order a bunch of 6mm Napoleonic French from Baccus to play some Blücher.


Baccus is my 6mm supplier too :laugh:

Although, I've been looking at the 10mm stuff from Pendraken......


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## Sigur (Dec 9, 2010)

I suppose that Baccus pretty much is the first adress for anything 6mm, especially in Europe. Adler I hear is preferred by some people, mostly due to them having a bigger variety of poses and such, but oh well. I think I'll go with Baccus.

At the same time I want to get a bunch of 6mm GHQ WW2 stuffs for company level WW2 and above. :angel:

Pendraken's stuff is tip top notch. Some of their ranges have cast-on spears and pikes which is something I really can do without. What period did you have in mind for 10mm?


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## Tawa (Jan 10, 2010)

Sticking with ECW, although I may also scratch my TYW itch and build an army of Swedes. 
I may even put the 6mm on hold indefinitely and shift over to 10mm, as the pikes are unbelievably brittle in 6mm 




Do you know anywhere that actually does 10mm Highlanders, @Sigur?


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## Sigur (Dec 9, 2010)

Yeah, I imagine that pikes might be a problem at 6mm. At 10mm you can pretty conveniently use wire pikes and Irregular got a pretty nice 2 or 3mm scale range in which the pike blocks are pretty much solid blocks as they look like in pictures of battles of the time.

What kind of highlanders do you mean? For the 17th century? Pendraken got several packs of ECW Scots (Lancers, cavalry, musketeers, pikemen, etc.) if that's of any help.


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## Tawa (Jan 10, 2010)

Sigur said:


> Yeah, I imagine that pikes might be a problem at 6mm. At 10mm you can pretty conveniently use wire pikes and Irregular got a pretty nice 2 or 3mm scale range in which the pike blocks are pretty much solid blocks as they look like in pictures of battles of the time.


I actually looked at 2mm, and then I thought "No, I'm not that mad!" :laugh:



Sigur said:


> What kind of highlanders do you mean? For the 17th century? Pendraken got several packs of ECW Scots (Lancers, cavalry, musketeers, pikemen, etc.) if that's of any help.


Yeah, the Pendraken Scots are good for the Covenanters and for the regular Scots and Irish units under Montrose, but I'm after some proper Highlanders like these:


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## Sigur (Dec 9, 2010)

@Tawa: Hmm, that seems to be a tough one. Tons of Highlanders for the 18th and 19th century, bunch of them for medieval stuff, but these guys you're looking for seem to be harder to find. I mean you can always GS some kilts onto other minis I suppose as long as the hats are right?











It's the Thirty Years War supplement for Pike&Shotte! To which,I had the honour to contribute a few pictures. I'm very glad that the people who designed this book were capable enough to turn my photos into something printable. Very chuffed to see my stuff in there (all three pictures were put in there). Which isn't bad for 10mm stuff, because all the other photos of course show 28mm minis because those look sexier in promo pictures and Warlord Games sell that scale figures and all. My name and webbysite are also credited in the book, so things are well. Seems like the author forgot to put my name in bold letters and two sizes bigger than those of the other people who contributed, but I'll let that slide for now. 

This actually is my first supplement book ever for any of the Warlord Games battle games (Pike&Shotte, Black Powder, Hail Caesar). It's got a bunch of army lists, some scenarios (one for each phase of the war, so not too many), a fun looking little campaign system for running your own company of mercenaries during the war and a bunch of siege rules which are very welcome. I mean people were all about sieges then, weren't they. Hope to post a more in-depth review some time in the future when I found out where to put it and when I can justify putting the time into it, because TYW stuff usually isn't the biggest blockbuster possible.


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## Tawa (Jan 10, 2010)

I have precisely zero skill with green stuff :laugh:


I'm also looking at getting that book for when I eventually get my ECE/TYW project underway again


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## Sigur (Dec 9, 2010)

@Tawa: Any luck yet? I keep my eyes open for the sort of Highlanders you're looking for, but haven't happened across any so far.



Hullo. The following is a bit about my TYW collection which took about five times as long as I thought. Of course I don't really have much of an incentive to get it done either because I rarely play TYW stuff. On the other hand, it's a pretty darned important thing. Possibly the most important to any army - it's the Baggage Train.

The full seven bases set up in column. The models are mounted on 45x40mm plastic bases. Almost all of the models are converted to some extent or in the case of the four females I sculpted them by hand.










Going through the bases one by one now, because I put effort into each of them, so you have to suffer through them now. 









I put grass on the sides of the bases so together the wagons and such look like they're moving on a road. Of course this makes setting up the bases next to each other, but given the scale it doesn't make much sense anyway. So above there's a base with some cows and a dude and a green wagon. (When I took the pictures I already thought that this posting would read like a slides presentation of someone who was on vacation in a really boring place. And I think it might turn out that way. ). Not really happy with the cows, but oh well. They look good enough I suppose.

Here's one of my favourites - a family and their belongings:









Hope you can see anything at all. The lady and the little girl in the green dress I sculpted myself. The guy is carrying his musket on his shoulder.









Here's one with a well dressed dude chatting to some rider-by( if that's a word  ) while a dude in a red hat pulls his horsecart by.




























Here's a guy with a mulish oxen which refuses to walk on and a smug musketeer followed by his well-behaved packhorses:









...and here they finally are: The eagerly awaited flock of 10mm sheep (plus a cow which was raised by sheep, so it hangs out with the sheep), herded by a shepherd and his eastern European pal.









Another nice one:









The guy with the sack over his shoulder is converted from a pikeman. Maybe it's a bit hard to see, there's also a dark grey and pretty huge dog with him. As well as...










A _tiny _little girl sitting in the back of the wicker cart. Also sculpted by me. Probably not very responsible by the guy to have his kid sit there like that. There's also some kind of flower pattern I made up on that big earthenware container next to her.










Last one! On this one a strumpet uses the cover of a larger cart to unsubtly hit on a wealthy horseman riding by, waving her arm, donning the biggest 10mm scale smile anyone could muster and raising her dress just a little.



















I sculpted the lady, and I'm pretty proud of her. 

Another picture of a few of the bases together:











...and two size comparison pics:



















Hope you like them.


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