# Fantasy Curious.



## Syko515 (Jan 22, 2008)

well my initial journey into the realm of fantasy was a flop. however i have found a group at the FLGS to play with. looking for advice on dark elves, namely starting and Competative builds. thanks in advance!


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## Flindo (Oct 30, 2010)

all I know is the hyrda is a very good unit to have.


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## coke123 (Sep 4, 2010)

I don't know too much about Dark Elves, apart from that they require a fair amount of skill in the current edition. Can't really help more than that, but I thought I might just warn you before you have trouble learning them and get frustrated. It happens. Dark Elves are really powerful in the right hands.


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## olderplayer (Dec 11, 2009)

There is a Druchii web site with excellent discussions on optimal builds and pros and cons of units and magic items and choice of lores in 8th edition. 

Hydras are the most undercosted and most powerful models in the army. They are the only really tough, high strength, mobile units available and have regen and flaming breath weapon attacks and thunderstomp. There are certain armies where hydras are essential to deal with certain models (like a hellpit abomination in skaven). Unless frowned upon, you should always run two of them because the weakness of dark elves is that almost all models are only T3 and have modest armour saves. The core units are good for the points but not excellent. 

Core: On a points value basis, repeater crossbowmen are the best value among the core choices because of the ability to hit at range with s3, AP muli-shot and stand and shoot. It is typical to see them run in two ranks with a total of 12 to 20 with a musician and shields (the shields add an extra +1 AS that often pays off given S3 and S4 magic and shooting attacks and the parry save benefit when in close combat to the front of a 6+ ward save as well). The musician is to allow swift reforms so that one can rotate the unit, move and still shoot at targets coming in from the flanks or rear ior reform to add ranks for steadfastness against smaller units charging (three or four ranks of five each when charged) and yet still shoot. 

Corsairs with repeater handbows are an interesting option. I used the RHB because of the ability to shoot in two ranks and the quick-to-strike allows a stand-and shoot even at close range. But, without armour piercing, corsairs stuggle against troop with better AS and/or T4 or greater. Thus, they need either more attacks (Sea Serpent banner), armour piercing (banner of muder), or some augment (like lore of metal) or hex on opponent (from lore of shadow or the one from dark lore). 

Spearmen are okay but also limited by magic banner points limit and need help in a boost or in protection to be effective. Often only one spearmen unit is employed cheaply and used with the standard of disciplne (+1 LD to reduce panic and break risks) with deep ranks for stubborness and with the lvl 4 sorceress with a sac dagger. The unit is really there to provide a bublle and look-out-sir for the lvl 4 and as cheap sacrificial models for the sac dagger. Expect this unit to get shot up and wasted but to hold with LD 10 of the lvl 4 and for the lvl 4 to flee the unit when threatened. If using lore of shadow, the razor spell can make this unit a buzzsaw (S is equal to LD until your next magic phase) but it is very situational and tough to get off. 

Dark riders are fragile and expensive but essential core units for flank protection, bait and flee tactics, transporting mounted masters and lvl 2 sorcerors, and harassing with shooting. Run on unit of 6 with a musician. 

Harpies suffer from lower LD (panic and they often flee off the board) but are need to fly over stuff to attack war machines, light units (fast cav and skirmishers), screen and bait and flee. Only run one unit of 5 or 6. 

Special: Cold One Knights with the ASF banner in larger units with a dreadlord and/or BSB are now becoming a popular option. They are the only unit with a good AS of 2+ and S4 and the BSB allowing re-rolls helps to almost eliminate the problem of stupidity that they suffered from in 7the edition. They only have T3, so expect to have to rely on the AS and maybe a ward save from the cauldron to save them. They are often a tar pit unit to transport and protect the dreadlord and BSB and often will get killed off by the end of the game but will take out key characters, units, or at least tarpit something a lot time if kitted properly. 

Black guard are the only other special unit I recommend, mainly for their 2 attacks, re-rolls to hit, and S4 with halberds and ITP and stubborn ability. But the unit size is limited to no more than 20 and the T3 and 5+ AS means that they can die fast unless screened, protected by a 5+ ward save from a cauldron, or given some augment protections (limited options, lore of metal adds a 5+ scaly skin AS boost). 

Witches and execs have serious problems in 8th edition. Execs have the low T and AS of black guard and strike last, so, even though their hitting on S6 and with killing blow, they will die in droves unless in a large unit and can use killing blow to take out a modest unit of knights or something. Some use a death hag BSB with the ASF banner to partially remedy this but the death hag has no armour and must really be with the cauldron to gain the T10 of the cauldron and 4+ ward save plus two hags and have the ability to bless one unit each round within 24" with either killing blow, +1 attack, or a 5+ ward save. Witches used to be great when strking first in 7th edition with poison and frenzy mean that they killed a lot and then limited the attacks back, but with the ability of ranked units to step up and strike back witches kill in the first round but then get massacred thereafter with T3 and no AS. 

The rares are good with hydras being a must max options. Repeater bolt throwers are still a good choice, but not as good as in 7th edition. The ability to shoot 6 bolts per turn at S4 with AP is very effective against certain types of troops and units and the ability to shoot one bolt at S6 with no AS allowed and pierce ranks and cause multiple wounds is a decent option against very tough, high AS units and monsters. They are hit or miss but do not misfire, unlike cannons and stone throwers. 

The strength of the dark elf army is in the heroes and lords and the magic items they can take.

Dark Elf armies are best played at or above 2500 points. At that level, one can take both a dreadlord with a 1+ armour save, a decent weapon, and a ward save and possibly the crown of command to make him stubborn (an essential option) and a lvl 4 sorceress with a sac dagger or some other arcane item and a decent ward save. The Pendant of K is the best protective talisman because it provides a reverse ward save equal to the strength of the hit (fails on roll greater than the strenght, autofails on a 6, so a S5 or greater hit will allow a ward save on a roll of 5 or less on a D6). A dreadlord with a 1+ armour save and the pendant will be extremely difficult to kill except by hitting it with spells that ignore armour saves and have no strength value or allow for no ward saves. Once in combat, a single stubborn dreadlord within range of the BSB can absorb a huge number of attacks for a series of rounds of battle and tarpit an entire deathstar unit, especially if the attacks are limited by a challenge. A lvl 4 sorceress with the sac dagger in a unit of spearmen can max out the magic phase with a cheap lvl 2 sorceress especially using power of darkness (cheap spell to add casting dice) spells with the sac dagger to ensure it gets off and using the sac dagger to limit the number of dice rolled and then use the sac dagger when the casting roll just falls short. 

The best heroes are the death hag with a cauldron (comes with the death hag and two hags, all have poison and frenzy but cannot leave the cauldron, the cauldron give T10 and 4+ ward save, stubborn and ITP) and masters. Masters can max out armour saves with heavy armour, cloaks, shields, magic armour and mounts and have access to re-roll armour save talismen and decent mundane and magic weapons. 

If I was starting a dark elf army and wanted to test out different ideas at up to 2750 points, I'd initially buy:

1. at least 60 warriors, with 30 to 35 set up as RXB warriors with shields and 25 to 30 as spearmen with or without shields
2. 6 or more dark riders
3. 6 harpies
4. Up to 20 black guard (at least 12)
5. 10 cold one knights (two 5 model boxes)
6. One lvl 4 on foot and one lvl 4 able to be mounted on a dark steed
7. One lvl 2 on foot and one able to be mounted on a dark steed
8. One death hag with cauldron of blood (one box)
9. Two hydras
10. Two repeater bolt throwers
11. One dreadlord on cold one, one dreadlord on foot, and one dreadlord on dark steed (optional peg mount can be considered). (I often put a pin in the butt or magnet and use one model with different mounts)
12. One master on foot, one master on dark rider, and one master on a cold one. (optional peg mount) (I often put a pin in the butt or magnet and use one model with different mounts)

Optional additions: Up to 24 corsairs, another 6 dark riders, another 6 harpies, another 20 RXBs, and another 2 RBTs. If you plan to play at 3000+ points, then a third hyrda and additional core and special models would be needed.

Sorry about some spelling and gammar, typed up quickly.


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## Masked Jackal (Dec 16, 2009)

Fortunately, for Dark Elves, there is a lot of versatility to what builds you can use, however, essentials for beginners would include: 

Plenty of Warriors/Repeater Crossbowmen: 

Warriors add much-needed bodies to the army and can be used for sacrifices. Repeater Crossbowmen can now fire in two ranks, and large units are much more viable. They can also reform and charge into flanks late-game if there's nothing to shoot.

Characters: 

A Sorceress model on foot to take advantage of the Sacrificial Dagger is an absolute must. A level 4 with that item is the best option for magic Dark Elves have. Apart from that, a Cauldron of Blood is quite god at higher point-levels, especially if you make it the BSB. Model is stupid, but it is possible to convert a better one. Especially easy if you get an Avatar of Khaine.

Special: Cold One Knights come in the battalion, and are a good choice if you combine them with the Cauldron. 6-man with musican or up to 11-man with ASF banner and character for larger games.

Apart from that, Black-Guard are the most obvious buy. Apart from their fragility, they have no real weaknesses. You can send them up against just about anything. Finally, Shades, for warmachine hunting.

And the coup de grace, Hydras. These things are the last blatantly overpowered unit Dark Elves have, get two of them.


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## stevebucknor1 (Dec 21, 2010)

My initial journey into the realm of fantasy was a superb and fantastic. However I have found a group at the FLAGS to play with. looking for advice on dark elves, namely starting and Competitive builds. thanks in advance by me. It was really amazing and outstanding.


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