# Biovores



## ironhammer (Aug 14, 2008)

I was Wondering if there was any practical use for taking Biovores? I generally write them off as a waste of a perfectly good heavy weapon slot but the more i think about it... The best use i can come up with is to use them to dislodge and attack heavy weapon teams (devistators, havocs, lootas, etc...) but is there a better way? or for that matter, do these beasts actually serve a role on the battlefield I'm not seeing? can anyone offer any advice?


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## Wolf_Lord_Skoll (Jun 9, 2008)

Competatively, no, they don't offer much more than what you can get out of another unit. 

In a friendly game they are an interesting option, more for variety than effectiveness, though they can help with 3+ saves and light vehicles, as well as not needing LOS.


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## Winterous (Mar 30, 2009)

For Planetstrike they're ok, the indirect attack can help.
But don't ever take them in regular games, they're terrible right now.
Every time a Spore Mine cluster detonates, it counts as a kill point.


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## Wolf_Lord_Skoll (Jun 9, 2008)

Winterous said:


> For Planetstrike they're ok, the indirect attack can help.
> But don't ever take them in regular games, they're terrible right now.
> Every time a Spore Mine cluster detonates, it counts as a kill point.


Only if they are placed on the table. If you score a dead hit, they never hit the table so can't give up KPs.


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## Winterous (Mar 30, 2009)

Wolf_Lord_Skoll said:


> Only if they are placed on the table. If you score a dead hit, they never hit the table so can't give up KPs.


I actually disagree with that, but it's irrelevant.
The point is you're giving away free Kill points just to take a mediocre unit.


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## darklove (May 7, 2008)

They do not give away kill points because they are ammo, and the FAQ says they always detonate at the 'end of the phase'.


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## Winterous (Mar 30, 2009)

darklove said:


> They do not give away kill points because they are ammo, and the FAQ says they always detonate at the 'end of the phase'.


I agree with you, but unfortunately they actually DO give kill points.
There's nothing to say they aren't a unit you own, and despite my best insistence (yelling at people), I was disproven.


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## ironhammer (Aug 14, 2008)

uhh... where does it say spore mines count as kill points?

I mean i can see why a squad of spore mines would count, but a Biovore shot is not a squad and it doesn't fill any slots, heck the nid player isn't even paying for the mine, It just comes with the Biovore.


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## Winterous (Mar 30, 2009)

ironhammer said:


> uhh... where does it say spore mines count as kill points?
> 
> I mean i can see why a squad of spore mines would count, but a Biovore shot is not a squad and it doesn't fill any slots, heck the nid player isn't even paying for the mine, It just comes with the Biovore.


I agree with you, it's dumb that they do count.
Personally I argue (although I accept that they do count) that because you don't actually CONTROL the unit, it's merely that you choose where to move it come your turn, that it doesn't count as one of your units, and therefore not a kill point.

But in response to your argument, take a look at Gift of Chaos.
You don't pay for the Chaos Spawn that you can create, so why should it count as a Kill Point?
Because it's a unit, it follows normal rules, and that's all it needs.


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## ironhammer (Aug 14, 2008)

ah, so same reason "without Number" is a bad choice in kill-point scenarios.


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## Winterous (Mar 30, 2009)

ironhammer said:


> ah, so same reason "without Number" is a bad choice in kill-point scenarios.


Er, kinda.
Although you don't get to choose your list AFTER you decide mission, in a standard game.


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## darklove (May 7, 2008)

I have yet to see a tourney (a serious one anyway) take the interpretation that spores fired from a biovore count as kill points.


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## Winterous (Mar 30, 2009)

darklove said:


> I have yet to see a tourney (a serious one anyway) take the interpretation that spores fired from a biovore count as kill points.


And there's a good reason for that.
It's clearly not how the rules were intended to be played.

_Unfortunately though,_ RAW, they do give Kill Points (at least that's the consensus)


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## ironhammer (Aug 14, 2008)

Winterous said:


> Er, kinda.
> Although you don't get to choose your list AFTER you decide mission, in a standard game.


which is why the upgrade is generally not taken.


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## Winterous (Mar 30, 2009)

ironhammer said:


> which is why the upgrade is generally not taken.


Actually I think it's well worth taking, especially if you don't have scoring units to spare.
If you only have a few troops choices that aren't ripper swarms, it can be quite valuable; you can still use the unit as a bullet-screen, and then have it respawn and take a point that's far back.


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## Wolf_Lord_Skoll (Jun 9, 2008)

I don't see why people seem to think WoN is terrible in a KP mission. You can choose not to come back on. The reason you don't see it is because it isn't cost-efficient on big broods, you have to take small 8 man broods for it to really start to shine. Its an easy KP, but nothing back-breaking in a KP game. Take more than one and you mioght have a problem, but you don't really need more than one. 

By RAW the spore mines only count as Kps if you miss and you place a spore mine on the table. At that point you have created a new unit and hence another KP for you opponent, should they be destroyed/dentonate.


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## Winterous (Mar 30, 2009)

Wolf_Lord_Skoll said:


> I don't see why people seem to think WoN is terrible in a KP mission. You can choose not to come back on. The reason you don't see it is because it isn't cost-efficient on big broods, you have to take small 8 man broods for it to really start to shine. Its an easy KP, but nothing back-breaking in a KP game. Take more than one and you mioght have a problem, but you don't really need more than one.
> 
> By RAW the spore mines only count as Kps if you miss and you place a spore mine on the table. At that point you have created a new unit and hence another KP for you opponent, should they be destroyed/dentonate.


Yeah, WON, used correctly, is an incredibly useful and not too expensive upgrade.
You only EVER take it on a small-medium brood, to save the cost.
And as he said, you can always opt not to have them come back, denying them any further kill points off that unit (however, if you choose not to, you don't get the choice again, it's only the turn RIGHT AFTER they die)

I disagree with you on the Spore Mines though; you DO place them down on the table if they hit directly.
How it goes when firing Spore Mines:

You choose the target model, and then roll the Scatter dice.
After finding the final location, regardless of where it is, you place the Spore Mine model down.
You then place the other 0-2 Spore Mine models down, in base contact with the first.
Any Spore Mine which is touching an enemy model at this point can be chosen as the point of detonation, but you must detonate if any are in base contact.
After choosing the point of detonation, you resolve it as a Multiple Barrage, with the first template being directly over the middle of the chosen Spore Mine.

So you're wrong, you ALWAYS place the models down, and ALWAYS give a kill point.


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## Wolf_Lord_Skoll (Jun 9, 2008)

It says "use a spore mine model to portray where it lands" and then it goes on to say If the cluster scatters so that it is not in contact with an enemy model "place a spore mine at the indicated point".

When I read this, I see it as saying that the initial placement of the spore mine is only for marker purposes. Though I can see where you are coming from, as the Spore Mine is on the table. Though you technically have not 'placed' the unit on the table yet, it is just marking the point of impact(which you can do with a blast marker anyway...)


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## Winterous (Mar 30, 2009)

Wolf_Lord_Skoll said:


> It says "use a spore mine model to portray where it lands" and then it goes on to say If the cluster scatters so that it is not in contact with an enemy model "place a spore mine at the indicated point".
> 
> When I read this, I see it as saying that the initial placement of the spore mine is only for marker purposes. Though I can see where you are coming from, as the Spore Mine is on the table. Though you technically have not 'placed' the unit on the table yet, it is just marking the point of impact(which you can do with a blast marker anyway...)


Oh yeah, good point.

The model is still just a representation of location, it's not an actual unit.
And even if it is, it's not yours, so it doesn't count as a kill point.
*rant*


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## Tim/Steve (Jan 25, 2009)

I always think of spore mines as ammunition until the end of the biovore shooting- if the mines hit directly or get placed close enough to enemies to explode instantly (eg when a second mine in placed into the cluster it makes base contact- pretty common). In these cases I dont give a KP, in all others I do... TBH I dont really mind about giving KPs, my army often has twice the KPs of the enemies, with biovores and 1-2 WoN gaunts so to win anhiliation games I need to table the opponent or to smack them around hard early (something biovores are good at doing).

Mainly I take biovores because they are half decent at killing light-medium vehicles (bioacid) and help to keep the enemy hiding his MEQs in cover in fear of a lucky rolling shot (being potentially able to kill 7-8 MEQs anywhere on a table is immense.. even if unlikely).


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## Inquisitor Einar (Mar 6, 2009)

Bioacid biovores can be a pain.. they're especially nasty against my sisters.. since they only have T3.


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## Winterous (Mar 30, 2009)

Tim/Steve said:


> I always think of spore mines as ammunition until the end of the biovore shooting- if the mines hit directly or get placed close enough to enemies to explode instantly (eg when a second mine in placed into the cluster it makes base contact- pretty common). In these cases I dont give a KP, in all others I do... TBH I dont really mind about giving KPs, my army often has twice the KPs of the enemies, with biovores and 1-2 WoN gaunts so to win anhiliation games I need to table the opponent or to smack them around hard early (something biovores are good at doing).
> 
> Mainly I take biovores because they are half decent at killing light-medium vehicles (bioacid) and help to keep the enemy hiding his MEQs in cover in fear of a lucky rolling shot (being potentially able to kill 7-8 MEQs anywhere on a table is immense.. even if unlikely).


Yeah, making MEQs stick to cover is something that Tyranids can't do too well; only 2 ap3 weapons in their whole army.
And it also pins people, no matter WHEN it explodes


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## emergeo (Jun 14, 2009)

Bio-acid is good for dropping on rear armour of vehicles.

If your opponent insists they get KP's for your spore mines, then the mines can also run and go to ground.


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## Tim/Steve (Jan 25, 2009)

its the old issue of "are you playing a prick?"
I play that biovores give KP once the shooting phase ends (ie, if they hit as they are being shot then they never form a unit and so arent a KP), this is already being incredibly kind to my opponent in terms of giving him free KP. If my opponent was to insist that all shots from biovores give KP regardless I would A- think him am evil rules laywering bastard (if they have a ~6KP army and expect to get 5-7KP just from me shooting I would smack them round the head till they stopped thinking the silly thought) and B you better believe that every stupid rules lawyering thing I know will be used against them...
If you need to use them (ie, dont do this against a nice friendly person) then yes, you can run spore mines in ANY direction you see fit. Yes, they can go to ground and get cover saves of 3+. Even funnier- yes they can indeed BLOCK captures just like any other units can (so if you have last turn in an objective game shoot the mines as close to the objective as you can... hope to miss, then just run them to within 3"- if your not playing an evil player I would still do this but wouldnt throw in the run move; so its far less likely to work).


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