# New Salamanders Anthology + More Nick Kyme.



## Bane_of_Kings (Oct 28, 2009)

Not sure if this is old news or not, but there will be an anthology collecting all of the Salamanders short stories/audio dramas as well as a new novella:



> Originally Posted by *Nick Kyme:*
> 
> Going back to the Sallies, I mentioned that the _Tome of Fire_ trilogy wasn’t completely done with. That’s because there’s going to be a fourth volume that will come out between _Nocturne_ and the next book in the new trilogy (tentatively titled _Rebirth_ at the moment, which may change if the sales and marketing daemons don’t like it…). It’s actually going to be a collection of all the short stories (including the audio) that tie-in to the series and include some of the main characters (oh, _The Burning_ will be in there too – I know a few people have contacted me on FB about how to get hold of that one).
> 
> ...


Also, some more news from Nick Kyme:



> Originally Posted by *Nick Kyme:*
> 
> ....Yep, Nocturne is the last book in the Tome of Fire trilogy (sort of…) and I am heartily pleased by A) the fan reaction and B) that I finished this epic story. Some bloggers, Facebookers, Tweeters (etc, etc) have commented that it still has some loose ends a la Lost. That’s deliberate, folks. I am returning to the Salamanders this year/next year (that’s 2012/2013 now) for the Circle of Fire trilogy where some of those threads will be taken up and run with.
> 
> ...


Source: http://www.nickkyme.com/?p=1629

Thoughts?


----------



## Doelago (Nov 29, 2009)

Into the fires of battle, unto the anvil of war!

And did he mention a new audio drama? :yahoo:


----------



## Davidicus 40k (Jun 4, 2010)

News to me! Looks good.


----------



## Fire Tempered (Dec 16, 2010)

After reading Nocturne, I don't think I will read any more of Mr. Kyme's work.


----------



## Dicrel Seijin (Apr 2, 2011)

Still haven't been able to track down all the shorts, so yes, this is welcome news. 

Now I just need to track down a copy of _Nocturne_....


----------



## Mob (Nov 14, 2010)

Are the second and third Sallies books good? I've not been overly impressed by, well, any of Kyme's work so far (his short stories are very, very meh and Promethean Sun is godawful), although I thought parts of the first Salamanders book were ok. But if he's gonna keep cranking them out, maybe I should give them a shot?

Thoughts on Nick Kyme's work?


----------



## Fire Tempered (Dec 16, 2010)

I liked second Sallies book, (it feature a lot of dark eldar so if you're into them one more reason to read it), and I found Fall of Damnos pretty enjoyable. But Nocturne was terrible. Everything seemed too far fetched to me, all action, no substance, plots from previous books were resolved badly, dialogs were terrible etc. Its far worse then first, and first book had some bad parts. That's just my opinion though, it got pretty good reviews.


----------



## Loli (Mar 26, 2009)

Ill be getting this if anything to complete my Salamander BL collection.


----------



## Lord of the Night (Nov 18, 2009)

The fires of Nocturne shall be reborn! :grin:


LotN


----------



## bobss (May 18, 2008)

I've yet to read Nocturne, even though I bought my copy months prior to this announcement. Therefore, I'm unsure whether the prospect of a further trilogy is good or not. The original Ultramarines trilogy was much better than the disaster that was the second, even though I did enjoy The Killing Ground.

I can't believe no one has brought up the possiblity of a second Night Lords trilogy based on this announcement, especially since we have known about it for much longer. Although ADB has other commitments, such as a greater involvement in the Horus Heresy than Nick Kyme currently, the idea that if Black Library are prepared to allow a second Salamanders trilogy, they may for the Night Lords. Of course, other factors exist beyond time management, such as authorial commitment. Black Library can't force their employees to write something they don't want to, surely?


----------



## Malus Darkblade (Jan 8, 2010)

bobss said:


> Black Library can't force their employees to write something they don't want to, surely?


One can only hope ^_^


----------



## Khorne's Fist (Jul 18, 2008)

I'm half way through _Nocturne_, and enjoying it so far. I think Kyme does a great job of humanising that most human of SM chapters.


----------



## Lord of the Night (Nov 18, 2009)

bobss said:


> I've yet to read Nocturne, even though I bought my copy months prior to this announcement. Therefore, I'm unsure whether the prospect of a further trilogy is good or not. The original Ultramarines trilogy was much better than the disaster that was the second, even though I did enjoy The Killing Ground.
> 
> I can't believe no one has brought up the possiblity of a second Night Lords trilogy based on this announcement, especially since we have known about it for much longer. Although ADB has other commitments, such as a greater involvement in the Horus Heresy than Nick Kyme currently, the idea that if Black Library are prepared to allow a second Salamanders trilogy, they may for the Night Lords. Of course, other factors exist beyond time management, such as authorial commitment. Black Library can't force their employees to write something they don't want to, surely?


I assure you, _Nocturne_ is NOT the end of the _Salamanders_ series. Its only the end of Part One. Its not even a case of 'could there be a sequel?' as the book leaves no room for doubt or interpretation, this is only the beginning of the end and much has yet to be resolved.


LotN


----------



## bobss (May 18, 2008)

Lord of the Night said:


> I assure you, _Nocturne_ is NOT the end of the _Salamanders_ series. Its only the end of Part One. Its not even a case of 'could there be a sequel?' as the book leaves no room for doubt or interpretation, this is only the beginning of the end and much has yet to be resolved.
> 
> 
> LotN


I know this.

What I was curious about is whether Nocturne even merits a second trilogy. The fact Nick Kyme has left loose ends implies he always desired a second trilogy and wrote Nocturne around this idea. What I'm wondering about is whether he should have written Nocturne in a way that completes the Salamanders' story, like Graham McNeill could have done for Dead Sky, Black Sun. Although I enjoyed The Killing Ground, the second Ultramarines trilogy was terrible in my opinion. Until I've read Nocturne for myself and then read the opening novel of the next trilogy, I am unable to comment on whether this is a wise move or not. Hence:




bobss said:


> I've yet to read Nocturne, even though I bought my copy months prior to this announcement. Therefore, I'm unsure whether the prospect of a further trilogy is good or not. The original Ultramarines trilogy was much better than the disaster that was the second, even though I did enjoy The Killing Ground.


It's a 'quit while you're ahead' mentality and it applies to many series that have had their continuity ruined by either too many subsequent novels, or following novels of a much lower quality that tarnish the series as a whole. For example, if Nocturne is brilliant, but the next novel is rubbish, this won't be a wise move in retrospect.


----------



## Dead.Blue.Clown (Nov 27, 2009)

bobss said:


> I can't believe no one has brought up the possiblity of a second Night Lords trilogy based on this announcement, especially since we have known about it for much longer. Although ADB has other commitments, such as a greater involvement in the Horus Heresy than Nick Kyme currently, the idea that if Black Library are prepared to allow a second Salamanders trilogy, they may for the Night Lords. Of course, other factors exist beyond time management, such as authorial commitment. Black Library can't force their employees to write something they don't want to, surely?


I'm not sure them "allowing" it is quite the right term; or that they may allow the same for the Night Lords. You can largely write what you like (at least, once you reach a certain point).

Black Library is just a publisher, like any other. I'm sure if I said "I'd like to do another trilogy for some of your best-selling and best-reviewed books", they'd snap it up. But I don't. Not now, at least. That's the reason there'll be no second NL trilogy for the foreseeable future.


----------



## Khorne's Fist (Jul 18, 2008)

As an aside, ADB, what ever happened to your plog,


> The Aphotican Oath - my Chaos Marine project log


 Al lot of us were waiting with baited breadth for this to kick off. Any progress?


----------



## Phoebus (Apr 17, 2010)

My thoughts on the "Tome of Fire" trilogy...

1. I think Mr. Kyme did a good job of introducing new themes for the Salamanders while also staying true to the original material. Cudos for that. It made me interested in a Chapter I never really thought I'd get into on account of some pretty lazy concepts ("Mount Deathfire", anyone?) from the past.

That having been said... so much of it was over-kill. It got to the point that the _constant, constant_ references to anvils, hammers, fire, and forges sent my eyes rolling back.

2. The invasion of Nocturne by a hated, traitorous son certainly makes for dramatic material... but it comes right after two short stories, a novella, and a full novel that made for the exact same story - save for the fact that Honsou was an Iron Warrior and the planet being invaded by a horde of renegades, mercenaries, and xenos was Ultramar. I actually feel bad for Mr. Kyme here. Did no one from the publishing house or his editing staff think to inform him that the basis of his story was so similar to another project being done by one of their other authors?

3. I'm becoming more and more depressed and disappointed by the lazy attempts at describing mass combat in the 41st millennium. I get that a great degree of anachronism (the propensity of melee weapons, for instance) is a key theme in 40k. It's getting to the point, though, that this idea is being used as an excuse to simply rehash the same unimaginative mass-wave charging against the same battlement defended by the same thin line of stalwart Space Marines.

Whatever happened to critically thinking about the forces you're going to describe and thinking through (or doing a bit of research, when applicable) on how they might fight given their capabilities? The ship battles shown in "Soul Hunter", for instance, didn't veer from the basic considerations of the setting, but they sure _felt_ like battles fought by a brilliant void-fighter from a long-ago age, did they not?

Or, if all else fails, at least make it so that said wave of hordes charging fanatically to a certain death do so with a sense of the epic scale of 40k. Anyone here read "The Armour of Contempt"? Remember the scenes of the landing Imperial Guard Regiments charging against K'ethdrac'tt Shet Magir, the sense of utter chaos, and the scope of millions of human beings moving forth, pressed shoulder-to-shoulder?

4. This series was unfortunately made less than entertaining (to me, at least) by the author's unwillingness (or inability?) to lend detail and life to where it truly mattered. Examples?

Nocturne is a semi-volcanic world whose titanic geological upheavals render its totality utterly deadly on a regular basis... with the exception of seven sacred cities that have stayed firm for over ten thousand years. Yet over the course of three novels, I read more about random predators (none of which I recall being described as proof to lava, naturally-occuring fire-storms, or colossal earthquakes) than I ever did about the wondrous seats of Mankind that were obviously more than a collection of rock huts if they could survive, well, _Nocturne_. When we do get a chance to see something of them, what do we get? Ultimately scaleable wall with just enough defenses for the eeevil Sorcerer's cannon fodder to suffer grievously before eventually making it through anyways? Check. Void shields? Check. Right on!

Please, Mr. Kyme, if you randomly (and improbably) happen upon this post... I don't hate you. I admire the fact that you've tackled professional writing for a living, and am happy you chose to tell new tales of a different Chapter for us. I do ask, though, that you be more ambitious with your projects henceforth.

Cheers,
P.


----------



## forkmaster (Jan 2, 2010)

Ive only read his part in Age of Darkness, first Salamander book (which was very meeh in my opinion), Fall of Damnos which I actually liked, the short Fear the Alien which was ok/meeh and listened to his audio Firedrake plus his part in Sabbats Worlds, which I would argue is his best work actually writing about the Bluebloods. However after reading his first Salamander book, I will not continue to read that series, Im afraid. 

Reading the short if Fear the alien was only awesome because halfway through The Core, I understood they took place at the same timeline and same place.


----------



## Captain_Daerys_Arrun (Jan 9, 2012)

Glad to hear he is going to continue the Salamander story, really wanted more of a conclusion in Nocturne.


----------



## KjellThorngaard (Oct 4, 2010)

I'll pick any of them up. I wasn't a fan of the Sallies before, except of the paint scheme, but know I am toying with the idea of painting up a force of them. 

Maybe I don't look at BL books with as critcal an eye as some of you, or maybe I am just really happy that there continue to be 40K books to read, but I have enjoyed Kyme's work so far. I am halfway through Noxcture, I haven't finished it kinda because I want to drag it out. Knowing they might be more in the future will let me finish it and get on to something else.

I have't gotten into the mass combat yet, the first waves of fodder have just reached the void shield, so I can't compare it to the assault in Salvation's Reach, not having read that one yet (I refuse to buy hardback).


----------



## Roninman (Jul 23, 2010)

Having read Kyme's first 2 books of Salamander trilogy and about half of Nocturne, im feeling same as i had when read Chapters Due. Utterly boring and compelling and just badly written and story which doesnt interest me anymore. I havent still finished Nocturne and not sure if i ever will, but i dont want ever again read something like that from BL. I liked second book quite much actually.

Exactly same happened with Graham's Ultramarines series. First three books were good, fourth ok, fifth bad and last utterly horrible. Even Honsou and his buddies couldnt save it from that. Took about a year to almost finish that book. Must have read 15 others between that.

These series are sometimes like hollywood movies. Some part, usually first is succesful, then you pump sequel after sequel out and not exactly sure where you want to go. Here is of course author which is of course more than happy to write about characters that he made, but havent figured out from beginning what is gonna happen at the end. Or is it gonna end. Uriel in Ultramarines series has become totally invincible, this already happened in third book but later on he survives things just out of luck again and again. And Graham is good writer, but seems also that he hasnt got time to make his story more believable and dialogue better although his HH books have been quite outstanding so far.


----------



## Fire Tempered (Dec 16, 2010)

Roninman said:


> Utterly boring and compelling and just badly written and story which doesnt interest me anymore. I liked second book quite much actually.


My thoughts exactly. Really, really, bad.I've read about 30 BL books so far, and this is among the worst(haven't read Ultramarines or any other loyalist series).

After pretty good second book and Fall of Damnos, I thought his writing is improving and Nocturne will be an ace, but I was terribly disappointed, even though I like Salamanders as chapter, being army I collect. I really can't see reedeming quality in this book, even action wasn't interesting.


----------



## Lord of the Night (Nov 18, 2009)

Roninman said:


> Having read Kyme's first 2 books of Salamander trilogy and about half of Nocturne, im feeling same as i had when read Chapters Due. Utterly boring and compelling and just badly written and story which doesnt interest me anymore. I havent still finished Nocturne and not sure if i ever will, but i dont want ever again read something like that from BL. I liked second book quite much actually.
> 
> Exactly same happened with Graham's Ultramarines series. First three books were good, fourth ok, fifth bad and last utterly horrible. Even Honsou and his buddies couldnt save it from that. Took about a year to almost finish that book. Must have read 15 others between that.
> 
> These series are sometimes like hollywood movies. Some part, usually first is succesful, then you pump sequel after sequel out and not exactly sure where you want to go. Here is of course author which is of course more than happy to write about characters that he made, but havent figured out from beginning what is gonna happen at the end. Or is it gonna end. Uriel in Ultramarines series has become totally invincible, this already happened in third book but later on he survives things just out of luck again and again. And Graham is good writer, but seems also that he hasnt got time to make his story more believable and dialogue better although his HH books have been quite outstanding so far.





Fire Tempered said:


> My thoughts exactly. Really, really, bad.I've read about 30 BL books so far, and this is among the worst(haven't read Ultramarines or any other loyalist series).
> 
> After pretty good second book and Fall of Damnos, I thought his writing is improving and Nocturne will be an ace, but I was terribly disappointed, even though I like Salamanders as chapter, being army I collect. I really can't see reedeming quality in this book, even action wasn't interesting.


?! :shok:

Are we even discussing the same book? _The Chapter's Due_ doesn't even compare to _Nocturne_, though i'll admit that the Raven Guard scenes in _The Chapter's Due_ are brilliant.


LotN


----------



## Roninman (Jul 23, 2010)

It doesnt compare yes, but its second book from BL i had to put down and moved to next book. 

Regarding Chapters Due it had so many problems which were so visible about third into novel and it kept getting worse. This has been littlebit same but not as much. Its just i aint interested in yet another battlescenes, i demand more drama, good dialogue, something that drives the action, not otherway around. And i never was too attached to any Salamanders either. They are ok but not something special. Now just look at my favourite characters: Gaunt, Cain, Talos, Honsou, Eisenhorn, they are miles apart from these Salamanders.


----------



## Babu Dhakal (Jan 10, 2012)

Phoebus said:


> My thoughts on the "Tome of Fire" trilogy...
> 
> 1. I think Mr. Kyme did a good job of introducing new themes for the Salamanders while also staying true to the original material. Cudos for that. It made me interested in a Chapter I never really thought I'd get into on account of some pretty lazy concepts ("Mount Deathfire", anyone?) from the past.
> 
> ...


This is almost how I would crit'd Nocturne, but perhaps not the series in general. NK did a very poor job here. Fireborn was the better of the 3 imho.

I would certainly echo your comments regarding combat though. Very badly done with absolutely no sense of scale or even drama. I felt like I was reading about a playground fight rather than an assault on the homeworld of a Founding Chapter..... At least Ryns World gave us a sense of scale. 

Any future titles, of which we can now guess there is another in the offing, will be met with trepidation and a sense of reluctance. Not something I want to feel when I sit down to read about my beloved Sallies.


----------

