# Grey Knights heavy weapons & nemesis stave



## Hammer49 (Feb 12, 2011)

I am wondering what everyones take is on the heavy weapons choices. Which one is the most useful generally, as Im currently putting together a few units.

Also I may be missing something, but what is the benefit associated with a nemesis warding stave as it seems that you can take only one in a unit.

Thanks for any help in advance!


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## Neelam (Mar 9, 2011)

Riflemen dreads /w psybolt ammo for heavy support , 4 S8/tl shots per turn for 130 pts .

As for the warding stave i don't think it's worth the points


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## Hurricane (Feb 27, 2010)

Of the three primary heavy weapons, psilencer, incinerator, and psycannon, the psycannon is easily the best. Despite the number of shots th psilencer has, the lack of AP value is horrid imo. The incinerator is ok, but grey knights don't need any help in the anti-infantry department really. Psycannons are fantastic, especially when put on a terminator body since they are then relentless and get the extra shots, rending, etc. Definitely go with psycannons as your default choice.

Warding staves are generally not worth their points, but if you have some spare points at the end of building your list you may want to throw some on some of your important characters. I'm currently playing around with lists of walking crusader squads with a techmarine carrying a stave, rad grenades, and servo skulls so that I can keep casting hammerhand on the squad. It's looking to be very, very fun.


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## Vaz (Mar 19, 2008)

Psilencers have their use in cheapo Deep Strike Objective contesting squads. They have a comparatively low threat level compared to many other units, but are fairly tough. A Free Weapon putting out that amount of firepower gives them an edge, and against Daemons, is basically 3-4 Killed + Bolter fire for 0pts.

On Terminators, I wouldn't take ranged upgrades. Too expensive, and not concentrated enough.

On Paladins, Purgators, and Purifiers, Psycannons are the way to go - Maxed Squads combat squadded shit out a HUGE amount of firepower, and with the relevant asset (Grand Master or Crowe), are able to hold a firebase.


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## Barnster (Feb 11, 2010)

pslincers are the worst choice, because their heavy, the flexability of the psycannon is better on pagks and the termis are better with the psycannon anyway.

I like the staff, for the parts to convert other units, for using it as a staff, not worth the points


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## anarchyfever (May 24, 2008)

If I remember the rules, it only confers the inv save to the unit holding it, and why take an inv save when you can take a conversion beamer for about the same cost.

Also Hvy section to me looks a bit useless, the dreadnought looks nice but can't really keep up with the SS squad and HQ who can all deep strike, empty Rhinos make a nice barrier for the flanks, but Assault cannons with psybolts on Razorbacks would be just as useful as a dread.

Dreadknight looks nice but only for 1500+ pts personally, other wise you need to fill out the troops section a bit more with things like a crusader warband for those pesky blood angels etc.


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## TAU4297 (Feb 19, 2011)

anarchyfever said:


> ...Also Hvy section to me looks a bit useless, the dreadnought looks nice but can't really keep up with the SS squad and HQ who can all deep strike, empty Rhinos make a nice barrier for the flanks, but Assault cannons with psybolts on Razorbacks would be just as useful as a dread...


Well let's compare the to razorback Asscan with psybolt= 4 s7 rending vs riflemen dread's 2 twin-linked psybolt AC's 4 s8 shots that are re-roled once if needed


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## anarchyfever (May 24, 2008)

TAU4297 said:


> Well let's compare the to razorback Asscan with psybolt= 4 s7 rending vs riflemen dread's 2 twin-linked psybolt AC's 4 s8 shots that are re-roled once if needed


Ok, rifleman dread, 2 shots rubbish AP for about 125pts, (thats why your buying a long range weapon, to shoot from afar, not to mention you have a ton of other weapons which are just as good and better for AV)

Against a razorback with assault cannon, +80pts for AV11 at most, 24" range (taking into account every other tank busting weapon is normally over 24" except melta) and 4 shots rending.

I'm sorry but these two units to me just look bad, really bad. Considering you can get a 3+ inv powerweapon wielding guardsmen for way less. 

You would first of all have to do the 3:3 radio for AV, otherwise the enemy will just pick it off. Thats running near 250 for dreads and 160 for razorbacks with assault cannon. 

You see my problem here, Gks already have few men on the ground and your denying them more because you want to use a dread or razorback.



If ya that desperate for long range awesomeness get a monkey and warriors for 1/3 the price.

However if you (or anyone) think that they are worth it feel free to argue your point.


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## Iron_Freak220 (Nov 8, 2009)

Are you implying that a 3+ invul/ power weapon gaurdsman is a better anti- tank choice than a rifleman dread with psybolts?!?!

Sure the crusader is cheap but it has a completely different purpose than the psyrifle dread.

As far as the jokaero goes, 3 S9 shots isnt always better than 4 S8 especially when they're BS3. Now before you go arguing points, you gotta figure that you'll need at least 3 jokaeros to cancel the BS3. Then since they have no save and terrible toughness they have next to zero survivability. So the most logical choice is a chimera. At this point you're pretty close to the points of a psyrifle dread. But you cant move and shoot and you have worse accuracy.


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## asianavatar (Aug 20, 2007)

Anyone consider a small purgation squad or full purgation squad with 4 incinerators in a transport. A full squad with transport is pretty cheap and a half squad is less than 100 points.


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## Bhaal006 (Apr 11, 2010)

x2 TL AC dreads w/psybolt ammo are the ABSOLUTE *BEST* suppressive fire available in the *ENTIRE* game for two very important reasons, The ability to glance AV 14 and ID T4 Units all for a measly 135 points.

Whoever says the NWS isn't worth the points has never lost a Librarian to a PFist. There's a lot of bull about "If you control the situation..." but lets be honest if you could control every situation this wouldn't even be a game, I only buy them for IC's, Usually Techmarines and Librarians.

Side Note: Techmarines got a new lease on life with the GK Codex being the only unit outside of HQ's w/Grenade Options.


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## Iron_Freak220 (Nov 8, 2009)

Yeah i agree with the techmarine comment. Nothing like sticking those incredible grenades in every squad and watching the enemy cry as hes forced to attack himself.


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## anarchyfever (May 24, 2008)

Iron_Freak220 said:


> Are you implying that a 3+ invul/ power weapon gaurdsman is a better anti- tank choice than a rifleman dread with psybolts?!?!
> 
> Sure the crusader is cheap but it has a completely different purpose than the psyrifle dread.
> 
> As far as the jokaero goes, 3 S9 shots isnt always better than 4 S8 especially when they're BS3. Now before you go arguing points, you gotta figure that you'll need at least 3 jokaeros to cancel the BS3. Then since they have no save and terrible toughness they have next to zero survivability. So the most logical choice is a chimera. At this point you're pretty close to the points of a psyrifle dread. But you cant move and shoot and you have worse accuracy.



Monkeys have a 4+ inv from the backpack, you can 12 units (eg warriors) in a warband and with corteaz they can be taken as troops, so times that by your free troop slots.

Dreads are only good when you have just as many units on the board to represent the same threat. When your dread becomes the only long range threat, he is going to be a priority target.


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## anarchyfever (May 24, 2008)

Bhaal006 said:


> x2 TL AC dreads w/psybolt ammo are the ABSOLUTE *BEST* suppressive fire available in the *ENTIRE* game for two very important reasons, The ability to glance AV 14 and ID T4 Units all for a measly 135 points.
> 
> Whoever says the NWS isn't worth the points has never lost a Librarian to a PFist. There's a lot of bull about "If you control the situation..." but lets be honest if you could control every situation this wouldn't even be a game, I only buy them for IC's, Usually Techmarines and Librarians.
> 
> Side Note: Techmarines got a new lease on life with the GK Codex being the only unit outside of HQ's w/Grenade Options.


Vindicare for 10 more pts and you get a 3+4D6 reroll with WS 8 who gets a +save in cover and can pick out targets, the ultimate in tank busting and HQ killing for GKs


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## Barnster (Feb 11, 2010)

I've reconsidered the psilencer on purgation squads, its surprising effective against hordes. and they are very good in heavy terrain boards, where you can use astral sight. With any other weapon a/s becomes a terrible power as incinerators lack the range and psycannons lose to much to the gain of cover saves


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## Jackinator (Nov 18, 2008)

Barnster said:


> I've reconsidered the psilencer on purgation squads, its surprising effective against hordes. and they are very good in heavy terrain boards, where you can use astral sight. With any other weapon a/s becomes a terrible power as incinerators lack the range and psycannons lose to much to the gain of cover saves


Surprisingly good? Why is a heavy 6 weapon surprisingly good against hordes :laugh:?


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