# New Eldar and guard tanks incoming



## Too_hot_to_handle

with spearhead been announched the eldar and guard will be getting some new goodies. 

So for guard they will be getting a dual kit that makes the deathstrike, and medusa?[im not a guard player so not 100% on the names]

The eldar will also be getting 2 tanks, the fire prism redone fully in plastic, and the Nightspinner.

Awesomeness

EDIT* also coming out will be the support weapons in plastic with all the variants


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## MadCowCrazy

Pfft, where is the remake of the Exorcist tank? or Penitent Engine for that matter, or the entire codex for that matter


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## Too_hot_to_handle

MadCowCrazy said:


> Pfft, where is the remake of the Exorcist tank? or Penitent Engine for that matter, or the entire codex for that matter


is this on topic? no.
if you want to bitch and moan about gw, the pricing, or they way they do there releases then make you own thread so people like me dont have to read your whining please
thanks


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## FatBoyFat

Now that is a somewhat unpleasant attitude to take, and have you got any proof to this? or are we just taking it because you said so?


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## dthwish09

where are the rules going to be for the Nightspinner.


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## Cyklown

Nightspinner? Ooh, s6 ap- artillery on a tank! Go team! Does GW not understand what makes something playable? They better not use that as an excuse to put a Nightspinner in the new codex instead of something kickass.

The plastic FP... eh, well, we knew we weren't going to get anything that was particularly playable new, right? And the things were stupidly top-heavy. Metal prisms lets me strip off the paint with no effort as many times as I want, but, eh....


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## Bubblematrix

I do hope its not just a nightspinner and plastic prism that would be the lamest upgrade Eldar could get - the most useless tank around and a plastic kit for a model anyone who wanted to own already got theirs, might as well make some nice new guardian resculpts while they are at it.

Too_hot_to_handle how sure are you and whats your source?


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## Cyklown

Maybe they'll feel nice and also give us all new artillery!


I mean, seriously... the nighspinner? WTF? It's not even good at what it does. And it does something that's less than "OMFG we need it nao!"

Couldn't we have gotten something with a Pulsar? The IG get freaking Baneblades and all we get is a bunch of ap- templates.


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## Daniel Harper

I would like to know the source of this, if it were true then I'd have no money haha. Sweet releases although I was hoping for the other varients for a tank based expansion.


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## VanitusMalus

well considering no source was cited, I'm going to assume this is pure speculation and not take it seriously in the least (no offense too_hot_to_handle).

Also as someone else has already stated why would they release a Nightspinner and yet the vehicle isn't covered in the Codex. I highly doubt they are about to release another Eldar codex considering how recent they released the latest one, I doubt they'll put the rules for the Nightspinner in WD because then they'll have to make a pdf about it online and that just adds to more crap you have to download and lug around with you (and for one tank, one tank that unless the rules are better than what we have percieved won't even make it worth it).

I doubt any of this.


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## Too_hot_to_handle

if i gave you my source guys then firstly, i'd never get infomation early again and secondly he lose his job as he works for gw....im thinking he would be quite rightly pissed with me. 

As far as my confidence that its true, im 100% my source knows his stuff. As evidence as far as you want to take this, then EVERY prediction ive brought to heresy's pages has been true. i know a couple of guys who get access to this kinda stuff, and this guy is the real deal. Feel free to go through my previous posts if you can be bothered.

Now as to the prism, its supposed to be an extremely sexy piece of kit, with a long sleek shard like crystal. very nice indeed.


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## bitsandkits

Wow GW releasing eldar tanks that are not in a codex, i think that would class as crazy talk. 
plus the source is a GW employee, who are about as reliable as a taxi cab operator on a friday night at closing time.

peronsally i dont think we will see any eldar models , the fire prism/nightspinner and the firestorm would likely be a combined tank set for the future and i wouldnt expect to see them until they redo the codex.


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## Catpain Rich

1. What the hell is a nightspinner?
2. Looking forward to the guard tank predictions, the medusa and deathstrike are pretty cool


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## Too_hot_to_handle

bitsandkits said:


> Wow GW releasing eldar tanks that are not in a codex, i think that would class as crazy talk.
> plus the source is a GW employee, who are about as reliable as a taxi cab operator on a friday night at closing time.
> 
> peronsally i dont think we will see any eldar models , the fire prism/nightspinner and the firestorm would likely be a combined tank set for the future and i wouldnt expect to see them until they redo the codex.


where do you think all of the rumours that turn out to be true come from. they don't come from random people sitting at home on the internet in there pants willing things to be true. by works for gw that also doesn't mean the guy working in the shop down the road. Gw has lots of employees. 

As with all these kinda posts, the reader can and will believe whatever they want. however for those who it means something too, ive got a pretty good track record


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## Cyklown

VanitusMalus said:


> Also as someone else has already stated why would they release a Nightspinner and yet the vehicle isn't covered in the Codex. I highly doubt they are about to release another Eldar codex considering how recent they released the latest one, I doubt they'll put the rules for the Nightspinner in WD because then they'll have to make a pdf about it online and that just adds to more crap you have to download and lug around with you (and for one tank, one tank that unless the rules are better than what we have percieved won't even make it worth it).
> 
> I doubt any of this.




They'd just put the stats in the book and later in CA, d00d.


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## bitsandkits

Too_hot_to_handle said:


> where do you think all of the rumours that turn out to be true come from. they don't come from random people sitting at home on the internet in there pants willing things to be true. by works for gw that also doesn't mean the guy working in the shop down the road. Gw has lots of employees.
> 
> As with all these kinda posts, the reader can and will believe whatever they want. however for those who it means something too, ive got a pretty good track record


Well maybe your source can explain the release of a non codex tank, whats the rules for said tank and were will eldar players be able to buy the published rules? plus can they explain why GW would make a plastic fire prism? Its not a popular tank and to cut a sprue for it would cost far too much money and would be a waste of tooling time and production unless they were going to expand the kit to encompass other eldar tanks.

Even tha baal predator got a second weapon load out added to the baal sprue as did the LR crusader,LR demoliser and the hell hound and the lowly sentinel got loads of weapon options when it was recut. 
Cutting a sprue for the fire prism parts alone would be out of character in the current trend of multiple weapon options on one sprue and would bring zero value to eldar players who already own the tank and releasing a non codex entered tank like the night spinner would be so far off the mark for GW i cant even comprehend it.

Im not saying it isnt possible im stating it highly unlikely, not to mention the marketing didnt say they were releasing new tanks, it says new minatures and some plastic kits, everybody has assumed that means tanks because of the opening line "gather your tanks and lascannons" but the releases could just as easily be plastic kits for storm raven, space wolves or tyranids and anything in between.


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## bitsandkits

Cyklown said:


> They'd just put the stats in the book and later in CA, d00d.


this isnt a book to buy its some articles to be printed in white dwarf and some stuff on line,


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## MadCowCrazy

bitsandkits said:


> this isnt a book to buy its some articles to be printed in white dwarf and some stuff on line,


Afaik allot of tournaments dont even accept the use of troops or vehicles that are not in the army codex itself. Some might accept IA units but even that is a far stretch at times.

If anything I could believe something like this if a new Eldar codex was to be released but from what I hear there isnt one planned for this year atleast.

From what Ive gathered there are 4 possible candidates for codicies left this year. BT, GK, DE and Necrons. GW is likely to release atleast 2 more codicies this year.

I can believe the IG kit but from what I heard GW are not going to make any more multi kit boxes or some such. If anything Id guess they would release the deathstrike and the medusa as 2 different boxes.

I guess only time will tell, maybe there will be something in next weeks WD.


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## Cyklown

The Fire Prism isn't popular?
It's the Primary HS choice for Eldar! You have to use them in _pairs_. Just because there are 15 billion of the metal bastards floating around from back when they sucked...


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## bitsandkits

Cyklown said:


> The Fire Prism isn't popular?
> It's the Primary HS choice for Eldar! You have to use them in _pairs_. Just because there are 15 billion of the metal bastards floating around from back when they sucked...


in the grand scheme of 40k sales the fire prism isnt popular, that aside i doubt we will see a que of eldar players round the block of every GW in the land if they cut a 100% plastic prism. If they re do the model it will no doubt be the same price as the metal so anyone who has not got it based on price will still not buy one so that only leaves those who dont have one but didnt want a metal one and lets face it eldar players are pretty few in number anyway. 

Dont get me wrong i hope the rumours are true, as a long time eldar player i would be happy as larry to add new non forgeworld kits to my collection but plastic prisms wont be one of them, though i will be happy that they have changed to 100% plastic tanks but in terms of models in the eldar range that need alot of attention i dont think the prism is the one they should be focussing on. from a moving the range to plastic point of veiw it would be nice to see some of the aspect warriors change ,wraithguard goes without saying but i think they need expanding as a troop type to include close combat ghost warriors, and the obvious one is a full selection of bike mounted codex options, though many armies suffer from a lack of mounted model options.


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## Aramoro

It is exceedingly unlikely but I would like a Nightspinner model, but only if they update the rules a lot. Like make it fire Large blasts barrages, increase it's BS, possibly keep it as AP- but make it cause instant death. Something like that would make it playable as a novelty if it stays as just vehicle mounted Shadow Weavers it would be junk. 

Aramoro


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## Bubblematrix

I always thought it should have pinning for a start, and be a little less likely to be shrugged off by anything that didn't completely suck.

I'm still hoping its not a nightspinner.

As for the fireprism, B&K is dead on the mark - the fireprism isnt much of a seller at the moment, true that each NEW eldar player is likely to get a couple, it still would not justify as new kit. The only reason that the latest big plastic kits have sold is either 

a) they were released with a new army - so all the new players to that army were going to buy one anyway

b) the model used to be a FW only kit (like the trygon) or unavailable

Even so a) seems to be the norm for plastic rework tank kits.

This would be another reason that an Eldar tank would have to be a superheavy or new and inspiring model (or old with new rules) to make any real sales.

I also still hang my quesses on the rules set being based around use of superheavies in standard games, its a logical progression and it does what GW want most - improves kit sales.

@B&K true it does not specifically state that they are releasing new tanks, but looking at the rumour mill as a whole, an Eldar tank(?) is very close to being finished and this looks like the ideal time to do it, so I think we will see something - even if its likely to be a dissapointment


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## Gog

on the Imperial Guard tank I feel it would more likely be a Hydra/Manticor kit as the Deathstrike would be one fat ass bit of plastic, tho it would be soooo Orkable.

Eldar wise I agree non-codex is unlikely, Eldar superheavy would be game tho as they are not in codex like normal units example Stompa.


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## jigplums

This fits in well with other rumours, i thought not long ago a plastic eldar tank kit was spotted in wd wasn't it? they delibrately put these little hints in the background of some pictures.
also your stuff seems pretty reliable so far, so i'm inclined to believe this.

I think the prism is pretty popular actually, im an eldar collector of 15+ years and would likely get 2 if they come out. Also i have no idea of where the night spinners rules are or what they are, but i'd probably get one as well because i collect models, and if i like th emodel and its for one of my armies i'll get one. Im sure there are others in the same position.

Spearhead will be a wd supplement, so i can see the rules being in it for the spinner, plus possibly having apoc style formations that will include things like 3 prism formations etc....


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## Sethis

I'm fairly certain that if they did release a Plastic 'Prism, the only people who would see a large increase in sales would be bitz stores, from Eldar players ordering the turret and nothing else.

I can't decide whether I would like them to blend the Prism and Falcon sets into one kit. On the downside, the cost of the Falcon would rise. On the plus side, it would let you interchange the weapons like a Dreadnought/Predator, and the Prism would finally be plastic. It would be good if they threw in an upgrade sprue as well (although not essential).

On the subject of a new tank, I would LOVE it to be a Super-Heavy but a lot of people said the IG/Ork kits were poor sellers, and if you combine the total numbers of Ork/Guard players and compare with the number of Eldar players, you don't get a promising sales figure.

Nightspinner... why would you take one instead of a Fire Prism? Unless it's like 80 points per model and therefore viable in small games, it only has 1 advantage over the Prism, the ability to shoot Barrage. It's inferior in accuracy and damage compared to a Prism, and pinning is such a pointless mechanic in this edition due to all horde armies being fearless across the board...

My preferred option for a new Eldar vehicle would be an assault transport, but that probably stomps too much on the toes of Dark Eldar. Mind you they've given our unique mechanics to other armies, why don't we nick someone elses? :biggrin:


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## Bubblematrix

Sethis said:


> My preferred option for a new Eldar vehicle would be an assault transport, but that probably stomps too much on the toes of Dark Eldar. Mind you they've given our unique mechanics to other armies, why don't we nick someone elses? :biggrin:


Oh, please let it be the storm serpent - I would like that as a play style, storm serpents take position and then spill out troops as required into the positions needed.


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## bitsandkits

Im a huge eldar fan and would love to add any new models gw produce to my collection, and to me as modeller first gamer second it wouldn't matter if they released the night spinner kits without rules, but I simply cannot see any model being released without a codex to support it, the codex is more than just a army list its also marketing tool, the big flash colour section packed full of photos and paint schemes does not happen by accident its part of the whole marketing deal. So to invest money in a plastic kit tooling for an unknown tank for a middle of the road army like the eldar and not support it in a codex does not make sense, the only way i can see this working is if they are doing a Eldar super heavy kit. Still cannot fathom the notion that the three apocalypse kits didnt sell, as and indie seller i have shifted a large number of these and the bane blade still remains one of the strongest selling tanks we provide bits for, i will grant you its not in the same legue as rhino based tanks,land raider or leman russ but it does still sell. Plus you have missed a fine point with super heavies, the stompa does not have to sell as well as main stream kits, it costs alot more at £60 and its produced in china so it costs less to produce, think about it if GW were able to make profit on space hulk making a profit on a stompa is childs play, but mainly your mistaking number of sales = profit, thats not how GW operate, if they did the prices would be half what they are so they could shift volume. As long as the product sales cover design and production quickly everything else is cream, and as we know GW have invested alot of money time and effort to reduce design and production with rapid prototyping and CAD and the switch to plastics. 
And thinking about it we should get another super heavy, we should get one for every army, the release of an eldar super heavy will boost sales of eldar products but also the sales of other super heavies to a degree, think about it if you play in a small group and the only one player in that group has access to a super heavy then its fairly pointless him buying a super heavy but if other players have access then they are more likely to all buy them.


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## jigplums

the baneblade sold massively to start with, however the other 2 didn't even reach the sales of the baneblade when combined together.


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## MaidenManiac

First of all I have to say I totally agree with *Too_hot_to_handle*: 
Its getting extremely annoying that all rumour threads get derailed by "WH/DE/GK/other-backwater-armies" players. 
I would very much like to see a new Tau Codex where all units are at least a bit useful, unlike the current one, but that does not mean that I have to whine like a child in each rumour thread that does not say "new Tau stuff":nono:
Grow up folks.


I would welcome new Eldar tanks, a plastic Prism sounds very likely and viable. All tank kits are shifting to "all plastic content" nowdays, why should not Eldars get the same treatment?
Adding a Nightspinner would naturally also mean rules for it, and on top of that most likely rules for new unit(s) in WD, something GW has shunned for too long imo. Lets hope this can continue, it might actually make WD a bit useful again!

New Artillery tank options for the IG is not directly a shocking rumour either, in all this sounds like a very reasonable rumour:good:


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## Styro-J

If they're going to produce an Eldar Super Heavy model, it would likely either be one they themselves have already put rules out for. That could only possibly mean the Revenant Titan. If they wanted to do a Cobra or Scorpion they would have to post the rules in a WD, as those have only been Forge World as far as I can remember.

I'm in the club that if the plastic prism came out, I would likely only be looking to buy the turret. (Yay! More business for B&K!) I would probably buy a nightspinner turret as well, but sadly I would never use it without a major rules tweek.


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## Stephen_Newman

I could see the fire prism being popular although I would like the extremist army theme continued. Perhaps make the nightspinner AV14 all round and make it 100 points!!(LOL this would never happen!)

I also do not see why new eldar tank kits cannot come out. I mean I hardly saw anyone use a venerable dreadnought before March or many people use Ork deff dreads and NO ONE used killa kans before new kits came out.

And speaking of if it is "needed" or not wel think about the recent chimera and basilisk. The old kits were perfectly fine and I can't see much difference.

As for an IG tank. Likely candidates (for me) are a new bogstandard leman russ as well as a griffon and possibly medusa/deathstrike missile.


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## bitsandkits

I would actually welcome a recut falcon /prism in a box, mainly because the tool for the falcon is getting tired and main hull for the last few years have been warped. plus the surface is a bit rough and i swear i can see finger marks. But given a choice i would take a scorpion or cobra kit over anything.


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## Warlock in Training

Sethis said:


> On the subject of a new tank, I would LOVE it to be a Super-Heavy but a lot of people said the IG/Ork kits were poor sellers, and if you combine the total numbers of Ork/Guard players and compare with the number of Eldar players, you don't get a promising sales figure.


Maybe thats becuase GW sells as much plastic as a $20 G.I. Joe tank for $90 instead. :shok: LOL.


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## dthwish09

this sounds reasonableand I belive that this is what GW will release, hopefully the fireprism box has the wave serpent sprue in it. I broke all mine and now I have ghetto ones.


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## TheKingElessar

THIS IS SPECULATION - Let's make that clear.

Okay...I like to sit down with a Codex, and rewrite it. It's something I've always done. Rarely is the project finished...but nonetheless great fun, and sometimes shockingly right (my DIY Necron Codex was a large contributing factor in getting the info I have regarding the Necrons)...anyway, a few months ago, I sat down with Eldar for a session of this...and one of my favourite ideas, followng in the theme of recent Codicies, was a Fire Prism entry with a multitude of turret options - not merely a Prism cannon, but a Shadowweaver, Firestorm, D-Cannon etc etc. Now, I'm not suggesting that GW stole my idea (lol)..but they could easily have come to the same frame of mind. Some of my 3rd Ed Ork Codex predictions were rather accurate (the only time I've ever finished a DIYDex) - though mine was far more elaborate, and more like a hybrid of the Ork Dex and the Pete Haines Dex than anything ever actually released. But I digress...point is, perhaps GW are planning to have a multi-tank Prism kit, or just a Prism with a reshaped hull would be great too.

As regards the Scorpion, Cobra and Storm Serpent...obviously I would love all of them to be released. Or a Nightwing. Oh,. and I trust T_H_T_H's Rumour Fu. If he's wrong, it not because that isn't what he's been told - it's because something changes.


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## bitsandkits

You are very correct Elessar but you also hit the nail on the head, GW could quite easily knock out a multi weapon fire prism/spinner/shit kicker combo tank but like you were doing when you came up with the idea , it would need a rewritten codex and the spear head email didnt mention an updated code or rules for a new eldar kit.
but thats the fun of rumour, someone comes on posts a rumour people argue the point and GW do what they want, i catagorically said that the storm raven would not be in the Blood angels codex because i couldnt see GW investing in a flyer kit for one marine army and i was wrong, well sort of wrong, the entry is in the book but no kit to complement the rules, this would be equally crazy in the fact a night spinner/firestorm/prism combi kit would have models but no codex entry, but hell its GW so who knows.


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## TheKingElessar

While I agree a new Eldar Dex is a fair bit away, they have, iirc, created things for Apoc before that later found their way into 40k - and IA featured a bunch of Russes that are now in the Dex, and artillery...I anticipate the rules for Shadow Weavers to be online, in WD, and possibly in a collection of 'Spearhead Formations' or somesuch in around 6 months.

Rules-wise - It NEEDS Rending, or AP4 at least. Maybe both. Of course, GW seem to like the whole 'expanding on characteristic test' mechanic...so maybe a S test? An AP2 S test to kill? Obvs no Cover either, but allow Invul saves. Large Blast, obvs...I think Heavy 2. 96" Range. About 170-200 points, with 12/12/12 and free Vectored Engines, Spirit Stones and Holo-Field. Yes, I wrote that in less than 2 mins, it wasn't the original entry I wrote months ago. lol.


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## MadCowCrazy

http://www.belloflostsouls.net/2010/03/40k-rumors-new-eldar-ig-kits-on-way.html

So the Spearhard supplement is headed our way this June, and new kits are headed our way. This little blurb has been floating around with some interesting tidbits:


This June the Imperial Guard unveil yet more of their armoured might. However they are not the only force ready to unleash powerful, death dealing weapons.

The manafactorums have been working overtime this past year to supply the frontline regiments with tanks to pound the enemies of the Imperium into dust. This summer they're stepping up production once more as yet more vehicles rumble off the production lines.

Not to be outdone by the Imperial Guard, the Bonesingers of the enigmatic Eldar have begun to craft new and elegant vehicles. In June the Eldar are gaining several new plastic kits, including a brand new tank. You can find all the information you need, including the rules and background for this vehicle, in White Dwarf 366.


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## Cyklown

We get a brand new tank, and it's that shitcan? Seriously? If they're going to give us one and then say "hey, there's your love, stfu" then they could at least make it something playable.

Everyone lives in tincans, right? So, give it twin TL starcannons that are mysteriously s7ap1 and a power of the machine spirit equivilant. Bam.

Or, y'know, something with a pulsar.



Hell, if it HAS to be an artilery tank then why not make something with twin mounted d-cannons?


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## Styro-J

The Assault Serpent still sounds coolest, hands down. (but not really an option it seem...:cray


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## Bubblematrix

Im giving up hope on it actually being anything worthwhile now, the rumors seem to be piling up towards FP/NS kits one of which I would simply not buy as I have 4 prisms and would just buy 2 more old style ones to finish the sunstorm (when they drop on ebay due to the new kit) and the other has such shitty rules its unplayable.

There is still the little spark of hope it might really be "new" but past rumours about plastic nightspinners seem too coincidental, here's hoping its actually some sick tank bursting D-artillery piece, large blast instant death 4+ penetrating would be nice


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## Too_hot_to_handle

Also coming out guys is plastic support weapons. So prehaps with a little conversion you can convert the turrets over.


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## Bubblematrix

Now that *would* be a kit I would buy and long overdue 

I'm glad I have resisted the temptation of a D-cannon battery until now


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## your master

i agree 100% that eldar are getting new tanks including one thats not codex ill tell you why.. it says so in the april white dwarf it says something like "not wanting to be out done by the imperium the bone singers have been busy building new and exciting machines" that isnt word perfect but the points the same


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## bitsandkits

Seems i was wrong, well all i can say is its very out of character, but IF GW want to drop a non apocalypse tank on us thats not in the codex and support it with WD rules/online rules i will take my hat off to them, This was standard practice back in the day and all the rules that were printed in white dwarf ,then were compiled into books and it worked for years, in fact i still own the original white dwarf with the oringinal release of the aspect warrior eldar and army list as it was back in the day. It was one of the reasons i stayed with the hobby when i was young, i didnt have to fork out masses of cash for thick hard back rule books that i only needed a fraction of to play the game, i have always believed that the codex should be a modular book that could be updated with either white dwarf pages or printed material from online rather than these grand 100 page plus things we have now.


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## Bubblematrix

It also makes WD more than just a catalogue with some newbies guides to stuff you can already do.

Maybe the business advisers pointed out that WD doesn't sell very well and that it might improve if it contained content key to playing the game - hell I would get a sub if it started having game rules in for new stuff.

It also has the advantage that they can create some balance a little easier, army X needs some anti tank - well next month in WD they get it, army Y sucks against army Z well this new balancing unit makes that not soo.

It makes the rules system less dependant on 3yr+ old codex decisions.


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## Warlock in Training

Hmmmmm.... cool. Too bad for Eldar if its a Shadow Weaver.


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## yanlou

personally i think it might a eldar super heavy, makes sense as imperial guard and orks have one, sm and csm can use the imperial guard superheavys, so eldar having a super heavy is a logical step, and whats been said "not wanting to be out done by the imperium the bone singers have been busy building new and exciting machines" means theres prob going to more then 1 kit,


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## Cyklown

So, aside from a nearly entirely useless artillery tank, things that Eldar actually NEED:
An anti-heavy vehicle, possibly a heavy itself: Pulsars. Freaking Pulsars. There've been IA rules for them in the past, right?

A tank with a stealth field. Viel of Tears would be better (if only it worked on the transport they were in. Then I'd actually put them in my Falcons, and once they were in there they'd be nice for clearly objectives) but that might be a bit much to hope for.

Multiple s7ap1 shots. We don't have any s7 stuff for transport killing, and while s6 heavy 4 is better than s7 heav2, ap1 (which you need for popping vehicles) ave 12 is suddenly everywhere, sooo.... Yeah. Two twinlinked s7ap1 heavy2 guns on it's turret. Maybe give it a machine spirit equivilant. They could call the new gun the Star Cannon. Give it the stealth field if you wanted to or not and throw it in fast attack. I mean, if it's got the machine spirit analogue and exists to take down light vehicles and occasionally help against heavy infantry it's clearly a fast response vehicle.


Anything they put in heavy will either have to be OMFGBROKED/fill a *compeling *need or else will never get used. Anything that blows chunks that eats a HS slot will not only be unusable but it will be a slap in the face. Watching all of the Imperium armies get new models, more new models, new models for models that were replaced in recent memory and new kits that supplement existing freaking amazing kits and knowing that this will be the ONE piece of love we get? Oh, and to top it off when sales are fucked because no one wants to field a piece of shit at HS they'll just use it as evidence that the eldar range is not viable to give kits to.

In short, as much as I damn well know I'm a doomsayer:
While it's nice to get models, the fact that we're getting a piece of crap, and the fact that the release of future kits will be linked to the sale of these kits means that I am at the very least agitated about this.


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## Sethis

Yay. Support Weapons in plastic. Exactly what Eldar need!

Not, y'know, Psykers on Jetbikes or anything... :laugh:


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## Bubblematrix

Sethis said:


> Not, y'know, Psykers on Jetbikes or anything... :laugh:


They will come with a new codex in the next 2-3years along with plastic poseable wraithguard as they are sure sellers to the two preffered fun eldar armies. Don't hold your breath on them before then.

I would expect that our new tanks will be suitable as tank poppers as that looks like what this spearhead rules suplement is aimed at, so hopefully they will be a nice heavy slot alternative.. but we will see


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## Vanchet

More Guard tanks-promising
if these are in the shape of Medusa's-Oh look a Squadron of 3 >8D


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## dthwish09

By the sounds of the BOLs article, i think the eldar are getting a codex update in june

ah nevermind i suppose they are jsut putting the rules into a white dwarf


----------



## Cyklown

Plastic Wraithguard?
Greeaaat. They'd need to be playable for that to matter, y'know?


Chant with me:
An assault transport with Viel of Tears on it!

A vehicle with a "Star Cannon" that's s7 ap1!

Pulsars! Pulsars! Pulsars!




Oh, wait, we're getting the worst artillery piece that Eldar get on a tank. Eating on of the FOC slots that's overcrowed rather than one of the ones that's useless.


----------



## Bubblematrix

Cyklown said:


> Plastic Wraithguard?
> Greeaaat. They'd need to be playable for that to matter, y'know?


Not the place for that tbh, but seeings you posted, just which wraithguard are you talking about? mine have been invaluable, also yes if a new codex came out they would get beefed out a bit.

As for the other things on your wish list, they seem very unlikely as a WD release, though a tank with better holofields or equivilent would be very nice and would work with the Eldar army feel.

I think the discussion of "does the nightspinner suck" is kind of agreed on all parties, lets just hope that isn't considered a "new" tank


----------



## jigplums

it doesn't have any real rules yet, so its hard to say its sucks. Its a really sexy looking piece of kit[FW] so until we see the WD with its rules in i saw AWESOME.


----------



## Bubblematrix

jigplums said:


> it doesn't have any real rules yet, so its hard to say its sucks. Its a really sexy looking piece of kit[FW] so until we see the WD with its rules in i saw AWESOME.


IA Apocalypse has rules, and they make it total junk - I would find it highly unlikely that they would simply null those and rewrite them, but they cant get any worse so sounds good to me if they do

Just went and trawled the rumours which were about in early february and the new kit was described as:



> "a good bit larger larger than a falcon"





> "make eldar players happy, and would put the eldar on the same terms as the other factions in terms of superheavy plastic kits"


Now I know the nightspinner is bigger than a falcon, but this was a clarification when someone thought it was a plastic nightspinner, so its a little more weight to the hope its a superheavy of sorts, that and I cant see much else achieving balance with other armies on the superheavy front

Edit: and "a "Star Cannon" that's s7 ap1!" should be called a Nova Cannon


----------



## Too_hot_to_handle

well the models for the eldar are absolutely lovely. In my experience and that of many i know who work for gw is that there are far far more people who buy for the models they like, over the rules for a unit. There are many who will not want multiples of units in there army as they buy for the modelling and painting as much as gaming, infact gw believes that 60% of its customers are modellers and painters rather than gamers.

This supports the Dark eldar debate in that they have god aweful models yet one of the most powerful army book.


----------



## Cyklown

No. it would be called a Star Cannon. As in the same gun with a name just different enough to not replace the stats on existing SCs.

It's plasma on a cannon mount. It's just safer and "more focused" on the grounds that eldar have that plasma stuff down pat.

heavy3 starcannons don't work because they're then better than scatterlasers at killing ap5 in the open and marines in cover. GW decided that seeing a bunch of 'rines killers everwhere was bad, and therefore it's no longer a gun with a lot of shots. It's now unplayable.

They mad it unable to compete for it's old slot. At s7ap1 it'd actually be fieldable. It might need to cost 5 more points than it currently does. *shrugs* It might not. It's basically an expesive autocannon that's harder to field and does the job a bit better in exchange for it being harder to field.

Do I exagurate? slightly. But s7 is nearly worthless vs s6 except against MCs and vehicles. s6 is better against av11 than s7. If it's going to cost more than a Scatterlaser and do less then it needs to be better at what it does. *shrugs*
I'd reccomended that Bright and Dark lances become s9ap1 lance weapons if I thought it'd get a meaningfull (or amusing) discussion going.


Besides, looking at new dex's it's clear that ap1 is the new black. If every non-eldar lance is going to be ap1... why not make eldar plasma ap1?


----------



## TheKingElessar

Too_hot_to_handle said:


> Also coming out guys is plastic support weapons. So prehaps with a little conversion you can convert the turrets over.





Too_hot_to_handle said:


> well the models for the eldar are absolutely lovely. In my experience and that of many i know who work for gw is that there are far far more people who buy for the models they like, over the rules for a unit. There are many who will not want multiples of units in there army as they buy for the modelling and painting as much as gaming, infact gw believes that 60% of its customers are modellers and painters rather than gamers.
> 
> This supports the Dark eldar debate in that they have god aweful models yet one of the most powerful army book.


Quote 1 = Awesome. Horrible as they are, rules-wise, the conversion opportunities will see me buy loads. Especially if my rules-related hunch works out.

Quote 2 = Absolutely, although I certainly don't think it's over 50% of GW customers buy toy soldiers if they don't want to play toy soldiers. As regards DE, I call shenanigans. They certainly have a very strong army possible...it's just that only one build is possible from the book making it inflexible, unbalanced, and not a very good Codex overall - just a strong army.

Especially if you consider fluff important (to a Codex's structure), then DE is the worst Codex...


----------



## Cyklown

If said hunch involves a new chassis and some stranner manner in which the guns for support batteries can move and shoot and it pans out then I'll stop bitching about the lack of support for the pointy-hats and put my money where my mouth is as far as "yes, GW. Everyone loves them some gorgeous plastics. This is a wonderfull business decision."


----------



## Bubblematrix

Cyklown said:


> No. it would be called a Star Cannon. As in the same gun with a name just different enough to not replace the stats on existing SCs.


Ok whatever, fact is it doesn't exist and isn't likely to for 18months+

Too_hot_to_handle, any idea from your source as to whether the prism and nightspinner are the only tanks and are indeed the ones the rumours have been forseeing or whether we can expect an early (June?) Christmas?

Edit:



> If said hunch involves a new chassis and some stranner manner in which the guns for support batteries can move and shoot


Now that is something I could dig, and would be at least original


----------



## Cyklown

Well, sure. But given the fact that we'll be waiting at least 3 years for a codex (I'd love it if I felt otherwise) 18 months isn't so long to wait. I have WAAAY to much painting to do as it is. I utterly refuse to get exciting about anything that's coming out in less than 12 months.

Heck, I'll be lucky if the desk I paint on is clean in 2 months. And then I've got to paint a few guardians (my sacrificial lambs) to get back into the groove. Then I've got to finish half a squad of fire dragons. Then I've got the 15 billion jetbikes and Eldar tank Chassis to paint, some turrets to magnet up and paint, some more turrets to buy (I knew I needed 3 more. I forgot which) and then I have...

Yeah. 18 months just means it's safe for me to want to like things.

The fact that D-cannons only pen 1/3 and aren't ap1 (because at the time that the codex was written ap1 turned glances into penentrating hits, so it really would have made no sense. sigh) of the time would be made up for by the fact that it's a defensive weapon, so if they were rocking quads (ie twin tl) you could just go mad... and fire that underslung shurikanon as well.
I'm not even remotely sure how they'd work Vibros. If it got multiple shots AND still had it's "you'll honestly never miss unless you jinx yourself somehow, it autoglances everything ever" status it might be good if you just kept running around staying behind any cover and hitting the other side. ::Cyk wanders off rambling about ludicrious "I want a gun that can teleport warp energy into a sun" demands and desires::


----------



## Warlock in Training

I think its funny that this thread is about the many IG chassies and a SINGLE Eldar Tank. So far the whole thread is focused on the what Tank the Eldar get. GW, this is a wake up call to get your priorities straight.


----------



## Cyklown

Hey, they know I don't spend much money on them. Quite frankly I'll any metal kits I want by waiting and buying on ebay when it's the price I want.

If we were getting new kits that'd be different. First of all because there'd be less new ones out there for sale, and secondly because I'd support that. Except for the new Reapers. Not only are the less than amazing, they're ugly too! Luckily the old ones got easier to find...

Give me a new plastic model tank kit and I'd have to buy from them, y'know? I prefer to put plastics together myself. I'd be forced to give them my money for what I wanted and happy to do so.

The guards players are jaded at this point. They know they'll lose 5% of a sprue every time a kit is remade. GW seems to have forgotten that saturation is just as much a factor on supply and demand as elasticity and initial demand.


----------



## TheKingElessar

On the offchance anyone from GW Eldar Design is reading (and with my presence in the thread, they SHOULD be! lol)

I would happily pay £40 a pop for a box that had the Falcon sprue, a Fire Prism plastic Sprue, and the Wave Serpent sprues - enough parts to make one tanks, but it could be any of the three. In fact, I'd pay £45.

And I'd buy about 10 if they had a reshaped hull like the FW one with the elongated awesomesauce prow. Oh, and a 'made of win' cargo bay that looked like more than 3 Eldar [that weren't the gymnastic porn stars we all know they are] could fit inside.

Then you can sell the turret sprues with my shiny weapon options, just like the Razorback/Battlewagon upgrade sprues. Also...let me write the Codex, 'kay? Promise not to do a Pete Haines.


----------



## Sethis

Funny, reading the "Larger than a Falcon" and "Equal footing with other Super-heavies" actually makes me speculate about the possibilit of it being a Walker, not a Grav Tank. I mean, we've already said that plastic Fire Prisms wouldn't sell and there aren't any -major- problems with Falcons and Serpents (not big enough to justify altering the kits before the new codex, anyway).

So what if we got something as tall as the Tervigon, but bulkier, and it looked like a Wraithlord on steroids? Could have a Toughness value (like squiggoths) and a Veil of Tears effect, armed with several long range Pulsars. Kinda like the Revenant, but smaller.


----------



## TheKingElessar

An Eldar Stompa? Conceivable, but it doesn't fit in with the image of the Eldar, IMO.


----------



## bitsandkits

if the put a revenant in plastic i will drive to warhammer world and hand out a cuban to every employee. Its been mentioned a few time that eldar titans are far easier to produce as they have fully encompassing armour, so they are in effect just like a normal minature but taller, were as the warhound and imperial titans have many pistons and internal workings on veiw which makes them very complex. its like the ork truck vs the rhino, the rhino is supposed to be far more complex and advanced but the kit has about a quarter of the parts that the truck has, a revenant would possibly come in at the same part count as the trygon and they already have the FW model to scan, quick win for GW.


----------



## TheKingElessar

I suppose it could be one of the old Knights...http://www.solegends.com/citcat911/c2131epiceldarknights-h.htm

But I don't see them getting a Renaissance.


----------



## Sethis

I'm not sure about the Centaur looking Knights there, I was thinking more along the lines of actually just casting the 3-ups of the Wraithlord and sticking Pulsars on instead of the regular 6 options.


----------



## Styro-J

Of all Eldar Super Heavies, the Revenant is the most likely since GW already has rules posted for it. Cobra/Scorpion would be sweet but that's just more effort to get into the works. 

The Night Spinner currently uses a 7'' blast, so a transition to normal 40k would mean that a rules change is going to happen anyway, but a 5" S 6 AP- Heavy 1 is just a joke. If that happens, I would want some kind of special rule that lets the Spinner carry 6 Warp Spiders, and for every 2 Spiders the Spinner gains another shot from its gun. There semi-balanced and not too broken, but kind of useful.


----------



## Cyklown

That just sounds... clumsy.

If the templates were large blast or even just heavy 2 they might have been decent before everyone started packing their things into metal boxes.

As things are there's no need for large amounts of completely squishy s6 hits. We already have scatterlasers, but they actually do thing to av11 and bellow.

Even a tank with two 3-gun-strong vibrocannon batteries would do more, since at least that would always hit, autoglance (and two autoglances every turn against anything your opponent lined up for you, LOS be damned would make glancing things to deal bearable) and dish out the s6 hits. Plus it would FINALLY be an eldar tank that was a bit less terrified of weapon destroyed results.


----------



## Styro-J

See? Not broken!


----------



## Cyklown

Hey, as a shenaniganmancer I took the "ignore sarcasm" ability, and I accidentally left it on. Would you clarify?


----------



## VictorLazarus

I don't get why they can't bring back the Griffon kit as they had it out before; not that the FW isn't nice.

MVL.


----------



## TheKingElessar

VictorLazarus said:


> I don't get why they can't bring back the Griffon kit as they had it out before; not that the FW isn't nice.
> 
> MVL.


It simply didn't sell. Plus, it was a metal model - and re-releases of those are counter-productive.


----------



## Lash Machine

Just got April's White Dwarf and it had a section saying that in June there will be new Eldar vehicles. It states " In June the Edldar will be gaining several new plastic kits, including a brand new tank."

This could be a re cut sprue for the falcon set which contains a plastic prism cannon and one other new option or of course something else. Speculatively I doubt this would be an apocalpse tank but an upgrage to the falcon kit with either the rules printes in white dwarf and on the web or even an updated reprint of the Eldar codex rather than a brand new codex.


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## TheKingElessar

I'd love something added to our FA section as much as anyone...but I reckon an Apoc vehicle will be what we get...it DOES cause hassle to force players to carry an extra book to tournies to use new vehicles.


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## Bubblematrix

I would like both your thoughts to come true TKE, I want a Storm serpent 

Even if this does end up being a dissapointment it has acomplished one thing, I have finally got in gear and been finishing assembling and basecoating all my eldar - my wife is more likely to go ape if I buy new tanks if I havent finished(?) the ones I already have.
I also found while digging through my box of unfinished sprues that I have 8 Vypers - not to start a debate on the virtues(?) of vypers but I like them in apocalypse with cannons or scatter lasers for horde wasting


----------



## Sethis

Bubblematrix said:


> not to start a debate on the virtues(?) of vypers


A "debate" implies that there are two arguable sides. In the case of Vypers... there isn't. :laugh:

/joke


----------



## TheKingElessar

I've had some success with Vypers, but not against top-notch opponents.

Just makes it all the more frustrating really. I believe they're our best current FA choice, but that doesn't say much.


----------



## Bubblematrix

No No No, not the vyper debate 

(I use them to be in all the wrong places in apocalypse, you have a board big enough and take enough of them that a bit of fire doesnt cripple your chances and they can really nag at troops, last time 3 of them cleared an objective of orks as the squad they were firing at was doomed - but I have also seen them just roll over and waste points, as TKE said, they should be a really good FA choice - but for some reason and I think its points based, they just suck too often in normal games)

Has anyone picked up on any more rumor material? i have been scouting the web and cant find much more - i cant wait till may to find out what we get... im impatient


----------



## TheKingElessar

Strangely, I'm quite patient about this...I know I'll buy 3 anyway, so...


----------



## VanitusMalus

yeah I can wait, I still have other crap to paint and I plan on buying a large force of Eldar around that time, so I'll save a little for these new tanks.

concerning Vypers they're really cheap fire distractions that carry a fast moving gun. I use them as bait to get opponents wasting shots at them while greater threats loom. I agree with TKE against more strategic players not such a great plan, but against "panic and shoot" players works everytime!


----------



## Cyklown

Well, all longings about a nondedicated assault vehicle (it can't be "true" open-topped, since the we'll still never field banshee's, we'll just break it into three elites slots worth of pieces with fire dragons. mmm. fire dragons) aside (hey, it'd make harlies good! woo!), I'd definatelly buy two, maybe three of an improved, not insanely top-heavy Prism, and any sort of Eldar heavy would be an at least one-of so I could reward myself for finally getting shit painted when that day finally came.

It's just that Nightspinner bit. That worries the shit out of me. It's like meeting a gorgeous but dumb as a rock girl, really. Gorgeous model, but quite frankly I'd really, REALLY rather have the reverse.


----------



## TheKingElessar

How about some Fire Points? A new Dedicated Transport that allows up to 5 models to shoot out, and has a 48" range TL AP1 Melta Large Blast weapon on the turret.

Go go suddenly viable Dark Reapers!


----------



## Stephen_Newman

It might be a long shot but has anyone considered the new tank to be a flyer like a nightwing for instance?


----------



## Bubblematrix

I think that was mentioned

I think it would be a bit too far of a stretch though, our apocalypse group has murmerings of some flyers being bought at the FW open day and already an escalation of anti-flyer gear is being predicted (go go 40k arms race). It would likely result in too much of a change to regular armies to combat it.

That said it would be very Eldar to get a flyer, and both the Nightwing and Phoenix would be fairly easy to cut a plastic kit from.


----------



## Stephen_Newman

Well other than that I just hope it is eldarish by being manouverable, fragile if handled terribly and can point devastating firepower if aimed right.

I think it would be cool if some not as powerful version of sonic lances on the revenants could be used as an option. Maybe with rules like a more powerful vibro cannon shot?


----------



## Don_Keyballs

I think the best bet would be to make a turrent mounted D-Cannon like the cobra... but make it more realistic for non apoc games and make it a large blast instead of the 10in blast like the cobra. Make it str 10, ap2 and 6's equals automatic death. It would just be like a vanquisher only on a fast, skimmer body. That would work for me.


----------



## Cyklown

TheKingElessar said:


> How about some Fire Points? A new Dedicated Transport that allows up to 5 models to shoot out, and has a 48" range TL AP1 Melta Large Blast weapon on the turret.
> 
> Go go suddenly viable Dark Reapers!


Wait, you wouldn't just put Fire Dragons in it? 
Yeah, yeah, I know. Eggs in one basket syndrome

Making it BS 4 would be nice as well. At BS4 you're seeing a 1/3 chance of rolling a hit and a 1/6 chance of it scattering 0". At that point you're as accurate as a TL BS3 nonblast weapon.


Being able to take melta antitank without eating a FoC would be a godsend.

Heck, I'd love to just see a varriant of the D-Cannon that actually pens a reasonable amount of the time and is AP1, with maybe a 6 autodestroying.

Or... assault transports with TL fusionguns underslung. reliable? Hell no. A nice "and here's some backup"? hell yes.

Just remember, GW: there's roughly two things you could do at HS that will be even remotely playable. At dedicated transport it just has to do something we don't already have competently, and at fast attack it just needs to no suck. I mean, a Vyper variant with stealth fields (or not) and TL (or just, y'know, dual) D-cannons would probably see play even if you fail to fix D-Cannons.


----------



## Sethis

I would LOVE to get an assault transport, but the problem is that it overlaps far too much with Dark Eldar. Ditto for open topped. The only open topped vehicles we've ever had have been 1-man scout varients (walkers, vypers, jetbikes).

How could we have an open topped or assault transport without it simply being a *better* Raider?

My personal preference would be 6-man transport like the Falcon, dedicated, with an assault ramp and twin-linked fusion guns that can be swapped for twin linked flamers. 12/12/10 without Forcefields, at about 80pts.

However if the latest is true and it's simply a Nightspinner and a plastic Prism then I won't buy either and the Eldar will sit on the shelf a while longer (some of you may have noticed my win/loss hasn't changed in some months). Why would I buy a tank that's WORSE than the Prism, and why would I spend ~£70 simply to upgrade a metal turret to plastic?

...

No, I can't think of a reason either.


----------



## TheKingElessar

Hell, screw all this 'underslug Fusion Guns' bollocks - we need more Flamers even more, let's be honest here. Storm Guardians, just to get 2 fucking Flamers? DBF, in an anti-tank squad? Hardly good options.

Think I'm going to write a new Codex entry for Warp Spiders, one that doesn't suck.

An Assault Variant of the Vyper, just like 2nd Ed, would be awesome. Especially if it had a DBF mounted on the front. And cost 40 points. With free Spirit Stones. And 5 point Vectoreds. And 5/10 point Star Engines. And 15 point Holo-Fields. And a D-Cannon turret option (to replace Transport) for 10 points.

Fucking A.

Oh., and not fucking open topped if there's a turret...or just give it the same fucking Energy Field as a War Walker, FFS.


----------



## Judas Masias

dthwish09 said:


> where are the rules going to be for the Nightspinner.


In the new White Dwarf from what i last herd.


----------



## Judas Masias

I found this on BOLS.

40K RUMORS: Spearhead Models Latest
March 25, 2010 


So various new kits have been added to the Spearhead model mix since the initial list of kits rumored to be in the June release slot. Here are the latest contenders:

"Imperial Guard:



Leman Russ/Standard/Vanquisher/Exterminator/Eradicator: Similar to the Demolisher kit the new kit will be capable of creating the remaining Leman Russ variants currently without a model. Will probably increase in price to match the Demolisher kit

Manticore/Deathstrike: Hybrid kit combining the two 'missile launcher' vehicles from the codex. Expected to cost the the same as a Demolisher kit. 

Eldar:

Fire Prism/Nightspinner: Full plastic Kit. Fire Prism crystal/turret is said to get a redesign making it slimmer and more in line with the Forgeworld MkII superheavy tanks. Nightspinner will have rules within the white dwarf for use in eldar armies. Probable price increase to match the Demolisher Kit.

Support Weapon Battery: Plastic versions of the eldar heavy support weapons. Vibro cannon, D-cannon, and Shadow weaver.

Cobra/Scorpion Superheavy Tank: Small whispers about a possible plastic superheavy for the army. However it is now believed to not be part of this release.

Orks:

Warbuggy/Wartrakk/Skorcha Kit: Vague information on this, however CAD drawings have been seen a good while back but apparently the design has been scrapped for something else."


----------



## Stephen_Newman

Forget this I will NOT buy a nightspinner.

Since this new supplement is about tank fighting then why release a tank with S6 AP- guns. This will do nothing on tanks oh and also HAS to get a penetrating hit and then roll a 6 because it has no AP. WTF??????

Here is to hoping that the tank is an all new creation. Not an existing variant.


----------



## TheKingElessar

Seeing a new Ork Warbuggy would be nice, it's the oldest plastic model still in the 40k range, by about 5 years!


----------



## Pssyche

A Games Workshop employee told me this week that he's heard they'rebringing out a plastic Cobra Heavy Grav Tank. I would presume that a it would come with enough components to make the Scorpion as well, although that's just me speculating. But they did re-tool the Baneblade to come with several variants so here's hoping.


----------



## Sethis

TheKingElessar said:


> Seeing a new Ork Warbuggy would be nice, it's the oldest plastic model still in the 40k range, by about 5 years!


You're forgetting our very own Jetbikes! :biggrin:

And yeah, looking through the GW site, it's just us and Orks that have to put up with 2nd Ed models. Everyone else has a full range of 3rd and beyond.


----------



## TheKingElessar

Ah. Yes, yes I did.


----------



## Tel Asra Nejoar

i add that sisters are predominantly 2nd edition models, just to add to your list:grin:


----------



## Don_Keyballs

Who really cares about Sisters anyways... everyone knows Eldar is the only army people should care about!


----------



## Sethis

Tel Asra Nejoar said:


> i add that sisters are predominantly 2nd edition models, just to add to your list:grin:


No they're not. Sisters didn't exist in Second Edition. Neither did Grey Knights, Tau, Dark Eldar or Necrons (unless you count the exactly 3 models that they got: Scarabs, Warriors and a Destroyer). :so_happy:


----------



## Cyklown

A Nightspinner? Seriously?

And... it built into the FP kit, so I have to pay more for sprues I don't even remotely want?

It's a terrible gun that fails at life. Additionally, the one thing that it does poorly is largely irrelevant and not needed. Loading utter crap into a slot that is one of our only ways of taking quality is NOT a good way to sell kits.


----------



## Kettu

Sethis said:


> No they're not. Sisters didn't exist in Second Edition. Neither did Grey Knights, Tau, Dark Eldar or Necrons (unless you count the exactly 3 models that they got: Scarabs, Warriors and a Destroyer). :so_happy:


Yeah, they did. got a 2nd ed codex and everything. 3rd ed gave them a new canoness, Saint Celestine and a tank upgrade sprue.

They even predated GK, Tau, DE and Necs.


----------



## TheKingElessar

Sethis said:


> No they're not. Sisters didn't exist in Second Edition. Neither did Grey Knights, Tau, Dark Eldar or Necrons (unless you count the exactly 3 models that they got: Scarabs, Warriors and a Destroyer). :so_happy:


Sorry, but Sisters and Necrons were introduced at the Battle of Sanctuary 101 in 2nd Ed, and GKs were (basically) invented in 2nd Ed.

DE and Tau though, you're right. Chaos Eldar existed in the fluff from RT days though.

EDIT: It was WD 216 brought the Necrons into the game, with a free warrior model with 217.


----------



## Stephen_Newman

I REALLY hope the cobra kit is true. Even if for apoc only then I would invest up to about 80 quid for one.

Better than nightspinner anyway. I believe the redone ork buggy is wishlisting since the WD was pretty adamant that the focus was on guard and eldar.


----------



## VanitusMalus

Anyone remember those Daemonhunter models in Terminator armour? I wish I could get ahold of those models, they were pretty kick ass


----------



## bitsandkits

VanitusMalus said:


> Anyone remember those Daemonhunter models in Terminator armour? I wish I could get ahold of those models, they were pretty kick ass


you mean these guys ? they are almost 20 years old now and still very nice models,jes goodwin has an uncanny knack of producing iconic models

http://www.solegends.com/citcat911/c2018smgreyknightterminator-h.htm


----------



## VanitusMalus

hell yeah, I use to also love the other two. The hooded guy and the one with the long hair and goatee. I think they were Inquisitors in terminator armour.


----------



## Bubblematrix

Stephen_Newman said:


> I believe the redone ork buggy is wishlisting since the WD was pretty adamant that the focus was on guard and eldar.


I don't have the time to go and look it up, but iirc the combined buggy model has been rubished. Anyway, orks are getting a 12-18month spell of FW love so I can't see them getting plastic kits in that period, that and they already have a tonne of kits.


----------



## MaidenManiac

Sethis said:


> Neither did Grey Knights, Tau, Dark Eldar or Necrons (unless you count the exactly 3 models that they got: Scarabs, Warriors and a Destroyer). :so_happy:





Kettu said:


> Yeah, they did. got a 2nd ed codex and everything. 3rd ed gave them a new canoness, Saint Celestine and a tank upgrade sprue.
> 
> They even predated GK, Tau, DE and Necs.





bitsandkits said:


> you mean these guys ? they are almost 20 years old now and still very nice models,jes goodwin has an uncanny knack of producing iconic models
> 
> http://www.solegends.com/citcat911/c2018smgreyknightterminator-h.htm


Was going to point towards the "good old RT GK terminator models" but *BitsandKits* fixed that smoothly. Regarding Necrons there has been pictures of a "Space Android" even back in the RT rulebook, which were the base concept of the Necrons, so they have been around loosely for a damn long time. DE are basically the RT edition "Eldar Pirates" which were common back then, but were revamped to be less alike their craftworld equivalent.
SoBs were defo 2nd ed units, not sure if they were represented in RT though.

The only "new" invention is the Tau army...


----------



## Warlock in Training

The newest invention was Tau, the only invention that was uninvented was the Squats. Fair trade it seems .

Hey Eldar players, sorry you got screwed again, you all must be sore by now, thats why I sold my Eldar for Chaos.


----------



## Cyklown

Hey, at least DE will get a codex that actually works in 5th ed.

Chaos has... well, there's two viable Khorne lists and one viable Nightlords list. The rest of Chaos is firmly in... 4th. Ish. 4th with no fluff whatsoever.


----------



## major soma

The rules for the new eldar tanks will be in an issue of WD. My local GW store confirmed it


----------



## major soma

The rumours are mentioned in the new WD :biggrin: more tanks for my Guard and two Eldar kits plus some metal kits being made into plastic


----------



## Cyklown

Hey, maybe we'll get plastic FD! lawl.

Actually, precodex plastic FDs would probably be a surefire sign that they were getting full nerf-bat action. Teasting us with plastics and not releasing them until the codex comes out is the only safe possibility.


I'm looking forward to the first teaser picks of the Prisms, in any case. I'm dirty consumer whore whenever it comes to things with wraithbone chassis. A lust-filled dirty consumer whore at that.


----------



## Sethis

The smart bet is Plastic Support Weapons, Cyklown.

Aspect Warriors won't be made plastic until they find a way to put multiple aspects in a single box, which is never going to happen. Why would they plasticise something that most players only have 6-10 of in their army? And even then, the vast majority of players don't use Hawks, Spears, Reapers or Spiders.

I can see myself converting to Dark Eldar as soon as they get a new dex. Depressingly.


----------



## Cyklown

Yes, but I wouldn't buy those either. I have Hawks, Spears and the last generation of reapers. Gorgeous models, all. Just... not any good.

And hey, people will need 18 fire dragons plus 3 exarchs, right?
If they just expanded Dire Avengers to an extra sprue for each aspect warrior (arms, shoulders, helmets, weapons, etc. could be handled in a sprue) and go wild. It'd be great for autarchs on jetbikes, to boot.


----------



## TheKingElessar

Spears are the only Aspect I don't have double figures of...well, Spears and Reapers - think I have 8 Reapers.

I also have some unassembled Support Weapons, and some RT ones.


----------



## Crimson Shadow

Personally I would love plastic Aspect warriors. I need to round out my squads, and work on a 3rd complete set of all of them.


----------



## Stephen_Newman

I could see plastic support weapons but top of my wishlist is a box of 5 wraithguard and a plastic spiritseer. I mean if terminators are more expensive points wise than wraithguard then surely they could factor in at 25 pounds.

At the moment wraithguard a troops choice of wraithguard costs a measly 87 pounds!! Making them the most expensive troops choice available in the 40K universe that I know of. Rectify this GW!!!


----------



## Cyklown

Except Wraithguard are terrible. Let them wait the three years we've got till the next dex comes out (y'know, right before the next set of rules screw us over again). When they make WG not bad then let them set some plastics for them. I'm sick as all hell of getting more gorgeous, unplayable models. I'm just glad they they downgraded the reapers from "fucking awesome" grade to "well, it's better than the 2nd-3rd ed reaper models, but that doesn't really mean much" when the released the newest set. Now I no longer have to see gorgeous pictures of the reapers I won't be fielding in the batreps I read. Instead I'll be able to see ugly pictures that make me glad I won't be using them.


----------



## TheKingElessar

You mean 3rd-4th. 

Also, I was told today that it won't be a Prism, unless it's as a multiple turret kit.

And that Aspects could be amongst the 'several' plastic kits. For accuracy of material, I'd say 6.5/10.


----------



## Cyklown

Well, the 3.5 figures (ie, the ones with the picks in C:CWE) were amazing. The stupid purple point hats of doom ones were.... terrible, but it amazing how good GW is at taking a good model and rereleasing it as crap while leaving other models basically untouched.


No prisms wouldn't be the end of the world. It's not like I don't have a few spare falcon chassis that just need a few bits to be good to go. While it is rather obnoxious having the model be so freakishly top-heavy, the easy of stripping means that I never have to be satisfied with my paintjob on the crystal iteself.

Aspect's will be cool. Lord knows one can have fun with plastics.


----------



## TheKingElessar

Well, the Sanguinary Guard's wings bodes well for Hawks... (Did I really say that...???)

I want new Warp Spiders!!!!!!!!! Stupid ass 1995(?) models!


----------



## bitsandkits

Stephen_Newman said:


> I could see plastic support weapons but top of my wishlist is a box of 5 wraithguard and a plastic spiritseer. I mean if terminators are more expensive points wise than wraithguard then surely they could factor in at 25 pounds.
> 
> At the moment wraithguard a troops choice of wraithguard costs a measly 87 pounds!! Making them the most expensive troops choice available in the 40K universe that I know of. Rectify this GW!!!


I agree with you but i think that wraith guard along with alot of other eldar units need expanding within there given roles, an example would be dark reapers , would be nice if they could have shrunken cannons or missle launchers like back in the day and in the case of the wraith guard they should have a close combat version like the old ghost warriors.
Plastics for most aspects at the moment would be pointless as they only have 1 weapon available so no point knocking out an expensive tool. i would be happy keeping metal aspects but need more variety in both choice and metal models as some of the aspects warriors have 2 troopers models and a exarch only, which is a bit poor when most of the rest of the army isnt customisable.


----------



## Stephen_Newman

The only priblem with this is that realistically they would only be implemented in a new codex. I have never understood why guardians could never get a wraithcannon platform since a wraithguard can hold one and use it as an assault weapon.

Weird.

By the by the wraithguard do not suck. A neat way of using them is to target small but expensive squads and terminate them in one go. I recently used 5 in a couple of games to decimate a wraithlord and even mephiston! (wraithcannon AP2 and no invun save on either wraithlord or new mephiston made them easy targets!!) Just be sure to have a combat character like an autarch, avatar or phoenix lord to engage the nearest enemy so the wraithguard keep shooting.


----------



## Cyklown

Stephen_Newman said:


> By the by the wraithguard do not suck. A neat way of using them is to target small but expensive squads and terminate them in one go. I recently used 5 in a couple of games to decimate a wraithlord and even mephiston! (wraithcannon AP2 and no invun save on either wraithlord or new mephiston made them easy targets!!) Just be sure to have a combat character like an autarch, avatar or phoenix lord to engage the nearest enemy so the wraithguard keep shooting.


No. No they are not what is best in that situation. Fire dragons would have done the job better, for less. The only thing that the WG have over the Fire Dragons is the whole "6 to wound" thing. I suppose against the Lord of Skullfucking Death that's a perk (they did fail to give him EW, did they not? but other than that...

Fire Dragons kill vehicles better. They are more likely to get a pen against av14, and will do more damage with either a glance or a pen than WG will do. They're both so slow that they need vehicles to get around, and then you're paying 19 points, the cost of a warlock, AND a gun downgrade in order to make them better at surviving non-antitank fire. Which... the transport already takes care of.


Play them for fun games. They're a totally awesome unit, but... They were an overpriced poorly configured unit in 4th ed, and then 5th ed nerfed the shit out of them. Pitty them, paint them, long for the new codex to fix them, but please do not demean yourself by defending Wraithguard as a solid or sane choice.


----------



## Desolatemm

I just noticed this thread! yay new eldar!

...wait...night...*gasp* :headbutt:

Honestly though, whose to say that it will remain an utter waste of wraithbone if they release playable rules? They could change its rules like just about everything else that transfered from IA to standard 40k. I'm not going to freak out about it until i'm starring at the stat line.

Plastic prism cannons are only interesting to me for apoc games. Yes I would like to have 18 on the table one day...


----------



## Stephen_Newman

ha ha ha nice one!

Cyklown I never meant to offend you but you are kinda right. I do deploy wraithguard for fun and this makes them more enjoyable (and has a weird knack of making them perform better too....)


----------



## Cyklown

Oh, I'm actually quite hard to actually offend. It's just that I'm a mouthy little bastard with a fairly dark outlook on life. Plus my humor works better when you can hear my tone.

In a "just for fun" game effectiveness matters more, and things like "the tarpit from hell" has a valid place. People will chase those things down out of sheer annoyance.

But... that's a "just for gun" game. You can grief someone using Stupid Queen Tricks in starcraft too, y'know? It just isn't viable outside of goofing off.


----------



## Judas Masias

Here is alittle sneek peak at the June White Dwarf Cover. I think IG are getting Mantacore or Deathstrike Missile Launcher tank or whatever the hell it's called. I found this on BOLS.com.

Take a look at this upcoming White Dwarf cover. Hmm, not only is the Nightspinner referenced by name, but what could that Imperial Guard vehicle be???


View attachment 5816


----------



## Gog

Hmmmm It looks like a Manticor as each of the pictured tanks has 4 missles.

note it says " Rules and Background for New Eldar Night Spinner " so they are putting the rules in a WD, finaly a reason to buy it lol.


----------



## RhYn0

looks like the old epic style manticore to me










bugger I've just gone and built my own manticore aswell


----------



## Barnster

great an artillery ap- tank, thats what eldar players want, I wonder whether it will be easy to convert into a firestorm? If their putting rules in WD its probably a long time till the eldar get a new codex, which is a good thing in a way

That said I'll probably buy one anyway because eldar are cool. As with wraithguard they may not be the best but they are cool, and really fun to paint


----------



## TheKingElessar

I think that cover was an April Fools. Note the lack of WFB and WotR info on the cover...also, the artistic style is very 2002.


----------



## Sethis

I'd also be inclined to ignore that cover completely, it looks nothing at all like any WD released in the past couple of years.


----------



## _link_carsten_

I wonder If they will do stuff for space marines


----------



## _link_carsten_

and i forgot tau


----------



## tu_shan82

I honestly don't see the point of this expansion, I thought Apocalypse was supposed to be the expansion for fighting huge tank battles along with everything else in your collection. But it'll be cheap to buy as it only be the cost of a WD, which I buy anyway (God only knows why I do, it stopped being a hobby resource and became a sales brochure a long time ago), and partly for free as the rest of the supplement will be posted on the website.


----------



## Warlock in Training

_link_carsten_ said:


> I wonder If they will do stuff for space marines



:shok: (Turns around and walks out of the forum) :laugh:


----------



## FiresOfBattle

Yea, is going to be IG, SM, and...mabey Eldar, or Tau.

I think we all just hope *Prays to the Emprah.* That they will have multi tank sets again.... and stronger Predator Sponsoons. T

his will probably just be a lot of tanks that are now, scoreing uints. That way my LR can sit on a Obj and count as controling.


----------



## TheKingElessar

I'd say the Predator will be released with the Baal Sponson design.


----------



## Azkaellon

TheKingElessar said:


> I'd say the Predator will be released with the Baal Sponson design.


but that would save people money....Gw cant let that happen!!!!!!!!

But ya the new Nightspinner should be fun...Im kinda hoping for a cobra or New monolith as well mind you.....(maybe Knight titans...It COULD happen when hell freezes over)


----------



## Bubblematrix

FiresOfBattle said:


> Yea, is going to be IG, SM, and...mabey Eldar, or Tau.





> I wonder If they will do stuff for space marines


FFS come on kiddies READ, there may be 15 pages of this thread now, but if you could be arsed you would know that its IG and Eldar CONFIRMED and others possibly but no evidence yet.

The wonderful thing about forums is they preserve loads of information all of which you can search, read and go back to - if you want to know whats going on rumour wise then feel free to go back and read up.

*rant over*

On another note, the WD front cover is looking increasingly like a fake - but I am not sure either way. On one hand it says exactly what we were expecting, on the other hand...it says exactly what we were expecting


----------



## TheKingElessar

Witch King of Angmar said:


> but that would save people money....Gw cant let that happen!!!!!!!!
> 
> But ya the new Nightspinner should be fun...Im kinda hoping for a cobra or New monolith as well mind you.....(maybe Knight titans...It COULD happen when hell freezes over)


Not really, most people already have the Predators they are going to get, and will replace them for better designed ones. Luckily, I have not.:wink:

As for an Eldar Super-Heavy? I hear tell there will categorically NOT be an Eldar Super Heavy out in June/July.


----------



## tu_shan82

I reckon it's fake, for the simple reason that there is no mention of fantasy or LotR on the cover.


----------



## Bubblematrix

TheKingElessar said:


> As for an Eldar Super-Heavy? I hear tell there will categorically NOT be an Eldar Super Heavy out in June/July.


Thats crap news, what source? I was really hoping for one


----------



## TheKingElessar

A G-Dub source.
Not an especially high ranking one, but one who has a fair chance of knowing.

He did expect a Xenos SH at some stage this year though.


----------



## Bubblematrix

Hmmm, I would hypothesise then that our big Eldar toy will be later on then, but that would suggest nightspinner + ? unless GW go the whole hog and make sepperate nightspinner and plastic fireprism kits.

Damnit GW hurry up with the plastic scorpion or im going to buy a FW one and end up regretting it later


----------



## TheKingElessar

My hypothesis is that it MAY be an Eldar SH, but Xenos also covers Nids and Orks. Nids sales weren't spectacular (thanks internet naysayers, talking trash about the Codex, and by trash, I mean nonsense like 'Oh noes!11 It's shit! Don't buy it!) so a Nid SH is exactly the kind of thing GW do to revitalise sales. Orks are a pretty safe bet too, because they will sell, though I think the Stompa sales were disappointing

If it IS an Eldar one, I'd expect a Nightwing, tbh. As an experiment for Thunderhawks. They know they can do the size okay, now to see if:
a) People buy flyers
b) Structurally they hold okay

??

Speculation, ofc.


----------



## Bubblematrix

I wouldn't expect the nightwing purely on its game role, an interceptor which is awesome at killing other flyers but not great for much else (for the points anyway), Orks - i can't see then doing that with 12months of FW models on the cards, a nid one would be a good bet - but I can see it happening to try and sell more of the poor selling nids.

The big question is what the source which stated that a model would be realeased which would put the Eldar on the same footing as other armies on the superheavy front was alluding to, if they were reliable (and I think they were) then we are expecting something and in the next 12months.


----------



## TheKingElessar

Good point. A Phoenix?


----------



## Bubblematrix

Could well be, no rules on it that would be a problem, its very very useful in all games - only trouble is I just bought one :shok:

Still, I'm sure my apoc army could fit a few more


----------



## TheKingElessar

:laugh:

Well, you never know, if we're back to the Halcyon days of rules in the Dwarf...


----------



## Barnster

lets all pray for a scorpian, cobra or nightwing by the end of the year, or a revenant, I really want a revenant

And when they first advertised spearhead they said their would be more SM stuff, but that could simply be the new Ven Dread and BAs


----------



## Bindi Baji

Barnster said:


> lets all pray for a scorpian, cobra or nightwing by the end of the year, or a revenant


you can pray for that, I on the other hand am going to carry on praying for Shakira, Parminder Nagra & Scarlett Johansson naked in a hot tub waiting for me


----------



## major soma

Looking forward to the new Guard releases and I know a few people looking forward to the eldar releases


----------



## Cyklown

That really depends. If we're getting Nightspinners then I for one am most assuredly not looking forward to that utter garbage.


----------



## TheKingElessar

Bindi Baji said:


> you can pray for that, I on the other hand am going to carry on praying for Shakira, Parminder Nagra & Scarlett Johansson naked in a hot tub waiting for me


If I could give a bazillion Rep for this, I would. Instead, I'll simply picture it...:victory:

Note, I'm not picturing Bindi...and I think I'd add Rhianna. Cos I can.


----------



## spudboy

Cyklown said:


> That really depends. If we're getting Nightspinners then I for one am most assuredly not looking forward to that utter garbage.


Everything Forgeworld has out like that is basically a modified WS/Falcon body with a different turret. A new Eldar tank could concievibly simply be the old body with a new turret with a ton of options, including plastic prism, nightspinners, and whatever else they decided to plop on. The core design can remain the same.

Of course, it might also make sense to redo the heavy support weapons as tanks this way...


----------



## Stephen_Newman

I still maintain and hope in earnest that the new tank is NOT a nightspinner cos it is the biggest waste of money anyone could spend on. I use little used units like dark reapers and wraithguard and I still fail to see what the point of this pathetic excuse of a machine is.

Personally I am STILL hoping it to be a completely new vehicle. Way more fun and potentially more useful!


----------



## Cyklown

spudboy said:


> Everything Forgeworld has out like that is basically a modified WS/Falcon body with a different turret. A new Eldar tank could concievibly simply be the old body with a new turret with a ton of options, including plastic prism, nightspinners, and whatever else they decided to plop on. The core design can remain the same.
> 
> Of course, it might also make sense to redo the heavy support weapons as tanks this way...


Then it wouldn't be a Nightspinner, now would it?

I've already been over what it would be like if we didn't have to deal with that particularly shitty gun. It's still not great, unless it's in fast attack. We'd need a gun that eldar don't currently get or something we can assault out of/shoot out of to be "good".


----------



## Barnster

I think it will be something forgeworld inspired, they have been doing that since the tau got the crazy bad missile tank and cool piranahas, nids got the trygon, etc.

sorry to go back to an older post but nid sales would have been disapointing simply because other than the trygon and the new gargoyles everything else released either sucked or was stupidly expensive. Raveners cost the same as kans to buy in the shop, should be a £20 set at max rather than a £27, I'll just get the metal ones from ebay. all the repackaged gaunts are stupidly more pricy now. The pryrove is useless in a game and the hive guard are pointless as well. All the cool stuff in the codex wasn't released like the terigons, supergun carnifexes, spores and special characters.

They should stop rushing to release codexes and put the horse before the cart again


----------



## Sethis

Barnster said:


> hive guard are pointless as well.


Wait, what? Assault 2 Hunter Killers on T6 models are pointless? They seem to do a decent job raping every transport bar Land Raiders to me...


----------



## davespil

Did they just change the rules for the Hive Guard to make them less awesome? Gargoyles going plastic was good, and I like the Vanomthrope. Yeah, the Pyrovore is useless but the rest of it was pretty good.


----------



## TheKingElessar

Hive Guard are just as good as Zoes - that's the biggest problem with the Codex! lol

It's annoying Tyrannofexes aren't on the shelves, but you got plastic Trygons, FFS! They may be inferior to the T-Fex, but it's still pretty good.


----------



## Wolf_Lord_Skoll

I'd rather a Tyrgon over a Tyrannofex anyday. *Shrugs*


----------



## spudboy

Wolf_Lord_Skoll said:


> I'd rather a Tyrgon over a Tyrannofex anyday. *Shrugs*


You just in the thread.


----------



## FiresOfBattle

Hmmm...mabey this is all one big sham...nah...

I think it might add better rules for raming, I dont think I have ever seen a ram, at lest where i play. 

Fluf ? that related, Why dont SM have any plasma wepons on their tanks, they are the ones that fight CSM most of the time (and pulls a victory away from the IG, who are running away form the hoarde of CSM.)


----------



## spudboy

FiresOfBattle said:


> Hmmm...mabey this is all one big sham...nah...
> 
> I think it might add better rules for raming, I dont think I have ever seen a ram, at lest where i play.
> 
> Fluf ? that related, Why dont SM have any plasma wepons on their tanks, they are the ones that fight CSM most of the time (and pulls a victory away from the IG, who are running away form the hoarde of CSM.)


Reread your Razorback entry, then. You can strap on TL plasma guns. Also, there are options on one of the land raider variants for similar (I think).

Eldar + ramming = sounds like you've been reading Rage's write-up.

So far the only tanks with a real ramming preference seem to be Orks, which is of course a little silly. CSM should be into that, possibly others as well.


----------



## TheKingElessar

CSM don't have a 5th Ed Codex though. Ramming didn't exist when they came out.


----------



## Bubblematrix

spudboy said:


> Eldar + ramming = sounds like you've been reading Rage's write-up.


When the fireprism has no guns left and objectives arent an option - go for the ram GO FOR THE RAM! :grin:


----------



## RhYn0

any one else noticed the highlights on the games workshop sight, where it says about free shipping in April it's got a picture of a manticore (pic from the guard codex) next to it. Could be a subtle clue of whats to come

Steve


----------



## Stephen_Newman

It is possible. I suppose


----------



## Bubblematrix

Damnit, we neeed a superheavy - I just got my arse handed to me again in apocalypse by orks - the sunstorm squadron just doesn't cut it and I can't afford £130 for a cobra


----------



## Stephen_Newman

Luckily for me a recent large cash influx saw me aquire a revenant titan. It just can't stop squishing the marines that are stupid enough to walk in front of it.


----------



## FiresOfBattle

spudboy said:


> Reread your Razorback entry, then. You can strap on TL plasma guns. Also, there are options on one of the land raider variants for similar (I think).
> 
> Eldar + ramming = sounds like you've been reading Rage's write-up.
> 
> So far the only tanks with a real ramming preference seem to be Orks, which is of course a little silly. CSM should be into that, possibly others as well.


No LR variant w/ plasma.     :cray:

I was just talking about ramming in general.


----------



## Stephen_Newman

Enough land raiders already. Some armies (eldar and tau the only ones I know of) do not even get a single vehicle with AV 14 anywhere and you are moaning that you need another tank with AV 14 all round. That just takes the mickey.


----------



## Wolf_Lord_Skoll

Stephen_Newman said:


> Enough land raiders already. Some armies (eldar and tau the only ones I know of) do not even get a single vehicle with AV 14 anywhere and you are moaning that you need another tank with AV 14 all round. That just takes the mickey.


So? If all armies had all the same choices, it would be rather boring. Anyways, Falcons are hard as nails to take down anyway,


----------



## Stephen_Newman

Only if given the right tools


----------



## Sethis

By "Tools" I assume you mean a Holofield and intelligent movement decisions?

Statistically speaking, versus a lot of firepower, Falcons are harder to kill than Land Raiders.


----------



## Stephen_Newman

I know but it just annoys me since If I wanted holo fields on a wave serpent then a lot of people would argue that it would be unfair. It is just the same that I think yet another land raider is a bit too much.


----------



## Cyklown

Well, while it's "harder" to kill with a lascannon or meltagun, it's arbitrarily easier to kill with missile launchers and autocannons. Or heavy bolters, powerfists, etc.


----------



## Sethis

Oh yeah, no argument from me that another Land Raider is totally unnecessary, I just don't think that "Eldar don't have one" is the best argument. I'd hate it if they gave us a Land Raider equivalent.

On the other hand, if they gave us a Wave Serpent with the guns and rules of a Storm Raven... I wouldn't say no.


----------



## MaidenManiac

Sethis said:


> On the other hand, if they gave us a Wave Serpent with the guns and rules of a Storm Raven... I wouldn't say no.


Who would, I wouldnt as a Tau player either:wink:


----------



## Bubblematrix

Any assault transport which doesn't cost the world and takes up a redundant FA slot would be nice


----------



## Sethis

MaidenManiac said:


> Who would, I wouldnt as a Tau player either:wink:


In all honesty I'd be amazed if you didn't get an equivalent for Tau. Look at how many pictures there are of Crisis suits jumping out of flyers... Just screams "Valkyrie analogue" to me, as well as providing you with a new vehicle(s?) and tactics. Especially considering the step they've taken by allowing the Raven to hold a Dreadnought AND infantry... I definitely predict a transport capable of holding 3 Crisis Suits and a Fire Warrior team in your next dex.


----------



## Cyklown

Meh. There are enough landraiders out there. How about they stop making landraider variants for anyone, stop giving armies things that other codices that are begging for a rewrite used to have as their own special treasure and call it even?

A FA slot transport would actually be better for Eldar, since we could then put Rangers and Harlies in it.


----------



## Lash Machine

Sethis said:


> In all honesty I'd be amazed if you didn't get an equivalent for Tau. Look at how many pictures there are of Crisis suits jumping out of flyers... Just screams "Valkyrie analogue" to me, as well as providing you with a new vehicle(s?) and tactics. Especially considering the step they've taken by allowing the Raven to hold a Dreadnought AND infantry... I definitely predict a transport capable of holding 3 Crisis Suits and a Fire Warrior team in your next dex.


And the model will be produced to the same high standards of the thunder wolves and storm raven. :grin:


----------



## Stephen_Newman

In all honesty I agree with the tau getting a flyer. Hopefully something like an orca but with guns.

However I doubt that it will ever have a set of rules since GW only give flyers to loyalist armies. This is evidenced by the fact that the 3 most airborne races (both eldar and tau) have zilch when it comes to aircraft.

commenting on above comment I presume that has a hint that no such model will be produced. Well anyone could tell you it would be easy to get some fantasy wolves and sit spacd wolf bikers on them (although the best models I saw had some space wolves on lions from the high elf chariot-shame about the paint job) and a storm raven model will likely be released when they redo the GK since it is extensively used by them, or so we are told in the BA codex.

See you later


----------



## Cyklown

Er, DE was the first race to be able to DS their transports, AFAIK. Eldar and Tau don't have 5th ed codii. Comparing non-5th ed codii to 5th ed codii is fallacious.

If there's any justice, Eldar skimmers will, among SO many other things, have deepstrike with the safety of a drop pod as a default, since they're capable of true flight. Having it count as moving flat-out when it comes in as well would certainly make a ton of sense as well. We'll see, though.


----------



## Blue Liger

On the note of flyers I could see this being the next step for 40k in 6th ed as many said it would be for 5th ed but didn't occur due to it being too much rule change, and for those vehicles that are skimmers that could be flyers - valkyries and storm ravens all they would need is a FAQ saying change Type: Skimmer to Type: Flyer


----------



## FiresOfBattle

Stephen_Newman said:


> Enough land raiders already. Some armies (eldar and tau the only ones I know of) do not even get a single vehicle with AV 14 anywhere and you are moaning that you need another tank with AV 14 all round. That just takes the mickey.


i wasn't moaning, i was just saying from a flulf point of view Plasma LR makes since, SM fight CSM alot... and its only fair that one army gets a brick with wheels. And a Plasma LR would not have Troop Transport anyway. 

You know why Eldar + Tau dont have AV 14. They are armies that move a lot.

Tau need a flyer like....well tau need more plasma guns. or a new Dex...


----------



## bitsandkits

i would have thought we would have seen some photos by now? or at least some confirmations of whats coming.


----------



## Bubblematrix

You took the words from my mouth, I was just counting the months out last night and realised we would normally have seen something concrete by now.
Though saying that GW has been pretty good a keeping sources quiet in the last few months (since their crackdown on pre-official release popularity).

Not even getting glimpses of anything Eldar related this leads me to guess that either - its the dissapointing nightspinner and is so dull that GW staff don't think it worth leaking, or theres something nicer on the horizon and GW staff in contact with it are being silenced - my pessimistic guess is the former.

I really do hope we get something useful however, our latest apocalypse game hilighted how Eldar find it very hard to fight on equal terms with superhevaies without £130+ FW models.


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## subtlejoe

Blue Liger said:


> On the note of flyers I could see this being the next step for 40k in 6th ed as many said it would be for 5th ed but didn't occur due to it being too much rule change, and for those vehicles that are skimmers that could be flyers - valkyries and storm ravens all they would need is a FAQ saying change Type: Skimmer to Type: Flyer


In The White dwarfs around the Valk model release date, they stated that the Valkyrie counts as a flyer in Apoc. Which is nice.


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## TheKingElessar

Cyklown said:


> Er, DE was the first race to be able to DS their transports, AFAIK. Eldar and Tau don't have 5th ed codii. Comparing non-5th ed codii to 5th ed codii is fallacious.
> 
> If there's any justice, Eldar skimmers will, among SO many other things, have deepstrike with the safety of a drop pod as a default, since they're capable of true flight. Having it count as moving flat-out when it comes in as well would certainly make a ton of sense as well. We'll see, though.


Point 1) LMAO - paraphrase much? 
2) I was having this very conversation yesterday, lmao. It's been a running theme since the 'Raven came out, amongst myself and a friend. Ceramite-esque plating for ALL the Eldar exo-atmospheric craft. Even Vypers. If I can do re-entry, then a Microwave gun can't hurt me, either.


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## Cyklown

1) If at first it doesn't get through people's skulls, the some good citizen with too much time on their hands ought to find the biggest mallet thay can along with a funnel and ram it through their ears.

2) Fuck yes.


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## TheKingElessar

<3

:laugh:


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## Stephen_Newman

Heeey since the new WD is out we now know that the model for the new eldar tank will be shown on the website.

Looking forward (praying it is not a nightspinner)


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## chromedog

Oh it is, it even gets named on the cover of that month's WD. Above the WD title block.
Rules AND background on the "new" tank (not new, but unless it gets a 5" blast and multiple barrage it's still going to suck harder than a dyson. ).

The kit is supposed to do both, though. Not bad considering that while the Falcon WAS listed in the 2nd ed codex, it didn't arrive for a couple of years afterwards.


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## bishop5

I really, really hope they don't give the Imperial Guard the (frankly) gash model of the Manticore based on the epic 40k version. God I hate that...


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## Daniel Harper

Just thought I'd share this with you all.
View attachment 5949


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## Bubblematrix

> Unleash the armoured fury





> sweeping tank battles





> brutal mechanised assaults


Am I the only person seeing some kind of "kick in the teeth then handed the broken teeth back" motion of making these kind of statements then giving Eldar a Nightspinner :suicide:


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## Horacus

Daniel Harper said:


> Just thought I'd share this with you all.
> View attachment 5949


The funny thing is that I'll be getting that issue in 6 months...


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## Daniel Harper

Ok, this isn't confirmed but today at my FLGS a GW employee actually advised me not to spend money. This was as I told him I play Guard and we started talking about the new kits. According to him there will be two kits. One will be the Manticore/Deathstrike, while the other kit will be the Leman Russ Exterminator/Vanquisher/Eradicator. However he said that he doesn't know if the original tank will be recut. Both kits should be around £30 and also he said watch the website around 2nd-4th May as this should be when the pre-orders for these kits as well as the Eldar tanks should be available.

As to whether he is correct with this information we'll see.


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## TheKingElessar

Daniel Harper said:


> Ok, this isn't confirmed but today at my FLGS a GW employee actually advised me not to spend money. This was as I told him I play Guard and we started talking about the new kits. According to him there will be two kits. One will be the Manticore/Deathstrike, while the other kit will be the Leman Russ Exterminator/Vanquisher/Eradicator. However he said that he doesn't know if the original tank will be recut. Both kits should be around £30 and also he said watch the website around 2nd-4th May as this should be when the pre-orders for these kits as well as the Eldar tanks should be available.
> 
> As to whether he is correct with this information we'll see.


Bad News: I bought a Chimera to convert into a Deathstrike...

Good News: I have hardly touched it - I clipped the sprue, and built the tracks and sides.


I may get the best of both worlds here, lol.


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## Wreckferret

Daniel Harper said:


> while the other kit will be the Leman Russ Exterminator/Vanquisher/Eradicator. However he said that he doesn't know if the original tank will be recut. Both kits should be around £30 and also he said watch the website around 2nd-4th May as this should be when the pre-orders for these kits as well as the Eldar tanks should be available.


ARSE, my FW Exterminator turret is sat in a box waiting for me to get home.... :shok:


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## MaidenManiac

Wreckferret said:


> ARSE, my FW Exterminator turret is sat in a box waiting for me to get home.... :shok:


I seriously think you will be more then pleased with your FW turret, the difference in detail between resin and normal plastic is huge, and not to the normal plastics favour:grin:


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## Stephen_Newman

I do hope we find out soon enough what is coming out.


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## Crimson Shadow

Personally I want some more IG artillery. The Medusa and the Manticore specifically. I'm too lazy/broke to buy them from FW.


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## Daniel Harper

Yeah, Crimson Shadow, more artillery would be nice. At least we get the Manticore. With these releases that'd only leave the artillery variants and Hydra left. In my opinion I thought they'd make the Hydra first as I can't see the Deathstrike being a big seller. As in people won't be buying multiple of them outside apocalypse.


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## Wreckferret

MaidenManiac said:


> I seriously think you will be more then pleased with your FW turret, the difference in detail between resin and normal plastic is huge, and not to the normal plastics favour:grin:


I have a FW vanquisher turret which I think is great so I'm not really too upset. Its just nice to know these things _before_ you spend the cash...

Plus i got a Mars pattern hull at the same time (for the vanquisher) so again i cant really complain :so_happy:


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## VanitusMalus

all I can say is "That poor griffon"


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## HOBO

MaidenManiac said:


> I seriously think you will be more then pleased with your FW turret, the difference in detail between resin and normal plastic is huge, and not to the normal plastics favour:grin:


Hell yes..the modified Ryza pattern Turrets are far superior to any of the plastic ones, and add Engine Filters and the Russ transforms from an ugly f....r to a thing of beauty.


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## Azkaellon

Stephen_Newman said:


> I do hope we find out soon enough what is coming out.


One would hope so.....But gw has been pretty good at keeping a lid on stuff lately.......Well Except the whole....Space hulk release...and...Blood Angels.....


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## TheKingElessar

And the fact that I found out today the release date for WFB 8e...


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## VanitusMalus

what's the date?


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## Styro-J

No, no

That's a surprise, and his sources may not like too public leaks.

I'm just glad the thread started to show more attention to I.G.


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## TheKingElessar

10th July. It's on my blog, and at least two threads on here. lol


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## Blue Liger

I can't belive people are still asking the date, it's on the GW site and all GW stores know it's coming the 10th of July


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## bishop5

Does anyone know if GW has released anything (since 5th ed) that didn't resemble the artwork in the codex for that particular unit?

Just thinking about the Manticore... the artwork in the codex is the FW model, but there's talk of it looking like the old (and shit) epic 40k model.


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## RhYn0

Hey all

Just seen this over at Librarium Online haven't seen it posted here yet so I thought I'd put it out their



Soulshade said:


> The new Fire Prism
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And the nightspinner
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Love them both myself. I may have to dust of the Eldar.


[/quote]

I'm not sure how much I like the fire prism looks pretty top heavy and dumb but I'm hoping it will grow on me 

RhYn0


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## spudboy

To slightly modify what I wrote earlier (and to keep the discussion going), I'm hoping the rending part of the Apoc rules stays around. Otherwise... what would be the point?!?

On a side note, is this a possible sign that heavy weapon platforms are on the way out? If the all get mounted on tanks, I would say that makes them more viable. I would particularly be interested in seeing the vibro-cannons ala the old Wave Serpents. They have the new turret. It would be a waste not to get the most out of it.


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## VanitusMalus

yeah but has anyone gotten a picture of the new IG tanks?


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## Stephen_Newman

No because more people cared about the eldar.

Surely this should be sending a message to GW showing that not everyone cares about loyalists or green skinned freaks!


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## Stephen_Newman

Another point I did not see on the nightspinner is at the end it says "a deadly risk to both ---- alike". This means it might be a hazard to your own troops (another reason to not buy one) or has some new powers to make it effective on vehicles.


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## RhYn0

Well the word before alike looks like it ends with les so I'm guessing it's vehicles, will be interesting to see what it does


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## Stephen_Newman

Especially since AP- shots only destroy vehicles on 6's.


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## Styro-J

I'd tie in the "est Aspect" with Warp Spiders who are often called the Bravest Aspect. Who use Warp Jump Generators for fast attacks on the enemy. This method of attack is also a deadly risk to infantry and vehicles alike.

You can lose Warp Spiders with a bad Warp Jump. Something similar would make sense.


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## spitfire6x

I think this would be a great oppotunity to release knight comander pask!!!


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## Capt.Al'rahhem

Why would they need to release a model for Knight Comander Pask? They have several tank commander models and how hard is it to stick a guy out the top hatch of your tank? Ta Dah Pask! Just my opinion, tho.


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## Vaz

Stephen_Newman said:


> No because more people cared about the eldar.
> 
> Surely this should be sending a message to GW showing that not everyone cares about loyalists or green skinned freaks!


You're saying that considering that at least 3 of the design team are well known for their heavy Eldar playing, and hence Bias?

Only thing I'm keen on seeing is the Night Spinner - getting sick of using the Fire Prism rules for it now.


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## spudboy

Wait... support weapons in plastic? The thread is huge now, so I'll just ask... are there pics someplace?


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## Stephen_Newman

The only pics are rumour pics for the new fire prism and nightspinner.


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## Daniel Harper

Ok, I saw the sprue today of the Russ variants. Sadly I couldn't get a picture. Basically it's similar to the Demolisher, one extra sprue with the 3 variants. Exterminator, Vanquisher and Eradicator. Also the original battle cannon is included so this looks to replace the existing Leman Russ kit.They commented on a manticore kit but it wasn't included in the black box.


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## Stephen_Newman

All sounds awesome but has anyone seen the sprues for the other Eldar plastics coming out. I was under the impression the fire prism was not the only one.


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## Daniel Harper

From what I saw today I only found the fire prism parts. Then again they may be holding stuff back, as I said people they say there's a manticore kit but those sprues where absent.


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## TheKingElessar

Daniel Harper said:


> From what I saw today I only found the fire prism parts. Then again they may be holding stuff back, as I said people they say there's a manticore kit but those sprues where absent.


I was told, categorically, that NO other kits will be released that Saturday, for 40k.


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## TheKingElessar

Stephen_Newman said:


> All sounds awesome but has anyone seen the sprues for the other Eldar plastics coming out. I was under the impression the fire prism was not the only one.


[Apologies for double-post.]

The Night Spinner/Fire Prism box IS the only one that day. More Eldar plastics are slated for release, but not the same day. Presumably to fill the gap somewhat between Spearhead and WFB 8e, or between WFB Books early next year?


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## bitsandkits

GW always release models in two drops, one drop at the start of the month and then two weeks later, this helps with production and shipping etc etc


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## VanitusMalus

hmm so we're getting the eldar tank for the beginning and perhaps the IG tank 2 weeks later?


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## TheKingElessar

VanitusMalus said:


> hmm so we're getting the eldar tank for the beginning and perhaps the IG tank 2 weeks later?


Sorry, no, I mean the only _Eldar _release. The Russ box will be the same day.


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## Daniel Harper

So you mean that we will definitely see the Leman Russ and Eldar kit released on the 5th(as we've seen the sprues) and other kits MAY be released 2 weeks along?


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## tu_shan82

Is there any truth behind the rumor of them releasing a re-cut predator for the SM.


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## TheKingElessar

tu_shan82 said:


> Is there any truth behind the rumor of them releasing a re-cut predator for the SM.


Not on the same day as the Prism/Spinner, and Russ/Russ/Russ/Russ boxes.



I have heard probably the same as you, it WILL happen...but when is the question. Probably subtle, like the Chimera.


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## Stephen_Newman

It was announced at the same tiome as Spearhead that more than 1 Imperial guard tank kit will be released as well as several new Eldar plastic kits so we will see some more soon.

Where have you heard about a recut pred? I just thought that it was wishlisting like my plastic wraithguard.


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## TheKingElessar

Honestly don't remember, tbh. There is a noduled piece like on the crest of a Warlock Titan in the Prism/Spinner sprue. Perhaps plastic Wraithguard are indeed a possibility.

I'd say it's probably just going to be Artillery, and maybe a new Jetbike, if we're really lucky.


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## Stephen_Newman

We know that support weapons were among the rumoured. 

However one of the units I never really use because of monetery costs are a seer council so a plastic one would be awesome. They could even make a model of a farseer with lightning coming from his fingers!


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## fynn

BoLS has pics of the new LR sprue up here
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_4nzgPbHlNo4/S-YuJYOaPKI/AAAAAAAAH00/Q0diCiSQEJc/s1600/russ-sprue-01.jpg
to be honest, im not happy with it, i was hopeing they do the turret the same way as the demolisher, where you can easerly swap the main weapons over, but looking at the guns on this one there fixed in the turret for good, so i probaly wont bother buying it now


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## bitsandkits

looks like two of the barrels are interchangeable check the sockets in the red section









also if you magnetise the top and bottom of the turret you could easily swap out the other two, cost you about £1.50 for the magnets and drill bit (green section)


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## yanlou

looks gd, im not to bothered about it been interchangable, as ill be mainly using the vanquisher


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## Styro-J

Interchangeability is seems like it would be all Pro's no Con's, I just wish other tanks will pick up that trick.


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## Stephen_Newman

Just occurred to me that because the stores have the black boxes then the GW web site will publish the prices and pictures of the new tanks this week. Keeping my eyes peeled.


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## Shandathe

Actually... While we've all been talking about tanks, WD264 on page 11 promises 



> In June the Eldar are gaining several new plastic kits, including a brand-new tank.


Obviously, the Nightspinner/Prism is the tank. 'Several' however, should mean '3 or more' Have we IDed all those yet?


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## Stephen_Newman

No because the only definite new kit coming out IS the nightspinner/fire prism. Maybe the prism is one of the several eldar kits in conjunction with the nightspinner.


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## TheKingElessar

bitsandkits said:


> looks like two of the barrels are interchangeable check the sockets in the red section
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> also if you magnetise the top and bottom of the turret you could easily swap out the other two, cost you about £1.50 for the magnets and drill bit (green section)


I've had them in my hands - they are definitely interchangeable.


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## Lord Rahl

does this mean theres a new dex in the not to distant furture?


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## Shandathe

uhrr... Well, I'm sure one will show up EVENTUALLY, right? It's not too distant if you think like a near-immortal Eldar?


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## Daniel Harper

I dunno if anyones picked up on this yet, but www.giftsforgeeks.org.uk is taking pre-orders for Eldar Fire Prism and Support Weapon Platform kits. And the same for Imperial Guard Leman Russ and Deathstrike Missile Launcher kits. No images, dates or information included however the price for the tank kits are £30 and the Platform is £15.


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## spudboy

Checking. No pics up, plus no mention that the fire prism and nightspinner are the same kit (which I am pretty sure they are... maybe I'll go check that again). Still, nice to know where this is going, and that support weapons are now affordable.


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## Stephen_Newman

Depends on how many are in the pack. I would like 2 at least


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## Zodd

Here You are , It's up at GW.


http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/armySubUnitCats.jsp?catId=cat1490603&rootCatGameStyle=

Enjoy:grin:


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## Khazaddum

:goodpost:

Wow I love the manticore/deathstrike kit. :yahoo:



*wonders what the storm eagle rockets would look like on the underside of a valkyrie*:spiteful:


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## bitsandkits

Very disappointed that we have no new jet bikes , on the plus side the rest of the kits are very nice, though i think £6 for Pask is a fecking liberty. The manticore/deathstrike is seriously brilliant.


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## smfanboy

manticore is do want support weapons just something to paint now you realy feel like the aterily is one with the handlers


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## yanlou

having a better pic of the prism now, it looks better then before as you can seem more detail, i like the little crystal at the end of the barrel it makes it look better overall, as for the new leman russ i was expecting the vanquisher barrel to be abit longer but i suppose i could convert it to be longer


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## Daniel Harper

Not what I was expecting the deathstrike or manticore to look like but I am still pleased, June can not come sooner. I'm ordering these now.


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## MaidenManiac

Finally they release that "vehicle command unit" upgrade for Tau









I can recall seeing it a damn long time ago, but not where. The big question is what to use it for....


*edit: LOL wtf? take a look at Pasks left hand, since when did tank commanders have Orgyn sized hands? It will be kind of hard to fit in 2 fingers behind the headset with those big fingers so I guess he only has 4 fingers on each hand...*


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## bitsandkits

Pask is very poor, and he does have the left hand of a teenage mutant ninja turtle.

Im liking the support weapon, i like the idea of being seated to fire.

The leman russ looks good too, i always hated the turret on the old version, the new turret seems to have balanced out the model , i still dont like the tank as i think its far too small but the new one is a vast improvment on the old one.

As others have mentioned the russ should have had a modular swap out main gun for that price, they have reduced the sprue count for the model and removed the accessory sprue so i dont think £30 is fair price but GW will still sell bucket loads.


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## Horacus

The manticore is nice. I think it'll look good corrupted for a Chaos Traitor army I'm working at. Still, I miss the Medusa and the Mortars...


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## Shandathe

Hrmm. As the rules are officially released now, what does everyone think of the Nightspinner? Seems a bit more useful than I expected.


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## Don_Keyballs

To me, the Nightspinner seems only useful against orks without mech and nids that have tons of gaunts. The rule for difficult and dangerous terrain is definetly a boost to it... but for going up against armies that I didn't list above... you still most likely would go with a fire prism as it at least as anti-tank power.


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## Shandathe

Yeah, the FP is better against tanks, but the Nightspinner CAN damage a vehicle (though not easily, and it needs Rending for anything above AV11). Mind you, I don't think it's a replacement for an FP. It's more of an addition - the FP cracks hard targets and the Nightspinner takes care of any infantry. It doesn't need any upgrades as it can safely cower behind cover, which means it stays fairly cheap.


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## TheKingElessar

Shandathe said:


> Hrmm. As the rules are officially released now, what does everyone think of the Nightspinner? Seems a bit more useful than I expected.


I think it is as bad as Reapers or Scorpions.


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## H0RRIDF0RM

The Nightspinner has its place in the Eldar army. I've found it to be useful against Orks and Tyranids. I plan to include one in my Eldar tournament list if I ever play them in a Tournament again


----------



## Geist

Well, decided that I will never buy a basilisk for my IG. Just Manticores. Damn, but I love cluster rockets. :victory:


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## Stephen_Newman

The whole rending and the monofilament wire rules for the night spinner do not make it as bad as it was. The improved strength is good because its main targets (T4 enemies or lower) get wounded on 2's. means lots of armour saves and you know what they say about throwing enough mud up a wall.....

The only way to improve it is to at least give its weapon an AP of 6.

There is no way to justify this but it should have been placed in the fast attack slot rather than heavy support. Places there are overcrowded as it is.


----------



## Nitetime

Saw these. They look awesome imo.


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## Stephen_Newman

Shame nothing else like my dream of plastic wraithguard came out.


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