# killing ... high initiative Skaven characters



## Sworn Radical (Mar 10, 2011)

So, my Slaanesh themed WoC will be facing some 2.000 points of Skaven tomorrow. A solid infantry list with something around 120+ clan rats, some rat ogres, some skaven artillery, and about five to six characters. 
I have the means to counter the Grey Seer, and am not much afraid about _'regular'_ hero level characters and the like.
Two models give me pause though ... the high initiative Assassin (which also has ASF) that'll inevitably come for me, and the Skaven warlord with his initiative of seven ... hummm.

I'll be running three characters myself in my 1.997 points list, Throgg to unlock and upgrade my trolls, another hero level character, plus a level four sorcerer lord.

I only played against Skaven once until now, and my tactics worked fairly well overall, but the lord and Assassin make me wonder about viable strategies to counter them or beat them in close combat.
Some things that came to my mind earlier were _'Word of Agony'_, since it's resolved before the initiative order, and of course the sword of swift slaying that grants ASF.
The _'Word' _might have a fair chance to wipe out the Assassin before he can even strike, because against his initiative of eight plus ASF there's not much else to do. Having ASF on my own character would counter his re-rolls, but would still see me go last combat wise. So, simply some heavy protection ? On the other hand, the ASF sword might do well against the skaven lord... 

Thoughts appreciated


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## neilbatte (Jan 2, 2008)

You could just pin him in place with trolls and puke attack him, Acid ichor could be a good deterrant.If you can negate ranks then the beguiling gem is both fluffy and usefull although the Blasphemous amulet could be more effective as i works in the magic phase rather than relying on another flanking unit plus it's cheaper.
If all else fails the Skaven characters have fairly low ST so let the attacks come hope they're not poisonous and smash them before they get another go.


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## Ratvan (Jun 20, 2011)

I got to agree the fear and thought of an assassin is usually much stronger then what they can accomplish in a game. 

I would just let the attacks come at you then smack the rat once done


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## LukeValantine (Dec 2, 2008)

My vamps love letting skaven characters attack them, its like a baby kitten trying to claw a German Shepperd to death.


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## olderplayer (Dec 11, 2009)

A well equipped warlord on a war litter would give a vamp character a bit of trouble, especially if he has the othertrickster's shard.


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## aboytervigon (Jul 6, 2010)

A properly tooled up assassin will probably be more points than what he is going to kill.


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## Skari (Dec 20, 2011)

True, skaven lords can be a pain in the neck. Personally just grinding them down has worked for me, also die to low basic LD the power of the lore of death leech essence works wonders


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## Sworn Radical (Mar 10, 2011)

Thanks for all the feedback people ! 

I agree that the fear factor about that Assassin is a major contributor in this line of thought of mine. Like most characters that are either heavily specialised or simply damn expensive he might not be able to bring back the points he's worth, alright.

I decided to simply add some heavy duty protection (Enchanted Shield & Talisman of Preservation) to my general, the Sorcerer Lord, and invested into the Blasphemous Amulet for the hero character. Wanted to give that item a try anyways, so why don't bring it to the table in this friendly game.
Of course, should the unit which contains the Assassin face off against Throgg and his band of Trolls the problem might not even arise ...


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## Orochi (Jan 28, 2009)

I sincerely doubt that any none-over-spending skaven character is going to give a WoC hero/lord any trouble.

If you're that worried, Sigvald leading a unit of chosen will be a battering ram no skaven unit can stop.

Failing that, spurge out on Archaon for banter.


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## Sworn Radical (Mar 10, 2011)

Yeah, my concern came from the two facts that, *a.) *This was only my second game against Skaven and I still don't know s**t about them, and *b.) *In my Slaanesh themed list most characters (excluding Throgg whom I only take when running trolls) will be sorcerers, with _'only'_ five initiative to go.

In any case, the game was a complete wipeout. 1.997 points of Slaanesh WoC went down on 2.000 points of Skaven without losing a single unit ...


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## Stephen_Newman (Jul 14, 2009)

Orochi said:


> I sincerely doubt that any none-over-spending skaven character is going to give a WoC hero/lord any trouble.


I disagree. Any Skaven Warlord with the Fellblade is definitely going to give any character with I7 or less a good run for their money. Giving the Skaven character S10 in combat and forcing opponents to reroll successfull ward saves and each wound doing D6 is horrible for an army that has to enter challenges. I have done it to Warriors of Chaos at 1000 points and it hurts badly.

My advice would be to mainly ignore the Assassin. If he hides it then the rules state that he has to have written down which unit it is hidden in to prove he is not cheating. Although its likely to be the biggest Skaven block on the table. Unless tooled up heavily then its not really going to cause many problems although Throgg is probably the best bet to kicking it around.

As for the Warlord again mainly ignore it if your opponent has tooled it up instead of making it cheap and focus on leadership for the army. Then using a tough unit (most likely Chaos Warriors) to beat the Skaven characters unit through combat res to make him run. Best unit it will hide with is either Stormvermin or not much else. More likely you will face Clanrats which are piss easy to kill in combat.


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## Sworn Radical (Mar 10, 2011)

Stephen_Newman said:


> ...
> My advice would be to mainly ignore the Assassin.
> ...


This is what I did, worked well enough.



> ...
> although Throgg is probably the best bet to kicking it around.


Yup, that was my line of thought exactly. Yet, it never came to that situation.



> ...
> to beat the Skaven characters unit through combat res to make him run.


This is how I finished the Warlord, the massive block of Skaven ... and actually the game itself.
Like mentioned in my above post, it was a complete wipeout. :drinks:


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## aboytervigon (Jul 6, 2010)

It is INCREDIBLY hard to beat skaven through combat res, if there a good skaven player they will have LD 10 Re-rollable and also be stubborn cause there bound to have more guys than you.


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## Tim/Steve (Jan 25, 2009)

Flank skaven (and negate ranks) and they'll crumble just like anyone else: they'll be steadfast at their basic LD, which at 6-7 isn't that impressive, even with the BSB reroll.


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## LukeValantine (Dec 2, 2008)

Or you know just hit them with units that can strip 3-4 ranks a turn. Like khornate warriors with hand weapons, or monstrous infantry. Mind you that this isn't a option for some armies.


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## aboytervigon (Jul 6, 2010)

Like tomb kings .


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## Sworn Radical (Mar 10, 2011)

aboytervigon said:


> It is INCREDIBLY hard to beat skaven through combat res, if there a good skaven player they will have LD 10 Re-rollable and also be stubborn cause there bound to have more guys than you.


Obviously. But relentless hacking and slaying from my _'24-attacks-per-round'_ Warrior units had them dissolving rather quickly to be honest.
Also, I had the good fortune (or tactical skill) to simply bind two large Skaven units with my single hoard of Marauders, ready to be torn apart from the flank by the Warriors and some Trolls.


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