# Horus heresy question



## Zondarian (Nov 17, 2007)

I have just returned to HO after a long break and am after people's opinions on the horus heresy depictions of the primarchs. Who is you most and least favourite and why?


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## Child-of-the-Emperor (Feb 22, 2009)

Hi Zond, nice to have you back.

Personally, Abnett's Horus and Alpharius along with AD-B's Lorgar and Jonson are probably some of the best in the series. Mcneill's Magnus was enjoyable as well.

I really don't like Swallow's Sanguinius, nor are his Mortarion or Horus anything to shout about. Thorpe's Corax is also very underwhelming.


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## Words_of_Truth (Sep 20, 2007)

I don't like the way Fulgrim went, I didn't appreciate the one dimensional portrayal of Ferrus from his appearences, especially when you compare him to ADBs Angron. 

Perturabo was well done, McNeil totally changed my view of him. Dorn has been portrayed pretty well for the parts he's shown up in.

Roboute still doesn't do it for me, during _Know No Fear_ I didn't get anything about of his character, no emotion or anything. Not seen enough of Mortarion to really make an judgement on him.

Curze was suitably messed up and the Lion is still an enigma to me, either he's socially incompetent or out for himself.

I liked the "good" Horus, however since then he's brief appearences haven't done much to convince me he's not just a conduit for Chaos rather than his own person, although the advent calender audio "_Warmaster_" did help try and change my mind.

Lorgar has gone through a massive transformation, however I'm slightly worried he's becoming unhinged and potentially ending up being a total chaos puppet, he's walking a fine line.

I'm intrigued with the Khan after _Brotherhood of the Storm_ there's a lot more of him to come though.

Magnus and Leman Russ are suitable to what they are meant to be like, but they don't blow me away.


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## Zondarian (Nov 17, 2007)

Several have been done well for me, heard very good things about the portrayal of Perterabo ( not read myself yet) and I particularly enjoyed the 'good' Horus. From the little I have read of the Night Haunter I have enjoyed. I enjoy reading about the primarchs kicking ass as much as the next guy, but for me the true enjoyment comes from seeing the failings and weaknesses of them as characters. Because of this I like the Lion and Magnus the most. For me I found Magnus to be very well done because, as a thousand son fan, I read with sadness as the chief weaknesses of Magnus came to the fore, ignorance and arrogance. As you read of his, and his legions, titanic power you realised just how trapped they were by events. For me it was like watching a mountain knowing an avalanche was coming and then seeing it happen, tragic but enthralling. 

My least fav is Lorgar, but I thought he was one of the richer characters to read about, I just didn't like how weak a puppet he was portrayed as. It did provide a good sequence when lorgar asks what he shall be remembered for, one of my fav sections in the entire series. As has already been pointed out Corax seemed very lacklustre, but the worst by far for me was Sanguinius. Fear to Tread was the only book I had preordered to date and I was very excited to read about the blood angels and more specifically, their primarch. It was a very poor depiction of him for me with only hints of darkness in the book. It focused on Sanguinius as the most noble primarch, almost the antithesis of Horus, without ever actually presenting a true weakness. I mean sure kill lots of his troops and he goes into a coma but really come on. We see the depths the blood angels plunge to, the uncontrolled savagery that even shocks the space wolves, and we are told that deep within the core of Sanguinius this same dark heart lies but we never see it. Sanguinius is never anything but in control of his personal demons. We solely deal with his responsibity for his legion but never get to witness him at his worst. Ultimately he was a 2 dimensional character and everything I feared he would be made into.


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## Angel of Blood (Aug 18, 2010)

Generally I'm happy with all or most of Abnetts and ADBs depictions. The stand out ones would be Abnetts Horus and Alpharius, ADB's Jonson, Kurze and the brief part of TFH with Corax, he really nails how much of an avatar of war Corax and primarchs in general are on the battlefield. 

I feel ADB with Corax, the Lion and Guilliman, really shows the rage of the loyalist Primarchs at their betrayal, I could feel their anger more than any other Primarch in the series thus far. His depictions of the Lion are leagues ahead of any other portrayal of Jonson which somehow fall flat.

Not unlike Abnetts Alpharius/Omegon. They were exactly how you would want the XX Legion Primarch(s) to be, everything about their depiction was spot on. Their portrayal in _Deliverance Lost_ couldn't have been any different or disappointing however. 

I liked Mcneils Russ and Magnus very much. Both of them really stood out as much as you would expect, no other primarch has sounded quite so threatening as Russ or as intelligent and regal as Magnus.

Abnett of course will always hold the title though for his depiction of Horus in the opening novel, making Horus so likeable, his charisma and charm oozed from the pages as did his brilliance.


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## Xisor (Oct 1, 2011)

Whilst I think there's a ton of decent depictions (ADB & Abnett haven't really put a foot wrong in this regard), there're a few conspicuous weak points and, remarkably, some that for their small appearances totally overshadow even the fare put out by the two As.

In that light, I'll start with the weak:
- McNeill's Horus in _False Gods_. He had an interesting bit early on, evading the taxmen and such, but it all disappeared really quite quickly. The charm and charisma of _Horus Rising_ was lost, with no gain in credible malevolence or vivid resentment.
- Scanlon's Lion in _Descent of Angels_. Whilst I think it was the weakest of the series so far, it's certainly not completely awful by a long shot. In that regard, I don't think it's that Scanlon wrote a bad rundown for the Lion, I just think the ideas that he executed weren't so tip-top in the first place. 
- Swallow's Dorn in _Nemesis_. It's only a small role, but considering the range of authors that have written him, I felt he (and the Terra scenes) came of worst here. Which is a shame, as I damn well enjoyed the rest of the novel!

Whilst I think we could do with seeing _more_, from almost everyone on everyone, there's a few that only narrowly redeemed themselves. Of those, I think Swallow's Mortarion and McNeill's Fulgrim are amongst them. 

As for *the best*, I think we've got two top-tier contenders with a third sitting not far behind.

*Alpharius Omegon and Angron, Sanders and Farrer*

Appearing in _The Serpent Beneath_ and _After Desh'ea_ respectively, I think these authors managed to nail the narrative power and tension that primarchs should exude. Of course, Sanders slightly dodges this because Alfie is arguably the 'least' of the Primarchs, we're nevertheless left with something really astounding- an excellent play on the established concepts for the Primarch and a great way of realising their power.

With Angron, on the otherhand, up until this story, Angron had had basically nothing done for him between being... angry. Fearsomely powerful, sure, but that's not really much of an extra dimension beyond angry. In AD we get a glorious glimpse of superhuman agony and the effects it has on such near-singular beings.

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The third footnote would be French's Dorn in _The Last Remembrancer_ and _The Crimson Fist_, for pretty evident reasons if you read the stories.


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## ckcrawford (Feb 4, 2009)

My favorite are Dan Abnett's Horus. In my opinion, Dan has done the best job of writing his characters. McNeill's Fulgrim and Magnus get honorable mentions for me. ADB has a very "brotherly" way in the way he depicts the primarchs, and it's one I really like. Of his work I liked Lorgar the most.

Perturabo is iffy for me. I thought he was personally written pretty well, but the rest of the book was crap. As Vaz would say, it was a diamond in shit.

I think there is no question that Swallow's Sanguinus was utter crap. It was as though the Sanguinus everyone was excited about reading more about never existed. Gav Thorpe in my opinion utterly sucked. He's not a bad writer but I think he got a little carried away with the plot instead of focussing on Corax's personalitly.


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## Child-of-the-Emperor (Feb 22, 2009)

Xisor said:


> - McNeill's Horus in _False Gods_. He had an interesting bit early on, evading the taxmen and such, but it all disappeared really quite quickly. The charm and charisma of _Horus Rising_ was lost, with no gain in credible malevolence or vivid resentment.


I agree. I think Counter's Horus from _Galaxy in Flames_ was a wasted opportunity as well, Horus had reached near-pantomime villain levels without justification or an insight into his psyche as he was on the cusp of betraying everything he had ever lived for. One thing I don't think the opening trilogy as a whole stresses enough is Horus's ambition as the key factor in his downfall. 

Every portrayal of Ferrus Manus and the Iron Hands has been ridiculously poor. They come across as idiots and quicker to anger than World Eater's in most cases.


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## Stephen74 (Oct 1, 2010)

As I listen to the books on audio tape (some of them anyway) it gives me a different perspective on things as I hear the Primarchs rather than read discriptions of them. 

Of those i've heard:
Magnus has been the best. 
Mortarian was interesting with his breathing problems.
Rogal Dorn was spot on exactly as I would have expected him to be, but dull as it gets.
Leman Russ has a lisp.
Sanguinius is so camp he should be in pantomime.


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## Stephen74 (Oct 1, 2010)

As I listen to the books on audio tape (some of them anyway) it gives me a different perspective on things as I hear the Primarchs rather than read discriptions of them. 

Of those i've heard:
Magnus has been the best. 
Mortarian was interesting with his breathing problems.
Rogal Dorn was spot on exactly as I would have expected him to be, but dull as it gets.
Leman Russ has a lisp.
Sanguinius is so camp he should be in pantomime.


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