# Look Out Behind You



## xCr0okz- (Jul 20, 2009)

Im having some trouble infiltrating my chosen CSMs into a viable position to stay alive long enough to redeem their points?

what would be a good strategy for equipping them to deal with, oh lets say a LR, and how to use them while infiltrating or outflanking effectivly?


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## drummerholt1234 (May 27, 2009)

For the chosen just max out the meltaguns and outflank them and surely there will be something to shoot with 18" (6" move plus 12" range) to shoot on the bored.


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## TheKingElessar (Mar 31, 2009)

Or, use their ability to take 4 Specials to get 2 Melta, 2 Flamer, put in Rhino, and deploy normally.

Failing that, note that you can deploy behind them if there's room. After the enemy has finished deploying, they cannot turn round, so if they all face the main part of your army, you can deploy 12.1" directly behind.


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## LordWaffles (Jan 15, 2008)

Max meltas. Profit.


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## xCr0okz- (Jul 20, 2009)

yea thats wat ive been doing but my opponent stole the initiative and destroyed them 
1st turn with assault marines
but yea i think im gonna try siting them up with all meltas
jamming it in a rhino next to a vehicle and blowin them to ****


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## LordWaffles (Jan 15, 2008)

Wait, what are you doing not outflanking them?


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## xCr0okz- (Jul 20, 2009)

thats why i posted this i have no idea how to use them effectivly
i guess the reason im not outflanking is because its kind of unpredictable
it could send them to a side of the board where they will be of no help at all


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## Col. Schafer (Apr 15, 2008)

Its chaos man, unpredictability is what makes the army interesting. Outflank was _made_ for those guys.


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## Zaden (Oct 21, 2008)

Yep kit them out with 5 meltas and a rhino and outflank em every time. The beauty of outflanking over something like deepstriking (just comparing different forms of getting on the board from reserve) is that you have a lot of control over where you put your rhino (on the side you end up on) so that your guys are hidden behind it while they melt their target, hopefully allowing them to live to fight another turn. This compares to throwaway Terminator melta squads that deepstrike in, hopefully beside a tank, destroy it, and then die. 

Unpredictability of outflank is not as bad as you think it would be, especially when you are in a transport.


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## TheKingElessar (Mar 31, 2009)

5 Melta is a waste of points, you can only fire 2 out of the Rhino hatch.


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## Concrete Hero (Jun 9, 2008)

Some people get out of their transports TKE :grin:

I'll give you a moment to compose yourself, I know that's going to come as a shock


But seriously, I'd prefer to stay in myself but if your in a gorgeous landraider popping location it would be hard to resist getting out


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## TheKingElessar (Mar 31, 2009)

Not if the Raider has a tasty TH/SS filling...


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## KageRyuuUji (Jan 16, 2009)

Meltas at 12" are no better than Missle Launchers, that is unless your talking Multi-Meltas, which is it?


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## TheKingElessar (Mar 31, 2009)

Not true, AP1 is always better than AP3, _especially_ against vehicles.


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## SpacedGhost (Dec 16, 2008)

And that you can move around in your rhino armor and still shoot the MGs is a point over the ML too.


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## xCr0okz- (Jul 20, 2009)

nice straying off subject
but yea meltas are better, if only they had better range
and as a chaos player multi-melta are only left to vehicles and oblits


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## maniclurker (Jun 12, 2008)

Elassar, I think he was saying that he disembarks in such a way as to limit the possible return fire, while leaving a shot open on his target.

And never say that 5 meltaguns is a waste. If I could have a squad in my army have 5 meltaguns...


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## Zaden (Oct 21, 2008)

I would prefer to, as I said, pop out of the rhino in such a way as to use it as cover while I melt holes in heavy tanks (not LRs full of LH/SS Termies), then pop back in the rhino and reposition. Against a Land Raider with LH/SS Termies in it, I would probably use a Daemon Prince/Obliterator team to open the tank up and purge its passengers, keeping the chosen away from it.

I can see your reasoning behind only taking two Meltas, but at 10 points per gun, I would rather take more to make sure Land Radiers, Leman Russ's, etc for sure go down. And those extra meltas will come in handy against heavy infantry as well, versus only having two, which may kill one of them before they pound you into the ground.

And I would rather eternal warrior character/MC hunt with five meltas over two.

In the end it is personal preference; I would find two meltas lacking more often than I would find four or five meltas overkill.


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## SpacedGhost (Dec 16, 2008)

I find the 8 MGs I run on average lacking. You can never have too much melta.


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## xCr0okz- (Jul 20, 2009)

im having trouble popping landraiders 
besides running a DP up to it or unloading a melta palooza
any suggestions for a long range alternative


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## SpacedGhost (Dec 16, 2008)

Chaos dreadnoughts, defilers, or predators purchasing a LC is going to be your longest range, best weapon for popping LRs. The defiler's battle cannon could glance on a 6, but you'd have to deal scatter and be wasting one of the best anti-infantry guns in your army on a tank. (It would get to roll two dice on the pen/glance table, and ignore one result though since it's ordinance.) In other words, not wise. Meanwhile buying the LC upgrade, even twin-linked, would cost a lot need, 4s to hit and a 5 glance or 6 to pen. The Dreadnought and Preds can get LCs too, so you'd have the range, but again... 6s to pen get a little dicey, and the cost for LCs add up to a lot of points too quickly.

Your best bet are Obliterators DSing in, and TL-MGing/MMing it, or havocs with MGs. The Havocs will get their slower though. But rolling at str 8+2d6 and getting +1 on the pen table for AP1 is a much more reliable solution to LRs than the longer range ones. In my BA list I use a squad of VAS with MGs to help tank hunt when need be; you could use a squad of raptors similarly. Quite frankly though, LRs are supposed to be difficult to deal with. 

Devoting all the points to LCs, or diverting your Defiler's shots/purpose from anti-infantry can be too compromising to the list. LCs aren't as useful (when factoring points) for some other things, whereas Obliterators never run out of uses regardless of which army they're against. Hell, the Obliterators even have lascannons too if you wanted to just walk them on at your table edge and take your chance with those three 48" str 9 shots. At the Obliterators' BS 4 it'll be more reliable than 1 TL-LC shot from the BS3 Defiler, and more importantly you're not going out of your way for them.


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## TheKingElessar (Mar 31, 2009)

Ordnance actually now gives 2 rolls to Pen, pick highest. Damage stays the same.


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## SpacedGhost (Dec 16, 2008)

I think I mentioned that, TKE. 

...though my wording may have been more confusing.


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## TheKingElessar (Mar 31, 2009)

No, I mean it's two dice to penetrate, not two on the Damage Chart.

Middle of page 60.


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## SpacedGhost (Dec 16, 2008)

Ah thanks for the correction. I haven't read ordinance in a while on account of never running them myself.


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## TheKingElessar (Mar 31, 2009)

Anytime.


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## xCr0okz- (Jul 20, 2009)

Yeah you have got it right Elessar, and im really into the idea of deepstriking oblits. The other possibility for using raptors is enticing, however I would not want to buy them becaus e they almost look impossible to build, and are very expensive. What i am planning on doing is buying some assault marine jumppacks and slapping them onto the backs of a few CSMs.


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## Critta (Aug 6, 2008)

Raptors are really easy to build - they're 2 piece, metal body and jump pack. Stick one to the other and you're away.


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## xCr0okz- (Jul 20, 2009)

Yeah true, its just that the all metal body and how they have to balance on the thrust from their jumppacks seems like it would be difficult.


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## MJayC50 (Oct 30, 2007)

as chaos you have to take advantage of combi weapons (all sgts who can have a combi melta has one just for the same reason of LR or DP dready's) but best placed i think on chaos rhino's - combi plasma for these doods. i also run a squad of chosen in a rhino (6 of them) 3 have plasma guns 3 normal doods to keep points down. on the turn i arrive i can either bomb it 12 and smoke up or move six and shoot 6 ap2 shots at bs4. side armour or doods. its always good. then jump out if i need the extra dood to fire aswell, but i generally dont get them out til it blows up. then they got one turn b4 the get squashed. but they generally make their points back. These guys will always die b4 the end of the battle - if they dont your using them wrong (or ur oppenant sux, in which case bring spawn next week)


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## 123birds (May 17, 2009)

3-5 obliterators? (Anything above 6 is pushing the limit with friendlyness) Or a predator with a TL lascannon, and 2 lascannon side sponsons (I know this is normaly not liked by people because its a waste, but if you have things like demon princes and obliterators with it it works well). My friend also uses a dreadnought well, but he is blessed by nurgle....(not kidding he frikin has a shrine in his basement, and finds joy in the gospel of nurgle....Burrrrrr.) So his nurgle dreadnought has killed 15 monoliths/ 17 games against me, 7/10 land raiders, and like 3/3 leman russes. Also maybe try giving a lord Flying, Chain Fist, and flying, and have him go up the field with raptors, then unleash hell by disattaching and charging tanks. Vindicators also work pretty well if you can keep them relativley well protected, and give them the infamous 1 way cover.


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## TheKingElessar (Mar 31, 2009)

:shok: Casino dice?


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