# Adeptus Arbite Strike Cruiser



## hailene (Aug 28, 2009)

Here's a question I have from the book "Execution Hour".



So the Arbites have a deep space vessel. A cruiser to be more specific. A _Strike_ Cruiser to be exact. A Strike Cruiser that is "...constructed in much the same way as the Adeptus Astartes variant..." So they basically have a Space Marine Strike cruiser at their disposal. Odd or no? And please cite your sources! Rhetoric is good. Conjecture is fun to wrap your mind around, but sources are required.


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## locustgate (Dec 6, 2009)

hailene said:


> Here's a question I have from the book "Execution Hour".
> 
> 
> 
> So the Arbites have a deep space vessel. A cruiser to be more specific. A _Strike_ Cruiser to be exact. A Strike Cruiser that is "...constructed in much the same way as the Adeptus Astartes variant..." So they basically have a Space Marine Strike cruiser at their disposal. Odd or no? And please cite your sources! Rhetoric is good. Conjecture is fun to wrap your mind around, but sources are required.


Crossfire they have an Indictor-class fast cruiser called Jadgement's Clarrion, Ch 5. 
And what do you want to a source from you just said it and did it say 'Strike' cruiser or just cruiser?


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## Helsreach (Jun 2, 2010)

Now thats police work! I'd say that given the nature fo the Arbites, being the galactic police force and essentially answerable only to the High Lords (seeing as they have the authority to execute a Govenor should they fail in their duties and can assume control over a planet (see Dark Apostle)) and are the equivelant of a millitary force (being capable of fending off PDF troops (Nightbringer)), and even being used to take on Space Marines (The Bleeding Chalice) I'd say that the idea that they're capable of requesitioning a Strike Cruiser isn't too far out of the question.

Similar to how the Naval Security in Eisenhorn is probably better than most guard units, I'd say they would be used for boarding illegal vessels, destroying rioting prison planets and executing the Emperors justice. Heck, they get Rhino's and Land Speeders so why not a Strike Cruiser, in fact it only seems logical, why keep them trapped on the ground when rapid deploment and mass sentencing (what I imagine they'd call an orbital bombardment). Not forgetting that most Imperial prisons take up entire planets.

The Sisters of Battle get Rhinos, Power Armour and bolters too and their massivly more common than a Space Marine (which is I assume the point of your question, asking how they can afford Space Marine standard stuff). What sets them apart from the Space Marines is their only humans, same goes for the Arbites. This is the best equipment the Imperium can offer and if they can afford to dish it out to about 1000 SM chapters, why not give it to your police force and the massivley wealthy and influential church and their enforcers? The only reason the Guard doesn't get it (in fluff terms) is because they are billions, not thousands in number and far more expendable. A regiment needs to be home grown and shipped out cheap as chips and to cover every warzone in the galaxy. If they had the resources and if the role suited them, I can imagine a Guard Strike Cruiser.


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## hailene (Aug 28, 2009)

locustgate said:


> Crossfire they have an Indictor-class fast cruiser called Jadgement's Clarrion, Ch 5.
> And what do you want to a source from you just said it and did it say 'Strike' cruiser or just cruiser?


Part four of the book, chapter 6, "It was the _Inviolable Retribution_, a Punisher class Arbites strike cruiser, constructed much in the same way as the Adeptus Astartes variant and intended much for the same purpose: rapid resposne planetary assault force deployment and orbital offensive support."



Helsreach said:


> Similar to how the Naval Security in Eisenhorn is probably better than most guard units, I'd say they would be used for boarding illegal vessels, destroying rioting prison planets and executing the Emperors justice. Heck, they get Rhino's and Land Speeders so why not a Strike Cruiser, in fact it only seems logical, why keep them trapped on the ground when rapid deploment and mass sentencing (what I imagine they'd call an orbital bombardment). Not forgetting that most Imperial prisons take up entire planets.
> 
> The Sisters of Battle get Rhinos, Power Armour and bolters too and their massivly more common than a Space Marine (which is I assume the point of your question, asking how they can afford Space Marine standard stuff). What sets them apart from the Space Marines is their only humans, same goes for the Arbites. This is the best equipment the Imperium can offer and if they can afford to dish it out to about 1000 SM chapters, why not give it to your police force and the massivley wealthy and influential church and their enforcers? The only reason the Guard doesn't get it (in fluff terms) is because they are billions, not thousands in number and far more expendable. A regiment needs to be home grown and shipped out cheap as chips and to cover every warzone in the galaxy. If they had the resources and if the role suited them, I can imagine a Guard Strike Cruiser.


There is a huge difference between a land speeder and a strike cruiser.


Also, SoB gear is significantly different than Space Marine gear. Even their bolters.

And why give it to Space Marines and not your police force? Because Space Marines are a weapon designed to outfight whatever the galaxy can throw at them. They are the Emperor's chosen, his sons. They fight against horrors that would drive normal men to commit suicide and they win.

Also there's a reason why Guard don't get Strike Cruisers. Because the separation of Imperial Navy and Imperial Guard. As per the Guard codex, "The Imperial Army, as it was, ceased to exist. The link between fleet and army was severed--never again would ground commanders be given direct control over interstellar ships."

This was all to "prevent the possibility of large scale rebellion from occupying again."


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## Helsreach (Jun 2, 2010)

Having a Land Speeder and Strike Cruiser is different yes but why give them Rhino's and Land Speeders but draw the line at a Cruiser if one is needed? If it helps them do their jobs and they're worth the cost they get it.

SoBs get different bolters because they're human. Same with the Power Armour. Its a matter of expence really and they have the connections to afford it just like how a rich ganger can equip himself with a plasma cannon or a noble can get Power Armour.

Space Marines can face down horrors because of mental conditioning and genetic enhancement, not because just because their bolters are superior. The Arbites have to keep entire planets in check most of the time and if you've got the tech and resources avaialble then it makes perfect sense to equip them with it. A cruiser is not something only a SM can use and its often piloted by human crew so whats the problem? If you can afford a good few thousand of them for the Space Marines then why not give another small elite force with vast resources one of them?

The Navy don't use Strike Cruisers I'd say because they have far less practical use for them in their operations.


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## hailene (Aug 28, 2009)

Explain to me when the Arbites themselves would need a Strike Cruiser. Are they leading planetary assaults now? If there was a need for a planetary assault, the Guard and Navy would be called in.


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## JaqTaar (Apr 9, 2011)

The Arbites are indeed among the few armed organisations that are allowed to have both ground and spaceborne forces. This is because their work is not just hunting criminals and heretics, but generally defending Imperial order, territory and assets as well as taking them back when lost. 

This is from the novel Crossfire:


> ... Arbites fleets that roamed their light-years long patrol beats back and forth across the Imperium, ready to reinforce a beleaguered planetary precinct. It was an Arbitrator's life at its most simple, the paramilitary side of their calling stripped bare...


And from the bonus material in the omnibus:


> The fleet constitute mobile forces able to reinforce the work of planetary precincts with resources both of judical expertise and scholarship, and considerable military and paramilitary force; (...) their primary function is the exertion of armed might in support of their planetary colleagues.


Also keep in mind that both the Arbites in general and these vessels in particular are few of number (the Strike Cruisers will also usually patrol alone) and not that much of a threat should they decide to rebel, which seems to be rather rare (actually I can't remember ever reading of a heretic Arbites).
They are very loyal and it's less likely for them to turn heretic compared to the mostly less well trained and indoctrinated common Guard and Navy personnel. Many of them are recruited from the Schola Progenium so in those terms they are on one level with many Guard and Navy officers, Commisars, Sisters of Battle and Storm Troopers.

PS:
One example of such a support action can be found in the old Warhammer Monthly comics, which had two short strips dedicated to the Arbites (but if you doubt Execution Hour's fluff validity, you might disregard this one as well as it was written by Gordon Rennie too), in one of which Arbites were the last loyal forces on a planet attacked by a Genestealer cult. They were wiped out, but later an Arbites relief force reconquered (and bombed) the planet.


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## locustgate (Dec 6, 2009)

JaqTaar said:


> Also keep in mind that both the Arbites in general and these vessels in particular are few of number (the Strike Cruisers will also usually patrol alone) and not that much of a threat should they decide to rebel, which seems to be rather rare (actually I can't remember ever reading of a heretic Arbites).
> They are very loyal and it's less likely for them to turn heretic compared to the mostly less well trained and indoctrinated common Guard and Navy personnel. Many of them are recruited from the Schola Progenium so in those terms they are on one level with many Guard and Navy officers, Commisars, Sisters of Battle and Storm Troopers.


I found an idea for my next chaos squad.


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## Helsreach (Jun 2, 2010)

Well put JaqTaar. It tends to be the Arbites themselves who are the last remaining loyalists, they don't ever seem to side with rebels, aren't privy to planetary polictics and will probably lack the support of the local navy. They need to be strong and independant. Planetary assault is something you may need for a highly trained crack force of soldiers and that is what they are. When the Space Marines use them its so they can deploy a smaller elite force. Its like a regiments worth of Storm Troopers, you want them to deploy quickly and efficiently just like a SM company would do. If they need to get their troops to a rebelious Hive City fast they'd call in the Arbites Cruiser.

Even then I'd say its more of a special feature than something they'd really use it for. I imagine the writer put that in to make the Arbites sound better as well as demonstrating that like a SM cruiser it can get in low orbit and deliver a payload without fear of being shot down. Planetary assault covers more than ground troop being deployed in any case.


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## NiceGuyEddy (Mar 6, 2010)

Strike cruisers seems a bit extreme. I would say it depends on the planet's purpose and importance, in _Crossfire_ the planet in question, Hydraphur, is a major port so it makes sense that there would be a strike cruiser available for the arbites, however I'd say it is rare. Most planets' arbites probably only need picket ships.


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## JaqTaar (Apr 9, 2011)

As I understand it the Arbites fleets are entirely independant of the planetary Arbites. The ships do not "belong" to any planetary precinct, the ships themselves are precincts. And most of the time they would be on patrols between planets rather than stationed at one planet.

Though as you indicated in the case of important planets like Hydraphur it may well be the case that a strike cruiser is kept there in reserve.


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## hailene (Aug 28, 2009)

I'm still not biting. Arbites monitor and watch. If things hit the fan (like a planetary rebellion) they buckle down, hold the fort, and call for help. They try to hold it together and send any information they can to rescuing forces--usually IG and Navy, but I'm sure Inquisitors and Space Marines could tag along, too, depending on the circumstance (if the former Governor possessed by a daemon, coerced by Xenos, ect).

I can see how Arbites could use a warship, but with resources being ever so thinly spread, why would they give a dedicated planetary assault ship to the Arbites. If some traitor worth sending thousands of men down to a planet was to be found, why wouldn't they call in the Guard and Navy? Plus, do the Arbites even boast enough numbers to be assaulting planets? And if not, why would they need such a powerful ship? They would probably be better off with more numerous, smaller ships that would give them more flexibility. 

Also about rebelling prison planets--from what I've read (Gaunt's Ghosts and Last Chancer's series) those are controlled by the commissariat. Even if such a planet rebelled, the Arbites would have little to do with it: the prisoners there have been found caught and found guilty.


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## JaqTaar (Apr 9, 2011)

hailene said:


> If things hit the fan (like a planetary rebellion) they buckle down, hold the fort, and call for help. They try to hold it together and send any information they can to rescuing forces--usually IG and Navy, but I'm sure Inquisitors and Space Marines could tag along, too, depending on the circumstance (if the former Governor possessed by a daemon, coerced by Xenos, ect).


That is correct. But these rescuing forces can also be other Arbites. Who have the advantage of being able to respond quicker, since they are a smaller, more specialized force with its own ships and hence not dependant on the Navy providing transportation.



hailene said:


> If some traitor worth sending thousands of men down to a planet was to be found, why wouldn't they call in the Guard and Navy? Plus, do the Arbites even boast enough numbers to be assaulting planets?


Some traitors are not worth or rather do not require the manpower of the Guard or the firepower of the Navy to be put down. Sometimes it only takes hundreds of men and/or a single ship who strike at specific points or take out specific people to end a rebellion. Which can be done by the Arbites. Also by the Space Marines (in rarer cases even Imperial Assassins), but they may not be in the area or may (think they) have better things to do, while the Arbites are entirely dedicated to protecting Imperial sovereignty.



hailene said:


> Also about rebelling prison planets--from what I've read (Gaunt's Ghosts and Last Chancer's series) those are controlled by the commissariat. Even if such a planet rebelled, the Arbites would have little to do with it: the prisoners there have been found caught and found guilty.


I think it was the older fluff that had the Arbites controlling the prison worlds and penal legions (Citadel Journal #12 had a Penal Legion army list with Arbites guards). It remains unclear how much of that is still applicable, if at all.

In a way, all the justification can be found in a single quote; though it is from Execution Hour, so I guess it's kind of a circular reasoning (but both Farrer's novels and the Dark Heresy RPG confirm the range of tasks carried out and authority held by the Arbites): The oath sworn by the Arbites.


> To serve the Emperor. To protect His domains. To judge and stand guard over His subjects. To carry the Emperor's law to all worlds under His blessed protection. To pursue and punish those who trespassed against His word.


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## Aramoro (Oct 7, 2009)

hailene said:


> Here's a question I have from the book "Execution Hour".


Haven't you just cited your own source that they have Strike Cruisers? It would seem that way. 




helsreach said:


> Well put JaqTaar. It tends to be the Arbites themselves who are the last remaining loyalists, they don't ever seem to side with rebels, aren't privy to planetary polictics and will probably lack the support of the local navy. They need to be strong and independant. Planetary assault is something you may need for a highly trained crack force of soldiers and that is what they are.


Indeed, Arbiters don't come from the general population, they're brought in from outside, they live in the precinct, it usually has it's own landing facilities. Popular rebellion never really gets within the compound as they do not socialise. They're all orphans as well or something bizzare. 

The reason they need Strike cruisers is simple though, if a Planetary Governor or PDF rebels it's the Arbites job first to sort that shit out. So they'll need craft able to support the fortress precinct on the ground if it all goes pear shaped.


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## NiceGuyEddy (Mar 6, 2010)

hailene said:


> I can see how Arbites could use a warship, but with resources being ever so thinly spread, why would they give a dedicated planetary assault ship to the Arbites. If some traitor worth sending thousands of men down to a planet was to be found, why wouldn't they call in the Guard and Navy? Plus, do the Arbites even boast enough numbers to be assaulting planets? And if not, why would they need such a powerful ship? They would probably be better off with more numerous, smaller ships that would give them more flexibility.


They wouldn't invade planets haha. As I said earlier for systems like Hydraphur (a major port) there are dozens of scenarios where an arbites strike cruiser would be handy; a riot on a penal ship, a mutiny on a minesweeper, a renegade frigate captain, the events of _Crossfire_, a criminal stow away, a rogue trader fleeing with contraband etc etc. In cases like these (which would arise frequently enough in a busy port system) one arbites strike cruiser could accomplish much without having to waste the guard or the navy's time. As to flexibility you can't get more flexible than a strike cruiser but yes they are rare...


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## hailene (Aug 28, 2009)

Aramoro said:


> Haven't you just cited your own source that they have Strike Cruisers? It would seem that way.
> 
> Fluff isn't consistent across all sources. Particularly when they commission writers from outside the WH40k universe. Or just plain bad writing, like Goto.
> 
> ...





NiceGuyEddy said:


> They wouldn't invade planets haha. As I said earlier for systems like Hydraphur (a major port) there are dozens of scenarios where an arbites strike cruiser would be handy; a riot on a penal ship, a mutiny on a minesweeper, a renegade frigate captain, the events of _Crossfire_, a criminal stow away, a rogue trader fleeing with contraband etc etc. In cases like these (which would arise frequently enough in a busy port system) one arbites strike cruiser could accomplish much without having to waste the guard or the navy's time. As to flexibility you can't get more flexible than a strike cruiser but yes they are rare...



All the examples you gave, a Strike Cruiser would be less useful than a normal cruiser, as the Strike Cruiser is designed to bombard planets and survive long enough to drop troops onto it. Plus, how often would the Arbites need so much firepower? Rarely is my guess. Leave it to the military arm of the Imperium who needs it constantly, the Imperial Navy, and then requisition a ship when you need it (as in my previous thread we've concluded that a senior Arbite has the purview to commandeer Imperial Navy vessels). 

Edit: Doh! Didn't see Jaq's post. I'll respond when I get back from class in 5 hours.


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## Doelago (Nov 29, 2009)

hailene said:


> All the examples you gave, a Strike Cruiser would be less useful than a normal cruiser, as the Strike Cruiser is designed to bombard planets and survive long enough to drop troops onto it. Plus, how often would the Arbites need so much firepower? Rarely is my guess. Leave it to the military arm of the Imperium who needs it constantly, the Imperial Navy, and then requisition a ship when you need it (as in my previous thread we've concluded that a senior Arbite has the purview to commandeer Imperial Navy vessels).


Dude, red color is reserved for official moderator statements. Just thought I do point it out.


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## JaqTaar (Apr 9, 2011)

hailene said:


> If the PDF rebel the Arbites are going to be outnumbered by a ridiculous amount. I can't think of a single example of the Arbites quelling a rebellious planet by themselves. It's always the other arms coming (as they have the manpower) while the Arbites hold their fortress. Or try to, anyway.


Think of it this way: Why would such a case be described or even mentioned? If the Arbites quell a rebellion by the PDF or IG, the status quo is preserved and nothing changes. Doesn't make for a very good story, does it? :wink:
Almost all of the human-viewpoint novels are about Marines and the Guard *, so of course they almost all describe those forces beating up the enemy. Instead of occasionally arriving "too late" and finding that the Arbites have already done the job. 

The Arbites are like the Mechanicus in that regard, they are an armed force of (locally) considerable might, but they rarely get the spotlight in the background material.

PS:
* or the Inquisition


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## hailene (Aug 28, 2009)

Doelago said:


> Dude, red color is reserved for official moderator statements. Just thought I do point it out.


I totally didn't know that. I'm not very good at multiquotes--usually I just reply by making a list of points that addresses a person's questions or reasons. I saw someone reply to a post like that, and I thought red just looked good. I'll change it.



JaqTaar said:


> That is correct. But these rescuing forces can also be other Arbites. Who have the advantage of being able to respond quicker, since they are a smaller, more specialized force with its own ships and hence not dependant on the Navy providing transportation.
> 
> I have never seen Arbites from another system to assist Arbites in another system. Not on Arbites business, anyway. In the Eisenhorn trilogy, Eisenhorn's Arbite did help with a another Arbite's invesigation on a different world, but Fischig, the Chastener, was operating as part of an Inquisitional retinue and not as an Arbite.
> 
> ...





JaqTaar said:


> Think of it this way: Why would such a case be described or even mentioned? If the Arbites quell a rebellion by the PDF or IG, the status quo is preserved and nothing changes. Doesn't make for a very good story, does it? :wink:
> Almost all of the human-viewpoint novels are about Marines and the Guard *, so of course they almost all describe those forces beating up the enemy. Instead of occasionally arriving "too late" and finding that the Arbites have already done the job.
> 
> There's plenty of room for writing. Arbites discovering a convoluted conspiracy against the Imperium. Arbites finding Chaos taint amongst a Hive's subculture. Take almost anything the Ordo Hereticus or Malleus do and place Arbites there. It works, most of the time. I know you sort of mentioned it, but you'd think there'd be at least one mention of Arbites stopping something. It seems that either things are going peachy and controlled or they get steamrolled and cling to life. In most stories.
> ...


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## JaqTaar (Apr 9, 2011)

> That's my point. Either it requires thousands and men, so the Guard and Navy is called in, or it requires hundreds or tens of men, and if that's the case a Strike Cruiser is complete over kill.
> (...)
> Giving the Arbites one of the most powerful ships in Imperial space, plus one designed for a role I don't see them in engaging much is a bit...odd.


Maybe there's been a misunderstanding here. I always thought of it like this: The design and purpose is very similar, but the Arbites strike cruiser is less mighty than the Astartes one.
To what extent I can only guess, but if you come across them you could compare their rules from the Battlefleet Gothic game (Punisher class rules were published in one of the specialist game magazines).

Either way, I don't see what speaks against such a vessel. As Execution Hour mentioned "it's pirmarily a blockade runner and rock pounder, designed for dealing with orbital defense platforms and putting the fear of the Emperor into planet-based ground forces". Seems perfectly fine for an organization charged (among other things) with keeping the local government in line and acting as sometimes first, sometimes last line of defense against rebellion and invasion.

I also don't agree with the wasted ressources / overkill argument. We are still talking about 40k here. :wink:



> The Mech usually get a good amount of screen time. They have their own HH book, Titanicus, they're mentioned in almost every book. Sometimes they have crucial roles like in "Gunheads" or "Helsreach". They're all over the Codices. Arbites...not to much.


Actually the Arbites have three dedicated novels, a major role in two (Execution Hour and Nightbringer) and are mentioned all over the place: In the Eisenhorn novels (and not just Fischig), the Cain ones, the Soul Drinkers books, one of the Word Bearers series and even the HH (Nemesis) etc.

They also had two army lists in Citadel Journal (four if you count the one for Epic (!) and Penal Legion). 
They were in the WH codex as an actual unit. Though counts-as, it was an officially sanctioned one.

Still they don't get nearly the same feature time as the Mechanicus, but then again they are not as crucial to the workings of the Imperium.



> There's plenty of room for writing. Arbites discovering a convoluted conspiracy against the Imperium. Arbites finding Chaos taint amongst a Hive's subculture. Take almost anything the Ordo Hereticus or Malleus do and place Arbites there.


The thing is: Why would they write much about them (and Farrer's novels are a special case as they are about conflicts within the Imperium)? Unlike the Mechanicus with the iconic Titans (other parts of the Mechanicus don't get mentioned that often besides maintaining/repairing stuff*) or the Inquisitors that are in several codices and have their own game, there's simply no need for GW to advertise them. Many people don't know much about them and they are not a codex army.
They are mentioned in quite a lot of texts, because they have been part of the background for a long time and their role makes it necessary for them to be included from time to time (what with armed conflict on human worlds being a common thread of a large portion of the BL output).

But unless they do get more attention in the future (maybe the next SoB codex will feature them more heavily than the WH one; I doubt it, but who knows), we have to make do with the sources we currently have.

* Ironically the maybe best Mechanicus fighting scene not involving Titans can be found in the Arbites novel Legacy.


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## Warlock in Training (Jun 10, 2008)

Huh. whats the big deal here? So what they have a Strike Cruiser. The argument im seeing alot has to do is why would they need it? Why not let the IG deal with what they deal with?

The IG and Navy are fine and Dandy but there general convential resource. Case point would be a american city has a drug lord that killed the govenor. Who do you send? The Army? The Navy? Well the police are unable deal with it. Thats when you send in the Special Train forces like F.B.I., D.E.A., Marshals, Swat, the guys that have ALL the resources any given place can offer and do the job with Surgical Prescision. You dent send in a Meat Cleaver (IG) to cut out a Cancer. Thus Inquisition, SoB, Arbites, and SMs are the Orginazations to deliver the "prescision" to deal with any given threat. Also unlike Guard these orginazations have HUGE amount of resources and favores to call in to get what they want. So a Strike Cruiser not only sounds plausible, but nessicary to cut out major threats before it gets so big the IG are needed.


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## Aramoro (Oct 7, 2009)

> Fluff isn't consistent across all sources. Particularly when they commission writers from outside the WH40k universe. Or just plain bad writing, like Goto.


This is kinda irrelevant though. They have a Strike Cruiser so they have a Strike Cruiser. Why they have it and what they use it for is up to our imagination but it is indisputable that they have at least 1. 

That's the other thing about the Imperium, it's not consistent. They may in fact only have 1 in the entire galaxy because of some freak occurance, or they might be common an certain sector but unheard of elsewhere.


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## hailene (Aug 28, 2009)

JaqTaar said:


> Maybe there's been a misunderstanding here. I always thought of it like this: The design and purpose is very similar, but the Arbites strike cruiser is less mighty than the Astartes one.
> To what extent I can only guess, but if you come across them you could compare their rules from the Battlefleet Gothic game (Punisher class rules were published in one of the specialist game magazines).
> 
> I don't have the special rules for the Punisher class. I didn't know it existed outside the novel. But from the book it says that the Punisher is "constructed in much the same way as the Adeptus Astartes variant" which makes me believe it's more or less equitable to its Space Marine cousin.
> ...


That's all from me tonight. I'm off to bed. Hope to see s'more post tomorrow!


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## JaqTaar (Apr 9, 2011)

> Any planet or installation worth rating an orbital defense requiring a Strike Cruiser to crack would probably have sufficient ground forces to make an Arbite sponsored attack unfeasible.


And how do you come to that conclusion? Do you have some Administratum statistics compendium providing you with all the information about all kinds of different planets in the Imperium or how all invasions/rebellions play out? :wink:
Anyway the Arbites might not have to worry much about the ground forces, what with the bombardment cannons.



> The role of the Arbites isn't to defend a planet from invasion or quell rebellious planets.


They protect Imperial sovereignty, which will include fighting off (ar trying to do so) invaders or rebellions. Or do you think they'd just stand by and watch the planet (and its tithes) they're supposed to keep in check go down?


> is there any record of an Arbite force going to another system to crush an ongoing rebellion? Not within their home system, but in another.


The Arbites operate (and patrol) within certain structures, some of which are the same as the sector/subsector/system-order usually used by the Imperium, some are not. Again, read up in the Enforcer omnibus if you're interested in the Arbites.
In the "Pax-Imperialis"-comic example I have brought up, where the Arbites relief force came from was not mentioned and why would it? It's not important to the story whether it came from a nearby planet or out of the system.



> (...) So just looking at the Cain series, the Arbites repeatedly go to other arms for assistance in manpower. Now while Mitchell's view of the Arbites roughly conforms with mine (that of watchdog and whistle blower), maybe this view point is less supported than Rennie's Strike Cruiser totting paramilitary force. Hence why I'm trying to read up on every Arbite source I can get my hands on.


I brought those up because you said that Arbites weren't mentioned so often, not because they had anything to do with the Strike Cruiser. The latter is indeed only brought up in Execution Hour (and the fleets mentioned and described in a general fashion in the Calpurnia books), while almost all Arbites appearances are involving "only" the planetary ones.
But simply put, I don't see the scarcity of references as a reason to doubt the concept.



> (...) One would think that the Arbites would fall under that? Maybe Arbites do travel to other worlds, just under the banner of the Imperial Guard? After all, you say they provide a crucial defense to planets. A "defence unit", one could say?
> 
> I have no proof beyond this one quote and I haven't really thought about it, but I could see Arbites forces being drafted to act as NCOs in a newly raised regiment.


I'd say the planetary Arbites will stay where they are, they are bound to the place they protect and are not free to simply leave it.
The Arbites of the fleet, if they were any nearby, would probably join such an action, but acting alongside the Navy and Guard, not under them.
I also don't see them getting split up and reinforcing the Guard in such a case. 
They might do so on the planet that was under attack though. If for example the Governmental/Guard command structure was destroyed. See the "Necromunda Enforcers" rules, which talk about the Arbites in the introduction (as the Necromunda Enforcers are modelled on the Arbites):
"If planetary control is ever lost, the Arbites are empowered to take over and rule the world in the Emperor's name." 

PS:
I found some stuff on the Punisher class, apparently compiled from the BFG magazine.


> The Arbites Punisher class strike cruiser is a policing vessel which is used to provide local system security, to quell small rebellions in nearby systems, and to root out pirate bases. The design of the Punisher is very similar to that of its Space Marine strike cruiser equivalent. Much of the design is similar, with the exception of the more typical Imperial prow, which (to the untrained eye) can give the Punisher the appearance of a Dauntless light cruiser. There is also slightly less armour plating on the ship's engine ports compared to its Astartes counterpart. (...) Adeptus Arbites ships are rare compared to their naval counterparts, and rarely participate in joint fleet actions. An Imperial player may take one Punisher for every 1000 points. It would be appropriate for a corresponding scenario or subplot to be used to explain its appearance. (...) Barrage bombs, the bombardment cannon, and special drop pods make the Punisher quite adept at assaulting planetary targets. (...)


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## Anarkitty (Jul 29, 2008)

In addition to the debate about wht Arbites do on planetary surfaces, they also enforce the law between the stars. They would need a ship capable of taking on xenos and rebels and well-equipped Rogue Traders in a pinch.
Strike cruisers are fast, maneuverable, and good at boarding actions. All of these make them the best choice for an Arbites craft, versus another class of cruiser.
Additionally, even if they don't use them very often, the _ability_ to use those bombardment cannons make them a powerful took of fear, and knowing there is such a ship floating in orbit could make a planetary governor think twice about rebelling against the Imperium.
It's the same reason Arbites have such distinctive armor and weaponry, and stay in their precincts instead of interacting with the everyday citizenry. Intimidation, fear, and a healthy dose of propaganda and mystery are very powerful tools.


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## hailene (Aug 28, 2009)

Warlock in Training said:


> Huh. whats the big deal here? So what they have a Strike Cruiser. The argument im seeing alot has to do is why would they need it? Why not let the IG deal with what they deal with?
> 
> The IG and Navy are fine and Dandy but there general convential resource. Case point would be a american city has a drug lord that killed the govenor. Who do you send? The Army? The Navy? Well the police are unable deal with it. Thats when you send in the Special Train forces like F.B.I., D.E.A., Marshals, Swat, the guys that have ALL the resources any given place can offer and do the job with Surgical Prescision. You dent send in a Meat Cleaver (IG) to cut out a Cancer. Thus Inquisition, SoB, Arbites, and SMs are the Orginazations to deliver the "prescision" to deal with any given threat. Also unlike Guard these orginazations have HUGE amount of resources and favores to call in to get what they want. So a Strike Cruiser not only sounds plausible, but nessicary to cut out major threats before it gets so big the IG are needed.
> 
> ...





Aramoro said:


> This is kinda irrelevant though. They have a Strike Cruiser so they have a Strike Cruiser. Why they have it and what they use it for is up to our imagination but it is indisputable that they have at least 1.
> 
> That's the other thing about the Imperium, it's not consistent. They may in fact only have 1 in the entire galaxy because of some freak occurance, or they might be common an certain sector but unheard of elsewhere.
> 
> This is correct. I should clarify what my initial question asked. How frequent would Arbites have access to major warships, in particular the Strike Cruiser.





JaqTaar said:


> And how do you come to that conclusion? Do you have some Administratum statistics compendium providing you with all the information about all kinds of different planets in the Imperium or how all invasions/rebellions play out? :wink:
> 
> I could cite a redonkulous amount of sources that show planets with significant orbital defenses also have significant ground forces. I can't think of a single example where a world had powerful orbital defenses but lacked any significant ground forces, barring the occasional dead world with remnants of defense still functioning long after the owners had passed away. Arbites probably wouldn't have much interest in dead worlds, anyway.
> 
> ...


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## JaqTaar (Apr 9, 2011)

hailene said:


> a Strike Cruiser isn't something the FBI, Swat, or Marshalls would be given. They're equitable to a missile cruiser, a battalion of tanks, or a wing of modern aircraft. It can devastate a world on their own. Much like their contemporary counterparts could overrun a small country. It's not the issue of Arbites receiving the best gear, like carapace armor and Rhinos, but a Strike Cruiser is so beyond what an organization interested in maintaining order.


It's funny that you write that, because I was going to add that you should try to imagine the FBI having access to fighter jets.

In the real world it would be inappropirate, but again: We're talking about 40k. In what they do they are similar to these organizations. In how they do it, they are very 40k-ish.



hailene said:


> I could cite a redonkulous amount of sources that show planets with significant orbital defenses also have significant ground forces.


 Again, what's the problem? The strike cruiser is established to be equipped with weapons capable of dealing both with orbital platforms and ground forces and as has been mentioned, due to their low numbers the Arbites would strike locally, not try to occupy an entire planet.



hailene said:


> Oh, by no means do I mean that. Ample proof has been given across a multitude of sources that show them defending the world they're stationed on. They try, but they are no means the primary means of defense and they're not designed to be.


 They may not be the primary means, but they still do it when required, so what's the difference?
To quote the Necromunda article again:
"They are well armed and armoured, as they are often the first line of defence on a traitorous world."
And whether or not they manage to achieve it or just hold out long enough to send a call for help doesn't make a difference in my eyes either.



> Though it's interesting that you mentioned "Planetary" Arbites and naval ones, since the command of the Strike Cruiser was most definitely the same one with control of the planetary Arbites. I don't think there was any distinction.


 That was odd for me too, at least after reading the Enforcer omnibus, which states that command of the planetary and naval parts were seperate. Maybe it was just that Marshal Byzantane was more senior than the captain of the strike cruiser. Or it's just something that was more fleshed out and/or "updated" by Farrer.



> Comics do sort of limit the amount of information you can give (in some ways, other ways it allows you to give information a book would be incapable of giving), so perhaps you could use another source? Any other, in the hundreds of books and codices, of an Arbite force from outside assisting another?
> (...)
> The scarcity (or rather lack of) references is important. Without any ability to check the falsifiability of a concept things would fall apart.


So basically everything that's only mentioned once is to be put into doubt?

I think I'm repeating myself here, but the Arbites don't play a major role in the universe or rather in the tabletop. And most of the novels they appear in have the IG, SM and/or Inquisition as main characters, so the Arbites only appear on the sideline.

So what they do and how they do it is explored in detail only in a few novels. And when you disregard those, of course your view of them (or the universe in general when that sort of argument is expanded on other parts of the fluff) is going to differ from mine.

Maybe it's something we inherently cannot agree on. Personally I take every piece of fluff as true (unless it is directly contradicted somewhere else), even if I don't like it, don't agree with it or if it doesn't fit how I see the 40k universe.


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## hailene (Aug 28, 2009)

Yeah, I think we're going to have to agree to disagree. 

It seems that Execution Hour and this Enforcer series paints one image of the Arbites while many other create a more modest one. Different authors, different stories.

On one hand, it seems that the newer-ish sources have the Arbites as a powerful military force (Enforcer trilogy, Dark Heresy rule books) while stuff from earlier this decade have them closer to the FBI/Swat rolled into one. Maybe WH40k is moving Arbites closer to their own standalone army. We'll have to see if they get any more books or maybe some codex limelight.


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## JaqTaar (Apr 9, 2011)

Maybe it is that (though Execution Hour is from 2001, so a bit older itself).

Taking an example already mentioned here, older fluff seems to indicate the Arbites having control of the penal legions, but the current IG codex makes no mention of them if I remember correctly.


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## hailene (Aug 28, 2009)

Amazon.com says that Execution Hour was published in 2004. Dunno if there are multiple editions or what.


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## JaqTaar (Apr 9, 2011)

Seems so. There actually are two on amazon.com, one from 2001, the other from 2004. It was also republished in 2010 as a print-on-demand title by the BL. Speaking of which, their site also lists it as 2001:
http://www.blacklibrary.com/all-products/Execution-Hour.html
As does my physical copy btw.


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## hailene (Aug 28, 2009)

Hrm, I see. 

I think I'll get around emailing the author (if I can find his email address). I'd like to see his cut on things.


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## Aramoro (Oct 7, 2009)

hailene said:


> Yeah, I think we're going to have to agree to disagree.
> 
> It seems that Execution Hour and this Enforcer series paints one image of the Arbites while many other create a more modest one. Different authors, different stories.
> 
> On one hand, it seems that the newer-ish sources have the Arbites as a powerful military force (Enforcer trilogy, Dark Heresy rule books) while stuff from earlier this decade have them closer to the FBI/Swat rolled into one. Maybe WH40k is moving Arbites closer to their own standalone army. We'll have to see if they get any more books or maybe some codex limelight.


The Imperium is so vast that organisation work in radically different ways and have radically different resourcing in the different parts of the Galaxy. So it's perfectly reasonable to have one group of Arbites in a Strike Cruiser messing around with their Power Mauls and another group somewhere else with nothing but a sharpened stick to fight off the enemy. It all depends on Sector and Sub Sector politics in the end.


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