# Flying Hive Tyrant build dilemma



## Wookiepelt (Jan 29, 2013)

As some of you on here may know, I'm currently in the process of build my son's X'mas/B-day prezzies consisting of a large swarm of Nids! Among them is the Hive Tyrant model which we've kinda decided to build as the flying version.

Now comes the dilemma... how should we kit this Flyrant out? Rules and game-play wise, my gut instincts is to simply have it with the bonesword and lashwhip plus wings as it automatically has the Vector-strike rule due to it being a flying monstrous creature. No real issues for a minor conversion to have the wings plus two sets of armaments but if I don't need to do any conversions, I'd rather save that time and spend it building the rest of the Nids (and getting on with my other armies/conversions/painting/household-DIY chores(!)).

My main queries are:

1. Do I really need to equip the Flyrant with a range weapon like the stranglethorn cannon or the heavy venom cannon on top of the CC weapons?

2. If I vector strike the Flyrant, can I still use the range weapon during the shooting phase if I only have one? My read of the vector-strike rules seems to indicate that I can't as vector-striking appears to count as having shot once already during the shooting phase!?! i.e. I can only shoot a range weapon if I have a second one, otherwise I'm only allowed to run during this phase?

Any suggestions and help in clarifying this will be greatly appreciated!


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## MidnightSun (Feb 10, 2009)

Wookiepelt said:


> 1. Do I really need to equip the Flyrant with a range weapon like the stranglethorn cannon or the heavy venom cannon on top of the CC weapons?


You really ought to run two sets of Devourers with Brainleech Worms for a Flyrant, as it becomes an exceedingly efficient anti-everything tool. 10-12 Str6 hits is going to make a mess of any tank as you will always be shooting rear armour, and infantry evaporate against it too. If you're set on Lash Whip/Bonesword, I'd probably take basic Scything Talons to keep it pretty cheap (and do they give you an extra attack? Confuzzling rules for new Tyranids).



Wookiepelt said:


> 2. If I vector strike the Flyrant, can I still use the range weapon during the shooting phase if I only have one? My read of the vector-strike rules seems to indicate that I can't as vector-striking appears to count as having shot once already during the shooting phase!?! i.e. I can only shoot a range weapon if I have a second one, otherwise I'm only allowed to run during this phase?


Yes, you count as shooting one weapon if you Vector Strike so you can only shoot one gun in the Shooting Phase. However, Monstrous Creatures can shoot two weapons per turn, so you can Vector Strike + fire one gun or fire two guns per turn.


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## Wookiepelt (Jan 29, 2013)

MidnightSun said:


> You really ought to run two sets of Devourers with Brainleech Worms for a Flyrant, as it becomes an exceedingly efficient anti-everything tool. 10-12 Str6 hits is going to make a mess of any tank as you will always be shooting rear armour, and infantry evaporate against it too.


Hmm... that is definitely worth considering.



> If you're set on Lash Whip/Bonesword, I'd probably take basic Scything Talons to keep it pretty cheap (and do they give you an extra attack? Confuzzling rules for new Tyranids).


The Lash Whip/Bonesword option provides a +3 Initiative bonus in CC (LW) and Instant Death on 6's fo wounds. They nerfed the old Scything Talons re-roll rules but since the Flyrant has as default 2 sets of Scything Talons, exchanging 1 set for the WL/BS combo (not a specialist weapon classification) should still count as two sets of standard melee weapons so should have the +1 Attack bonus in CC. This is assuming no ranged weapons substituting the second set of Scything Talons.



> Yes, you count as shooting one weapon if you Vector Strike so you can only shoot one gun in the Shooting Phase. However, Monstrous Creatures can shoot two weapons per turn, so you can Vector Strike + fire one gun or fire two guns per turn.


Thanks for this clarification and reminder on Monstrous Creatures.


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## MidnightSun (Feb 10, 2009)

Wookiepelt said:


> The Lash Whip/Bonesword option provides a +3 Initiative bonus in CC (LW) and Instant Death on 6's fo wounds. They nerfed the old Scything Talons re-roll rules but since the Flyrant has as default 2 sets of Scything Talons, exchanging 1 set for the WL/BS combo (not a specialist weapon classification) should still count as two sets of standard melee weapons so should have the +1 Attack bonus in CC. This is assuming no ranged weapons substituting the second set of Scything Talons


In that case, go with two sets of Devourers (especially as Nids lack native Skyfire and now that the Hive Tyrant has BS4) if you're bringing a ranged weapon at all - if you're bringing the Whip/Sword, then stick to Scything Talons and add Adrenal Glands and Old Adversary. I would, however, recommend the Devourer setup if you find yourself facing any AV12 flyers or more than one AV11 flyer. AV10 is Vector Strike fodder so no worries there :victory:

EDIT: Also, the feet for the Flying Hive Tyrant are Scything Talons, so no conversion required


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## Jdojo18 (May 8, 2012)

I'm going to try and tell you that a walking tyrant with guard is a better bet for this codex as it is less of a fire magnet and cover saves are more available. plus the synapse would be harder to kill off. That being said, you probably shouldn't listen to me and just build what you want! Flying tyrants definitely look cool and are fun to play with or against. 

I just played a game against one yesterday.


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## Wookiepelt (Jan 29, 2013)

MidnightSun said:


> In that case, go with two sets of Devourers (especially as Nids lack native Skyfire and now that the Hive Tyrant has BS4) if you're bringing a ranged weapon at all - if you're bringing the Whip/Sword, then stick to Scything Talons and add Adrenal Glands and Old Adversary. I would, however, recommend the Devourer setup if you find yourself facing any AV12 flyers or more than one AV11 flyer. AV10 is Vector Strike fodder so no worries there :victory:
> 
> EDIT: Also, the feet for the Flying Hive Tyrant are Scything Talons, so no conversion required


I think you've just solved my dilemma. Forming the idea in my mind now but basically by magnetising the lower arm slots, I'll be able to have both combos!

1. CC configuration - Lashwhip/Bonesword in the lower arm slot and Scything Talons on the feet... Done!

2. Double TL Devourer configuation - double Devourer cone conversion to count as one TL Devourer, so having one in each lower arm slot equals 2 TL Devourers. Scything Talon on feet remain as simply feet for aesthetical reasons only.


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## Wookiepelt (Jan 29, 2013)

Jdojo18 said:


> I'm going to try and tell you that a walking tyrant with guard is a better bet for this codex as it is less of a fire magnet and cover saves are more available. plus the synapse would be harder to kill off. That being said, you probably shouldn't listen to me and just build what you want! Flying tyrants definitely look cool and are fun to play with or against.
> 
> I just played a game against one yesterday.


I was thinking that as well originally but I believe there is enough "spares" in the kit plus some bitz hunting to build both versions for flexibility. After that I'll have to attempt to explain the choice options to a 7 year-old!!! :scratchhead:


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## MidnightSun (Feb 10, 2009)

Jdojo18 said:


> I'm going to try and tell you that a walking tyrant with guard is a better bet for this codex as it is less of a fire magnet and cover saves are more available. plus the synapse would be harder to kill off.


The thing is, the mobility and anti-air is really, really important for Nids, and while synapse is also vital, it can be gained through other choices (mainly Tervigons, which everybody seems to think are terrible now that they're not the staple of the Codex, but also Zoanthropes and Warriors), anti-air options are quite limited.


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## Jdojo18 (May 8, 2012)

MidnightSun said:


> The thing is, the mobility and anti-air is really, really important for Nids, and while synapse is also vital, it can be gained through other choices (mainly Tervigons, which everybody seems to think are terrible now that they're not the staple of the Codex, but also Zoanthropes and Warriors), anti-air options are quite limited.


I just always see the flyrant die by turn two or three because of its 4 wounds and 3+ save and no chance of LOS. They were really good in the last codex, but synapse is so important right now. The use of the flyrant is about 50/50 with nid players right now that the walking tyrant and the flyrant both find their uses in lists. 

Unless nids go against 3 or more fliers, the swarms of bugs can either ignore the fliers, or clog the board with bodies to make it hard for the fliers to actually be placed. I do the same with my orks. 

But again, flyrants are good, but I've always been left unimpressed


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## SilverTabby (Jul 31, 2009)

I may be reading it wrong, but I thought you only got the +1 attack for having two pairs of CC weapons. LW/BS isn't a paired set, it's two seperate weapons?

If I'm wrong, then that's awesome :grin:


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## iamtheeviltwin (Nov 12, 2012)

SilverTabby said:


> LW/BS isn't a paired set, it's two seperate weapons?


The LW/BS has it's own entry in the weapon table separate from either the Bonesword or Lashwhip entries, which to me indicates it is considered a weapon pair.


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## Jdojo18 (May 8, 2012)

Wookiepelt said:


> I was thinking that as well originally but I believe there is enough "spares" in the kit plus some bitz hunting to build both versions for flexibility. After that I'll have to attempt to explain the choice options to a 7 year-old!!! :scratchhead:


I had a feeling it was for a young blood so that's why I said to just ignore me haha winged tyrants look way cooler, especially when you're young


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## SilverTabby (Jul 31, 2009)

iamtheeviltwin said:


> The LW/BS has it's own entry in the weapon table separate from either the Bonesword or Lashwhip entries, which to me indicates it is considered a weapon pair.


Very true. Bonehead assumption on my part :wink:


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