# Crimson Consuls...



## MontytheMighty (Jul 21, 2009)

the scheming of one Alpha Legionnaire wipes out the entire Crimson Consuls chapter...really? 
I don't get how people are annoyed by the "invincibility" of the Ultramarines when Alpha Legion [email protected] is even more ridiculous...this sh*t is getting out of hand
/end rant


EDIT: apologies for the failed spoiler alert...I just fixed it


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## Lastik (Jun 15, 2011)

Yeah, the way AL is portrayed is full of plot armour and "OH C'MON!" moments worthy of Death Note.

I keep saying the true followers of Tzeentch aren't the Thousand Sons but the Alphas and their love of unecessarily bizantine plans for what can only be described as the lulz!


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## Brother Emund (Apr 17, 2009)

No idea what book you are talking about, but check your Spoiler tab!!


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## Bane_of_Kings (Oct 28, 2009)

A Short Story called _The Long Games at Charichas_ (or however you spell it), by Rob Sanders in Victories of the Space Marines.

I enjoyed the short myself. Somebody really seems to hate Rob Sanders, don't they?


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## Dicrel Seijin (Apr 2, 2011)

I read the short story this past week. Now while I love to immerse myself into a story, this one did stretch my credulity. I'm all for byzantine machinations, but for every element of the "long game" to succeed--no flaws, no mistakes, no unanticipated actions--over the course of several years did not seem possible. I too ranted my friend's ear off after having read this (we bought our copies during an earlier Borders sale).

I will acknowledge that as a loyalist SM player, my view is biased, so take the above paragraph how you will.


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## Lord of the Night (Nov 18, 2009)

I read this story some time ago and I have no complaints about it. The Alpha Legionnaire in the book, obviously not Alpharius... well probably not Alpharius... or maybe..., planned his long game out very well, he predicted how loyalists would react, taking into account the Guilliman based ideals of the Crimson Consuls and manoeuvring them subtly into the situations where they would lose their companies.

Plus he had the Black Legion helping him, and the resources of Warmaster Abaddon to call on so his ability can't be questioned.

Its the Alpha Legion, this is a legion that's been declared dead three times throughout history, that is how good they are at keeping themselves and their plans hidden from everyone else. The Horus Heresy series is showing us more and more of what they can do. They can move undetected in an alien city, they can infiltrate both loyalist and traitor legions for their own ends, and their motivations and loyalties are a complete mystery. This is a legion where we can't say for certain whether that unnamed marine wasn't really their Primarch! If anyone could pull off the scheme that destroyed the Crimson Consuls, its the Alpha Legion.


Lord of the Night


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## Words_of_Truth (Sep 20, 2007)

Tbh It's within the realms of how so many Craftworlds are destroyed because of a single individual to me, things like it do nothing but (to use a wrestling term) "bury" the opposition and inflate an ego that's already pretty big.


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## Lord of the Night (Nov 18, 2009)

Words_of_Truth said:


> Tbh It's within the realms of how so many Craftworlds are destroyed because of a single individual to me, things like it do nothing but (to use a wrestling term) "bury" the opposition and inflate an ego that's already pretty big.


I'll admit that too many Eldar Craftworlds are dying right now due to single individuals. Only the Doom of Malan'tai made sense in that regard. But I don't think you can compare bringing down an organization like a Space Marine chapter to an entire planet-ship like an Eldar Craftworld.


Lord of the Night


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## bobss (May 18, 2008)

MontytheMighty said:


> the scheming of one Alpha Legionnaire wipes out the entire Crimson Consuls chapter...really?
> I don't get how people are annoyed by the "invincibility" of the Ultramarines when Alpha Legion [email protected] is even more ridiculous...this sh*t is getting out of hand
> /end rant






There's dozens of people who have some serious ''wanking'' going on with the Alpha Legion. (Using the term strictly in its internet slang sense. I.e. 'He wanks Luna Wolves, there's no way they could beat Raven Guard. Etc.'

Frankly, Rob Sanders style is totally fanboyish. It doesn't seem proffessional at all.

@Bane of Kings. Dude, seriously. _Liking_ a book doesn't make it good. I _like_ your reviews. Does that make them good?


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## Bane_of_Kings (Oct 28, 2009)

bobss: Fair point . It's a matter of personal opinons, though. This is the first time I've heard somebody say bad things about this particular short, anyway.


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## Cowlicker16 (Dec 7, 2010)

Hearing about this I'm seriously thinking about buying it so I can get the details, Alpha Legion for 1 is my favorite legion and watching their plans come to fruition for me would be awesome


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## MontytheMighty (Jul 21, 2009)

Dicrel Seijin said:


> I read the short story this past week. Now while I love to immerse myself into a story, this one did stretch my credulity. I'm all for byzantine machinations, but for every element of the "long game" to succeed--no flaws, no mistakes, no unanticipated actions--over the course of several years did not seem possible. I too ranted my friend's ear off after having read this (we bought our copies during an earlier Borders sale). I will acknowledge that as a loyalist SM player, my view is biased, so take the above paragraph how you will.


you echo my sentiments 

I'm pretty sure the authour left out the details of the scheme because he knew he'd never be able to provide a convincing explanation of how it worked
the idea is ridiculously implausible without plot-induced idiocy on the loyalists' part

I understand that an authour sometimes needs to make a certain side look awesome, but this is ridiculous


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## gothik (May 29, 2010)

peronally speaking i enjoyed it, could have been better in places but lets face it the UMs are not invincible no chapter is and no leigon is the Heresy proved that and some chapters fall fom gace easy enough. 

unless GW and BL decide to let us in on the AL plan then to me it is plausable that the AL had planned this as thier schemes and plans seem to take years to come fruition.

just my two pennath worth as i enjoyed it


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## Words_of_Truth (Sep 20, 2007)

From what I've read and seen the story just comes across as the result of a fan. 

Maybe I should write a story where a single space marine enters the warp and takes out a daemon princes home world without even being seen or a Tau infilitrates an Imperium world and has sex with just about every woman, the out come being an army of Tau hybrids who wipe out the Imperium so the Tau can settle without problems...etc etc.

There's other short stories that mimic this imo, the one with the Chaos dude who has a "blood" bond with an Imperial Fist's geneseed which was in his friend from the Heresy is another story I loath for reasons that become apparent if you read it.


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## increaso (Jun 5, 2010)

I'm surprised no one has brought up this similarities between this and what happened to the Emperor's Swords.

I personally thought it was shocking and therefore good, that is my opinion. Any against-all-odds victory at the conclusion would have been wank. That Rob Sanders was allowed to kill off a chapter was awesome.

When the AL are portrayed at their best they do appear to be too good, but, no matter the legion/chapter/race, I don't want to read 'codex' stories. By which I mean, run of the mill.


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## Words_of_Truth (Sep 20, 2007)

increaso said:


> I'm surprised no one has brought up this similarities between this and what happened to the Emperor's Swords.
> 
> I personally thought it was shocking and therefore good, that is my opinion. Any against-all-odds victory at the conclusion would have been wank. That Rob Sanders was allowed to kill off a chapter was awesome.
> 
> When the AL are portrayed at their best they do appear to be too good, but, no matter the legion/chapter/race, I don't want to read 'codex' stories. By which I mean, run of the mill.


It's not really against all odds because the AL marine was never in danger apparently. He was ahead of the chapter all along, it was almost destined to occur. Against all odds is the Crimson Consuls (love the name btw) returning and remaking, similar to how the Crimson Fists did, but no the Alpha Legion is to badass and if they want they can exterminate a Space Marine Chapter.


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## increaso (Jun 5, 2010)

Words_of_Truth said:


> It's not really against all odds because the AL marine was never in danger apparently. He was ahead of the chapter all along, it was almost destined to occur. Against all odds is the Crimson Consuls (love the name btw) returning and remaking, similar to how the Crimson Fists did, but no the Alpha Legion is to badass and if they want they can exterminate a Space Marine Chapter.


Sorry, I was not clear.

An against all odds outcome would have occured if the Crimson Consul's chapter master had survived, pulled it out the hat or something. In some ways that would have been the usual, predictable ending.

The ending given, no matter how far fetched, was infinitely better than the boring alternative (imo).

Again imo, the best short stories do something a little special and deviate a little from the rigid codex accounts.


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## Words_of_Truth (Sep 20, 2007)

There's deviation and there's blowing it to pieces


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## Malus Darkblade (Jan 8, 2010)

I find it far more believable than an errant missile destroying one's own base/crippling a chapter.

The AL got to the recruits prior to their indoctrination (or during, I forget), their weakest point in their transformations into superhumans which is akin to when they were babies in a way and in my opinion the manner in which they executed their plan makes perfect sense. 

Subliminal messaging is a proven tactic and even we subconsciously are susceptible to this in the real world (ie. media, advertisements, etc.)


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## Chaosveteran (Aug 29, 2010)

*may contain spoilers*

I think that if Ultrasmurfs can still win a war which by all logical probabilities and descriptions they should lose (I just finished Chapter's Due), then I think the AL are entitled to destroy a Chapter due to their scheming...


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## Dicrel Seijin (Apr 2, 2011)

Malus Darkblade said:


> The AL got to the recruits prior to their indoctrination (or during, I forget), their weakest point in their transformations into superhumans which is akin to when they were babies in a way and in my opinion the manner in which they executed their plan makes perfect sense.
> 
> Subliminal messaging is a proven tactic and even we subconsciously are susceptible to this in the real world (ie. media, advertisements, etc.)


It was prior. 

Thing is though this means that the SM psycho-indoctrination can be broken and not just broken, but overwritten to the point that a loyalist SM is just a sleeper waiting to be woken with a key and will then take up arms and kill fellow SMs without any hesitation or qualms and then commit suicide when all is said and done.

By extrapolation, unless the Alpha Legion screw up and there is a leak (which will not happen since they plan for all contingencies, it seems--well who knows maybe one of the Black Legion will talk), there is nothing to stop the destruction of any and all SM chapters.

My friends tease me about the perfection of space marines and I don't like it any more than they do; I prefer flaws. This is the perfection of chaos marines, why should I like this perfection instead?


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## Malus Darkblade (Jan 8, 2010)

I was thinking they simply replaced/tampered with the tapes/programs that usually are on the pyscho-indoctrination machines used to brainwash Space Marines.

I think it's clear the AL chose this particular chapter for their own reasons but also perhaps because they were the easiest to target?

Not sure what you meant about the perfection bit.


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## Words_of_Truth (Sep 20, 2007)

Malus Darkblade said:


> I was thinking they simply replaced/tampered with the tapes/programs that usually are on the pyscho-indoctrination machines used to brainwash Space Marines.
> 
> I think it's clear the AL chose this particular chapter for their own reasons but also perhaps because they were the easiest to target?
> 
> Not sure what you meant about the perfection bit.


From reading Lexicanum....



What made them turn was simply writing on the walls of their hives.

"Their recruits were brainwashed even before induction with psycho-sensitive words written on the walls of Carcharias' underhives, and a mere phrase was all that was needed to turn them against their non-brainwashed brothers."

Sounds really bad to me if that's all it takes


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## Malus Darkblade (Jan 8, 2010)

Yeah I recall it was subliminal messages on the walls of their city.

Perhaps those words were tainted with the warp?


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## Dicrel Seijin (Apr 2, 2011)

Hmm, I'm going to have to spoiler tag this...



The trigger phrase "From the single flake of snow -- the avalanche." was spread throughout the underhive. 

The original words that were imprinted with some kind of psycho-sensitive conditioned indoctrination were never specified.

The one that figures this out is the Chapter Chief Librarian who is killed by his Lexicanium protege. The protege was also indoctrinated and with the trigger phrase his shields and training left his mind open to the warp. The demon that possessed him, killed the Chief Librarian by collapsing an underhive cavern.


@Malus: what I meant by perfection was that the AL's plan was executed flawlessly.


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## Chaosveteran (Aug 29, 2010)

Is this all from the short story in Victories of the Space Marines?


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## Bane_of_Kings (Oct 28, 2009)

Yep. [10 Character Limit]


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