# Adeptus Mechanicus & The Grey Knights



## netfoo (Dec 9, 2008)

I have wondered for a time as to whether or not there are Techmarines in the Grey Knights, or if they rely on Adeptus Mechanicus Tech-adepts?


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## Wolf_Lord_Skoll (Jun 9, 2008)

Grey Knights don't have Techmarines. They are based on Titan, so they are pretty damn close (well, relative to normal inter planet distances) to Mars. They get all their gear from Mars, and the stuff they get is the best.


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## netfoo (Dec 9, 2008)

Wolf_Lord_Skoll said:


> Grey Knights don't have Techmarines. They are based on Titan, so they are pretty damn close (well, relative to normal inter planet distances) to Mars. They get all their gear from Mars, and the stuff they get is the best.


But what about when they are in the Field, Techmarines are as combat capable as any battle-brother. Should the Gray Knights really be any different? 

I would ask how strange it would be to see an Engionseer walking into battle along side a company of Grey Knights, if the sight of a company of Grey Knights on a single field of battle were not a strange sight in the first place.:laugh:


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## Blackhiker (Dec 28, 2007)

netfoo said:


> But what about when they are in the Field, Techmarines are as combat capable as any battle-brother. Should the Gray Knights really be any different?
> 
> I would ask how strange it would be to see an Engionseer walking into battle along side a company of Grey Knights, if the sight of a company of Grey Knights on a single field of battle were not a strange sight in the first place.:laugh:


You have to remember that the grey knights wouldn't take a tech marine with them to battle because all of their forces are extensively trained to resist the powers of chaos and a normal marine isn't as well trained. And also grey knights are more of a strike and then move on force not a fight and continue fighting force so combat repairs shouldn't be too necessary


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## netfoo (Dec 9, 2008)

But they have land raiders and such. But I guess that you are right.


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## Deneris (Jul 23, 2008)

But why couldn't a Grey Knight be trained in the ways of the machine? If ye olde much-revered Land Raider gets damaged, I can't see the Knights waiting for tech-support from an outside organization. And when a brother is interred in a dreadnought sarcophagus, I can't see them begging the Mechanicus of Mars for help. So yes, there ARE Grey Knight techmarines, but I imagine thay are QUITE rare and probably reside mostly on the battle-barges/strike cruisers to be deployed as needed.


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## Vaz (Mar 19, 2008)

A Marine in the Grey Knights is as specialised as he wants to be - Genhain in Grey Knights is an armourer, and enhances the forces weaponry to suit the individual.

Meanwhile, on the battlefield, Techmarines are their to ensure the technical tasks of destroying bridges, repairing vehicles mid CAMPAIGN, and other feats of engineering.

Grey Knights however, are Deamon Killers. Despite the games of 40K, you will not see an Ork horde fighting against a Grey Knight Strike force, unless they are possessed - and a Grey Knight strike force won't kill billions of Orks to get to the heart of the problem, the will simply teleport/drop pod/thunderhawk in, and take out the Daemons.

They have their own armour to defend against Heavy Armour, and Transport them - you notice there are no predators, Vindicators or Whirlwinds present in the Grey Knights list, and resort to using allies to help them with the Support Role. Why would a daemon hunting grey knight fail in his duty, to repair a tank?


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## Steel Rain (Jan 14, 2008)

Vaz said:


> Grey Knights however, are Deamon Killers. Despite the games of 40K, you will not see an Ork horde fighting against a Grey Knight Strike force, unless they are possessed - and a Grey Knight strike force won't kill billions of Orks to get to the heart of the problem, the will simply teleport/drop pod/thunderhawk in, and take out the Daemons.


Unless the Orks happened to be there too. But yes, most Grey Knight battles against any non-Chaos army (though possibly Necrons and Dark Eldar) would happen through sheer coincidence on the Xenos' part.


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## Katie Drake (Nov 28, 2007)

Grey Knights are the elite of the elite and have to train for a lot longer than any normal Space Marine to even make it to the battlefield. On top of that, there's really not that many of them so each Grey Knight is a precious resource, one that the Imperium can't afford to send off to Mars for training.

The way I figure it is that they have normal Adeptus Mechanicus Priests take care of all the technical stuff while the Knights themselves focus on killing Daemons. I guess this logic would work to explain why they don't have Apothecaries either (at least in game. I know they had them in one of the books).

Katie D


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## revenant13 (Feb 15, 2008)

just a question, but dont techmarines\adepts praise to the omnissiah as much, or possibly even more, than the Emperor (or respective primarch)? isnt the GKs praising the emperor above everything kind of part of what they learn\do? i cant imagine GK grandmasters then wanting their knights to be worshipping some other person\god as well. Note: i dont know much about GK and i am just making speculation.


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## Steel Rain (Jan 14, 2008)

revenant13 said:


> just a question, but dont techmarinesadepts praise to the omnissiah as much, or possibly even more, than the Emperor (or respective primarch)? isnt the GKs praising the emperor above everything kind of part of what they learndo? i cant imagine GK grandmasters then wanting their knights to be worshipping some other persongod as well. Note: i dont know much about GK and i am just making speculation.


It's a well kept Adeptus secret, revenant. No one really knows EXACTLY who the Adeptus is worshipping. Some say it's an aspect of the Emperor, some say it's the sleeping Void Dragon. The Inquisition is...curious about this practice. That's another reason why GKs don't become Techmarines. Conflict of interest.


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## netfoo (Dec 9, 2008)

Steel Rain said:


> It's a well kept Adeptus secret, revenant. No one really knows EXACTLY who the Adeptus is worshipping. Some say it's an aspect of the Emperor, some say it's the sleeping Void Dragon.


 This issue was discussed to some extent in Dan Abnett's book _Titanicus_



Steel Rain said:


> The Inquisition is...curious about this practice. That's another reason why GKs don't become Techmarines. Conflict of interest.


Where did you find this rational?



Katie Drake said:


> The way I figure it is that they have normal Adeptus Mechanicus Priests take care of all the technical stuff while the Knights themselves focus on killing Daemons.


 You mean kind of like an internship program?



Deneris said:


> But why couldn't a Grey Knight be trained in the ways of the machine? If ye olde much-revered Land Raider gets damaged, I can't see the Knights waiting for tech-support from an outside organization. And when a brother is interred in a dreadnought sarcophagus, I can't see them begging the Mechanicus of Mars for help.


 This was what I was getting at...



Deneris said:


> So yes, there ARE Grey Knight techmarines, but I imagine thay... probably reside mostly on the battle-barges/strike cruisers....


...,and I think this is most likely the case.


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## Steel Rain (Jan 14, 2008)

Where did I find what rational?


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## netfoo (Dec 9, 2008)

Steel Rain said:


> Where did I find what rational?


Sorry, I meant the word that means explaination. Not rational as in "makes sense."


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## Steel Rain (Jan 14, 2008)

I've been hunting around for it. Let me find it. I read somewhere that the Inquisition is quietly questioning the Cult Mechanicus. It's the same thing that they are doing to Space Marine chapters like the Blood Angels over their geneseed and the Black Templars over their organization.


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## netfoo (Dec 9, 2008)

Steel Rain said:


> I've been hunting around for it. Let me find it. I read somewhere that the Inquisition is quietly questioning the Cult Mechanicus. It's the same thing that they are doing to Space Marine chapters like the Blood Angels over their geneseed and the Black Templars over their organization.


 Really? That's interesting. Would it be in The Inquisition book?


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## Steel Rain (Jan 14, 2008)

The Blood Angels thing was in their codex I believe, same with the Black Templars.


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## Shonuff (Sep 11, 2008)

i see a somewhat analagous comparison to the U.S. Military. (i am going to speak in generalizations, anyone wants to wax intelligence to show me they know so much more about our military, i'll conceede, you win now, no need to show your epeen.)

We have the military in it's branches, and we have specialized sub units. THe U.S. Navy Seals are a specialized unit used for precise missions. They don't blanket bomb areas.

There is no such thing as a U.S. Navy Seal mechanic. Why? Because if they need a hum-vee then they just use it. If it breaks, it's given to the branch of the military they borrowed it from.

Why don't the Marines own their own ships? because they USE THE NAVY. 

Same way with the Grey KNights. 

They're used, as everyone else said, for precise missions dealing with demons, when things get out of control. THey see a land raider....it gets loaded into a drop ship..they use it.. it breaks..they give it back to whichever naval space ship they're on, and have their tech marines fix it. Grey Knights use available vehicles and support from another army ( Either a Space Marine branch, or Imperial Guard) They could care less about the machine spirit, and focus on doing what they were cooked in the tube for....slaying demons. Last thing they care about is a machine spirit in a broken land raider.
"The Emperor Provides"....and to a Grey Knight..that goes for " The Emperor privides..new vehicles."

They don't need techmarines.

Grey knight strike squad floating in space, on a ship..in the ship's hold is a few drop pods and some land raiders, adorned with their emblems. The grey knights don't sit and buff them. they don't have a techmarine, stirring the machine spirit.... that's what (whoever's ship they're on)'s techmarine is for. 

i see it as a Grey knight would see it as letting Marine chapter X's Techmarine be HONORED to bless their machines..

just my opinion.


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## netfoo (Dec 9, 2008)

Shonuff said:


> There is no such thing as a U.S. Navy Seal mechanic. Why? Because if they need a hum-vee then they just use it.


 What in the bloody warp are you talking about?:shok:



Shonuff said:


> If it breaks, it's given to the branch of the military they borrowed it from.


Not in the middle of a mission they don't!



Shonuff said:


> Why don't the Marines own their own ships? because they USE THE NAVY.


No, they _are_ part of the Navy.

...You lost me after that point.


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## Deneris (Jul 23, 2008)

Shonuff said:


> i see a somewhat analagous comparison to the U.S. Military. (i am going to speak in generalizations, anyone wants to wax intelligence to show me they know so much more about our military, i'll conceede, you win now, no need to show your epeen.)
> 
> We have the military in it's branches, and we have specialized sub units. THe U.S. Navy Seals are a specialized unit used for precise missions. They don't blanket bomb areas.
> 
> ...


Frankly, I can't see the GKs TRUSTING any other organization to take care of their Land Raiders and Dreadnoghts. If you NEED the Land Raider to beat 9 shades of warp goo out of a daemonic incursion, you're not going to let some non-GK take care of it; YOU, a GK, have undergone 666 different rituals to prove your loyality and piety- Who KNOWS what that non-GK has gone through. 

And I can't see the GKs calling up the local non-GK chapter and asking, "Could you please send a techmarine to wake up our honoured brethern in dreadnought armour? We really NEED them today. You'll come between 8am and 6pm? Great...".


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## Vaz (Mar 19, 2008)

What are you on about? The Grey Knights crew their own vehicles. They are sanctified and warded against possession - it's not 'any ol bucket' they use to transport their own stuff - it's their own transport.

Much like Royal Marines use their own Vikings, the Grey Knights utilise Land Raiders.

If you're going to make a comparison about todays armed forces - either know what you're talking about, or be man enough, and have the balls to take criticism and corrections over your statements, that you blatantly know nothing about.

You talk about the Seals for one - they don't carpet bomb areas, but if it's required, they requisition use of it from command. In 40K, it's granted by the Imperial Navy. Marines don't have need for it, although they have the capability to be drawn into a war, hence their support vehicles - Whirlwinds, Vindicators for heavier close in support, and Fast Recon units, such as Skimmers and bikes - it's all self contained.

Grey Knights have no need of that. They are a Space Marine chapter, and have all the tools they require. Their transports, their troops, a big lance, and lot of bullets. They don't need big support Vehicles, for that is not their style. And big support vehicles hints to a drawn out campaign. This means repairs are needed.

Grey Knights don't. They either stop the Daemonic Incursion or die. There aren't any repairs to be made - every Grey Knight is important to the mission, and if one's tinkering with the weapon systems, it ain't hitting daemons with a sharp thing. That's bad.

It's like putting a square key in a round hole - it's not meant for that task, so they aren't used.


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## Steel Rain (Jan 14, 2008)

Are they a legit Space Marine chapter? Or are they just an inquisition force like Deathwatch kill teams? I see them as having regular human Enginseers and Priests on Titan and on the Battle Barges for that role. Maybe not.


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## Vaz (Mar 19, 2008)

They are Space Marine Chapter 666 (designation number, I don't think this is their founding number).

There was a story with the release of 3rd Ed. Daemonhunters that talks of the Grey Knights fighting and slaying a Chaplain (or could have just been an Apothecary) of a Space Marine Chapter (Relictors, I think), as the two fought over a candidate, just to show how rare a fully pure individual is, and how valuable that they are to the Grey Knights.


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## Khorne's Fist (Jul 18, 2008)

Personally I can't see the GK taking the time to send a battle brother away for a few years after investing immeasurable resources to make him the ultimate demon killing machine. Yes, the GKs use vehicles, but they are a rapid strike force aimed at the heart of a demonic force. If the LR breaks down, you get out and chop your way to the target, not pop the hood and check your coolant levels.

Every marine chapter, navy ship, or IG regiment has attached AdMech personnel. Gks, being the finest weapon in the Inquisition's armoury, are therefore going to have the finest priests attending them and their equipment that Mars has to offer. Their sole purpose is to cleanse the demon, and when they are not doing that, they are preparing to do it. For that reason I would also assume that they do not captain their own ships, and other tasks that senior marines might carry out in other chapters. A single Grey Knight is too precious a weapon to leave off the front line.


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## Wusword77 (Aug 11, 2008)

The inquisition is able to get their hands on anything in the imperium. they have final say on anything, as shown by the fact that they can call upon a Space Marine force to assist them in a mission.

They are flown by the fastest ships of the imperial navy, which are crewed by the best navigators of the Nobli Navous (or however the hell they spell it in the book). They most likely have the best tech-Priests from Mars on board the ships to repair any damage to their Land Raiders or other transports.

The Grey Knights are the Elite of the inquisition. Their sole purpose is the battle the single greatest threat to the imperium of man, the forces of chaos. Given this they do not do long protracted attacks that would generally require the use of a land raider. Almost all of their missions would be single kill missions and if a land raider needs to be repaired in the field the mission is lost anyway.

Could there be a tech-marine or tech Priest for the deamon hunters organization? Sure. Would there be one just for the Grey Knights? no


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## netfoo (Dec 9, 2008)

It would seem that this question would be best answered by the Games Workshop staff, not us. It is infinitely possible that either side of this argument is valid, though, as we seem to be lacking in sufficient evidence to support either of our respective positions (other than what we think seems reasonable and that there is no mention of this issues anywhere else) I think that this issue will remain unresolved until someone produces solid evidence that supports one argument or the other.


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## Vanchet (Feb 28, 2008)

Like katie said I persume Tech priests (more notably the ones from mars) wold be the attenders and the Adeptus Hospitaliter (if spelt right ^^; ) would be the attenders to the wounded. Grey knights are sent in small groups (cause in a way a Space marine altogether is insane so a GK is even worse!!) marines can be sent into small groups, in Iron Snake they just send a single marine to settle a task against the Dark Eldar and that was easy, and they wouldn't direct their attacks on one location less there's a truly serious situation.


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