# yet another price increase



## admiraldick (Sep 9, 2008)

There will be _another _price increase effective on the 1st of June. 

okay so that's the news, here's my little break down of the events.

i don't know about you but personally i find this a little distasteful. it seems pretty clear that GW are abusing their position as market leaders, and that they expect us as the customers to take it, because we have done every other time.

if we just run a couple of quick comparisons for a moment we can see the scale of the issue (all of these models are plastic multi-part kits):

Cadians by GW - £15 for 10 = £1.50 per miniature
Zombie Horde by Wargames Factory - £17 for 24 = 71p per model
Roman Legionnaires by Warlord Games - £17 for 30 = 57p per miniature
American Civil War Soldiers by Perry Miniatures - £15 for 36 = 41p per model
French Napoleonic Infantry by Vitrix - £20 for 60 = 33p per model

even Privateer Press don't seem to have a problem doing it; they going to release their first multi-part plastic kit for models which are roughly equivalent to terminators (and a darn site more detailed) for $5 less than GW do their models for.

there are numerous other models that i could point to, but i think that illustrates the point. GW models are good, in many cases the best of their kind in the world, but they are not worth twice as much as the next competitor.

i realise that in the current financial climate where businesses' futures are unsure they need to be setting themselves up for future difficulties, but i'm not convinced that pumping us for every penny we are worth is going to build up the kind of brand loyalty that they need.


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## bitsandkits (Mar 18, 2008)

how come you are quoting 10 Cadians at £15? the bols site mentions Battleforces increasing by £5 and the odd other increase,cant see anything about the ten man squad going up by another £3


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## Treewizard648 (Feb 4, 2009)

I have a couple solutions to the price increases: 

1) SPEND LESS ON GW STUFF! Fall back and finish whatever models that need completion for the time being. 

2) Look for extra work, my new gothic fleet has been fueled by doing yard work, washing cars, and other random tasks or chores I do for my neighbors. Or there is always finding a second job.


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## beenburned (May 15, 2008)

Hot damn that's cheeky. They'll be getting away with it though, because no matter how much we bitch and moan, we'll still keep buying their stuff. Damn.


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## radical_psyker (Jun 6, 2008)

bitsandkits said:


> how come you are quoting 10 Cadians at £15? the bols site mentions Battleforces increasing by £5 and the odd other increase,cant see anything about the ten man squad going up by another £3


Yep, gotta agree with *bitsandkits* here (although I couldn't care less what BoLS has to say) there has been no confirmation that the lower end price band plastic kits will be going up in June. Information to hand is that it's only some metals and upper end plastics like the Battleforces that are going up.

Oh, and as to the rest of the OP's post... *yawn*


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## Nemesis-The-Warlock (Jun 10, 2008)

someone has confirmed it on warseer but no idea how "confirmed" that makes it to be fair and that's probably where the original idea came from


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## Codex Todd (Mar 22, 2009)

tbh guys why we talking about this?? as beenburned has said we're still gonna buy the stuff we want/need! just give the wife more to moan about


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## Stuntiesrule (Mar 22, 2009)

why would they not raise their prices until we stop buying boat loads of their product for huge amounts of cash they have no reason to not raise prices. the only thing that truly saddens me about a price increase is the loss of new young gamers who honestly without a job will not be able to afford this luxury, and even if they have a job most of their paycheck would have to go towards minis just to start an army. GW has a loyal customer base what they are bad at is expanding it to the young less afluent members of the world.


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## JokerGod (Jan 21, 2009)

Nemesis-The-Warlock said:


> someone has confirmed it on warseer but no idea how "confirmed" that makes it to be fair and that's probably where the original idea came from


The way it works is you send an E-mail to BoL saying you know some one that knows some one that works at GW and they instantly believe you. Thats why people still think the SW codex is already written, because that one guy that knows that guy that is friends with the guy that works at GW told him so.

And I STILL find it funny that GW gets blamed for the increase in cost to make the models. the way all of you make it sound is that you want them to take more loss out there 1% profit just so you don't have to pay a few extra bucks for models you will use for years. but you will still go out and spend 50$ for a video game that you will only play for a few months at the most.


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## Abomination (Jul 6, 2008)

GW really should try to reduce costs and make themselves more efficient. Other model company's (dont know what you call them, GW clones?) can release superior models for less. There is no doubt more price increases are greed and abuse of their position only. However, we all know we are going to continue to buy their stuff, therefore making them think its fine and so the cycle continues. Still, if your smart, you don't need to buy your models, there are ways of acquiring items you know.


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## anarchyfever (May 24, 2008)

you really have to think what goes into 1 box, you have the printer, the set designer, the molds, the original molds, the design artist for the model (who have brought out some very detailed plastics this year), the background, the graphics artist, the cost of plastic or metal, the eletricity cost, the painters (Evy metal team) etc, all of these people are pros in their feild and need money they can live off. 

Then they have to work against internet sellers, people who buy most of GWs products from ebay, people abroud who make illegal copies and sell them for personal profit, brothers who give their little brother 2000 pts worth of space marines becuase they have moved onto eldar etc, a lot of this money never sees GWs hands. 

So I think it's a little condonsenting to complain about the price of a box of models when their selling them pretty cheap considering how much they could sell them for and what some other companies do sell their models for.


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## DeathJester921 (Feb 15, 2009)

Stuntiesrule said:


> why would they not raise their prices until we stop buying boat loads of their product for huge amounts of cash they have no reason to not raise prices. the only thing that truly saddens me about a price increase is the loss of new young gamers who honestly without a job will not be able to afford this luxury, and even if they have a job most of their paycheck would have to go towards minis just to start an army. GW has a loyal customer base what they are bad at is expanding it to the young less afluent members of the world.


I agree with you. Plus I dont even have a job yet, but I do get payed every 2 weeks for allowance. Except i'm also paying for a WoW account and with 30 bucks every 2 weeks comin in, I only have 30 to spend. The other 15 bucks the first week go into savings. With a price increase here in the U.S. I'll have to save up my money even longer so I wont be able to buy the models I need for my SM army. The upside to this is i'll have time to paint the army I have right now.


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## Rahmiel (Jan 3, 2009)

Honestly I can agree with both sides of the argument here. GW doesn't make a whole lot of their stuff now, so that could justify a price hike so they can stay in the market. The thing I don't agree with is how they are only making such a low profit on models that are seemingly overpriced. Example look at other mini companies, Reaper is a good one. They have really nice minis,some of which rival GW in my opinion, for almost a 3rd of GW prices and all of their range is metal. So it can't be a price raise in metal that causes their prices to go up and plastic is supposed to be a cheaper yet alternative, but if plastics are increasing then whats the deal? GW has been seeming to step away from the hobby part of the hobby, look at some of the recent minis, fewer parts. Look at WD its a sales magazine anymore. I used to love reading the articles packed full of painting guides and other information, now every other page is an add, and the magazine went up 3 dollars in u.s. No other magazine has had to increase its price? Wierd. I love GW products and will no doubt continue to buy them, but it would be nice for them to step back and make cheaper minis to hook the rest of the world on their games. By lowering prices and producing more you sell more.


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## nightfish (Feb 16, 2009)

They will eventually price themselves out of the market. While we know that independent stockists / eBay is the way to go, the parents of kids new to the hobby will still buy from GW. The problem will be is when said parents look at how much its costing to fund son / daughters hobby and say, actually this is too much. Sales go down, GW loses more money than its actually doing at the moment and the hobby is consigned to history.

I can see a couple of problems in the UK

1. They employ far far too many people at the HQ on very large salaries instead of creating more front line staff in stores.

2. They have failed to get the grasp of marketing. If they decided to put a limited range of products in major toy stores it may give better returns. For example I saw the original LOTR game in WH Smiths (Book / stationary etc store) when it was first released and I thought it was a good idea. Getting it out in a well-known, centrally located outlet means the game was viewed by people who may never visit or even know what GW is.

3. They were heavily reliant on said LOTR and when interest ran out so did a large amount of cash hence why the other systems have suffered with price increases. Saying that, with the upcoming new films in that universe maybe they will experience a 'boom' time again.


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## JokerGod (Jan 21, 2009)

Abomination said:


> GW really should try to reduce costs and make themselves more efficient. Other model company's (dont know what you call them, GW clones?) can release superior models for less. There is no doubt more price increases are greed and abuse of their position only. However, we all know we are going to continue to buy their stuff, therefore making them think its fine and so the cycle continues. Still, if your smart, you don't need to buy your models, there are ways of acquiring items you know.


That has to be the most ignorant thing I have heard yet. How can you compare a company that has a select few things being cast to a company that not only created but updates not one but 3 full games and many lesser games and produces more models than any other company out there right now. You can't and its pure stupidity that you would even think they are the same or even have close to the same operation costs.

GW can't control the price of materials, power, shipping, packaging, and whop knows what els. Its a hard time and GW is not in a place where they can afford to take anything as a loss.


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## inquisitoryorei (Nov 25, 2007)

Rahmiel said:


> Honestly I can agree with both sides of the argument here. GW doesn't make a whole lot of their stuff now, so that could justify a price hike so they can stay in the market. The thing I don't agree with is how they are only making such a low profit on models that are seemingly overpriced. Example look at other mini companies, Reaper is a good one. They have really nice minis,some of which rival GW in my opinion, for almost a 3rd of GW prices and all of their range is metal. So it can't be a price raise in metal that causes their prices to go up and plastic is supposed to be a cheaper yet alternative, but if plastics are increasing then whats the deal? GW has been seeming to step away from the hobby part of the hobby, look at some of the recent minis, fewer parts. Look at WD its a sales magazine anymore. I used to love reading the articles packed full of painting guides and other information, now every other page is an add, and the magazine went up 3 dollars in u.s. No other magazine has had to increase its price? Wierd. I love GW products and will no doubt continue to buy them, but it would be nice for them to step back and make cheaper minis to hook the rest of the world on their games. By lowering prices and producing more you sell more.





Reaper makes their own molds and produces their own models. GW pays another company to do so.


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## inquisitoryorei (Nov 25, 2007)

nightfish said:


> They will eventually price themselves out of the market. While we know that independent stockists / eBay is the way to go, the parents of kids new to the hobby will still buy from GW. The problem will be is when said parents look at how much its costing to fund son / daughters hobby and say, actually this is too much. Sales go down, GW loses more money than its actually doing at the moment and the hobby is consigned to history.
> 
> I can see a couple of problems in the UK
> 
> ...



i agree with point 2. they should try getting product into other non-hobby stores. as much as i hate to say it, i would love to see their stuff on shelves in wal-mart as this is the only store close enough to my place that i could buy from at this time. :ireful2:


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## Svartmetall (Jun 16, 2008)

nightfish said:


> 1. They employ far far too many people at the HQ on very large salaries...


Trust me. Most of the people working at GWHQ are definitely not on a 'very large salary'.


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## lawrence96 (Sep 1, 2008)

JokerGod said:


> GW can't control the price of materials, power, shipping, packaging, and who knows what else. Its a hard time and GW is not in a place where they can afford to take anything as a loss.


well they can control the price of packaging to an extent, for example why cant the boxes be a plain white, with black writing saying "Cadian Shock Troops" (or you know whatever)? why the pretty pictures? i personally dont look at the 'Eavy Metal painting examples on the back. Cut back on the pictures on the box and save a bundle.

Materials is another difficult one, maybe trying switching to a recycled plastic? then they might get some sort of subsidiary from the goverment for being green.


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## JokerGod (Jan 21, 2009)

lawrence96 said:


> well they can control the price of packaging to an extent, for example why cant the boxes be a plain white, with black writing saying "Cadian Shock Troops" (or you know whatever)? why the pretty pictures? i personally dont look at the 'Eavy Metal painting examples on the back. Cut back on the pictures on the box and save a bundle.
> 
> Materials is another difficult one, maybe trying switching to a recycled plastic? then they might get some sort of subsidiary from the goverment for being green.


Yes, they should remove the thing that draws new people to there product, thats smart marketing.

And if they use a recycled plastic every one here would cry to no end about how shity the models are and how they fall apart and look like shit. 

We expect high standards from GW, but then you all bitch and moan because you have to pay the price for it.


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## TrintLord (Apr 2, 2009)

Being in the process of trying to create my own miniatures game I can understand the pricing on many of the models I see. In most cases a good sculptor will cost about $300 an inch of height for a model. Casting varies by type. Hand pour molds are about 90, Rotocast is around $150, and Injection (GW and highest quality) is almost $500-$3000 depending on size. It is not a cheap process. With Reaper the owners are the sculptors and so they make do with the sales they have, others (GW, PP, and others) often have many sculptors they have to pay and so cost a little more for that.

Buying your own casting equipment also saves money. But when you can pay someone $150 to cast your model or pay $30,000 for the equipment yourself, most take the former route.


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## bitsandkits (Mar 18, 2008)

Like many of you i am not happy at the prospect of paying more for GW models,But by the same token price increases are simply part of life,Many of you think that the price increase can simply be dismissed by GW if they make what you see as simple in house changes or that GW cant justify an increase in price because "the competition" is selling for less.

Making in house changes could easily cut costs, but at what cost to the player? to reduce costs GW would close down stores as they are the largest drain on the company,and most of these closures would be overseas( im in the UK) because this would save them money two fold one because no rent or staff to pay and two no international shipping of goods produced in the uk,plus no import taxes etc.

Personally i think that would be a step backwards for the company and the hobby. 

GW in the uk already supply a large chain of stores in the form of hobby craft and they carry a lare range too, as did toyworld until they went under and you could also buy the models in virgin mega stores too again they also went under.Major retailers are a pain in the ass, they want the stock for nothing, they want sale or return,they are only interested in a range for the next six months or the next big thing,they want movie tie in's,cartoon shows and fads,major retailers are far too fickle to carry any of the GW range.

I also think its a little crazy to compare an international company that has hundreds of stores world wide,two manufacturing facilities that have been consistently great for 20 plus years with the likes of reaper,privateer and the rest of the small games companies,these companies are only making money and models because of GW's consistent success,these companies are tiny and have far less overheads, the models they sell are not required to support a huge infrastructure which is in place to support many thousands of players all over the globe,how many of the smaller companies have stores? and how many of those stores allow players to play the games they produce for free 7 days a weeks with trained staff helping introduce new blood to the hobby?

No one wants to pay more, i totally agree with that sentiment,but i can put my hand on my heart and say honestly that if GW require me to pay more for miniatures so that they stay at the quality produced in 2008/2009 then so be it.


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## Svartmetall (Jun 16, 2008)

I do believe *bitsandkits* hit the nail on the injection-moulded head.


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## Stuntiesrule (Mar 22, 2009)

After reading many of the posts, I agree a lot of work goes in to each model but how many people buy GW products. Yes they have high costs but when you own a company that can sell one box of cadian shock troopers 1000 times or more then what are they worried about. I don't blame them for seeking more profit they have a fun game that brings a lot of people together in a common place and that is cool they should get paid for it but they have been in business long enough and I know the only game coming close to them near me is Warmachine/Hordes by PP. Thats my 2 cents but I understand everyone who has posted.


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## JokerGod (Jan 21, 2009)

Stuntiesrule said:


> After reading many of the posts, I agree a lot of work goes in to each model but how many people buy GW products. Yes they have high costs but when you own a company that can sell one box of cadian shock troopers 1000 times or more then what are they worried about. I don't blame them for *seeking more profit* they have a fun game that brings a lot of people together in a common place and that is cool they should get paid for it but they have been in business long enough and I know the only game coming close to them near me is Warmachine/Hordes by PP. Thats my 2 cents but I understand everyone who has posted.


Have you seen there last report? They are only making 1% profit after everything, most company's would close up shop and call it a day if they even fell to 5% profit. GW is one of the few companys out there that is not money hungry, they can not only about there players but there indapendant sellers as well. Do you really think places like WayLand games, MiniWargaming, the Warstore or your local shop could sell you GW product at 10%-25% off if GW wasn't giving them 40% off to retailers? No other company dos that.


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## BDJV (Dec 15, 2008)

Wow, no other miniatures company raises prices every year. GW does it because we the GW hobbyist choose to keep buying. 

Look at the new IG squad boxes for an example of price gouging. We used to get 20 models for 35 USD now we'll get 10 of the exact same models for 22 USD. Absurd!

With every price hike I see more and more gamers moving away from GW to other games that are cheaper to play. 

Flames of War is the perfect example, I'd venture that at least 75% of the FOW fanbase are ex-40Kers. (Locally it's closer to 90 percent)

The GW pricing scheme and their inability to write clear concise rules is hurting them; at least it is here in the States.

I'm not saying that I'm quitting but I won't be making many large purchases from GW in the near future. I'm just glad I bought like a mad man when I worked for GW at 60 percent off! I've got 400+ metal IG and a dozen or so tanks to still paint.


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## BlackTemplar93 (Apr 9, 2009)

are you serious you get 60PERCENT OFF WHILE WORKING AT GW????????AAAAAAARRRRGGGGGGHHHHHH!!!!!!Why havent you told me earlier, now that i got that damn McDonalds part-time thing....i'll go to my closest gw shop tommorow.......60fu*&cking PERCENT!!!!!but yeah im still a student and price increases suck with my $200 per month budget...


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## nightfish (Feb 16, 2009)

bitsandkits said:


> No one wants to pay more, i totally agree with that sentiment,but i can put my hand on my heart and say honestly that if GW require me to pay more for miniatures so that they stay at the quality produced in 2008/2009 then so be it.


Quality? I would say that a majority of the models that have been produced recently have been horrid especially for warhammer. All this OTT dynamic posing. urgh!


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## Lord Sinkoran (Dec 23, 2006)

for fuck sake not another price increase this is just getting stupid.


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## bitsandkits (Mar 18, 2008)

nightfish said:


> Quality? I would say that a majority of the models that have been produced recently have been horrid especially for warhammer. All this OTT dynamic posing. urgh!


Come on nightfish can you honestly say that the overall quality of the products GW have produced in the last 18 months is worse than the previous years? Bearing in mind your choosen army is dark eldar i would have thought you would welcome new models in any form?
I can understand that some models may not tick all the boxes for you, but OTT dynamic posing aside, can you still honestly say that the new dark elf cold one knights for example are worse than the previous set? also bearing in mind they cost half the price ?and what about the new chaos knights?are they also worse?
What about AOBR? surely you cant say that this set is of worse quality than battle for maccrage?what about the super heavies?and new ork range? if you can find me a Ork player who would prefer the old range to the new i will show you someone who has no cash to spend and is kidding themselves. 

I dont want to sound like i am defending a price rise,I would prefer we all pay less for everything(such as fuel,food,mortgage etc) But if a price rise on battleforces and some odd other kits means that GW keep producing things like the baneblade,stompa and Valkyrie and keeps the company afloat during the recession its a small price to pay,after all how many battleforces do you buy in a year? how many lord of the rings models do you buy? because thats were the price increase is effecting as i understand it?


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## Stella Cadente (Dec 25, 2006)

admiraldick said:


> French Napoleonic Infantry by Vitrix - £20 for 60 = 33p per model


oh no, £20 for 60 amazing models, how will anyone survive, talk about bargain of the century, GW could learn a few things


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## Jezlad (Oct 14, 2006)

> I also think its a little crazy to compare an international company that has hundreds of stores world wide,two manufacturing facilities that have been consistently great for 20 plus years with the likes of reaper,privateer and the rest of the small games companies,these companies are only making money and models because of GW's consistent success,these companies are tiny and have far less overheads, the models they sell are not required to support a huge infrastructure which is in place to support many thousands of players all over the globe,how many of the smaller companies have stores? and how many of those stores allow players to play the games they produce for free 7 days a weeks with trained staff helping introduce new blood to the hobby?


This is a 100% flawed point. 

We should pay more for GW products because they're a big company?... 

"Welcome to Tesco/Walmart, we have more stores and bigger overheads than BillyBobs Convenience Store so expect to pay more. Oh, and have a nice day!"



> No one wants to pay more, i totally agree with that sentiment,but i can put my hand on my heart and say honestly that if GW require me to pay more for miniatures so that they stay at the quality produced in 2008/2009 then so be it.


If people dropped this strange self flagellating mentality the bigwigs at GW might rethink their business plan.

£8 for a catalogue! They charge you to buy a catalogue!! :laugh:


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## bitsandkits (Mar 18, 2008)

sorry jez but i think that you have misunderstood my post, i didnt say we should pay more because GW is a large company, i said that we are paying more because GW is a large company, like i said i dont want to pay any more, but putting other model producers as a yard stick to measure GW by is wrong because it is not a direct comparison.

If PP was the same size as GW and they sold equal quality products for less while maintaining a chain of world wide stores etc then i would completely agree that GW were taking the piss out of players,but until they are in that position it not a realistic yard stick to measure GW by.

I agree than if people did stop spending with GW would need to rethink what they do, but i dont think that the out come would be a drop in prices, more that they would start striping away the non profit /less profitable making sections of the company,ie shops.


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## JokerGod (Jan 21, 2009)

Jez, how can you compare company's that don't create anything to a company that dos? Wall mart doesn't produce any of there products, they but it from the companys that do and re-sell it, just like the countless indapendant retailers, if you go to Sony do they sell the TVs for the same price as wall mart? No. If you go to Bits and kits do they sell for the same price as GW? No. 

The companys that create the products we but sell them to us at higher prices, how ever they also sell it to small retailers for a lot less so that they can give us the discounts we all love to see. If GW started to sell everything at 25% off like most indi retailers we would see less of them, they are supporting the gaming communality, there own stores AND the private sellers. People don't see that because they don't look it from an economical stand point, they just see another 1-2$ added on to the price tag and start to scream and yell they they are being ripped off.


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## Jezlad (Oct 14, 2006)

Independent retailers around here sell the GW products for exactly the same price as the GW does... you're mixing bricks and mortar businesses up with online retailers here. They (most) don't have overheads, and they're competing with all the other online retailers so they have to go cheap to draw custom. 

Personally I don't care what GW charge, £40 for a plastic model is a £40 worthier purchase than a brain numbing obesity inducing video game. 

Its clear what their long term strategy is - get the kids hooked on cheap starter sets such as AOBR then rape the parents with expensive "compulsory" follow up purchases. I just hope it doesn't draw the veterans away from the hobby.


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## Chaosftw (Oct 20, 2008)

Jezlad said:


> Its clear what their long term strategy is - get the kids hooked on cheap starter sets such as AOBR then rape the parents with expensive "compulsory" follow up purchases. I just hope it doesn't draw the veterans away from the hobby.


Might be the best line I have ever seen! I am crying... +rep haha!

Well said Jez.

Chaosftw


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## Nemesis-The-Warlock (Jun 10, 2008)

Jezlad said:


> Its clear what their long term strategy is - get the kids hooked on cheap starter sets such as AOBR then rape the parents with expensive "compulsory" follow up purchases. I just hope it doesn't draw the veterans away from the hobby.


a good few years back (mid 90's) something similar to that happened, 

after a few price rises sales slumped and GW decided to stagger price rises, 

price rises are coming but we don't have enough info about where they will be coming yet (except battleforces), to come to a complete view of what is happening


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## inqusitor_me (Jan 27, 2008)

i rember a 10 man tac squad use to be £12.
but with GW modles getting alot more detailed and the kits getting better its only enebitable (i think thats the spelling) that the price will go up


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## Stella Cadente (Dec 25, 2006)

inqusitor_me said:


> i remember a 10 man tac squad use to be £12.
> but with GW models getting allot more detailed and the kits getting better its only inevitable that the price will go up


I dunno about that, when I compare an old tactical marines from the £12 days to a new marine in these £18 days, I can't see any difference in quality, just a slight one in size, sure people will say about how GW need to increase price because of material and mold cost, but how come Victrix can do better and sell you 60 models for £2 more than what you pay for 10?


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## Svartmetall (Jun 16, 2008)

Stella Cadente said:


> ...compare an old tactical marines from the £12 days to a new marine in these £18 days...


 One thing to bear in mind is this - how long ago (as I'm kind of a newbie to this hobby still) were they £12 compared to the current £18? I'm thinking of inflation and so forth, and what the relative pricing over time may have been...


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## cccp (Dec 15, 2006)

the thing with increasing prices by large amounts every so often is that its not a long term business strategy, really. theres only so much people will pay before enough is enough and they move on to a cheaper alternative, or stop altogether. this is especially true if the price rises are consistantly above inflation, meaning gamers have to spend a higher and higher proportion of their income of toy soldiers. again, there comes a point where this becomes unacceptable, especially during the kind of financial climate we all live in.

to answer stella, while the standard core boxed sets have stayed fairly static in price (only rising, as far as i know from £15 three or for years ago to £18, and having stayed static since) the biggest increases have come on blisters and hobby supplies. i would say a pot of paint increasing in price from £2 to £2.50 is a far higher percentage rise that is higher than three years worth of inflation.

GW should try and deal with the root of their financial problems, whatever they are and wherever they stem from.


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## rdlb (Nov 30, 2008)

They're not selling life-saving drugs!!

There are no compulsory purchases. I played with the 2nd edition box set and the cardboard ork dreadnought forever!!!! When I wanted a predator or a marine with a Lascannon my parents said "No."


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## inquisitoryorei (Nov 25, 2007)

BDJV said:


> Wow, no other miniatures company raises prices every year. GW does it because we the GW hobbyist choose to keep buying.
> 
> Look at the new IG squad boxes for an example of price gouging. We used to get 20 models for 35 USD now we'll get 10 of the exact same models for 22 USD. Absurd!
> 
> ...



ive been playing for almost six years now and the prices have only increased twice in that time. and that was mostly for the metal models.

ALSO, WHERE IS THE CONFIRMED PRICE INCREASE ANNOUNCEMENT FROM GW?


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## LordWaffles (Jan 15, 2008)

I'll buy more when they start putting out faqs.(RIGHT after I buy my -last- chaos marine squad!)

Kinda hard to buy plastic spacemen when the rules(something we can't buy, and cost little to nothing to produce) are broken.

"What do your plastic spacemen do?"
"I-I don't know..."
"Wanna play warmachine?"
"No. Krueger always wins."

Seriously. I wouldn't mind the pricing if they just spent the thirty cents to pay steve from accounting to type up another faq regarding how seer councils can't take bikes and ork nobs can't take powerklawz....and how daemon princes cost another hundred points when equipped with wings.


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## inquisitoryorei (Nov 25, 2007)

i have never heard of a lot of the games that are being mentioned here. maybe they are cheaper because the companies that make them dont do as much advertising or have their own stores.

also, as far as the issue with the other big companies selling stuff cheaper. one question. how much does a 6 inch batman figure cost to buy? around $7.99 at walmart here in maine where i live and the quality is horrible. i know some of you are thinking "what does that have to do with anything?", but think about it for awhile.



cccp said:


> the thing with increasing prices by large amounts every so often is that its not a long term business strategy, really. theres only so much people will pay before enough is enough and they move on to a cheaper alternative, or stop altogether. this is especially true if the price rises are consistantly above inflation, meaning gamers have to spend a higher and higher proportion of their income of toy soldiers. again, there comes a point where this becomes unacceptable, especially during the kind of financial climate we all live in.
> 
> to answer stella, while the standard core boxed sets have stayed fairly static in price (only rising, as far as i know from £15 three or for years ago to £18, and having stayed static since) the biggest increases have come on blisters and hobby supplies. i would say a pot of paint increasing in price from £2 to £2.50 is a far higher percentage rise that is higher than three years worth of inflation.
> 
> GW should try and deal with the root of their financial problems, whatever they are and wherever they stem from.


prices havnt increased by "large amounts" at all.



LordWaffles said:


> I'll buy more when they start putting out faqs.(RIGHT after I buy my -last- chaos marine squad!)
> 
> Kinda hard to buy plastic spacemen when the rules(something we can't buy, and cost little to nothing to produce) are broken.
> 
> ...


they're called "codexes" my good sir. get one.


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## Wachaza (Mar 20, 2008)

GW're barely making a profit after several years of losses. Clearly they need a price rise to try and maintain profitability. No body likes it. GW aren't doing it to piss you off.

GW's problem compare dto all the competitors mentioned is that they ahve much bigger overheads. Their own factories. To be efficient they need to run them constantly. Their own distribution, their own stores, their own magazines, based in the UK with a minimum wage, UK production not made in China. Their overheads are higher. 

No body sees sales figures but in the UK GW sells more through one shop tahn the combined UK sales of Warmachine. Go on ebay and search for warhmmaer 9000 hits.
warmachine 97 hits. 

1% of the specialist ebay market. Less than that when you look at the general sales.


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## BDJV (Dec 15, 2008)

inquisitoryorei said:


> ive been playing for almost six years now and the prices have only increased twice in that time. and that was mostly for the metal models.
> 
> ALSO, WHERE IS THE CONFIRMED PRICE INCREASE ANNOUNCEMENT FROM GW?


You need to pay more attention then because GW does raise prices every year. Not on everything but they do it selectively every year. The only prices that seem to have normalized are the plastic kits as most of them have not risen in about 6 years. They are putting the screws to the customers on the price of metal models.

The confirmation is in the May White Dwarf.


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## JerryDaMouse (Feb 28, 2009)

If you check the GW website you can find their previous annual stock report. 
http://investor.games-workshop.com/

If you click on the latest results link and scroll to the bottom of the page, you can notice that GW recorded profits on every continent except continental Europe.


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## Dead4XxX (Jun 29, 2008)

inquisitoryorei said:


> they're called "codexes" my good sir. get one.


First off, they are called "codices". Yes, there *is* a right way to spell it. Use it before you correct someone else.

Secondly, GW does leave a lot of holes in their codices, which is why they make FAQ's, to answer all the broken links and questions in the codices without releasing a new version of it.

Thirdly, please use the edit button


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## Jezlad (Oct 14, 2006)

Any more bullshit in this thread and I'm closing it down. It's clear people are divided on the issue but try to remain civil and drop the sarcastic trolling please.


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## cccp (Dec 15, 2006)

inquisitoryorei said:


> prices havnt increased by "large amounts" at all.


i would say a metal blister going up by 25% a year is a large increase. unless youre going to argue your point properly, i suggest you cease posting in the thread or we may have to do you the disservice of doing it for you.


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## Treewizard648 (Feb 4, 2009)

OP, or somebody, close this thread. GW prices are what they are. And like I said earlier, If you dont wanna pay up or if you cant, DONT! Or If you MUST have something from GWS, find extra work, period.


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## Stella Cadente (Dec 25, 2006)

Wachaza said:


> GClearly they need a price rise to try and maintain profitability.


if they keep raising prices soon nobody is going to buy there crap from them and will use other cheaper sources not connected to GW (Ebay, carboots etc), meaning GW see no profit at all, if they want profit lower the prices to see more.

example: if Tactical squads were £15 and I had £30, I could spend £30 in GW on 2 boxes and they get £30, as it is now if I have £30 I look at the £18 price tag, I walk to entertainer and buy 3 boxes of Starship battles for £30 meaning they receive nothing.


Treewizard648 said:


> find extra work, period.


so easy to say, so hard to do, some people need to snap back into reality


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## cccp (Dec 15, 2006)

Wachaza said:


> GW're barely making a profit after several years of losses. Clearly they need a price rise to try and maintain profitability. No body likes it. GW aren't doing it to piss you off.



continually raising prices isn't a long term strategy for increasing profitability. if they arent making a profit, they need to manage their business better, rather than passing their inefficiencies on through higher prices.



Wachaza said:


> GW's problem compare dto all the competitors mentioned is that they ahve much bigger overheads. Their own factories. To be efficient they need to run them constantly. Their own distribution, their own stores, their own magazines, based in the UK with a minimum wage, UK production not made in China. Their overheads are higher.


they may have large costs but they should also bring in loads of money and benefit from economies of scale that a large business brings, such as bulk buying.


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## Treewizard648 (Feb 4, 2009)

Stella Cadente said:


> ........so easy to say, so hard to do, some people need to snap back into reality



Read my 1st reply to this thread, you can find work in your own neighborhood. You just have to ask, wise guy.


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## Nemesis-The-Warlock (Jun 10, 2008)

Treewizard648 said:


> Read my 1st reply to this thread, you can find work in your own neighborhood. You just have to ask, wise guy.


so in the middle of a worldwide recession you say the answer to price rises is that people should find extra work?:shok:

guys, is their an ignore function in this forum?, 

there is only so much bs my eyeballs can cope with


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## admiraldick (Sep 9, 2008)

ultimately, i don't think the price increase is the biggest issue here. for al we know there may well be a very logical, understandable reason for the need of an increase in prices. the real problem is that we don't know what that reason is.

considering how close we, as customers, are to GW it would behoove them greatly to communicate better with us. there have been a number of issues caused by simple lack of communication. GW seems to have this wierd idea that all of their ideas are going to be stolen, as though they work in the most competetive market their is, but we all know that there simply isn't anyone who could 'steal' their ideas, even if they published them when they first thought of them.

the whole situation could be fixed if they simply used WD as a means of commuicating and passing on information to the players. they often publish designers notes that consist of nothing more than 'yeah, isn't this great!', even though there is some glaring issue with the codex that we can all see. i'm not asking for them to break down sobbing and spill their hearts about how they've been wrong with every decision, i just want them to say stuff like 'we wanted to do X, but that resulted in Y, so we've switched to Z, even though we'd have like to have found a way to make X work'.

i think a lot of players complaints about GW would change dramatically if they were just more open with us.



inqusitor_me said:


> its only enebitable (i think thats the spelling)


it worries me a little that English is your first language and you think that's how inevitable is spelt. :grin:

seriously though, dictionary.com is very helpful when trying to expand your vocabulary, i always keep it open when posting.



Stella Cadente said:


> but how come Victrix can do better and sell you 60 models for £2 more than what you pay for 10?


now i'm a little confused. are you actually saying you think the Victrix stuff is good, because earlier it sounded like you weren't a fan.

i have to agree though, i the Victrix models are good (very good even), but they aren't as good as plasitic Cadians, but there is no way on earth that they are less than 1/3 as good as Cadians.



Wachaza said:


> GW're barely making a profit after several years of losses. Clearly they need a price rise to try and maintain profitability. No body likes it. GW aren't doing it to piss you off.


even if that were true, which i think a lot of people on the thread are in disagreement about, simply raising the prices is not really the best option for increasing profit margins.

getting rid of many of the smaller stores, increasing the GCN and pushing hard to sell through other retailers (which until recently would have been Woolworths), would all go a much longer way towards making profit from the minias and not seeing it frittered away on things like gaming tables that players can make for themselves.

also, the stores are an appalling advert for GW, they breed a closed community that is unwelcoming and uninviting to 'outsiders'. aside from socially oblivious small boys and the girls desperate enought to follow them, most people find GW stores intimidating, confusing and unpleasant.

i have no problem with GW knowing who their core market is, but whislt they only cater for that market they will never see a significant increase in profits.



Dead4XxX said:


> First off, they are called "codices". Yes, there *is* a right way to spell it. Use it before you correct someone else.


whilst i agree that it is the correct English for the plural of 'codex', in 40k Codex is always pluralised as 'codexes'.


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## Nemesis-The-Warlock (Jun 10, 2008)

admiraldick said:


> ultimately, i don't think the price increase is the biggest issue here. for al we know there may well be a very logical, understandable reason for the need of an increase in prices. the real problem is that we don't know what that reason is.
> 
> considering how close we, as customers, are to GW it would behoove them greatly to communicate better with us.


indeed, I agree 100% here, 
as I stated before there is no need to panic before we even know what the price rises will be, 

but were GW to be as upfront about price rises as they were the last time it probably wouldn't bother people quite as much,

putting a midget (or dwarf) column in WD with no indication of what will be rising is like they are trying to hide it altogether


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## Stella Cadente (Dec 25, 2006)

Treewizard648 said:


> Read my 1st reply to this thread, you can find work in your own neighborhood. You just have to ask, wise guy.


and washing cars or peoples drives is not gonna get you any money, plus nobody round her would want you too, plus its hard to run from chavs carrying a bucket of water, plus the council would probably have a moan................wise guy


admiraldick said:


> now i'm a little confused. are you actually saying you think the Victrix stuff is good, because earlier it sounded like you weren't a fan.


I'm saying its very good, 60 models for £20 is value for money far beyond anything GW could pull out there backsides


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## torealis (Dec 27, 2006)

Stella Cadente said:


> I'm saying its very good, 60 models for £20 is value for money far beyond anything GW could pull out there backsides


Alot of very legitimate stuff has already been said about the higher operating costs of workshop, but i only have one more thing to add, and that is that if you buy Victrix stuff, or Starship whatevers, that's cool, but you won't have Workshop stuff. and that's the unfortunate thing. if you want workshop stuff, and want to play workshop games, and play in workshops, you have to pay what they ask, or do whatever to get the models on ebay.


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## Stella Cadente (Dec 25, 2006)

torealis said:


> but you won't have Workshop stuff. and that's the unfortunate thing.


is it really?


torealis said:


> and want to play workshop games,


you can use any models you like


torealis said:


> and play in workshops


people actually want to?


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## torealis (Dec 27, 2006)

fair enough... then why complain at all about their prices?


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## lawrence96 (Sep 1, 2008)

i suppose because whereas you could use the green and the tans for guardsmen, people like to use minis which all the gamers recognise, and you dont have to say "yes thats a guardsmen" a 1000 times.


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## Death 0F Angels (Feb 27, 2008)

Meh....not suprised. Nor will i be suprised the next time. The bottom line is price increase will not stop people from buying.


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## Stella Cadente (Dec 25, 2006)

Death 0F Angels said:


> Meh....not suprised. Nor will i be suprised the next time. The bottom line is price increase will not stop people from buying.


it stopped me, I haven't spent more than £10 on GW products this year


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## torealis (Dec 27, 2006)

so why are you complaining about the price increase? why do you care?


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## Stella Cadente (Dec 25, 2006)

torealis said:


> so why are you complaining about the price increase? why do you care?


because it was price increases that stopped me buying in the first place, and I can guarantee you I'm not the only one, my uncle stopped playing (also because he hates the rules), my 2 friends stopped playing, and in our gaming group about half have stopped playing, all due to price being the main factor, crappy rules being the second

so thats about 10 people in a very small area that have stopped playing due to GW's increasing prices right there, carry that across the globe and I bet the numbers would be staggering, sooner or later its only going to be kids with rich parents and people with more money than sense playing


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## torealis (Dec 27, 2006)

I still don't get it. They're not going to lower their prices, nor are they going to acknowledge the whining protests of internet forum users, so surely you're out now?

I just don't understand, when you have no realistic stake in it, why you have to continue to complain. 

This isn't just directed at you Stella, but to most people complaining about this. This is a 'deal with it or don't' situation as far as i can see.


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## Jezlad (Oct 14, 2006)

People are entitled to bump their gums and express their opinions mate. Many have been forced to quit the hobby on account of this.


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## torealis (Dec 27, 2006)

well... harumph.

though, having now read the proposed increases... I'm not happy either.


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## World Eater XII (Dec 12, 2008)

Ebay is always a good place to find shite...or bring back the lead spacemen!!!


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## Jezlad (Oct 14, 2006)

If you want a way to make a few easy shillings to buy models check out my thread here. Yes it's a little effort but it helps and is totally accessible for the younger members. 


I was working this method for a few months and making $12 a day easily for 30-40 minutes work. 

12 x 31 = do the math


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## Djinn24 (Jan 12, 2008)

As far as the cost of the pewter minis jumping up, it was because the cost of white metals shooting up out of the blue, all models makes adjusted their prices including GW, PP, and Reaper. Their has been talks of including more lead in models again to try and lower the prices but I doubt that will happen.

Also I remember when you coul dget 3 Rhinos for $20 or 10 man Tact for $22, a Vyper was $18. And this game is still cheaper then Magic or any of the games like that! Trust me I know.


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## harrytheschmuck (Nov 4, 2008)

anarchyfever said:


> Then they have to work against Internet sellers, people who buy most of GWs products from ebay, people abroud who make illegal copies and sell them for personal profit, brothers who give their little brother 2000 pts worth of space marines becuase they have moved onto eldar etc, a lot of this money never sees GWs hands.


 VERY LONG RANT COMING UP, I MAY HAVE LOST THE PLOT

OMG there is so much wrong with this statement its really pissed me off!

they have to work against Internet sellers!! WTF!! they sell the models to these Internet sellers you fool!! its not like GW don't sell things over the net also. its like going boo hoo play.com is selling things on line, we should stop this so HMV can keep their shops open boo hoo. o wait HMV do have an on line store, so who gives a flying!

people who use Ebay, again this should be fine, maybe according to you we should ban such a site so people cant use it so GW can get more money, how about people who sell i don't know spanners on ebay, should we ban that so the spanner company gets the money! we should all go out and get new things because thats the only way GW will stay open, don't bother re using stuff, if your car breaks down don't fix it, throw it away, that way the car company can get the money. think about it, that statement is so wrong it makes me want to poo myself.

people who makes copies!! think about it, we all live on earth and on earth we have lots of people, these people grow up and they can either do good things or bad things. so people do bad things. this is a part of life people, there are measures in place to stop people making copies of GW models. just as there is for many other things. there is no point in crying for GW if people make copies of their models, its down to them to fight it. did we all start crying when people started downloading movies and music of the Internet, oh no, how is brad Pitt going to live now, how will the killers make money if they don't sell albums because people are downloading stuff, making copies if you will. trust me, I'm sure there doing fine. bottom line is that making copies are wrong but how can anyone be naive to think this sort of stuff wouldn't happen.

and now the worst part of the statement was saved till the end, now if i wasn't thinking this person had totally lost it by now, this was the deal maker, this now seals the deal on making this person a major retard, and i don't mean that in a bad way before anyone with mentally handicapped friends and family start up. i mean this person has missed schooling and/ or didn't get the help that was needed and for that my heart goes out. however hes smart enough to use a computer and type things so lets just assume his misguided and spent to much time in his room with little or no social interaction in order to understand how the world works. (now this bit was a wee bit harsh on the reread but i feel strongley about it im going to take the risk of a backlash and leave it in)

"brothers who give their little brother 2000 pts worth of space marines becuase they have moved onto eldar etc"

well well well, I'm having to take a moments break before coming back for this one, i cant even formulate into words whats wrong with this statement. don't you think that even for a second that when you buy something, you then own that something. if you buy a hat from a shop and pay using money you then own said hat, with said hat you are free to do what you like with it. be that you could use it, sell it, burn it, loose it, paint it, cook it, eat it, wipe your bum on it or even give it to someone!!

when i purchase GW models they are mine, i am free to do with them as i like, if i wish to give them to someone or sell them on ebay then i bloody well can do, i don't need to make a donation to GW. bottom line is i have paid for the models!! 

because they moved on to eldar!! so in the example this person is going off to buy even more GW models! just think how that situation would go;

A: hay bro, so your getting a new army?
B: yeah, eldar i think. flying seerer councils are loads of fun.
A: what are you going to do with your marines?
B: I'm not sure, guess ill throw them away.
A: why? thats retarded, cant i use them seeing as your not going to?
B: ide love to but how is GW going to make any money with me giving the army to you?
A: well you did buy the army in the first place, and you are now getting a second army. they have made enough money off you don't you think?
B: more than enough bro.
A: how about selling them on ebay or selling them to me, or even better letting me have them as I'm such a cool brother. plus i wont tell mom what you keep under the bed.
B: but the bad people on the Internet will tell me off, this person said its not rite to sell things on ebay or give my marines to my little brother.
A: hes just a retard, think about it,they are yours and no one can tell you what you can and cannot do with your things.
B: very true, very true. please never tell mom whats under the bed or i will kill you so bad you would die!

now this is bound to piss the person who wrote the above statement off, but please thats not my intention, i just think that your weak defence of GW has.... lets say a few holes in it and it really made me mad about how silly i thought the whole thing was. so lets just leave it at that. you don't even have to defend your self, its better to agree to disagree.

on the topic its self, this is how the GW story will play out. GW will put their prices up year after year and then a bit more for good measure, white dwarf mag will turn more and more into your monthly advert that you have the pleasure of paying about £4 for. more front line stores will turn into gaming intro only stores and not hobby stores, at the moment its an OK balance but in the past it used to be more about the hobby than the sales pitch.

the result, this will make the game less accessible to younger games so fewer will pick the game up, the older guys will also feel the pinch, some will fall out of the hobby all together as work and children take over, others who cant possibly leave the grip of table top gaming will find other games to play, games that need less models to play with, like flames of war is becoming very popular around my area and war machine etc

oh no, GW seams to be loosing money! i know, we will put the prices up and put more adverts in white dwarf, we could also phase out gaming in stores and run intro games only to maximise short term sales, we already tell our staff to go rite up to people as soon as they enter the store more than a foot, HELLO, YOU ALRIGHT THERE! NEED ANY HELP? I'm not sure yet, Ive spent 2 seconds in your store, I'm only looking at the moment, if i need any help ill let you know. (another person walks in) HELLO, YOU ALRIGHT THERE! NEED ANY HELP? maybe we shouldn't let people leave the store without buying something. all staff will be trained in the figure four leg lock!

next step is no one is using the stores, people are buying things on line as our stuff is so dam expensive, the best way to get people back into stores is to stop the discount we are giving to on line traders. this means those people who have been holding onto the hobby buy finding alternate routes will be cut loose. over time the cycle will continue until no new people will be getting into the hobby and the older people leave, jobs are cut then lost. even Rome didn't last remember.


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## bitsandkits (Mar 18, 2008)

@ harry, i think you need a sit down and a cup of sweet tea


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## inquisitoryorei (Nov 25, 2007)

couple things....

what game does one play with the napolianic models from victrix? i cant find any info on that end....

why not suggest that GW stop making metal models altogether? that would bring that pricing issue out. 

also, they should stop opening new stores for a while (unfortunately) because that is a lot of money going out and they just effectively lost six in the U.S. in 2008, so....


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## admiraldick (Sep 9, 2008)

torealis said:


> I still don't get it.


the thing i don't get is why you are responding if you think that this whole thing is pointless? i don't bother going on wish-listing threads and having a go at them for their 'wild ideas' because it would be pointless.

so why are you here if you genuinely think this is all meaningless?



torealis said:


> They're not going to lower their prices, nor are they going to acknowledge the whining protests of internet forum users


if we set aside your pejorative language; agreed.

but then might it also be possible that part of the reason that we continue to discuss this is because we want to raise awareness of the situation?

a lot of gamers seem to live in a stupor, where they think that there can be no other way, its simply inconcievable, and thus anything that GW (or any other games company for that matter) hand to us, is the best possible result. what they seem to forget is that we are paying customers. we owe GW nothing, we've paid our cash and that's all they get from us. we shouldn't put up with bad situatutions just because 'we love GW!'. i have no problem with brand loyalty, i love GWs games and a lot of their minis (even LotR), and i want to be able to continue to buy their products, but not at the expense of my hobby.

i can no longer afford to casually update my army on a regular basis, and that is exactly the thing that GW needs me to be doing to keep turning over a profit.

sure, at the moment there aren't equivellant models for everything in the 40k range, but there are plenty of companies that do produce something. the Victrix models are not perfect, but with a little conversion work you could probably turn them into Vostroyens; and if i can afford to buy 60 men from Victrix, i will.

i'm not saying 'down with GW, burn the heretics'. i like their models, i like their games. but i do want them to produce a game and miniatures that i, a casual gamer, can afford. i want us as gamers to wake up to the reality that we are consumers, and that in any other market companies would have to compete for our money and attention. we don't need to just swollow everything that is forced down our throats.

there are otherways, and other solutions to the difficult problem, that will create a better, more positive future for the game.



torealis said:


> I just don't understand, when you have no realistic stake in it, why you have to continue to complain.


i don't understand why you think he doesn't have a 'realistic stake' in the game in comparision to you? he owns an army, wants to buy miniatures, plays the game with a group friends? what's so different to you? do you own shares in the company?

Stella seems to me, just to want the game to be more affordable, so that he and his friends can continue to play, rather than being priced out the game completely.



torealis said:


> This is a 'deal with it or don't' situation as far as i can see.


and we choose not to 'deal with it' (in your words, or 'bend over an take it' in mine).

if someone is refusing to play ball, it is GW. they are the one's that seem to want to rape the market, rather than work with it.


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## bitsandkits (Mar 18, 2008)

@admiraldick ,Im struggling with the concept of people being "priced out of the game"(GW hobby i guess), At what point did GW price its models out of peoples reach?.

Im not trying to be funny but i really cant understand the whole "i can no longer afford to play due to a price increase on some models",Dont get me wrong, i know peoples incomes are totally varied and things are different prices depending on where and how you shop/live. But i seriously cant get my head round the concept that if GW increase a price that either people who currently have armies or were about to buy/build an army can no longer afford to do so?and they by default must quit the game.

If it was going to cost you £300 to build/update/add to an army this year before the price rise, but due to the rise your army will cost £330, why does that extra £30 (or what ever) mean you can no longer play?surely it just means you take longer to build the army or you stump up the cash and move on.Or do like stella and source a cheaper source of models

Is it not more likely that people who quit the game who give the reason price increase,were going to quit anyway or were not in a situation to afford to play the hobby anyway?


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## harrytheschmuck (Nov 4, 2008)

@ bitsandkits. a good point and very well put sir. we all know we dont have to spend money on GW stuff, but we cant help it. a price increase does mean if i want to keep up the same level of interest in GW ide have to spend more money so im not that ok with it. its like being ok to take a pay cut at work


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## JokerGod (Jan 21, 2009)

Stella, why are you even still here? I have nothing agenst you for stating your mind and all that, but you have made it clear (several times now) that you don't buy or play any GWs games. So why do you even come here? Just to complain about them? (And no, this is not some sarcastic remark, I am just asking) 

Jez, you should just close it at this point. all the facts and conversations have ended pages ago. GW increases prices like everything els, some people can understand that prices rise in a bad economy and see GW doing the same thing, and others see it as GW being greedy. The only thing coming out of this at this point is crying from both sides of the field.


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## Stella Cadente (Dec 25, 2006)

JokerGod said:


> that you don't buy or play any GWs games. So why do you even come here?


I like the old fluff, I like SOME models not sculpted by retards, and I like SOME of the overpriced codex's not written by retards, so I still have 3 things left to talk about.

plus I still love LotR's, the only game GW hasn't yet buggered up, even though war of the ring is crap and the metals are far too expensive (£15 for 3 models?, shove em GW)


JokerGod said:


> Just to complain about them?


somebody has to keep a grip on reality at what GW actually is and deserves


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## Fluff'Ead (Aug 22, 2007)

bitsandkits said:


> @admiraldick ,Im struggling with the concept of people being "priced out of the game"(GW hobby i guess), At what point did GW price its models out of peoples reach?.
> 
> Im not trying to be funny but i really cant understand the whole "i can no longer afford to play due to a price increase on some models",Dont get me wrong, i know peoples incomes are totally varied and things are different prices depending on where and how you shop/live. But i seriously cant get my head round the concept that if GW increase a price that either people who currently have armies or were about to buy/build an army can no longer afford to do so?and they by default must quit the game.


Imho it's not a shortage of money, it's that some people feel that the hobby is no longer worth it. The prices account to the hobby's attractiveness just like the model quality or the fiction behind it.


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## JokerGod (Jan 21, 2009)

Fluff'Ead said:


> Imho it's not a shortage of money, it's that some people feel that the hobby is no longer worth it. The prices account to the hobby's attractiveness just like the model quality or the fiction behind it.


Any one coming in to this hobby even 10 years ago would a fool to believe it was cheap. The price tag is not what gets people to play, its the games. If anything the price tag turns most people away from the start.


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## Jezlad (Oct 14, 2006)

JokerGod said:


> Jez, you should just close it at this point. all the facts and conversations have ended pages ago. GW increases prices like everything els, some people can understand that prices rise in a bad economy and see GW doing the same thing, and others see it as GW being greedy. The only thing coming out of this at this point is crying from both sides of the field.


:no:

The thread has plenty of valid points, please stop telling me how to run the forum. :wink:


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## admiraldick (Sep 9, 2008)

bitsandkits said:


> @admiraldick ,Im struggling with the concept of people being "priced out of the game"(GW hobby i guess), At what point did GW price its models out of peoples reach?


i see your point, and can understand the confusion, but i guess that's perhaps down to my poor phrasing rather than an invalid point.

i didn't mean to suggest that people were no longer allowed to play with the models they already own (this isn't poker, where you have to pay for each round you play), but that people no longer feel they are able to keep on purchasing, which is a fundamental core of the hobby part of the game. the game is not complete out-of-the-box, you are never quite finished and there is always something else you can pick up.

and that is really where GW make their money. not in the big army that you've saved up for and planned all along, but on the boxes set you splurge out on every couple of weeks. if you can't be frivolous in this hobby, it grows static and stagnent very quickly. and when that happens, you simply move on, because its no fun any more. that's the thing that if picking GWs pocket, that they are pricing out people just wanting to pick up a boxes set here and there. and its more subtle than prices rises. every new edition of a boxed set contains fewer men, for more money. but those things don't make it onto lists of 'price rises'.

so you are right, its not an issue of vets no longer being able to play with what they have, its an issue of no longer being able to keep up.



JokerGod said:


> Jez, you should just close it at this point.


i'd prefer it if you didn't try and high-jack my thread. if you don't want to discus it any further, that's cool. others do though. unless you're on the payroll of the GW accounts department, it doesn't benefit you in anyway to prevent people from discussing this situation and possible alternative, so you really don't need to post things like that.

if you really feel that the thread is offensive, dangerous or otherwise breaking the forum rules than you can report it in the appropriate fashion.


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## World Eater XII (Dec 12, 2008)

So what prices are, for def being "hiked up"?


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## Fluff'Ead (Aug 22, 2007)

JokerGod said:


> Any one coming in to this hobby even 10 years ago would a fool to believe it was cheap.


I don't buy things based on (or despite) the realization that they are expensive. Everything I pay for I consider worth my money. 



> The price tag is not what gets people to play, its the games. If anything the price tag turns most people away from the start.


Prices turning people away from the hobby is an impact on the hobby.


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## Nemesis-The-Warlock (Jun 10, 2008)

World Eater XII said:


> So what prices are, for def being "hiked up"?


battalions and battleforces will be going up to £55/ $95
i'm unaware of any others, but i'm sure there are others all the same


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## MaidenManiac (Oct 2, 2008)

IM SO RICH NOTHING OFFENDS ME!!1!!one!:laugh:

...or not...I view it like this:
If you count up the hours you use each model they aren't expensive at all, rather the opposite
The models aren't like beer or liquor either(which folks gladly pay for when a little tipsy totally regardless of the price), they are actually still there the day after, and not in the shape of a hangover:no: 

If a model costs 5 or 6 $ is totally indiffrent to me. I'm more intrested in having a hobby then whining over that the company that provides it wants to earn its living:wink:


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## Syph (Aug 3, 2008)

Price increases, expensive hobby etc is all nothing new. Sure, I'd love for the hobby to be cheaper than it is (well, from a GW perspective), but I suppose if you don't shop at GW it probably is quite affordable. 

If I think back over the several times I've started up and stopped:

1995 (11yo) a typical metal model cost me £3. Marneus was £5/6. £3 was a weeks pocket money for me - a model a week. IIRC, I could never afford a metal Dreadnought, as it was at least £20. Devastators - £15 for crappy scuplts. Predator tank, IIRC, was £15. Paints went up to £2.50 at one point. Sprays were £5-6. 

2003/4 ish. Cold One Knights were about £25 a box IIRC. Big fat horrible plastic Cold Ones, not so great metal sculpts.

Now: loads of plastic options. Can get the Cold One Knights from any number of places for £9 (and they rock), Dreads ~£19, Devs are £15 from tons of places, lots of options etc. Metals are expensive, sprays are expensive, books are getting there... But you get a big bang for buck as far as I'm concerned with the plastics and all the extras that come with them.

In no way is it a justification of a price rise (yet to be confirmed fully?) but it shouldn't be a surprise, nor unexpected.


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## World Eater XII (Dec 12, 2008)

Maybe its a ploy to curb peoples spending habits and the truth is, GW has almost drained the worlds supply of metals and spacemen plastic?!


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## Death Shroud (Mar 1, 2008)

There's price increases and ridiculous price increases. A price increase (and some would argue it's a huge one) is moving the £12 sets up to £15 (that's a quarter of the original price again). 

It's especially bad for those wanting to do guard:
20 Guardsmen = £18
Reboxed into 10 for £12
20 Guardsmen =£24 (an increase by a whole third!)
if the £12 boxes go to £15
20 Guardsmen =£30 (an increase on the original price by two thirds in two months!!)

I'm trying not to sound like a completely cynical bastard but the fact is that is that some of these price increases will be vast. GW need to ditch the price banding system and look at more practical and sensible pricing on a box by box basis. The staff will be able to cope with a few more price lables to deal with and GW's customers will be a lot happier


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## smfanboy (Apr 1, 2009)

why why gw what did i did to deserve this


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## JokerGod (Jan 21, 2009)

smfanboy said:


> why why gw what did i did to deserve this


you play Space marines.


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## BDJV (Dec 15, 2008)

Do we have any confirmation on what items are going up yet?


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## Dafistofmork (Jan 9, 2009)

wow, 10 pages of bitching about price hikes. good thing i only collect 1500/2000pt armies, and look i have two 1500pt armies (orks & SM (oh, and 2000pts dwarfs)). i have not bought anything in ages. sure, the manager at my store prefers the beginers to us vets because they buy stuff, but as long as i have a place to play and decent friends into warhammer i am happy to shell out £15 for a box every 2-3 months or so.


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## Death 0F Angels (Feb 27, 2008)

did anyone else notice no pricetag on the Empire battalion? Im sure we will have to wait till the price hikes come to see that one. Wonder what the price tag is gonna be on that seeing as how the smallest unit in the box is nearly half the price of the whole set at current ranges. But people will say "ohh, the battalion is such a good deal, even if they raised the price 10$, because greatswords alone are 40$". Just dumb luck? i think not.


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## Syph (Aug 3, 2008)

It's £60. It's now available for Pre-Order.


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## Death 0F Angels (Feb 27, 2008)

no price yet on the american site. Prolly be regular price then. Jumped the gun on that one. But still guaranteed sales of battalions


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## HorusReborn (Nov 19, 2008)

Syph said:


> Price increases, expensive hobby etc is all nothing new. Sure, I'd love for the hobby to be cheaper than it is (well, from a GW perspective), but I suppose if you don't shop at GW it probably is quite affordable.
> 
> If I think back over the several times I've started up and stopped:
> 
> ...



In my tenure playing GW games I've seen some crazy price hikes. No one likes it, but people get over it. The newer prices are what's ridiculous. GW ranted and raved at how plastics would make things more costly, but 41.25 for ten great swords???? in [email protected]? yeah ok... Look if you can afford 90 bucks for a battalion to begin with, what's 5 more dollars?!?

Syph, you are right in some ways, the plastics are better, but they aren't the greatest. Look at normal military modelling prices and you'll see bang for your buck! Brass parts, slide molds, crisp detailing all in one kit for 60 bucks. almost 60 for a steam tank that's the same thing as the metal one?!? Man...

Yeah prices go up in a recession, people try to capture their losses, but these same people forget to lower their prices when times are good and well greed takes over!


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## bobby2 (May 7, 2009)

i buy off gifts 4 geeks all the time


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