# My Failcast experience



## Achaylus72 (Apr 30, 2011)

Yesterday i was in one of my local GW stores and on the spur of the moment i bought a box set of Chaos Raptors, why i just don't really know.

But anyway i opened the box and low and behold 3 of the Chaos Raptors were miscasts, i showed the bloke who sold me the box and he we over to the shelf to grab another box of Raptors, and he proceded to open the box to replace the miscasts, so low and behold two of the three Raptors were miscasts, and so he decided to open another box of Raptors, and the two Raptors i needed to finish off my squad were also miscasts.

We were stunned that out of 15 Chaos Raptors we discovered that only 5 were acceptable, while the remainder were miscasts, we could not compleate a full five man squad of Failcast Chaos Raptors.

They ended up giving me a full refund.

Also another couple of misserable examples of this Failcast crap, another guy bought a box of Techmarine and Servitors and all were miscasts, and another was allright until the poor bloke tried cutting the figure off the sprue and the whole leg broke off, while another had an arm broke off.

I will say that thank god GW isn't an Australian Company or it would now be facing criminal prosecution for knowenly producing and selling faulty goods.

And to finish off, those Failcasts that were OK in my book the quality of their appearence was second grade at best, none came close to the quality of their plast kits.

I have decided on that never ever to purchase any Failcast product again.

To end my rant, in 35 years experiance of build all manner of kits in all manner of mediums (including Resin) these Failcasts are by far the worst examples of Resin kits i have ever seen.


----------



## Samules (Oct 13, 2010)

At least they have a great return policy.


----------



## Wax (Jan 6, 2010)

Damn man, you sound really upset.



Achaylus72 said:


> I will say that thank god GW isn't an Australian Company or it would now be facing criminal prosecution for knowenly producing and selling faulty goods.


This part was funny though.


----------



## bitsandkits (Mar 18, 2008)

That will teach you to make spur of the moment purchases


----------



## Serpion5 (Mar 19, 2010)

Honestly dude, there are crappy instances of finecast yes, but plenty of their kits are exceptional. 

I will say this however, many of the model designs are ill suited to the resin itself. I don`t know about other necron players, but I exchanged every single necron lord's resin staves with plastic equivalents, either from the lychguard kits or tomb kling kits.


----------



## HOBO (Dec 7, 2007)

Personal experiences will dictate how each of us views Finecast...if the models received/bought have been good, then cool it's the best thing ever. If the models have been crap then it's a different story, especially if it's repeated over and over.

My group of 15 regulars alone have only kept about half of the Finecast models we initially wanted, and the other half we got our money back...about a $grand GW lost in sales. After multiple times of sending back the same models due to them been shitty just ends up pissing people off so much they drop any interest in adding to the armies.


----------



## Barnster (Feb 11, 2010)

I can tell you that I bought 3 Draigos in finecast and returned every one of them, The quality was awful, and they were total miscasts. So I bought metal which had no issues

I randomly bought a queek from ebay, which i thought was metal but turned out to FC, overall the quality is ok, but the detail is light to non existant in places, and i generally hate the feel and overall "cheapness" that is oozing from it, I would be very happy if GW turned around and said we tried it, it was more bother than its worth we're losing money in returns, lets go back to metal

That or just give over all resin like models to the guys at forgeworld. They know what their doing. Forge world model is solid, crisp 

Serpion If the material is unsuitible it shouldn't be used, you shouldn't have to buy another kit because they never delieved what you paid for in the first place


----------



## stevey293 (Aug 16, 2011)

I've had some horrors. From both forgeworld and GW their new fave is misaligned moulds so the model looks like two halves glued together by a 6 year old.

But and its a big but... I think overall the switch to resin is a good thing just rushed into. Wait till models designed for finecast start to get released.


----------



## Doelago (Nov 29, 2009)

Never had a single problem with Finecast. At the beginning I was a bit sad that the metals I so loved to paint were gone, but after trying Finecast I am of the opinion that it is far superior. Now I wont be gluing those pesky metals together anymore and be forced to re-paint them every time I move them somewhere.

And I am yet to see one of these miscasts.


----------



## Orochi (Jan 28, 2009)

I think Finecast was a good idea personally, but I have yet to have any problems.

One thing GW have got right is the staff's willingness to help and replace miscasts.


----------



## stevey293 (Aug 16, 2011)

Resin models will cost far less to make so they should be willing.


----------



## Doelago (Nov 29, 2009)

stevey293 said:


> Resin models will cost far less to make so they should be willing.


I recall Matt from MiniWarGaming saying that the reason why the cost more is cause they are produced at a far lower rate than what they were able to sphew out metal minis.


----------



## khrone forever (Dec 13, 2010)

thats true but the actuall resin costs much less than the tin (or whaterver) does, and the price of metal is still rising. also they dont need as many people to make them


----------



## Ravner298 (Jun 3, 2011)

Mixed results with finecast, although nothing as bad as the OPs experience.

3 Nurgle DPs, a Bloodthirster, imotehk and an overlord.

1 of the DPs hands had almost hollow fingers with holes in them, quick green stuff fix. One of the areas in the bloodthirsters wing was so thin a gentle breeze could of punched through....again 5 minutes of gstuff.....and imotehk was a mess, he has thin wires on his arms, the orb on the top of his staff is held on by a spider thread.....his fingers are frail and long.....staff was crooked and wobbley......he was a nightmare.......no problems with the overlord though!

Can't complain about the level of detail, and the patch work required to make them satisfactory in my eyes has only required a very ametur level of modeling ability.


As a side note, I have an entire 2k army of death guard made from forge world conversion kits, and never once have I had a problem or needed something to be returned.


----------



## C'Tan Chimera (Aug 16, 2008)

Hm, odd. I had heard of the miscasts, but have yet to hear about any complaints in my area. To be fair, I only own one finecast miniature given to me as a gift, and never had any trouble there. 

Not that I ever intend to buy any more than the single character, though. The finecast boxed sets can go bite me. I nearly died when I read Plague Marines were 50$. For that horrifically unreasonable price, they better be making sure they're top quality.


----------



## khrone forever (Dec 13, 2010)

my gaming group have had ok results with the finecast, my commissar only had one tiny hole in his hat, and the other bloodthirster and tomb king that other people have got have been fine


----------



## JokerGod (Jan 21, 2009)

I think the FC was rushed for an early release, I remember when they first hit the shelves at my local, almost every blister had holes or miscast parts, but now, a few months latter I can't see any problems with the blisters, it just needs time to be worked out and get the fine points of the art mastered.

And for the record FW is only suck high quality because they take forever to make anything, they have the time to inspect every last inch coming off the line, GW can't, they have a much higher demand and there for need to push them out, inspecting only a few per batch.

In the long run FC will be cheaper then metal and with practice GW will get as good with it as it is with plastic. the vets among us can recall the poor quality of plastic when it first came around.

~Joker


----------



## Champion Alaric (Feb 17, 2011)

My only beef is that they should not even send a half assed mold out the door. There should be some sort of quality control. Its like buying a brand new car and then having to paint the doors and bolt on the bumper. Why do I have to buy a finished product to put MORE work in it?


----------



## JokerGod (Jan 21, 2009)

Champion Alaric said:


> My only beef is that they should not even send a half assed mold out the door. There should be some sort of quality control. Its like buying a brand new car and then having to paint the doors and bolt on the bumper. Why do I have to buy a finished product to put MORE work in it?


you have to remember that they throw out hundreds, if not thousands of the same model every day, they can't check every last inch of every model coming out, some have flaws. 

What I don't get is why no one is noticing how well they stepped up there game for returns, they know there is a problem and they are working on fixing it fast, in just a few months you can see the major quality increase from the first few models to the ones coming out now.


----------



## Imwookie2 (Jul 14, 2010)

JokerGod said:


> you have to remember that they throw out hundreds, if not thousands of the same model every day, they can't check every last inch of every model coming out, some have flaws.


I think thats the problem....if the design is so bad that your throwing out that many models and still more poor models are slipping through the cracks maybe its time to reevaluate your design. I personally think they are getting so good with plastic that they dont need metal or failcast models. They should be concentrating on making these kits into plastic kits (did plague marines need to be recast in resin.....no they needed a plastic kit). Maybe only do a few special characters in metal, everything else should be plastic. I understand that doing all plastic kits would raise the price on them but im already being asked to spend at least $40 or more on any 5 model failcast set, id rather spend $50 on a good plastic kit.

Ive really been avoiding failcast models because of all the bad things Ive heard about them. Alot of the gamers at my FLGS have had problems with failcast products. My only exp. with it has been a necron cryptek which had a few small imperfections in the casting which wasnt a big deal, but the main problem was the staff wasnt straight and when I cut it from the spur it broke in half. I wont make the same mistake my other crypteks will be converted from plastic kits.


----------



## IanC (Sep 3, 2010)

Okay, seriously people that call Finecast "failcast" get ignored by me. Its a sad pathetic name, that needs to be left on Dakkadakka where it belongs.

Aside form that, i have had mostly good experiences with Finecast. My Plague Marines I got last week? Perfect. Same with the Skaven Jezzails. And a Skaven Warlord. My Black Templar Sword Brethren had a guy that seems to have taken a melta blast to the face though (ended up cutting the head off and replacing it, since they didn't have any other boxes in stock). And my Treeman needed a good soaking in hot water to bend a leg back in to shape.

Though both the Treeman and Sword Brethren were from earlier batches, more recent ones are a lot better.


----------



## Imwookie2 (Jul 14, 2010)

IanC said:


> Okay, seriously people that call Finecast "failcast" get ignored by me. Its a sad pathetic name, that needs to be left on Dakkadakka where it belongs.


Well maybe since this thread was named "My Failcast experience" you shouldnt have read it.......just saying


----------



## Bogg (Mar 2, 2008)

I have yet to buy Finecast, and I frown at the idea of having to buy it, I think its utter crap, and a bullshit material, I would rather pay for the metal, than that crap!

To thin, to delicate, I like to pick up my models with one hand and deploy them all in one go, ... I "use" them well... and not have worry about the models falling apart or melt in direct sunlight! Finecast= failcast ..Shoooo !! 

-


----------



## Stephen_Newman (Jul 14, 2009)

Bogg said:


> I have yet to buy Finecast, and I frown at the idea of having to buy it, I think its utter crap, and a bullshit material, I would rather pay for the metal, than that crap!
> 
> To thin, to delicate, I like to pick up my models with one hand and deploy them all in one go, ... I "use" them well... and not have worry about the models falling apart or melt in direct sunlight! Finecast= failcast ..Shoooo !!
> 
> -


I am sorry but I have the opinion that your view of finecast is very askew from the truth.

I find "Failcast" much easier to work with than the old metal crap. Easier for converting, great for detail and certainly not as bad as made out. Also I don't have to varnish a finecast model to stop it chipping when in contact with other models.

The whole melt in the sunlight crap is purely crap. I saw the effects of sunlight on one model (Aragorn). He was left in the sun for at least we know 5 hours as a minimum since it was fine beforehand. Its pretty bad to leave most things in the sun for that long really. Also they fall apart less frequently than the old metal because I do not have to pin a single damn piece together!

As for the comment that you like to deploy models in one go. I find this is easier with finecast due to the weight. I play Eldar. I struggled to play Apocalypse because the weight of the case I had to carry for all those metal aspects was so large I practically had a dead arm by the time I reached the store. I certainly do not have that problem anymore.

In short I think the problems with Finecasr have been grossly overdone because the entire release was rushed because GW panicked at the sharply increasing rise in tin prices. Not everything was ready and as a result inperfections arose.

I am a happy gamer who has bought plenty of Finecast, both on original release till now and yet have to experiance ANY problem with the miniatures that was not remedied by filling in the gap with a little liquid green stuff.


----------



## Sothot (Jul 22, 2011)

I have yet to see a finecast model without problems. I check the blisters at my gw and see bubbles, holes, and general garbage. I can sort of justify (lie to myself) paying in excess of $20 for a single figure because it's an artist's sculpt. But for that price, i'm sorry, I shouldn't even have to consider using "amateur modeling skills" to fix up that kind of fuck up. Premium price for crap product. I will take plastic every day of the week and twice on Sundays.


----------



## Achaylus72 (Apr 30, 2011)

IanC said:


> Okay, seriously people that call Finecast "failcast" get ignored by me. Its a sad pathetic name, that needs to be left on Dakkadakka where it belongs.
> 
> Aside form that, i have had mostly good experiences with Finecast. My Plague Marines I got last week? Perfect. Same with the Skaven Jezzails. And a Skaven Warlord. My Black Templar Sword Brethren had a guy that seems to have taken a melta blast to the face though (ended up cutting the head off and replacing it, since they didn't have any other boxes in stock). And my Treeman needed a good soaking in hot water to bend a leg back in to shape.
> 
> Though both the Treeman and Sword Brethren were from earlier batches, more recent ones are a lot better.


When you go and purchase a box of chaos raptors and out of 3 boxes you get 5 that pass muster and you get 10 miscasts meaning in this we get a 66.66% failure rate, then it ceases to be FINEcast but FAILcast, and if you don't like the expression then maybe you should not have clicked onto this with FAILCAST in the title.

Also when you read at the amount of work that some here have posted to get their FAILcast figures up to scratch then the whole process becomes one huge sick joke on GW customers, since they brought in FAILcast i have personally seen litterally hundreds of miscasts and or figures that break whilst being carefully removed from the sprue.

And i did say in my opening post that if GW was and Australian based business then they would be crimminally prosecuted for knowenly producing and selling a faulty product, and that Fair Trading Australia would enforce either a total ban on the product or order a full recall of all FAILcast products.

GW should have decided that when they were switching out of their metal range then Plastic was the only way to go.


----------



## CattleBruiser (Sep 3, 2011)

I've personally had no problems with finecast, although i've only gotten the avatar of khaine and a box of eldar rangers. well, technically there's been 1 problem, one of the rangers has a tiny part of his heel missing, but who cares.


----------



## Serpion5 (Mar 19, 2010)

I'm sensing a lot of butthurt here. :wink:

My necron overlord was a miscast piece of shit. I got a refund, and bought it again in the next batch which turned out fine. 

My Striking Scorpions were literally missing the Exarch. Same thing, refund, replace. All worked out. 

My zoanthrope must have had a hollow tail, because it began to lean to the side in my display case over this summer. I intend to reheat and repose it before cutting and pinning it to place. 


That is Three examples from personal experience. In addition to these, i have also bought in Finecast: 

Four Hive Tyrants.
Three more necron lords.
Two more zoanthropes.
Two Tyrant Guard.
Another box of striking scorpions.
A box of Warlocks with Farseer.
Harlequin Shadowseer.
Eldar Autarch.
Three lictors.
DE Archon.
Both C`Tan.
Tomb King.
Liche Priest.
Dark Elf Assassin.

All of these have been fine. Seems pretty successful to me.  

What few problems I have experienced have been easily resolved.

So in conclusion... Get over yourselves. :thank_you:


----------



## bitsandkits (Mar 18, 2008)

i would like to add that my Large Asda porkpie was not very good this Christmas, its a bit of a family tradition to buy a large "stand" pie and offer it to guests and have it with various meats and pickles over the festive season, well i have to admit it was a bit poor, pastry was too thick meaning it was raw on the inside and overcooked on the outside, the meat was tasetsy enough but it had a strange texture as though it had been cooked and ground up then put in the pie, its difficult to describe...anyway it didnt spoil christmas which was pretty good all in all.

anyway i know im a bit off topic but i figured you all might want to talk about pork pie quality rather than go over the whole finecast debate yet again


----------



## Ratvan (Jun 20, 2011)

bitsandkits said:


> i would like to add that my Large Asda porkpie was not very good this Christmas, its a bit of a family tradition to buy a large "stand" pie and offer it to guests and have it with various meats and pickles over the festive season, well i have to admit it was a bit poor, pastry was too thick meaning it was raw on the inside and overcooked on the outside, the meat was tasetsy enough but it had a strange texture as though it had been cooked and ground up then put in the pie, its difficult to describe...anyway it didnt spoil christmas which was pretty good all in all.
> 
> anyway i know im a bit off topic but i figured you all might want to talk about pork pie quality rather than go over the whole finecast debate yet again


did you save on the price promise that is the real question here


----------



## bitsandkits (Mar 18, 2008)

Ratvan said:


> did you save on the price promise that is the real question here


not sure i will have to check,but i have a friend who still works in the industry who says that the big three are all guilty of price fixing because they have so much access to each other prices through price checker websites etc and the fact most consumers shop by habit not by price and only those who are willing to put the effort and leg work in will be the only ones to save anything.


----------



## Ratvan (Jun 20, 2011)

bitsandkits said:


> not sure i will have to check,but i have a friend who still works in the industry who says that the big three are all guilty of price fixing because they have so much access to each other prices through price checker websites etc and the fact most consumers shop by habit not by price and only those who are willing to put the effort and leg work in will be the only ones to save anything.


I tried that for a month saved £5.34 ish on my monthly shopping...not really worth the effort


----------



## Serpion5 (Mar 19, 2010)

bitsandkits said:


> not sure i will have to check,but i have a friend who still works in the industry who says that the big three are all guilty of price fixing because they have so much access to each other prices through price checker websites etc and the fact most consumers shop by habit not by price and only those who are willing to put the effort and leg work in will be the only ones to save anything.


This is true and all, but as a consumer I made the conscious decision to stick to my habits because I know and trust the same company I started with. If they ever failed me in a significant way, I would seek other options but I am not a tight person by nature, so spending a bit more for trusted quality is not an issue for me. 

Of course, I have no gripes with your methods either. To each their own Sir.


----------



## Samules (Oct 13, 2010)

My experiences with metal are much worse than with finecast. Anyone who says finecast has more problems needs to take another look. From pinning arms to paint chipping repeatedly on models I spent hours painting (sometimes for competitions) to flying stands that never stand, to heck with metal. I have 1 product of finecast and it was perfect. And the way to solve our problems? I would much rather deal with a little green stuff or GW customer service than with another metal striking scorpion. Finecast doesn't have more problems, you just got used to the problems with metal. Give it a year or two for GW to improve it and for you to get used to it and then see if you can complain.


----------



## Ravner298 (Jun 3, 2011)

> Not that I ever intend to buy any more than the single character, though. The finecast boxed sets can go bite me. I nearly died when I read Plague Marines were 50$. For that horrifically unreasonable price, they better be making sure they're top quality.


The FW kits for plague marines are 10 fold better in everyway.


----------



## Euphrati (May 24, 2009)

*Disappointment*

I received two 'finecast' models as a gift for Christmas from my father in-law: Logan Grimnar and Njal Stormcaller. 

I had not purchased any of the new 'finecast' models for myself yet due to having a massive amount of regular models that I still need to paint, hearing some rather poor reviews on their quality, and the fact I was considering doing a custom conversion for the two models I received (something I will most likely still do, but it is also nice to have the actual GW model as well!).

I finally got a chance to actually sit down and get a close look at both the models yesterday and to be blunt- I was utterly shocked at the overall substandard quality of Both models. Air bubbles, misaligned molding, a snapped section, and the general physical feel of cheapness I got from the material. 

Now, I'm a fair hand at GS and I can fix any of the flaws with the models... but why should that even be something that _needs _to be done in the first place? These are supposed to be of higher quality than the plastic kits and they are not. Not even by a long shot. If I had purchased them myself I would be rather upset and most likely have already taken them back to the store, but it actually urks me far greater as they were a gift and I feel somewhat sorry for the GW CS department when I let my father in-law know just how _bad _the models he received are as he worked as head of QC for a contractor to major corporations in their high-end beauty product lines upwards of 25 years before retiring. That these models were even shipped out *at all *was an outright QC fail and he isn't going to be pleased in the slightest when I make him aware of their quality.


Starting with Logan-








The back of the storm bolter on his left arm along with the shoulder pad shows a number of bubbles.
-








The front of the storm bolter showing the misalignment of the moulding.
-








You can see the numberous bubbles in the front of the torso/body itself- including a large chunk out of his chin and underside of his nose. Everywhere you see a 'shine' point is a reflection of the glossy inside of a bubble.
-








This is a side-shot of Logan's face- see the light shining through the gap under the bridge of his nose?
-








The back of the model frankly looks like it was peppered with bird shot. Halfway down the left leg (the leg at the lower edge of the image) is a fairly large gap right above the knee joint. You can see the overall roughness of the material in this image fairly well too.

Moving on to Njal-









You can see the fair-sized bubble where his psy-hood crests over his head.
-








lines of bubbles run down the underside of just about every cable and edge of his armour, as well as a number of them are scattered throughout his beard/hair.
-








He is missing almost every 'tip' to his fang talismans and the claws of his wolfpelt, along with a vast number of the studs everywhere on his wargear.
-








His staff came fractured at the wolftail talisman and contains a few bubbles in the runes along its length that this image doesn't show.
-








Nightwing is missing a rather large portion of his beak/face.
-








You can see the almost 'froathy' bubbles that run along the lower edges of his shoulder guards in this image, along with the ones down the backs of his legs and in the soft flex-points at the joints of his knees.

Overall, both the models will take a lot of filling/detail work to even get to the point they would be basecoat ready though I'm going to hold off and see what my father in-law's reactions to their state is. As I stated before, it is the fact that they were even allowed out the door by QC that is the biggest disappointment in the end.


----------



## Imwookie2 (Jul 14, 2010)

Thats just pathetic. Some FAILcast supporters will tell you that just some "basic modeling skills" will be needed to fix that up and that you shouldnt complain about it but I totally agree with what you said at $15-$25 a model you shouldnt have to fix ANYTHING on the model. Also this effects the price of these models. Do you think gamesworkshops just eats the price of the models that dont pass QC or the ones they get back....no they make you the customer pay for it by raising the prices of the models thats why all failcast models are overpriced.


----------



## bitsandkits (Mar 18, 2008)

Imwookie2 said:


> Thats just pathetic. Some FAILcast supporters will tell you that just some "basic modeling skills" will be needed to fix that up and that you shouldnt complain about it but I totally agree with what you said at $15-$25 a model you shouldnt have to fix ANYTHING on the model. Also this effects the price of these models. Do you think gamesworkshops just eats the price of the models that dont pass QC or the ones they get back....no they make you the customer pay for it by raising the prices of the models thats why all failcast models are overpriced.


actually they would tell him to stop posting on the forum and just get them exchanged for good models that hes paid for, dont waste your time trying to correct errors on that scale or post photos of them here, just call customer service or return them to a store and ask for replacements and then crack on with some modelingand painting. Models are no different to anything else you buy retail,if your not happy take it back


----------



## Imwookie2 (Jul 14, 2010)

bitsandkits said:


> actually they would tell him to stop posting on the forum and just get them exchanged for good models that hes paid for, dont waste your time trying to correct errors on that scale or post photos of them here, just call customer service or return them to a store and ask for replacements and then crack on with some modelingand painting. Models are no different to anything else you buy retail,if your not happy take it back


I said "some" would tell him to fix them. Also just saying take them back doesnt make it ok, the point is that he shouldnt have to watse his time to get replacements. The fact that this happens quite often is a poor reflection on GW and I think they should look into better ways to make these models.


----------



## Zaden (Oct 21, 2008)

I would say for the average gamer finecast is much better than metal with all of its downsides, and FC is only in its preliminary stages of development. In gameplay, FC is far superior due to ease of positioning and retaining paint and staying together upon falling over/being dropped. To the average hobbyist, FC is far superior due to ease of building. Click out, prime, paint...sounds good to me. People that take the modelling and painting very seriously need to wait for the next stage of FC. It will be improved greatly over the next couple of years.

Finecast was released partially in response to all the gripes about metal, and especially mostly metal armies like Necrons. After having to deal with all that metal, I would take FC and its flaws any day of the week. As has been said already, take flawed product back for a replacement/refund. To cut down on time wastage, open the product in the store and check it.


----------



## Doelago (Nov 29, 2009)

Zaden said:


> Finecast was released partially in response to all the gripes about metal, and especially mostly metal armies like Necrons. After having to deal with all that metal, I would take FC and its flaws any day of the week.


Puh, look at me and my old Grey Knights. Fuckers are falling apart like no ones business. I would have welcomed Finecast back then like gods blessing.

On that note, Sisters need Finecast!


----------



## Euphrati (May 24, 2009)

bitsandkits said:


> actually they would tell him to stop posting on the forum and just get them exchanged for good models that hes paid for, dont waste your time trying to correct errors on that scale or post photos of them here, just call customer service or return them to a store and ask for replacements and then crack on with some modelingand painting. Models are no different to anything else you buy retail,if your not happy take it back


First off- Though a vast majority of 40K enthusiasts are male, not all of us are! I wear my 'balls' a tad bit higher up than the 'majority' 

Secondly- These models were received as a gift that was ordered from the online GW store (I know this due to the fact they were wrapped still in the shipping box). I took pictures of the flaws in them on request of my husband who is currently in Afghanistan and wanted to see them as it was on his suggestion that his Father (my father in-law) bought them for my Christmas gift.

If only one of the models had been flawed, it might not have made such a negative impression on my view of the product line. But, this was not the case. Someone ordering two different models and having both come in so heavily flawed is the issue here.


Having to return a product or open the packaging immediately upon purchasing due to manufacturing flaws should not be the standard occurrence!


----------



## Imwookie2 (Jul 14, 2010)

Euphrati said:


> Having to return a product or open the packaging immediately upon purchasing due to manufacturing flaws should not be the standard occurrence!


I completely agree and thats basically the point Ive been trying to get across. We have allowed GW to make a crappy product and get away with it. We do this by continuing to buy the sub par product that is Finecast and by making excuses for the product and that is why I will no longer buy finecast models.


----------



## IanC (Sep 3, 2010)

Ravner298 said:


> The FW kits for plague marines are 10 fold better in everyway.


Agree totally. End up costing more than the Finecast Plague Marines though :grin:


----------



## El Mariachi (Jun 22, 2008)

Well as much as I want to dislike Finecast...it hasn't been too bad for me. It's more Finecost than Failcast. Now I've only constructed 2 kits so far (hardly representative I'm sure but for those who are interested, the Tau Sniper Drone team and some Striking Scorpions)and to be honest, I haven't really had any miscast issues.

I guess strictly speaking, i've had a couple of really small miscasts (maybe a tiny missing bubble on the odd model) but nothing major and nothing that was worse than I have experienced with metal. So far I've found that the pros and cons of Finecast are:

*Pros:*
Good detail, even if you can't really tell much of a difference once painted.
Easy to convert- it's much easier to cut than metal.
The paint doesn't chip off as easily as with metal models.

*Cons:*
Takes forever to clean. Far more than metal models to the point I find myself getting irritated (probably something to do with time being far too much of a premium at the moment).

Very easy to damage. The material is almost too soft- whilst I haven't tested the theory I can believe the rumors of this stuff melting in the sun. As for when you're removing the flash or cutting models from the sprue- you have to be very careful or you can unnecessarily damage the models.

Too light and expensive. Honestly, this won't bother most people and some will see it as a plus but I prefer the weightiness of a metal model (2nd edition dreadnoughts ftw!). As for cost, I personally don't find that the products offer much in the way of value for me to spend the required amount on them- however that's why all my new GW stuff these days (and for the past few years now) have all been gifts. For those who continue to buy with their own hard-earned money however, this obviously does not apply as they still find the products to have value. That is fine but its a discussion for another thread.

So will I miss metal? Yes. Will I boycott finecast models? No, as long as I keep receiving them as gifts (just like any GW product for the record, I like the plastic kits but I don't buy them anymore either) I will happily work with the material. It's not as bad as a lot of rumors on the net (although I do not doubt some people have had bad experiences with it) but as the new processes for finecast get perfected- people will begin to forget about metal and new gamers won't even find it an issue as they will probably remain unaware of GW's metal past)!

Cheers,

El


----------



## Serpion5 (Mar 19, 2010)

Imwookie2 said:


> I said "some" would tell him to fix them. Also just saying take them back doesnt make it ok, the point is that he shouldnt have to watse his time to get replacements. The fact that this happens quite often is a poor reflection on GW and I think they should look into better ways to make these models.





Euphrati said:


> Having to return a product or open the packaging immediately upon purchasing due to manufacturing flaws should not be the standard occurrence!


It does not happen "quite often" at all. I've had no more trouble with finecast than I have with metals. Yes metals were stronger, but there were still plenty of instances where I had to gap fill because of two slightly misshapen halves or replace a fragile metal banner pole with brass rod. 

To be frank I see no real difference in the amount of things I need to fix between metal and finecast. The difference being FC is much EASIER to fix, and if it can't be fixed you replace it anyway, just like the metals.


----------



## Imwookie2 (Jul 14, 2010)

Even if it happens (them having to be returned) 1 out of every 20 models thats still 5% of the models that have major problem any other form of retail that would be considered a big problem and would most likely cause a recall. To be totally honest 1 out of 20 is probably an underestimation, just look at the OPs experience with chaos raptors. At my LFGS the problem seems to be closer to 1 out of every 3 which is a staggering 33% any other business would quickly go out of business with those kind of numbers. Also I think you guys are totally ignoring a point I made earlier....since GW has so many models that get sent back or just tossed we as the costumer have to pay more for the product to compensate for GWs lost product....thats a simple fact. Please dont try to tell me that GWs prices are not effected by these miscasts......even in the best case scenario where they catch the model in QC before they get sent out and can melt the material down and reuse it (not sure if that is even possible) they still are losing money on time spent casting the model and time being spent melting the model back down. I know thats not alot of time for each model but it adds up. Trust me when I say that GW dosnt eat this money...you do cause it is built into the price. So even if you like finecast I dont understand how you wouldnt be conserned about this as it directly effects you wallet. This hobby is expensive enough with out having to pay for GWs mistakes. 



As for metal models being "just as bad" I never had to return a metal model....nuff said.


----------



## Serpion5 (Mar 19, 2010)

I had to return a metal farseer and a metal cave drake for miscasting. 

And I know that cost will hurt over time, but as we said before this was rushed into and it seems obvious that many models once metal simply aren't suited for finecast. 

The problem will disappear eventually, whether or not you are willing to wait and make allowances in the meantime is your call. 

GW has done nothing to spite me personally, so I have no problem with giving them the benefit of the doubt until then. Like any business associated with producing product almost constantly, I understand that sometimes shit happens.


----------



## Imwookie2 (Jul 14, 2010)

Look I really hope you guys are right, I would love to be able to buy Finecast products with confidence and have great looking models. If they get all the airbubbles and what not out the material itself isnt bad and is easier to work with then metal. Despite all of my problems with finecast I also strongly dislike metal models as well for the same reason some other people have said. In the end I think plastic is the way to go. For right now im not going to be buying anymore finecast models...but maybe in a few years I will give it a try again to see if they fixed the problems.


----------



## Serpion5 (Mar 19, 2010)

I undoubtedly agree that plastic is superior. :so_happy: 

But for the time being, I do prefer finecast over metal. 


To each their own I guess. k:


----------



## Doelago (Nov 29, 2009)

Imwookie2 said:


> As for metal models being "just as bad" I never had to return a metal model....nuff said.


I have had to return two boxes due to the Space Marine veterans inside them being in a totally fucked up shape, which was shit hole annoying as the store I bought them from was 300km away. 

And getting one of those metal banners to stay on a Space Marines Back pack... :shok:


----------



## Zaden (Oct 21, 2008)

I worked at a Rogue Trader store and saw a multitude of miscast metal figure returns. Certainly not as many as Finecast, but it definitely still happened. Last year I had to return two metal Hive Guard, one missing a leg and one with a half melted gun. For smaller miscasts I would rather deal with resin than pewter.


----------



## khrone forever (Dec 13, 2010)

you people say that it takes a lot of GS skill to cover over the gaps, this maybe true. but how much time and effort did it take to pin all of those massively heavy monsters?

also, with no work on either, if you dropped both; which would break........the metal one


----------



## Imwookie2 (Jul 14, 2010)

khrone forever said:


> you people say that it takes a lot of GS skill to cover over the gaps, this maybe true. but how much time and effort did it take to pin all of those massively heavy monsters?
> 
> also, with no work on either, if you dropped both; which would break........the metal one


And if I left both in the car in the summer which would melt........Finecast. Look both materials have there problems. Like I said earlier instead of putting time into designing new finecast kits (Flayed Ones and waht not) they should be putting that time into what we all really want.......plastic kits. Plastic right now gets just as good detail as metal and finecast. With the right design even special characters can be done in plastic. I havnt seen any new special characters whos pose has blown me away in fine cast or metal.....in fact the coolest pose I have seen recently was the Plastic Skaven Warlord that came in the warhammer starter set. Like I said before I know plastic might be more expensive but im sure almost all of you would pay an extra $5-$10 a kit if it was plastic....heck with most of them you would be able to pose your own models something you cant really do with metal or finecast.


----------



## JokerGod (Jan 21, 2009)

Imwookie2 said:


> And if I left both in the car in the summer which would melt........Finecast. Look both materials have there problems. Like I said earlier instead of putting time into designing new finecast kits (Flayed Ones and waht not) they should be putting that time into what we all really want.......plastic kits. Plastic right now gets just as good detail as metal and finecast. With the right design even special characters can be done in plastic. I havnt seen any new special characters whos pose has blown me away in fine cast or metal.....in fact the coolest pose I have seen recently was the Plastic Skaven Warlord that came in the warhammer starter set. Like I said before I know plastic might be more expensive but im sure almost all of you would pay an extra $5-$10 a kit if it was plastic....heck with most of them you would be able to pose your own models something you cant really do with metal or finecast.


Having left 3 Finecast models in my car for several weeks (The case was hot to the touch) Other then needing to buy more foam (The glue melted and they fell apart  ) and a few warped bases there was no problems. 

Unless you plan on leaving your models in direct sunlight in your car with the windows rolled up for several weeks at a time and allowing the temperature of the car to get over 100, you wont have a melting problem.


Now I understand some people dislike finecast, they are more then likely the same group that generally dislike change. What I don't get is how people can just claim it is the worst thing GW could have don when they haven't given it time. Can any one els remember back to RT? or 2nd edition? my god man can you remember how retched the models looked back then? Or how about when they first went to plastic? I remember getting units with missing legs, missing half a gun, hollow body parts that snapped off with a light breeze! 

Give FineCast the time to evolve, I am glad GW went to Finecast, a little less happy about how they rushed it out but seeing as how the metal prices have skyrocketed I can understand why they did it.

~Joker


----------



## Doelago (Nov 29, 2009)

From where does this whole Finecast melts in the sun thing come anyways?


----------



## Imwookie2 (Jul 14, 2010)

JokerGod said:


> .
> Now I understand some people dislike finecast, they are more then likely the same group that generally dislike change.
> ~Joker


Everyone is certainly entitled to their own opinions. That being said if we are going to start making statements that stereotype people (which are unwarranted just read my posts, I want a change..... a change to plastic), im going to make one of my own: I think most of the people who are supporting finecast are the same ones who think GW does no wrong and would support them no matter what. In other words your drinking the GW KOOL-AID. I mean seriously look at what we have been asked to endure over the last three years:

White Dwarf going from $6 an issue.....to $8....and then to $9
Starter sets price rising from $60......to $75.....to $99
Prices in general increasing across the board (example: Assault Marines $25......to $31.....to $33)
Codexes that make old stand bys useless so you have to buy new models.
Codexes that have 25%-50% models that arnt even made....and some never get made.

and now we are asked to spend a little more money on finecast models that a big percentage (5% is a big percentage in retail) of have to be returned because of poor quality. 

and all of this while we are in an economic recession (at least over here in the US) 


Am I the only one who is tired of this?


----------



## khrone forever (Dec 13, 2010)

well GW arnt run by a load of hobbiests they are owned (in the main part) buy outside investors that dont care what prices people are paying just so long as they get their money.

also why would you leave models in the car for several days if you know theirs a problem with it?

i mean, i wouldnt carry a metal model in a tool box....


----------



## Marzillius (Jun 30, 2011)

I've yet to have a single major fault with Finecast. Sure, there have been some parts that were bent, some that had bubbles and sone that didn't really look good. But overall, my experience has been great. I like Finecast, I rate it above metal and I will continue purchasing it.


----------



## Imwookie2 (Jul 14, 2010)

Never said I did leave any in the car....just pointing out that finecast melts and metal doesnt if your were to forget a model in the car....I actually do know someone that this has happened to.


----------



## MidnightSun (Feb 10, 2009)

Imwookie2 said:


> Prices in general increasing across the board (example: Assault Marines $25......to $31.....to $33)
> Codexes that make old stand bys useless so you have to buy new models.
> Codexes that have 25%-50% models that arnt even made....and some never get made.


First off, things get more expensive in a recession. Deal with it. Secondly, since when were 'old stan bys' made useless? I can't think of a unit that has been entirely removed in recent times except Pariahs, and they can be used as Praetorians now. The 25-50% of models lacking is unimportant - would you rather play Guard under the old codex and have all the models for your 15 units, or the new Guard codex and have half the models for your 30 units? No-one will stop you converting models - GW support it, in fact. Having more options for a book is never bad.

By the way, you are a very angry person. It's unattractive.

Midnight


----------



## Imwookie2 (Jul 14, 2010)

MidnightSun said:


> First off, things get more expensive in a recession. Deal with it. Secondly, since when were 'old stan bys' made useless? I can't think of a unit that has been entirely removed in recent times except Pariahs, and they can be used as Praetorians now. The 25-50% of models lacking is unimportant - would you rather play Guard under the old codex and have all the models for your 15 units, or the new Guard codex and have half the models for your 30 units? No-one will stop you converting models - GW support it, in fact. Having more options for a book is never bad.
> 
> By the way, you are a very angry person. It's unattractive.
> 
> Midnight


Well Midnight first off thing actually tend to get cheaper during a recession because companies realize that they wont get as much business if they dont. This is especial true for hobby items as they are not a necessity and when times get hard thats what people buy. So to compete with that alot of hobby companies drop their prices slightly....not raise them by 30%-50%. Second I never said that GW got rid of units....I said they made them useless so you would have to buy some more units...Its a good business strategy but it sucks for your customers. Finally at no point did I attack anyone on this thread I was just posting my thought on the subject and you dont have to agree with them. Just because I dont agree with you doesnt make me an angry person....and the fact that you right away resort to attacking me confirms what I already knew about you midnight.....that your an idiot. 

OH P.S. Like I really give a Sh*t if im unattractive to you.


----------



## Achaylus72 (Apr 30, 2011)

I am surprised at the amount of anger that has festered.

All i was intending to do was to pass on my own personal experiences and others that i have personally seen with you folks on Heresy, and my shared my opinion that Finecast is not worth the trouble. I personally believe that GW should have several years ago when they were considering replacing metal that they should have bitten the bullet and invested into gearing up with tooling to produce only Plastic models. Thus leaving Forge World to it's Resin range.

My experience is that folks here in Australia are/or willing to pay the 87.5% mark up to buy plastic kits.

I have said previously in all my 35 years of building all manner of mediums of materials in modelling, these Finecasts are by far the worst examples of Resin kits ever produced, and that many folks i have spoken to that have been doing Warhammer since the old Rogue Trader days say the same, Finecast is rubbish and won't touch it.


----------



## Imwookie2 (Jul 14, 2010)

And alls I was trying to do was agree with your point and post some facts to back it up, and I totally understand that not everyone shares the same opinion. There is nothing wrong with having a healthy debate about something...the problem comes when people take it personal or make it personal. There really is no need for insults and what I said was really for midnight only as he has been nothing but a jerk to me since I started posting on here. Im sorry the rest of you had to see read that.


----------



## Serpion5 (Mar 19, 2010)

Imwookie2 said:


> And alls I was trying to do was agree with your point and post some facts to back it up, and I totally understand that not everyone shares the same opinion. There is nothing wrong with having a healthy debate about something...the problem comes when people take it personal or make it personal. There really is no need for insults and what I said was really for midnight only as he has been nothing but a jerk to me since I started posting on here. Im sorry the rest of you had to see read that.


I know I am being a huge hypocrite here, but you were in no way forced to post that. 


Anyway, stereotyping and personal jibes don't have to factor in. I know that I for one do prefer finecast. And I am not drinking "gw Kool-aid" either. They still try to convince me to buy White Dwarf and I still tell them to shove off. 

As Reever said to me,

This is happening people, so deal with it.


----------



## Imwookie2 (Jul 14, 2010)

You are right no one forced me to post....at the same time I didnt force anyone to read this thread....or try to force my opinion on anyone....I was simply making an argument for my side of the whole finecast issue.


----------



## Stephen_Newman (Jul 14, 2009)

Imwookie2 said:


> You are right no one forced me to post....at the same time I didnt force anyone to read this thread....or try to force my opinion on anyone....I was simply making an argument for my side of the whole finecast issue.


That is a fair point. However I notice that you and one other user seem to reply to every comment that gives any sort of view that Finecast is actually not that bad. Judging by this one can pick up on teo points:

1. You're not giving the other users a chance that might share your views.

2. In my eyes it looks like YOU are forcing YOUR OPINION onto everyone else that might think differently.


At the end of the day however I think its best to agree that we disagree with each others views. Where others have had bad experiances with Finecast with constant warping and miscasts there have been ohers like myself and local gamers in my area that have nothing but good things to say about the models.


----------



## Imwookie2 (Jul 14, 2010)

Stephen_Newman said:


> That is a fair point. However I notice that you and one other user seem to reply to every comment that gives any sort of view that Finecast is actually not that bad. Judging by this one can pick up on teo points:
> 
> 1. You're not giving the other users a chance that might share your views.
> 
> ...


Im sorry if it comes off as me trying to force my opinion on other people....that is not my intent. That being said I respond so much because other people quote me often so im just responding to their counter points with some of my own thats all.


----------



## Khargoth (Aug 5, 2010)

My Necron Overlord seems to be fairly okay. His staff is slightly crooked, but nothing crazier than Forge World. His 'crown' is quite badly deformed, though, which would irk me more if I wasn't already planning on chopping it. It looks like these minis aren't fully cured when they're de-moulded, the right side of the crest looks like the tip snagged and stretched it out of shape.

I've got the usual share of tiny bubble holes, two of which are in REALLY annoying spots, but I guess it could be worse...


----------



## Justindkates (Apr 30, 2010)

I haven't had any real problems. My Astaroth had a small chunk of flash on his scroll work I just used an exacto and shaved it down. Other than that its been smooth sailing. 

I did get a metal Terminator Chaplain a few weeks ago and his Crux was about half flat on one side and the storm bolter was a fraction off down the center but that's always been about par for the course.


----------



## jigplums (Dec 15, 2006)

Imwookie2 said:


> Well Midnight first off thing actually tend to get cheaper during a recession because companies realize that they wont get as much business if they dont. This is especial true for hobby items as they are not a necessity and when times get hard thats what people buy. So to compete with that alot of hobby companies drop their prices slightly....not raise them by 30%-50%. Second I never said that GW got rid of units....I said they made them useless so you would have to buy some more units...Its a good business strategy but it sucks for your customers. Finally at no point did I attack anyone on this thread I was just posting my thought on the subject and you dont have to agree with them. Just because I dont agree with you doesnt make me an angry person....and the fact that you right away resort to attacking me confirms what I already knew about you midnight.....that your an idiot.
> 
> OH P.S. Like I really give a Sh*t if im unattractive to you.


theres alot of inaccurate infomation here. things don't "Tend" to get cheaper in a recession, it is entirely dependent on industry and the type of products/business you have. 

"Hobby" items. what does that mean? Because if you look at the hobby of collecting and gaming with miniatures and were to take a look at other companies for example privateers press then you'd see that in general the prices of the miniature and wargaming hobby is going up and very much in line with GW prices.

if you look at other "hobbies" then which do you think have gone down? my brother is into football, it costs more than ever to go to the stadium and watch a match. It costs more than ever to buy a team shirt. Other hobbies are similar. Im sure you could find a few examples of hobbies that are cheaper but its not really relevant.

Niche businesses, which is what all wargaming falls firmly into are not dependent on price. The most important thing for its customers is quality and if you look at the stuff that gw have producted over the last few years i dont think you can quibble that they have invested alot into the quality of the miniatures and army books it produces. if gw put all its prices down 10%, no-one would by any extra models so why would they do that? in fact it shows as if you look at the fact there are several products that have become cheaper [i.e. treekin] and yet you spout "price rise" hysterics and exhaggerated figures in order to back your own arguement.

Do you know what a recession is? Its when people spend less than they did the previous year. Do you know how you get out of a recession? You spend MORE money. 

Prehaps the whole personal comments thing has stemmed from the fact you appear to have made sweeping statements as matter of fact, that are purely made up?


----------

