# IG Rumours - CLOSED. See 'Part 2'



## Jezlad

Thanks to Bigred over at *BoLS* for this.



> Hi everybody,
> 
> Word on the wind this cold December morning says:
> 
> *Codex*
> The IG Codex is slated for release in the first week of May.
> 
> There is a new HQ choice referred to as a "Fleet Officer". This fine chap gives you access to different types of orbital bombardments every turn. There are other officer "types" to select from that give other abilites including a Commissar Lord.
> 
> *Models*
> New Commissar Lord is available as a new HQ choice with dual models.
> 
> Plastic Command Squads; Cadians and Catachans are said to both be getting plastic command squads.
> 
> Infantry Squad Recuts; Infantry boxes are rumored to be repackaged as 2 sprues containing eight guardsmen and a single heavy weapon team in each box; similar to what was done to the Eldar Guardian kits.
> 
> Plastic Stormtroopers are on the way.
> 
> Plastic Valkyrie is on the way. This is said to be a transport option for the Stormtroopers and possibly other select squads. Kits have been visually spotted. The Valkyrie will be interesting as it is said to be a skimmer only in the codex. The idea is that flyers never exist in "straight 40k" so the Valkyrie keeps its flyer/skimmer modes as published only in Apocalypse. Price is said to be £35/US$50, and the kit is fairly large (roughly Land Raider sized)


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## Wolf_Lord_Skoll

Good find Jez. It seems like instead of special characters changing the army, normal characters can. I hope thats so, gives an army a more personal feel.


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## Soundwarp

I like the sounds of that!


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## chrisman 007

This is going to be great! I hope these rumours are true!


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## fynn

well if it is true, let hope theres a good range of characters to suit everyones style of play, and not be stuck with the way MR jarvis wants us to play the game (his way and be screwed over on the guard).
i will take a wait and see position at the mo until more info appears from GW itself


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## bishop5

Nice find! About time the guard got some orbital love and plastic valks? Yummy!


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## comrade

damn it Jez... now I gotta go delete my thread.. you beat me to it.

Recutting the sprue... bad.

Cause we all know it will cost about $22 for 10 men, instead of $35 for 20


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## Djinn24

Well it looks llike my Army plans will be moving forward.


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## Lord Sinkoran

Commissar lord, interesting


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## Menathorn

Are there going to be any Great Coats for the Guard then?


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## Katie Drake

I like that Fleet Commander idea, even though I doubt it'll be very useful in-game (sorta like the current Space Marine Chapter Masters and how their Orbital Bombardment isn't terribly effective).

I must say that although the Guard are being repackaged into 10 man boxes, it'll be nice to have heavy weapons (and hopefully special weapons that don't suck) all in one box.


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## Steel Rain

I guess I like the idea of the heavy weapons being packaged in. It brings them more in line with the rest of the 40k universe.


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## EndangeredHuman

Commissar Lord you say? Interesting, I love Commisssars and will definatly pick it up. All of it sounds wonderful, sadly the infantry recut doesn't sound at all plesant... I rather liked the idea of having mountains of troops rather than heavy weapons.. I guess it could be worse. Probably 12 troops to a heavy weapon still sounds respectable.


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## Underground Heretic

I like the current box of Cadians. While I haven't played guard or bought any Cadians, the idea of getting 20 guys for $35 (US) is a better deal than you can get with orks. That's $1.50 (US) per Cadian and roughly 1.75 (US) per ork with Da Green Tide box or $2.20 (US) for the box of Boyz. But if the 4 point guardsman rumor is correct, then the price might drop. If I didn't have enough to paint and play, I'd start guard soon.


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## leinad-yor

I like guard infantry and heavy weapons the way they are. If I need more troops I get more troops and the same for heavy weapons. On that note will they still sell the heavy weapon squad box? Will there still be HW squads and if so will I have to buy 3 boxes of infantry to get one?

If they recut the infantry will we finally get plastic plasma and melta weapons for our infantry? Or will we need to load up on plastic command squads to get them?

So far the only thing I'm really looking forward to is the plastic stormtroopers and valkyries. It will make it so much easier for DH and WH armies to build up on troops.


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## ACoz

First week in May?

Just in time for me to treat myself to a birthday present!


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## Degzi

i thought the background on comissars didn't allow for that with gaunt being the exception to the rule


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## Steel Rain

Degzi said:


> i thought the background on comissars didn't allow for that with gaunt being the exception to the rule


No no. A commissar lord is a rank within the Commissariat.


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## MarzM

Degzi said:


> i thought the background on comissars didn't allow for that with gaunt being the exception to the rule


You would be correct in this. It is not common for a commissar to be in charge (unless due to the Emperor benediction lol). However it did happen every now and again, Yarrick at tempest hive for example.

However, i would never be amazed if GW were to change their own background (aye the world eaters were white and blue! Whatever!)

There has been a couple of rumours flying about. The one i am interested in is the supposed appendix that deals with traitor guard. They have a different command structure and apparently they might get an appendix to deal with that. If that is true i will be might happy. Guard will take care of themselves, i just hope everything in the army becomes feasible not just a few things.


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## Katie Drake

MarzM said:


> There has been a couple of rumours flying about. The one i am interested in is the supposed appendix that deals with traitor guard. They have a different command structure and apparently they might get an appendix to deal with that. If that is true i will be might happy. Guard will take care of themselves, i just hope everything in the army becomes feasible not just a few things.


I cannot express how happy this would make me. Traitor Guard really are worth exploring outside of Apocalypse and seeing rules for them right in the Guard Codex would be amazing.


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## Lord_Murdock

The Fleet Officer sounds interesting... Some more ranged support for my basilisks can't hurt!


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## MarzM

Katie Drake said:


> I cannot express how happy this would make me. Traitor Guard really are worth exploring outside of Apocalypse and seeing rules for them right in the Guard Codex would be amazing.


Well i'll give you another little rumour. I was told that GW were experimenting with conscripts. 

They wouldn't take up a FoS but counted as troops and came with both a commissar (of some type) and a heavy bolter platoon. All well and good. However if you fail a leadership test and run away you have to shoot your own unit a la "enemy at the gates"


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## warhammergrimace

sounds like some good changes are possibly on the way, a wait and see now.


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## MaidenManiac

Katie Drake said:


> I cannot express how happy this would make me. Traitor Guard really are worth exploring outside of Apocalypse and seeing rules for them right in the Guard Codex would be amazing.


You are far from alone on that one Katie

Tbh they more or less need to do something about it, there are lots of "Lost and the Damned" armies out there which cant be played atm. It cant be that hard to include that in an uppcoming Codex, and it would really make the IG codex alot more intresting:biggrin:


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## Wolf_Lord_Skoll

It won't be an appendix. They have gotten rid of all of those and I don't see them bringing them back anytime soon. I guess they will just make the army list itself to be able to reflect the Traitor Guard.


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## officer kerky

its gonna suck the new guard sprues 8 guardsmen and 1 heavy weapon team i personaly prefer the 20guardsmen so i can get a onne of models.


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## Katie Drake

Well for those of you that don't like the idea of the new boxed set, now is a great time to pick up a bunch of the Cadian Drop Troop boxes. They're still cheap and won't be going away until May, so get them while you can!


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## officer kerky

that what i have been doing drake lately got 60 of the little buggers i want my money in plastic and at $50 for 20 i am getting aas many as i can


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## Djokovic

I actually have a relative whose friend is at nearly the very top of GW management. He said not to tell anyone what he knows.

AP 6 lasguns

Plastic DKoK

no more doctrines

5 pt guardsmen

40 pt chimeras


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## officer kerky

ap6 guardsmen yes now we can kill those ork players but i don't think that will happen.


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## Katie Drake

AP6 lasguns - Thank god. I never got why an Ork wearing a t-shirt and/or a helmet would get a chance to save himself from a concentrated laser beam. At least lasguns won't be completely crap anymore.

Plastic Death Korps - smart move on GW's part as the Forge World models are excellent and are highly popular.

No more doctrines - Sorta unfortunate, but expected. It's just the direction the game is heading and really isn't worth bitching about.

5 point Guardsmen - Well, that's better than the 4 point Guardsmen rumor, as to be frank, 4 point Guardsmen would get a bit silly, imo.

40 point Chimera - Thank goodness. It's about time that those poor things were lowered in price so that they're more in-line with other transports in the game.

Katie D


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## officer kerky

well i personaly would prefer 4point guardsmen but considering they are "supposedly" getting ap6 i would pay the extra point isn't much but will chnge things in large armies

also every army seems to be getting limited in change so before long we will all play the same army. boohooo

doctrines im sad to let these things go i liked them


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## Druchii in Space

Djokovic said:


> I actually have a relative whose friend is at nearly the very top of GW management. He said not to tell anyone what he knows.
> 
> AP 6 lasguns
> 
> Plastic DKoK
> 
> 40 pt chimeras



I hope you don't mind if I take these with a very large dose of salt, but if any of those are true I'll be very happy come May.


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## gwmaniac

I really wish this sprue cutting thing is not true. They screwed up the Eldar Guardians a bit when they remade it into only 10 guys, so I hope they're not making a $30 set that only gives 10 guys with a heavy weapon. That should just stay with the collectors guardsmen. I guess I should consider saving up for the trooper sets they have right now.


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## Underground Heretic

I love doctrines... you've heard this all before, but I like that you can play a guard army that isn't cookie cutter. I always thought that the guard was equipped the same, but local officers were in tactical control of the regiments (allowing for doctrinal divergences).

EDIT: Got ninja'd by 4 people while trying to post.


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## Djokovic

In the stead of the doctrines I believe they will make regular platoons more 'customizable', which probably means there will be options in the entry for things such as light infantry and drop troops.


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## Galahad

I'm not sure how I like the recut IG squads though
It was 20 guys in a box, now it'll be 8 and a heavy weapon team like eldar guardians? (which, by the way, run the same price as the box of 20 cadians)...so half as many models for the same price? (sure, you get the heavy weapon, but really...)


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## Ferik

I myself have heard rumours going around of tank squads which I think would be sick and potentially a bit much IMO.


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## when in doubt shoot!

oh yeah, that's pretty definite, as guard are seen as the main tank army, but don't get anymore tanks then any other race. So I'm pretty sure leman russes will come in squads of 3 for one heavy support choice. Also, that sentinels (maybe tanks as well) may be able to be attached to infantry platoons. 

An interesting rule I've heard my gw store manager talking about is that guard heavy weapons teams, being so specialist, and able to cross their lines of fire and stuff will be able to ignore the new 5th edition rule where you can hide behind your men and get a 4+ cover save. It kinda makes sense, as you'd imagine that sort of thing to be possible.


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## comrade

I'm wondering what the Commissar lord is gonna give to the Army.

That is the only plus side IMHO

Maybe it would be add like Jr. Commissars to add to regular squads.. that would kick ass.


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## Lord_Murdock

Like the commissar cadet squad back in the 2nd edition? Those guys are great... I wish they'd bring them back...


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## Johnathanswift

Plastic Valkyrie :biggrin:
Plastic Stormtroopers :biggrin:
Commissar Lord :biggrin:
Infantry boxes to be repackaged containing eight guardsmen and a single heavy weapon team in each :ireful2:


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## joebob

Jezlad said:


> Thanks to Bigred over at *BoLS* for this.


any news on a new plastic trench coat guard model or any new plastic regiment


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## don_mondo

There is some RUMINT (Rumor Intelligence) support for the cheaper Chimera. The IA 2 update FAQ (which I think has now been pulled) shows the cost of a Chimera with lultilaser, hull heavy bolter, smoke and searchlight as 55 points. It also lists two new rules for it, Armoured Firebase and Mobile Command Vehicle. Neither of these is explained. 
If I had to guess, going from what I've heard and read, the Firebase rule might allow an IG vehicle to ignore the ST 4 defensive weapon rule and might even allow it to split fire. 
Mobile Command Vehicle is possibly Improved Comms, altho I do have a problem seeing that on every Chimera, unless they change the rules for it. Other possibility is that the vehicle might act as a Vox for any unit within a set range, using it's built in comm system to relay the Command frequency to squads.


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## Morgal

any word on whats going on with the battle force?


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## don_mondo

New models isn't something I've been too worried about or cared much about. Neither of my two IG armies uses current models so I haven't paid too much attention to rumors on that aspect.


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## IamI1966

I like everything...BUT the repackaging of the men. I like it how it is.


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## bon_jovi

IamI1966 said:


> I like everything...BUT the repackaging of the men. I like it how it is.


I think we are all singing from the same song sheet on that front mate. I am gonna stockpile mine before then.


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## Cadian81st

Aww christ, it all sounded so good up until the squad recutting. Ima have to go buy a few now I guess. I'll wait a bit to confirm though, or else I'll be stuck with a whole bunch of troops I don't need atm.

In other news, I'm intrigued by this "Comissar Lord". That could be really cool.


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## Insane Psychopath

joebob said:


> any news on a new plastic trench coat guard model or any new plastic regiment


I would not hold your breath on the trench coat models. That rumour been around for agies, since start of 3rd Ed to my knolwege. But same time I would not say it impossible.



> Plastic Valkyrie
> Plastic Stormtroopers


Yep, Plastic Storm Trooper, 10 in a box, around £12 to £15 I been hearing.

Also wait until the codex. Upgread your command to allow your Storm Trooper to act as troops. I think (was a while ago I hear this) it was going to be between a squad to a platoon worth as one chose.
Just image 30 odd Storm Troopers who are troops FLANKING the oppent or a whole army if you'd like (they keep Inflty skill).

Plastic Valkyrie going to be there transport as well :biggrin:


> Infantry boxes to be repackaged containing eight guardsmen and a single heavy weapon team in each


I hear they might be doing a Platoon set for the Imperial Guards, your basic Command & 2x squad?? Not 100% sure if this is going to go ahead.

But from what I have hear of the new Imperial Guard codex. I can not wait to make a new version of my Storm Trooper army :biggrin:

IP


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## Death 0F Angels

if they added in melta and plasma gun options to the plastic kit id be a bit more happy as i wont have to buy the metals. Other then that i see no + to a recut. Gonna have to buy up some cadians boxes.


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## Cadian81st

Insane Psychopath said:


> I hear they might be doing a Platoon set for the Imperial Guards, your basic Command & 2x squad?? Not 100% sure if this is going to go ahead.


Ooo, this sounds nice. This, plus the battleforce and the new chimera/squad set would mean you could build an army quite fast. I'd probably buy just toon boxes then, and use the command squads for bits.

Any words on if the cadians are getting recasts or additional poses at all?


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## Wolf_Lord_Skoll

What if the recut rumour is just made by GW to make everyone buy more cadian box sets . Sounds like guard are getting some buffs, but they do need them. Pitty about doctrines, but we all saw that coming.


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## colonel gator

wooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
commisar lord and fleet officer sounds awsome
plastic command squads for cadians and jungle fighters
theres still hope yet


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## Dirge Eterna

Ooo. Plastic Stormies. And Valkyries! I'm definately going for a Mechanicus army after I round off my Word Bearers. Great find!

-Dirge


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## ACoz

Am I the only one who's noticed a lot of old-school stuff returning to the game, lately, and wondering what that implies for the new IG Codex?

By old-school stuff, I'm referring to Shokk Attack Gunz, Digi-lasers, Aux. GLs, Combat Squads and the like...

It seems to me that the guys developing stuff have some serious nostalgia for, like, second Ed. and stuff.


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## Kobrakai

Sounds like my stormtrooper army has come a step closer to being a reality :grin:

Thanks for the news guys and girls :good:


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## ACoz

I was just thinking about it all some more, and, well, in keeping with my prior line of thinking, perhaps they'll make the Heavy Weapons Teams that are part of an infantry squad 'detachable', like they used to be.

I dunno.

Just some speculation.


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## Lord_Murdock

ACoz said:


> Am I the only one who's noticed a lot of old-school stuff returning to the game, lately, and wondering what that implies for the new IG Codex?
> 
> By old-school stuff, I'm referring to Shokk Attack Gunz, Digi-lasers, Aux. GLs, Combat Squads and the like...
> 
> It seems to me that the guys developing stuff have some serious nostalgia for, like, second Ed. and stuff.


I've noticed that too. Lysander's "bolter drill" rule, Weirdboyz, etc. etc... Maybe they'll bring back Macherius as a special character in the new codex.


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## Cadian81st

I'd like to see those rapier lasers come back, I never got to play with them and always thought they were pretty neat.


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## Lord of Rebirth

Yey for plastic stormies and the Valkyrie!


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## slaaneshy

I'm happy with these rumours, nice touches added to the guard!


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## lawrence96

if they made AP6 lasguns then what will they do for the hellgun?

sure the hellgun may be AP5, but it would be a fair amount of points for a weapon with a slightly better AP


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## Lord_Murdock

They might make hellguns a bit more like they are on DOW then... something like assault 3 pinning.


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## willem the beterthan

i will be anoyd if they screw with the infentrey boxes 

but i like the sound of the other changes


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## Marneus Calgar

Hmm, looks like a small traitor guard army may be on the cards for me...


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## Nemesis-The-Warlock

some more ig bits from BOLS



> -Return of the Griffon mortar carrier and other "old units"
> -New weapon options for Sentinels and a sprue recut with the new options added.
> -Sentinels are said to be split into 2 diffent FOC options based on weapon loadouts (basically heavier armed ones won't be able to scout)
> -New Sanctioned Psykers
> -New Ratling Snipers
> -May 2nd release for the codex and other initial offering.


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## pchandler43

If the guard are being repackaged into 10 man squads, does that mean they are going to be worth more point wise?


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## neilbatte

More likely to be worth less as its just another way to make more money for least amount of effort. Just like making more tanks available and cheaper as they are normally the biggest cost when building an army. It seems to be GW marketing strategy at the moment to redo all the big unit boxsets by adding a few command and special options but drastically reduce the amount of actual figures per box meaning you have to buy twice as many, Hope they don't do this to the Skaven when they redo them .


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## gwmaniac

Yet more IG rumors from BoLS:

-Return of the Griffon mortar carrier and other "old units"
-New weapon options for Sentinels and a sprue recut with the new options added.
-Sentinels are said to be split into 2 diffent FOC options based on weapon loadouts (basically heavier armed ones won't be able to scout)
-New Sanctioned Psykers
-New Ratling Snipers
-May 2nd release for the codex and other initial offering.


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## Cadian81st

I like the redo of the psykers, might make them actually worth a damn for once. Rolling for powers is bullshit, I don't care how you try and justify it, when your psyker has a 1/6 chance of just being a guy with a laspistol, something is wrong.

I don't really like the idea of sentinels with heavy weapons becoming heavy support, because that means less tanks if you want to take any of them. Though the new weapons options sounds interesting. (multi-meltas? Plasma cannons? heavy bolters? assault cannons?)


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## Nemesis-The-Warlock

gwmaniac said:


> Yet more IG rumors from BoLS:
> 
> -Return of the Griffon mortar carrier and other "old units"
> -New weapon options for Sentinels and a sprue recut with the new options added.
> -Sentinels are said to be split into 2 diffent FOC options based on weapon loadouts (basically heavier armed ones won't be able to scout)
> -New Sanctioned Psykers
> -New Ratling Snipers
> -May 2nd release for the codex and other initial offering.


i think there is an echo in here


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## willem the beterthan

the sentanel thing sounds cool 

just as long as they give more wepons 

but the armagedon patern sentanels nead to be abel to come in frome the side and hit tanks on there rear armor 

las canons are plenty strong but the weaker the armor the beter chance you have


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## Cadian81st

That's what the scout rule is for. An extra move that lets you outflank stuff.


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## willem the beterthan

but the armag-Sentinels are said to be split into 2 diffent FOC options based on weapon loadouts (basically heavier armed ones won't be able to scout the armagedon patern might not be abel to scoute because it has a biger gun


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## Syph

BoLS has an update: http://belloflostsouls.blogspot.com/2009/01/rumors-early-may-ig-releases.html



> Hi guys, here is what we've heard regarding the first week of IG releases in May. I'm certain there will be much more coming later in the month.
> 
> 
> IG Codex $25
> IG Primaris Psyker $15
> IG Ratling Snipers $20
> IG Sentinel $25
> IG Cadian Command Squad $25
> IG Catachan Command Squad $25
> IG Valkyrie $50
> IG Cadian Shock Troops $22
> IG Catachan Jungle Fighters $22


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## Underground Heretic

Like BOLS said, it does look like the guardsmen are going to be packaged like the Eldar Guardian defender squads. Two boxes would cost $44, but would include two heavy weapons. You would get 16 guardsmen and two heavy weapons teams for $44 when you would currently have to spend $61 to get four more guardsmen.


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## comrade

personally, I am not liking the Recut for Guardsmen at all. for just one Troops choice we are talking.. hmmm...$69 usd and thats 25 men, when before it would cost $70 for 40 men.

I personally, calling that major sucking. Thankfully, I will not have to worry about that as I have 600 Guardsmen (with I think 3 HVY weapons, and 7ish Plasma)


And I really don't know how compelling it will to get someone to play IG when just to play an HQ and 2 Troops it would cost $163.

nope nope. Horrible idea. hate it. stupid. despise. I don't need hvy weapons when I play to bury you in a wall of flesh.

personal opinion of course.


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## Dafistofmork

Well maybe the 10 man box set is a top up box set, and you can buy a small platoon in an other box set, using the first to expand it. ( a bit like a cheeper battion and a troops box set). well thats what i think any way.
I cant wait for my orks to crack open some humie skuuls. Waaaagh!


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## Stella Cadente

gwmaniac said:


> -New Ratling Snipers


oh no, when they redid the Ogryns they screwed that up, now they might screw the Ratlings, better get 10 before GW mess them up


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## Dirge Eterna

I'm still hoping for a Platoon box of stormies. The plastic ones would be great bases for Skitarii.

-Dirge


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## Cole Deschain

Blah.

If they're not tweaking the basic troop sculpt, it'll save me a pile of money- 'cause new troops who look different were going to be the only thing to make me take the plunge with the new Codex.

If I wanted a damn Cadian army, I'd have one by now.


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## comrade

before anyone comes up with the argument of this saves money and such, I present you with this:

In all reality, The each current HVY weapon sprues can be changed into 3 Hvy weapons separately.

Make the complete set a HVY bolter/auto cannon
Give a normal guardsmen a ML
Put on a base a Mortar.

So with the old system (Current)

26 men, 9 HVY weapons = $70 (well even if you dont use em split up, its 3 HVY weapons)

New set

25 men, 2 hvy weapons= $69

great saving. more like more suckery


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## Cole Deschain

... You didn't read what I wrote, did you?

It's going to save me money because I'm not going to _buy_ any of it.


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## comrade

Cole Deschain said:


> ... You didn't read what I wrote, did you?
> 
> It's going to save me money because I'm not going to _buy_ any of it.


and you didn't read what I wrote. I said BEFORE ANYONE SAYS IT. was not targeting you m8k:


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## QuietEarth

Honestly, I wouldn't mind the recut boxed set. If you already have a large army like myself and you just want to add a squad it's cheaper, not necessarily per model, but if I just want one squad I don't have to buy a $35 box and a $15 box and instead I can just buy a $22 box.


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## thatCavguyc8d

Ahhh Crap!! if they cut out the doctrines, i may have to nix my current plans for my air assault/ light regiment:cray:. Then again, I may save them. It could just mean just making the basic most guyz with out touching the HQ. I hope GW does srew this one up too much.:scare:

Oh and WEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!! PLASTIC FREAKIN VALKERIES!!!!!!!!!!!
Edit- I mean doesn't srew this one up


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## Wrath of Khaine

If all these are true, I might just be adding some actual infantry to my large tank company.. And the traitor guard entry would just plain rock.


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## gwmaniac

I sure hope these new guardsmen aren't really cadians even though the rumors say it and they keep the current cadian boxed set, cuz I'm gonna be very ticked if they take off such an incredible deal. I might as well start saving up for these sets, I'm pretty stoked on the new command squads and basically everything else. Lets hope the ratlings will come in a squad of ten, they were $12 in a squad of five.


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## Ebsolom Dhaark

A Valkyrie borne IG army supported by tanks and artillery sounds too good an opportunity to pass up. I'll definitely be starting IG upon its release.


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## Cadian81st

Stella Cadente said:


> oh no, when they redid the Ogryns they screwed that up, now they might screw the Ratlings, better get 10 before GW mess them up


You can't screw up the ratlings, they're the ugliest models in the IG line. Midget hicks with sniper rifles? How does that fit in at all with the IG?


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## Stella Cadente

Cadian81st said:


> You can't screw up the ratlings, they're the ugliest models in the IG line. Midget hicks with sniper rifles? How does that fit in at all with the IG?


no, there the best models in the IG range, they have this little thing called Character, something GW hasn't sculpted into a model in many long years, they just swap "character" with "Power armour", they are awsome.


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## Katie Drake

Stella Cadente said:


> no, there the best models in the IG range, they have this little thing called Character, something GW hasn't sculpted into a model in many long years, they just swap "character" with "Power armour", they are awsome.


No, no, I'm pretty sure they're ugly abominations.


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## Cole Deschain

Katie Drake said:


> No, no, I'm pretty sure they're ugly abominations.


Seconded (or is it thirded?)

There's a reason _my_ Ratlings are made from Skaven.


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## Duke Vorian

So, I was wondering: with the recent couple of IG rumours let out their doesn't seem to be any indication of a Steel Legion and/or Vahallan type set coming out in any form. 

Don't get me wrong, I hope one magically does, and I would love their to be one coming out as much as the next Guard player, but it doesn't seem so. 

Is their ANY actual smidgin of fact to this? Or is it all wishfull wishin'/he said, who heard from a friend, who heard from his mom's dad....


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## Dirge Eterna

Cole Deschain said:


> Seconded (or is it thirded?)
> 
> There's a reason _my_ Ratlings are made from Skaven.


Well, it does stick to the spirit of "RATlings" better...

I'm hoping that the Stormtroopers are Kasrkin...IMO they look much better then the older ones.

-Dirge


----------



## thatCavguyc8d

Hopefully GW expands the IG story a bit further. Sure they had rich stories in the last ed., but how about a story of IG's on the offensive:aggressive:, rather being seiged all of the time:blackeye:? Tallern were a good example, but (plz prove me wrong:taunt the only ones.
On a side-note what do you think of a slightly rehash of Armoured Companies?
And better Rough Riders? The last ones were lame:hang1:, stats wise.:ireful2:


----------



## when in doubt shoot!

I'm hoping there is a way to make the stormtroopers into kasrkin, maybe alternate bodies/legs. But Ireally hate the rough rider models! I just don't like the hats and furry boots they have! I wanna see some cadian ones. 


I know it will never happen, it just won't, but a little less of guardsmen dying left right and centre, I know it doesn't particularly fit fluff, but if my opponent sees a guardsmen squad sitting on an objective I want him to think "hmm, they're gonna be hard to get out of there" not: 
"dakka dakka dakka!"
I hate the image that guardsmen can be sneezed on to kill them, I just imagine them more about moving and firing, using cover well, flanking nemy fortifications like modern day troops, not just running down the street screaming until they get gunned down.
see? never going to happen.


----------



## pchandler43

thatCavguyc8d said:


> but how about a story of IG's on the offensive:aggressive:, rather being seiged all of the time:blackeye:? Tallern were a good example, but (plz prove me wrong:taunt the only ones.
> O


1. Death Korps of Krieg at Vraks
2. Menazoid Epsilon
3. That planet in the beginning of the book "Legion"
3. Armageddon (went both ways)
4. The planet in the book "His Last Command"
To name a few


----------



## The Sullen One

*Chaos Guard possibility*

Here's a quick question. Given that Traitor Guard armies have been featured in White Dwarf, that Forge world provide conversions for them, and that probably dozens of people here have mentioned them at one time or another, does anyone know if the new IG codex will provide lists for them?


----------



## ASHIO

ok, new models sound great as guard have been limited for ages and need the input as to me they seem like the forgotton army when it came to the re-invention of the other various forces.

The thing i am intrigued about is....are catachans getting a re-sculpt. i have a sizable catachan force, think the buggers are cool but i dont want to go out and buy lots of 20man box sets to avoid the re-cut and find out they have completely new better looking models? (new weapons are no bother as have bought loads of the old necromunda weapon sprues and elysian weapon sprues to add some diversity that way). anyone heard any re-sculpting rumours?

Cheers


----------



## lord Sanguinius

*i heard IG*

i heard from all lo of sites that u can have about 45 guardsmen for around 200pts i don't know myself for sure so don't blame me if im wrong:mrgreen:


----------



## fynn

ive heard that rumour too, but i think i wait till the new codex is out untill i belive if its true or not


----------



## Usaal

*Watches poor rool for Basalisk send template back into Gardsman line* 

Sorry, was just thinking with troops that cheep then your army is going to take up a good chunk of the board now... Almost like a Nids army with guns.


----------



## Syph

*RUMOUR ROUNDUP*

Courtesy of The Dude over at WarSeer:



The Dude said:


> General info
> 
> Release Rumoured to be 2 May 2009.
> 
> Rumoured to include at least 2 waves of releases. It is unclear when the second wave will appear.
> 
> Rules
> 
> Judging from the release schedule, it is pretty much confirmed that Primaris Psykers will make a return. Their rules can only be speculated on as yet.
> 
> There is rumoured to be a new commander type that allows some type of bombardment.
> 
> The green of a Commissar Lord was seen some time ago, and it is rumoured to have rules in the new Codex.
> 
> There has also been rumoured to be an Inquisitor and Retinue entry as an HQ choice, which would supposedly appear much like the elites from the current Daemon Hunters/Witch Hunters books.
> 
> The assumption has been made based on the WIP Stormtrooper mini that Stormtroopers will be able to take shotguns
> 
> Sniper Squads can supposedly infiltrate, get stealth, range finders and all models in the squad have sniper rifles and BS 4.
> 
> Veteran squads are rumoured to become upgrades to platoons rather than Elites choices.
> 
> Platoons will supposedly benefit from various special rules which only work if the Platoon command squad is alive and within 12” of the rest of the platoon. One such special rule is rumoured to be called "Platoon Drill" or something similar, and grants the ability to ignore any other squad within the Platoon for the purposes of determining the enemy's cover save. What this means is that the Guard squads will get a cover save when being shot at through a squad in the same Platoon, but their enemy will not get one when the squad shoots back.
> 
> Platoons have been rumoured to have a great number of options available to them including attaching various support vehicles like sentinels, hellhounds and demolishers. They still take up a FOC spot, but become part of the platoon and so will benefit from the Platoon Drill rule.
> 
> Doctrines have supposedly been replaced by Platoons with more options, so for example, rather than Armoured fist squads a player would buy Chimeras for a whole platoon, or buy the whole platoon grav-chutes to give them deep strike, or drop the heavy weapons from squads and give the platoon Scout. This system would allow “crusade” style armies of multiple regiments.
> 
> Different kinds of Sentinel will be available with different weapon options. Some will be able to Scout, whilst others will have heavy weapons like Plasma Cannons.
> 
> The Valkyrie will be included, possibly as a transport for Stormtroopers, but will most likely be a skimmer (possibly fast) and is rumoured to allow embarked troops to deploy after deep striking.
> 
> Ogryns have been rumoured to be T5 with a 4+ save and Feel No Pain.
> 
> There are rumoured to be 21 “variants” of tank in the new Codex. It is unclear what exactly constitutes a variant though. It has been rumoured that at least one old style of artillary tank, possibly the Griffon, will make a return.
> 
> It is also rumoured that IG tanks will get a special rule allowing them to fire sponson weapons as though they were Defensive weapons. Opinion is still up in the air on the veracity of this one.
> 
> The Leman Russ can be bought as a squadron so you can get 3 for a single FOC. It is also rumoured to get a drop in front armour to 13.
> 
> It has been pretty much universally stated that the Baneblade is NOT in the new codex.
> 
> Minis
> 
> First Wave rumoured to be as follows (US$):
> IG Codex $25
> IG Primaris Psyker $15
> IG Ratling Snipers $20
> IG Sentinel $25
> IG Cadian Command Squad $25
> IG Catachan Command Squad $25
> IG Valkyrie $50
> IG Cadian Shock Troops $22
> IG Catachan Jungle Fighters $22
> 
> New Ratlings have supposedly been spotted and have cloaks and hoods.
> 
> The new Sentinel box is rumoured to have all Heavy Weapon options including at least a Plasma Cannon in the box.
> 
> The contents of the Command Squads are as yet unknown.
> 
> Some say the Valkyrie will include bits to make a Vulture as well. This is far from confirmed and could just be wish-listing repeated as rumour.
> 
> The Cadian and Catachan Boxes are most likely 10 man sets with a heavy weapon included. Nothing has been said about whether the box will include multiple heavy weapon options, or if individual heavy weapons sets will be withdrawn. The Catachans are rumoured to be a slight improvement in sculpt more in line with the recent Heavy Weapons team than their original incarnation.
> 
> Plastic Roughriders in the Cadian style have been rumoured. Little has been said about these, so they would be 2nd wave at the very least.
> 
> CAD drawings of some tanks have been spotted but it is not clear if these are simply concepts or if they are in production. It has been rumoured that the new Leman Russ kit will allow plastic demolishers and a 3rd variant. They don’t seem to be included in the first wave either way.
> 
> A WIP Stormtrooper with shotgun (assumed to be Plastic) has been seen. It is unclear when or if this will be released but it doesn't appear to be in the first wave.
> 
> 
> There have been rumours of Greatcoat plastics for some time, but these have been consistently shot down by those “in the know”. It seems quite a few GW managers are reporting that plastic Greatcoats are in the pipeline, possibly even as soon as 2nd wave. They will supposedly make Steel Legion, Kreig, and/or Valhallans, which some people believe to be a sign the rumour is untrue, as the look of those regiments would need to be drastically altered to create them all from one kit.
> 
> Regardless of whether or not they are being developed, it is safe to say they will not be seen during the initial release.


Lots to digest here. Feel free to quote parts and comment for clarity's sake!


----------



## JokerGod

My prediction for the next GT~Guard wins first.

As a hole the RT players start crying "Guard are so unfair and unbalanced! This is total cheese list! So unfair! No one can beat this! So unfair!" 

Just going off what the last two codex relises caused 

Anyway, it looks like the Guard are finally getting a very needed upgrade, might have to worry about winning when I play them ^^


----------



## Cadian81st

God..yes. This may is going to be awesome.


----------



## Pauly55

I would pick up a guard army if Death Korps were plastic. No doubt in my mind. 

At least my witch hunters get a plastic troops choice! Too bad the stats wont be the same.


----------



## Vaz

The Fuck? Guard Snipers have better BS than Marines? Haha, Games Workshop really are hamstringing the MEQ's =D.

Bah... I'll take the Pinch of Salt, and throw the rest of the pot over my shoulder.


----------



## Stella Cadente

awwwww armour 13 russ tanks?, thats poo, I lost armour 14 russ tanks fast enough, so why drop it?.....well I suppose its only fair to the poster boys


----------



## Inquisitor Malaclypse

> The Leman Russ can be bought as a squadron so you can get 3 for a single FOC. It is also rumoured to get a drop in front armour to 13.


well, if the rumor is true, then a player cant take 9 tanks as 3 FOC choices.

assuming that this is not possible under the currentl codex, that's not too shabby.


----------



## Stella Cadente

Inquisitor Malaclypse said:


> well, if the rumor is true, then a player cant take 9 tanks as 3 FOC choices.


well thats ok, cus I don't want to take 9 like "those" players, doesn't change how easy it is to lose 3


----------



## Djinn24

Wow..... 

God I must not collect IG, with teh way I collect armies, IG and Orks are a no go.... but a plastic Valk... maybe even a vulture.... sigh.


----------



## Katie Drake

Hrm, a change of the front AV of a Russ to 13... that's pretty dramatic. Leman Russ Battle Tanks are renowned for being rugged and unstoppable. The high AV of its front arc was one of the few things that kept it firing turn after turn. I'd hate to see it become a glorified Predator. Then again, it's rather difficult to take 9 Predators in a single FOC...


----------



## Lord_Murdock

AV 13 would kind of kill the whole feel to the Leman Russ tanks... They'd better not do that. Everything else sounds pretty good though, I must say.


----------



## Cole Deschain

AV 13? If it's true, those mothballs are looking better and better...Guess my Inquisitors will just need to get an Exorcist.


----------



## muffinman82

Finally a freakin command set that will match the rest of my jungle fighters!


----------



## the cabbage

Have GW buggered about with specific vehicle AV's in recent history? I can't remember one but feel free to point out the error of my ways.


----------



## Cadian81st

I think they messed with the falcon a while back...


----------



## JokerGod

Lord_Murdock said:


> AV 13 would kind of kill the whole feel to the Leman Russ tanks... They'd better not do that. Everything else sounds pretty good though, I must say.


Considering you not get more then one per slot I can see the point to lowering it. Also, you have to remember that the Guard don't have new tanks, so over time they get shot up and lose some of there pretty little armor 

A lot of the changes will be good for Guard, can't wait for the Codex to come out so I can start crushing them some more


----------



## Pauly55

Guard don't get new tanks? You kidding? Forge worlds churn out thousands of chimeras a day.


----------



## JokerGod

From what I know Guard don't know how any of there crap works and they can't replicate it because there to busy praying to some old guy to learn how to build it.


----------



## Cole Deschain

JokerGod said:


> From what I know Guard don't know how any of there crap works and they can't replicate it because there to busy praying to some old guy to learn how to build it.


And you would be more or less, well.... wrong.

While the Adeptus Mechanicus have a superstitious dogmatic approach to technology, one thing they CAN do is replicate their approved technology damned near endlessly.

They won't invent ANYTHING new, but an old STC construct like a Russ? They make new ones fairly frequently.


----------



## Vaz

Yeah. This guy knows nothing about them. But it's still his right to comment. Gotta love 'em.

And Guard don't build anything major. Sure there are Engineers that bolt on some new plates. But they don't build tanks from what's around them.

That the Adeptus Mechanicus. So he's completely right in that they don't build stuff, but completely wrong in that they're too busy praying. They're too busy dying, waiting for the Marines to come, or the enemy to run out of bullets, if fluff would have you believe.


----------



## Stella Cadente

Vaz said:


> That the Adeptus Mechanicus. So he's completely right in that they don't build stuff, but completely wrong in that they're too busy praying. They're too busy dying, waiting for the Marines to come, or the enemy to run out of bullets, if fluff would have you believe.


well if were going by fluff, then most guard don't even pray to be busy, sure there supposed to, and probably do when the local priest or commissar is walking around, but plenty of books will show that in reality, most guard don't give a crap about superstitious nonsense, nothing to do with being too busy dying.

and waiting for marines?, most guard think there a myth anyway, there rarer than rocking horse poo.


----------



## Vaz

Fair point. They wait to die, enemy loses all ammo, or a Marine Appears from somewhere, minus Spikes at least.


----------



## Skcuzzlebumm

Still amused that 3 of the most awesome things in the new IG book doesn't yet seem to have hit the rumor mills (unless i missed them).


----------



## Fangio

And they are?


----------



## scoobytgi

Skcuzzlebumm said:


> Still amused that 3 of the most awesome things in the new IG book doesn't yet seem to have hit the rumor mills (unless i missed them).


Now that's just not a fair thing to say and then leave it...


----------



## Vanchet

I really like the idea of a Commssar Lord (always love the fluff of Commissars)


----------



## Skcuzzlebumm

Ok to keep it vague and not get ppl in trouble i can say:

One of the current unit choices is having its guns bumped up to AP3
There is the possibility of having a heavy 29 tank
There is the fist use of the Apocalypse 5" massive blast in regular 40k


----------



## Fangio

Whats a heavy 29 tank? And I hope the AP upgrade goes to mortars. That would be hilarious.


----------



## Druchii in Space

The 5" blast in normal 40k, really? :biggrin:
If it happens I'll be looking forward to facing my mates orks. 

As to AP3, hmm, would they be so blatent to make Ogryns a worthy choice, or maybe Ratlings are getting a big boost. I can't think of any other units where that would effect the whole unit without removing the need to take Special/Heavy weapons.

Interesting though.

As to the Heavy 29 vehicle, you can't seriously be hinting at a vehicle with weapons with that many shots, that would be insane? The only other thing I can think of is the adding the three armour values together I've seen some folks do, but then 29 would be worse than a Leman. Now 39 and it might well be fun. 


edit - oh good point Fangio didn't think of heavy weapon teams, in that case, Hmm Mortar may be a good bet if an odd one. Other wise the Autocannon or Heavy Bolter would in general be more useful than the Missile Launcher.


----------



## Darkangeldentist

Skcuzzlebumm said:


> Ok to keep it vague and not get ppl in trouble i can say:
> 
> One of the current unit choices is having its guns bumped up to AP3
> There is the possibility of having a heavy 29 tank
> There is the fist use of the Apocalypse 5" massive blast in regular 40k


That's not particularly vague to be honest Skcuzzlebumm. Incidentally are pintle weapons included on the heavy 29 tank? I've heard that the 5" huge blast may not be big enough as well.

I must admit I'm really looking forward to the new guard book. So many changes and pretty much all the rumours seem to be making them sound great.

By the way 29 shots isn't necessarily that insane. If you factor in guard BS and the new potential for regular blasts depending on the strength and AP it might well only just work out as effective as a regular russ.


----------



## Daniel Harper

Hey guys, all of these rumours sound great.

However I do have some questions but I don't expect an answer anytime soon. Anyway for fluff reasons that fit with my WIP army does anyone know if there will be a Heavy Stubber team as I heard an early rumour it was going to be a new heavy weapon choice. Furthermore I also heard an even earlier rumour that there would be a light recon jeep with twin-linked stubbers. Are these rumours still going around or should I dismiss them?

Thank you for any help you can give.


----------



## Fangio

I did hear something about stubbers recently but in all honesty it may have simply been that someone had said they were keeping the sponson stubber. As for a jeep, I wouldn't hold your horses. This is the first time I've heard about it.


----------



## Druchii in Space

Darkangeldentist said:


> By the way 29 shots isn't necessarily that insane. If you factor in guard BS and the new potential for regular blasts depending on the strength and AP it might well only just work out as effective as a regular russ.


I'm thinking more of my regular opponents to be honest, I nearly always play either Tyranids (not Nidzilla) or Orks. So for me a 29 shot tank regardless of BS or other factors would be insane. :biggrin:


----------



## Katie Drake

Skcuzzlebumm said:


> One of the current unit choices is having its guns bumped up to AP3


It's the Storm Trooper's hellguns, isn't it?

You know, this would not surprise me if only because it's so heavily rumored that Storm Troopers are getting a plastic kit - what a great way to sell a ton of those boxes!


----------



## Druchii in Space

I did consider that for a moment Katie, but I didn't put that down as I was thinking GW couldn't be that obvious. Compared to the Ogryns that would be a 'yeah new box equals best ever rules' is true moment if I ever saw one. :laugh: 
Well I was hoping they wouldn't, but if they did and they where able to be troops as well. :shok:


----------



## CommissarHorn

No, it wouldn't be the ST, unless its only a special weapon. Guard will never be given better standard guns, the lasgun is already awesome. Plus AP 3 for standard weapons just ruins the guard. AP 5 is high enough for hellguns.

Best guess is this would be available to infantry squads as a special weapon.


----------



## Katie Drake

CommissarHorn said:


> No, it wouldn't be the ST, unless its only a special weapon. Guard will never be given better standard guns, the lasgun is already awesome. Plus AP 3 for standard weapons just ruins the guard. AP 5 is high enough for hellguns.
> 
> Best guess is this would be available to infantry squads as a special weapon.


I was more or less joking... more or less. It's just the kind of assinine move I've come to expect from GW is all. If I had to take a serious guess, I'd say that it'll be either the Ogryn Rippa Gun or perhaps even the Ratlings, though the latter would piss me off even more than the Storm Troopers. Midget snipers mowing down Space Marines... *shudder*


----------



## Stella Cadente

Katie Drake said:


> Midget snipers mowing down Space Marines... *shudder*


oh how I would love that, its no less than what marines deserve


----------



## Cole Deschain

Katie Drake said:


> Midget snipers mowing down Space Marines... *shudder*


The little bastards already do.

You know how many Terminators mien have accounted for?

Friggen Rending.


----------



## Phenius

I think S4 AP6 for hellguns would be hella sweet, making them a viable ELITE choice, not lite another troop selection taking up an elite slot (without grenadiers). But then again, that's kind of cutting it close to Mini-space marines...


----------



## CommissarHorn

Katie Drake said:


> If I had to take a serious guess, I'd say that it'll be either the Ogryn Rippa Gun


Thats what i'm hoping for. Being an awesome looking weapon and being huge, the ripper gun deserves a bit more than str4 AP 5. Although the assualt 2 aint that bad. 

I'd laugh if they give em a 4+ sv. 
Army of Ogryns, here I come.


----------



## Darkangeldentist

I do not believe the ripper gun will get any improvement to it's AP. Strength and number of shots would be a different matter.

Just a question about the idea of AP 3 guns for the guard. Why would that be such a bad or silly thing? I mean, if it's an S3 AP3 hellgun wouldn't that make storm trooper the ideal unit for the guard to send to kill enemy elites? Ok the strength wouldn't let them cause massive numbers of wounds but they would kill stuff and guard aren't exactly lacking in weight of fire in other areas.


----------



## Marshal Balian

I like the thought of the hell gun getting the boost as well. I have avoided putting stormtroopers in my army or even painting them because I have yet to see the value in them. And even still if they give the hell gun AP 3 I would be reluctant to use them. But it all comes down to I am not touching my guard untill the new codex comes out.


----------



## the cabbage

A mechanised army of stormtroopers with AP3, is it the new twin lash?


----------



## Fangio

There is no way in hell that they would ever change the hellgun stats, simply because it was cause them a major headache when they redo the inquisition st. I'm still holding out for AP3 Mortars.


----------



## Stella Cadente

hellguns being AP3 would be beyond dumb in my opinion, unless you have disadvantages, like gets hot AND heavy 1, theres no other way justifying what is basically a lasgun suddenly becoming a marine grater


----------



## Phenius

True dats. And if their stats were boosted that much, they'd be worth as many points as an SM, which is very not-guard. The point is to make many troops available for cheap, which means weaker weapons, but more of them.

I would also like to see the shotgun get a boost in S. IMO a shotgun, sticking with the short range, should pack quite a punch. Keep the at at null, or 6, and make them worth 2-4 points. I'd pay that for a squad of vets with shotties and meltaguns, specially if they do end up taking some deep striking options away from them.

And, havn't heard much about this, but with the new rules of templates, the hellhound I think should have its hitting rules revised. Maybe making it scatter if you don't roll your 4 to hit directly.


----------



## Stella Cadente

Phenius said:


> I would also like to see the shotgun get a boost in S.


in all likely hood they'll become str4 like marine shotguns, but maybe only for vets and stormtroopers



Phenius said:


> And, havn't heard much about this, but with the new rules of templates, the hellhound I think should have its hitting rules revised. Maybe making it scatter if you don't roll your 4 to hit directly.


I think it should have more than its hitting rules revised, I still think it makes no sense for a hellhounds flame to suddenly shoot sideways across a unit, I think they should just count it as a flamer still obviously (no cov saves etc), but use the small template or ordnance template, to show the flame hitting the ground and splashing over everything, not just peeing sideways suddenly.


----------



## Phenius

Good point, but I always thought of it as the tank hosing an area with fire instead of having one shot of flames. Still, they need to do something about it.


----------



## Duke Vorian

> I think it should have more than its hitting rules revised, I still think it makes no sense for a hellhounds flame to suddenly shoot sideways across a unit, I think they should just count it as a flamer still obviously (no cov saves etc), but use the small template or ordnance template, to show the flame hitting the ground and splashing over everything, not just peeing sideways suddenly.


It makes perfect sense that you can put the flame template sideways for the Hellhound. It simulates the Hellhound aiming and then turning its turret as it fires to spray across an area. Just like when you fire it at a distance the shooter is arcing the turret to make it cover more of an area.


----------



## Lord Reevan

I have heard from other sources, elite store managers mostly, that hellguns wil either be S3 ap4 or S4 ap 5 or 6, there are a lot of things going around for them...

Also as there are a lot of rumours about plastic storm troopers does anyone have any pictues of sculpts and the like? I haven't seen anything new for them picture wise....


----------



## Stella Cadente

Duke Vorian said:


> It makes perfect sense that you can put the flame template sideways for the Hellhound. It simulates the Hellhound aiming and then turning its turret as it fires to spray across an area. Just like when you fire it at a distance the shooter is arcing the turret to make it cover more of an area.


then if its representing doing that then it shouldn't be a cone it should just be a line of equal thickness, or a measured out area of effect in a line.......but I suppose that would be too difficult to fathom for todays 40k generation


----------



## Lord Reevan

you could say the large part was the turret stopped and the rest of it was moving... huzzah! logic in 40k! not great logic but eh!


----------



## Duke Vorian

The line _shouldn't_ be simply a rectangle cause the splash of the initial impact can either represent the first splash and the thinning out being the end of the 'doose' if you will or the thinner end being a slight 'dribble' with the larger part being the initial target.

Having the rules for the Hellhound Inferno Cannon changed to just a small template would one: make it worthless; and two: not make a lot of sense on the firers judgement.

I'm not one of those little kids playing this game or "todays 40k generation".


----------



## LegendX

IG getting skimmers! lol

Just another thing my Nids will have trouble hitting.

LX


----------



## LordWaffles

Stella Cadente said:


> I think it should have more than its hitting rules revised, I still think it makes no sense for a hellhounds flame to suddenly shoot sideways across a unit, I think they should just count it as a flamer still obviously (no cov saves etc), but use the small template or ordnance template, to show the flame hitting the ground and splashing over everything, not just peeing sideways suddenly.


Isn't that technically what napalm is meant to do? Just a drive-bye peeing on things? A large gout followed by an increasingly smaller trail that would end in an abrupt point?

Or is just a drive-by urination too awesome for IG to have? 


Also I'm looking forward to the next book and having more guard players around.


----------



## Dafistofmork

What happens is that as the flame gushes forth it expands, at the end of the shot it gets cut off-less flame to go around, cone shaped exploion.
That, or chaos did it.


----------



## kenzman

*I was hoping....*

I was kinda hoping to see GW do away with ratlings... since most of the guard have snipers in there main line now. Guess Ill have to ask myself if i want to put the little turdlings in my line up.. pass. :laugh:


----------



## Firewolf

>> New Jungle fighters will be sweet. i always wanted ti do a JF army, as I dont like the Cadian models, but the Junglies at the mo are a wee bit to rambo for my liking. Everything else sounds cool. The recut of squad boxes was agiven, as it seems to be the way GW are goin wi boxes. 10 men, for a wee bit cheaper, but we cant ahve everything.


----------



## comrade

Firewolf said:


> >> New Jungle fighters will be sweet. i always wanted ti do a JF army, as I dont like the Cadian models, but the Junglies at the mo are a wee bit to rambo for my liking. Everything else sounds cool. The recut of squad boxes was agiven, as it seems to be the way GW are goin wi boxes. 10 men, for a wee bit cheaper, but we cant ahve everything.


I personally have used the Catachans, and I have got to say the poses, the set up, thier heads, the size of thier arms is just horrid.

The models are very... un-appealing in my mind. I found cadians much more.. hmm.. 'normal' per se.

But, I will hope to see the recuts/remolds (I hear thats what they gonna do) and If I like them, I may buy 20-40ish and combine them with Cadians to make vetrans. 

and by cost to Value, the Re-cuts come out to being a wee-bit more expensive then the current sets.

(Not to mention, this is taking in mind you get all 3 heavy weapons to choose from, not 1, if it is only 1, its a damn rip-off.)


----------



## fowlplaychiken

Am I the only one slightly concerned at the thought of having to fight 6 pie-plate throwing leman russ battle tanks in a 2k point game?:-/ technically could field 9, but realistically I imagine the average guard army will have 6, or 3 + basilisk + griffin, or some such. either way, we are looking at more pie plates than you can shake a stick at, and a similar number of infantry as before due to the point reductions. :-/


----------



## Capt.Al'rahhem

Is there a definent answer on what the transport cap. of the new super heavy tank is (the one with the mega bolter I believe)? I've heard anywhere from 20 to 40. I was just wondering if it was cutting into the Gorgons action. I've been in love with Gorgon ever since I first saw and will have at least one or 2 but the new S.H. Tank kits got to be cheaper. Just Wondering.
Still not happy the didn't see fit to put a plasma blast gun in there to make Stormblades cheap but I guess Forge Worlds gotta make some money too.


----------



## spike12225

guard are going to be new anti horde


----------



## Syph

Bit of an update. Had an anonymous source PM some Guard rumours he received from a playtester friend. Some are likely to have already been posted or confirmed, but it'd be like picking at chicken bones if I sat and got rid of older rumours!  

Usual caveats apply! 



> - Going to be a lot new models from ratlings, rough riders, Commissars, command squad, possibly sniper, Valkyrie flyer
> - Conscripts; way they are working is there troops but like Daemons in the Chaos Marine dex. They do not take up a force org chart. You now get a command squad with them, being a Commissar with three team of Heavy Bolter. Idea is when conscript failed Ld, Heavy Bolter team gun them down (like Enemy at the Gates) each one get killed +1 to your Ld, get to Ld 10 & your fearless until 1: end of the game, 2: Commissar & team have been killed.
> - Hellhounds are going to be in squads of 3, they can combi there fire power but mean missing a turn (like dire avanger) of shooting but while the load also mean +1 to any tank damnge results.
> - Though Doctrines are gone you can still working out things like c armour, etc... Another example being upgrade you HQ to allowed Storm Trooper to act as troop choice.
> - GW are planning a Platoon set for Guards that will be in a tank size box around £35, basicly 2-5 squads with command squad.


----------



## Duke Vorian

The conscript rule sounds really cool...but kinda not likely for some reason, just a vibe. I mean, this is what all Guard players probably dream of (me included) but the fact that it may actaully be a rule is kind of...unbelievable. haha.

Plus, the rumoured rule for Hellhounds rings a bit of Apoclaypse. Again, sweet but unbelieveable. haha. If true I wonder how other tanks may be affected. Leman Russs as squads for one choice?

The last two rumours better be true or it will be as horrible mistake as Sony having the PS2 only having two controller slots. Still psst about that one...


----------



## Dirge Eterna

Hellhound Squads are kind of annoying-sounding, I think. And will conscripts be able to hold objectives despite not being on the Force Organization chart?


----------



## killmaimburn

IF they function in the same way as lesser daemons in the chaos codex in that they cannot fill a compulsory slot, they should be able to score.


----------



## Dirge Eterna

Brutal. Although one could argue since they are not on the Force Organization chart, they are therefore not Troops, and thus not capable of holding objectives. But I'm being a rules lawyer now.

-Dirge


----------



## killmaimburn

Dirge Eterna said:


> Brutal. Although one could argue since they are not on the Force Organization chart, they are therefore not Troops, and thus not capable of holding objectives. But I'm being a rules lawyer now.
> 
> -Dirge


Back, foul rules lawyer! The power of khorne compels you!
Ok, dumb exorcist reference over, that interpretation doesn't work as they are CONSIDERED troops for all purposes except compulsory slots. It would obviously depend on the wording in the codex, but essentially if it matches the chaos codex they will be scoring.


----------



## The Sullen One

Heavy Bolter teams to gun down fleeing conscripts, so I'm finally able to kill my own men and get away with it, ah a dream come true.


----------



## Cole Deschain

kenzman said:


> I was kinda hoping to see GW do away with ratlings... since most of the guard have snipers in there main line now. Guess Ill have to ask myself if i want to put the little turdlings in my line up.. pass. :laugh:


You're entitled to your poor decisions, I suppose.

In any event, all of this sounds like the standard jibber-jabber.before a book comes out.

SQUADS of Hellhounds? Man, ONE was plenty.

I'll just have to wait until either (A) I get my hands on acopy of the book or (B) one of my verminous piratical friends leaks it to me. Even money on which will happen first.


----------



## Widowmaker666

i dont like the vehicle squad idea. hellhounds in a squad would be annoying. I guess it would be ok though. if they do it with the russ ill cut, or if they reduce the armour to 13. I would like to see the conscripts like that and that box set sounds awesome. really cant wait for may


----------



## Syph

The Dude has yet again updated the now mammoth thread over at Warseer:



> General info
> 
> Release Rumoured to be 2 May 2009.
> 
> Rumoured to include at least 2 waves of releases. It is unclear when the second wave will appear.
> 
> Rules
> 
> Judging from the release schedule, it is pretty much confirmed that Primaris Psykers will make a return. Their rules can only be speculated on as yet.
> 
> There is rumoured to be a new commander type called a Fleet Officer that allows some type of orbital bombardment.
> 
> The green of a Commissar Lord was seen some time ago, and it is rumoured to have rules in the new Codex. Some have said this could include allowing Stormtroopers as Troops choices.
> 
> There has also been rumoured to be an Inquisitor and Retinue entry as an HQ choice, which would supposedly appear much like the elites from the current Daemon Hunters/Witch Hunters books.
> 
> The advisors special rule may have been dropped. It is not clear if it has been replaced with something else or if they count as Squad upgrades.
> 
> The assumption has been made based on the WIP Stormtrooper mini that Stormtroopers will be able to take shotguns and can Infiltrate if not transported. You can supposedly have a Storm Trooper Squad/Platoon as a Troops choice (not clear if this means both or one of), but this is reliant on an upgraded HQ choice, which is NOT linked to the Commissar Lord as previously rumoured, just the basic Officer who can be upgraded for x-amount to get Storm Troopers as Troops. They may also get to pick from a list of mission 'operations', such as outflank, deepstrike etc.
> 
> Bestiaparda offered the following:
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by Bestiaparda
> Hellguns will be now AP 3 as I said in the other long dead post, making stormtroopers capable of dealing with a lot of different (MEQ) opponents...
> There are apparently a few other things that you can give the Command Squad to affect the army.
> 
> Sniper Squads can supposedly infiltrate, get stealth, range finders and all models in the squad have sniper rifles and BS 4.
> 
> Veteran squads are rumoured to become upgrades to platoons rather than Elites choices and may work like Ork Ard Boyz in that you may upgrade one unit in the whole army.
> 
> Platoons will supposedly benefit from various special rules which only work if the Platoon command squad is alive and within 12” of the rest of the platoon. One such special rule is rumoured to be called "Platoon Drill" or something similar, and grants the ability to ignore any other squad within the Platoon for the purposes of determining the enemy's cover save. What this means is that the Guard squads will get a cover save when being shot at through a squad in the same Platoon, but their enemy will not get one when the squad shoots back.
> 
> Another unconfirmed rumour says Platoons will have some kind of "overwatch" rules, allowing them a round of shooting during the enemy’s shooting phase at the cost of shooting and assaulting next turn (effectively going to ground). It is unclear what, if any, further restrictions apply (one per turn, once per battle?).
> 
> reds8n semi confirms this with the following:
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by reds8n
> I believe that command squads will in fact be able to give actual orders to their troops-- I assume perhaps only the ones under their direct command perhaps ? These have various affects, the ones I heard about being one that reduces their chance to hit ( for guard ! ) but ignores/lowers cover saves.
> 
> .... and one that in affect puts the platoon onto overwatch.
> 
> Which I was immensely skeptical of, and then I saw that Thunderfire datasheet.
> Another poster who will remain anonymous heard that orders are given by Officers to a squad (note not the whole Platoon) within command radius or via Vox channel. Orders generally make a squad do something such as make them better shots, rally, or recover from things like pinning or gone to ground. These orders are not automatic and will probably require a Ld test. Orders will be one or maybe two orders per officer per turn.
> 
> Platoons have been rumoured to have a great number of options available to them including attaching various support vehicles like sentinels, hellhounds and demolishers. They still take up a FOC spot, but become part of the platoon and so will benefit from the Platoon Drill rule.
> 
> Doctrines have supposedly been replaced by Platoons with more options, so for example, rather than Armoured fist squads a player would buy Chimeras for a whole platoon, or buy the whole platoon grav-chutes to give them deep strike, or drop the heavy weapons from squads and give the platoon Scout. This system would allow “crusade” style armies of multiple regiments.
> 
> Another rumour says that there will be multiple flavours of Platoon with varying rules and options, such as Heavy Platoons, the squads will have the option of taking up to three heavy weapons teams; Assault Platoons, able to take up to three assault weapons; Stealth Platoons possibly able to infiltrate. It is not clear if this was based on a proper rumour or mutant wishlisting.
> 
> This has been given some credence with catdubh posting the following:
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by catdubh
> From the way I was told it an assault platoon can only take assault weapons, 3 flamers fine, 3 G/L fine, 3 plasma no. From both a fluff point of view and game balance it seams fair to me.
> 
> Also told Heavy Weapons squads are now 10 men not six and that the rumour of all squads in a platoon being able to take 3 Heavies per squad is not quite right. Instead a Heavy Weapon Squad can be attached to a platoon. Very similar but as to which one is correct we will have to wait
> There has been much talk about a point decrease to 4points per Guardsman. This has also been rumoured to be 50 point Infantry squads (10 men with Sgt, Heavy Bolter & Flamer).
> 
> Heavy weapons teams will supposedly be required to be on large bases, with Col.Gravis posting the following:
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by Col.Gravis
> Aye, if your basing your teams at the moment it would proabbly not be adviseable to base them seperately, which is all I'm saying at the moment.
> It is assumed there will be some sort of rule making HW Teams a single 2W entity, like a Space Marine Attack Bike. Nothing has been rumoured on this yet though.
> 
> Kill Points have supposedly been sorted out. The example given to me was a platoon Command Squad and 4 Guardsmen Squads will surrender one kill point if you lose half the platoon (eg - Command Squad & two Guard Squads). You then surrender another kill point if the Platoon is wiped out. So instead of being five KP worth, that platoon is worth two.
> 
> Conscript will supposedly be a Troops choice much like Daemon in the Chaos Marine Dex in that they do not take up a FOC slot. They will supposedly come with a command squad mad up of a Commissar and three teams of Heavy Bolters. The concept is that if the Conscripts break, the Heavy Bolter team guns them down each one killed gives +1 to their Ld up to a max of 10. They are supposedly also Fearless until the Commissar and HW team have been killed.
> 
> On the other hand, some rumours say conscripts will disappear altogether, or remain only as “naked” Platoons.
> 
> Different kinds of Sentinel will be available for both FA and HS slots, with the slot determining the weapon and upgrade options, as well as special rules. FA Sentinals will retain Scout, but only be open topped, whereas HS ones will lose Scout, but will be enclosed and have options for heavy weapons such as the Plasma Cannon.
> 
> The chimera seems to have been given new stats and undefined special rules in Forge World’s IA2 update. http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/pdf/ia2-update.pdf This could be an indication of what is to come.
> 
> The Valkyrie will be included, possibly as a transport for Stormtroopers, but will most likely be a skimmer (possibly fast) and is rumoured to allow embarked troops to deploy after deep striking. Another rumour says they will be able to DS more accurately like Drop Pods.
> 
> Ogryns have been rumoured to be T5 with a 4+ save and Feel No Pain.
> 
> There are rumoured to be 21 “variants” of tank in the new Codex. It is unclear what exactly constitutes a variant though. It has been rumoured that at least one old style of artillary tank, possibly the Griffon, will make a return.
> 
> It is also rumoured that IG tanks will get a special rule allowing them to fire sponson weapons as though they were Defensive weapons. Opinion is still up in the air on the veracity of this one.
> 
> The Leman Russ can be bought as a squadron so you can get 3 for a single FOC. It is also rumoured to get a drop in front armour to 13.
> 
> The Hellhound is supposedly bought in squadrons of 3 (this could mean up to 3), and they can combine there firepower but will sacrifice a turn of shooting like dire avengers do. They will subsequently suffer +1 to any damage results during their reload turn. It has also been rumoured to have three variants, although no further details have emerged about this.
> 
> Bestiaparda supplemented this with the following:
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by Bestiaparda
> There will be three types of Hellhound: Hellhound, Devildog and another name I don´t remember... Three types of tank=three types of gun=flamer, melta and plasma.
> It has been pretty much universally stated that the Baneblade is NOT in the new codex.
> 
> Minis
> 
> First Wave rumoured to be as follows (US$):
> IG Codex $25
> IG Primaris Psyker $15
> IG Ratling Snipers $20
> IG Sentinel $25
> IG Cadian Command Squad $25
> IG Catachan Command Squad $25
> IG Valkyrie $50
> IG Cadian Shock Troops $22
> IG Catachan Jungle Fighters $22
> 
> The green of the Commissar Lord can be seen here:
> 
> http://warseer.com/forums/attachment...7&d=1214001137
> 
> New Ratlings have supposedly been spotted and have cloaks and hoods.
> 
> The new Sentinel box is rumoured to have all Heavy Weapon options including at least a Plasma Cannon, as well as the Armoured Crew Compartment bits in the box.
> 
> The contents of the Command Squads apparently includes an underarm swagger stick Drill Instructor style. It is not clear which one has this, but most likely it will be the Cadian one.
> 
> Some say the Valkyrie will include bits to make a Vulture as well. This is far from confirmed and could just be wish-listing repeated as rumour. A CAD picture of the interior can be seen here:
> 
> http://warseer.com/forums/attachment...8&d=1214001168
> 
> The Cadian and Catachan Boxes are most likely 10 man sets with a heavy weapon included. Nothing has been said about whether the box will include multiple heavy weapon options, or if individual heavy weapons sets will be withdrawn. The Catachans are rumoured to be a slight improvement in sculpt more in line with the recent Heavy Weapons team than their original incarnation.
> 
> Plastic Roughriders in the Cadian style have been rumoured. Little has been said about these, so they would be 2nd wave at the very least.
> 
> CAD drawings of some tanks have been spotted but it is not clear if these are simply concepts or if they are in production. It has been rumoured that the new Leman Russ kit will allow plastic demolishers and a 3rd variant, another rumour saying 5 (standard, demolisher, conqueror, exterminator, and the new variant). It is also rumoured that Chimeras and Hellhounds will share a kit.
> 
> The C SD picture of what is thought to be the new Hellhound can be seen here:
> 
> http://www.warseer.com/forums/attach...8&d=1233353300
> 
> They don’t seem to be included in the first wave either way.
> 
> A WIP Stormtrooper with shotgun (assumed to be Plastic) has been seen. It is unclear when or if this will be released but it doesn't appear to be in the first wave. They are supposedly 10 models to a box from £12-15. No further word on box contents. WIP can be seen here:
> 
> http://warseer.com/forums/attachment...4&d=1232629639
> 
> 
> There have been rumours of Greatcoat plastics for some time, but these have been consistently shot down by those “in the know”. It seems quite a few GW managers are reporting that plastic Greatcoats are in the pipeline, possibly even as soon as 2nd wave. They will supposedly make Steel Legion, Kreig, and/or Valhallans, which some people believe to be a sign the rumour is untrue, as the look of those regiments would need to be drastically altered to create them all from one kit.
> 
> Regardless of whether or not they are being developed, it is safe to say they will not be seen during the initial release


----------



## Stella Cadente

Hellguns will be now AP 3 as I said in the other long dead post
no matter how many times I hear it I doubt it, there is no possible good fluff explanation as to why a hellgun suddenly becomes a baby a tau plasma rifle (without the str obviously)
Heavy weapons teams will supposedly be required to be on large bases
tough luck, unless GW give you bases for free to replace what you already have


----------



## Katie Drake

I tried to resist, but I told all of you so about the AP3 hellguns. :laugh:


----------



## Marneus Calgar

AP3 hellguns... Can't wait for the next Inquisition update then, my Stormtroopers suck at the moment :laugh:

Overally, looking good for Guard!


----------



## Lord Reevan

yay more mass ap3 shots. yet another way to guarantee the downfall of the MEQ in tournaments.... I'd still ike to see pictures of the new stormtroopers. I've heard so much but seen nothing


----------



## Steel Rain

Pah. AV13 is half-assing it. Either AV14 or don't bother. I'm wondering if they will drop Demolisher armor too, since that is higher overall than the standard. Guard will still suck if sponsons can't be fired as defensive weapons. Unless the Leman Russ's get a price and points drop, I don't think many people would field more than three anyways.


----------



## Skcuzzlebumm

So my previous teaser proved to be true (well i knew it was obviously).

And still they have yet to mention the 29 shot tank or the apocalypse blast.


----------



## comrade

ohh.. the conscript squads being a unit that takes up no FOC, that wouild be most kick assery..... now I can field all 500 of my guardsmen in 2k. 

Now its starting to sound real good. I'm all excited now... I hope I don't get dissapointed.


----------



## Katie Drake

It really does seem that even with the loss of Doctrines most Guard players will be happy with what's coming in the new Codex. We can only hope. :so_happy:


----------



## comrade

yes, we can only hope. oh and the latest from BOLS (its mainly just a list of release dates mind you)

:


> Ok guys, this one has been making the rounds today so here it is. I will spare you the horrific babelfish translations and give you the basics as well as what we are hearing.
> 
> 2009 Warhammer 40k & Fantasy
> -April: Imperial Guard (we hear May)
> -May: Fantasy Empire 2nd Wave (Empire Steam Tank, Greatswords, "Military Altar") (we hear June, and have no indication of a "Military Altar")
> -July: Planetstrike (looks like its coming at LONG last)
> -September: Space Hulk (with all new modern plastic termys, genestealers...the whole 9 yards) (we have no confirmation on this)
> -October: Skaven (we hear August)
> -November: An unnamed marine chapter (we hear Space Wolves)
> 
> 2010 Warhammer 40k & Fantasy
> Fantasy Candidates: Khemri...
> 40k Candidates: Tyranids, Blood Angels (possibly following on the coat-tails of Space Hulk), Necrons, Tau, Dark Eldar are reported to be almost finished, but pushed off due to their low interest level.


but, the problem with to much hope (read: hype) is that if it falls below what you wished, you will be more disappointed then you would be normally.

So take everything with a dose of skepticism


----------



## the cabbage

I'm still not convinced on the hellgun AP3 thing. With the possibility of stormtroopers as troops as well it seems more like a gaurd players wet dream than a real option.

We're talking baby Tsons now.


----------



## Katie Drake

the cabbage said:


> We're talking baby Tsons now.


Well, Thousand Sons that aren't _Slow and Purposeful_, have lower Strength guns, have lower toughness, have worse armor and no Invul save. So... yeah, I guess aside from all that, they are like Thousand Sons.


----------



## Capt.Al'rahhem

I'm not to happy cause it looks like their going to do away with Armored Fist squad. Which means I have to buy another squad, a command squad, and 2 more Chimeras to fill out my req. 2 troop slots in my fully mechanized unit. Using more points I'd rather spend on support units and tanks. Plus since I'm using all Tallarns quite a bit more money. I quess it's a good thing I'm getting a nice tax return.

And lower the front armor on the most rugged, reliable tank in the universe after all these years in BS, IMO.


----------



## Spot The Grot

Damn it links don't work is anyone else getting that?

AP3 hellguns sound impossible. Even if they did get it they would probably have "gets hot" and would be hugely expensive. Unless GW are trying to make them like sternguard in the way of different ammo.


----------



## Vanchet

I won't be suprise if the Hellguns are AP4 at best, can't see a a slightly more stronger Flashlight rip through Marine armour.


----------



## slaaneshy

Yeah, AP3 would be over kill for a hellgun, but as a guard player, I won't complain too loudly! In all though these changes seem in tune with the ethos of the guard, lots of cheap troops and lots of tanks. Me likes!


----------



## ACoz

Spot The Grot said:


> Damn it links don't work is anyone else getting that?


Yeah. I'm getting 'Page not Found'...


----------



## Someguy

I really like what I'm hearing. If IG end up being like they sound, they will be a genuinely competitive army.

I'm not sure about the AP3 hellguns. I can imagine that they would do it but keep strength 3. That still leaves you with a guy who is only even odds with a marine when shooting, not in close combat and not if the marine is in cover. It would certainly be good, but it wouldn't change the world. I can imagine that they would do it as a two-setting lasgun that could be fired at ap3 gets hot. 

All pure speculation, and I probably won't have any storm troopers in my feudal IG anyway.


----------



## Druchii in Space

Hmm some interesting things, the Russ AV drop could hurt, although that might be a factor in making them cheaper or allowing Guard to take more than the normal 3 Heavy slots worth.

AP 3 Hellguns would be interesting if true, although any price hike might make them not as useful against my normal 'Horde' opponents.

The only thing that makes me chuckle is the heavy weapons note, hehe obviously GW didn't like us getting nine heavy weapons from a box. Not that this would change anything for me, just means I'd either ignore that, or I'd pick up a load of the larger bases from the main store.

Some interesting stuff there though, roll on May.


----------



## TAUfanatic

I'm just glad for plastic stormtroopers,but I'd like to know if they'er redone stormtroopers or if they have the same look


----------



## fowlplaychiken

ap3 hellguns =

field lots of stormtroopers and 6 leman russ, fight any enemy; MEQ or Horde. I cant imagine the best ork or nid horde player in the world finding a counter for 6 leman russ + a basilisk. 7 pie plates = entire army dead first, 2nd turn


----------



## Insane Psychopath

TAUfanatic said:


> I'm just glad for plastic stormtroopers,but I'd like to know if they'er redone stormtroopers or if they have the same look


Check warseer for some photos of a mock up Storm Trooper. Some changies compired to the Cadain Storm Trooper.

IP


----------



## Death Shroud

I'd heard that Hellguns will be Strength 4 but no lowering of AP (I think they might even be raised to the same AP as normal Lasguns in the new book). AP3 hellguns would be overpowered and in conflict with the background and style of play of the guard. 
AP3 Hotshot rounds with snipers would make sense though (perhaps with the "gets hot" rule).


----------



## Fangio

Ratlings being AP3 would be the most sensible approach to the new AP change. I, personally, don't think the IG need it. We fight with mass firepower to overwhelm nothing else.

If a unit is definately getting AP3 though I still want it to be mortars.


----------



## Death 0F Angels

AP 3 storm troopers overpowered? Not really. They are still frail as shit against any MEQ. I think the only thing i dont like is the AV 13 on the Russ. Seems like lots of goodies in their though. Gotta take the good with the bad.


----------



## Col. Schafer

Ok, as always take everything with a rain of salt.

Also, I didnt read the whole 20 pages, so dont yell at me if I post somthing already said

Diclaimers out of the way, now.

This is straight from the horses mouth, a GW employee. 

-Lord of the fleet, HQ addon, allows orbital strikes
-Commisar lord, will have a greatcoat, and will give you acces to sertain eliets as troops
-22$ 10-man boxes for infantry, includes an _optional_ heavy and special weapon
-tech-priests (Lords?) will allow you to field sentinals with plasma cannons
-There will be sentinals with heavy bolters
-the valkarie will be a skimmer, and it will be posible to field a whole army mounted in them (This implies a whole army of storm troopsers)
-Doctorines will be replaced with upgrades for individual platoons, mostly based on charactors
-The leman russ box will be constructable as 5 diferent varients, including the concorer, and demolisher. Mostly by way of difering turret weapons
-The chimera box will replace the hellhound by including parts to build a hellhound
-The basalisk box will include parts to build a griffon
-Sentinal boxes will have every weapon posability in them, inculding the prieviously mentioned plasy cannon
-the new ratling models will have bandanas that look (Quote) "Badass"
-Ogryns are going to be (Quote) "Toughf as nails"

My thaughts: YAY!!! I was sad at first when I heard about the new way of doing the infantry squads, but with the "toybox" kits (The 5 man things for 8$) if you want sheer volume, you can get 20 men for 32$, wich is actualy cheeper than we have now.


----------



## leinad-yor

Col. Schafer said:


> -Doctorines will be replaced with upgrades for individual platoons, mostly based on charactors
> 
> I wonder if this will be like SM Characters or will be upgrades to the Officer in Charge. I'm hoping for the later for the fact that will allow the weapons that we want to use and not dictated by the character rules.


----------



## kenzman

Fangio said:


> If a unit is definately getting AP3 though I still want it to be mortars.


I hear that... as a old school valhallan player i have TONS of mortar teams that havent seen action in a long time.


----------



## Dafistofmork

As an ork player, i am getting scared at the thought of ap3 mortars.


----------



## Underground Heretic

New from BOLS


> - Command Squad Boxes will include all the special weapons in plastic (1 of each), 3 different officer heads, several different close combat weapons (Swords, Fists etc), various embellishments, 2 suits of officer armor, one more practical one more dressy, and 4 Cadians with a few new/special heads.
> - The Stormtrooper greens with the shotguns do not imply that IG Stormtroopers will be getting shotguns, but are instead for WH Arbites-style Stormtroopers.
> - Stormtroopers will not be released in the first wave, but instead may be released with an Inquisitor supplement oriented around Planetfall.
> - The new Ratlings are nice, the new psykers, not so much.
> - Commissars still exist in a capacity different to what they do now. They are allowed to attach to certain squads. However once a Commissar Lord is taken they have more freedom and there can be more of them. They are also cheaper(almost half of what they are now).
> - IG Sniper Squads, in addition to getting infiltrate, stealth, rangefinders, and sniper rifles will also get camo cloaks.
> - Vet Squads probably won’t be upgrades for platoons.
> - While sentinels, chimeras, and hellhounds will be able to attach to platoons as support vehicles, demolishers will not.
> - Support Squads are different now and are platoon attachments not command squad attachments.
> - Basic squad loadout will be 10 Lasguns or 9 Lasguns and a Laspistol for 40 points.
> - Platoon Drill will require a vox network.
> - Some squads will have access to heavy flamers.
> - New Catachan plastics will have scaled down arms.
> - No greatcoat plastics.
> - Ogryns will be T5, 4+ save, and FNP for the same price they are now.
> - Ogryns have no new models. At least not yet. The newish ones are current.
> - Some, but not all, tanks will be able to fire sponson weapons as Defensive weapons.
> - Cadian Rough Riders will be in the 1.5 wave.
> - Leman Russ boxes will include parts to make LRBT, Demolisher, Vanquisher, and Exterminator.
> - Chimera boxes will have parts for 3 other variants (including Hellhound). The Chimera will have 6 variants (though some of these sound like they’re just different Chimera weapon options).
> - Basilisk boxes may come with parts for Medusas and Griffons.
> - While you’ll be able to field more armor, you won’t be able to field an armored company as part of the regular codex.
> - And while you’ll be able to field more tanks, the true strength will be the numbers of guardsmen you can field. 110 Points for 25 Guardsmen with nothing but flashlights.
> - The Valkyrie will be different from the FW version, but not any huge difference.
> - A Spearhead Sentinel is one that is equipped with heavier weapons and meant to be the spearhead of an attacking force. It lacks Scout moves or the like but has slightly better front armor and several variant weapons.


Looks very nice.


----------



## bishop5

"- Basic squad loadout will be 10 Lasguns or 9 Lasguns and a Laspistol for 40 points."
"- Some, but not all, tanks will be able to fire sponson weapons as Defensive weapons."
"- Leman Russ boxes will include parts to make LRBT, Demolisher, Vanquisher, and Exterminator."

Loving these rumors; very excited about brushing off the Guard (not so excited about having to paint 100+ guardsmen but hey...)


----------



## kenzman

*sentinal*

Ork players not liking mortars makes me want them ap3 even more! as the xeno fighter rules will most likely not make a comeback  and Valhallans should be feared by orks :biggrin:

Also the note on higher front armor sentinels sounds good. Im tired of my walkers die'n to bolter fire


----------



## Stella Cadente

- The new Ratlings are nice, the new psykers, not so much.
Ratlings are already nice, in fact better than nice, there awesome, and psykers, well they can't get any worse, thats impossible 
- They are also cheaper(almost half of what they are now)
YAY, that means more SS commissars for me
- Platoon Drill will require a vox network.
no biggie, always take one, who wouldn't, apart from those delusional enough to think 200+ guardsmen can stay withing 12" of your main officer
- No greatcoat plastics.
well that was obvious, GW don't do demand and supply or supply and demand


----------



## Vaz

Stella Cadente said:


> - Platoon Drill will require a vox network.
> no biggie, always take one, who wouldn't, apart from those delusional enough to think 200+ guardsmen can stay withing 12" of your main officer


Well, only 20 need to stay in 12". But I'd love to use some Blasts against those .


----------



## Stella Cadente

Vaz said:


> Well, only 20 need to stay in 12". But I'd love to use some Blasts against those .


not if you want the whole army to benefit, not just 20 blokes


----------



## Shugotenshi47

I really hope that the platoon drills will let me field an army similar to the one I already have or at the very least the closet to my current set up which would probably be a Tanith rule set


----------



## Duke Vorian

Sorry if I'm ruining someones 'Thunder' here but this needs to be posted for everyone:



> TROOPS
> 
> Penal Battalion: 50 pts. 1 Custodian and 9 Penal troopers. Ld 8. Rifle and close combat weapons. Scouts, Stubborn, "Desperate".
> 
> Chimera: 55 pts. 12 10 10 Tank, Amphibious, Mobile Command Vehicle. Multi-laser, hull Heavy Bolter, searchlight and smoke launchers. Options: Upgrade Multi-laser to Heavy Flamer or Heavy Bolter - free; hull Heavy Bolter to Heavy Flamer - free; Storm Bolter or Heavy Stubber +10pts, Hunter-Killer Missile +10pts, Dozer Blade +10 pts, Extra Armour +15pts, Camo Netting +20pts.
> 
> FAST ATTACK
> 
> Hellhound: 12 12 10 Tank, Fast. Inferno Cannon: 12" Template, S6 AP4 Heavy 1 (like the previous version but there is no roll to hit and no partials, but reaches 12").
> 
> Devildog: 12 12 10 Tank, Fast. Fusion Cannon: 24" S8 AP1 Heavy 1, Blast, "Fusion".
> 
> Banewolf: 12 12 10 Tank, Fast. Chemical Cannon: S1 AP3 Heavy 1, Template, Poison (wounds on a 2+ to "targets with resistance").
> 
> HEAVY SUPPORT
> 
> - Leman Russ Special Rule: Can choose to move 6" and fire all weapons or fire nothing and move 6" +1D6".
> 
> LR Battle Tank: 14 13 10 Tank. Battle Cannon.
> 
> LR Exterminator: 14 13 10 Tank. Exterminator Autocannon: Heavy 4, Twin-linked.
> 
> LR Vanquisher: 14 13 10 Tank. Vanquisher Cannon: AP2 Heavy 1, +1D6 penetration.
> 
> LR Eradicator: 14 13 10 Tank. Eradicator Nova Cannon: 36" S6 AP4 Heavy 1, Large Blast, Ignores cover saves.
> 
> LR Demolisher: 14 13 11 Tank. Demolisher Siege Cannon.
> 
> LR Punisher: 14 13 11 Tank. Punisher Gatling Cannon: 24" S5 AP- Heavy 20.
> 
> LR Executioner: 14 13 11 Tank. Executioner Plasma Cannon: 36" S7 AP2 Heavy 3.
> 
> Basilisk: 12 10 10 Tank, Open Topped^.
> 
> Medusa: 12 10 10 Tank, Open Topped^. Medusa Siege Gun: 36" S10 AP2, Heavy Artillery 1, Large Blast. "Fortification Buster" Ammunition: 48" S10 AP1 Heavy 1, Blast, +1D6 penetration.
> 
> Colossus: 12 10 10 Tank, Open Topped^. Colossus Siege Cannon: 24-240" S6 AP3 Heavy Artillery 1, Large Blast, Ignores cover saves.
> 
> Griffon: 12 10 10 Tank, Open Topped^. Griffon Heavy Mortar: 12-48" S6 AP4 Heavy Artillery 1, Large Blast, can choose to "repeat" (re-roll?) deviation dice roll.
> 
> Manticore: 12 10 10 Tank. Storm Eagle Missile: 4 only. 24-120" S10 AP4 Heavy Artillery 1D3, Large Blast.
> 
> Deathstrike: 12 12 10 Tank. Deathstrike Missile: 1 only. 12"-960" S10 AP1 Heavy Artillery***, Blast (radius 1D3+3").
> Special Rules:
> - Cannot be fired on Turn 1. Each turn roll a D6, weapon can be fired on a 6. Modifiers: +1 per turn, -1 for each crew stunned or weapon destroyed results sustained. Can always be fired on the roll of a natural 6.
> - Any weapon destoyed results received are ignored, the only effect they have is to delay the launch.
> - Hits on vehicles in the area of the Deathstrike Missile are not calculated at half strength but at S10.
> 
> ^These four can also be enclosed.
> 
> 
> Thats it ... I have heard on the other hand, from the same guy who took the photos, that:
> 
> Ogryns: 25 pts, S5 T5 A3 Sv4+ and have "rabid assault" (Furious Charge?).
> 
> Valkyrie: Skimmer. 24" move. Troops may disembark at any point in its movement, but more than 12" and they take a dangerous terrain check.
> 
> Conscripts: Gone.


All from BoLS. I literally gasped when I saw some of these....if this is true....my God if this is true....


----------



## godzy

just read it to. so much tank love... makes this army look like my next one. heavy 20 at s5? just the dakka of dice rolling...:laugh:


----------



## spitfire6x

*small IG rumour*

Hi, I was in my local GW store today, and got talking about the new IG stuff....something i cant wait for. some stuff might be old news but anyway:

he says he has seen some of the new stuff and he says its awesome

valk wil knock you socks off he says it has a footprint the size of a baneblade

psykers look realy good and one of the powers is a tank busting psykic buillet

plastic HQ which looks awsome with several options and some old heroes make a return. iron hands is one he metioned, but also a whole loads of platton orders which is spread down into your army.

he said the ig stuff is going to be some of the best stuff we have seen for a long time, he also said there is some realy cool plastic sm on its way as well.

sorry about the spelling and enjoy:victory:


----------



## Aenarian

Holy... :shok:

If this is true it was money well spent on starting Imperial Guard.


----------



## Stella Cadente

hopefully the Leman russ Vanquisher will still get the large blast as well


----------



## when in doubt shoot!

Stella Cadente said:


> hopefully the Leman russ Vanquisher will still get the large blast as well


I don't know, I always imagined the vanquishers long cannon to fire a stronger, but less explosive round. 

I like the sound of all those leman russ variants though, punisher? Gatling gun? Awww yeah :biggrin:


----------



## Concrete Hero

My my... And I was just thinking about starting a new army :grin:


----------



## Druchii in Space

Well if that Leman Russ special rule turns out to be true I'll be a very happy bunny. Also liking the ammount of tanks, and ties in to the talk from around the net, and even the pages of White Dwarf.

I note on the new varient Hellhound with the Poison rule, is that meant to say wounds on a 2+ those 'Without' resistance? Although that confuses me anyway as I can't think of anything that has any comment about poison on it, or any other resistance. Unless its a rule that other armies/units will gain as they are updated.

Oh and there would be the heavy 29 tank Skcuzzlebumm mentioned, top gun Heavy twenty and three heavy Bolters below. :grin: Dang if that is right, Fire Warriors, Orks, Guardians and few other units besides are in all kinds of trouble.

Regardless, some very interesting things there, May is becoming all the more interesting as we approach it.


----------



## radical_psyker

Druchii in Space said:


> I note on the new varient Hellhound with the Poison rule, is that meant to say wounds on a 2+ those 'Without' resistance? Although that confuses me anyway as I can't think of anything that has any comment about poison on it, or any other resistance. Unless its a rule that other armies/units will gain as they are updated.


It says "wounds on a 2+ against targets with resistance" as in targets that have a Toughness value. In Spain, they have R in profiles in the place of T for Toughness. This would match up with similar Poisoned weapon concepts.


----------



## Druchii in Space

Can't think of any in 40K who even have poisons, maybe Dark Eldar, but I haven't even glanced at their book in years, never mind read any of their rules. Just oddly worded, there has to be a better way of writing that.

Although as its just rumours, it could well be the way the guy who broke the rumours at BOLS wrote it down. Still can't think of resistance used as a reference to Toughness in the main 40K rulebook though, so forgive me for not having a clue what it meant.


----------



## radical_psyker

Druchii in Space said:


> Can't think of any in 40K who even have poisons, maybe Dark Eldar, but I haven't even glanced at their book in years, never mind read any of their rules. Just oddly worded, there has to be a better way of writing that.
> 
> Although as its just rumours, it could well be the way the guy who broke the rumours at BOLS wrote it down. Still can't think of resistance used as a reference to Toughness in the main 40K rulebook though, so forgive me for not having a clue what it meant.


I didn't know either until some Spanish dude posted on WarSeer and explained it.  It's just part and parcel of transfering concepts between different languages I guess.


----------



## Druchii in Space

Ah, gotcha. Hehe, I don't feel so much of a fool now, didn't even think about the fact the rumour came from another language site and it was one of those 'lost in Translation' moments, thanks for clearing that up. :good:

Heh, back on topic and upon reading them a second time it occurs to me if this is right, we have some serious Guard tank kits incoming over the next year or so. 
Looking at it I'm wondering how they plan on breaking them down. Two or three different Leman based Kits, then three varients based in the Basilisk box, three in the Hellhound and three in the griffon? 

That sounds mad and If so, we'll have some crazy spare parts for conversions, especially for those among us who have both Guard and Orks. :grin: Regardless, its certainly seems an ambitious Codex from GW if these rumours are right.


----------



## Capt.Al'rahhem

Ok, now I'm very interested. Lowering the points of the Chimera may just offset the cost of having to get a whole platoon to replace the Armored Fist squad in my Mech. IG company.

I'm liking all the tank love. Only problem with that is, I have a company of regular LR is the box waiting to be assembled, now if I really like any of the new varients I'll have to convert them.

Wow, with all the long range artillery it like they're making allot of it just for Apocalypse which is cool with me. I hope they come out with an all plastic kit for the Manticore. I'm not real fond of the FW one.

Nice to see the IG becoming a real treadheads dream. Hope I don't have to change my army too much. I hope forge world comes out with rules for AC armedChimeras quickly the reflect the lowered pts.


----------



## Vaz

when in doubt said:


> I don't know, I always imagined the vanquishers long cannon to fire a stronger, but less explosive round.
> 
> I like the sound of all those leman russ variants though, punisher? Gatling gun? Awww yeah :biggrin:


Nah, it better have a Rifle and a Pistol Sponsons.

The Vanquisher can choose to fire either standard ammunition, or the tank busting round.


----------



## Stella Cadente

when in doubt said:


> I don't know, I always imagined the vanquishers long cannon to fire a stronger, but less explosive round.


well there supposed to be able to fire both fluff wise, as the Vanquisher shell like the Vanquisher barrel isn't a mass produced item, so being only able ti fire that shell would mean it would carry an ammo load too ineffective for combat use


Vaz said:


> The Vanquisher can choose to fire either standard ammunition, or the tank busting round.


if it stays as that, then I'll be happy, I love the Vanquisher too much to reduce it to ONLY tank hunting, although I will be intrigued to see if it has any special rules once it has penetrated, since we no longer have an ordnance damage table and the Vanquisher is supposed to be able to kill Titans, I would expect at least a +1 to damage rolls


----------



## comrade

Very interested in the Penal Squad, seems interesting

They got rid of consripts.... damn, but maybe these penal legions will replace them, with amybe a few cool special rules... hopefully.

Vehicles.. meh, I'll still be using basilisks.


----------



## Cole Deschain

Bah. Not all of us are treadheads, though.


----------



## Talos

Well I bet there will be alot of new Guard armies spring up when this codex hits. My army is mostly inf heavy you know overwhelm them with bodies till they run out of ammo. But after reading this I may have to go for armoured fist backed up by a number of tanks. Love to heavy 20 hope it has a cool brutal looking machine gun on it. 
Look good so far, I was hoping the new Pyskar models would be good but as said they cant be any worse and as Traitor guard could just use the forgeworld ones.

Just had a look though the tanks again and anybody here going to use a deathstrike. Unless they arnt many points I dont really see a point. I suppose it is str 10 ap1 and I think you can get extra inchs on the blast radius. But it can only fire once and it seems a bit random when it will fire. So thoughts on the deathstrike ?


----------



## Johnathanswift

Ah luck it just so happens that I am fluent In spanish and posses a 4th ed codex in spanish, so to clarify some of the confusion "Fusion" means melta, the repeat means a reroll, and rabid assult is indeed furious charge, If someone could get me a link to the original spanish page I can also find out about anything else that is unclear. 

Edit: Psiker is correct about resitance


----------



## Casmiricus

I will be very, very unhappy if my conscripts are gone.

VERY UNHAPPY!


----------



## Someguy

More stuff, now a 4th hand rumour posted at the Eternity Gate by Treadhead Arisen via Mkoll at Boot Camp and Count de Money at Warseer.

My own take on this is that it's not entirely up to date. The guy talks about discussing things with the designers while they were still WIP rules. I found it an interesting read, but don't take it for granted. The vehicle section in particular is very different to what we're hearing from the spanish sources, but there's not a lot we can read into that either way.

Here you go anyway.



> A disclaimer. Games Workshop is currently adding the final touches to the IG Codex and as such any info you read here is not guaranteed by myself. What I present here is info I have gathered from various sources one of which is a mock up of the Codex which may be a key part in the final production. As the codex has yet to be formally prepared for print all info is subject to change and/or be removed as the design and test teams of this Codex see fit. I ask anyone reposting this information elsewhere simply carry this disclaimer with it. Thank you.
> 
> Releases;
> 
> Launch Wave(Wave 1);
> Codex
> Primaris Psyker(2 Metal Models)
> Ratling Snipers(4 Metal Models
> Sentinel(Recut to contain a huge amount of options for various outfittings)
> Cadian Command Squad(Officer and 4 Guardsmen. A huge box of goodies. This will contain 2 different Officer looks as well as 4 Cadians with various head, pouches and weapons. The beautiful thing here is all Special Weapons in plastic a several CC Officer weapons as well)
> Valkyrie
> Cadian Shock Troops
> Catachan Jungle Fighters
> 
> **Please note that originally a Catachan Command Squad and "new" recut of the models was meant to to be released here. This however has disappeared from my list**
> 
> Wave 1.5
> This wave is technically a multi wave of various armies being planned with Planet Strike. As such this may be before or after the 2nd wave release. This one is the most unlikely of them all and has thus far only been alluded to me by some people.
> Modern Rough Riders(I cannot confirm bikes instead of horses but I have been told.....less Fantasy more gritty sci-fi)
> Storm Troopers/Arbite Riot Team(I do not know if these are the same release or separate however they are plastic and will be less Kasrkin, more Imperium)
> Naval Fleet Officer Adjutant(1 Model)
> Artillery Overseer(1 Model)
> 
> Wave 2
> Leman Russ Recut(Will include 4 variants)
> Chimera Recut(Will include the Chimera, Hellhound, Salamander and various outfitting options)
> Commissar Lord and Commissars(The new lord is plastic and will be released at the same time as 2 new metal models, giving us 5 metal Commissars and a plastic lord)
> 
> Wave 3/Unknown
> These are things that are being released eventually I am told but have no exact info when. The only thing I am pretty sure on is that they will not be released at the time of the First wave.
> Artillery Tank(Basilisk and 2/3 other variants. My bet is for sure Griffin and Medusa and have heard the word Manticore thrown around)
> Veteran Models(Metal not sure if they are meant to be officers or Veteran soliders)
> 
> Army Wide Rules;
> 
> Platoon Fire Drill
> This rule will allow any platoon that is equipped with a Vox network in ALL squads to shoot through each other without granting the enemy cover saves. This will not effect each platoon as a whole as only members of the same platoon can fire through one another.
> - However there is talk of how people will keep track of who is who when the game starts without conversions. As such this may be scrapped or changed to effect every unit that has a vox provided a Master Vox is taken in each Command Squad.
> 
> Lumbering Behemoth
> This rule is meant to show the Leman Russ as the workhorse of the Imperium. As such any Leman Russ(I have been told just Leman Russ this could mean all or just the MBT though)to fire all Offensive weapons as defensive weapons when they have moved a max of 6 inches. Note however firing the Ordnance of any such vehicle will still not allow it to fire other weapons.
> - This is/was a variant that allowed you to fire the Battle Cannon and any one weapon with it, this however has not been heard by my ears for sometime now.
> 
> Advisers
> Attached the Command Squad of the officer in charge are various Advisers/Aides from different factions able to assist the guard in their fight.
> - Although about 12 have been tossed around these 4 I have heard several times;
> Priest 45 Points - Allows the entire army, once per game to fleet and gain +1 attack and reroll all failed to hits. May only happen in the IG players turn. Must be declared in the shooting phase.
> Naval Attachment 25 Points - This close support officer is observing the battle and is able to call in pin point strikes from the might ships of the Imperium in orbit. Once per game an Orbital Bombardment may be used in the IG players shooting phase. This strike will only scatter if a HIT is not rolled, and will only scatter D6 inches.
> Artillery Observer 40 Points - Can call in long range artillery well outside the active warzone. This can be used to call up to 3 Earthshaker rounds per game, they may come in any shooting phase the IG player wishes and can all be used at once or separately. They will always scatter 2D6 inches.
> Commissar Lord 40 Points - This man can install the fear and faith into any loyal servant. This unit will allow up to 10 Commissars to be attached to the Regiment rather than the usual 5 and will be able to once per game rally any and all fleeing IG units on the table automatically.
> 
> The Units
> HQ
> 
> The HQ is home to Special Characters of the IG as well as the required Field Command Platoon. Honestly the Special Characters have been flying around and there are about 18 choices with only 6 or so making it into the book. Personally I think we will see; Yarrik, Cain, Gaunt, Creed, and two or 3 of the new ones.
> 
> Field Command Platoon.
> Consists of 1 Commanding Officer or Junior Commanding Officer(Roughly a SO or HSO)with 4 guardsmen. The unit can then add up to 1 of each Adviser. Can be taken as "Grenadiers" instead of regular Guard.(Also talk of this allowing up to 3 Storm Trooper squads to be taken as troops) May take a Chimera or Salamander Command Vehicle.
> 0-2 Veteran Squads(Replaced with Storm Troopers if the Grenadier option is taken)
> 0-2 Special Weapon Squads
> 0-2 Heavy Weapon Squads
> Max of 5 Squads can be taken.
> 
> Primaris Psyker. Basically the Guard version of a Space Marine Librarian. Has Guardsmen stats, but has several powers it can choose from and can purchase a hood. This has been moved between its own choice and an adviser option several times. **When I mentioned that they were not so nice I meant the model, the rules will be fun i think sorry for any confusion)**
> 
> Cadet? Commissars 0-5. These may be placed in any unit within an IG platoon. One per unit max. Do not use up an HQ choice. Also on the subject that 3 Heavy Bolter Commissar squad I have read about while very fluffy seems to be absent from anything I have seen. I am not sure if this was wishlisting that got absorbed or if I missed it.
> 
> Elite
> 
> Veteran Squads(No infiltrate)
> 
> Storm Trooper Squads
> 
> Sniper Team - 6 Models, all armed with Sniper Rifles, Camo Cloaks, Stealth[This would give them Stealth twice as the Camo Cloak gives them it too.....unless they are meant to get +2 to all cover saves], Range Finders and Infiltrate.
> *Also this squad has been considered to be moved as a 0-1 platoon option rather than an elite choice*
> 
> Ogryns, I was mistaken here. The talk is T5 or FNP not both. Well at one time it was both but it was considered to "hard" for them. Nothing much changes except that someone wants 3A 3W for the same points.
> 
> Ratlings - 10 Models, all with Sniper Rifles and BS 3[So I have read could change but might make our Sniper teams more elite]and Stealth.
> Their old rule for being small has simply been replaced for stealth. At 10 points each they are a steal.
> 
> Spearhead Sentinels - That is right Armour in out elite section! Actually not much basically just a sentinel with 3 different weapons(Lascannon, Multi Melta, Plasma Cannon and 11 front Armour) This is the one I am most unsure about. The problem is whether to include them all as Sentinels or have two entries, and if so where do the entries go.
> 
> Troops
> 
> We have only one troop choice. It is the Infantry Platoon. **I know some talk of Penal Legion troops has been muttered somewhere. I cannot say for sure if these will make it. If they do they may very well be troops**
> 
> Platoon Command(May take Chimera)
> 2-5 Infantry Squads(4 points each, may take 2 special weapons OR 1 Special and 1 Heavy, May take Chimera)
> 0-2 Heavy Weapon Squads(May not take Chimera)
> 0-2 Special Weapon Squads(May take Chimera)
> *0-1 Sniper Team(May not take Chimera)
> 5 Squads + Platoon Command Max
> Attachment; if all units have a Chimera then a Hellhound may be taken as part of the Platoon and not as a FA slot. If all units do not have a Chimera the squad may have a Scout Sentinel or Salamander Scout Vehicle Attached instead.
> 
> -Chimeras have a wide variety of weapons including the popular Auto Cannon and a new one. The rules are virtually identical to the ones located in the IA update-
> 
> Fast Attack
> 
> **Honestly the Vehicles that this new Spanish site has posted have never come to me. I will not say for sure they aren't real as BoLS has had confirmations on one of them**
> 
> Hellhound
> 
> Salamander Scout Vehicle
> 
> Scout Sentinel (See Spearhead) - This variant would be AV 10 all around, have scout and be equipped with a Heavy Bolter, Heavy Flamer, Autocannon, Multi Laser or twin CC Weapons.
> 
> Vendetta/Vulture Gunship - 24 inch fast skimmer, may shoot all weapon no matter how fast it moves. Various loadouts
> 
> Valkyrie - 24 inch fast skimmer. May carry Storm Troopers or Veteran Squads and deploy them even after moving 24 inches.
> 
> Rough Riders
> 
> Heavy Support
> 
> **Honestly the Vehicles that this new Spanish site has posted have never come to me. I will not say for sure they aren't real as BoLS has had confirmations on one of them**
> 
> Leman Russ Squadron - The Squadron has AV 14 at the front. Although people claim a 13 so this could change but I have heard no such change. This unit may ONLY be MBTs with no variants. The Squadron does NOT act like a Squadron and the vehicles may be placed separate. The choice is a 0-1.
> *This unit is one of the most unsure things around. Honestly GW wants it in there. The Leman Russ is EVERYWHERE the guard are, however playtesters are finding this 600ish point unit is "cheesy" If my opinion counts it will make it into the codex for fluff sake*
> 
> Leman Russ
> Leman Russ Vanquisher
> Leman Russ Demolisher
> Leman Russ Exterminator
> *These are the only 4 I know for sure are being a "shoe in" for the codex. There are other variants being worked on/debated*
> 
> Basilisk
> Griffin
> Medusa
> *Medusa is a possibility*
> 
> Well I think that covers the main bulk of what I know for sure. As I said things change and I will try to update what I hear and see and answer any questions as best I can.


----------



## Ste

good find there


----------



## Capt.Al'rahhem

Does anyone else think the write new codexes so everyone has to change the army and start again.

WTF? No conscripts (which i don't use but lots of people do), no Chimeras for heavy weap. squads (how exactly are we supposed to make a mech. army?).

I do like the new tanks and chimera varients. Oh and I'm so happy that their making plastic salamander kits, after I've purchased 3 from FW. They seem to be trying to put FW out business, with all the new plastics, which is strange cause their at least sister companies.

I'm still waiting to past judgement but most of what I've seen it just F#@*s up everybodies army.


----------



## Someguy

Capt.Al'rahhem said:


> Does anyone else think the write new codexes so everyone has to change the army and start again.
> 
> WTF? No conscripts (which i don't use but lots of people do), no Chimeras for heavy weap. squads (how exactly are we supposed to make a mech. army?).


Well you could try not taking heavy weapon squads, or other stuff that can't take a chimera. It's still possible to make a mech army. Lots of armies have units that can't have transports. 

I agree that it's a bit different to how it was, but actually this doesn't seem like a case of people having to throw models away much at all. The basic organisation and armament of squads is remaining exactly the same as far as I can tell, other than that you may have the option for a second special weapon if you don't take a heavy. You won't have to change anything much to do with either your infantry or tanks.

I have a friend whose Nid army became totally unuseable when the new codex came out. He had about 10 models that were still legal. I don't think there's a single IG model that will go from legal to illegal with this codex. Maybe the odd character.


----------



## Ztrain

I don't think their putting them out of busness. That's kinda what FW is there for in my opinion. To make low run, more experimental models and rules. Find out what works and what doesn't then over time GW refines and tunes those items and the real popular ones get integrated in to the GW catalog. 

Z


----------



## rob12763

Great now if they could come up with plastic Mordians and Valhallans.Rob


----------



## Capt.Al'rahhem

I already have Hvy Weap. squads the have their own Chimera, so now in couple months I'll have to stop using them? I just think they should think about the armies they already allow when they make a new codexs. I pretty sure it's happened to every army at one time or another, it just sux when it's yours.

I know I'm just bitching about this allot. I'm just getting back into 40k and have been trying to get my IG army compleatly done and painted. Now it's all gonna change. I'm just a lil bit bitter. 

I'll wait for it come out and see how it is.


----------



## radical_psyker

Capt.Al'rahhem said:


> I already have Hvy Weap. squads the have their own Chimera, so now in couple months I'll have to stop using them? I just think they should think about the armies they already allow when they make a new codexs. I pretty sure it's happened to every army at one time or another, it just sux when it's yours.
> 
> I know I'm just bitching about this allot. I'm just getting back into 40k and have been trying to get my IG army compleatly done and painted. Now it's all gonna change. I'm just a lil bit bitter.
> 
> I'll wait for it come out and see how it is.


Yes do please stop bitching. This happens with every new Codex. And everything is rumours so far anyway, so wait til the Codex is actually released before reaching for the razor blade.

Be thankful that in this case you're getting a more powerful amped-up Codex rather than a nerfed one.


----------



## Timesplitter

As with the coming of all codex's and changes, it will take time to adjust. Many players from what I have noticed tend to be players of habit, and with every new codex takes them out of their comfort zone. There will always be mixed feelings, and I am no master about IG, but from what I have been reading, many of the changes are being highly accepted and are making IG much more of a viable army.


----------



## leinad-yor

Timesplitter said:


> As with the coming of all codex's and changes, it will take time to adjust. Many players from what I have noticed tend to be players of habit, and with every new codex takes them out of their comfort zone. There will always be mixed feelings, and I am no master about IG, but from what I have been reading, many of the changes are being highly accepted and are making IG much more of a viable army.



Very true, I play Guard and the only constants that are in my lists are platoons of infantry, and they are changing all of the time. I don't think that I've played the same list more than once (not counting tournaments), I'm always trying out new combos just to see how things can and can't work together. I don't think there is one catch all list for the Guard, I don't count the infantry horde army.

I'm really looking forward the the new codex and some of the rumors are ideal for me and the ways I like to play. If weapon squads do get put into platoons then I may have some maxed out platoons in the near future. And I don't think I'll know what to do with myself if that rumored tank list makes it into the codex.

Leinad


----------



## Cole Deschain

radical_psyker said:


> Yes do please stop bitching.


Shan't.



> Be thankful that in this case you're getting a more powerful amped-up Codex rather than a nerfed one.


Since it's perfectly easy to win with Guard these days? I don't see that a power spike was at all in order.


----------



## Siege

Seriously some people are never happy, nerfed.. spiked.. blah blah. 

If half of these rumours turn out to be true I think most Guard players will be pretty happy, I know a mate of mine who plays IG is really looking forward to the new codex.


----------



## Fumble Tumble

nice mate good find..... finally those IG will stand up to things like SM and Daemons and CSM and Tau and such..... because no offence to IG players out there but whenever i see someone playing with IG they seem to be losing but it could just be their tactics please dont take offence


----------



## ACoz

Sorry to be a grammar/spelling cop, but the word is _codices_, when you wanna say _codex_ in the plural.

Thank you, rant over.


----------



## chrisman 007

Cole Deschain said:


> Since it's perfectly easy to win with Guard these days? I don't see that a power spike was at all in order.


True, but I still like the power spike.


----------



## Timesplitter

I do agree I seem to see IG losing at my local store... but in some games I'll walk by, see almost no IG on the board.. say "wow they got crushed" then turn back 2min later and the board is filled with flankers and IG just rolls. Sometimes it works.. others it doesn't.. 

That is what one gets for having so many units... Heck I was watching a 10k Apoc battle... 2 IG vs 2 SM... one IG had over 480 models while the other only had 60, so there are many different ways to play... personally I love seeing the firepower.


----------



## CommissarHorn

Yeah I use vets, so for every sm the enemy has, i've got half a guardsmen. =)


----------



## colonel gator

you say that theres going to be a cadian as well as catachan command squad but ive been repeatedley told that catachans are being ditched as a codex army by games-workshop so why would they make a plastic command squad for them? ....it may not be true but its what ive been told.


----------



## Syph

New picture of a Leman Russ variant materialised on BoLS:


----------



## Wolf_Lord_Skoll

That seems to support the Leman Russ "Punisher" variant, which means one would assume that there is a fair bit of credibility behind the update on page 22 of this thread, which introducted a fari few new tanks.


----------



## Widowmaker666

colonel gator said:


> you say that theres going to be a cadian as well as catachan command squad but ive been repeatedley told that catachans are being ditched as a codex army by games-workshop so why would they make a plastic command squad for them? ....it may not be true but its what ive been told.


They aren't making a Catachan codex but like in the 4th edition guard codex I'm guessing they will have a way to have jungle fighters (special charecter, etc.)


----------



## Widowmaker666

What is that turret weapon on the russ?


----------



## Vaz

Damn... I wanted the Punisher to have a Sniper Rifle and Pistol Sponsons =(. Maybe a shotgun as a Hull Mount.

Still, that mini gatcan looks safe. Heavy 6 Str 6 AP4? Can't see them putting the MegaBolter in Standard 40K.


----------



## Spot The Grot

Looks awesome. Wouldn't mind getting one.

Its nice to see a Russ with a decent turret gun.


----------



## Lord_Murdock

So that's the "Heavy 29 Tank"... Yep, the Punisher Gattler and 3 heavy bolters would make it heavy 29 alright... Heavy 32 with the heavy stubber. I might just want to get a few of those, or convert some of my own (I've been looking for an excuse to mount a Hellblaster Volleygun onto a tank for quite some time now...).

Pretty neat, I must say.


----------



## Djinn24

Vnery nice amd damn why must the tempt me so!


----------



## Fangio

Vaz said:


> Damn... I wanted the Punisher to have a Sniper Rifle and Pistol Sponsons =(. Maybe a shotgun as a Hull Mount.


LOL

"And the more this priest spoke to me about the Emperor, his sons and the treachery.. I realised that a lot of people had to die..."

Eversor+Vindicare= Punisher

Now back on topic - that tank seems so ridiculously pointless. Why would you bother with a gatling tank? I mean Christ knows they have a hard enough time remembering how to build basic tanks and I fail to see why the mechanicum would sanction the creation of yet another variant. What ever happened to "arghh scary new ideas" and Techpriest whipering in fear at the very concept of imagination?


----------



## leinad-yor

They will probably just fluff it away as an ancient STC that has finally been sanctioned by Mars and has been put into full construction. Deemed very useful in engagements with zenos hoard forces like Orks and Tyranids.


----------



## Druchii in Space

Oh now that looks very nice, I'm really looking forward to seeing more snippets the closer we come to May. :biggrin:


----------



## The Sullen One

I think I've just become a convert to the Imperial Guard.


----------



## Casmiricus

May can't come soon enough!


----------



## bon_jovi

I was at the seminar where they talked about the guard releases. For definate is Plastic Catachan and Cadian Command squads, Plastic Ratlings, Plastic Valk, New Battleforce for Catachans and Cadians, recut Sentinals with everything in 1 box, 4 new blisters primaris Psyker, Commisar lord, Belive it or not i cant remember the other 2. Oh, sly marbo is back but i have never seen the old model so i don't know if its new or not. Errr Doctrines Have definatly gone, 22 "armoured vehicles" in the book including another skimmer/flyer. All they said on the guardsmen boxs are they will be in squad boxes of 10, whatever that means?. Thats about all i can remember, (i was hung over!) I know most of this is all but confirmed anyway but, its definatly comfirmed now.


----------



## comrade

I don't know why anybody didnt put this up, so here it is:


----------



## bishop5

Wow, that's looking awesome!
Can't wait to get my grubby mits on these!


----------



## scruff

Can't wait to laugh and say 'I Told You So' to every single staff member in my GW =P
Seriously, how many of us knew about this November?


----------



## Stella Cadente

great googly moogly, they looks great, ratlings look shit, better buy some old ones fast


----------



## Vaz

Plasma Cannon Sentinels? Whoop =D

Not keen on the Ratlings, and I really, really do like that Officer of the Fleet. Really, really. Reminds me of Leoten Semper. How it should be.


----------



## when in doubt shoot!

look at the command sprue dammnit! There's a sniper arm with camo cloak! That is several shades of awesome :biggrin: 

plus rep to you good sir!


----------



## * Luke T *

That Fleet Officer should cool, let's just hope he dosnt cost a sh*t load of points. Hope they make the priets more effective or cheaper! I just got a IG Codex the other day, bad timing I guess.


----------



## Marshal Balian

Curse the US Army servers and their blocking content.


----------



## Fangio

Marshal Balian said:


> Curse the US Army servers and their blocking content.


If you like Marshall I will email them to you. Just pm me.


----------



## Marshal Balian

Thanks man. you are awsome. I was going insane not being able to look at it. PM sent.


----------



## Fangio

email sent. I hope it works.

edit: rereading the caption below the fleet officer I noticed that he makes your enemies get -1 to their reserve rolls. That does sound pretty cool. Also that psyker guy makes your reserves get +1. Sweet if you are packing that gorgeous Valkyrie.


----------



## Lord_Murdock

I like the model for the Fleet Officer, it goes well with my Mordian army. I wonder how many of these new advisers you can have in one command squad (if there's a limit)...


----------



## Marshal Balian

You are the man Fangio. Thank you so very much. I wish I could access bell of lost souls from here in the desert.


----------



## Fangio

Hey was looking on the bell of souls site and found more pics.





There is also a detailled look at some of the new toys available but due to points being ther I felt it best to simply link it:
http://belloflostsouls.blogspot.com/

ps: I'll email you these too, Balian.

edit: I hope they work this time, how do you embed easily anyway?
Also I'm sure I like the psyker. He looks too much like an angry grandfather too me.


----------



## when in doubt shoot!

ah yes, these will be:
1: A random guardsman, maybe made with bits from the command squad box?
2: Sniper (the ones with ballistic skill 4) with the sniper arm from the command box
3rimaris level psyker don't like them myself but I've never used psykers so, meh
4: I can just make out "commisar lord" underneath him. That is an awesome model!


----------



## Fangio

Damnit I can't seem to upload pics on this website properly. Could someone tell me how to upload/embed them like Comrade has for example?


----------



## Syph

Fangio said:


> Damnit I can't seem to upload pics on this website properly. Could someone tell me how to upload/embed them like Comrade has for example?


Your best bet is to sign up to Photobucket.com and upload your pictures to there. Once they're uploaded, there's a link to copy and paste which automatically shows the pictures on the forum using the


----------



## Fangio

tons thanks!


----------



## Cadian81st

Does anyone know what the new astropath does? I was attempting to make out his rules under the picture and all I could get was "the astropath can transmit and receive ______ orders, and adds +1 to your reserve rolls"

Brilliant model as well.


----------



## radical_psyker

Cadian81st said:


> Does anyone know what the new astropath does? I was attempting to make out his rules under the picture and all I could get was "the astropath can transmit and receive ______ orders, and adds +1 to your reserve rolls"


The missing word is "covert".


----------



## Wolf_Lord_Skoll

So... what does that mean? :laugh:


----------



## Stella Cadente

Wolf_Lord_Skoll said:


> So... what does that mean? :laugh:


it means the astropath can transmit and receive covert orders, and *adds +1 to your reserve rolls*, its right there


----------



## radical_psyker

Covert means secret. Whether that is a game term or just descriptive, we'll have to wait and see. My understanding is that the Vox network is an important part of the Orders system in the new Codex, so it may be part of that. It certainly sounds like the Astropath will have some kind of game effect relating to Orders.


----------



## nightfish

"There are rumoured to be 21 “variants” of tank in the new Codex. It is unclear what exactly constitutes a variant though. It has been rumoured that at least one old style of artillary tank, possibly the Griffon, will make a return."

FW might get agitated about this since they produce most types. I can't see there being 21 types, just seems too high and I am thinking that a lot of them might be - 'opportunities for modelling' i.e. like the Chaos Dreadnought / current chimera. At best I think a return for the Griffon and maybe the Leman Russ Exterminator might be a conservative suggestion.


----------



## bishop5

nightfish said:


> "There are rumoured to be 21 “variants” of tank in the new Codex. It is unclear what exactly constitutes a variant though. It has been rumoured that at least one old style of artillary tank, possibly the Griffon, will make a return."
> 
> FW might get agitated about this since they produce most types. I can't see there being 21 types, just seems too high and I am thinking that a lot of them might be - 'opportunities for modelling' i.e. like the Chaos Dreadnought / current chimera. At best I think a return for the Griffon and maybe the Leman Russ Exterminator might be a conservative suggestion.


Why would FW get agitated? They're part of GW and some of the better kits they've made have come out in plastic as part of the main lines (Vindicator).

You're also forgetting that a lot of the varients can be made by swapping a weapon on a turret - most of the sponson options will remain the same. Not exactly too much work there, really. There's like, two hull configurations, Chimera and Leman Russ.

Plus the new release scheme for GW is write a lot of shite in the codex, release some models with the codex and then more later on.


----------



## radical_psyker

GW France had a pdf up that was a reference sheet of all the upcoming Imperial Guard units, tanks and weapons. It basically confirmed all the Spanish list rumours and gave us a whole heap more including new special characters. Not sure what link to give you (as the GW link is now 404), so will opt for WarSeer:

http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=182510&page=46

*chadenej* over at WarSeer did up a nice little list of the page contents going off the page listings of the reference sheet:



> HQ
> Page 30: Company Commander
> Page 31: Astropath, Bodyguard, Master of Artillery
> Page 32: Commissar, Commissar Lord
> Page 33: Primaris Psyker
> Page 34: Enginseer, Servitor
> Page 35: Ministorum Priest
> 
> Troops
> Page 36: Platoon leader, Guardsman
> Page 37: Sergeant, Conscript
> Page 38: Heavy Weapon Team
> 
> Elite
> Page 40: Veteran Sergeant, Veteran, Veteran Heavy Weapon Team
> Page 41: Penal Custodian, Penal Legionnaire
> Page 42: Ogryn, Bone 'ead
> Page 43: Ratling
> Page 44: Rough Rider, Rough Rider Sergeant
> Page 45: Sentinel
> Page 46: Stormtroopers
> Page 47: Sanctioned Pysker, Mentor
> 
> Heavy Support
> Page 48, 49: LRBT + variants
> Page 50: Hellhound + variants
> Page 51: Hydra
> Page 52, 53 : Basilisk + variants
> Page 54: Manticore
> Page 55: Deathstrike
> Page 56: Valkyrie + Vendetta
> 
> Special Characters
> Page 57: Jaran Kell + Ursakar Creed
> Page 59: Lukas Bastonne
> Page 60: Straken
> Page 61: Marbo
> Page 62: Harker
> Page 63: Yarrick
> Page 64: Al'rahen
> Page 65: Chenkov
> Page 66: Kamir
> Page 67: Nork Leddog
> 
> Weapons
> Page 68 to 70
> 
> Ok, seems there is no fast attack with this organisation...


----------



## Lord Lucius

NORK DEDDOGS BAAAACK!!!! whoop
are they re releasing the special characters or making new models?


----------



## bishop5

WarSeer said:


> Name Ws Bs St To Wo In At Ld Sv
> Astropath 3 4 3 3 1 3 1 7 5+
> Captain Al’rahem 4 4 3 3 2 3 2 9 5+
> Rough Riders 3 3 3 3 1 3 1 7 5+
> platoon commander 4 4 3 3 1 3 2 8 5+
> Colonel Straken 5 4 6 4 3 3 3 9 3+
> Captain Chenkov 4 4 3 3 2 3 2 9 4+
> Company Commander 4 4 3 3 3 3 3 9 5+
> Commissar 4 4 3 3 1 3 2 9 5+
> Commissar Yarrik 5 5 3 4 3 3 3 10 4+
> Conscript 2 2 3 3 3 3 1 5 5+
> Heavy Weapons team 3 3 3 3 2 3 2 7 5+
> Veteran heavy weapons team 3 4 3 3 2 3 2 7 5+
> Guardsmen 3 3 3 3 1 3 1 7 5+
> Garde du corps 4 4 3 3 1 3 2 7 5+
> Penal Guard 3 3 3 3 1 3 2 8 5+
> Bone head 4 3 5 5 3 2 4 7 5+
> Jarran Kell 4 4 3 3 2 4 2 8 4+
> Penal legionairre 3 3 3 3 1 3 2 8 5+
> Lukas Bastonne 4 4 3 3 1 3 2 10 4+
> Master of Ordinance 3 4 3 3 1 3 1 7 5+
> Mentor 3 3 3 3 1 3 2 9 5+
> Moghol Kamir 4 3 3 3 2 3 3 8 5+
> Nork Dedog 4 3 5 5 3 3 4 8 4+
> Fleet Officer 3 4 3 3 1 3 1 7 5+
> Ogryn 4 3 5 5 3 2 3 6 5+
> Ministorum 3 3 3 3 1 3 2 7 5+
> Sanctioned Psyker 2 3 2 3 1 3 1 9 5+
> Primaris Psyker 4 4 3 3 2 3 3 9 5+
> Ratling 2 4 2 2 1 4 1 6 5+
> Commissar Lord 5 5 3 3 3 3 3 10 5+
> Sergeant 3 3 3 3 1 3 2 8 5+
> 
> 
> 
> Name Ws Bs St To Wo In At Ld Sv
> Artillery Sergeant Harker 4 4 4 3 1 3 2 8 5+
> Rough Rider Sergeant 3 3 3 3 1 3 2 8 5+
> Shock Troop sergeant 3 4 3 3 1 3 2 8 4+
> Veteran Sergeant 3 4 3 3 1 3 2 8 5+
> Servitor 3 3 3 3 1 3 1 8 4+
> Sly Marbo 5 5 3 3 2 5 4 7 5+
> Techpriest 3 3 3 3 1 3 1 8 3+
> Shock Troops 3 4 3 3 1 3 1 7 4+
> Usarker Creed 4 4 3 3 3 3 3 10 4+
> Veteran 3 4 3 3 1 3 1 7 5+
> 
> Weapons
> Name Range St Ap type
> Autocannon 48 7 4 Heavy 2
> Exterminator Autocannon 48 7 4 Heavy 4, Twin Linked
> Hydra Autocannon 72 7 4 Heavy 2
> Bolter 24 4 5 Rapid Fire
> Heavy Bolter 36 5 4 Heavy 3
> Chemical Cannon Template 1 3 Poison (2+)
> Melta Cannon 24 8 1 Small blast, Melta
> Punisher Gatling Cannon 24 5 - Heavy 20
> Inferno Cannon Template* 6 4 Heavy 1
> Lascannon 48 9 2 Heavy 1
> Eradicator Nova Cannon 36 6 4 Heavy 1, Large blast*
> Executioner Plasma Cannon 36 7 2 Heavy 3, small blast.
> Vanquisher cannon 72 8 2 Heavy 1*
> Demolition Charge 6 8 2 Assault 1, Large Blast, One use only.
> Storm Bolter 24 4 5 Assault 2
> Meltagun 12 8 1 Assault 1, Melta
> 
> Name Range St Ap Type
> Lasgun 24 3 - Rapid Fire
> Shotgun 12 3 - Assault 2
> Hellgun 18 3 3 Rapid Fire
> Sniper Rifle 36 X 6 Heavy 1, Sniper
> Flamer Template 4 5 Assault 1
> Heavy flamer Template 5 4 Assault 1
> Grenade launcher (Krak 24 6 4 Assault 1
> Grenade Lancher (frag 24 3 6 Assault 1, Blast.
> Missile Launcher (Kra 48 8 3 Heavy 1
> Missile Launcher (frag 48 4 6 Heavy 1, Blast.
> Plasma Gun 24 7 2 Rapid fire, Gets hot
> Plasma Cannon 36 7 2 Heavy 1, Small blast, Gets hot.
> Multiple Rocket Launcher 24 4 6 Heavy 1, Large Blast.
> Hellfury Missile 72 4 5 Heavy 1, Large Blast, One use Only
> Heavy Stubber 36 4 6 Heavy 3
> Mortar 48 4 6 Heavy 1, Small blast, barrage
> Multi Melta 24 8 1 Heavy 1, melta
> Multi Laser 36 6 6 Heavy 3
> Medusa Bunker Buster 48 10 1 Heavy 1, Blast.
> Bolt Pistol 12 4 5 Pistol
> Laspistol 12 3 - Pistol
> Plasma Pistol 12 7 2 Pistol
> Hellpistol 6 3 3 Pistol
> Ripper gun 12 5 - Assault 3
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Artillery
> Name Range S Ap Type
> Demolisher Cannon 24 10 1 Ordinance, Large Blast
> Earthshaker Cannon 36-240 9 3 Ordinance, Large Blast
> Medusa Cannon 36 10 2 Ordinance, Large Blast.
> Deathstrike Missile 12-unlimited 10 1 Ordinance barrage, D3+3” Explosion, one Use only
> Hellstrike Missile 72 8 3 Ordinance 1, One use only
> Griffon Mortar 12-48 6 4 Ordinance barrage, Large Blast
> Colossus Siege mortar 24-240 6 3 Ordinance, Large Blast
> Battlecannon 72 8 3 Ordinance, Large Blast
> Storm Eagle Rockets 24-120 10 4 Ordinance 1D3, Barrage, Large Blast
> 
> Vehicles
> Name Bs Front Side Rear
> Banewolf 3 12 12 10
> Basilisk 3 12 10 10
> Chimera 3 12 10 10
> Colossus 3 12 10 10
> Deathstrike 3 12 10 10
> Devildog 3 12 12 10
> Griffon 3 12 10 10
> Hellhound 3 12 12 10
> Hydra 3 12 10 10
> Leman Russ 3 14 13 10
> Demolisher 3 14 13 11
> Eradicator 3 14 13 10
> Executioner 3 14 13 11
> Exterminator 3 14 13 10
> Punisher 3 14 13 11
> Vanquisher 3 14 13 10
> Manticore 3 12 10 10
> Medusa 3 12 10 10
> Valkyrie 3 12 12 10
> Vendetta 3 12 12 10
> 
> Sentinels
> 
> Name Ws Bs St Front Side Rear In At
> Heavy Sentinel 3 3 5 12 10 10 3 1
> Scout Sentinel 3 3 5 10 10 10 3 1


Copied from Warseer... some nice stuff in there!


----------



## Aenarian

I think I've just started to believe in go-... The Emperor :shok:

All of this looks nice, really nice. Of course, I'm a beginner on IG, so I'm not sure if it is nice.


----------



## bishop5

Well, the Hydra, dissapointingly, seems almost totally useless... two autocannon shots up to 72" - meh.
The Heavy Sentinels, Valkyrie, Hellguns and Vet. Heavy Weapons Teams however...


----------



## fynn

bishop5 said:


> Well, the Hydra, dissapointingly, seems almost totally useless... two autocannon shots up to 72" - meh.
> The Heavy Sentinels, Valkyrie, Hellguns and Vet. Heavy Weapons Teams however...


thing is, is that for all 4 barrels on the hydra, or just 1 barrel, if its all 4 then yeah, its crap, if its for one then that be a total of 8 dice per round, or 4 dice if twin linked


----------



## Vaz

Punisher Gatling Cannon - Heavy 20, Str 5, AP-

I suppose it's balanced that way, but an Orked up Assault Cannon, no rending, and worse, no AP... Wierd.

The Hydra has 2 TL LB Autocannons - so can fire 4 Str7 AP4 shots. But it is in an AA turret, so anti-aircraft, which, other than the Manta, I believe (or maybe even the Orca) has Armour of 10 all round. 

I'm liking the Collosus Seige Mortar. Shame about the Min Range though... I hope it has a Direct Fire option...


----------



## Capt.Al'rahhem

The return of Al'rehem!!! At least now I have something to be happy about in the new codex. Maybe they make a new mini for him too.

I'm also liking the return of the Griffin, that saves me from buying 3 of them from FW. and the Manticore and the Hydra. I'm liking all the tank love.

I think the Punisher Gatling Cannon is a load of BS. I can't believe they'd put something on a LR that out shots the Vulcan Mega Bolter, yeah it's got a higher STR & AP but it's only a Hvy 15. It's also got 2 gatling barrels and is a titan class weapon.

Still annoyed with the organizational changes. Already ordered the collectors Tallarns I need to fill out a second platoon and the turrets for the extra Chimeras. If you truely can not mount Hvy Weap. Squads in Chimeras I won't be happy at all, :ireful2: ruins the whole mech. army.

As I said I'll wait till it comes out to pass final judgement but in the end if I want to play my Gaurd I'll end up having to use the new rules.


----------



## radical_psyker

fynn said:


> thing is, is that for all 4 barrels on the hydra, or just 1 barrel, if its all 4 then yeah, its crap, if its for one then that be a total of 8 dice per round, or 4 dice if twin linked


I mean, as it stands on the reference sheet for the Hydra it's just Heavy 2, no twin-linked, no nothing. It doesn't even have an asterisk indicating additional special rules, but hope it has some. I also suspect Hydras may come more into play when Planetstrike drops.


----------



## Fangio

> Garde du corps 4 4 3 3 1 3 2 7 5+


For those who don't speak French that means Bodyguard. Does this mean that maybe command squads will continue to ignore the IC rule for combat?


----------



## MaidenManiac

> Hellgun 18 3 3 Rapid Fire
> Hellpistol 6 3 3 Pistol
> Punisher Gatling Cannon 24 5 - Heavy 20


*sigh*

Good luck SM players next GT, you'll need it:laugh:


----------



## EmbraCraig

*runs off to bulk buy plastics box sets before they get expensive*


----------



## Vaz

Fangio said:


> For those who don't speak French that means Bodyguard. Does this mean that maybe command squads will continue to ignore the IC rule for combat?


Sounds right - looks like that you actually get the Creme De La Creme to protect your Commanders.



radical_psyker said:


> I mean, as it stands on the reference sheet for the Hydra it's just Heavy 2, no twin-linked, no nothing. It doesn't even have an asterisk indicating additional special rules, but hope it has some. I also suspect Hydras may come more into play when Planetstrike drops.


Hydras have 2 TL LB Autocannons  Not much improvement, but at least you hit with 3/4 shots.


----------



## Blood Angel Jimmy

Didnt they have conscripts a long time ago? I like the idea, same goes for penal legions


----------



## Ezekiface 73

There are some recently confirmed thing over on BoLS, including a heavy 20 leman russ gun! Check it out!


----------



## Syph

Ezekiface 73 said:


> There are some recently confirmed thing over on BoLS, including a heavy 20 leman russ gun! Check it out!


This stuff?



BoLS said:


> Leman Russ Executioner's turret plasma cannon: R: 36" S:7 AP:2 Heavy 3, Blast
> _~Jwolf was right on blast templates, this thing will be the terminator eraser!_
> 
> Leman Russ Punisher's gatling punisher: R: 24" S:5 AP:- Heavy 20
> _~Thats right folks, Heavy 20 is in the game!_
> 
> All Leman Russ variants have AV:13 side armor.
> Valkyrie is: AV 12/12/10
> The "Armoured Sentinel" variant is: AV 12/10/10
> 
> The Deathstrike exists; and drops a 1d3+3"??? sized template upon its target once per game.
> The Medusa Manticore exists and each of its 4 missiles drop 1d3 templates upon its target.
> 
> Named characters in the Codex:
> -Creed
> -Marbo
> -Artillery Sergeant Harker
> -Nork _~YAY!!!!!_
> -Kamir
> -Kell
> -Yarrick
> -Chenkov
> -Straken
> -Al'rahim
> -Lukas Bastonne


Link: http://belloflostsouls.blogspot.com/2009/02/40k-news-imperial-guard-summary-leak.html


----------



## cool_conoly

Heavy 20? Really? Cmon no one is actually buying into this are they? there is NO WAY they would make a weapon like that! Maybe like heavy 2d6 or something but NO WAY will it be heavy 20!


----------



## McCready

can't wait for the new plastic command for the cadians and the valk's then my Red Devils will be complete :victory: untill the :ireful2::angry: come on may.


----------



## Wolf_Lord_Skoll

cool_conoly said:


> Heavy 20? Really? Cmon no one is actually buying into this are they? there is NO WAY they would make a weapon like that! Maybe like heavy 2d6 or something but NO WAY will it be heavy 20!


Why not? It's got a low S and no AP, its really not going to much better than a demolisher to be honest. And they already have a Heavy 15 gun, it's only for apocylpse for sure, but it still exists.


----------



## bishop5

Wolf_Lord_Skoll said:


> Why not? It's got a low S and no AP, its really not going to much better than a demolisher to be honest. And they already have a Heavy 15 gun, it's only for apocylpse for sure, but it still exists.


I think i'll kit one out with 3 heavy bolter sponsons and use it to hunt CSM deamon princes. Mwuahahah.


----------



## Widowmaker666

Wolf_Lord_Skoll said:


> Why not? It's got a low S and no AP, its really not going to much better than a demolisher to be honest. And they already have a Heavy 15 gun, it's only for apocylpse for sure, but it still exists.




It may not be TOO usefull but rolling 29 shots (32) from one tank is just fun :victory::grin: lol if they do squadrons of 3..... 32*3*3.. *mental math*.... 288 shoots per turn. thats alot of dakka.


----------



## Capt.Al'rahhem

The Vulcan Mega Bolter is 4x the size of that pee-wee gatling gun & it's a Titan class weapon.


----------



## selig

*Storm Troopers?*

Wow this sounds really cool! But when you guys are talking about "Storm Troopers" do you mean Karsrkin? If so that would be insanely cool! I would ally myself with some IG (DW and IG ) 

- S


----------



## thatCavguyc8d

yeah. this past month i think i went through so many pairs of drawers and ACU pants as i crapped at all of these freaking bitchin post and pics. i luv the tanks and i defenately luv that command sprue comrade came up with. all of u guys made my already bitchin month.


----------



## Vaz

I'd missed that Executioner - I really, really, may have to start a Plasma Army - Demolisher with PC Sponsons, Executioner, and PC Sentinels. Naturally, Command Support Weapon Teams with Lascannons to deal with the Heavy Vehicles.I would say big beasties, but with the amount of Plasma, What big beasties?

Haha, "I'm a PC" took a whole new meaning.



Widowmaker666 said:


> It may not be TOO usefull but rolling 29 shots (32) from one tank is just fun :victory::grin: lol if they do squadrons of 3..... 32*3*3.. *mental math*.... 288 shoots per turn. thats alot of dakka.


Try telling that to a Daemon Prince. 5 wounds it's got to save on a 3+ means that it's going to be taking a couple of wounds a turn. Well worth it, then you factor in the Heavy Bolters, and it's taking roughly 3-4 wounds. Add in a Storm Bolter (Heavy Stubbers are useless vs. a Daemon Prince) and you're looking at perhaps causing another wound.

Yes, selig, Storm Troopers are Kasrkin, or rather the Kasrkin are Cadian elite Grenadiers represented by the Storm Trooper Special Rules. I believe the new models are representing them actually.

Better than the Gimp Mask ones, anyway. Having a Parachute Helmet = F. I. T.


----------



## selig

*Hellguns?*

Are they going to make the Hellguns any better? At this moment they are wortheless. They should make them Assault 3. And S:4 - 5. I just think S:3 is just horrible lol.


----------



## fynn

well there still str 3, but are now Ap3, going by the list


----------



## Engelus

is there any confirmation or the 4pt guard rumor? ive heard it all over, but never seen the original material.

and yeah, I am excited by the new hellgun, makes stormtroopers worth taking imo.


----------



## Vaz

There's a post earlier in the thread over a 40pt Guard Platoon, minus Upgrades. I think you're in luck 

And Selig, what's horrible about Rapid Firing Ap3? Hit on 3's, Kill marines on 5's. Better odds than Space Marines killing each other with a Bolter.

Combine that with the expected Deep Strike or Infiltrate, very nasty.


----------



## when in doubt shoot!

I think ap3 hell guns would give storm troopers the punch they lack, I really don't like paying extra points for glorified guardsmen with a gun with an extra ap above the lasgun. Either strength 4 AP4 or strength 3 AP3. I'd prefer AP3 though, would give them a use against power armour :wink:


----------



## Engelus

yeah, the ap6 really wasnt worth it, so many few things in the game have 6+ armor, now if the lasgun was originally ap5, and the hellgun having one better at ap4, that would be a worthwhile upgrade. because there's alot of 4+ armor out there.


----------



## Djinn24

Seen the PDFs.... From what I have seen in the threads everything seems legit, Heavy 20.... wow....


----------



## Widowmaker666

No Schaefer?! :cray::headbutt::suicide:


----------



## radical_psyker

Seems everybody is having a good old cry about Gaunt and Schaeffer.

There's Penal Legion in the list so you may still get some kind of counts-as dealio.


----------



## Galahad

Vaz said:


> There's a post earlier in the thread over a 40pt Guard Platoon, minus Upgrades. I think you're in luck
> 
> And Selig, what's horrible about Rapid Firing Ap3? Hit on 3's, Kill marines on 5's. Better odds than Space Marines killing each other with a Bolter.
> 
> Combine that with the expected Deep Strike or Infiltrate, very nasty.


Actually, it's slightly better, but not a lot
Mathematically 10 marines with bolters will kill 3.3 other marines at 12", and 10 stormies with hellguns will kill 4.4 

The low strength does go a long way towards watering down the AP3, but it's still a little ahead of the old bolt-gun

Meanwhile those same 10 hypothetical marines firong against the stormies will kill <drumroll> 4.4 storm troopers, so they're actually evenly matched, stormies vs marines in a shooting battle. Stormies are a little better at killing marines than other marines are, but mariens are just as good at killing stormies.


----------



## Widowmaker666

Galahad said:


> Meanwhile those same 10 hypothetical marines firong against the stormies will kill <drumroll> 4.4 storm troopers, so they're actually evenly matched, stormies vs marines in a shooting battle. Stormies are a little better at killing marines than other marines are, but mariens are just as good at killing stormies.


Stormtroopers are just overglorified glorified guardsmen.
and EVERYONE is good at killing guardsmen :laugh::victory:


----------



## when in doubt shoot!

yeah, I've just read the gaunts ghosts novels, and was started to come round to making up a (very, very, very) small force of the tanith first. Oh well.


----------



## MarzM

You can still have a Tanith force. Imperial Guard will have access to Commissar lords which is what Gaunt is. Wait until you see the options that they get. You never know you might find something like;-

powersword - 5pts
powerfist - 15pts
Honour blade (powersword +1 strength) - 15pts

You never know. Take a light infantry army with little or no tanks led by said commissar lord and off you go!!

I'm certainly going to be creating a new guard army! Number 6! I just wonder if the powergamers will look at guard now that they appear to have toys? Doubt it, it will still be folk like me! lol


----------



## Widowmaker666

Capt.Al'rahhem said:


> The Vulcan Mega Bolter is 4x the size of that pee-wee gatling gun & it's a Titan class weapon.


yeah but the vulcan can fire twice if it doesnt move

(im sorry to double post but - please use the Edit button then  - Syph)

Does anyone have the English translation to that datasheet in French?


----------



## spike12225

looking scary more so for the humble ork but so much anti horde if anyone thinks this won't be a competitive army is smoking the wacky tabaccy.....

it'll be fun to watch all the ork power gamers jump ship to gaurd after first tourny if those gattling LR 's can be taken in squads of 3 there is serious potential add with some other ord and hellhounds move 12 fire flamer it will be very scary


----------



## radical_psyker

Widowmaker666 said:


> Does anyone have the English translation to that datasheet in French?


I'll post the translated summary sheet if I'm allowed to? *Syph*?


----------



## blood 4 the blood god

a realy hope this is true i have been waiting since like three years ago


----------



## Widowmaker666

radical_psyker said:


> I'll post the translated summary sheet if I'm allowed to? *Syph*?


or PM it too me if you dont mind, thanks a million in advance! :victory::good:


----------



## Syph

radical_psyker said:


> I'll post the translated summary sheet if I'm allowed to? *Syph*?


Please do.


----------



## stooge92

can i have it:grin: thanks:victory:


----------



## radical_psyker

Syph said:


> Please do.


Here it is then.


----------



## Micklez

These changes to the ST does make an all ST list actually viable but ill leave my final judgement till im sipping a nice walm coffee and reading the Codex (or when im trying not to be noticed i GW as i try to memerise it quickly :biggrin: )


----------



## radical_psyker

Okay, full-sized version posted above. The first one I uploaded got scrunched down, but it is fixed now. :good:


----------



## Apoctis

let's think about it Gw likes money and so cut sprues are the perfect thing. I at least have enough troops to be set for the sprues. I also can't wait for the plastic valkaries and storm troopers.


----------



## stooge92

the new IG is going to be so pumping, hellguns AP3, so many tank types and new weapons, but so, so, so much money-- aw well, ill live!!!!!! 

SOrry if this has already been mentioned, but i heard from a insider that you can take 3 tanks as 1 HW choice?? truth??

peace:victory:


----------



## stooge92

According to that list, Straken has a ST 6, isn't that like Ven Dread ST.
How is that possible, he's just a little Catachan Dude????

And another thing, is it going to be like before where only some tanks are going to be in the codex, or this time are all of them going to be. Because they all have a page no. in the sheet above/... so?


----------



## Cadian81st

He's S6 because he has a powerfist melded onto his arm. "Iron Hand" Straken remember?


----------



## radical_psyker

stooge92 said:


> According to that list, Straken has a ST 6, isn't that like Ven Dread ST.
> How is that possible, he's just a little Catachan Dude????


He's got massive bionics including one arm which hits like a power fist but strikes in initiative order. That's probably been factored directly into his stat line.

(EDIT - ninja'd)


----------



## Commissar Maximus

He is bionic half of is chest...in game terms,power fist str aleready modify in profile.
That's what i think but we shall see soon:grin:


----------



## stooge92

oh yeah, thanks guys--- but 6, cmon, he has a dreadnought cc weapon str, okidoki


----------



## Widowmaker666

Commissar Maximus said:


> He is bionic half of is chest...in game terms,power fist str aleready modify in profile.
> That's what i think but we shall see soon:grin:



his arm and half his chest got om nomed by a land shark so he got a pretty little power fist and new metal ribs (thus the toughness 4 and s6) the powerfist was his arm so it can hit much faster than other fists. i think my head will explode from all the charecter options!:suicide: I WANNA FIELD THEM ALL! :shout:



stooge92 said:


> oh yeah, thanks guys--- but 6, cmon, he has a dreadnought cc weapon str, okidoki


he has the strength of a dreadnougt without its CCW. with its CCW Dreads are S10.


----------



## stooge92

yeah thanks for correction, thats what i meant, STRONG:so_happy:


----------



## LordWaffles

Unless they allow allies between traitor guard and chaos, I don't see myself hopping on the bandwagon of the 'latest best codex'.

I'm loving the gracious amounts of marine killing ability though. S6 ap3 ignores cover saves? Brilliant. That'll teach underpowered marines everywhere to play marines.


----------



## Daniel Harper

stooge92 said:


> SOrry if this has already been mentioned, but i heard from a insider that you can take 3 tanks as 1 HW choice?? truth??


From what I recall from hearing. It's 3 Leman Russ' in a heavy choice but can only take 1 set of them. It can only be the battle tank varient as well.



stooge92 said:


> And another thing, is it going to be like before where only some tanks are going to be in the codex, or this time are all of them going to be. Because they all have a page no. in the sheet above/... so?


As it looks from the image, I'd say all tanks are listed.


----------



## Johnathanswift

This list makes my shiny new sternguard and land raider reedemer want to cry and cower. Sigh, time to dust of all those old IG models from my shelf.


----------



## Fangio

I like the new codex but I am annoyed no end by the AP3 Hellguns. That is simply ridiculous. On a related note: I still wished they had made the mortars AP3.


----------



## Widowmaker666

i dont like how everyone pretty much is I3. to me its fuckin' lame. i mean like even Sly is which makes me wanna cut:suicide:, and i dont even play catachan(though i may have to include him, hes hunky k: and commisars with one wound? wtf? ogryns Ld6?!?!?!? lame! assault oriented guard seems very unlikely now. the leadership on like everyone is fucked. commisars with the same ld as SANCTIONED PSYKERS?!? lame! there better be an explanation for this new devilry.

Sorry about the language and ranting. venting is complete. tired, have school in the morning and i would prefer not to stay up all night. 
night.


----------



## Duke Vorian

Personally, even just for the 4 pt per Guardsman rumour and 40 pt. Chimera rumour, no tru Guard player should really be complaining. :wink:

Sure it would be cool for atleast the special characters having +I3 but its all good compared to all the other goodies we are supposedly getting. 

Also, Assault Guard shouldn't _ever_ be likely. It would be sweet, and make the Stormblade worth while for a full Guard list but its just not Guard....plus its far more bad @$& to see a squad with nothing but bayonets kill Deamon Princes.


----------



## Widowmaker666

Duke Vorian said:


> Personally, even just for the 4 pt per Guardsman rumour and 40 pt. Chimera rumour, no tru Guard player should really be complaining. :wink:
> 
> Sure it would be cool for atleast the special characters having +I3 but its all good compared to all the other goodies we are supposedly getting.
> 
> Also, Assault Guard shouldn't _ever_ be likely. It would be sweet, and make the Stormblade worth while for a full Guard list but its just not Guard....plus its far more bad @$& to see a squad with nothing but bayonets kill Deamon Princes.



I hadnt heard the 40 points chimaira rumour. the cheapest i heard was 55 points.


----------



## LordWaffles

Fangio said:


> I like the new codex but I am annoyed no end by the AP3 Hellguns. That is simply ridiculous. On a related note: I still wished they had made the mortars AP3.


Because marines REALLY didn't die enough to basilisk fire.

"Two marines left? HERESY! *blam*"

On the upside it sounds like they're at least..uhm...trying to think up new ideas?(Throwing play balance to the winds, to be sure.)


----------



## Katie Drake

I love the cries of cheese when we haven't even seen the points costs for most things yet.


----------



## Death 0F Angels

LordWaffles said:


> Because marines REALLY didn't die enough to basilisk fire.
> 
> "Two marines left? HERESY! *blam*"
> 
> On the upside it sounds like they're at least..uhm...trying to think up new ideas?(Throwing play balance to the winds, to be sure.)


AP3 on a squad i can nearly wipe and watch run away with one round of bolter fire doesnt concern me too much. Nearly everything in existence gets a 4+ cover save anyways.


----------



## silversurfer

Katie Drake said:


> I love the cries of cheese when we haven't even seen the points costs for most things yet.


Seems like drakes always know what is wise. And I can add special rules concerning them and FOC and such things ...


----------



## LordWaffles

Katie Drake said:


> I love the cries of cheese when we haven't even seen the points costs for most things yet.


What if we heard tell of the "Lash of submission" before it spawned? 

Besides, it'd be a foolish investment NOT to make them slightly more powerful than marines. Nobody would want to buy a 'new and improved' ig codex and be worse.


Also it's not cheese, it's a business. And sadly, if they keep the ability to drop from the sky, storm troopers could be positioned to negate your cover save entirely.(Although it is lulzy to think of space marines crashing out of a drop pod only to be mowed down by ig who fell with all the safety of a brick from a building.)


----------



## Fangio




----------



## gwmaniac

@ Fangio, Ahhhh.....so much cheese! I love cheese, I think I could live off Cheez-its! Thanks for that beautiful picture of a mouse's heaven, I'm going off to my fridge now to make some cheese and crackers!


----------



## stooge92

does anyone have any ideas on what kind of point addition/changes there will be???:victory:

i mean, are we goin to suffer for the good stuff we're getting or what??

thoughts, suggestions, theories???


----------



## The Son of Horus

It's rumor confirmation time!

The HQ section consists of a Company Commander and his Retinue, which can include, in addition to the usual assortment of medic, standard bearer, and veteran guardsmen, a Fleet Officer, Master of Ordinance, Astropath, Primaris Psyker, Priest, and/or Commissar. As seperate HQ choices, we have Techpriests with Servitors, and the Commissar Lord, who is a -beast-. The Commissar Lord is a Commissar as far as all other things are concerned, but has a profile equal to a Space Marine Chapter Master, Strength and Toughness aside. 

On the Troops front, there's only one choice-- the Infantry Platoon. You can do all sorts of things with them, including adding Conscript Squads to the Platoon-- so for those of us who want to run 200 Conscripts lead by the Commissar Lord, that's in there. Heavy Weapons teams have changed to be a single model with two wounds and attacks rather than two seperate guys. Platoon Commanders are now better than Veteran Sergeants, as well. 

Veteran Squads have changed a lot. They function more or less like regular Infantry squads, but with superior ballistic skill and more attacks. There's no 0-1 cap on them. Penal Legion Squads are in the Elites. They're functionally more like the Veteran Squads are right now. Other Elites are Ogryns and Ratlings. Ratlings haven't changed, but Ogryns are S and T5. Ripper Guns are S5 AP- Assault 3. Stormtroopers are in Fast Attack, interestingly enough. A Sanctioned Psyker can be included in the squad, who is Ld9 but otherwise unremarkable. Hellguns are S3 AP3 Rapid Fire, with a maximum range of 18'' rather than the usual 24''. Other Fast units are Sentinels, which are broken into Scout Sentinels (the current Sentinels as we know them) and Heavy Sentinels, which are armed with heavier weapons such as plasma cannons, multiple missile launchers, and the like. The Heavy Sentinel also features reinforced front armour 12.On the Heavy Support end of things, there are no less than 19 different choices. We've got the Leman Russ, whose armor is 14/13/10 now, the Demolisher, whose armor is unchanged; we see the return of the Exterminator, and have actual Codex appearances for the Executioner and the Vanquisher for the first time. The Executioner Plasma Cannon is a Heavy 3-- no blast. The Vanquisher Cannon is AP2 rather than AP3, and features both the classic bonus to armor penetration as well as superior armor piercing. New Leman Russ variants are the Punisher (Punisher Gatling is S5 AP- Heavy 20 24''), and the Eradicator (Eradicator Nova Cannon is S6 AP4 Large Blast, Pinning). 

The Hellhound (and its two new variants, the Devildog and Banewolf) have moved to Heavy Support. The Hellhound hasn't changed, except for the template just hitting as opposed to the initial to-hit roll for the template. The Devildog has a Melta Cannon that's a multi-melta with a blast; and the Banewolf has a chemical cannon that's S1 AP3 template, that's Poisoned (2+). The Hydra makes an appearance in the Codex as well, with a pair of 72'' autocannons. The Basilisk returns with a 36'' minimum range. The Colossus Siege Mortar is a 24'' minimum range S6 AP3. Griffon Heavy Mortar makes a return this edition, unchanged from its 3rd Edition incarnation. The Medusa Siege Gun appears as well, with a bunker buster round that's S10 AP1. The Manticore Missile Artillery has an Ordinance 1D3 weapon, 24'' minimum to 120'' range, S10 AP4. It's a battery, so those templates are going to hit all close together. The Deathstrike Missile Battery has unlimited range with a 12'' minimum, with a D3+3'' blast size. The Deathstrike only comes with four rounds, though, so you only get four of 'em for the game. 

Named Characters are Creed & Kell, Lucas Bastonne, Colonel Iron Hand Straken, Sly Marbo, Artillery Sergeant Harker (who is sort of like Chronus, but for artillery vehicles), Yarrick, Tallarn Captain Al'Rahim, Valhallan Captain Chenkov, Moghol Kamir, and (yes!) Nork Dedog. All the major Games Workshop regiments have a named character now, and some of these guys are unit champion types. The regiment-specific ones add regimental traits kind of like how Codex: Space Marines characters change the Combat Tactics special rule.


----------



## FatBoyFat

I hear cheese and other things thrown around a bit, I personally can't wait for the new list! I just hope I've managed to sort out having to buy a new car, so I'll have money for release, definatly a few valkeriyes, 

Orkies don't surf!

You smell that You smell that? promethium, I love the smell of promethium in the morning!


----------



## Underground Heretic

Here's the translated reference sheet:


----------



## Widowmaker666

i dont wanna sound like a bitch or anything but... fuckin a. hellhounds as heavy? crap
penal squads as elites? crap. 
you wont be able to field half the fun stuff that you want to.
once again raped by fuckin FOC


also Son of Horus, where did u get the conformations from?


----------



## radical_psyker

Underground Heretic said:


> Here's the translated reference sheet:
> /IMG


I already posted that in this thread three days ago (and at full size too):

http://www.heresy-online.net/forums/showthread.php?p=311483#post311483


----------



## Grimskul25

After seeing the list, I'm quite unimpressed, I don't understand why they debuffed some of the IC, Jarran Kell now has about the same stats as Creed now, and he's the bodyguard! :nono: I'm surprised they kept the Sanctioned Psyker, seems the Primaris is decent, but we'll see. The major ting that's good for guard right now is the ap 3 hellguns and the crazy # of tanks they're having. MAN that's a lot! :shok: Anywho I can't wait to try out my Orks against dem 'umies :threaten:


----------



## The Son of Horus

Widowmaker666 said:


> also Son of Horus, where did u get the conformations from?


The Codex.


----------



## Triangulum

How do you have the codex?


----------



## Ztrain

Triangulum said:


> How do you have the codex?


He's just that ninja.

Z


----------



## radical_psyker

The Son of Horus said:


> The Manticore Missile Artillery has an Ordinance 1D3 weapon, 24'' minimum to 120'' range, S10 AP4. It's a battery, so those templates are going to hit all close together. The Deathstrike Missile Battery has unlimited range with a 12'' minimum, with a D3+3'' blast size. The Deathstrike only comes with four rounds, though, so you only get four of 'em for the game.


Isn't it the Manticore that is limited to four shots, and the Deathstrike just one?


----------



## thatCavguyc8d

So wait, can you actually choose the phykers powers now (sanction and that Primaris dude), or is it all still dictated by the old roll-to-see-what-useless-ability-you-get -stuck-with rule as the last codex? And whats this cheese bussiness? 

(on a side note, has anyone ever heard of or created schimatics of the interior of IG tanks, like engine compartment, troop compartment, ammo starage, ect.?? anyone?? Working on a side project of a very detailed Chimera, just need some insiration. Didn't think much of the FW model.)


----------



## Fangio

I've just noticed that they have removed Commissar Gaunt. Sniff. I like that model and he would have allowed for a Light Infantry style army easily. Oh well I hope there is a good option for light infantry.


----------



## Pinkmerauder

Exciting, I can't wait to see the new models. Although I dislike the new troop packaging, because the price per model will go up.


----------



## The Son of Horus

radical_psyker said:


> Isn't it the Manticore that is limited to four shots, and the Deathstrike just one?


You'd think. But the Manticore doesn't have limited ammunition, and the deathstrike has four rounds. These aren't the "big" deathstrike missiles, apparently. I mean, by the logic that these things should have seriously limited ammunition based on what's physically on the model, the Space Marine Whirlwind would only have a couple volleys.


----------



## radical_psyker

The Son of Horus said:


> You'd think. But the Manticore doesn't have limited ammunition, and the deathstrike has four rounds. These aren't the "big" deathstrike missiles, apparently. I mean, by the logic that these things should have seriously limited ammunition based on what's physically on the model, the Space Marine Whirlwind would only have a couple volleys.


That just seems silly for the Deathstrike. Always saw and liked it as a single missile vehicle. Makes it quite OTT too if it's S10 AP1 Blast 1D3+3" as per the summary sheet. :scratchhead: Can you confirm if the summary sheet is correct?


----------



## gwmaniac

Pinkmerauder said:


> Exciting, I can't wait to see the new models. Although I dislike the new troop packaging, because the price per model will go up.


Yes, I'm thinking of getting the current squad sets before the price of each model goes up, has it been confirmed that it will be 10 guys, and for how much money? 

Oh, and Welcome to Heresy!


----------



## when in doubt shoot!

10 troops, a heavy weapon an optional special weapon for £12. Not sure what that is in dollars though. I'm not sure why everyone sees this as such a bad thing, when you actually do the maths, it works out a few pounds cheaper. 

Let's see, currently £18 for 20 guardsmen, no heavy weapon. so, for £12 you're getting about 7 or 8 pounds of troops (not sure exactly, I don't know how much an individual guardsman is) and a 10 pound heavy weapon. That seems like quite a saving actually.


----------



## inqusitor_me

aye for one am happy about the new rules


----------



## Col. Schafer

when in doubt said:


> 10 troops, a heavy weapon an optional special weapon for £12. Not sure what that is in dollars though. I'm not sure why everyone sees this as such a bad thing, when you actually do the maths, it works out a few pounds cheaper.
> 
> Let's see, currently £18 for 20 guardsmen, no heavy weapon. so, for £12 you're getting about 7 or 8 pounds of troops (not sure exactly, I don't know how much an individual guardsman is) and a 10 pound heavy weapon. That seems like quite a saving actually.


Yes, But what if you dont want the heavy? If so it comes out as more. But heres what I'm thinking, If I dont want the heavy, I'll pay 32$ for 4 boxes of 5 men =D. Although I probably will want the heavy.


----------



## when in doubt shoot!

Col. Schafer said:


> Yes, But what if you dont want the heavy? If so it comes out as more. But heres what I'm thinking, If I dont want the heavy, I'll pay 32$ for 4 boxes of 5 men =D. Although I probably will want the heavy.


yeah, but meh, who wouldn't want a heavy weapon? :laugh:


----------



## radical_psyker

Reports from several people who attended the UK Open Day is that it's a 10 man box and that's it. No heavy weapon team, no recuts. The price per model is going up, somewhat matching the Ork Boyz box but without having been lovingly recut.


----------



## Alexander_67

minimum range 36 on basilisks? ugh god. there goes my artillery company. back into the box they go along with cultists and everything else that made alpha legion special.


----------



## Lord_Murdock

Alexander_67 said:


> minimum range 36 on basilisks? ugh god. there goes my artillery company. back into the box they go along with cultists and everything else that made alpha legion special.


Just remember that minimum ranges on ordinance barrage weapons go away if you choose to fire the weapon directly.

Personally, I'm disappointed they didn't bring back Macharius. I mean sure, he's been dead for a while, but still... That, and there's no Leman Russ Conqueror. I was looking forward to seeing how they might change it, and now it's gone :cray: Oh well...


----------



## Wolf_Lord_Skoll

No conqueror, no Anihilator. With the amout of new ones they came up with, you have to wonder why they didn't throw in a couple of already made ones. Sure Anihilator is pretty new, but, it would still be a cool adition.


----------



## Galahad

I'm wondering how available sentinels, carapace armor and stormtroopers are. Thinking about maybe hacking up my unused tau as Gue'Vessa. Is it possible to have all stormies or carapace?


----------



## stooge92

thats an idea, and here i was about to sell my tau battleforce. 

cheers


----------



## comrade

Col. Schafer said:


> Yes, But what if you dont want the heavy? If so it comes out as more. But heres what I'm thinking, If I dont want the heavy, I'll pay 32$ for 4 boxes of 5 men =D. Although I probably will want the heavy.


Dude, those models are horrid. absolutely horrid, I hate em.
But I guess to each his own


----------



## Galahad

stooge92 said:


> thats an idea, and here i was about to sell my tau battleforce.
> 
> cheers


I've been trying to unload my tau for ages. I figure if I can't get rid of them I may as well take the hacksaw to them.
Cut the FWs off at the wrist and the shin, slap on boots and human hands, the odd bare headed human or cadian helmet, etc.

Stormtroopers get tau'd up lasgun-pulse carbine hybrids with power cbales going back to the mysterious tau backpack dealie.

Cut down broadside railguns make a good sub for lascannons, slightly beefed up missile pods for autocannons, etc. Mate some battlesuot parts with sentinels, maybe frankenstein a devilfish into a valk

Flamers, meltas and plasma all have ready substitutes, maybbe chud them up a little, mate them with imperial parts here and there Could be fun.


----------



## spike12225

bassies always had a min of 36'' for indirect but can see siege mortar being new top dog if points are similar


----------



## Ztrain

Galahad said:


> I've been trying to unload my tau for ages. I figure if I can't get rid of them I may as well take the hacksaw to them.
> Cut the FWs off at the wrist and the shin, slap on boots and human hands, the odd bare headed human or cadian helmet, etc.
> 
> Stormtroopers get tau'd up lasgun-pulse carbine hybrids with power cbales going back to the mysterious tau backpack dealie.
> 
> Cut down broadside railguns make a good sub for lascannons, slightly beefed up missile pods for autocannons, etc. Mate some battlesuot parts with sentinels, maybe frankenstein a devilfish into a valk
> 
> Flamers, meltas and plasma all have ready substitutes, maybbe chud them up a little, mate them with imperial parts here and there Could be fun.


Heresy man Heresy!!!!!!

Z


----------



## stooge92

i have recently seen a GD model of a kroot trying to kit into a battlesuit, im going to try it with a IG model maybe??? i might greenstuff a stormtrooper into a open battlesuit!

let you know when its completed


----------



## bon_jovi

On the new cadian boxes, i was told by GW trade (Not sure how in the know they are) That its just an extra box and they are not doing away with the boxs of 20.

However if you were planning on stocking up on the 20's you might as well anyway.


----------



## when in doubt shoot!

Galahad, there is a doctrine (kinda like special rules to personalise your guard) in the current codex that allows for carapace armour in all your guardsmen squads, and one called grenadiers, that means you can take stormtroopers as troops choices. 

Although, we all know doctrines are good as gone in the new codex, to be replaced with mutable upgrades 'n' options. So, you will probably be able to still take guardmen all with carapace armour and/or stormtroopers as troops. At least, I hope so.

Hope that helps Gal


----------



## Grimskul25

I still think that ST recuts should ahve been along in the first wave, considering their getting ap 3 hellguns, oh well anyways so in terms of advisors why do you think they kept sanctioned psykers? Being useless and all and still having crap stats, I guess its just new powers, I think the Commissar Lord will be cool though


----------



## Galahad

when in doubt said:


> Galahad, there is a doctrine (kinda like special rules to personalise your guard) in the current codex that allows for carapace armour in all your guardsmen squads, and one called grenadiers, that means you can take stormtroopers as troops choices.


I was well aware of that, but thanks ;-)
Unfortunately I'm more concerned with what the new codex holds than what can be done with the old one for the month or so it's still valid.


----------



## QuietEarth

Even with all of the new rumors and additions to the Imperial Guard my army will remain mostly unchanged. The only thing that may change is the armaments of my tanks. The Punisher just seems too good to pass up as my main two opponents are Orks and Dark Eldar.

I would like to have the ability to have Battle Honors or a Tank Ace but I'm not sure how likely that will be. I do think the mainstay of my army will be the Battle Tank or Vanquisher with a hull mounted Heavy Bolter.

However, an all Storm Trooper Army with Valkyries seems too cool to pass up to that will be my WIP project . . . after I finish my Fantasy and Mordheim projects.


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## stooge92

QuietEarth said:


> Even with all of the new rumors and additions to the Imperial Guard my army will remain mostly unchanged.


what about for balabced armies, i mean, we might have to co-ordinate different strategies and combinations without doctrines; and new rules.


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## Underground Heretic

I'm actually worried that the Guard will be very difficult army to counter. I may have to metagame and mech up against Guard because I just can't weather the heavy bolter fire that could be put out by four point guardsmen.

[wanders off to wonder about being outshot as Tau]


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## Katie Drake

To be honest my largest concern is going to be dealing with both large numbers of high armored vehicles (Leman Russ tanks mostly) and tons of cheap infantry. It's probably going to be rough the first few games to learn how to counter both of these things at once with a balanced list.


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## stooge92

there has to be points changes on the tanks to even it out against cheapie infantry. i mean, how would one attempt to counter dozens of cheap models upgraded wif HB and about 3-9 vehicles.

How would you?


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## Underground Heretic

Vehicles are no problem, full broadside team with shield drones will down tanks, but will do nothing against the infantry wall of the IG. Also if there are four point guardsmen, I can feasibly see 150 with a heavy weapon in each squad and tanks for under 2000 points, if they reduce the weapons costs accordingly. At least their leadership should stay in the crapper, hopefully.


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## stooge92

Underground Heretic said:


> At least their leadership should stay in the crapper, hopefully.


how are you going to get 150 men falling back or pinning, there is simply to many targets, and with your good troops concentrating on tank hunting, how are u going to counter all those troops with HWT


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## Katie Drake

Underground Heretic said:


> Vehicles are no problem, full broadside team with shield drones will down tanks, but will do nothing against the infantry wall of the IG. Also if there are four point guardsmen, I can feasibly see 150 with a heavy weapon in each squad and tanks for under 2000 points, if they reduce the weapons costs accordingly. At least their leadership should stay in the crapper, hopefully.


Easy for a Tau player to say... try playing Blood Angels, or Daemons and see how much luck you have against masses of heavy tanks.


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## Vanchet

The problem is that your taking one tank at a turn and the chances are that Guard could be aable to field 9 russes.....I pretty think there be enough damage made to your tau lines when the broadsids are trying to take out one tank also the power of cover is never to be underestimated.


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## Stella Cadente

stooge92 said:


> and about 3-9 vehicles.


well that bits easy, just look at armoured companies, there the weakest army in the game


Underground Heretic said:


> Vehicles are no problem, full broadside team with shield drones will down tanks


I've heard that before 


Underground Heretic said:


> At least their leadership should stay in the crapper, hopefully.


ahh guard, the only army you can't fail LD tests with, even when you want to


stooge92 said:


> how are you going to get 150 men falling back or pinning, there is simply to many targets


some necron players think 1 monolith can do it..........HA


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## stooge92

ok say that they are really great, and you can have alot of tanks, and alot of cheapies with HW

how do u think GW see the other armies beating them, what would their justification be, i mean they must have a reason for their changes

thoughts, comments???



Stella Cadente said:


> well that bits easy, just look at armoured companies, there the weakest army in the gameHA


thats only because of their usage, with 3-9 tanks people with think about what they are doing, not get caught up in false superiority.


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## bon_jovi

We will find a way. Its always the same when an army is redone but people find a way.
Personally i think its gonna be as many of the cheapest troops you can get your hands on! Failing that lots of transports to protect them, Failing that, just don't play against Guard:grin:


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## stooge92

what about a tyranid army, genestealers could rip troops apart quickly and they would pose a lot of targets for the tanks.

im not familiar with tyr. anti tank weapons but there might be something is that

comments>?


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## bon_jovi

I'm not overly familiar with the bugs either but i know they have some anti tank. Overall, like i said its best to wait for the book, see whats what and play a few games to get an idea on how to work around it, then share it with us all in the tactics section on here. I regularly play 2 Guard players but until i see exactly what they will have i will not worry too much.


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## comrade

yes all be afraid of my 3 LRMBTs advancing upon you with 200+ standard infantry marching beside them, with officers with standards intermingled to provide LD...

and then have the shelling of 2 basilisks raining upon your ranks with a guard of 50+ well armed infantry

or maybe just get rid of all the tanks, and just have a FULL INFANTRY ARMY!!

yes.. be very afraid, I can finally be able to maybe field all 500 of my guardsmen in a 2000pt game :laugh:


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## Syph

Maybe I'm looking at this with a bit of rose tintedness (yep, I went there), but _surely_ they playtest IG against a wide (all) range of armies before actually releasing a book where people just cannot beat it, right?


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## Triangulum

I hope not...


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## Ztrain

Anyone know if their putting the new super heavies in the codex sinse their now in plastic? Or are they being kept out to keep them in Apoc games?

Z


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## when in doubt shoot!

nope, they will remain apocalypse models. I think.


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## Katie Drake

Syph said:


> Maybe I'm looking at this with a bit of rose tintedness (yep, I went there), but _surely_ they playtest IG against a wide (all) range of armies before actually releasing a book where people just cannot beat it, right?


Oh sure, it'll be _possible_ to beat Guard. Anything is possible. The question is if the army will be a balanced one or not. Only time will tell.


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## Stella Cadente

Syph said:


> but _surely_ they playtest IG against a wide (all) range of armies before actually releasing a book where people just cannot beat it, right?


you still think GW playtest?, you have much to learn young grasshopper


Ztrain said:


> Anyone know if their putting the new super heavies in the codex sinse their now in plastic? Or are they being kept out to keep them in Apoc games?


you'd have to use Imperial armour super heavies rules with them, which is a slightly smaller range of choice, and there all as underpowered as frell


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## Vanchet

Katie Drake said:


> Oh sure, it'll be _possible_ to beat Guard. Anything is possible. The question is if the army will be a balanced one or not. Only time will tell.


I perasume their weakness will always be cc (Unless it's Tau) but it'll take longer to wipe them out. Also it works in a good way for players who need to get allot of kill points


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## stooge92

does this happen every time an army gets overhauled?? i cant remember when the other new codex's came out (bar orks), did the daunting factor play a part when they happened.

i mean, armies get redone, they look invincible, they get beaten somehow.


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## Katie Drake

Vanchet said:


> I perasume their weakness will always be cc (Unless it's Tau) but it'll take longer to wipe them out. Also it works in a good way for players who need to get allot of kill points


Well sure, Guard will never be an army that's phenomenal at close combat - it's just not what they're designed to do (I'd use the example of a shooty Ork army to help illustrate my point, but after the release of the new Codex it's sort of inappropriate). GW has taken a couple of small steps to help the Guard not suffer so awfully in combat with the introduction of better Ogryns and the Commissar Lord, but these units, like Rough Riders, are mostly intended for counter-attacking enemies that do manage to get in among the Guard's firing line.

Beating the Guard through close combat alone is probably going to be really tough, I'd think. I mean, ever since 5th edition coming along and stealing away our (by our I refer to myself and the players of armies that specialize in close combat) ability to consolidate from one unit to another, it's been a lot harder to just roll Guard armies up from one flank. We charge one unit, beat the living hell out of it, break it, chase it down... and then are stuck in the open and are praying for a high roll on our D6 to dash into cover to avoid being blasted to pieces. It's nigh-impossible to use the old "stopping short" tactic of insuring that only a few of your models made it into combat with the enemy at a time to reduce the number of attacks that you had to make, now that defenders react by moving into the attacking unit. Blech! >_<


> does this happen every time an army gets overhauled?? i cant remember when the other new codex's came out (bar orks), did the daunting factor play a part when they happened.
> 
> i mean, armies get redone, they look invincible, they get beaten somehow.


Yeah, it does. Everyone screams "CHEESE!" and such when a new book comes out as they scramble to figure out how to deal with the new kid on the block. Right now it's a bit silly to call the Guard cheesy since the Codex isn't even out yet and nobody's played any games against them - expect to see a lot of it (especially in the Space Marine section ) a couple weeks after the Codex book's release.


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## stooge92

ok, so all this stuff is new, BUT

is this what we wanted-- what was the basis of the IG changes, did we want them or did GW do them for other reasons?

what do we think??
COMMENTS???


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## fynn

hmmm lets see, reasons for GW to make the changes??? umm to make lots of money from the tank kits maybe? and probaly to screw people over useing older models (which seems to be the thing for GW), but hopefully the main reason for the changes is to give IG players a better game in 5TH ed.
Also i hope that GW have given the special characters a wide range of abilites so that "docterine" fans can still have a good choice of customiseing there IG the way they want (and not how GW says you should), as ive seen on here and other forums a lot ot players worried that have there army's gona be fubar once the new sex comes out


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## Capt.Al'rahhem

Yup, I'm one of the players who's worried about their army being FUBARed. As I play a mechinized army if there is no way to put everything, including Hvy Weap. squads, in Chimeras I'm pretty much screwed. I've already resigned myself to the fact I need another platoon, instead of the easy way out with 1 platoon and an AF squad but if they lower the troops pts and the Chimeras pts it should balance that out.

I think the loss of Doctrines is an EPIC FAIL. That was the best thing about the last couple 'dexs, IMO. It allowed everyone on make their own unique guard army, with I think is what the guards are all about. Now it seems like they (GW) are setting about forcing us to all play the same army. Sure we get a bunch of new tanks but that, for me, doesn't make up for the loss of Docterines. Thats what IA and FW are for.

And even as a guard player and a huge Treadhead!, I still think the Punisher Gatling Gun is BS and proof the whole 'dex was writen by a 12 yr old wearing a Cheesehead. I don't think it's cool, or badass and won't ever play one. It's just complete and udder cheese.

That's just my $.03.


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## Cpt. Grice

Yayy a tank with a S4 AP4 Heavy 20 weapon:victory:


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## Syph

I thought the direction GW are heading in with a character lending his abilities to the army was to allow people to retain individuality without stuff like doctrines - a bit like the changes to the Space Marines codex from 4th to 5th.


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## Elemental_elf

Capt.Al'rahhem said:


> And even as a guard player and a huge Treadhead!, I still think the Punisher Gatling Gun is BS and proof the whole 'dex was writen by a 12 yr old wearing a Cheesehead. I don't think it's cool, or badass and won't ever play one. It's just complete and udder cheese.


Heavy 20 isn't that bad. I mean the average Smurf squad can shoot nearly as many shots at a higher BS and they get AP5. I'm honestly more scared the of the Vindicator's Demolisher Cannon as it doesn't have to deal with the Gatling Punisher's BS3 and you don't (typically) get a save from the Vindicator.


----------



## Katie Drake

Syph said:


> I thought the direction GW are heading in with a character lending his abilities to the army was to allow people to retain individuality without stuff like doctrines - a bit like the changes to the Space Marines codex from 4th to 5th.


It's hardly very individual when you take the same character as everybody else. At least with Doctrines you got to pick five of them from a large pool of choices.


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## Capt.Al'rahhem

I just picked up the 5th Ed. SM codex (for my DA sucessor scout army), so I'm not sure how the character give the army abilities outside the FOC. As far as I know you have to take Special Characters (well not so special anymore cause their on the codex list) for get the abilities. It'd suck to have to take a Steel Legion character to get Mech. abilities, although I'm not opposed to just doing the "counts as" thing. Maybe all my dreams will come true and Al'rahem will be cool and give me the Mech. special rule but I'm not holding my breath.

As I've said many times, I'll wait and see but the rumors don't make me very hopeful. 

Also no I don't want the next new "ubber" army, I want my very own unique "fluffy" IG.


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## Stella Cadente

Capt.Al'rahhem said:


> It allowed everyone on make their own unique guard army.


thats a joke, yes it allowed everyone to make an exact copy of everyone else's drop guard force, very unique.

you want unique paint yah guard pink, rules don't make an army unique, players do


Cpt. Grice said:


> Yayy a tank with a S4 AP4 Heavy 20 weapon


except there is no tank with heavy 20 str4 ap4


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## Capt.Al'rahhem

Stella Cadente said:


> thats a joke, yes it allowed everyone to make an exact copy of everyone else's drop guard force, very unique.
> 
> you want unique paint yah guard pink, rules don't make an army unique, players do



My army's not and never will be cookie cutter. I'd also like think the paintings unique (see sig. pic.). I liked being able to have a Mechanised Guard Army, while someone else could have Light Infantry, ect, ect. Some people only want the Best, most "competitive" army so they do what ever one else does. I want my unique army, while being supported by the rules. The words "competitive" and "viable" have no value to me. I put my time & effort into "theme" and "fun". To each his (or her) own.


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## Katie Drake

Stella Cadente said:


> except there is no tank with heavy 20 str4 ap4


What Stella's trying to say here is that the Punisher gatling cannon's stats aren't as above.


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## QuietEarth

I'm really not opposed to the loss of Doctrines. The only one I really ever made use of was Iron Discipline. Sure Mechanized was cool but if I'm playing a Mech army I'm not playing it because I want Heavy Weapons Squads, I'm playing it because I want Tanks and more Tanks.

I say good riddance to Doctrines.


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## stooge92

cmon, you all complain about how your armies will not be individual or 'special',:angry::victory: but we all know that as soon as you get the codex everyone will have different lists, people will convert, painting and tactics schemes will change and adapt--- everyone wants 'unique'-- and no matter what the IG codex says, we'll make it work.


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## karix bloodfist

guard are going to be almighty once again! they won't be one of those armies you won't use because the other armies are more appealing!


----------



## stooge92

karix bloodfist said:


> they won't be one of those armies you won't use because the other armies are more appealing!


like that happens now 'cough cough' SM cough' excuse me.

its good to see that even without the new codex with can throw about YAYS and NAYS about what it will bring. im afraid there'll be nothing to talk about once it comes out lol, just about a million new lists and a BILLION different opinions. let the constructive criticism commence (in may)

:victory:


----------



## Widowmaker666

The Son of Horus said:


> *Stormtroopers are in Fast Attack, interestingly enough. A Sanctioned Psyker can be included in the squad, who is Ld9 but otherwise unremarkable. Hellguns are S3 AP3 Rapid Fire, with a maximum range of 18'' rather than the usual 24''. Other Fast units are Sentinels, which are broken into Scout Sentinels (the current Sentinels as we know them) and Heavy Sentinels, which are armed with heavier weapons such as plasma cannons, multiple missile launchers, and the like. The Heavy Sentinel also features reinforced front armour 12.


Will rough riders be included?



The Son of Horus said:


> Named Characters are Creed & Kell, Lucas Bastonne, Colonel Iron Hand Straken, Sly Marbo, Artillery Sergeant Harker (who is sort of like Chronus, but for artillery vehicles), Yarrick, Tallarn Captain Al'Rahim, Valhallan Captain Chenkov, Moghol Kamir, and (yes!) Nork Dedog. All the major Games Workshop regiments have a named character now, and some of these guys are unit champion types. The regiment-specific ones add regimental traits kind of like how Codex: Space Marines characters change the Combat Tactics special rule.*


how will the characters work? will they be substituted for your company commander or will you have to take them as a second HQ choice? Also can you take more than one company command squad?


----------



## Fangio

By the feel of the codex I'm inclinded to say that HQ Command Platoons will not be compulsory as you could have a Commissar Lord leading your army. Speculation on my part though.


----------



## when in doubt shoot!

I'd like to see some sort of...rule... (trying my hardest not to call it a doctrine) that allows you to bypass the platoon-as-a-troops choice rule. It may sound stupid, but Some people may want to play an army that doesn't mean you need 50 men minimum (2 platoons) Unless it's an armoured fist squad. 

Like for my WIP: stormtroopers (if there are plastic ones, if not I'll use guardsmen) all mounted in valkyries. I don't want to take two platoons of men, (which is 6 squads) and give them all valkyries. I want about 3 squads. That's it. XD

I hope they keep a rule like the old "grenadiers" doctrine. That would be so much easier.


----------



## spike12225

ha ha lol i remember same thing happeniing with marine codex assault after deepstrike etc sternguard all getting cheese factors then codex was released suddenly not so bad

everything seems bad/cheesy when its rumours but then when its confirmed we adapt and respond meaning not so bad


----------



## Vanchet

Hurray for the power of over-coming complicated armies


----------



## Kobrakai

Just read this thread from start to beginning again to take in everything correctly and see how peoples reactions have changed over time. Must admit it's funny reading some people acting all hating of changes for the stormtroopers and similar, but once rules are out they are loving it. :so_happy:

The new Stormtroopers are going to be great, along with the Valkyries. Lots of new armour and modified units, it's definitely what the guard needed. It's definitely tempted me into starting a guard army. Will get the Codex regardless, it's just whether or not I can stave off temptation. 

Roll on May time, it's nearly here! Can imagine the next White Dwarf we will start to see photos and bits of information regarding them. Can't wait


----------



## bishop5

Kobrakai said:


> Just read this thread from start to beginning again


Must have taken a while 

Also, yeah; the Stormtroopers & Valk are going to be top-notch. A 10 man squad with 2 plasmaguns should nicely kill most things, and being able to deploy them from a Valk just makes it all the sexier. 

Downside will be of course, that everyone takes loads of both in their armies...


----------



## Col. Schafer

I want to see the new sentinals. Plasma cannons? Im there... with a well placed shot take out two termies a round X squad of three= ponage


----------



## Katie Drake

I'm personally most excited about the Support Sentinels with the multiple missile launchers - how to cure all your Orkish problems.


----------



## Vanchet

Katie Drake said:


> I'm personally most excited about the Support Sentinels with the multiple missile launchers - how to cure all your Orkish problems.


How about Flamers, Hellhounds and sentinels with Heavy Flamers 
Hehe Missle frenzy is also my fave ^_^ (cop aload of this Dreadnought )


----------



## Kobrakai

bishop5 said:


> Must have taken a while


Aye it took awhile, but did it just in case I raised anything which already had been answered a dozen times and didn't want to waste peoples time etc... there is a lot of information in this thread after all! :grin:

I think they didn't do guard any favours when they released the current Codex (around Eye of Terror campaign time i think?), think this one does them justice! 

Tons of new models, sweet new rules, even the return of some old favourites. Sounds like the plot to a disney movie :so_happy:


----------



## karix bloodfist

Anyone got any pictures of the new ratlings? i heard that they were to look like little squares but as good as an ORK!! in fight


----------



## thatCavguyc8d

Nobody has answered my questions yet, whats this cheese bussiness? I'm new, so please forgive me.


----------



## when in doubt shoot!

"Cheese" is a term for when something is overpowered, or not fair in a game, like using a baneblade in a 500 points battle. Impossible, just plain daft and super cheesey!


----------



## inqusitor_me

back in te day the trem was beerdie


----------



## Stella Cadente

inqusitor_me said:


> back in the day the term was beardie


because most people with beards were and still are cheesy cheating good for nothing gits.......its evolution


----------



## radical_psyker

Beardy refers more to a style of force composition and gameplay that borders on cheating. Extreme reading of rules and exploiting the tiniest of loopholes that may exist in a Codex. Cheese is more moderate. That is, taking what is allowed in a list but is, well, a bit cheesey. i.e. giving a plasma weapon to every model that can carry one in a Marine army.


----------



## Lord Reevan

> because most people with beards were and still are cheesy cheating good for nothing gits.......its evolution


My beard and I find that quite offensive! Anyway nowadays it seems more to be people who are too young to grow beards to make beardy and cheesy lists.... in my group anyway.....


----------



## stooge92

Does anyone know of any new ratling pictures, i mean, ive seen the commissar lord photos, they're pretty good, does anyone know of any new ones?
:grin:


----------



## Triangulum

I actually do what radical psyker mentioned... 

Anyway the fact that GWs target market is now prepubescent kind of explains the amount of beard/cheese. Most people in that group cant win with strategy but they can look at an FOC and pick really powerful stuff and alot of it. If they ran legit lists and you won every time, wouldnt it be worse than with some beard?


----------



## Captain Galus

radical_psyker said:


> That is, taking what is allowed in a list but is, well, a bit cheesey. i.e. giving a plasma weapon to every model that can carry one in a Marine army.


Guilty :mrgreen:

I play Dark Angels for a reason lol


----------



## Syph

stooge92 said:


> Does anyone know of any new ratling pictures, i mean, ive seen the commissar lord photos, they're pretty good, does anyone know of any new ones?
> :grin:


I took photos of the Ratlings at the Design Open Day. Just search for Design Open Day, you'll find them.


----------



## The Son of Horus

I really like the new ratling sculpts. They're much grittier and dirtier looking than the current ratlings, which are still not bad for what they are. And they scream "I'm a little hobbit with a gun!" which is all sorts of awesome.


----------



## when in doubt shoot!

The Son of Horus said:


> I really like the new ratling sculpts. They're much grittier and dirtier looking than the current ratlings, which are still not bad for what they are. And they scream "I'm a little hobbit with a gun!" which is all sorts of awesome.


And hopefully they'll keep a model with a hankerchief tied round his head, like in the current ones. That rocked :laugh:


----------



## bishop5

The Son of Horus said:


> I really like the new ratling sculpts. They're much grittier and dirtier looking than the current ratlings, which are still not bad for what they are. And they scream "I'm a little hobbit with a gun!" which is all sorts of awesome.


I don't like them; feet are too big and make them look a bit like shit hobbits, and the rifles look like a blunderbuss, again, shit.

They should have made them look like Verne Troyer dressed up as a ninja, carrying a compact barrett .50 cal.


----------



## Vanchet

I like the little sods (slight pot belly to them XP)


----------



## stooge92

i think so far the primaris psyker takes the cake, he has psychic bad-ass written all over him. cant wait to check the codex for what kinda powers can can wield--- i hope his physical is matched by his skill. 

id put a picture of him in, but i don't know how, and it has 'warseer' written on the bottom-- so ill steer clear of that i think


----------



## radical_psyker

Official pics care of GW newsletter:

Cadian Command Squad
http://gwutil.com/newpictures/products/Incoming_Cadians_550x300.jpg









Catachan Command Squad
http://gwutil.com/newpictures/products/Incoming_Catachans_550x300.jpg









Commissar Lord
http://gwutil.com/newpictures/products/Incoming_Commissar_250x200.jpg









Ratlings (really tiny picture!) 
http://gwutil.com/newpictures/products/Incoming_Ratlings_250x200.jpg


----------



## gwmaniac

@radical: drat, you beat me in posting those pics by 5 minutes. :grin:


----------



## radical_psyker

gwmaniac said:


> @radical: drat, you beat me in posting those pics by 5 minutes. :grin:


5 or 45? :grin:


----------



## gwmaniac

no, I was about to post em about 45 minutes ago and then saw that you posted em already. don't worry, I'm not that bad at math. :grin:


----------



## magician847

i am going to get the catachan command squad, i dont like the models for the cadian one, so i will do some converting, and be happy 

lol

M


----------



## kenzman

*commissar*

I LOVE that new commissar. I hope the new commissar lord rules make it so you can have a commissar command squad. Nothing looks better then 5 commissars as a unit


----------



## Stella Cadente

definitely going to combine those 2 command kits together


----------



## Vanchet

I love the command squads (where's the medic though? though we do have a guy reading a book-most likely Gunheads ) I'll definately be having a commissar lord leading the way :biggrin:


----------



## magician847

Stella Cadente said:


> definitely going to combine those 2 command kits together


bloody good idea there stella!

might have to copy you on that one!

M


----------



## Wiccus

friggen boner! New models are pretty damn sexy and so are all the new tanks. Im really tempted to spend the next couple months painting the rest of my incomplete guard so theyre all shiny and pretty for the codex release. My Daemons and CSM be damned!


----------



## Spot The Grot

i like the cadian banner bearer with the bionic arm. that awesome.


----------



## Katie Drake

Man, I really love that bolter-armed Catachan. I might consider using that arm for a Chaos Marine conversion...


----------



## Daniel Harper

That cadian command is awesome. And I think the medic is there, his 'reading book' I think is him unrolling a bandage.


----------



## Inquisitor Einar

Some stuff I heard last saturday was that Valkyries can fly over the battlegroudn and then you can drop your stormtroopers from it a la deepstrike within range of where it's flying.

I also heard something about a heavy 20 tank

And Hellfire guns being made AP 3. ( What stormtroopers are carrying )
If the last is true, that means that flanking up with 2 squads of the buggers against marines will toast em with their BS 4 and rapid fire.

Sadly it's going to be a long time before my WH codex will be updated.. but in the mean time.. I can borrow nifty stuff from impies for my army


----------



## Jezlad

I haven't seen the cover posted yet so here it is.

There's a lot more images on this article too.

http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/c...atId=cat180002&categoryId=400032&aId=14500025


----------



## radical_psyker

T'other pics:


----------



## Stella Cadente

its not a bad cover, I prefer the previous one, but its ok considering GW's artwork quality gets worse and worse everyday


----------



## your master

im so glad the psykers dont look like a cripple now


----------



## MaidenManiac

radical_psyker said:


>


This is _sooooooooooooooooooo_ much a remake of the old Adeptus Astra Telepatica model:laugh:

But its good non the less:good:


----------



## radical_psyker

MaidenManiac said:


> This is _sooooooooooooooooooo_ much a remake of the old Adeptus Astra Telepatica model:laugh:
> 
> But its good non the less:good:


Why laugh? I would think that it is wholely intended to. It certainly captures the feel of the Rogue Trader art (pg 135) better than the original model.


----------



## Llamafish

Does anyone have any photo of the new tanks! Glad to see the psykers look better than every, i cant recall a good looking psyker figure EVER, for the guard!

Only problem i got now, is that i have to wait till May for the guard to get more guns to play with... better work on my genestealer hybrids and ordos mallus untill then!k:


----------



## stooge92

do we think we should stock up on troops before this release (when they put it t ten men)

doe anyone know how much things are going to cost???


----------



## radical_psyker

stooge92 said:


> do we think we should stock up on troops before this release (when they put it t ten men)
> 
> doe anyone know how much things are going to cost???


These are the 'known' US prices, refer to the US and Oz GW sites to get some idea of the Oz$ prices:

Codex Imperial Guard - 104 pages US$25 
Primaris Psyker US$15
Ratling Snipers US$20
Sentinel US$25
Cadian Command Squad US$25
Catachan Command Squad US$25
Valkyrie US$50?55?58 (recent conflicting reports) 
Cadian Shock Troops US$22
Catachan Jungle Fighters US$22


----------



## Kobrakai

Wow, loving the photos coming through.

Definitely getting my mits on the stuff now


----------



## radical_psyker

GW have replaced the mock-up Codex art with the finished art now on the same page from the other day. The article is the same as before, they've just changed the picture:

http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/c...Id=&categoryId=&pIndex=0&aId=14500025&start=1


----------



## thatCavguyc8d

I'm liking the new cover so far. It has a old school US civil/ Neopolinatic wars/ fantency empire feel to it. But I have to agree, the older codex cover was better looking.


----------



## when in doubt shoot!

I really like the look of the new codex, but is it just me, or has almost every guard codex so far had it's own men dying (or dead) on the front?


----------



## Vanchet

Notice that to (either that or they're heretics who are very good at disquises) in fact they are fighting heretics (gnarly hand on the pic) Another thing is that all the guardsmen have the same facial features (I know it'd be a pain to make different faces but still can't help it)


----------



## Druchii in Space

Either cover postion works for me, as to those close ups, can't wait for some of those new command figs, lovely.


----------



## Cadian81st

I really like that new cover, it really captures the idea of an inhumanly large swathe of troops just poring over the field very well.


----------



## Triangulum

I like the image, but personally I would rather they play up the fact that the guard's higher tech regiments actually do use some tactics occasionally.


----------



## gwmaniac

when in doubt said:


> I really like the look of the new codex, but is it just me, or has almost every guard codex so far had it's own men dying (or dead) on the front?


And almost every picture as well! Besides maybe the character pics, there's at least 2 dead or dying Guardsmen (the dying ones usually dying in a horrific fashion)


----------



## radical_psyker

gwmaniac said:


> And almost every picture as well! Besides maybe the character pics, there's at least 2 dead or dying Guardsmen (the dying ones usually dying in a horrific fashion)


As well it should be. A key component of the background for the Imperial Guard is that they are plentiful and entirely expendible, with thousands of troops being sent to their deaths for the tiniest of gains on the battlefield.


----------



## edd_thereaper

or thousands of troops being sent to their death for no gain :biggrin: 
as it sometimes happens



"you value the lives of your men more than your objective?
Insanity! tell the men to advance, all of them!"


----------



## stooge92

HA my brother laughed when i rolled a big scatter into my own troops in assault with his plague marines. 4 of my men died, and so did 2 of his marines-- i threw my head back in a fierce battlecry-- he didn't realise it was a victory for me 

such is the nature of imperial guard-- unless your yarrick... YOUR DEAD

i love it


----------



## Darktheos

I'm not entirly sure Yarrick is Undead.


----------



## stooge92

Couldn't let that one go could you?

you know what i mean


----------



## radical_psyker

Such are the hazards of being lazy with "your" instead of "you're".  But *Darktheos* did slip up by mistyping "entirly" while pointing out someone else's language fail. :grin:


----------



## karix bloodfist

someone might have got this pic before me but it is so cooool!!!


----------



## radical_psyker

karix bloodfist said:


> someone might have got this pic before me but it is so cooool!!!


Red X of Death. Try again. Or maybe have a read through the thread to see if someone has posted it already.


----------



## Fangio

I do love that new codex picture. I will only say that it is clearly using artistic license. An officer that close to the front line? LIES!


----------



## Marneus Calgar

Looking good, this means more traitors for me :biggrin:


----------



## stooge92

Fangio said:


> An officer that close to the front line? LIES!


Someone has to look like a hero!

and troops arent that awsome for the front cover, i would have thought (with all the new tanks) they have a scene with an ARMRD company with thousands of troops milling in and around them (led by a commissar lord)

what would you put on the cover if it were up to you???k:


----------



## Col. Schafer

I would put a valkarie droping 50 guardsmen on top of 1 very disgruntled Khorne brezerker.

"He cant kill all of us men! Maby..."


----------



## stooge92

Seriously though, what would your dream cover be?

be creative


----------



## bishop5

I like the front cover; it's a very nice picture. Ideally it could have been 50% more epic, but it'll do.


----------



## QuietEarth

I like the cover myself however I would like to see more dead Guardsmen and perhaps a wing of Valkyries flying overhead.


----------



## stooge92

yeah, with all the hype of Valkyries you would have thought they'd been on the front. 

do we think this cover is an improvement on the last one, or have we gone backwards?


----------



## Cadian81st

stooge92 said:


> yeah, with all the hype of Valkyries you would have thought they'd been on the front.
> 
> do we think this cover is an improvement on the last one, or have we gone backwards?


That's a good point about the valks, a few of them would make for a pretty epic cover. 

Personally, I like it, I'll have to reserve final judgement until I see it in person, but for know it looks pretty good.


----------



## stooge92

hey, i dont know if its already been said, (i havnt read it since i joined this thread) but what is being released first? 

obviously the codex, but what is being released in the first wave? and the second? how many waves are there?

thanks


----------



## Cadian81st

1st wave is the dex, the cadian and catachan command squad, the valks, the recut troops, and a few command models.


----------



## stooge92

so pretty much they're going to drag it out for as long as they can?


----------



## Triangulum

back, it looks alot like the cover of the EPIC supplement that introduced guard to that system


----------



## radical_psyker

The Codex cover is essentially a retake of an earlier piece of art we've already seen - which had Valkyries - just pushed from landscape into portrait... by a crappier artist.











stooge92 said:


> hey, i dont know if its already been said, (i havnt read it since i joined this thread) but what is being released first?
> 
> obviously the codex, but what is being released in the first wave? and the second? how many waves are there?
> 
> thanks


*May 2nd *
Codex
Primaris Psyker
Ratlings
Cadian Command Squad
Catachan Command Squad
Sentinel
Valkyrie

*May 16th*
Commissar Lord
Advisors (3 in one blister)
Cadian Battleforce
Catachan Battleforce

No mention yet of where the Troops boxes will fall, most are assuming May 2nd but they aren't on any independent stockist release sheets. This often happens when they repackage existing products that aren't strictly "new" however.

There will then be IG releases spread out over the following 18 months, with a rumoured "1.5 Wave" around July/August. 2nd Wave is usually 9-12 months after the 1st Wave but there is talk of a "1.75 Wave".


----------



## stooge92

Damn thats annoying- 1.5 wave,. 1.75 wave, what the hell is that?!!?!

whats going to be in the battleforce boxes?


----------



## Chaosftw

Alright I was talking to the Head of GW Canada today he was in at my Local GW. He brought down the new Codex so I got to peek through it and man its kinda making me want to play guard. The Tank selection is amazing, The new units are pretty cool. 

My favorite were the troops that are essentially convicts that at the beginning of your game they roll a D6 and on a 1-2 there guns rapid fire and i believe they have a stronger AP, 3-4 they have fleet, and Furious Charge, and on a 5-6 they get an extra dice in CC and on 6's they have rending if i remember correctly.

I tried taking pictures of the pages but I got shut down I was able to get one from my phone so here it is:









The Valkarie is a sweet fast attack choice! its nice that it does not fill your heavy slots. The Guard are great in Kill Point missions now a platoon is 1 kill point, the command squad is still separate though. You can ether choose to combine all squads in a platoon into one squad OR keep them separate.

The Chimera options are pretty cool too. Not my favorite thing but certainly cool.

The organs are wicked now T5, more Shooting and more Swings in CC.

Psykers STR = the Number of them in a squad. Ex. If there are 10 its a STR 10 Shot.

Oh! as for releases everything new for the guard the GW rep said that within 4 months it will all be out here in Canada at least. Like Tuesday The Codex HQ's and Troops as well as the Valkarie comes out. Then sometime within the next few months the tanks will be available.

If I can remember anything else ill toss it up.

Cheers,

Chaosftw


----------



## Cadian81st

Goddammit, I guess it's confirmed that Vanquishers only do 1d6 extra now...


----------



## QuietEarth

Chaosftw said:


> Alright I was talking to the Head of GW Canada today he was in at my Local GW. He brought down the new Codex so I got to peek through it and man its kinda making me want to play guard. The Tank selection is amazing, The new units are pretty cool.
> 
> My favorite were the troops that are essentially convicts that at the beginning of your game they roll a D6 and on a 1-2 there guns rapid fire and i believe they have a stronger AP, 3-4 they have fleet, and Furious Charge, and on a 5-6 they get an extra dice in CC and on 6's they have rending if i remember correctly.
> 
> I tried taking pictures of the pages but I got shut down I was able to get one from my phone so here it is:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Rep for you my friend!
> 
> The Valkarie is a sweet fast attack choice! its nice that it does not fill your heavy slots. The Guard are great in Kill Point missions now a platoon is 1 kill point, the command squad is still separate though. You can ether choose to combine all squads in a platoon into one squad OR keep them separate.
> 
> The Chimera options are pretty cool too. Not my favorite thing but certainly cool.
> 
> The organs are wicked now T5, more Shooting and more Swings in CC.
> 
> Psykers STR = the Number of them in a squad. Ex. If there are 10 its a STR 10 Shot.
> 
> Oh! as for releases everything new for the guard the GW rep said that within 4 months it will all be out here in Canada at least. Like Tuesday The Codex HQ's and Troops as well as the Valkarie comes out. Then sometime within the next few months the tanks will be available.
> 
> If I can remember anything else ill toss it up.
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Chaosftw


Reputation for you my friend!


----------



## Venderland101st

*Exterminator*

Is the top tank in the picture a Leman Russ Exterminator? If so, it's a heavy 4 when I thought it used to be a heavy 2. Cool if so, I have one of those! :biggrin:


----------



## Triangulum

Am I reading it wrong if I think an extra D6 is in addition to the normal S + D6 for AP?


----------



## stooge92

Triangulum said:


> Am I reading it wrong if I think an extra D6 is in addition to the normal S + D6 for AP?


if you are talking about the Vanquisher, you're reading the same as me!!!! 

from memory is that the same as a melta bomb? 8 + 2D6??
all right, the guard are truly coming into their element- points wise though, i wonder what we are going to have to pay....


----------



## Ravingbantha

Does anyone know if there's going to be an option to mount the Commander on a horse if you wanted to do a rough Rider heavy army?


----------



## stooge92

Chaosftw said:


> My favorite were the troops that are essentially convicts that at the beginning of your game they roll a D6 and on a 1-2 there guns rapid fire and i believe they have a stronger AP, 3-4 they have fleet, and Furious Charge, and on a 5-6 they get an extra dice in CC and on 6's they have rending if i remember correctly.


i think this merits more explanation, are you saying that all normal troops need to do this at the start? that'll change the game a bit. and you say on 5-6 they get CC dice, but on a 6 they get rending, it it both if they roll a 6, AND what could guard be equipped with to bypass SM armour!!!!! (excited though) 



Psykers STR = the Number of them in a squad. Ex. If there are 10 its a STR 10 Shot.
this is awsome though, i hated psykers before, i might actually have to think about having some (10 even)!~!!

cheers for the information:victory:


----------



## stooge92

Ravingbantha said:


> Does anyone know if there's going to be an option to mount the Commander on a horse if you wanted to do a rough Rider heavy army?


haven't heard anything about it, but i suppose you could do it yourself if you want pure RR army!!


----------



## Duke Vorian

I'm slightly disapointed with the Vanquisher. I mean, its fair, kinda, but the original rules were sweet and what made it so tempting. Unless I'm missing something....

The rest are really original. I'm glad we are getting a few very different variants. 

Chaosftw can you tell us anything more? Like maybe what can the Valk actually transport; if hellguns are really ap 3?


----------



## stooge92

Duke Vorian said:


> if hellguns are really ap 3?


earlier in this forum there is a leaked reference sheet (french translated) and it states hellguns are AP3, so i suppose its 'kind of' solid info.

this is the link to the ref. page

http://www.heresy-online.net/forums/showthread.php?t=24107&page=34


----------



## Cadian81st

They're strength 3 though, which sort of sucks.


----------



## stooge92

Cadian81st said:


> They're strength 3 though, which sort of sucks.


i suppose we cant have it both ways, what does that make it against SM- 3+ HIT and 5+ wound with no save, not bad if they leave it at 10p a model


----------



## Duke Vorian

Yeah, I'll take St. 3. Fair trade off personally.

So is that leaked refrence legit then?


----------



## Chaosftw

stooge92 said:


> i think this merits more explanation, are you saying that all normal troops need to do this at the start? that'll change the game a bit. and you say on 5-6 they get CC dice, but on a 6 they get rending, it it both if they roll a 6, AND what could guard be equipped with to bypass SM armour!!!!! (excited though)
> 
> 
> 
> Psykers STR = the Number of them in a squad. Ex. If there are 10 its a STR 10 Shot.
> this is awsome though, i hated psykers before, i might actually have to think about having some (10 even)!~!!
> 
> cheers for the information:victory:


Ok these Convicts you get are NOT REGULAR TROOPS they are just another troop choice you can take. What Happens is AT THE START OF THE GAME every squad of them you take rolls a D6 individually (squad that is) The ability lasts for the game. On a 1-2 they get extra shots (basically always count as double tapping) on a 3-4 then get fleet and furious charge, and on a 5-6 they get an extra dice when fighting in Close combat and gain RENDING. 

I forget the names of these but ideally they are captured criminals fighting for the guard. and the 1-6 rolls prior to game start are things that convicts would use as means to survive. I was short on time and tried to absorb as much as I could. Sorry if its a little confusing.



Duke Vorian said:


> I'm slightly disapointed with the Vanquisher. I mean, its fair, kinda, but the original rules were sweet and what made it so tempting. Unless I'm missing something....
> 
> The rest are really original. I'm glad we are getting a few very different variants.
> 
> Chaosftw can you tell us anything more? Like maybe what can the Valk actually transport; if hellguns are really ap 3?


I did not see anything as far as the Valk being a transport for non-apoc games. It is just classified as a fast attack choice. Also the Hellguns as stated are in fact AP3.

All in all from what i saw the guard have a lot of nifty tricks up their sleeves and will defiantly balance the playing field. I wish i could remember more but I was in there for literally like 8 min. Im sorry guys  If I can grab some info off some other people ill post it up asap.

Cheers,

Chaosftw


----------



## Necrosis

I think I might start a Guard Army now with some allied sisters. With everything I've seen it looks like the Guard are going to be heavy hitter.


----------



## stooge92

Necrosis said:


> I think I might start a Guard Army now with some allied sisters. With everything I've seen it looks like the Guard are going to be heavy hitter.


one can only hope, im still worried though- with such good tanks are we going to have to pay a mint points-wise (because i know GW will charge a fortune in $$$$$$$ terms)

did you happen to see what things were worth (Chaosftw) when you were flicking through ???


----------



## Chaosftw

stooge92 said:


> one can only hope, im still worried though- with such good tanks are we going to have to pay a mint points-wise (because i know GW will charge a fortune in $$$$$$$ terms)
> 
> did you happen to see what things were worth (Chaosftw) when you were flicking through ???


The Tank kits are going to be between 45-55$ CAD. As far as points go per model it was pretty good Some things are a little more costly (5-10 points) but the idea is that guard need more heavy artillery so the points were not affected all that much. At least from what I saw.

I have someone sending me an email of the things he read over the course of the day. Ill update first thing in the morning if he sends.

Cheers,

Chaosftw


----------



## stooge92

Chaosftw said:


> I have someone sending me an email of the things he read over the course of the day. Ill update first thing in the morning if he sends.


Godspeed, the fate of the Imperium rests solely upon your shoulders!

:victory:


----------



## radical_psyker

Thanks Chaosftw! ChaosftwFTW!! :good: And most importantly (perhaps) can you confirm the recent rumour that Storm Troopers are 16pts each?


----------



## Wiccus

Well balls now I cant finish my daemon army. I have to update my guard to get ready for this. I imagine I will have to shell out an assload for all of the armor variants. Why god do you not allow me to completely finish an army? I think I'm going to order a bunch of forgeworld Elysians for my storm troopers. Eventually I hope to have a full Elysian army but with the points drop thats going to be harder to do. Also very excited for a decent close combat squad for guard. Will be nice to have atleast a little something to counter some assault.


----------



## stooge92

Wiccus said:


> Also very excited for a decent close combat squad for guard. Will be nice to have atleast a little something to counter some assault.


there's always pouring in 2 dozen troops to suppress the area while your armour takes out slower models, but yeah- we did have no CC choices (that were worth it) and now we just might! :victory: HAZZAH!


----------



## QuietEarth

My recommendation for getting all of the armor variants would be to first but and Emperor's Fist boxed set and then when the new LRBT kit comes out you can easily have four different turrets.


----------



## Hellskullz

Anyone have any idea what the new battleforces are to include (both of them if possible)


----------



## radical_psyker

Hellskullz said:


> Anyone have any idea what the new battleforces are to include (both of them if possible)


Both the Catachan and Cadian Battleforces contain the same breakdown but obviously have their respective Command Squads:

Contents:
Command Squad (5 models)
2 Infantry Squads (2x10 models)
Heavy Weapon Squad (3 teams)
Sentinel (1 model)


----------



## Stella Cadente

kinda glad theres no tank in it, especially since I won't be using the Leman russ model


----------



## Venderland101st

Kinda sad it wont have a Leman Russ in it, was hoping to get another one cheap. Not a bad box really, can see me buying one or two this year.


----------



## radical_psyker

*reds8n* has had a good old read of the new Codex and is currently sharing info all over the place (WarSeer and Dakka mostly). 

http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?p=3378512#post3378512
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/150/232594.page



reds8n said:


> Book looks very nice indeed. Looks to me like Mr. Cruddace has done a fine job.
> 
> Overall, aside from the loverly artwork and layout - great use of white space - what impressed me most about the book was the way that the doctrines and existing rules seemed to have been very neatly folded into the main list. Stormtroopers' AP3 Hellguns are a big boost already. But then when you give them an extra tweak of one of 3 skill sets, they become better and it involves a choice that directly influences your playing style.
> 
> It strikes me, and bear in mind this is just from a quick glance and a few discrete conversations, that there is a lot of variety and good builds in this book. Which the Guard deserve. I'm sure we'll hear a lot of OMYGAWDTEHCHEEZ111!1 initially, just like we did when the Marine Codex was coming out, with loads of people predicting ARMIES OF DOOM that would be unstoppable. But if you look at the Marine book and the Daemons one too - and this forthcoming one, they all seem pretty balanced insofar as there is no one powerbuild that screams USE ME like in most of the 4th edition books.
> 
> I guess it was more the complexity and options that caught me by surprise. There might well turn out to be the odd hole here and there I guess, but it seemed logical and well laid out. For example there is a strict hierarchy of command in the Guard, and this is reflected in the order that Orders are given. It all just comes across as logical and, well, common sense really. I was very impressed.
> 
> Looked like a ton of fluff as well, including some swanky timeline of epic battles etc. It was nice to see the Guard, outside of the 'Ghosts' novels perhaps, treated seriously and portrayed as an effective military fighting force. And then throw in Commissars, priests and units of psychic choirs for all manner of 40K goodness.


I have collated *reds8n*'s tellings and taken the liberty of editing it as I have seen fit. Given that the photo of the Leman Russ page posted by *Chaosftw* hasn't been pulled I presume it's okay for me to post the following... some of it, he's not 100% on anyway.

========================

*Orders*

HQ HAVE to place theirs first, then Platoon Command and so on. If a unit is "activated" before it receives an Order - which are given at the start of the shooting phase - then it cannot benefit from one that turn. 

The receiving unit has to pass a Ld test:
Double 1 - they understand and can even be given another Order. 
Pass - Order takes effect. 
Fail - Order does not take effect, but squad can proceed as normal. 
Double 6 - squad can do nothing but mill about in confusion.

Platoon level:
"First rank fire, second rank!" - squad gets one additional shot (so 3 at 12", 2 at 13-24").
"(????????)" - squad gets +1 cover save when they Go To Ground (i.e. +2 total).
"Move move move!" - lets them roll more dice when they run and take highest.

Command HQ level:
"Bring it down!" - which twin links weapons shooting at tanks, MCs and units or squadrons thereof.
"(?????????)" - Some form of rallying one which rallies a unit or even unpins them. He thinks this DOES work after they have "ducked and covered" that round.

*Special Characters*

Sly Marbo is a separate Elite choice (he thinks) (not a squad upgrade) and deploys pretty much like a Callidus Assassin. Might be Fearless (not sure). He wounds on a 2+ in close combat.

Iron Hand Straken is a full on HQ choice (not a squad upgrade) and very nasty too. Fearless, so is his Command Squad and he can issue a Special Order to nearby units giving them Furious Charge and Counter-Attack.

Al'Rahem lets a unit fire one volley immediately and then moves them D6" (might be out of sequence, he's not sure). Instant Death on a 6 with his sword in close combat.

Nork Deddog has some funky rule that as he dies in assault he auto hits the enemy X times in a frenzy before passing out. He comes round later and asks if they won.

There's a tank commander ala Chronus.

Aside from the main/HQ choices there a fair few unit upgrade characters for most units:
Veterans - Catachan guy - basically makes squad Catachan Devils.
Stormtroopers - Bastonne - squad can always try to rally regardless of casualties, etc. He looks scarred and a badass in the drawing of him.
Rough Riders - Some guy - (??????)

*HQ*

Primaris Psyker has a shooty assault 2D6 (he thinks) attack.

*Elite*

_Storm Troopers_
Storm Troopers can reroll the dice for scatter when they Deep Strike. Useful no doubt for when jumping out of a flat out Valkyrie.

_Psyker squad_
Multiple models are lost on Perils result.
The unit of them has two abilities.
- Heavy large blast, something like range 36" S=number of Psykers in the unit, AP D6, 5" blast. 
- Focussed attack that drops enemy Ld = number of Psykers in the squad. 

*Troops*

Platoons can indeed have a banner = +1 Combat Resolution in assault.
6 man special weapon teams are a choice.
Veteran squads - have defensive grenades.
Penal troops shooting makes them Assault 2 he believes.

*Fast Attack*

Valkyries are [*] points each, a Fast Attack choice and 1-3 in a squadron.

Both types of Sentinels are Fast Attack.

*Tanks*

Hellhounds and their variants be taken in squadrons (he thinks). The Inferno Cannon now a 12" range for the template.

*Heavy Support*

Hydra Flak Tank has special tracking systems that ignores cover saves for Skimmers going fast and Bikes, etc.

==================

*Points value was given but I have chosen to edit it out.


----------



## Dafistofmork

okay, my orks are now officaly dead. very dead. S10 large blast from 10 pskers? dead. hellhound squads? dead. more leman russ variants than you can shake a stick at? dead. ap 3 hellguns? dead. oh well, it was fun while it lasted.


----------



## Katie Drake

lol relax, we don't even know how many points 10 psykers will cost, or if Hellhound Squadrons are worth fielding and so on. I think Guard will be a competitive army, but I doubt they'll overwhelm the green tide.


----------



## Syph

Good stuff, both chaosftw and you (again) radical. Slices of rep for you both (esp. when I can radical!)


----------



## Lord Reevan

Damn I want to paly guard now.... Must finish everything else first though.
One thing I will be sxpecting though is people not playing them as horde anymore and have the minimum troop choices and a bollock load of tanks.... Kinda the exact opposite of orks and I see it being very very effective......


----------



## radical_psyker

Syph said:


> Good stuff, both chaosftw and you (again) radical. Slices of rep for you both (esp. when I can radical!)


No worries *Syph*. :victory: As to listing points costs, can I indicate a rough cost? Or include a range it might lie in? I have no intention of revealing the actual points cost, but just if it's possible to give a rough idea for people.


----------



## Syph

Yeah, you can list a _rough_ cost... :grin:


----------



## Chaosftw

So. Just waiting on the Email.

I asked for point costs and any special rules he can remember. I also asked about the valk being a transport. I could not remember reading anything but just to confirm 

I will update this post if not too many people have posted after me. If there is anything specific you would like me to find out toss up questions I suppose. but dont go to into it because the book does come out tomorrow.

Cheers,

Chaosftw


----------



## radical_psyker

Chaosftw said:


> So. Just waiting on the Email.
> 
> I asked for point costs and any special rules he can remember. I also asked about the valk being a transport. I could not remember reading anything but just to confirm
> 
> I will update this post if not too many people have posted after me. If there is anything specific you would like me to find out toss up questions I suppose. but dont go to into it because the book does come out tomorrow.
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Chaosftw


Whether Storm Troopers are a lot more expensive mainly, i.e. the recent rumour that they are 16pts each, before special weapons. What the mechanic is - if any - for taking an all-Storm Trooper army, and what the deal is with carapace in the new Codex. And just how the Vendetta differs exactly from the Valkyrie. Beyond that, any info on new models we haven't seen already would be nice.


----------



## Stella Cadente

Cadian81st said:


> Goddammit, I guess it's confirmed that Vanquishers only do 1d6 extra now...


they only ever did 1d6 extra, 1d6 normal, +1d6 extra, equals 2d6


----------



## spidie2000

heh i found that comment funny too.... im pretty sure 1D6 extra = 2D6


----------



## phillbrick

Hey

There was a rumour earlier about a "Platoon drill" order/ability, where you could shoot through your own squads in the same platoon and the targets wouldn't get the cover save for it. Any truth to that that you know of?

Thanks for the stuff so far.
Peace


----------



## when in doubt shoot!

Yeah, it seems a reality. I wouldn't be surprised if it was only for things like heavy weapons teams though.


----------



## karix bloodfist

does anyone know what they going to do instead of doctrines? and what are the heavys in the IG book to-be-released? cos i might 'orkyfy' some of 'em


----------



## radical_psyker

karix bloodfist said:


> does anyone know what they going to do instead of doctrines? and what are the heavys in the IG book to-be-released? cos i might 'orkyfy' some of 'em


Yeah, it's called Orders and it goes a little something like this... :music:

Orders generally make a squad do something such as make them better shots, rally, or recover from things like Pinning or Gone To Ground. These orders are not automatic and require a Ld test. 

The number of Orders an Officer can issue is dependent on rank, with Platoon and Company Commanders having only 1 or 2 and some Special Characters having as much 4, or possibly more.

Company Commander can issues Orders to any squad with Vox or within 12".
Platoon Commander can issue Orders to any squad in their platoon with Vox or within 6". 
Some squad leaders can issue Orders to their own squad. 

HQ have to place theirs first, then Platoon Commanders and so on. If a unit is "activated" before it receives an Order - which are given at the start of the shooting phase - then it cannot benefit from one that turn. 

The receiving unit has to pass a Ld test:
Double 1 - they understand and can even be given another Order. 
Pass - Order takes effect. 
Fail - Order does not take effect, but squad can proceed as normal. 
Double 6 - squad can do nothing but mill about in confusion.

Some rumoured Orders:
"First rank fire, second rank fire!" - squad gets one additional shot with any rapid fire weapons (so 3 at 12", 2 at 13-24").
"Down!" - squad gets +1 cover save when they Go To Ground (i.e. +2 total).
"Move move move!" - lets them roll more dice when they run and take highest.
"Tank!" - squad get +1 to armour penetration roll.
"Bring it down!" - which twin links weapons shooting at tanks, MCs and units or squadrons thereof.
"(?????????)" - Some form of rallying, which rallies a unit or even unpins them.

Special characters can issue Special Orders that are unique to them:

Ursarkar Creed
"For Cadia!" - squad becomes Fearless and gains Furious Charge.

Captain Chenkov
Can upgrade his Platoon's Conscript squad for 75 points, allowing the following Special Order:
"Send in the next wave!" - the squad is immediately removed from the table and next turn walks back on from the table edge at full strength.

Iron Hand Straken
"(?????????)" - can give nearby squad Furious Charge and Counter-Attack.

Captain Al'Rahem 
"(?????????)" - let's one squad fire one volley immediately and then move D6".

...

When you say "heavys" what do you mean exactly?


----------



## Triangulum

I really am interested in the answer to the all stormtrooper army. I have been trying to build a Kasrkin Phalanx like is mentioned in His Last Command and with the Stormtrooper character confirmed as a squad upgrade is the all stormy list quashed?


----------



## Chaosftw

Well Gents the gent I thought would really pull through for me today failed miserably. I do apologize. I will get a lot of info up for everyone tomorrow for those who cant get to a codex themselves.

Cheers,

Chaosftw


----------



## Kalishnikov-47

Chaosftw said:


> Well Gents the gent I thought would really pull through for me today failed miserably. I do apologize. I will get a lot of info up for everyone tomorrow for those who cant get to a codex themselves.
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Chaosftw


What, unbelievable you sir have crossed the line. I have alot of feelings and you just hurt ....damn near everyone of them. 

Seriously, no worries mate. We loko forward to your hard work and contributions. Thanks in advance to all who supply the info!! :shok:


----------



## Hellskullz

Chaosftw said:


> Well Gents the gent I thought would really pull through for me today failed miserably. I do apologize. I will get a lot of info up for everyone tomorrow for those who cant get to a codex themselves.
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Chaosftw


how do you have access to the codex tomorrow if it doesn't out until May 2nd?


----------



## Duke Vorian

Yes, I second this question? 

You mean every GW store will have a copy?


----------



## Chaosftw

Hellskullz said:


> how do you have access to the codex tomorrow if it doesn't out until May 2nd?





Duke Vorian said:


> Yes, I second this question?
> 
> You mean every GW store will have a copy?


Not to sound rude but does it matter. Ill get info tomorrow and ill get it to ll of you 

Just relax! and donate to Heresy!

Cheers,

Chaosftw


----------



## Hellskullz

Chaosftw said:


> Not to sound rude but does it matter. Ill get info tomorrow and ill get it to ll of you
> 
> Just relax! and donate to Heresy!
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Chaosftw


you don't sound rude at all. I just really wanted to know lol. Well, thanks in advance for the info! :biggrin:


----------



## Duke Vorian

I was just wonderin' if they'd be in the GW stores cause if they are I'd make a trip....haha


----------



## stooge92

sorry if this has already been addressed, i havn't read it sice joining this thread. the new tanks, are they coming in weapon sprues--- umm... i mean, do you buy a leman russ AND THEN buy the weapon for (vanquisher, punisher etc) seperate? or are they in one box?


----------



## radical_psyker

stooge92 said:


> sorry if this has already been addressed, i havn't read it sice joining this thread. the new tanks, are they coming in weapon sprues--- umm... i mean, do you buy a leman russ AND THEN buy the weapon for (vanquisher, punisher etc) seperate? or are they in one box?


GW have released exactly ZERO information on new Tank kits. In fact, at the UK Design Studio Open Day, they denied they were even working on any. Insiders however say that we will be getting them, probably by August.

EDIT - Sorry, to address your query more directly - it's my understanding that both the Chimera (and therefore Hellhound) and Russ sprues are being recut, so you should have all (or most) of the weapon options in the box.


----------



## Wiccus

thats going to be so annoying having to proxy for several months. This basic leman russ is a punisher variant despite it having a battle cannon. and this leman russ over here with the battle cannon actually is an exterminator. Oh well I guess I can make due except if I go to tournaments before the new tanks are released.


----------



## stooge92

radical_psyker said:


> GW have released exactly ZERO information on new Tank kits. In fact, at the UK Design Studio Open Day, they denied they were even working on any. Insiders however say that we will be getting them, probably by August.
> 
> EDIT - Sorry, to address your query more directly - it's my understanding that both the Chimera (and therefore Hellhound) and Russ sprues are being recut, so you should have all (or most) of the weapon options in the box.


thanks, weird, you would have thought they'd have given us snippets of information to gossip over to raise excitement and anticipation.
no doubt there will be some info. in next months white dwarf (and following ones) which should cover everything


----------



## radical_psyker

Yeah, the tank redo issue has been a bit baffling. As others have observed, you would've thought they'd release tank kits with the Codex given how many new ones there are. But as insiders have said, with time and labour constraints, you can't get everything "first" and the big plastic multi-option kits take longer*. I'm just surprised they haven't mentioned anything about new kits (beyond having anonymous CADs on display at Games Days and such) but GW does seem to be very much about "what's next" rather than "what's coming in a few months" of late. 

By the way, when I say "by August" it could be sooner. That's the baffling part. The insider info seems quite tight on the tank kits and it might be within a month of the Codex or within a few months. Hopefully, the info is not wrong and it ends up being several months. :cray:




*Apparently the Valkyrie has been ready for a while now. Supposedly it was the first FW kit they tried to carry over to plastic but they had some troubles with it being a slightly odd fiddly shape and ended up going with the easier "more boxy" Baneblade instead. But they kept plugging away at the Valk in the background.


----------



## Syph

I spoke to the CAD guys at the Design Open Day and they've changed software a couple of times. They used Rhino initially but it was very difficult to make minute changes (for instance, should someone say 'make that 1mm smaller' they'd have to redraw the entire part). The new software allows them to alter things very easily which of course means more complicated plastic kits; hopefully better fitting ones too!


----------



## Lord of Rebirth

Syph said:


> I spoke to the CAD guys at the Design Open Day and they've changed software a couple of times. They used Rhino initially but it was very difficult to make minute changes (for instance, should someone say 'make that 1mm smaller' they'd have to redraw the entire part). The new software allows them to alter things very easily which of course means more complicated plastic kits; hopefully better fitting ones too!


I wonder if that is the same Rhino I used to use cause it was a dream to work with and changing something minutely would have been especially easy with that program. If you get a chance to talk to them again or know I kinda wanna know what is a good 3D works program for both parts design (To make my real scale operational tank project feasible I plan to do all the parts design and assembly work myself which is extra good since I have schooling in design and can hand designs over to machinist friends to have the parts made a lot cheaper then going to a shop and having them have to remake parts several times just to get them right.) and for 3D architectural mock-ups for my normal housing design work since hand drawing out 10-60 view points per project takes to much time.


----------



## Syph

lord of rebirth said:


> I wonder if that is the same Rhino I used to use cause it was a dream to work with and changing something minutely would have been especially easy with that program. If you get a chance to talk to them again or know I kinda wanna know what is a good 3D works program for both parts design (To make my real scale operational tank project feasible I plan to do all the parts design and assembly work myself which is extra good since I have schooling in design and can hand designs over to machinist friends to have the parts made a lot cheaper then going to a shop and having them have to remake parts several times just to get them right.) and for 3D architectural mock-ups for my normal housing design work since hand drawing out 10-60 view points per project takes to much time.


We use Rhino here at school for graphics and 3D modelling, as well as Flamingo IIRC. The guy said he couldn't just click a part (for instance, a bit of a bumper on a trukk) and alter it by 1mm by just typing the new size in. There was a term for it, but I don't remember.

I think the new software they use is http://www.techsoft.co.uk/solidworks.htm

Don't quote me on that.


----------



## radical_psyker

US product release sheet for you yanks... 

May 1st 
42-06 IMPERIAL GUARD CATACHAN JUNGLE FIGHTERS 10 Fig Box $22.00 New - Repackaged
42-10 IMPERIAL GUARD CATACHAN COMMAND SQUAD 5 Fig Box $22.00 New
47-01-60 CODEX IMPERIAL GUARD (ENGLISH) 104pp Book $25.00 New
47-09 IMPERIAL GUARD CADIAN COMMAND SQUAD 5 Fig Box $22.00 New
47-10 IMPERIAL GUARD VALKYRIE 1 Fig Box $50.00 New
47-12 IMPERIAL GUARD SENTINEL 1 Fig Box $25.00 New
47-17 IMPERIAL GUARD CADIAN SHOCK TROOPS 10 Fig Box $22.00 New - Repackaged
47-39 IMPERIAL GUARD RATLINGS 5 Fig Blister $20.00 New - Single Print
47-40 IMPERIAL GUARD PRIMARIS PSYKER 1 Fig Blister $15.00 New - Single Print

May 15th 
(DIRECT) IMPERIAL GUARD REGIMENTAL ADVISORS 3 Fig Blister $17.00 New
(DIRECT) IMPERIAL GUARD LORD COMMISSAR 1 Fig Blister $15.00 New
42-11 IMPERIAL GUARD CATACHAN BATTLEFORCE 36 Fig Box $90.00 New
47-20 IMPERIAL GUARD CADIAN BATTLEFORCE 36 Fig Box $90.00 New


----------



## Cadian81st

Hmm...the lord commissar is a blister. I guess that pretty much nerfs the rumour of it being plastic then.

What does single print mean? Splash release?


----------



## radical_psyker

Cadian81st said:


> Hmm...the lord commissar is a blister. I guess that pretty much nerfs the rumour of it being plastic then.
> 
> What does single print mean? Splash release?


There was no way in hell the Commissar Lord was ever going to be plastic.

Yes, single print means splash release. Available in stores around release but then changing to Direct Only at a later date... for people who don't know what a splash release is. :wink:


----------



## Cadian81st

radical_psyker said:


> There was no way in hell the Commissar Lord was ever going to be plastic.
> 
> Yes, single print means splash release. Available in stores around release but then changing to Direct Only at a later date... for people who don't know what a splash release is. :wink:


I dunno, I'd heard something I while back about a plastic commissar lord. Whatever, I'm just happy the damned thing exists at all.

I can understand making the primaris psyker splash release, but why the ratlings?


----------



## radical_psyker

Cadian81st said:


> I dunno, I'd heard something I while back about a plastic commissar lord. Whatever, I'm just happy the damned thing exists at all.
> 
> I can understand making the primaris psyker splash release, but why the ratlings?


That was just some forum wishful thinking I'm afraid, the Lord was always going to be metal.

I'm not sure how well Ratlings sell by and large. There seems to be an enormous amount of bile directed towards these new models (I don't mind them myself, but still prefer human snipers) so maybe they're aren't going to go too well?


----------



## Chaosftw

Alright Here is what I got today. Stupid people would not let me take pictures or write things down.

Storm Troopers: They will be more expensive but have AP3 bolters
Valkaries: The can transport up to 12 models however because they are a fast attack unit they cant be dedicated transports.
HQ squads: When they have a medic in them they will no longer be allowed to negate one wound. Every unit that has a MEDIC in it now has FNP.

There are abilities called Drill orders or something like that. 
This gives your troops the ability to shoot 2 shots at long range oppose to 1 and 3 shots in "Rapid fire range" 
There is one that allows the troops to re-roll pin checks
There is another that allows for 3D6 when Running.
There are a few others as well.

The listed above will become very important because the armies leadership is not the HQ's leadership anymore each squad uses its leadership of (X). So those re-rolling pinning checks will be very valuable etc.

Will update again shortly posting as I read from my iPhone  so expect double and maybe triple posts.

Chaosftw


----------



## Duke Vorian

Now, when you say ap. 3 bolters are you meaning their str. 4 as well and 24"?


----------



## Syph

Good man chaosftw. I hope you good men are repping him for his efforts!


----------



## Chaosftw

Duke Vorian said:


> Now, when you say ap. 3 bolters are you meaning their *str. 3* as well and 24"?


Yes, yes and yes.

Chaosftw


----------



## Chaosftw

IDK if anyone has seen these yet but here are some images of the new models


































Also you can take 3 tanks for every one place in the heavy spots in a force organization chart so 9 tanks...OOOOOO just read and you can now move up to 6' and fire ALL GUNS! you can also equip plasma las etc as side sponsons.... =PWN!


----------



## Akuma

Hi my first post  

chaosftw - are you positivly extragreat and super hyper sure about the Storm Troopers weapon ?

I ask because there is a Roster Sheet that franch GW posted on there site - and in that roster the HellGun ( the weapon of storm troopers ) is R16" S3 AP3 Rapid Fire - Thay also cost tha same as Fire Dragon.

Would love to hear that you saw it with your own eyes and its basicly bolter with AP3 - would make Stormies Far Far more viable !


----------



## Syph

Chaosftw said:


> IDK if anyone has seen these yet but here are some images of the new models


Aye we have, back a couple of pages. Damn they look cool though.


----------



## Chaosftw

Akuma said:


> Hi my first post
> 
> chaosftw - are you positivly extragreat and super hyper sure about the Storm Troopers weapon ?
> 
> I ask because there is a Roster Sheet that franch GW posted on there site - and in that roster the HellGun ( the weapon of storm troopers ) is R16" S3 AP3 Rapid Fire - Thay also cost tha same as Fire Dragon.
> 
> Would love to hear that you saw it with your own eyes and its basicly bolter with AP3 - would make Stormies Far Far more viable !


Sorry my mistake its still S3. Sorry for that small mistake  and Welcome to Heresy!

Cheers,

Chaosftw


----------



## radical_psyker

Chaosftw said:


> Sorry my mistake its still S3. Sorry for that small mistake  and Welcome to Heresy!
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Chaosftw


The range is possibly the larger issue, which is *18"* on the summary sheet (not 16", Akuma).


----------



## Akuma

Yeah - your right 18" :biggrin: But it's RF so you will always want to be 12" from said enemy MEQ - so the S4 would be more helpfull - at leat for me...

I hope Chaosftw has some more juicy stuff on his Iphone 

( refreshing  )


----------



## Wiccus

Firing all guns from a russ is going to be very sexy. With the current codex its almost pointless to take sponsons seeing as you can pretty much only ever fire one gun. Dammit I still have over a month to wait for the codex. So freaking excited.


----------



## Hellskullz

who said I can only have 9 tanks? Your forgetting fast attack tanks like the hellhound! lol
and although it'd be impractical and expensive to boot (both point wise and money wise) something about fielding 9 LR punishers appeals greatly to me lol (180 str 5 shots anyone? not to mention any mounted or side sponson weapons)


----------



## Lord_Murdock

So, if Leman Russes are going to be in "squads" of three, how about other heavy support tanks, specifically Basilisks? I have way too many tanks to be used in one battle right now, so if they could all be "squadded"... that would be nice.


----------



## radical_psyker

Lord_Murdock said:


> So, if Leman Russes are going to be in "squads" of three, how about other heavy support tanks, specifically Basilisks? I have way too many tanks to be used in one battle right now, so if they could all be "squadded"... that would be nice.


Russes, Hounds and Artillery can be squadded within their types, but the Deathstrike can't. Valks/Vendettas and Sentinels can be squadded too.


----------



## Wiccus

a squad of valks would be rad would go well with my Elysian army I'm trying to build.


----------



## Chaosftw

Hellskullz said:


> who said I can only have 9 tanks? Your forgetting fast attack tanks like the hellhound! lol
> and although it'd be impractical and expensive to boot (both point wise and money wise) something about fielding 9 LR punishers appeals greatly to me lol (180 str 5 shots anyone? not to mention any mounted or side sponson weapons)


I was talking specifically about Heavy support.



Lord_Murdock said:


> So, if Leman Russes are going to be in "squads" of three, how about other heavy support tanks, specifically Basilisks? I have way too many tanks to be used in one battle right now, so if they could all be "squadded"... that would be nice.


Basalisks are only allowed to be used in Apoc games now.



radical_psyker said:


> Russes, Hounds and Artillery can be squadded within their types, but the Deathstrike can't. Valks/Vendettas and Sentinels can be squadded too.


To my understanding this is correct


----------



## inqusitor_me

from what i have heard its only the russies that can Squad up


----------



## nightfish

WHy would you give Stormtroopers S3 AP 3 weapons? Overkill I think, AP4 by all means but marine killers....


----------



## Katie Drake

Hrm? Basilisks can only be used in Apoc? What's this?


----------



## Lord Reevan

nightfish said:


> WHy would you give Stormtroopers S3 AP 3 weapons? Overkill I think, AP4 by all means but marine killers....


I think it works very well. Many armies have units that are easily able to take out marines in CC because of their CC nature, Banshees, daemons, incubi, etc.

The guard are a shooting army so they would have a unit that does a similar job but in a shooting style.... Plus the strength and shorter main range will get them...


----------



## phillbrick

Stormtroopers are also getting a ponts cost hike as mentioned, over on the warseer forums there were rumours about them being 16 points each, which is a pretty big jump from what they are currently. Also, they are only strength 3 now, so you aren't likely to kill too many marines with them.


----------



## Grimskul25

Well, its pretty damn nice IG is getting this power boost,  though this will make my orks cry for a while before we all find a way to smack 'em back. Still the big thing that worries is the new LR variants...that LR punisher is gonna beat the pudding out of my mobz :shok: anyhow thx Chaosftw for giving all this info. It's gonna be hard to counter them now with all those tank templates flying around... :scare:


----------



## Duke Vorian

So about Basilisks being Apoc. only...

Well, this is kind of interesting. I think from a fluff standpoint this would make sense as heavy artillery pieces are meant for larger battles and not so much 'small' tactical and/or skirmishes. Its sad but I could accept it.

The Leman Russ Squadron is interesting. This is pretty rough. I'm all for making my Guard army more powerful and more of a compatative army to the other armies out their but I fear for the cry of cheese coming from our new codex. The current codex is personally one of the balanced list out their: not really cheesable and still able to win against the newest of codex. 

When I think about it though a squadron of current LRBT would come to 430 bare, not including add ons. I guess that may be fair....I won't complain....

So when you say a LRBT for example can move 6" and still shot all of its guns does that include firing say the Battle Cannon, side sponson heavy bolters, and hull lascannon; or just the sponsons and hull or the Battle Cannon?


----------



## Duke Vorian

Also, Valkaries squadded? How would transportation work then? Would they have to be deployed next to eachother? 

Also, anything about how killpoints would work?


----------



## stooge92

radical_psyker said:


> US product release sheet for you yanks...
> 
> May 1st
> 42-06 IMPERIAL GUARD CATACHAN JUNGLE FIGHTERS 10 Fig Box $22.00 New - Repackaged
> 42-10 IMPERIAL GUARD CATACHAN COMMAND SQUAD 5 Fig Box $22.00 New
> 47-01-60 CODEX IMPERIAL GUARD (ENGLISH) 104pp Book $25.00 New
> 47-09 IMPERIAL GUARD CADIAN COMMAND SQUAD 5 Fig Box $22.00 New
> 47-10 IMPERIAL GUARD VALKYRIE 1 Fig Box $50.00 New
> 47-12 IMPERIAL GUARD SENTINEL 1 Fig Box $25.00 New
> 47-17 IMPERIAL GUARD CADIAN SHOCK TROOPS 10 Fig Box $22.00 New - Repackaged
> 47-39 IMPERIAL GUARD RATLINGS 5 Fig Blister $20.00 New - Single Print
> 47-40 IMPERIAL GUARD PRIMARIS PSYKER 1 Fig Blister $15.00 New - Single Print
> 
> May 15th
> (DIRECT) IMPERIAL GUARD REGIMENTAL ADVISORS 3 Fig Blister $17.00 New
> (DIRECT) IMPERIAL GUARD LORD COMMISSAR 1 Fig Blister $15.00 New
> 42-11 IMPERIAL GUARD CATACHAN BATTLEFORCE 36 Fig Box $90.00 New
> 47-20 IMPERIAL GUARD CADIAN BATTLEFORCE 36 Fig Box $90.00 New


it wouldnt be good enough to just convert these prices to AUS $ would it (because of importing and stuff), are there any aussies that know the prices for us?

cheers


----------



## kenzman

Basalisks out of the standard game? Really? That makes me a sad panda.


----------



## radical_psyker

stooge92 said:


> it wouldnt be good enough to just convert these prices to AUS $ would it (because of importing and stuff), are there any aussies that know the prices for us?
> 
> cheers


If you want to do a straight currency conversion, try google or xe.com. If you want to know what the Oz RRP for these kits is going to be, until the Australian product release sheet comes out, all you can do is get an idea by comparing items on the GW US site in those US$ prices (i.e. $15, $17, $22, etc) to the same items on the GW Oz site.


----------



## tu_shan82

Whaat does single print mean?


----------



## comrade

Katie Drake said:


> Hrm? Basilisks can only be used in Apoc? What's this?


yeah, I'm with Drake with this one. I refute the belief they will be reduced to 'only' Apoc, especially since we can now field a Deathstrike in reg 40k, that would just be lame and retarded...

*It will be in the new codex, simply because its stats are on that leaked stat sheet that came out a few months ago.
*
actually kinda like how we will be paying more for less with the new set up they are making.


shit, they even making Battleforce boxes smaller and saying its a 'deal':laugh:

thank god I got like 500 guardsmen.


----------



## radical_psyker

comrade said:


> shit, they even making Battleforce boxes smaller and saying its a 'deal':laugh:


Actually the new Cadian Battleforce is better value than the old one no matter how you squeeze it. Catachans one isn't though. 



tu_shan82 said:


> Whaat does single print mean?


Please do try and make the effort to read back a few pages before you ask questions...


Cadian81st said:


> What does single print mean? Splash release?





radical_psyker said:


> Yes, single print means splash release. Available in stores around release but then changing to Direct Only at a later date... for people who don't know what a splash release is. :wink:


----------



## QuietEarth

What's in the Cadian Battleforce?


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## tony161

In UK (home of GW lol) it will work out cheaper for a squad in a box, however if you prefer have mechanised forces with only las+special weapons, your be pretty [email protected]£ked. Also if you prefer massed meat shield conscripts (great for killing, but they get in the way alot) your not going to be so well off. Plastic storm troops, as long as they can be altered so they arn't just Karskin. 

Anyway. Standard regiment box in great britain is £18, i'd love to see the 10 man box be £15 but i doubt this. Platoon box would be so much fun if it was only £30.


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## Akuma

> What's in the Cadian Battleforce?


Command Squad 
20 Cadians 
3x Heavy Weapons 
1x Sentinel


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## nightfish

Lord Reevan said:


> I think it works very well. Many armies have units that are easily able to take out marines in CC because of their CC nature, Banshees, daemons, incubi, etc.
> 
> The guard are a shooting army so they would have a unit that does a similar job but in a shooting style.... Plus the strength and shorter main range will get them...


I don't buy this Reeven, guard can already take out marines with volume of shots. They do not need a unit with AP 3 weapons.

And another thing, having AP3 weaponry as standard is a bit unfair on other armies who have to rely on limited special / heavy weapons to kill marines outright.


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## bishop5

Just been reading about the new orders on warseer; some of those sound awesome!
Twin-linking weapons vs tanks & MC's, extra shots on teh lasguns, +1 to cover saves for going to ground.... mint!
That is really going to make IG infantry-heavy armies quite frightening...


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## don_mondo

nightfish said:


> I don't buy this Reeven, guard can already take out marines with volume of shots. They do not need a unit with AP 3 weapons.
> 
> And another thing, having AP3 weaponry as standard is a bit unfair on other armies who have to rely on limited special / heavy weapons to kill marines outright.


You mean like AP 3 bolters or flamers. Oh wait, Chaos and Marines have access to those types of weapons. Thing is, if the rumor is true re the cost of a Stormtrooper, they're going to cost (16 points?) almost as much as that Marine they're trying to take out.


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## your master

not sure if this has been mentioned but i was speaking to the GW staff today and they let slip somthing - that you can take as many commisars as you want they are no longer elite how cool is that plus they were putting together the cadian command squad which had alot of spares and looked awesome


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## bishop5

don_mondo said:


> You mean like AP 3 bolters or flamers. Oh wait, Chaos and Marines have access to those types of weapons. Thing is, if the rumor is true re the cost of a Stormtrooper, they're going to cost (16 points?) almost as much as that Marine they're trying to take out.


Very true; although hard-hitting (AP3 Hellguns and 2x Plasmaguns in each squad) they are much more fragile than Marines and can't hold objectives (that we know)

I'm looking forward to three squads of Stormtroopers, mounted in Valk's.


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## kenzman

wonder if grenade launchers are still ap4... what would be the point of taking one over a meltagun or plasma in a stormtrooper squad?  also if stormtroopers can use the "orders" from the command squads? Dumping out of a valk and rapid fire 3 ap3 shots per troop! think i would take more hell guns over other weapons if thats the case.


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## bishop5

If they're rapid fire they might be worth taking as one of the new orders supposedly gives rapid fire weapons an extra shot (i'm guessing plasmaguns are excluded but then you're much more likely to kill yourself with it)
Also, firing 6x S3 small blasts (2x grenade launchers rapid firing at 12" +1 shot for orders) is pretty decent against most stuff.


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## kenzman

Grenade launchers are assault. Wonder if hellguns are still rapid fire? if so this is starting to sound like a solid tactic.


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## Death 0F Angels

wow, up to 63 pages. Any chance at closing this thread and compiling the 2 0r 3 pages of usefull info onto a new thread?


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## radical_psyker

kenzman said:


> Grenade launchers are assault. Wonder if hellguns are still rapid fire? if so this is starting to sound like a solid tactic.


Hellguns are still Rapid Fire.


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## chrisman 007

Chaosftw said:


> Basalisks are only allowed to be used in Apoc games now.


No.....no!! There must be some mistake! Right? :cray:


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## Chaosftw

Katie Drake said:


> Hrm? Basilisks can only be used in Apoc? What's this?


Thats what I have heard word for word by GW employees.



phillbrick said:


> Stormtroopers are also getting a ponts cost hike as mentioned, over on the warseer forums there were rumours about them being 16 points each, which is a pretty big jump from what they are currently. Also, they are only strength 3 now, so you aren't likely to kill too many marines with them.


but its AP3 everyone needs to take them. Its the same reason everyone thinks Thousand Sons are amazing. ITS AP3.... sigh...

They are going to be somewhat useless against specifics but others it will be alright.



Duke Vorian said:


> Also, Valkaries squadded? How would transportation work then? Would they have to be deployed next to eachother?
> 
> 
> Also, anything about how killpoints would work?


Yes you would have to start / use the rules for mounting up (squad within 2' of the transport) but its not like you take a squad and under what the squad has you put Valkarie.

As for Kill Points Guard will certainly have an easier time managing now. You can choose at the start of the game to have literally a platoon count as 1 KP.



chrisman 007 said:


> No.....no!! There must be some mistake! Right? :cray:


Maybe a Mistake but thats what I heard by numerous people that are rather credible sources.

Cheers,

Chaosftw


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## Pauly55

-Imperial Guard Ratlings (5 figure blister). Abhuman snipers with Stealth and Infiltrate special rules. _Characteristic snacks modeled onto bases._


Italics are my favorite part.


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## Syph

Hahaha, well spotted.


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## Pauly55

I guess we should have expected such things when it was sculpted by this guy:









Edit: Thats Dave Thomas, founder of Wendys fast food burger place, for the non-americans among us.


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## radical_psyker

Chaosftw said:


> Thats what I have heard word for word by GW employees.


_*There's*_ yer problem! :biggrin:


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## Chaosftw

radical_psyker said:


> _*There's*_ yer problem! :biggrin:


It was not just store employees These were Canadian Head office people as well. The few gents at my Local GW are pretty good about this stuff.

Chaosftw


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## Syph

In light of Chaosftw's sterling work in doing a bit of a summary post, I'll go ahead and close this. Please contribute to the other thread - particularly if anything new comes to light or if anything is missed.


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