# primarch vs. xenomorph



## MontytheMighty (Jul 21, 2009)

I was thinking about just how superhuman a primarchs is...do you think an unarmed, unarmoured primarch could take on a xenomorph from the Aliens vs. Predator series

now I know some of you guys are going to think "well, a predator could kill multiple aliens as seen in the two AvP movies", but that was with weapons and armour (please ignore the predator on alien wrestling match in the first movie as it was just plain silly) 

the xenomorph has its acid blood, exoskeleton, fangs, inner jaws, claws, and tail with a blade on the end
the primarch has his bare hands, his superhuman physical prowess, and is only wearing a loincloth. 
the fight takes place in an arena 

primarchs are portrayed as incredibly fast, do you think a primarch would be too fast even for the xenomorph? how would the primarch circumvent the acid blood?


if you think this would be an easy win for a primarch, do you think a naked primarch could take on two or more xenomorphs? 

feel free to pick a specific primarch.


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## Uber Ork (Aug 23, 2010)

Hmmm... naked primarchs wrestling aliens. Well, this is a new one for me... 


I'd give the ultimate win to the primarch, but not without taking damage from the acid blood. 

If Fulgrim can take on a wraithlord with his bare hands, he (or any other primarch) can certainly take out an alien.

How does it go down? 


The primarch side steps the aliens attack with blinding speed and grabs the tail of the beast. Then swinging the alien by the tail bashes the alien into the ground, walls, etc repeatedly again and again, until the tail rips free from the body. Then the primarch uses the tail to stab the alien through the head pinning it to the earth. Acid sprays on the primarchs naked body and does damage, but the primarchs super enhanced physiology quickly neutralizes the acid minimizing the damage. The appropriate legion apothecary then tends to the injured primarch and throws the acid burned loincloth in the trash.


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## demonictalkin56 (Jan 30, 2011)

Curze would win by either out-stealthing it or staring it down forcing it to die from fear


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## Doelago (Nov 29, 2009)

Magnus would just burn it to cinders with his brain. 

Russ would just be to drunk to notice that the blood is actually dangerous and proceed to drink it after having killed the alien. 

Dorn would be to stubborn to do anything but win. 

Quilliman would just use his tactical brilliance to win. 

Horus would just win. 

Angron is so fuwken angry that the alien would be running on the first sight of him. 

Vulkan? He is so awesome that he would just rip the aliens tail of, forge it into a hammer, smash the alien in the head with it.


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## Malus Darkblade (Jan 8, 2010)

You serious man? 

Aliens/Xenomorphs/the Black Death are an absolute joke for a Primarch.

An Astartes can wipe the floor with a Predator/Yautja blindfolded and a Predator can easily deal with a Xenomorph.

Dachande, a a legendary Predator, killed a Xenomorph with his bare hands hence his nickname _Broken Tusk_. 

A Primarch might break a sweat killing a Queen. _Might_ and he would probably be super tired from a previous engagement before he would.

In regards to their acid blood, the same can be said about how Predators deal with fighting Xenomorphs. Wearing protective armor which usually consists of Xenomorph carapaces or from afar or with a long pointy stick. 

I'm sure a Primarch could easily deal with one with a spear and who is to say the acid blood would even effect a Primarch? 

In your scenario, the Primarch could snap the Aliens tail and use it to impale it or just grab it and throw it super hard into a wall so it explodes and yes a Primarch would be way faster than a Xenomorph.

Batman dealt with them despite their speed, including a crocodile hybrid. They're fast but not that fast, they just usually deal with slow enemies.

The Predator/Alien universe used to be my thing before WH40k. Glad I made the switch


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## Doelago (Nov 29, 2009)

Should not be forgotten that the Primarchs could also just spit acid into the face of the fucker.


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## DeathTyrant (Aug 23, 2009)

Primarch uses superior fighting skills to avoid the claws, jaws, and tail spike to get in close, and wrestle it. He picks up the Xenomorph and slams it hard enough and far enough away to both kill it and avoid any acid splash if the exoskeleton ruptures.


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## Angel of Blood (Aug 18, 2010)

Yeah this really is no contest at all. The alien pretty much survives for as long as the Primarch allows it to. Even a queen wouldn't stand a chance.


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## MontytheMighty (Jul 21, 2009)

Malus Darkblade said:


> You serious man?
> Aliens/Xenomorphs/the Black Death are an absolute joke for a Primarch.
> An Astartes can wipe the floor with a Predator/Yautja blindfolded and a Predator can easily deal with a Xenomorph.


oh come on now, there's no basis for saying that. not saying a predator would wipe the floor with a marine but I don't think the marine is going to curbstomp the predator
in the Dark Horse comics, a predator paced a speeding car and threw a bison around like a toy 



> Dachande, a a legendary Predator, killed a Xenomorph with his bare hands hence his nickname _Broken Tusk_


he was the only member of his species ever known to do that, and I'm pretty sure he lucked out big time (i.e. if he had tried to pull it off again he would have died)



> A Primarch might break a sweat killing a Queen. _Might_ and he would probably be super tired from a previous engagement before he would.


actually this is a really good match-up. come on you guys are gonna say a *naked, unarmed* primarch is going to easily beat a *T-Rex sized alien queen* 



> In regards to their acid blood, the same can be said about how Predators deal with fighting Xenomorphs. Wearing protective armor which usually consists of Xenomorph carapaces or from afar or with a long pointy stick.


in the original post, I specified a naked, unarmed primarch 



> They're fast but not that fast, they just usually deal with slow enemies.


I actually agree whole-heartedly with you there. A xenomorphs are abnormally fast but we've never seen them up against super fast opponents other than predators (predators are described as freakishly fast in the novels and comics)

of course in the movies, the aliens and predators don't look that fast because a lot of the portrayals are done with guys in rubber suits 



> The Predator/Alien universe used to be my thing before WH40k. Glad I made the switch


we miss you, i like both


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## Malus Darkblade (Jan 8, 2010)

MontytheMighty said:


> oh come on now, there's no basis for saying that. not saying a predator would wipe the floor with a marine but I don't think the marine is going to curbstomp the predator
> in the Dark Horse comics, a predator paced a speeding car and threw a bison around like a toy



Predators are tough but not nearly as tough as an Astartes.

Dutch, an unaugmented human and his brother dealt with them and came out alive. 

Do you really think a Yautja would be anything more than a pest for an Astartes?

And the Astartes are known for much bigger feats of strength than throwing around a bison.



MontytheMighty said:


> he was the only member of his species ever known to do that, and I'm pretty sure he lucked out big time (i.e. if he had tried to pull it off again he would have died)



Nah he wasn't the only one. 



MontytheMighty said:


> actually this is a really good match-up. come on you guys are gonna say a *naked, unarmed* primarch is going to easily beat a *T-Rex sized alien queen*


Dude you need to understand what a Primarch is capable of. And once you do, you need to re-understand what they are capable of because they're that insane.

Ferrus Manus for example beat up a Ctan who obviously was bigger.

Vulkan owned Salamanders that were gigantic in size.



MontytheMighty said:


> in the original post, I specified a naked, unarmed primarch



And I said who is to say their acid blood would do anything to a Primarch? And again, an unarmed Primarch could impale the Alien with its own tail or just crush it against a wall.



MontytheMighty said:


> I actually agree whole-heartedly with you there. A xenomorphs are abnormally fast but we've never seen them up against super fast opponents other than predators (predators are described as freakishly fast in the novels and comics)
> 
> of course in the movies, the aliens and predators don't look that fast because a lot of the portrayals are done with guys in rubber suits


They both are described as being fast in the perspective of regular humans.


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## Catpain Rich (Dec 13, 2008)

Malus Darkblade said:


> Ferrus Manus for example beat up a Ctan who obviously was bigger.


I thought it was just a necron construct of some kind and not necessarily a c'tan? 

Please bear in mind i read this on lexicanum


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## MontytheMighty (Jul 21, 2009)

Malus Darkblade said:


> Predators are tough but not nearly as tough as an Astartes.
> Dutch, an unaugmented human and his brother dealt with them and came out alive.
> Do you really think a Yautja would be anything more than a pest for an Astartes?
> And the Astartes are known for much bigger feats of strength than throwing around a bison.


well, un-augmented humans have killed space marines in the 40k universe, it's kinda pointless bringing something like that up because it has nothing to do with relative power levels and everything to do with luck or special circumstances 

yes, the hero of the movie Predator defeated a predator because the predator slapped him around, toyed with him but then triggered a pre-set trap mechanism
how does that apply to the analysis of a straight-up fight between an Astartes and a predator? 



> Nah he wasn't the only one.


source? Dachande was a legend because he did something his race thought was practically impossible. 



> Dude you need to understand what a Primarch is capable of. And once you do, you need to re-understand what they are capable of because they're that insane.
> 
> Ferrus Manus for example beat up a Ctan who obviously was bigger.
> 
> Vulkan owned Salamanders that were gigantic in size.


some of the earlier fluff is either ridiculous (and inconsistent with later portrayals of the primarchs) or in-universe Imperial fairy tales 

a primarch smashing mountains with his bare fists...really?



> And I said who is to say their acid blood would do anything to a Primarch? And again, an unarmed Primarch could impale the Alien with its own tail or just crush it against a wall.


might very well happen, I just don't think a naked, unarmed primarch is as unstoppable as you claim 
he's still a beast, but he can be carved up like any other creature made of flesh


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## Stephen_Newman (Jul 14, 2009)

Kill the alien by poking it in the eye with its massive schlong.

Sorry you mentioned naked primarchs so you let yourself in on this one.


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## TheSpore (Oct 15, 2009)

i always found these arguments pointless but i will put in my 2 cents

A xeno morph pose no threat what so ever to a primarch unless he was ganged up on by many. This like asking can a primarch take on a hormagaunt.

Now given the fluff behind a predator i would say that it would be a good match to see but please give the primarch some damn clothes on.


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## aboytervigon (Jul 6, 2010)

Fulgrim strangled an avatar of khaine with his bare hands and his armour was pretty much gone by this point im sure being on fire is worse than some silly acid blood.


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## MEQinc (Dec 12, 2010)

aboytervigon said:


> Fulgrim strangled an avatar of khaine with his bare hands and his armour was pretty much gone by this point im sure being on fire is worse than some silly acid blood.


This.

Fulgrim choked out a god-powered molten metal construct built by a race so powerful they could snuff out suns and so ancient they ruled the galaxy when we were nothing more than monkeys. What chance does a mere alien have? 

Here's how the fight goes. The alien lunges at the Primarch who calmly grabs its face with one hand and snaps its neck. He looks around and goes "So, when's this fight gonna happen?


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## MontytheMighty (Jul 21, 2009)

aboytervigon said:


> Fulgrim strangled an avatar of khaine with his bare hands and his armour was pretty much gone by this point im sure being on fire is worse than some silly acid blood.


is this still canon? even if it is, I'm pretty sure he started the fight with his power armour, so it would have still helped him a lot during the fight...does it even say that his power armour was burned away? primarch power armour is the best of the best. 



Stephen_Newman said:


> Kill the alien by poking it in the eye with its massive schlong.
> Sorry you mentioned naked primarchs so you let yourself in on this one.


lol, only the alien has no eyes



TheSpore said:


> This like asking can a primarch take on a hormagaunt.
> Now given the fluff behind a predator i would say that it would be a good match to see but please give the primarch some damn clothes on.


more like a naked, unarmed primarch vs. a gene-stealer


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## Emperorguard500 (May 5, 2010)

is TS really trying to say that an xenomorph can defeat a primarch

are you serious


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## LukeValantine (Dec 2, 2008)

MontytheMighty said:


> more like a naked, unarmed primarch vs. a gene-stealer


Yet a lowly captain stripped of his armor could fight a genestealer and come out on top.

So by extensions a Primach who can take a powerfist to the face would be all but invincible to the black carapaces bugger.

Hence the argument has just been resolved. Now maybe a pretorian or a queen could put up a better fight, but I will take the incredibly powerful 12 foot tall super being over a xenomorph any day.

Foot note: A primarch would be harder to fatally wound (Skull can stop a rifle round+), stronger (Probably twice as strong) and arguable just as fast if not faster


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## Emperorguard500 (May 5, 2010)

LukeValantine said:


> Yet a lowly captain stripped of his armor could fight a genestealer and come out on top.
> 
> So by extensions a Primach who can take a powerfist to the face would be all but invincible to the black carapaces bugger.
> 
> Hence the argument has just been resolved. Now maybe a pretorian or a queen could put up a better fight, but I will take the incredibly powerful 12 foot tall super being over a xenomorph any day.


i will also take the 12 foot tall super being that's genes come from the most powerful human being to ever walk in the 40k universe.... arguably the most powerful psyker, and is basically a walking "god".... in the eyes of the imperium..

vs. an alien that was defeated by sigourney weaver...


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## JelloSea (Apr 12, 2011)

I feel your really underestimating the power of a primarch. They make abbadon look like a sissy. Seriously a primarch could take on a Hive Tyrant with out his armor on. When a Primarch gets shot, they heal almost instantly. They move so fast normal Marines cant keep up with their moment. If you take that into account, you get a guy that could throw a tank, run 60+ MPH, could have psychic powers, heals almost instantly, has lightning reflexes. Really, there is a reason the only things that have killed primarchs have been other primarchs. No contest.


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## Chompy Bits (Jun 13, 2010)

One punch. That is all.

Seriously, what could a single xenomorph possibly do to stop a primarch? Angron had a couple thousand tons of rock dumped on his head and it only made him angry. Fulgrim strangled an avatar with his bare hands and, while he his hands were hurt, he healed rapidly and perfectly. Horus survived being trapped in a collapsing ship, receiving only what he considered a minor injury. Sure they had armour at the time, but the forces they encountered were far greater than what a single alien could bring to bear. And, as seen with Fulgrim's example, primarchs heal really quickly. And this isn't even considering the kind of damage primarchs themselves can dish out. So even if the primarch *lets* the alien have the first hit, he'll recover and squash it like a bug. Thus, I think that the alien is completely fucked.


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## Serpion5 (Mar 19, 2010)

A xenomorph does not have the resilience of a genestealer. 

A predalien probably would, but they`re a different case. 

I`ve read stories of primarchs beating wraithlords, avatars, massive fucking daemon lords and even other primarchs. 

I have also read of xenomorphas being killed by pointy sticks. 


I know that presentation was hardly fair :laugh: but even though I am a fan of the xenomorph I have to give this one to the primarch easily.


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## JelloSea (Apr 12, 2011)

Think of it this way. A grey knight chapter master can solo greater daemons...Ok a Greater daemon would no doubt poo on a Xenomorph.... A primarch makes a GK look like a Conscript guardsmen. I honestly wouldnt doubt said primarch could take on the GK chapter master, the greater daemon and the Xenomorph at the same time and only take minor wounds.... .and they wouldnt be from the alien.


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## LukeValantine (Dec 2, 2008)

On to a more interesting matter, considering the question of this thread was answered 2 pages back.

Is the physics defying powers of primarchs possibly do to them all unconsciously drawing on the warp at some level that doesn't require awareness or effort on their behalf? After all the laws of physics and biology more or less are broken by the feats many of the primarchs achieved. So it seems that they most be living conduits for some other wordly force to be able to do stuff like take power fists to the head.


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## Karak The Unfaithful (Feb 13, 2011)

I'm sure a primarch would look at an xenomorph and say: "hey look, a funny little bug" then swat it away without a seconf thought


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## Diatribe1974 (Jul 15, 2010)

Here's what'd have happened did Russ fight a xenomorph (aka the Aliens from Alien(s) movies):

Russ would swagger in, somewhat buzzed and pissed off that this stupid fekkin' alien would disrupt his feating. The first time the alien would swing the tail in to stab Russ with it, he'd grab the tail, break it off and impale it into the heart/chest cavity of the beast. As it lay dying, he'd tear it's freakin' head off. Later, you'd see him back at the feasting hall in the Fang with a handle attached to the semi-hollowed out alien skull (full of ale) in one hand and a leg of venison in the other, telling the story about this one time, a gnat from another planet had the audacity to interrupt his feasting!


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## LukeValantine (Dec 2, 2008)

Well if it was the kruz the alien would be the one being hunted not the other way around. I can see it now the alien following a sent trail thinks it getting the drop on a large humanoid, but all of the sudden it looks down to see 10 giant ass blade sticking through its chest moments before its ripped in half width wise. Then kruz fades back into the batman esc shadows.


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## Warlock in Training (Jun 10, 2008)

Theres too many post of a Primarch wipping ass, and since Fulgrim can choked to death the Avatar of Khain, a being thats praticaly a walking Melta, then Acid Blood be no Prob. As someone said in the begining as well, they could spit acid on the _fuckers_ face. :laugh: 

Now a Queen be alot harder... maybe worthy match as a hive tyrant would be, but not the lowly warrior Alien.


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## Doelago (Nov 29, 2009)

Warlock in Training said:


> Now a Queen be alot harder... maybe worthy match as a hive tyrant would be, but not the lowly warrior Alien.


A Alien Queen? No different, just a hit or two more and thats it. A alien queen is NOTHING compared to a Hive Tyrant. Fucking nothing. Maybe comparable to a Warrior, but nothing more. Probably less.


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## Uber Ork (Aug 23, 2010)

LukeValantine said:


> On to a more interesting matter, considering the question of this thread was answered 2 pages back.


:laugh: Yep. 





LukeValantine said:


> Is the physics defying powers of primarchs possibly do to them all unconsciously drawing on the warp at some level that doesn't require awareness or effort on their behalf? After all the laws of physics and biology more or less are broken by the feats many of the primarchs achieved. So it seems that they most be living conduits for some other wordly force to be able to do stuff like take power fists to the head.


Personally I think the better question is why a primarch is wrestling an alien naked, but I shall acquiesce to your question instead. 

So a passive link to the warp kind of like the orks? That's an interesting thought. Are we sure though that all the primarchs possess psychic potential? 

I think some of their resiliency has to do with their size. If a space marine is 7 feet a primarch has to be what, 11-12 feet tall? 

Shaquille O'neal's NBA info page has him listed as 7 feet 1 inch (2.16 m) and 325 pounds (147.4 kg.). 









Seeing that a space marine would be even more buff due to his genetic enhancements, I'm guessing the average Astartes must weigh 400 lbs unaugmented? That could put a primarch in the freakishly huge 800 pound category. 

Punching a normal Astartes with a powerfist would kill them outright. Punching something that is 12 feet tall and 800 lbs and has been genetically engineered with redundant systems, an enhanced fused ribcage and skeleton, etc. is an entirely different matter. 

Seeing that an ork warboss is toughness 5 with virtually only a shirt on, I'd say a primarch can't be anything under T6, and they would clearly have many more wounds than say marneus calgar's 4.

Pit that against a T4 (max), 1 wound, ST4 creature from the Alien(s)/AVP franchise and that little bugger has no chance whatsoever.


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## LukeValantine (Dec 2, 2008)

So you advocate that the primarchs strength is entirely do to biological factors, well not impossible it does seem a bit far fetched considering the physical limitations of the human form regardless of augmentatiotns.

FOr instance even though a ant is able to lift 10 times its body weight, if it was 10 times bigger it would be unable to even lift its body without difficulty do to their body not being designed to operate at such sizes. Using the basketball reference most humans over 7' tall have sever joint problems past middle age, and are also more prone to injury during periods of extreme physical exertions.

Mind you 40k like most sci fi is only vaguely based on hard scientific fact and law so within the 40k universe I suppose its entirely possible that all of the primarchs strength is do to their anatomy.

On a side note wasn't it decided a while back during the agron release fiasco that primarchs stats are a solid 5 across almost all stats with eternal warrior?


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## Malus Darkblade (Jan 8, 2010)

The Primarchs are a culmination of Warp power, the Emperor's DNA, technology, and who knows maybe even a dash of Xenos spice.

So I don't think we should be drawing real life analogies when I don't think any could be made.

But like you I have always wondered what exactly was it that the Emperor _stole_ from the Chaos powers to make from them. Was it simply a large sum of raw Warp energy? If so, where did it really go when it came to their creation? 

So ultimately I think it was just used to infuse the Primarchs with their aura, their ability to (like the Emperor) make people weep or lose their capacity to think when in their presence AKA their charisma, amongst other things while the technology and DNA went towards their physical traits.


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## JelloSea (Apr 12, 2011)

Leman Russ 1000 Points

(WS 9) (BS 7) (S 9) (T 9) (W 7) (I 7) (A 6*) (LD 10) (SV 2+)


Primarch: Leman Russ is a Primarch and thus a god of war. He has the following special rules: 
Counter-attack, Eternal Warrior, Fearless, Feel no Pain, Fleet of Foot, Furious charge, Acute senses. In addition, Leman Russ will always get his feel no pain roll which is a 3+.


Primarch healing: Any weapon wounding of str 6 or less makes Leman Russ' Feel no Pain a 2+

Chapter tactics: Leman Russ bestows the Fleet of foot and Furious charge special rules to any unit with the chapter tactics special rule. In addition, all units in the army become fearless.

Wolf helm of Russ: Leman Russ has a Inv save of 2+

Spear of Russ: The Spear of Russ is a master-crafted power weapon that gives D6+D3 attacks in the combat phase. In addition, If Russ or a squad containing Russ lose combat they never take No Retreat wounds.

Bolter of Russ: The Bolter of Russ was crafted with perfection. It is treated as Assault 5, Str 6, AP 2, 24"


I feel this is about how he would play out on TT


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## LukeValantine (Dec 2, 2008)

You would think, but then look a agron, and all of a sudden it makes all the primarchs look like they should be bumping around with only mediocre stats.


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## Serpion5 (Mar 19, 2010)

Yes, a primarch`s stats would be nothing fancy considering what else is out there. 

S and T of 5, maybe 6 in a few cases. Skill stats would probably be at least 7 or 8. 

Armour and such would depend on the individual primarchs.


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## Warlock in Training (Jun 10, 2008)

Doelago said:


> A Alien Queen? No different, just a hit or two more and thats it. A alien queen is NOTHING compared to a Hive Tyrant. Fucking nothing. Maybe comparable to a Warrior, but nothing more. Probably less.


Really? Hive Tyrants get brought down by Col. Schaffers power sword. A power Loader and ninja badass Predator couldnt put a fukin dent on the Queen. Have you seen the movies or play the Games? Even in the Game you the Queen is to tough to gun up or smack around.


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## Malus Darkblade (Jan 8, 2010)

The Predators treat the Queens like cattle, tying them up in their ships and forcing them to produce eggs. They aren't that big of a deal.


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## JelloSea (Apr 12, 2011)

Serpion5 said:


> Yes, a primarch`s stats would be nothing fancy considering what else is out there.
> 
> S and T of 5, maybe 6 in a few cases. Skill stats would probably be at least 7 or 8.
> 
> Armour and such would depend on the individual primarchs.


A primarch would fluff wise skull hump anything you put on the board. ws of 7/8 is a maybe but likely would make most things including marines hit on a 5+ so a ws of 9 is needed. S and T of 5? dont make me laugh. A primarch is much more durable that a chapter master. I would go as far as saying at least T 7 and they can rip a tank in half with out a power fist thus should either get str9 or count as a monstrous creature and have str 8 to insta kill MeQ or 7 and have a ability where their weapons are force weapons with out a test


To be truthfully honest, the odds of a primarch dying in a 40k battle would be horrible. Fluff wise they are almost unkillable and need to be represented as such.


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## Warlock in Training (Jun 10, 2008)

Malus Darkblade said:


> The Predators treat the Queens like cattle, tying them up in their ships and forcing them to produce eggs. They aren't that big of a deal.


Yeah and many men can catch a elephant and force it into a cage. Does that mean you by yourself stand a chance forcing the Elephant into a cage? Hell no! There is a reason why Predators are in huge Clans. Once again I fail to see how a Queen is not deadly as a Hive Tyrant.


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## LukeValantine (Dec 2, 2008)

JelloSea said:


> A primarch would fluff wise skull hump anything you put on the board. ws of 7/8 is a maybe but likely would make most things including marines hit on a 5+ so a ws of 9 is needed. S and T of 5? dont make me laugh. A primarch is much more durable that a chapter master. I would go as far as saying at least T 7 and they can rip a tank in half with out a power fist thus should either get str9 or count as a monstrous creature and have str 8 to insta kill MeQ or 7 and have a ability where their weapons are force weapons with out a test
> 
> 
> To be truthfully honest, the odds of a primarch dying in a 40k battle would be horrible. Fluff wise they are almost unkillable and need to be represented as such.


I repeat they actually released the rules for using the elevated versions of agron, and he is almost identical to a run of the mill bloodthirster. So no according to GW primarchs aren't anything special without there crazy wargear and what not.


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## JelloSea (Apr 12, 2011)

LukeValantine said:


> I repeat they actually released the rules for using the elevated versions of agron, and he is almost identical to a run of the mill bloodthirster. So no according to GW primarchs aren't anything special without there crazy wargear and what not.



And ill say this, table top does NOT reflect fluff. 250 guardsmen would not beat 100 space marines. Flawed logic is flawed.


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## Shag (Jul 12, 2009)

I like to think that Magnus would call a daemon from the warp to fight it. I mean that's not using clothes or armor right? 
"Take care of my lightweight!!!"


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## Shag (Jul 12, 2009)

Doelago said:


> Should not be forgotten that the Primarchs could also just spit acid into the face of the fucker.


haha save that for the emperor cuz he's a Snake!!!


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## Shag (Jul 12, 2009)

JelloSea said:


> Leman Russ 1000 Points
> 
> (WS 9) (BS 7) (S 9) (T 9) (W 7) (I 7) (A 6*) (LD 10) (SV 2+)
> 
> ...


Dude you are making Russ way too powerful for tabletop. Angron is only 500 without his bloodthirsters that come with him.


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## Uber Ork (Aug 23, 2010)

LukeValantine said:


> So you advocate that the primarchs strength is entirely do to biological factors,


Not really, what I said was...



Uber Ork said:


> I think some of their resiliency has to do with their size.







As to just how tough a primarch is on the table top, here's the actual data sheet for Angron...











It should be noted the data sheet is a reflection of Angron *after* he's been made a daemon prince. He would be less than these stats prior to his ascension to daemonhood. 


As you can see, your Russ (*jellosea*), is considerably more powerful than the daemon powered Angron. Looking at Angron's stats, and special abilities... 

(WS 10) (BS 6) (S 7) (T 6) (W 5) (I 6) (A 6) (LD 10) (SV 3+/4+)
*Monstrous Creature, Daemon, Iron Hide, Furious Charge, Daemonic flight 


...your version of Russ would win no problem. 





JelloSea said:


> Leman Russ 1000 Points
> 
> (WS 9) (BS 7) (S 9) (T 9) (W 7) (I 7) (A 6*) (LD 10) (SV 2+)
> 
> ...




Since we already have an example of how a Primarch would play out on the table top, I think you'd need to tone Russ down a bit. 

With 2 more strength, 3 more toughness, 2 more wounds, 2-9 extra attacks from the Spear of Russ (plus the 6 attacks he already has base), an assault 5, Str 6, AP 2, 24" weapon that shoots at BS 7, a 2+ armor save, 2+ invul. save, and a can never be taken away 3+ (sometimes 2+) FNP roll... he'll crush Angron 10 out of 10 times.


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## Killystar Gul Dakka (Mar 20, 2011)

Ugggh! Argument makes head hurt...(rolls "1") 'Eadbanger....aaaahhhh relief

Conclusions that have been drawn
1) Aliens is a cool movie
2) Predators beat up Aliens
3) Arnold beats up Predators
4) Stallone beats up Arnold
5) Stallone is Marbo
6) Marbo *couldn't* beat up a Chapter Master
7) a Chapter Master *couldn't* beat up a Primarch
8) Primarch don't beat up Alien; he fornicates eye-socket
9) JelloSea is Matt Wards 3rd cousin


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