# Warriors of Chaos



## Zion (May 31, 2011)

Looks like GW didn't forget them after all (from Faeit212):



> * Surprise!!!!! Warriors of Chaos for February. Pics *
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## VonMarlon (Apr 18, 2011)

Nuuuuuuuuuuuuuu! Wheres ma Daemons!? :ireful2:

Still the Vortex beast looks great I think. As do the 2 new lords.


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## DivineEdge (May 31, 2012)

Yes!!! Praise the chaos gods!!!

Totally called this one. 

WoC. Awesomeness. 

Saw this @212 first but thankee anyway.


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## Zion (May 31, 2011)

VonMarlon said:


> Nuuuuuuuuuuuuuu! Wheres ma Daemons!? :ireful2:
> 
> Still the Vortex beast looks great I think. As do the 2 new lords.


From what I've bee readig, GW has releases doe as far out as six moths in advance, allowing them to shuffle thigs about. WoC was apparently a Oct 12 release that was bumped back.


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## Turnip86 (Oct 7, 2011)

I spy plastic dragon ogres. Awesome. 

I seem to be fairly lucky with the armies I get into - they always get updated a couple of months after I start them up


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## nevynxxx (Dec 27, 2011)

Turnip86 said:


> I spy plastic dragon ogres. Awesome.
> 
> I seem to be fairly lucky with the armies I get into - they always get updated a couple of months after I start them up


Please get into Tau.


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## Mossy Toes (Jun 8, 2009)

We've been hearing Daemons are Feb/March so they might have been pushed back to March. At worst, I hope.

Hmm. I wonder if this means we won't be getting a flyer wave in these 2 months after all...


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## Svartmetall (Jun 16, 2008)

Zion said:


> From what I've been reading, GW has releases done as far out as six months in advance...


It's more like a year.


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## Charandris (Nov 27, 2012)

Vilitch, new chaps lord, forsaken, chariot and THROGG and DRAGON OGRES yes PLEASE! Was worried throgg may have been axed from the list. Im hoping for a kholek and troll kit in wave2 maybe?

Also, is the chariot a duel kit? I can read 'Chaos chariot/mumble mumble Chariot'. Jugger chariot maybe? And what is the 'vortex beast'? Sprry if iv missed something here!


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## ownzu (Jul 11, 2010)

why are the pictures always so crappy of stuff like this!!!,think il be getting some forsaken and dragon ogres to paint up though


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## Zion (May 31, 2011)

ownzu said:


> why are the pictures always so crappy of stuff like this!!!,think il be getting some forsaken and dragon ogres to paint up though


Cheap cameras mostly.


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## DivineEdge (May 31, 2012)

More pics of the warriors of chaos - individual models, here. 

http://natfka.blogspot.com/2013/01/more-pics-for-warriors-of-chaos-are-here.html

Just click the link.

Or scroll down. I added them in.


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## DivineEdge (May 31, 2012)

These pictures are courtesy of Faeit 212, not me. But check them out...


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## Turnip86 (Oct 7, 2011)

OK, changed my mind on the dragon ogres. Close up they look effing horrible.

Those chariots look really nice though as does Throgg. Might have to sneak those into a list at some point just to give me an excuse to paint some up.


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## KarnalBloodfist (Jan 30, 2010)

[email protected]$&ing right doggy! New WoC! :yahoo: ... I think I just messed my pants. :blush:

I'd say the kits are pretty solid to fracking awesome! Wasn't my idea but someone else said that the new lord on foot is just a BSB WAITING to happen! And I completely agree!

Hopefully the dark gods put a little inspiration into Cruddace and the book is halfway decent. The thought of it turning out like TK makes me shudder.


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## bitsandkits (Mar 18, 2008)

the dragon ogres look mint, rest of the stuff i will wait to see the sprues in the flesh as i cant tell much from the photos.

but on a side note , those aint fething deamons!


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## GrizBe (May 12, 2010)

Colour me impressed. Think this'll be the push to finally do that Warriors of Chaos army I've kept wanting for a while now.


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## your master (Jun 14, 2008)

i like that tenticle beasthe will make a great mauler fiend for my 40k slaanesh army. alot of bits and that i will be using to bulk up my chaos


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## Barnster (Feb 11, 2010)

Shame no sign of the rumoured Egrimm Van Horstman. 

I liked the old dragon ogres and the shaggoth, but these new ones look amazing! Chariots look ok, want to see what the beast chariot does.

The red beast is based on the first monster Chaos characters fought in Age of Reckoning I think, wonder about its rules. 

Throgg looks ok, but the rest of the Chaos trolls need to be updated or he simply won't fit with the in the unit

Forsaken seem to be suffering from the same affliction as the mutilators though


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## DivineEdge (May 31, 2012)

He'll go fine with river trolls, which are the troll models I use as they are awesome.


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## Firewolf (Jan 22, 2007)

>> Well, all I can say is bugger it! New Warriors and i just been made redundant! Oh well, I'll buy the book, then wait til I get a new job. Hopefully the new stuff will suck, then I dont have to buy anything.wink:


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## DecrepitDragon (Aug 2, 2011)

Firewolf said:


> >> Well, all I can say is bugger it! New Warriors and i just been made redundant! Oh well, I'll buy the book, then wait til I get a new job. Hopefully the new stuff will suck, then I dont have to buy anything.wink:


Note to self: Read all the posts in a thread before texting people about the new pictures. Might look like less of a fanboy then. :sarcastichand:


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## Zion (May 31, 2011)

NnXGjeGHYng

New WoC teaser up on the GW site.


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## DivineEdge (May 31, 2012)

All right. New WoC. How often did you have to check the site to find this?

I'd say a worthy memeber of the month. 

Thanks.


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## SilverTabby (Jul 31, 2009)

I am liking all the big beasties, but those Dragon Ogres... the leg poses are just awful. No movement, and so static! 

I shall see what they look like in the flesh before passing final judgement. But I have such big plans for those other beasties... :biggrin:


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## DivineEdge (May 31, 2012)

That tentacle thing is making me an awesome mawloc (and the giant red khorne looking thing). 

I might get me some dragon ogres though. Not great but leagues ahead of that old sculpt.


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## Zion (May 31, 2011)

Time for some WoC compilation:

From Libarium-Online:


Jared van Kell said:


> Core
> 
> Chaos Warriors
> Marauders
> ...


And from Chamber of the Everchosen (sorry, no link to the post, you need an account to see it):


mad lamb2 said:


> I'veread the BR in new WD and I can say that even the fact they have hidden all viable info that we can use, EOTG chart is still there but noew one (it even has +1 BS ???)... And we still have to issue challenges (it's clear when he hit Gobbo block and had to issuse 6 challenges).
> 
> Plus it is writtend under the chaos knight champion that he has to issue challenges)
> 
> ...


Other info gathered from the CotE Board (all quotes are mad lamb2):

- Forsaken are Core (M6, D3+1 Attacks each)

-


> The fluff at the start of WD says what this is:
> slaughterbeast is BOUNDED to the will of the chaos lord. The model acctualy has 8 swords (for 8 points of chaos star) in its back and 9th in the centre of it. This 9th is demonlike sword that lord uses to control the beast.
> 
> BEAST FIGTS ALONE. It is CC monster with it's own stats but it can be bounded to the lord and then it has lords WS and sometihn else (can't remember right now)
> ...


-


> Dragon ogres are on 50x75 mm.


-


> So there is no WILL OF CHAOS listed beneath lords, heroes, knights etc. Only eye of the gods and its note (doomknight only for knights).
> 
> List is 3000 pts:
> 
> ...


-


> Oh, and NURLGE SIGNATURE is TEMPLATE. You place breath tempalte at the base of the sorcere.
> All models beneath are forced to test T or suffer W no AS. cast is priced as manny as there are days in the week LOL
> 
> 
> ...


- "Did the Lord have to roll on the Eye of the Gods table after challenges?"


> Yes. He did 6 rolls. One was +1BS??? WTF, second was +1 WS and +1A was third mentioned. Other weren't mentioned (that's really )%)'%$)$)#%& ).
> When he got +1WS slaughterbrute benefited to.


- Correction on the Tzeentch Sorcerors:


> It's a D6 roll for every WOUND caused by spell. And on 6 you have bonuses.
> 
> 
> 
> And for tzeentch you look at every 6 that you rolled when you casted a spell. FOr each 6 you get extra PD. So it's a win-loose situation. You cast with 5 PDS, you have 3-4-2-6-6 roll. You have IF, you have Miscast and you have +2 PDs for the sorceror (if he survives)


-


> range for that Mutalith vortex beast is 18". It shoots in magic phase like a bound(?)... Gobbo player scrolled that instantly. T test for each model... and creation of spawn.
> 
> It comes in a box with slaughter and zou can combine parts for one. Price is huge 65e, 50 pounds, 85$... it's a lots of money...


-


> Knights are listed with hellstriders at the same spread so they are special.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


And that's where we stand at the moment.


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## Zion (May 31, 2011)

DivineEdge said:


> All right. New WoC. How often did you have to check the site to find this?
> 
> I'd say a worthy memeber of the month.
> 
> Thanks.


I check the Daily White Dwarf....well daily actually. I think they're doing these a week out from the White Dwarf's release to give us an idea of what might be coming to get us excited.


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## DivineEdge (May 31, 2012)

Probably. Could be my overactive paranoid mind, but it seems like they preview armies that they are about to release weeks/months in advance frequently. 

And while the teasers let us know something is coming, it is always darkness, flames, and maybe the partial sillouhette of a central miniature to that army. 

And they have the 2 schools of WD releases it seems like:

1. VC and WoC - a small wave a few months in advance to spark up new intrest before the codex

2. CD - A large wave, designed as a standalone supplement. 

Come on GW, you are getting predictable!!!


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## Charandris (Nov 27, 2012)

Im just going to buy the Throgg model when he comes out and paint him. Very very tempted to buy a kit of minotaurs and a kit of river trolls to make him some lads, but SURELY they will do a unit of trolls to go with him. Makes sense, buy throgg then you feel obliged to buy te trolls in the second wave. Same if someone buys Dr'ogres (though who would theyre sadly horrible  ) and then your more keen to buy a shaggoth. If there is no shaggoth kit coming though you could do a snazzy stegadon+Ghorgon/doombull conversion. Hm...


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## Adramalech (Nov 10, 2009)

Zion said:


> NnXGjeGHYng
> 
> New WoC teaser up on the GW site.


That made me moisthard


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## The Son of Horus (Dec 30, 2006)

It's funny, but as a Warriors of Chaos player, I don't really see much I want to add to my army in the new releases. I own around 7500 points of Warriors of Chaos...maybe more. The overwhelming majority of my collection are Chaos-armored troops-- I have maybe 100 Marauders total, but probably have around 240 Warriors of Chaos, 40 Chosen, and 30 Forsaken (which I converted. Yes, I know they're a bad unit. I've found uses for them, though.) And I see things like the chariot (which I'm glad to see they've resculpted to match the current range) and sculpts for the popular named characters that they never got around to. But I've never cared for chariots. And large monsters, I've found, just draw points away from the bread and butter units that make the army function at its peak-- namely, Warriors of Chaos. So the monsters are cool models too, but at no points level could I ever see bringing them-- I'd just continually expand my Warrior core with additional points. I might pick up the new Chaos Lord sculpt just because I like generic character models, and that one's definitely cool. And I guess I might consider the Dragon Ogres, although I never have found them a more useful option than a solid unit of Knights. 

So overall, I'm sorta meh with it. I'd have liked to see a resculpted Marauder box that was more in line with the Marauder Horsemen and Hellstriders, and I'd have liked to have seen a new possessed unit that rests somewhere in between Forsaken and Chosen-- Warriors who haven't earned favor of the gods, or fallen from it, but rather have taken the other road to power that a willing daemonhost can grasp.


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## Turnip86 (Oct 7, 2011)

The Son of Horus said:


> It's funny, but as a Warriors of Chaos player, I don't really see much I want to add to my army in the new releases. I own around 7500 points of Warriors of Chaos...maybe more. The overwhelming majority of my collection are Chaos-armored troops-- I have maybe 100 Marauders total, but probably have around 240 Warriors of Chaos, 40 Chosen, and 30 Forsaken (which I converted. Yes, I know they're a bad unit. I've found uses for them, though.) And I see things like the chariot (which I'm glad to see they've resculpted to match the current range) and sculpts for the popular named characters that they never got around to. But I've never cared for chariots. And large monsters, I've found, just draw points away from the bread and butter units that make the army function at its peak-- namely, Warriors of Chaos. So the monsters are cool models too, but at no points level could I ever see bringing them-- I'd just continually expand my Warrior core with additional points. I might pick up the new Chaos Lord sculpt just because I like generic character models, and that one's definitely cool. And I guess I might consider the Dragon Ogres, although I never have found them a more useful option than a solid unit of Knights.
> 
> So overall, I'm sorta meh with it. I'd have liked to see a resculpted Marauder box that was more in line with the Marauder Horsemen and Hellstriders, and I'd have liked to have seen a new possessed unit that rests somewhere in between Forsaken and Chosen-- Warriors who haven't earned favor of the gods, or fallen from it, but rather have taken the other road to power that a willing daemonhost can grasp.


Kinda how I felt about the Empire release really, lots of new toys but only one or two that would actually find their way into a list although I was in a different position in the fact that my empire army was small in comparison to 7k points  

A marauder resculpt would have been nice but again, that's like empire not getting a knight resculpt or state troops that actually have shoes. 

I also know what you mean about the core of the army. My small-ish chaos army consists of a few knights, a unit of marauders and a unit of warriors with a load of heroes that I bought mainly for the chaos warband WD booklet that came out just before Storm of Chaos and because I enjoyed painting them. I don't see that changing any time soon although if the dragon ogre's didn't look so clumsy and looked better overall (I.E. if they'd have stolen the looks of the male dragonkin from warcraft) then I'd definitely add a unit for the fun of it.

I'm curious to see how they point up all this stuff, they messed up the core choice points of the last fantasy release so lets see if marauders get their points doubled because of the the higher WS and I


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## The Son of Horus (Dec 30, 2006)

Turnip86 said:


> Kinda how I felt about the Empire release really, lots of new toys but only one or two that would actually find their way into a list although I was in a different position in the fact that my empire army was small in comparison to 7k points
> 
> A marauder resculpt would have been nice but again, that's like empire not getting a knight resculpt or state troops that actually have shoes.
> 
> ...




In all fairness, at the moment, Marauder units end up being undercosted not because of the base model count, but because their unit options are probably too cheap. Initiative is a joke stat these days because of the Step Up rule, so I wouldn't really worry about them increasing the points because of that-- when the current Warriors of Chaos book was written, being I4 was actually more valuable than it is now, I think. I think if they ratchet up the cost of marking a unit of Marauders (essentially forcing you to take a large unit for it to be worthwhile and killing the 10 Marauders of Khorne with greataxes throwaway unit) and making great weapons an additional point per model, they'd be much closer to where they need to be in points. 

I never cared much for Marauders. I own around 100 purely because they do have their uses-- but I'm definitely the minority opinion on them. I don't really see them as the mainstay unit of the army at all, whereas most people do, I think. They're certainly a points-efficient unit, but they have exactly no staying power. For an army that's strictly average in the movement phase, and generally fairly elite, staying power is very important-- my experience is that Marauders, regardless of their equipment, get one good round of combat in before they become a doorstop that takes your opponent another turn or so to kill them. Rather than use them as the line fighting unit and ignoring Warriors of Chaos altogether as a Core option, as many competitive players seem to, I tend to opt out of Marauders unless I know I need a buffer unit. When playing against Ogres, Brettonians, and Dwarves, I like putting a large unit with only two ranks in front of my battle line. In the case of Ogres and Brettonians, there's not a lot my opponent can ultimately do to avoid getting into combat with them first, and it's enough of a speed bump that I can usually produce a solid countercharge from the Warriors units trailing about 8'' behind. In the case of Dwarves, it provides a bit of a shooting buffer-- it doesn't help against cannons and grudge throwers, but it does soak shots from quarrelers, thunderers, and organ guns nicely.


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## Zion (May 31, 2011)

Some confirmation on some of the previous rumours of what's in the WD have hit over on Faeit212:



> Warriors of Chaos Rules Compilation
> 
> Here are two sets of rules taken from the upcoming White Dwarf for the Warriors of Chaos. There is quite a bit here, but somehow I feel that these sets are a little light on what we normally get gleaned from a White Dwarf release. Perhaps it just because its not 40k.
> 
> ...


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## KarnalBloodfist (Jan 30, 2010)

I'm pretty much in the same camp as Son and Turnip - the stuff looks cool but not sure what I'd get (if anything) to bolster the troops I have. I've been playing Chaos since '97 (back when all 3 armies were in a single book) and WoC were always the main army so I have a LOT of warriors. I have used the 10x4 marauder block but the 6x3 MoK warriors are by FAR my favorites and now that we have jugger MC, hell, I may never do normal cav again! The big beasties are pretty cool and all, but, monsters in the latest books have been a bit lacking and if they don't get any kind of save, they're just asking to be pin cushions/target practice for every missile troop and war machine out there. Even then, if it's just a silly 4 or 5+ armor save, most dedicated combat troops and most anti-monster war machines are going to negate the save. I may get some DOs just because they're plastic but I'm going to wager a guess that my 3 metal ones I have will have been cheaper than a box of the new plastic ones.

And I'm wondering if GW isn't going to strip the marauders of their ability to even take a mark. But let's not jump to conclusions just yet. But if marauders get no marks, I'm guessing they'll be going the way of 5th & 6th where there were next to no marauders on the table (minus the fact that cav was master those editions  )


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## revilo44 (Sep 17, 2010)

I just hope they bring out new core models as the maunders look rubbish and I love the new models want more tzeench


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## MetalHandkerchief (Aug 3, 2009)

Warriors of Chaos were probably my first Fantasy love. If this turns out good, well, maybe I'll have a look. But I've probably outgrown them. I was a teenager back then.

Anyway, not that anyone I know play Fantasy anyway. If I pick up a Fantasy army I'd have to convince others first. My entire city is exclusively 40K.

And even then, since gaining more sophisticated tastes, I'm more interested in Dark Elves, Skaven and Vampire Counts as it is.


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## DivineEdge (May 31, 2012)

Well folks, it is official:









February's White Dwarf is out tomorrow in all Games Workshop Hobby Centres and all good independent stockists. Gracing the front cover of this month's issue are three towering monsters, the sort of creatures that only the forces of Chaos would want to associate with.They are the new Dragon Ogres, which go on advance order tomorrow alongside a host of new Warriors of Chaos miniatures, all of which can be seen in the pages of February's issue of White Dwarf.

Alongside the tide of new miniatures there are three painting guides to help you paint them, interviews with the designers that created the new models, a chat to Robin Cruddace about the Army Book and, of course, a very meaty Battle Report in which Andrew pits the might of the Warriors of Chaos against Jeremy Vetock's entirely unpredictable Goblin horde. As you can imagine, the battle was chaotic at the best of times.

The issue also contains a wealth of other hobby articles, including a 24-page Golden Demon and Armies on Parade feature; a beautifully painted Army of the Month; the latest miniatures for _The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey_ (including two stage-by-stage painting guides for them); news from Forge World, The Black Library and our licensed partners; our monthly musings from Jeremy and Jervis and a whole lot more.

The iPad Edition of White Dwarf will also be available tomorrow - you can find the link to the Apple Newsstand on our Digital Products page. Make sure you come back tomorrow to see all the new releases - there are certainly a lot of them!




So here is GWs announcement of the new WD and book.

Also, on faeit something about the white dwarf, with 30k news:
http://natfka.blogspot.com/2013/01/february-white-dwarf-lokken-and-abaddon.html#more


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## DivineEdge (May 31, 2012)

From Faeit212: (This also went up in the new forgeworld section).

By now most everyone has seen pics of the Warriors of Chaos models, and the models themselves alongside their armybook is to ready for pre-order tomorrow. So here is a quick look ahead at what we will be seeing tomorrow from the latest White Dwarf magazine.



Also of note, Forgeworld's Lokken and Abaddon are here as well. They are Works in Progress (WIP) and will hopefully be released sometime soon. This pic comes from Trueminiwargamer.


​Most of my Warriors of Chaos pics are spanish and come from the Freak Factory, but hey, the models are out in a few short hours (not to mention a lot of spanish speakers come to this site). I am also expecting the standard close up video from GW here later today. At least I hope so, I do really like it when they finally show us a nice close up view of each model.​

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## normtheunsavoury (Mar 20, 2008)

Thoroughly underwhelmed by this release, the models are poor to horrific (in a bad way) and everything just looks so uninspired.

The Dragon Ogres, could and should have been stunning minis but instead they look like they have arthritis, seriously, what the hell is wrong with their front legs?
The big gorilla thing in the red cloak with the hammer, I'm not even sure where to start with this, what the fuck is it? 
And the bigger red gorilla thing, obviously its Chaos, I mean, isn't it obvious? Its got lots of horns and spikes on its face! Other than that I haven't got the first idea what the hell its supposed to be or how it fits into any army GW has ever produced, I think it would look more at home fighting against some turtles and a rat or maybe some power rangers?

No, this release is not for me at all.


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## MetalHandkerchief (Aug 3, 2009)

Those are some baaaaaaaad minis...


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## DivineEdge (May 31, 2012)

@Norm - the huge troll with the cloak and hammer is throgg. A lot of serious WoC players have been waiting (or converting, if you are me) for his model for ages, as in the current book he rocks and allows you to play a whole new kind of army. 

But yeah. I don't know if I like the red gorilla, but I like the vortex beast. Dragon ogres look ok. I might pick some up. But I perfer my vilitch over their vilitch and I haven't decided what to think about forsaken.


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## normtheunsavoury (Mar 20, 2008)

I take it the Forsaken are the minis that look like Marauders with big arms?

"My son, the evil north wind of Chaos has blown and afflicted the old world again with its many and varied warping changes!"

"Er, no Dad, they've all got wonky arms, that's about it"

"Yes my son, it is truly horrific to behold!"

"No, they've just got wonky arms, its not scary they're quite funny really!"

"No my son, they are the horrors of Chaos they will lay waste to all who....

Ooh, look! A monkey!!"


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## DivineEdge (May 31, 2012)

Yep. Pretty ugly. They aren't my favorites at all. 

I would have rather gotten a different new infantry unit, maybe a big thing and a new chaos troll.


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## Wiccus (Jun 2, 2008)

I really like everything coming out with the exception of the forsaken. I think the studio scheme does not do the models justice. Dragon Ogres are rad and at least 10,000 times better than the current ones. 

The big monsters are great. I think the red is a little too bright. If it were done in a more subdued scheme it would look fantastic.

Characters are solid with Throgg being awesome. Also the new chariots are super badass.


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## Lord of the Night (Nov 18, 2009)

OMFG!

That Vilitch model is AWESOME! Love the helmet style and the changes they've made to Vilitch himself, he looks much more threatening and dangerous than he did before.

If I ever play a WoC army, that will be my hero.


LotN


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## Sworn Radical (Mar 10, 2011)

The Dragon Ogres seem to look quite alright I guess. But the rest of those new releases is so butt-ugly, it hurts my eyes to lay gaze upon them. Yet, I will be forced to aquire that bloody Throgg model for like what ... 50 Euro ? Yeah, I got a self-made conversion I've been using the last years, but as soon as there's a specific model of a named character available the players at my local GW insist you use the appropriate model in a tourney ... bah.
The Forsaken are so ugly, words can't even descibe ...


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## Words_of_Truth (Sep 20, 2007)

What does Throgg allow you to do?


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## Turnip86 (Oct 7, 2011)

Words_of_Truth said:


> What does Throgg allow you to do?


At the moment take trolls as core, I doubt they'd change that.

The dragon ogres look slightly better in the pre-order pic than in the WD pic but still, there's something wrong with them. They look too clumsy and not in a good way. It's as if they have no muscle in their legs or back which would enable them to get into those poses and the way they look I imagine they waddle from side to side like penguins. The top half is pretty nice but seriously, the legs...


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## Lord of the Night (Nov 18, 2009)

Turnip86 said:


> The dragon ogres look slightly better in the pre-order pic than in the WD pic but still, there's something wrong with them. They look too clumsy and not in a good way. It's as if they have no muscle in their legs or back which would enable them to get into those poses and the way they look I imagine they waddle from side to side like penguins. The top half is pretty nice but seriously, the legs...


I agree. The Dragon Ogre legs just don't look like they could support their bodies, they seem too thin for it.

That and their faces look too stupid and dull for me. They should be bearded and savage and with trophies hanging from their beards.

Now we just need a model of Kholek Suneater.


Edit: The Forsaken. Look AWESOME! Love variety on the mutations and the chaotic feel to them. I especially like the helmeted one and the one with eye stalks for a head. Forsaken aren't meant to be fully mutated so I think the arms and various bits are the right line to draw, any further then that and they'd be Chaos Spawn.


LotN


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## Sworn Radical (Mar 10, 2011)

Okay, apparently the effects of some of the Marks of Chaos are supposed to have changed. I stumbled on this bit of info on another wargaming webiste ...


> MoK - supposed to bestow Hatred now
> MoT - stays the same
> MoN - stays the same
> MoS - supposed to grant +1 LD now


Can anyone confirm this or has more information regarding the changes that'll come our way ?
Because if these supposed changes are true, I'll have a huge (slaaneshi themed) WoC army for sale ... :angry:


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## Warpath (Nov 27, 2007)

Some great new editions here and though i started a Chaos army a month ago i feel like i'm a "on the bad wagon player" now but oh well lol, these new badguys are too to enticing.

Looking through the new releases i can't say i'm an overall fan of the Forsaken, there are some great pieces in there, they can and will be used but as a unit i find myself not as excited as some. Throgg is a great miniture and though some what costly (diffenerent arguement) i can see me including this in my army at some point.

The Slaughterbrute/Mutalth vortex beast which makes me feel that the Chaos gods took control of the scultper and set forth to create this beasty for us all to want and crave  And for those that don't know me the rules are secondary to what the army looks like Chariots getting a revamp is exciting stuff, now the more rule minded players may have different opinions on whether they are worth taking or not but for me looking at the kit with all the extras i have several ideas floating around my head already.

I'm in two minds at the moment with Vilitch, on first glance i loved it and the paint job gave that extra selling point to me, but then i used the 360 view and my smile slowly vanished  I can see how many will love the model but the creature grown from it kinda spoilt it for me. This is more because it will not sit directly with my chaos theme. But as a stand alone model its a fine piece indeed. 

With the Dragon Ogres i'm finding myself agreeimg with alot of you regarding the legs. Why do all the front legs have to be off the ground! The do seem a little short so maybe its some crazy chaos Gods way of amusing himself watching them walk about! Simple converion work can and will easliy correct this but really we shouldn't have to be doing some things and not every player has the time of ability to do it!

Well sorry for rambling to long but just thought i'd share my views on these scourges to the future of mankind


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## Charandris (Nov 27, 2012)

As chariots are core and lovely, i will be making a swifthammer all chariot army. Yes please. That or a troll swifthammer army. I need that throgg in my life. Cant wait to get hold of the book for a little snoop!


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## Warpath (Nov 27, 2007)

Charandris said:


> I need that throgg in my life.



Haha when i say this a bout a model my lady looks at me like i've grown a second head! But i get you here mate, its such a cool model


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## Charandris (Nov 27, 2012)

My girlfriend gave me the 'Am i not enough!?' look. :laugh:


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## Words_of_Truth (Sep 20, 2007)

I hate the fact I want to buy everything new that comes out I really do.


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## Tim/Steve (Jan 25, 2009)

This is a love/hate release for me... but mainly it sums up everything I hate about the way that GW thinks we are a bunch of complete and utter muppets.

Love:
Throgg... what an immense model, shame there are no decent chaos trolls to go with him, but at least he's kinda half way between the rubbish old chaos trolls and the nice new river trolls (which I also love).

Mutalith Vortex Beast... if I could buy the pictured model then I would buy a whole WoC army to surround it, but I know my painting would never do that justice. Doesn't stop the model being utterly amazing (now I bet its rules will suck).

Chariot... a nice solid chariot for chaos, excellent. Though I don't really like the elfily (TM) delicate icons or how the cool looking cloak leaves the left shoulder.

Hate:
Slaughterbrute... "let's stick some tyranid bits on a stonehorn and call it a new model." I'm also wondering what is up with those stupid little arms. Just don't look right to me. I also thought it was spawn sized at first glance.. until I saw the price. Now I'm a bit disappointed that it isn't; having a few little thugs running about the table might have been cool, but I doubt I'll ever see one of these things used.

Gorebeast Chariot... I'm not really sure why I don't like this one, but I don't. There's a thin line between impressive and stupid, and this just falls the wrong side for me.

... as for forsaken, Villitch and the dragon ogres: meh. They pretty much show why I don't have a WoC army: I think they are decent models, but I no wish to own or use them.



Now, for the real reason that I'm particularly pissed with GW about this release: the bundles.

Warriors of Chaos One-Click Launch Bundle: £185... saving £0
The Forsaken Horde: £90... saving £0
Chariots of Ire: £75... saving £0 and a crap pun to boot
Slaughter Incarnate: £100... saving £0

GW must think we are complete and utter morons: what is the point of a bundle if you can select all the individual items for the exact same cost? How many of us would select the one-click launch bundle and say "oh, I don't want the Slaughterbrute... ah to hell with it, selecting all these other boxes individually isn't worth a £50 saving"

Seems that as time passes I just get more and more annoyed with how GW treats its cutomers (and staff, and managers...)


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## Charandris (Nov 27, 2012)

Im simply sickened by the price on the big beast box and the plastic chaos lord. What justifies those kits being £15 and £50? I mean come on. The lord doesnt even have alternative heads or arms. Makes no sense when you can buy a chariot box with enough parts to build a lord aswell as a chariot with a spare character with weapon options and a spare monster.


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## bitsandkits (Mar 18, 2008)

You some how assume that GW has to justify the rrp of its products, the only person that has to justify anything is the person buying the model.


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## Dave T Hobbit (Dec 3, 2009)

I like the sculpt and want to try a monster army - assuming they still exist in the new book - so suspect I will be getting a Throgg fairly soon.

Now I have had a chance to look at the pictures on the GW website the Foresaken seem less like Norm's (most amusing) skit about wonky arms; however they do have quite a blobby aesthetic so not going to rush out.

The dragon ogres on the other hand have potential; the dragon skin looks mediocre but that might be the painting or the photograph, so I will want to take a look.

The Vortex Beast looks superb apart from the vortex itself, so I might build that without the twisty thing and either use it as another gribble or add a converted vortex of my own.

Depending on where the parts separate on the Chaos Lord I might pick one up and give a new head and less spade-like pole weapon. Then he would fit well with my Halberdier Warriors/Chosen.


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## Charandris (Nov 27, 2012)

*Ok*



bitsandkits said:


> You some how assume that GW has to justify the rrp of its products, the only person that has to justify anything is the person buying the model.


Ok, well then they make it pretty difficult when there is the same ammount of plastic on that kit as there is in say a box of saurs warriors or something. It just baffles me some what, and makes me a bit wound up because thats a lovely model which id love to paint and play with, but is simply not an available thing for me to buy for that price. Theres no need for it to be £50, and in making it that silly price they have denied its enjoyment vale to a huge crowd of people.
Those of you who can and will buy it, good for you thats fine, its just a shame we cant all appreciate it as much due to the greed of the company.


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## EmbraCraig (Jan 19, 2009)

Tim/Steve said:


> Now, for the real reason that I'm particularly pissed with GW about this release: the bundles.
> 
> Warriors of Chaos One-Click Launch Bundle: £185... saving £0
> The Forsaken Horde: £90... saving £0
> ...


Hasn't this been the same for all of the bundle deals since the 6th edition release 1-click bundle?


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## Warpath (Nov 27, 2007)

Charandris said:


> The lord doesnt even have alternative heads or arms. Makes no sense when you can buy a chariot box with enough parts to build a lord aswell as a chariot with a spare character with weapon options and a spare monster.


This is the first thought that went through my mind, and whilst i'll sucker into buying the Chaos Lord model i think a combination of parts will be free flowing between the 2 kits.




bitsandkits said:


> You some how assume that GW has to justify the rrp of its products, the only person that has to justify anything is the person buying the model.


They don't have to justify the costs though they has several times! Yes it is annoying when you think of what it is and how much it will cost but we all choose to do the hobby. And when you have been an ex staff member who remembers mails orders at weight cost, then you can truely shed a tear. Its simply as has been put, it's down to you as a consumer to buy it or not. Or its dependent or your massive addiction level to buy it or beg some one to buy it for you!


As my conversation with the GF went, we are doing valentines day presents aren't we. Her reply was of course and it better be nice new and shiney! So leaving the advance order page open with chariots with her own words on a note i am smuggly awaiting my muchly neeeeeeded chariot!


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## bitsandkits (Mar 18, 2008)

Charandris said:


> Ok, well then they make it pretty difficult when there is the same ammount of plastic on that kit as there is in say a box of saurs warriors or something. It just baffles me some what, and makes me a bit wound up because thats a lovely model which id love to paint and play with, but is simply not an available thing for me to buy for that price. Theres no need for it to be £50, and in making it that silly price they have denied its enjoyment vale to a huge crowd of people.
> Those of you who can and will buy it, good for you thats fine, its just a shame we cant all appreciate it as much due to the greed of the company.


i agree with you they have over priced it, it should never have been any more than £35 like its equivalents in other warhammer fantasy armies, personally i think £35 is too high when you consider similar two sprue 40k items roll in at £31. 

i cant figure on the reason for the price, but GW dont have to justify it, other than i figure they know most people will buy it from a indie for the discount, so they have priced it higher so they still get a huge profit from it,i think we will see more of that as time goes on.


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## DivineEdge (May 31, 2012)

Armybook Question and Answer from faeit:

Or follow the link here: http://natfka.blogspot.com/2013/01/qna-from-warriors-of-chaos-army-book.html#more

​

​Someone now has the army book Warriors of Chaos for warhammer fantasy and was nice enough to do the community a favor by answering some questions. So here is a compilation of those questions and answers gathered and collated by the Johan Mars over at Dice and Brush.



collated by Johan Märs over at Dice and Brush

via Beluc over at Warseer:
So I'll start with the thing everyone is waiting to here.

50 Great weapon, Khorne Marauders with full command are 580 points, they do however retain their statline

Now on the more mundane things that have changed.

Mark of Khorne; frenzy
Mark of Tzeentch; +1 ward save
Mark of Slaanesh; Auto pass fear, terror and panic
Mark of Nugrle; Flat -1 to hit in close combat

Marks on a per model basis

Mutant regen is gone (except throgg), and troll vomit is no longer magical, same cost

Chaos ogres gain impact hits

Dragon ogres gain halberd option

Forsaken are basically the same, same point cost, with a chart of rollable USR, ranging from asf, poison, etc
MofK on Forsaken is hatred, MofS is Swiftstride

Eye of the gods are all stat increases, except for 12 which turns characters, and chosen champ into Daemon Prince, units gain stubburn

Valkia always gets +1 S when she rolls on eye of the gods

Sigvald always rolls +1 A on eotgs, and gained T5

Chaos warriors same statline

Warhounds true core

Chariots as normal true core

Hellcannon gains 5+ ward, everything else is the same

Chaos lord stays the same, mounts change a little manticore for example, and marks are somewhat cheaper, mundane gear drops in price

Chaos sorcerers, lores as rumoured, same statline

Daemon Princes!!!

A wait for it... Mazing.

Chaos lord statline, ws9, S6, 5+ ward, Magical attacks, Unbreakable , must take a mark Khorne is +1s on charge, Nurgle is -1 to hit, Slaanesh is armour piercing?, and Tzeentch is re-roll 1's on ward and channel attempts

New stuff:

Chimera, SofM stats with a 4+ armour, for X points gains regeneration, for Y points gains s4 flaming breath weapon, tail attack has rules d3 attacks that are +1 to hit in rear

Slaughterbrute is basically just a attack machine, bound uses are lord or hero ws, and opperates as normal (S7 or 6 can't rememeber exactly can check later, t6, 4+ armour) or can be unbound in which case its frenzied (which it can't lose), and Random movement 2d6, can buy 2 more s5 attacks

Hentical beast, less killy bound spell's effect is roll a d6, 1-5 are d6 T test + effect, 6 is whole unit + effect.

On Magic really great spells basically all made to turn the army into a killing machine, some of my favorites are 2 slaanesh spells 2 and 6 are hexes that give the unit ASL, and random movement d6, Treason is no inspiring presences or hold your ground, Phantasmagoria and Pavane, are both there. Nurgle has a lot of spells that are hexes and augments depending on who you use them on. Curse of the leper gives +d3 T to allies or -d3 to enemies. None are AoE if I recall correctly. Gateway on a 10+ for S is 3d6 hits, instead of 2d6

Skullcrushers get regular MC stats, Juggers have 3 attacks at s6 on the charge, Riders buy lances for 3 or EW for 5. Juggers have magical attacks and are only +2 to armour. Added (And 20 pts increase?)

Juggers are T4, 3 wounds

Daemonswords is gone, Magic items are if I recall correctly, Hellfire sword, Sword of change, The nurgle mace, helm of many eyes is now armour, a slaanesh item that gives you an additional attack for every wound you cause (might be a gift actually), The chalice is pretty meh to be honest.

Eye of the gods is all stat increases +1 bs is 3, +1 attack, +1s, +1 I, etc. Chosen before game roll, get to roll 3d6 and remove on die.

Gifts are mostly pretty cheap, there is one where you trade your attacks for double strength, flaming +5 ward against flaming, poison + 5 ward against poison, scally skin, third eye is back but it doesn't steal spells, an item that gives you +1 spell and +1 to channel.

Oh glean magic, lore of tzeentch, your oppenent loses a wizard level, and a randomly determined spell, which you then gain.

Banner of rage is mofK only makes frenzy unlose able, if a character with the banner joins a unit they gain frenzy,I'm pretty sure blasted standard is also there can't recall all what it did to be honest.

There is a slaanesh banner or item that lets the unit roll 1d6 for Ld.

Oh giant is much cheaper, and mark of Slaanesh is +1 I

Question: Can you expand on the eotg table some more please since its involved so much is it similar to csm one or is it same small table with few changes? Do marauders come with light armour as standard or do you buy it?
Its pretty much what I said so far, 2 is take a ld test if you pass your -1 Ld and stupid, fail and your a spawn or removed, Stubburn, as is LD, 12 is daemon prince, 7 is a re-roll for that turn, everything else is a permanent killing stat increase.

Answer: Marauders are same as now you pay for all their gear in addition, you start with a naked dude.

Question: You're kidding. you have to CAST the EotG spell as a bound spell? That's it?

Shame on GW for pulling a brazen bait and switch with skull crushers, making them awesome so everyone bought them, then nerfing them once sales declined. And the warshrine too... a bound spell?

Answer: A unit of 3 skullcrushers w/ lances at under 250 points puts out 9 S 6 attacks, 9 S6 magical attacks and 3 S 5 magical attacks, have a 1+ armour save, and highly resistant to test or die spells, I'd say they are well costed, especially when compared against chaos knights.

Chaos knights stay the same, Command are normalized, and marks are per model, must buy EWs.

Question: They don't seem worse. The mounts gained +1 attack and +1 strength on the charge. They might be more expensive, but they're even deadlier than before.

Answer: Not red fury, they get an additional attack afterwards, think that pendant in the hordes of chaos book.

Question: What options in the book allow you to field a viable mono-Khorne army with no wizards as you should be able to do?

Answer: Depends what you mean by viable? Do you want an item that basically makes the opponents 200+ point investment pointless? Or are special flying monsters with regen and 6 attacks not an option? Not to be snarky or rude, I've never understood non-khorne players asking for nifty items or abilities to deal with magic. Khorne hates magic, take the wizard's skull. The fact that you can comfortably fit 3 flying monsters into a 2200 points list should deal with wizards pretty quickly.


Question: Must've misread something, I thought you said they're now AS2+ instead of AS 1+
Answers: Nope the Jugger gives +2 instead of +3 so the total is still 1+, as they have shields.


Question: Does Throgg still let Trolls be core?
Answer: Yes

Question: are there any god specific gifts?
Answer: Several gifts and items

Question: You mentioned marauders are now more than double their original cost. What about warriors, you said their stats are the same... exactly the same? Did their points cost go up or down?

Answer: A naked Chaos warrior is 6.25% cheaper, shield same, additional hand weapon same, halberd 300% increase, Great weapon 150% increase.

Question: Is Kholek still in the book? If the answer is no, just don't reply. My heart will break

Answer: lol Kholek is there cheaper and largely unchanged, although someone did mention his armour save was lower, I didn't follow up on it so I can check if I remember.

So I've double check warshrine. It gives a 3d6 roll and you remove the die you want. For example if you roll 2-3-5 you can have 7, 5, or 8 result. Which means unless you roll triple ones you aren't going to see insanity which still functions the same.

Question: are dragonogres still 4+ armor save and T4 for 60points naked (so still +12 for great weapon?)????? :|
Answer: Same stat line 30% less for great weapons, halberds cost the same as Great weapons

Question: Still after an answer on puppet if it's definately out?
Answer: Gone, like my dad

Question: Jeez and forksaken are the same points. ???
Nerd Vomit.
Answer: Forsaken are pretty meh to be honest, ASL is 1 in 6 chance, followed by one of poison, asf, killing blow, armour piercing, and one more USR.


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## seermaster (Feb 22, 2012)

Ah was waiting for this cheers man


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## LukeValantine (Dec 2, 2008)

Hmmm kind of a mixed bag if its right.



DivineEdge said:


> Armybook Question and Answer from faeit:
> 
> Or follow the link here: http://natfka.blogspot.com/2013/01/qna-from-warriors-of-chaos-army-book.html#more
> 
> ...


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## Sworn Radical (Mar 10, 2011)

LukeValantine said:


> Mutant regen is gone (except throgg), and troll vomit is no longer magical, same cost. So a rarely used unit get worse? Not a big deal but kinda hurts the few that run throggs monstrous horde.


Rarely used ? Must really depend on your local metagame ... over here there's close to zero WoC players who don't have a backup list featuring Throgg & Trolls.



> Forsaken are basically the same, same point cost, with a chart of rollable USR, ranging from asf, poison, etc
> MofK on Forsaken is hatred, MofS is Swiftstride. Meh so like CSM possessed the unit is subpar still and will mostly be used for flavor. For the price of the new box I see few people buying these in mass.


I'll be using them most likely for exactly that purpose. Flavor 'n fluff. I spend the last three years collecting a bunch of old metal models, mutant, beastmen, chaos thugs, just to fulfill their destiny and be deployed as a wild horde of Forsaken. Them being a core choice now just justitifes assembling and basing them.
Honestly despise the new models though.



> On Magic really great spells basically all made to turn the army into a killing machine, some of my favorites are 2 slaanesh spells 2 and 6 are hexes that give the unit ASL, and random movement d6, Treason is no inspiring presences or hold your ground, Phantasmagoria and Pavane, are both there. Nurgle has a lot of spells that are hexes and augments depending on who you use them on. Curse of the leper gives +d3 T to allies or -d3 to enemies. None are AoE if I recall correctly. Gateway on a 10+ for S is 3d6 hits, instead of 2d6. So I will finally have a reason to take any army lore beyond tzeentch? Nice


I never used Tzeentch in the first place. Running an all-Slaanesh theme list I always went with the respective Lore of Slaanesh, and it never failed me.
But yeah, if its any good there'll be quite a few jumping the bandwagon. I've always been a fan of mono-deity lists, but IMHO mixed lists will be all the more common with the new book.


Warshrines being moved to _'special' _kinda sucks though ... nothing to fill that_ 'rare'_ slot besides my Shaggoths now, and _'special'_ becomes overly crowded.

All in all, I'm looking forward to read the book now. It pleases me to no end that they didn't change the Mark of Slaanesh, and I'm sure there'll be some nice builds possible, even for mono-deity lists.


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## Charandris (Nov 27, 2012)

So based on all of this, what would you guys say are the must have units for a new WoC army?


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## Dave T Hobbit (Dec 3, 2009)

Charandris said:


> So based on all of this, what would you guys say are the must have units for a new WoC army?


It is hard to be definite without seeing the book. Based on the rumours alone I am inclined to say much like the current book: Sorcerer and Warriors almost definately; Warhounds very useful; mono-mark tactically challenging.


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## Charandris (Nov 27, 2012)

Dave T Hobbit said:


> It is hard to be definite without seeing the book. Based on the rumours alone I am inclined to say much like the current book: Sorcerer and Warriors almost definately; Warhounds very useful; mono-mark tactically challenging.


Righto cheers Dave, ill hang on till someone at my store has a copy so i can have a snoop. I think i might have to start a warriors army for this years project. Mmm yes indeed.


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## DivineEdge (May 31, 2012)

Like Dave said, we will always need magic, and warriors will always be a staple. 

I hope the slughterbrute/mutalith is good. A monster that can use a lord's WS (8) is good. 

I was gonna write up a WoC tactica, but in November I figured (at least partly) that they were pulling a vampire counts and waited. I'll start one saturday or sunday. Maybe. 

But we know marauders got watered down - but we expected that.


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## Barnster (Feb 11, 2010)

Not seen any real talk of chaos getting the Chimera as a regular special. 

I think this is a big deal, fairly cheap (if they use the sort of price featured in SoM) flying terror causer without the need to put a character on it is a great choice, especially vs WM, small units of missile troops, skirmishers, fast cav and skaven weapon teams. Could really help against the units that can hurt you warrior blocks. 

Thinking this will be a likely choice to replace the warshrine which if a bound spell I can see being used less unless your going magic superiority list, which will be tough based on how pricey chaos wizards are


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## Stephen_Newman (Jul 14, 2009)

Barnster said:


> which will be tough based on how pricey chaos wizards are


New Chaos Sorceror (hero choice) and Exalted heroes are both 110 points with no options. Marks are roughly around the 10 point mark.

As someone planning to run a mono-tzeentch army the blasted standard is quite awesome! For 25 points (and can be taken on a normal Warrior unit) the unit, when attacked by a missile attack (forgot if this includes magic missiles or not) rolls a dice. On a 1 the S of the shot against them is doubled but any other result (2+) causes the shot to have its S value halved! Makes a big block o Warriors liekly to survive most shooting attacks if taken in a large enough horde.

Also the chalice can be quite nice. However it is completely fucking random. Then again since it is only 15 points I was not exactly expecting it to be hugely game breaking. Then again the chance for one of my dudes to turn into a Daemon Prince may be too much for me to pass up!


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## Charandris (Nov 27, 2012)

Mmm never been much of a fan of marauders anyway, and after painting up my seaguard horde im in the mood for a small force of large killy things. Im hoping that an all chariot/monster/cavalry army will be viable, so no infantry. But this is 8th ed... so im not overly hopefull just now!


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## LukeValantine (Dec 2, 2008)

Yah marauders where one of those units that with a certain build everyone liked to bitch about even though only 1/6th of all the WoC players ever took one. So for most its not a big lose. However for the few that took the 2 weeks to convert and paint 25 GW marauders its a giant kick to the nuts. I mean really 10pts for a GW Khorne marauder? Tell me again why I should bother ever taking them when warriors are now around 14pts? Don't mind me I am just a bit bitter still. I was one of the few that found it retarded that 90% of WoC are made of the supposedly ultra elite and rare warriors of the chaos gods, which is dumb considering 85% of WoC are supposed to be made of of northern raiders and or beastmen. 

Meh I guess I will just have to go sword and board tzeentch warriors and GW/halberd khornate warriors like most other competitive players.


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## DivineEdge (May 31, 2012)

* This from Faeit 212. I know it is just a few hours until he dex, but here you go anyway. *



*Warriors of Chaos: Forsaken and Tzeentch Lore *




​
We are only a few short hours from the release of the newest release, Warriors of Chaos army book. Of course it would only be natural that we have a little more information for you about what is in it.


*via the Faeit 212 inbox *(no permission was given for the name of the source)
regarding the forsaken d6 roll:
1: the unit gains always strikes last
2: the unit gains armor piercing
3: the unit gains always strikes first
4: the unit gaines poisoned attacks
5: the unit gains regeneration (5+)
6: the unit gains the killing blow rule

also the lore of tzeentch :

Lore attribute : for every successful spellcast you gain a additional power dice for each 6 you rolled. only the wizard that generated those can use those power dice

Signature: MM 24" D6 S6 hits with warpflame rule cast on 5+. can extend to 48" for 8+

1: hex spell with 24" the enemy unit must use the lowest ldt in the unit and cannot benefit from inspiring presence or hold your ground. cast on 7+ may be extended to 48" on a 10+

2: DD Breath Template. roll on the artillery dice and move it the amount forward. all models under the template suffer a S D6 hit with warpflame. cast on 8+

3: MM 24" Single D6+4 hit with Multiple wounds (d3) and warpflame. penetrates ranks like a bolt thrower and armor saves are not allowed against it. cast on 8+

4: DD hits a single enemy wizard within 18". the caster and the target both roll a D5 and add their wizard level. if the user is equal or higher than the target the enemy suffers a S 3 hit with warpflame, loses one wizard level (minimum 0) and forgets one random spell. the caster gains this spell and can use it as normal. cast on 8+

5: DD 3ß" small blast. scatters D6" all models hit suffer a S D6 hit with warpflame. cast on 13+. can be extended to be a larg blase with 2D6 scatter. cast on 16+

6: DD with 24" the target suffers 2D6 S 2D6 hits with warpflame. roll for the strength first, if the Strength of the Spell is 10 then the target suffers 3D6 hits instead.

warpflame: at the end of each phase. a unit that sufferd one or more unsaved wounds from such a attack must take a T test. if failed the unit suffers D3 Wounds with nor Armor saves allowed. if the unit passes all models in the unit gain regeneration 6+ for the rest of the game. if the unit allready got Regeneration it is improved by 1.


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## LukeValantine (Dec 2, 2008)

So the most of the damage spells have a chance to give the the enemy increasingly effective regenerate saves? That can't be right if it is I can see even more people just taking lore of fire. Also I was super hyped for the level draining spell, but with it being a roll off it will only work less then 25% of the time (Taking into account the roll of and the fact you have to successfully caste, and the enemy doesn't dispel it). Oh gimmicky spells you are the worst thing ever. Breath weapon looks nice, but almost all the spells in this lore seem random and considering magic is already a random process I see little about this lore that makes it better or even more versatile then the base lores.

Hopefully the gifts attached to tzeentch make tzeentchian sorcs better because most of these spells are nothing to phone home about and some are basically more random versions of what other lores do or are just slightly scaled back versions of what already existed. Lore attribute is nice though.

Also I hope 3 has multiple casting levels as the bolt thrower spell looks fairly pathetic compared to even other bolt thrower spells. Number one is still as solid as ever even though it now only effects one unit now. See the problem with all these spells is the previous book realized that a solid D6 for strength is actually a hell lot worse then a set strength as even S3-4 stops you from a complete biff at a critical moment and as such gave all the offensive spells +1 on top of the D6. This lores spells could end up doing absolutely nothing when you roll a 1-2 for 1, 2 and 4 and may even end up giving the enemy a regen save (And big woop if they fail as most armies used mass cheap infantry and the big stuff has such high T that you are basically giving them a regen save by aiming a spell at them. I am trying to be optimistic here as I love the point drop to warriors and the change to Daemon princes, but these spells look weaker then basic magic lores, and don't even offer unique tactical advantages or army symmetry like other unique lores (Ogres), with the exeption of the #1 spell.


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## Stephen_Newman (Jul 14, 2009)

LukeValantine said:


> So the most of the damage spells have a chance to give the the enemy increasingly effective regenerate saves? That can't be right if it is I can see even more people just taking lore of fire. Also I was super hyped for the level draining spell, but with it being a roll off it will only work less then 25% of the time (Taking into account the roll of and the fact you have to successfully caste, and the enemy doesn't dispel it). Oh gimmicky spells you are the worst thing ever. Breath weapon looks nice, but almost all the spells in this lore seem random and considering magic is already a random process I see little about this lore that makes it better or even more versatile then the base lores.
> 
> Hopefully the gifts attached to tzeentch make tzeentchian sorcs better because most of these spells are nothing to phone home about and some are basically more random versions of what other lores do or are just slightly scaled back versions of what already existed. Lore attribute is nice though.
> 
> Also I hope 3 has multiple casting levels as the bolt thrower spell looks fairly pathetic compared to even other bolt thrower spells. Number one is still as solid as ever even though it now only effects one unit now. See the problem with all these spells is the previous book realized that a solid D6 for strength is actually a hell lot worse then a set strength as even S3-4 stops you from a complete biff at a critical moment and as such gave all the offensive spells +1 on top of the D6. This lores spells could end up doing absolutely nothing when you roll a 1-2 for 1, 2 and 4 and may even end up giving the enemy a regen save (And big woop if they fail as most armies used mass cheap infantry and the big stuff has such high T that you are basically giving them a regen save by aiming a spell at them. I am trying to be optimistic here as I love the point drop to warriors and the change to Daemon princes, but these spells look weaker then basic magic lores, and don't even offer unique tactical advantages or army symmetry like other unique lores (Ogres), with the exeption of the #1 spell.



Then perhaps the other lores might change your mind.

NURGLE

Atribute: when a spell from this lore is successfully cast the sorcerer rolls a dice. On a 6 he gains +1 wounds and toughness for the rest of the game.

Signature: Stream of corruption-cast on 7+. Causes a flame templates worth of hits that cause a toughness test or take a wound with no armour saves. Direct damage.

1. Miasma of Pestilence-cast on a 5+ with a range of 18 inches. Causes enemy units in base contact with target unit to lose 1 to WS and I until casters next movement phase. Can cause stats to drop by D3 for casting of 10+. Augment.

2. Blades of Putrefaction-cast on 8+ with a range of 12 inches. Causes unit to have poisoned attacks. Betters poison if they already have it (like unit with Festus). Augment.

3. Curse of the Leper-cast on 10+ with range of 18 inches. On friendly units causes T to rise by D3 and enemy units to fall by D3 until casters next magic phase. Can increase to range 36 inches for casting of 13+. Augment for friendlies and Hex for foes.

4. Rancid Visitations-cast on 10+ with a range of 18 inches. Causes target unit to suffer D6 S5 hits. Then take a toughness test. If failed unit takes another D6 S5 units. This continues until the toughness test is passed. Magic Missile.

5. Fleshy Abundance-cast in a 11+ with a range of 18 inches. Causes unit to gain regeneration (5+) or gain +1 to regen value if they already have it until casters next magic phase. Can affect ALL friendlies within 18 inches for casting value of 22+. Augment.

6. Plague Wind-cast on a 15+. Remains in play. Small blast template spawned and move it in direction of players choice by double an artillery dices value. If misfire centre on caster and scatters a distance to the wizard level of the caster. Units underneath it's passing take a toughness test or suffer a wound with no armour saves. In subsequent turns it scatters an artillery dices worth of inches and disappears on a misfire. Can be a large template for casting value of 25+. Magical Vortex.


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## Sworn Radical (Mar 10, 2011)

Don't worry, the book's contents are totally overpowered in regard to Khornate and Tzeentchian army themes / upgrades / gifts / whatever. Nurgle and Slaanesh got left behind somewhere along the way.
Yes, there definitely are nice goodies for them, like some Slaaneshi or Nurgle spells, but nothing that makes them as powerful as Khorne / Tzeentch.

Some possible combinations of chaos gifts / sorcerous powers / items on characters are so stupidly broken, it makes me wanna cry ... like the Tzeentchian sorcerer failing his ward save only on a roll of a natural _'2'_.

All in all, everything that was a core choice just got more expensive (yes, also warriors, even if they seem cheaper at first glance, but the cost for marks really adds up) while special characters (the same bunch of _trolls_ that's always been around) and monstrous creatures got cheaper in the process ... well yeah, GW likes to sell its huge plastic kits I guess. Too bad, I still prefer a Shaggoth over the Slaughterbeast or Mutalith-_'hear-me-scream-Cthulhu'_-beast.

One small step for GW, one giant disappointment army book wise.


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## LukeValantine (Dec 2, 2008)

Well looks like we have a new lord of magic and his name is nurgle. Honesty I can't see anything I don't like in that list although the 6th spell is actually a lot less promising then the 1-5 spells (But you won't here me complaining as every other spell just bleeds tactical usage). I mean blades of putrefaction would make my double hand weapon khorne warriors into human lawn mowers. Poor old tzeentch, if slaanesh is this good it looks like the old bird face will be out of a job.

Still from what Radical is saying tzeentch may be less for magic now and more for simply buffing HQ's.


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