# How do you defeat Noise marine army with Daemons army?



## Tomoyuki (Oct 18, 2008)

So far I have just played my first game against an opponent that mostly fields noise marines. Any help will be nice as they are a really mostly a shooting army and most of my units get decimated before they can get into cc.

It was a 2000pt game and he is able to field around 4-5 squads of noise marines, a regular squad of Chaos Space marines, 2 vindicators and 2 daemon princes. Results were I lost 90% of my army and he lost almost an entire squad of regular CSM and a few wounds on one both Daemon princes. I know that it helped contribute that I did not have flamers. His Vindicator canon took out my Bloodletters they next turn after they deep striked since all my units had to deep strike separately for all my six units so scatter was going to happen. Also on the daemon princes one of the has a slannesh whip just like the masque and he uses them to move my units within range of the Vindicators. 

I will pick up any models that will work will against them and if possible any tips you can give out on playing a daemon army when deep striking. I will be on all day to check up and answer any questions. As I have 6 days including today before I go back for another round so any tips and tactics I can use with Daemon army would be helpful.

Also if anyone can explain to me about the boon of mutation that would be most appreciated and if you can use them against Daemon princes or can't because of the eternal warrior rule. Thanks for any input.


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## MJayC50 (Oct 30, 2007)

Hmm... not having a demon army i dont know. have the codex tho! i do use noise marines alot tho and these guys are a bit sucky for points. they die like all marines do! my suggestion would be to get a masque character or herald think it is and put her in a chariot of slaanesh. amazing bonus to stat line. plus cant be instakilled! plus rending. as for demon princes the trick with them is to wipe them out and move on. they will die to mass demons! just get him in combat he aint that good! u also have lots of invuln saves. u bascally always get ur save regardless of whats firing as they are all 4 or 5++ so even the vindicators dont get it all there own way. i would suggest smaller squads as well. he can only hit one squad with another! so spread the targets. also u can run after deepstriking so make the most of spreading out or getting into cover.

i would also concentrate on one area of his army. u have to deepstrike so u can go anywhere! just drop near em! noise marines have assault weapons so u dont want to walking into lots of em for more than 1 turn. make it hard for him to pick u to bits. concentrate on half of his army and eat him alive. id check ur rules as well and his rules as i bet ur forgetting summit!


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## Tomoyuki (Oct 18, 2008)

Well the way he used his noise marines is that he would fire the vindicators and the way he did that was he would go and use the whip of slannesh and move an entire unit out in the open and for direct line of sight then hit them. Then he would use the blast master single frequency and then the same unit will use the blast master varied frequency right after if they are in range. 

Because his vindicators BS is 4 it is usually on target most of the games and rarely scatters. I mean his daemon prince was able to destroy my soul grinder the next turn because he was able to get into close combat with it from the side and destroy it same turn he assaulted. Only thing I question is if my soul grinder was allowed to fight back even though my WS was lower then his. It was him flying in rolled a bunch of dice and he says penetrated and destroyed it.:angry:

So I do agree that I should spread them out more and divide the squads into 10's instead of 20's. There is not much we left out as it was only a five turn game and most of the action was happening on my allies side of the table.


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## Someguy (Nov 19, 2007)

I would suggest getting some firepower of your own. If you are getting shot a lot you need to destroy the enemy guns, or at least stop them from shooting.

Vindicators are going to cause you some real issues, so you should probably focus on them as a priority. Lots of people take daemonic posession on them so that it's very difficult to keep them from shooting. You should always run after deep striking with units that can't shoot, and use the run move to spread, so that less guys will be under the template.

There are daemon units that are highly resistant to shooting. Nurgle units and khorne bloodcrushers can be good, as are the various monstrous creatures.  Bloodletters and daemonettes tend to fall over dead in large numbers. For example, the shots from bolters or sonic blasters kill three times as many bloodletters as they kill plaguebearers. Daemonettes are even worse and four times as many die, relative to what would happen with the plaguebearers. The payoff is that plaguebearers aren't very good at killing things, but they tend to live long enough to have more than one try at it.

You probably want to be dropping in some tough and/or shooty units that can survive a round of shooting and then provide icons for some close combat guys.

Hopefully some of that makes sense and will be helpful.


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## Wraithian (Jul 23, 2008)

First off, walkers always fight in CC with their front armor facing the enemy. Meaning that there will be no side or rear hits to them (albeit, in your case, the front and side armor are the same). And yes, you do get to fight in CC with your soulgrinder, regardless of weapon skill. He hit you and beat the grinder because a daemon prince has a higher initiative value. 

Look into small, suicide squads of flamers. Drop them as close to the vindi's as possible, light them up with the breath of chaos. Barring that, horrors shooting into the butt armor of a vindi have a chance (if I am thinking correctly that the vindi has a rear armor of 10).

Otherwise, someguy has touched on my other suggestions, so I leave them as they are.


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## b.anthracis (Nov 18, 2008)

I would suggest a list with Ku'Gath. His template rocks against MEQs and he takes a lot of fire. Two soul Grinders are better than one, and since he has only short to medium ranged weapons, you can kill his marines with the phlegm template easily. But, you have to be protect them from the DPs. So put the a Nurgle DP with Noxious Touch to their aid. He will wound the DP on a 2+ They need a 4+. A nice think are one or two units of Nurglings. Those guys can are brilliant to go into CC with his noise marines and lock them into combat. Or you lock his DPs with the Nurglings. But his DPs have most probably wings, so they are to fast for yur nurglings.
And than, go Tank hunting with one or two units Horros with Bolt. Flamers can help to destroy the Marines. Their are fast and they have flame templates which are really nasty. Then put some horros into your list. Since they can fire after deep striking it is possibly to do a lot of damage with them.
If you are playing with objectives take Plague Bearers, they are brilliant to hold objectives. And Bloodcrushers for Icons and contesting objectives. 

In General, stay together with your units, so that they can support each other.

b.anthracis


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## Tomoyuki (Oct 18, 2008)

Thank you all for the advice as it is extremely helpful. I also found out that the guy has used his pavane of slannesh whip incorrectly as he has bunched my units up as if they have just deep striked. So that did not help me when he used the vindicators after bunching them up. 

I am guessing I will use my DP of Tzeentch to use his bolt and kill his DP next time. As I said before I know the that flamers helped contribute to it since if I had 12 of them and divided them up into 3's for 2's with few having the bolt I should have done massive damage. I also did have a Ku gath but do to a deep strike mishap he almost fell off the edge. The only mistake I mad was when I used Ku gaths necrotic missile on a squad and could not assault a DP because he fired (which was the same one that took out my Soul Grinder). 

As for getting behind a vindi that is a problem as most of his noise marines were behind it so the best I could do is a side armor shot. Because he takes great care to avoid exposing his rear armor. Like i said with the noise marines, it is tough for me to get near them as they fire there weapon twice which is the template blast and then there standard weapons (if anyone can tell me if noise marines are the only one allowed to do this the blast master single and varied frequency). 

Thank you all once again and hope the tips and advice continue. :biggrin:


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## necroman (Jun 13, 2008)

with pavine, you are allowed to bunch units up, but csm has lash of submission not pavene

yeah i hate ku'gath he is 300pts, which is a lot. for noise marines, my 2 cents would be to buy a but load of slannesh daemon troops myself and just fleet and over there. you can buy squads for relatively cheap as well

then for elites i would buy bloodcrushers cause they take massed bolter fire to kill, which lets your slannessh troops charge

for fast attack, either none or the slannesh fast attack.

for hvy support i would get some defilers with the phlegm, as blasts are good vs. 25pt sitters

and then for hq, either a bloodthirster for anti tank and the fact that he flies, or maybe a masque to move them out of cover or even icon heralds are not that bad


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## Mud213 (Nov 20, 2008)

Tomoyuki said:


> Like i said with the noise marines, it is tough for me to get near them as they fire there weapon twice which is the template blast and then there standard weapons (if anyone can tell me if noise marines are the only one allowed to do this the blast master single and varied frequency).


For Noise Marines, ones with Sonic Blasters (the shorter ones) either can fire 2 Assault _or_ 3 Heavy. The ones with Blastmasters (the longer ones, there can only be up to 1 per squad) can either fire Assault 2 (with pinning) _or_ Heavy 1 Blast (also with pinning). I'm not sure if that's what you were asking, but each Blastmaster is only allowed to fire once per turn with one of the two settings. Hope that clears things up and good luck with against the foul CSM. :wink:


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## Tomoyuki (Oct 18, 2008)

Thank you two for giving me some advice I greatly appreciate it. Yeah I found out that there is a difference between the lash and pavane after the battle as something was goofy how he would bunch them in a circle and then use a large blast template on them killing most of them. :angry:

The problem with putting in a lot of Daemonettes is that he would use the lash of submission to move them away and then bomb or shoot them up with vindi or noise marines even with the blood crushers. But will still try it out as it is worth a try. :good: As for the noise marines yes that helped clear it up a a lot because it seems like he would fire blast temp then shoot them to death for each squad. 

So far what I am going to take for this is Ku'gath and Lod because Ku'gath would soak up a lot of fire power and Lod is really shooty unit with We are Legion. Then Masque to use pavanne to move squads closer to Ku'Gath and Bloodletters with Pink Horrors with Changling 20 each divided into 4 squads of 10. Last a Soul Grinder with a phelgm attack ability and also flamers 12 with one armed with bolt divided into squads of 3. All of this is what I plan on using because I plan on dropping them close to his army as possible which will force him to decide which unit to fire on first. 

My other question is can horrors fire on an enemy unit as on the turn they deep striked or the have to get into unit coherency first? Next question is if I drop my blood letters first with chaos icon can I drop another unit near them using the chaos icon to avoid scatter? Once again thank you all for your input.:grin:


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## m3rr3k (Oct 14, 2008)

in my experience, plaguebearers stand up to noise marines very well. Sonic Blasters have bolter stat lines & S4 hits need 5's to wound, then the plaguebearers get a 5+ invul THEN a 4+ if they fail... 

If you deepstrike aggressively, noise marines with sonic blasters will get 1 turn of H3 shooting, amounting to a 22% chance to inflict a wound per marine. The next turn, the marines will only have a 15% chance to inflict a wound per marine in close combat.

Plaguebearers themselves aren't terribly great, but if you include epidemius (sp?) they get better & better & better (I believe you can get in the neighbourhood of 500points in free upgrades)


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## b.anthracis (Nov 18, 2008)

Yes, every unit can fire after they deepstriked and after deepstriking they should be in unit coherency, since they are bunched together?
You can use Icons for avoiding scatter, but only in the turn after they arrived, becasue the rule said, that the Icon has to be on the table at the begin of your round.


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## Tomoyuki (Oct 18, 2008)

m3rr3k said:


> in my experience, plaguebearers stand up to noise marines very well. Sonic Blasters have bolter stat lines & S4 hits need 5's to wound, then the plaguebearers get a 5+ invul THEN a 4+ if they fail...)


I am just curious where you got the information on where they get a 4+ invul save from. As I do not think that you are talking about the Epidemius. TY for your contribution.:grin:


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## Chaosftw (Oct 20, 2008)

Sounds to me that Everything your army was good at he had countered. (Your good in CC - He has Long range, You are a Horde army that deep strikes - He has Pie plates things to manipulate your movement, and stand and shoot weapons and maybe flamers) I really don't know if there is a way to beat a list almost designed to penetrate all your weaknesses with ease. Only way I can think of is Loaded dice ...

Chaosftw


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## Someguy (Nov 19, 2007)

Tomoyuki said:


> I am just curious where you got the information on where they get a 4+ invul save from. As I do not think that you are talking about the Epidemius. TY for your contribution.:grin:


Plaguebearers have an invulnerable save on a 5. They also have feel no pain, which gives them a 4+ save against many weapons that they take if they fail their invulnerable. They therefore get two saves against noise marines, which is why they are so hard to kill.

Lash of submission is a big problem. From what you have said it actually sounds like your opponent is using it correctly and he is allowed to group your units up to hit them with his vindicators.

I think you would benefit from spending some time with the rulebook making sure you know the rules a bit better. It's very difficult to talk about tactics without a very clear understanding of the rules because your opponent will do things you didn't know about and you will fail to do things because you don't know you can.


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## Tomoyuki (Oct 18, 2008)

Someguy said:


> Lash of submission is a big problem. From what you have said it actually sounds like your opponent is using it correctly and he is allowed to group your units up to hit them with his vindicators.


Well no he was moving them 2 D6 where ever and then he would group them in a pile them blast them to pieces with a vindi and use of noise marines. Look in CSM faq under lash which says my units have to maintain unit coherency. 



Someguy said:


> I think you would benefit from spending some time with the rulebook making sure you know the rules a bit better. It's very difficult to talk about tactics without a very clear understanding of the rules because your opponent will do things you didn't know about and you will fail to do things because you don't know you can.


Well my opponent does not have an idea what he is doing. I mean from the looks of it he is either A taking advantage of the situation or B does not know what he is doing and should not be playing. After all the guy has the rule book, 
a CSM codex, and also a Daemon codex and has been playing alot longer then I have at least 3 months from the look of how many types of CSM's he has (can make a chaos god specific CSM list nurgle, khorne, and slannesh). 

I would like to point out that I have a good idea of what were are talking about as we are not talking about something too advance here like fantasy (not sure about that as this based off the opinions of people at the hobby chest). After all I think I would not be playing Daemons since they are a little more difficult to play then most of the standard armies in 40k. 

I am also sorry if I am being harsh but I want to learn how to play this game and nobody at my hobby chest but one guy (who I rarely see) can help as this guy I played against can not obviously help me. I also hope to get the rule book shortly but keep in mind this is kind of an expensive hobby and I was hopping I can count on the players at the hobby shop. 

What I did learn from this thread:
1.Need flamers 
2.Have all reference sheets and come prepared since most people are not honest or a clue what they are doing. 
3.last got an idea how I can try to defeat him thanks to everyones contribution.


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## Tomoyuki (Oct 18, 2008)

Oh and almost forgot any more tips or advice will be welcomed as well.


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## Critta (Aug 6, 2008)

Tomoyuki said:


> Thank you two for giving me some advice I greatly appreciate it. Yeah I found out that there is a difference between the lash and pavane after the battle as something was goofy how he would bunch them in a circle and then use a large blast template on them killing most of them. :angry:


I'm afraid that's a perfectly valid use of the Lash of Submission - he's allowed to bunch your models up as much as he likes.

Is he running 2 x lash of submission princes in your games? If so, despite it being perfectly legal, it sounds like an incredibly beardy list to be playing a friendly game against a mate with. I play a noise marine/blastmaster heavy Slaaneshi army, but generally limit myself to a single terminator sorceror with lash of submission to avoid feeling too much like a cheesemonger.

The only thing I can suggest is to try and kill the princes as soon as you can - or at least get them locked in combat... that way he can't bunch up your squads with the lash and you should survive a lot longer and stand more of a chance of winning.



Tomoyuki said:


> Well no he was moving them 2 D6 where ever and then he would group them in a pile them blast them to pieces with a vindi and use of noise marines. Look in CSM faq under lash which says my units have to maintain unit coherency.


Just noticed this post - well, technically if he bunches them all up next to each other, they are still within 2", so maintain unit coherency. However, from the way you describe it as "piling them up" is he fitting more models into the area than would be able to fit if they were all stood on their bases? If so this is wrong and he has to stand them all up (bases touching if he wants) but he can't put 20 models into a convinient 2" wide pile


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## Tomoyuki (Oct 18, 2008)

Well that is not true as he is only allowed to moved the that many inches based on the die roll. So if my unit is already 2" apart then you can not have most models where the base is touching and one models is 3" away. The way he moves them it almost looks like the unit has deep striked in a round pile. The way I read on unit coherency all models has to have the same number inches away from each other to maintain unit coherency. I hope that explains what I mean it is kind of hard to give an explanation for this.

Also he only has one lash of submission as we were playing a team game so other dameon prince was helping his partner out because he was being nothing more then a speed bump for the Necrons.


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## b.anthracis (Nov 18, 2008)

Tomoyuki said:


> The way I read on unit coherency all models has to have the same number inches away from each other to maintain unit coherency. I hope that explains what I mean it is kind of hard to give an explanation for this.
> .


And this is wrong. Unit coherency means each member of a unit must WITHIN 2" of another member of that unit. So one can be separeted only 1 " and the other 2". And with lash you can move a unit like normal, which means after movement they have to be in unit coherency. So if he piles them uo, base to base, like after Deep Striking, its perfectly legal, and this is one of the ways lash is played.

b.anthracis


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## Broken Sword (Jan 5, 2009)

The way you described the Lash being done to you is exactly how it is usually played and exactly how I do it. I pile them into a big ball in base to base with each other and then I hammer them with blast and large blast templates. This and using the lash to pick which unit you assault are the two common uses of the power and if you go to tournament, you will more than likely see two DP's with lashes playing exactly this way ... I know it is power-gamey, but tournament armies almost always are.


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## Tomoyuki (Oct 18, 2008)

Anthracis if you are going to quote me at least quote the entire paragraph and don't just pick a small sentence that want pick at. I said in my previous post that if all the models are touching bases and one is more then three inches away it is obvious that it is *NOT WITHIN 2"* so it is not legal. This game we played was with terrain and I said before this is a particular situation that I am talking about. I wish not to get detailed as it is not going to help me and that is not what the thread is about. 

As for this being used in tourneys I don't really care as much as I beleive I will devote a small squad of flamers to get rid of the dp. As I will use the masque and move them within range of my horrors or Loc and kill them if they are not careful as both ku gath and loc weapons out shoot the dps and with flamers they will not be coming too close. 

My question is should I ditch Ku' Gath and replace him with Skarbrand or a Blood thirster? He is a very good unit as he can breath a unit before assaulting them or use the necrotic missile attack. I know his draw back is he is slow but with his stats he can take a lot of fire and so I can drop him closer to the enemy.


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## Someguy (Nov 19, 2007)

Killing the DP is certainly the best solution, if you have a reliable way to do it.

Lash lets him move your unit exactly as if it was you doing it, just up to the distance rolled on 2D6 (and ignoring difficult terrain). He is allowed to stand them as if they deep striked, although he does have to maintain unit coherency. 

If he put most of your guys in a bunch but left one out of coherency, that's strange. It probably means he moved something else too far, because your unit was probably in coherency at the start. Without being there, I don't know.

I mean no offence by suggesting you spend time with the rules. It sounds like you understand most things but you have missed a couple of things, which is ok. There are a lot of rules to learn, and often it is the unusual stuff that catches you out. All of us have gone through this process, or are still going through it, and nobody here knows all the rules perfectly. No, not even Galahad. 

However, my advice stands and it's what I tell everyone in the same situation. It sounds like this guy is a hard player, and possibly doing things that he shouldn't do (though I have seen no conclusive proof of that). To play such a player you want to have a rock solid understanding of the rules, not just a reasonable understanding of the main stuff. Otherwise you end up worrying about whether people are trying to cheat when 99% of the time they aren't, or they are making a mistake themselves.

Also there is no point getting annoyed with the people here. We are trying to help you.


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## Tomoyuki (Oct 18, 2008)

*To someguy*

I understand and thank you for you input. I am not annoyed by the comment as I was not offended. :good: I might have taken it the wrong way and I do apologize for that as I am trying to get more input from people on how to fight a noise marine army and trying to keep the thread on track. I do occasionally post for more information or something that came up during the game. 

As for the rules I have a good idea and I don't think he is cheating nor do I care. Because usually if I find something fishy I will look up the information or ask as I am doing now to a respectable 40k forum like this one for clarification. I am learning it as time goes on and it is only preparing me for the 8000 to 10000 pt apocalypse game I am having in March with a bunch of friends. So I would not like to embarrass myself during that time so I am trying to learn everything now. 

The only thing that is slightly annoying me is we are going a little off track on the thread and I want to keep it simple and on topic. Tactics that a daemon player can use that will be effective against a 2000pt noise marine army. As I have already seen that they are devastating in 2000pt games and was told in 3000pt they are not as effective. What are the strengths and weaknesses of a noise marine army? Ways to counter their units with daemons? What to be careful of? 

These are the questions I am trying to get answered right now. As I have never seen a noise marine army in play before and only face against a regular CSM and also seen a nurgle list in action. I hope to continue to hear any advice and tips from veterans that have faced them as I am certain I only seen half of the damage they can do (mostly vindis took out most of my units). I will say that noise marines are frustrating to fight against so any more advice is welcome and thank you some guy for your input.


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## MaidenManiac (Oct 2, 2008)

Tomoyuki said:


> ...What are the strengths and weaknesses of a noise marine army? Ways to counter their units with daemons? What to be careful of?


Playing a 2k Noise Marine based army regularly here's my toughts of it, the list Ive played a time now is at the bottom of this thread:
http://www.heresy-online.net/forums/showthread.php?t=18621

Noise Marines are extremly flexible, all Sonic Weapons have both assault and heavy modes. This means that youre scarcely caught flatfooted, you can always respond. Tbh its a damn fun army to play thanks to the mobility and shooting combination that I really enjoy playing with:grin:

My army is based around Sonic Blasters so I shoot a hail of S4 shots each phase. Against T4 or less this makes lots of wounds which means that things does die, disregarding what save they have. The more saves you roll the more things die! When the targets starts having T5+ this ammount drops like a stone, so try to include tough components in the army:good:
The downsides with pure ECs is very high cost per model. Tough dedicated assault units will kill ECs despite high I if they get to CC intact. If he's pressed to move alot he also lose out shooting power which will make a diffrence on the wounds you suffer each turn!

I would try (as good as you can) an army with:
Atleast one Greater Daemon as HQ, and if you dont go for 2 I'd use 2 Heralds of Tzeentch with Bolt of Tzeentch, Master of Sorcery and We are Legion to increase tank hunting potentialk:
HS should be 3 used slots, try to go for either 3 DPs or 3 Soulgrinders if you can, if you must mix then preferably keep more Soulgrinders then DPs
Horrors and Plaguebearers as troops. Horrors for returning fire, Plaguebearers for keeping objectives and Icons. I would try to skip Daemonettes, T3 will generate buckets filled with wounds for you to save each turn:wacko:
2 small units of Screamers will ruin his Vindicators and are dead fast 
Bloodcrushers and Flamers for elites, maybe a Beast of Nurgle too if you have. Flamers should be played sacrifice style but preferably on one side of his army so he atleast must hunt them a bit to kill em
Wave one would include as much hard units(high T) as it can and all Soulgrinders

My list is Troop heavy, but despite that I feel the loss of every marine directly. This means that shooting some back(hence tip of Horrors) will really bring him pain and divide his attention to them too, meaning that youre assault units will get more "free time" to get to CC.
CC is the phase that you will beat him in, but that doesnt mean that you should skip out shooting. Its vital for a CC based army to have enough shooting to distract and damage the enemy early in the game. Otherwise you wont get there with something capable of killing anything:no:


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## Broken Sword (Jan 5, 2009)

My question is should I ditch Ku' Gath and replace him with Skarbrand or a Blood thirster? He is a very good unit as he can breath a unit before assaulting them or use the necrotic missile attack. I know his draw back is he is slow but with his stats he can take a lot of fire and so I can drop him closer to the enemy.[/QUOTE said:


> Ku' Gath would be a hard nut to crack for the Emporer's Children with his high toughness and wounds. With his ranged attack, he will also be hard to ignore. The only drawback to having him is the high points cost, but then again, your opponent will be paying 25 for each one of his troops and you do intend on moving into Apocalypse, so I would keep him. Now Skarbrand is another thing. Just given the fact that he gives your enemy a bonus as well as you with his rage, I would avoid using him, but a blood thirster with it's CC potency and it's mobilty, it could put a real hurt on the EC. It just needs to be able to make it to combat as Maniac said. A typical tactic is either the Horrors as he suggested or running Flesh hounds into CC to give the bloodthirster/bloodcrushers/bloodletters to get there. Fleshhounds are weak, but they are beasts which means they will have a ton of movement. The only thing that could hurt those ideas would be the beloved(or accursed) lash, but killing the prince seems to be something you are already working out.
> Best of luck to you. I am really interested in seeing where this goes.


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## Critta (Aug 6, 2008)

Tomoyuki said:


> Well that is not true as he is only allowed to moved the that many inches based on the die roll. So if my unit is already 2" apart then you can not have most models where the base is touching and one models is 3" away. The way he moves them it almost looks like the unit has deep striked in a round pile. The way I read on unit coherency all models has to have the same number inches away from each other to maintain unit coherency. I hope that explains what I mean it is kind of hard to give an explanation for this.


You seem to have got unit coherency wrong. Basically all it means is that all models in the squad need to be within 2" of each other. Nobody has to be the same distance, as long as all models are within 2".

He does not need to move the full distance of the 2d6, so he can move the models at the front slightly less (the way I normally do it is to move the furthest model the full distance, then form everything up around it in a nice little ball.

This is a perfectly legal use of Lash of Submission. I honestly think your best bet is to kill the demon prince ASAP unfortunately I've not had a lot of experience with demon armies so can't really help with suggestions of the best way to do this.


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## Someguy (Nov 19, 2007)

Let's leave the discussion of lash alone for now. This is the tactics forum, not the rules forum. Anyway Tomoyuni was in fact correct that you can't use lash to bunch a unit up but have one guy 3" away, as that guy is then out of coherency.

Good advice from MaidenManiac and Broken Sword. Keep it coming.


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## Tomoyuki (Oct 18, 2008)

Thank you someguy for finally pointing it out. I have been trying to point it out for 2 posts now to tell everyone I understand he can move 2 d6 and bunch them up but if the unit is out of coherency by 1" he then can not move it to the maximum distance (read carefully that I said if they are 3" away) Please let the subject die already.:threaten:

Thank you for the information on the noise marines as now I feel more confident about facing them since I know there capabilities. I thank everyones contribution and I will see how the battle goes this coming weekend. I have some ideas on how I am going to fight the noise marines. I hope they work and wish me luck.:biggrin:


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