# 'Pro-painted' models on eBay.



## nightfish (Feb 16, 2009)

Some of the prices are ridiculous. I.e. £250 for a painted sentinel. You are seriously having a laugh.

Does anyone pay these prices?


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## bitsandkits (Mar 18, 2008)

yes, i have sold many pro painted models on ebay, plus paid for my mortgage deposit funded mostly from selling painted models to rich people.


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## JokerGod (Jan 21, 2009)

I just ignore everything with the word "Pro" in it. it is always just a bad joke and an out right lie. 

Another trend is to mark everything as OOP (Out of Print) to jack up the price. It still gives me a chuckle to see Dark Eldar marked as out of print when they are the current models.


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## Lord_Murdock (Jul 16, 2008)

I wouldn't bother buying a pro painted model anyway, because I'd just strip the paint and re-paint it in my army's colour scheme... lol.


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## nightfish (Feb 16, 2009)

bitsandkits said:


> yes, i have sold many pro painted models on ebay, plus paid for my mortgage deposit funded mostly from selling painted models to rich people.


Define pro? Are you a 'eavy metal painter? Do you have a degree in fine arts? or are you 'pro' because you say so?

Since people are paying vast sums of money for these items, it would be interesting to know how 'pro-painted' works.


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## slaaneshy (Feb 20, 2008)

I've bought 'pro' painted mods and generally been happy with them. But I do have my limits - £250 for a sentinal, are you serious! 
I did see a pro painted Tomb King Battalion box set that looked gorgeous, but at £750, youre having a giggle!
I never go by description though, no pics, no sale!


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## noahwood (Mar 12, 2009)

I'm starting a new trend by selling pro-primed minis.



JokerGod said:


> Another trend is to mark everything as OOP (Out of Print) to jack up the price. It still gives me a chuckle to see Dark Eldar marked as out of print when they are the current models.


Also wanted to mention that OOP usually means "Out of Package."


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## Wu-Tang-Tau (Apr 2, 2009)

I actually hate "Pro-painted" or painted models online (we use trademe in New Zealand tho) cause I don't really care how well ya paint ya models, I am gonna go over with my Tau sept colour anyway!


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## morfangdakka (Dec 31, 2006)

It really depends on what the person's skill is on these items. I have seen many items listed as pro or master painted and you look at the picture provided and I think my 6 year old son could have done better. Which is a shame because it use to be that only really talented people would list their stuff as pro. 
I have purchased a couple of pro painted items off ebay but they are only from artist I know and I have seen their work before many of them have been published in WHite Dwarf but unless I really like their work I won't do it. I like to build and paint my own stuff.


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## Leaf (Feb 8, 2008)

There should be rules for the use pro painted 
Some of the stuff is beautiful then some is decent then the rest is just crap
I consider myself an ok painter and I have done comission work in the past 
and I am doing some now does that make me a pro? If I was to sell my models on ebay I wood list them as painted well but can easily be striped with pine-sol. It is not just in warhammer this happens it also happens in FOW and CBT I see it all the time people using the word pro I find it annoying 
I think if your going to list it as pro you should have to have credentials to show it and the OOP trend is another one that makes me :ireful2:


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## Arcane (Feb 17, 2009)

nightfish said:


> Define pro? Are you a 'eavy metal painter? Do you have a degree in fine arts? or are you 'pro' because you say so?
> 
> Since people are paying vast sums of money for these items, it would be interesting to know how 'pro-painted' works.


He runs a business around Warhammer for one. 

Personally I find the idea of paying that much for something like that a bit silly, but as an artist I completely respect doing it.


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## nightfish (Feb 16, 2009)

Arcane said:


> He runs a business around Warhammer for one.


If you did a search on Google you'd find lots of people who run a business around warhammer. Doesn't give you a licence to say your a pro-painter.


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## Lord of Rebirth (Jun 7, 2008)

Some of the stuff I have seen one ebay is amazing like a Falcon in individually colored puzzle pieces but think about it this way. A -really- god paint job takes a lot of time. If a tank takes 10 hours of painting if the artist wants to make a wage of $10/hr that is already $100 just for the paint job and of the model costs $50-60 and you factor in 4 or 5 hours to build it at the same rate as painting the tank is already $200. And really for something done as well as I'm thinking I'd say $20/hr is totally reasonable and that just about doubles the cost of one normal take to about $350.


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## Arcane (Feb 17, 2009)

nightfish said:


> If you did a search on Google you'd find lots of people who run a business around warhammer. Doesn't give you a licence to say your a pro-painter.


Professional; from Merriam Websters Online Dictionary:
2 a: participating for gain or livelihood in an activity or field of endeavor often engaged in by amateurs <a professional golfer.

Thus, having a business based on painting miniatures does indeed make you pro.


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## bitsandkits (Mar 18, 2008)

Arcane is indeed correct basically anyone who is selling a painted model on ebay has the right to sell it as "Pro-painted" as they are "participating for gain", it is up to the buyer to decide if the seller's quality of painting is worth paying the asking price.

In some ways pro painted models reflects the Art world, some "works of art" are in essence utter rubbish.

Don't get me wrong im not going to walk away with this years golden deamon slayer sword, but i know which end of a Kolinsky sable to dip in the pot.


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## JokerGod (Jan 21, 2009)

Lord of Rebirth said:


> Some of the stuff I have seen one ebay is amazing like a Falcon in individually colored puzzle pieces but think about it this way. A -really- god paint job takes a lot of time. If a tank takes 10 hours of painting if the artist wants to make a wage of $10/hr that is already $100 just for the paint job and of the model costs $50-60 and you factor in 4 or 5 hours to build it at the same rate as painting the tank is already $200. And really for something done as well as I'm thinking I'd say $20/hr is totally reasonable and that just about doubles the cost of one normal take to about $350.


Or you can hire a pro-painter for 5$-20$ a model and you even get to see there past work so you can tell if its worth it.


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## when in doubt shoot! (Oct 19, 2008)

Urgh, I hate this sort of thing. It's like these guys are getting monkeys to do the painting for them.


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## Jezlad (Oct 14, 2006)

Pro Painted of any standard is better than the dunked in paint heads upside down shit I've been tricked into buying before.


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## admiraldick (Sep 9, 2008)

noahwood said:


> I'm starting a new trend by selling pro-primed minis.


you joke, but...

i can't paint well enough to make people want my stuff, but i can convert up fairly well. and i'm seriously considering creating some of my own molds for my own creations which would then be modelled into miniatures (alternate chest pieces and the like). but i would then have to nearly complete the model and base-coat them, so that i couldn't be accused of selling 'fake' GW parts; they would simply be part of a conversion.



nightfish said:


> Define pro? Are you a 'eavy metal painter? Do you have a degree in fine arts? or are you 'pro' because you say so?


'pro' is short for 'proffessional', meaning someone who does a particular activity as their main source of income. anyone who cannot make enough money from selling their skill as a miniatures painter is not a pro. however, i would say that paying off a mortgage from the profits is probably near as damned it pro.

also, there are plenty of 'pro' painters that do not work for GW or even have anything to do with the game. to suggest that unless one works for the rather lacklustre 'Eavy Metal team their not a 'pro' is a little insulting.


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## The Son of Horus (Dec 30, 2006)

Technically, professional painting refers to anything painted by someone who's trying to make money by painting. That being said, real "pro painting" should get at least a 6 or 7 on CMON at the very worst. 

You have to remember two things, particularly about ebay: People are idiots, and people are looking for painted models. Some people don't care if they're really "pro" or not-- they're looking for something better than they can do, which more often or not means something only marginally better than "let's dunk 'em head first in the paint pot." 

As someone who occasionally sells stuff on Ebay, I've found that if you do very standard Games Workshop color schemes (Ultramarines, for example) you'll have no trouble selling stuff, because the same people who want painted models off of Ebay seem to be the same people who are content to just do everything as shown in the books, and not get creative with anything, which is totally fine. It does, however, lend itself to a marketing strategy of sorts on ebay. 

I sold an Eldar Farseer, for example, for thirty-five bucks. Not my best work, but it was still a 6-ish on CMON. It was in a Biel Tan color scheme, so there was plenty of interest. I think if I'd painted it with non-"standard" colors, it'd be less appealing to the kind of market that shops ebay for painted models.


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## bitsandkits (Mar 18, 2008)

one of my most profitable models was a Black templar land raider( will try and dig up the photos) at the time of the codex release. was base coated black using out of the can primer and some sisters of battle decals (the liturgy ones) and the molded black templar doors from the box set and it went for £99 plus p&p ,all in all it took about 6-8 hours work.

as for making a living at it, not sure its possible unless you are top notch and people are willing to fork out alot per model, or you can knock out a decent paint job very quickly,still a good way to fund your hobby, my little brother often buys a model and paints it and sells it for double its cost meaning his latest army was pretty much free.


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## Galahad (Dec 21, 2006)

I love it "Define pro"
Mate, the man just said he bought a house off selling painted models. I think that's as professional as it gets.
If you can buy a house doing anything, you can call yourself a professional at it LOL

Hell, technically speaking if I can sell you a model I painted with a sharpie for more than it cost me to make I can cal myself a professional painter.

It's true, there's no set standard for what is 'pro-painted' and whether or not it's worth it.
It's all down to results.

If someone can make 250 quid selling a sentinel with some paint on it, then obviously it was worth the price to someone. And if he can't, then that's his concern. Likewise, if a guy wants to call 'just a bit better than tabletop quality' pro-painted and try to make a buck off it, that's his call to make. You may not think it's the best paintjob ever, but if it's good enough for someone to buy it, it's pro-painted.

And if you were to, say, paint every miniature owned by an admin for a major 40k website, completely free of charge but in exchange for some ad space or a personal endorsement, I think that would count as professional too <wink wink>


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## nightfish (Feb 16, 2009)

Galahad said:


> I love it "Define pro"
> Mate, the man just said he bought a house off selling painted models. I think that's as professional as it gets.
> If you can buy a house doing anything, you can call yourself a professional at it LOL


He said 'paid for my mortgage deposit funded mostly from selling painted models to rich people'. Thats not buying a house.

I'm sure bitsandkits paints very well, the whole point of my questions to him was clarification on the world pro-painted, something that is open to judgment and is like I said and important factor when people part with their cash.


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## neilbatte (Jan 2, 2008)

I've sold loads of painted armies on Ebay for profit although I usually say its well painted and put up enough pictures for people to make their own mind up.
I normally buy cheap badly painted armies or miniature collections and strip them totally and start from scratch,
My models are nice to look at on the tabletop but I don't really go for the competative painting side of things but usually make a fair profit.
That said I don't think I would ever charge the prices some of the sellers seem to expect.


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## Druchii in Space (Apr 7, 2008)

Tbh I haven't used Pro painted in the title on ebay for a long time, and I mostly sell LVix's stuff, I know shes good enough to be classed as such, but many folks don't even look at it anymore if it has those two words in the title.

I usually just say well painted, or just painted, and then in the info explain shes been in the finalist case at Golden Daemon and was accepted as a member of the Fanatic painting scheme just before it was sadly canned due to the restructuring at Fanatic. Must work though, as we sold a Blood Bowl team for £120 odd just a few weeks ago. Trying to get her to paint another atm. 

Think our best sale though (just for the :shok: factor) has to be the 10 plastic Marines from Battle of Macragge, panted as Ultramarines for £54.


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## bitsandkits (Mar 18, 2008)

http://picasaweb.google.com/KITSANDBITS/MARKHOWARD#5097746227688545666

cant figure how to post these three but you get the idea


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## Gunstar (Feb 25, 2009)

Hi all- please allow myself to introduce myself! My name is Phill Holmes and i am an alcoholic.... i mean professional painter. I paint full time for a living (miniatures) and support my wife and son on my income alone. I have a degree in fine art and an HND in Illustration, and previous to painting minis i worked as an artist, also full time. I found that in order to have the time to enjoy my hobby to the max i had to make it my job- much to the alarm of my wife, at least at first. 

I sometimes sell my work on ebay, and have found that the best way to do it is to sell whole armies- usually tyranids. I do advertise my work as professionally painted, and have always sold my armies, although have experienced time wasters, usually (twice) Australian kids!! 

I paint a whole army in about a week. Time is money and there is a fine line between compromising your quality level and being cost effective. The armies i sell on ebay are by no means my best work, but the average price that i get for a 2000 point tyranid army is about £650. I put lists together that are cheap to buy- ie Battleforces plus an HQ and maybe an extra box of something, and always include a carry case. They work out at around £200 to buy in. It's either begginers with a bit of dollar or people who want to try nids and can't face painting another whole army! Personally i think they are crazy- why would you not want to paint your own army?

Now almost all the work i do is commision work, mostly from word of mouth, and when that runs out i put out another ebay army, with "I do commisions" at the bottom and that drums up more work if i need it.

I play my armies as well- religiously. I play Orks and Eldar, but surprisingly my own armies have yet to make it past undercoat! Ghaz being the exception, who is almost done! sigh... oh for more hours in the day!

Don't get me wrong here- i work really hard, but i do what i love, so i'm ok with that. I've only been doing this since the new year, so i have yet to stand the test of time, but being in London there seems to be no shortage of naked minis so far! Not only that, but the internet makes it soooo easy to have an international market.

So no i'm not an 'Eavy Metal painter, but i do consider myself a profesional painter.

If you like you can check out my site- i have only put it up recently, converted from my illustration website, and have run out of picture space already... (i'm working on that)

www.phillholmes.com


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## LTP (Apr 15, 2009)

Technically isnt anyone who makes a living off what they do a professional? For example im a professional soldier thats what i do and what i get paid for, but like Galahad said its up to the people who are willing to part with thier cash that decide i suppose.


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## Blue Liger (Apr 25, 2008)

Pro painted is avery loose term thrown around on eBay, though you find most decent guys who actually are Eavy Metal Standard painters and beyond, put there prices at a reasonable start say $50 and up for a Chaplain - hell I saw the Wood elves army from a WD on sale on eBay a while ago i was tempted but didn't have the funds at the time. 

Remember - Pro can be the misspelling of Por - Ah ebay you sly dog


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## tastytaste (Mar 31, 2009)

I think since their is no binding legal reason not to say Pro-Painted then lots of people do it. Really though you water down what you are trying to sell. I would never buy a painted army just because if I wanted to add on to the army their is no guarantee that I will find the painter that did again, let alone the additions I want to my army. Especially on Ebay.


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## Lord Reevan (May 1, 2008)

A lot of the shit I've seen On ebay have been "pro painted steel legion" which means they were sprayed metal and drybrushed silver. A simple job but charging a cockload for it... Thing is people lie liek crazy about it. I bought a "relatively good condition" predator on it recently and the entire side of it was melted in....


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## Gunstar (Feb 25, 2009)

I think the golden rule here is if there are poor quality or not enough photos then don't buy it- you really need to know what you are buying. When i sell an army on ebay i put at least 20 different high quality photos from a variety of angles etc, so you can really get a feel for the product. It's one of the most important facets of selling on ebay. I actually use Auctiva to get better hosting as well- i recommend them.

So in summary- if your not sure it's what you want- don't buy it. There is really no excuse for buying poor quality stuff on ebay. It's a bit like gambling, if your gonna play cards, sometimes you are going to lose.

(and no excuse for poor spelling- edited!)


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