# Battlefoam vs Blood of Kittens is heating up!



## MadCowCrazy (Mar 19, 2009)

10/06/2013 Update
Eldar is Here. Get Some! June 1st (Show 62)
40K Radio has their latest podcast out, they go over the documents BoK has laid forth and say they are all pretty much blatant lies.

I have a feeling this isn't really going to go anywhere, it's turning out to be a word against word type of situation. Seems allot of shady things are going on in the background with NOVA, BOLS etc
Seems they all have an agenda vs BattleFoam. It also seems TO's aren't deciding to deal with BattleFoam, it's BattleFoam who are deciding not to sponsor shitty events and this makes some people feel insulted.
If I'm not mistaken BattleFoam was told there'd be about 600+ people at NOVA but only 200 showed up, the T-Shirt thing was that they were meant to be given away in the swag back but the NOVA people decided to sell them to cover expenses for a hurricane and to save face.

They read some emails where the woman Romeo allegedly grabbed says they refunded the people who paid for the T-shirts and then also in the same email says they didn't.

Have a listen, decide for yourselves.


08/06/2013 Update

Network News: Battlefoam vs Blood of Kittens Update

At first I thought this whole thing a bit silly, I've met Romeo at Games Day UK and had somewhat contact with TastyTaste. I can't say my experience with either parties is positive but I've put all that behind me, let bygones be bygones etc.

I first thought TastyTaste was full of shit as that's what he does, he writes sensationalist articles to try and get as many views as he can on his blog for the add revenue and uses delay tactics to try and get you to come back for more (Like when he claims to have information but only puts out a little each day over a few days). Those page views = $$$

As I've now read all the declarations from the case it seems there might be allot of truth behind his posts regarding Romeo from Battlefoam, sure he writes it in a way to make it bigger than it really is but it seems it's all based on truth.

Anyway, some highlights from the declarations:
Jon Wolf, TO (Tournament Organiser) for War Games Con


> 4. For War Games Con IV, the 2012 event, we set the booth costs at $1,000 worth of
> merchandise or merchandise vouchers. Romeo Filip agreed to provide $1,000 worth of prize
> support for winner bags for 10 events. The expected value of each prize therefore was $100.
> 5. Leading up to the event, Filip refused to provide the agreed support. Instead Filip
> ...


Larry Vela, vendor organizer for War Games Con and owner of Bell of Lost Souls (BOLS)
Larry confirms the above and:


> 7. I have heard from other TOs that this bait and switch tactic involving large
> numbers of small-value vouchers was used at other events by Romeo Filip and Battle Foam.
> 8. Shortly after Nicholas Hayden (TastyTaste from BoK for those that dont know) published his article about Battle Foam's bait and
> switch tactic's, Mr. Filip telephoned me and complained about the article. He said he intended to
> ...


Chandler Lee, TO of Feats of Blades


> 5. In advance of the October 2012 Feast of Blades tournament, Romeo Filip
> approached me and requested to be a sponsor of the event. I sent a contract which set
> forth that the cost of the booth space would be $400 in cash or $800 worth of Battle Foam
> merchandise.
> ...


Michael Brandt, TO for NOVA Open


> 6. On the Saturday of the 2011 convention, someone came up to me and said that an angry
> Mr. Filip had my mother. Laurie Brandt, cornered in the 40k gaming hall, and was yelling
> at her. When I approached, I noticed there were a lot of people gathering around her. As I
> neared, I heard Mr. Filip's raised voice. When I arrived, the first thing I noticed was that
> ...


Nicholas Hayden, TastyTaste of Blood of Kittens.
16. In my March 7th article I wrote that Filip had threatened members on public forums.
I have attached hereto as Exhibit C three pages of screen captures for the somethingawful.com
forums. These screen captures depict a portion of a relevant conversation. It shows that Filip first
warns a member identified as killionair that he will identify who he is. Filip wrote, "oh, and I
have a few favors called in to find out who you are. In due time my friend in due time." Later
Filip continued to write, "hey clown, I'll tell you this one time and one time only, I will find out
who you are and we will handle this like men..... you have no fething clue who I am and what I am
capable of doing... when I find out who you are, and I will we will take care of this. I promise you
that. You habe pushed this to far and you are now my new hobby. Tick, tick, tick, your time
is coming." I interpret this, as I believe most people would, to be a threat of physical violence
against the individual.

Here is one of the pictures in question









To sum it all up? Romeo seems like he has some anger management problems, he's also a manipulative liar with a hint of self entitlement.
One of the podcasts I listen to said it best (long time ago, I has shit for memory but the voices in my head tells me this is close enough to what was said): "BattleFoam is a great product but Romeo is the worst thing that could happen to that company"

Romeo, I will be expecting that cut off horse head in my bed any day now...














Seems Romeo from Battlefoam wants to sue the Blood of Kittens news blog. BoK posted something that Romeo didn't like and he is now demanded that they prove what was posted in a court of law.

I have no idea what was posted about BF so if anyone can clue me in I'd be interested to know. Romeo is known for throwing around legal threats so it will be interesting to see where this goes.

My guess is that Romeo backs off because of the negative publicity this will cause. With GW trying to shut down sites left, right and center you DO NOT want to be associated with doing the same.

Full story here


> This is the official announcement by Blood of Kittens that Battlefoam LLC has taken legal action against this site over a post made in March.
> 
> Everything in that post I believe is true, gathered from sources and material available from the Internet, and since being threatened with legal action, I have done subsequent research and gotten sworn statements from witnesses that further prove its truth. For the time being, while certain aspects of the case are pending, the original post in question has been taken down.
> 
> However, it will be back up as soon as possible, and in no way should the fact that I took it down be viewed as an admission of any wrong doing. I took it down to try and facilitate a constructive dialogue with the party who made the legal threat, Romeo Filip of Battlefoam. It has not seemed to help, but I don’t want it to be said that I did not try everything in my power to maintain the high ground. Romeo and Battlefoam seem to insist upon forcing me to prove my statements were true, in a court of law. Once I do, not only will I put the article back up, but I will put the judgment there too, as the ultimate proof of the truth of my statements.



Here is a snippet from BF C&D letter:


> Your Defamatory Article is legally actionable. Because you published it on the Internet, the audience for your defamatory statements is immense. In the Defamatory Article, you falsely accuse Mr. Filip of the following:
> * physically and verbally threatening potential Battle Foam customers;
> * lying to current and potential Battle Foam customers and business partners;
> and,
> ...



Funny thing is, I would never have know about this if BF didn't sue BoK... I guess any publicity is good publicity...

After reading the BF C&D it seems they are trying to scare him into paying them $2.500 and never to post anything related to BF ever again. Kinda reminds me of another company that sell miniatures I buy...

As I've said, dont know the details but Romeo didn't like something posted on BoK in March so is now suing them.


BoKs response letter can be summed up as: So? What you gonna do about it? What was posted is true, substantially true or statements of opinions. As you filed a claim against me you will have to haul your ass from Arizona to California to settle this in court!


Seems the articles name was Meat for Meta: Bad Battlefoam Practices.

I have a feeling this court case is going to cost Romeo allot more than just ignoring it would have.


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## GrizBe (May 12, 2010)

I'd have ignored it... BoK are idiots who like to mouth off to try and get attention for themselves....

Which is probably why Battlefoams sueing him... BoK's a bad history of basically saying 'X company is crap, don't deal with them', which I think is what he's done here from what I can gather.

While it may be bad publicity for Battlefoam, its also the right thing to do. Hell... I'm pretty sure if anyone here started saying Bits is a con merchant who didn't supply the parts they orders or anything like that, we'd all be supporting Bits in kicking the guys ass for trying to ruin his good name.... And that's basically what BoK's done...


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## Jace of Ultramar (Aug 2, 2011)

Interesting. I'm curious to see how this turns out.


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## shaantitus (Aug 3, 2009)

I agree, Interesting. As i have nothing to do with either of them it doesn't effect me. What is everyone elses experience with them?


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## ntaw (Jul 20, 2012)

shaantitus said:


> What is everyone else's experience with them?


My buddy's got a sweet BF case for his IG army. Had nothing but good times ordering it, he strongly suggested I check it out as he was taken care of quite nicely. I've checked them out, even gone so far as to send in an e-mail about custom trays and was responded to in a professional manner. Friggin' awesome product, and decently priced considering the GW alternatives.


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## Angelofdeath690 (Sep 21, 2011)

Ive ordered from BF as well, had a bit of trouble with the custom creator tool for the foam as it didn't save the image and i had to cut/paste it from a screen shot to send it but once they got the image i got my stuff and my IG are happily sitting in it!


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## Battman (Nov 2, 2012)

Jace of Ultramar said:


> Interesting. I'm curious to see how this turns out.


Me too. Hmm one thought though where is the line between defimation and a bad review?


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## Magpie_Oz (Jan 16, 2012)

MadCowCrazy said:


> My guess is that Romeo backs off because of the negative publicity this will cause. With GW trying to shut down sites left, right and center you DO NOT want to be associated with doing the same.


Funny how a spat between two companies with no association with GW still ends up being pointed back at GW and that ONE blog disappearing for an as yet undetermined reason is somehow "sites left, right and centre".

Why not just report the news rather than trying to make it ?




Battman said:


> Me too. Hmm one thought though where is the line between defimation and a bad review?


A Bad review is "I don't like Battlefoam's customer service" or "I had a bad experience with Battlefoam" or "Battlefoam lied to me"

Defamation is "Battlefoam lie to their customers" when that is not true.


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## GrizBe (May 12, 2010)

shaantitus said:


> I agree, Interesting. As i have nothing to do with either of them it doesn't effect me. What is everyone elses experience with them?


Don't use them myself, but several people from my local store do. Nothing but praise from them for BattleFoam. 


As for BoK... he's a sensationalist moron who claims to have 'exclusive rumours', but all he's ever posted have been reworded reprints of rumours from known reliables. Plus.. he's a history of badmouthing companies just to cause a stir.





> A Bad review is "I don't like Battlefoam's customer service" or "I had a bad experience with Battlefoam" or "Battlefoam lied to me"
> 
> Defamation is "Battlefoam lie to their customers" when that is not true.



^This. BoK's saying that BattleFoam have been lying to customers and not filling orders etc. Which is flatly untrue.


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## Creon (Mar 5, 2009)

Yes, "Battlefoam lies to it's customers" is defamatory language. Unless you can produce one witness to testify they've been lied to. Then it's reporting. Defamation is hard to prove.


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## bitsandkits (Mar 18, 2008)

Creon said:


> Yes, "Battlefoam lies to it's customers" is defamatory language. Unless you can produce one witness to testify they've been lied to. Then it's reporting. Defamation is hard to prove.


You would first have to prove that they did indeed lie and then it would have to be multiple customers, but either way if you report it make sure it can stick or you might get theon grey joyed


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## Creon (Mar 5, 2009)

No, you just have to demonstrate someone told YOU Battlefoam lied to it's customers. Reporting inaccurate information provided by a witness is not defamation. It's only illegal if you had no basis for the reporting. A single testifying witness or example is enough to show a basis for the reportage.


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## MadCowCrazy (Mar 19, 2009)

Magpie_Oz said:


> Funny how a spat between two companies with no association with GW still ends up being pointed back at GW and that ONE blog disappearing for an as yet undetermined reason is somehow "sites left, right and centre".
> 
> Why not just report the news rather than trying to make it ?


You are right, I'm sorry. Natfka is the only site who have ever received a C&D letter from GW. No other website or forum has ever been threatened with legal action from GW forcing them to remove home made rules, fan creations that updates specialist games GW haven't bothered with for many years or posting rumour and pictures...


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## GrizBe (May 12, 2010)

A single person isn't a case though unless they've solid proof. Lying could be 'they said it'd be here on the 5th... it didn't come until the 6th!' for all we know. That's the delivery company, not Battlefoam.

If it was more 'we'll provide x cases, with x trays for x price' and they delivered less for more money then quoted... That's lying. But I've yet to see a single report anywhere of a case like that.

What BoK has done is pretty much said 'Don't use battle foam, they suck and you won't get your stuff' In a large public forum that reaches a big portion of BattleFoams target market.... BoK have shown no solid evidence of this other then heresay from some anymous faces who could just be internet trolls.

That's Defamation and BattleFoam has a perfectly good case for sueing them.





> You are right, I'm sorry. Natfka is the only site who have ever received a C&D letter from GW. No other website or forum has ever been threatened with legal action from GW forcing them to remove home made rules, fan creations that updates specialist games GW haven't bothered with for many years or posting rumour and pictures...


As said... BoK's got a bad history of sensationalist nonsense like this... Its why here he's got very poor reputation.


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## Jezlad (Oct 14, 2006)

BoK seem like a bunch of retarded pricks to me.

A blog that reports on toy soldiers getting taken to court over a comment about a company that makes foam for toy soldiers.

Its hilarious.


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## humakt (Jan 2, 2008)

Jezlad said:


> BoK seem like a bunch of retarded pricks to me.
> 
> A blog that reports on toy soldiers getting taken to court over a comment about a company that makes foam for toy soldiers.
> 
> Its hilarious.


I agreed. I could not give a monkeys who wins this one.


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## ChaosRedCorsairLord (Apr 17, 2009)

Jezlad said:


> BoK seem like a bunch of retarded pricks to me.
> 
> A blog that reports on toy soldiers getting taken to court over a comment about a company that makes foam for toy soldiers.
> 
> Its hilarious.


I'm just imagining the judge sitting there listening to both sides outlining there case thinking to him/herself "fucking nerds, why did I get out of bed this morning?" It's an amusing mental image.



bitsandkits said:


> you might get theon grey joyed


Probably the funniest part of season 3, I'm surprised it hasn't made it to meme form yet.


I didn't even think people still read BoK.


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## slaaneshy (Feb 20, 2008)

ChaosRedCorsairLord said:


> I didn't even think people still read BoK.


Apparently Battlefront dude does, but he is the only one!


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## darkreever (Apr 3, 2008)

ChaosRedCorsairLord said:


> I didn't even think people still read BoK.


Personally, until this thread actually explained what the abbreviation BoK stood for I thought people were just spelling Boc's name wrong.

Know what it stands for though, I have to ask: how? How could you possibly think a name like that might draw in a decent amount of interest?


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## GrizBe (May 12, 2010)

darkreever said:


> Know what it stands for though, I have to ask: how? How could you possibly think a name like that might draw in a decent amount of interest?


As said.. the guy who runs it is an idiot. And that's me being extremely polite about what I think of him.


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## Bindi Baji (Apr 23, 2009)

ChaosRedCorsairLord said:


> I'm just imagining the judge sitting there listening to both sides outlining there case thinking to him/herself "fucking nerds, why did I get out of bed this morning?" It's an amusing mental image.


the judgement of this court is that you need to get a f*ck*ng girlfriend :mrgreen:


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## ChaosRedCorsairLord (Apr 17, 2009)

Bindi Baji said:


> the judgement of this court is that you need to get a f*ck*ng girlfriend :mrgreen:


I usually don't belittle myself to answering negative comments from haters - but just this once I'll make an exception! 

I don't have a girlfriend you say? How about you ask my VICTORIA SECRETS MODEL GIRLFRIEND!!! 











SEE! SHE'S REAL! AND SHE'S WAY HOTTER THAN ALL YOUR GIRLFRIENDS COMBINED!!! 

I'm pretty disappointed in the level of maturity expressed on this site.


ps: I couldn't resist.


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## DeathKlokk (Jun 9, 2008)

RedCorsairLord, you're such a virgin. lol

I have never gone to BoK personally but I was surprised by how much of a jerk Romeo was when discussing BF products on-line.


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## MadCowCrazy (Mar 19, 2009)

Romeo talks about the case in the latest 40K Radio podcast. If what he says is true then Tastytaste is nothing more than a sensationalist asshole. Talking shit about people only to get viewers on his site for add revenue.

He does have a shitty reputation when it comes to rumours, trying to make it look like he knows more than he actually does and when he does post the rumours it's a mish mash of random phrases that can be interpreted in allot of different ways. As I search the web daily for rumours I ended up on his site a few times but dont bother anymore as any rumours from there have already been posted elsewhere.

I'm sure we can all say Natfka is the only place you need to go if you want rumours as he collects and compiles them allot better than anyone else on the net.

You can listen to the latest podcast over at: 40K Radio


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## ChaosRedCorsairLord (Apr 17, 2009)

DeathKlokk said:


> RedCorsairLord, you're such a virgin. lol


How dare you make a joke! On the internet of all places. Have you no shame?


To me, this defamation nonsense just seems like a big waste of time and money, the end result will be both parties look like arse-hats.


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## OIIIIIIO (Dec 16, 2009)

Do you even have a Power Armour suit Chaos? We all know the Termie suit will give you a 2+ Invuln for your virginity. But what would a Power Armour suit do for ya?

Heard of BoK but by name alone ... I would never visit the site.


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## darkreever (Apr 3, 2008)

OIIIIIIO said:


> Do you even have a Power Armour suit Chaos? We all know the Termie suit will give you a 2+ Invuln for your virginity. But what would a Power Armour suit do for ya?


Well it largely depends on which god he is aligned to:

Tzeentch = might as well be terminator armour
Nurgle = no need to bother rolling
Slaanesh = +5, with a follow-up +3 for things to get rather weird
Khorne = +4


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## Bindi Baji (Apr 23, 2009)

ChaosRedCorsairLord said:


> the end result will be both parties look like arse-hats.


what's wrong with arse hats?, I find them quite fetching


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## MadCowCrazy (Mar 19, 2009)

Bindi Baji said:


> what's wrong with arse hats?, I find them quite fetching


There's such a thing as an arse hat? Pic plz :crazy:


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## Oz Tra Ya (Nov 8, 2010)

MadCowCrazy said:


> There's such a thing as an arse hat? Pic plz :crazy:



Here you go...

http://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/2289883187/


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## Battman (Nov 2, 2012)

If anyone is interested the new 11th company episode #161 it has an interview with romeo of battlefoam. Shows his perpective on the matter, and explains a bit what happened if it is correct is another thing but isnt that the way with all this legal stuff.


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## MadCowCrazy (Mar 19, 2009)

08/06/2013 Update

Network News: Battlefoam vs Blood of Kittens Update

At first I thought this whole thing a bit silly, I've met Romeo at Games Day UK and had somewhat contact with TastyTaste. I can't say my experience with either parties is positive but I've put all that behind me, let bygones be bygones etc.

I first thought TastyTaste was full of shit as that's what he does, he writes sensationalist articles to try and get as many views as he can on his blog for the add revenue and uses delay tactics to try and get you to come back for more (Like when he claims to have information but only puts out a little each day over a few days). Those page views = $$$

As I've now read all the declarations from the case it seems there might be allot of truth behind his posts regarding Romeo from Battlefoam, sure he writes it in a way to make it bigger than it really is but it seems it's all based on truth.

Anyway, some highlights from the declarations:
Jon Wolf, TO (Tournament Organiser) for War Games Con


> 4. For War Games Con IV, the 2012 event, we set the booth costs at $1,000 worth of
> merchandise or merchandise vouchers. Romeo Filip agreed to provide $1,000 worth of prize
> support for winner bags for 10 events. The expected value of each prize therefore was $100.
> 5. Leading up to the event, Filip refused to provide the agreed support. Instead Filip
> ...


Larry Vela, vendor organizer for War Games Con and owner of Bell of Lost Souls (BOLS)
Larry confirms the above and:


> 7. I have heard from other TOs that this bait and switch tactic involving large
> numbers of small-value vouchers was used at other events by Romeo Filip and Battle Foam.
> 8. Shortly after Nicholas Hayden (TastyTaste from BoK for those that dont know) published his article about Battle Foam's bait and
> switch tactic's, Mr. Filip telephoned me and complained about the article. He said he intended to
> ...


Chandler Lee, TO of Feats of Blades


> 5. In advance of the October 2012 Feast of Blades tournament, Romeo Filip
> approached me and requested to be a sponsor of the event. I sent a contract which set
> forth that the cost of the booth space would be $400 in cash or $800 worth of Battle Foam
> merchandise.
> ...


Michael Brandt, TO for NOVA Open


> 6. On the Saturday of the 2011 convention, someone came up to me and said that an angry
> Mr. Filip had my mother. Laurie Brandt, cornered in the 40k gaming hall, and was yelling
> at her. When I approached, I noticed there were a lot of people gathering around her. As I
> neared, I heard Mr. Filip's raised voice. When I arrived, the first thing I noticed was that
> ...


Nicholas Hayden, TastyTaste of Blood of Kittens.
16. In my March 7th article I wrote that Filip had threatened members on public forums.
I have attached hereto as Exhibit C three pages of screen captures for the somethingawful.com
forums. These screen captures depict a portion of a relevant conversation. It shows that Filip first
warns a member identified as killionair that he will identify who he is. Filip wrote, "oh, and I
have a few favors called in to find out who you are. In due time my friend in due time." Later
Filip continued to write, "hey clown, I'll tell you this one time and one time only, I will find out
who you are and we will handle this like men..... you have no fething clue who I am and what I am
capable of doing... when I find out who you are, and I will we will take care of this. I promise you
that. You habe pushed this to far and you are now my new hobby. Tick, tick, tick, your time
is coming." I interpret this, as I believe most people would, to be a threat of physical violence
against the individual.

Here is one of the pictures in question









To sum it all up? Romeo seems like he has some anger management problems, he's also a manipulative liar with a hint of self entitlement.
One of the podcasts I listen to said it best (long time ago, I has shit for memory but the voices in my head tells me this is close enough to what was said): "BattleFoam is a great product but Romeo is the worst thing that could happen to that company"

Romeo, I will be expecting that cut off horse head in my bed any day now...


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## Djinn24 (Jan 12, 2008)

I listen to 40k radio and have almost stopped on several occasions due to Romeo's dickish behavior. Sounds like BoK is going to win this one.


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## Zion (May 31, 2011)

Wow. I knew that the case was going on, but I didn't know the details. I'm surprised to say that I'm 100% on BoK's side. They're tossers some of the time, but they're definitely right about this.


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## seermaster (Feb 22, 2012)

:goodpost:


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## Jezlad (Oct 14, 2006)

I like Romeo.

Met him several times, maybe 5? Had dinner with him IIRC (the who's who of people in the wargaming world were there... Alessio, Warren, Rich, Romeo and the BoW guy that doesn't speak. I say meet up, throw down the gauntlet and DUEL! 

If you want to name a champion Romeo - I'm available for an Eldar Tray and a Handjob.


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## Boc (Mar 19, 2010)

Eh kind of sounds like a twat to me, so I'll wait until this thing is concluded before buying the battlefoam that I REALLY want.


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## Septok (Jan 21, 2012)

Wow, what a twat. He really needs some kind of management classes, maybe even several. Not buying any Battlefoam until he's gone, that's for damn sure as mustard.


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## GrizBe (May 12, 2010)

Personally I think they're as bad as each other.... BoK stirring things and posting all the smack talk in public.... Romeo, if he has done these things probably deserves it. But as theres zero proof of this apart from here'say we've gotten through guess where... BoK's website.. I dunno if its true or not, especially given the only credible and known source mentioned... BoLS, has zero mention of anything to do with this anywhere on their website


BoK's a known trouble causer... till we get some official court stuff, I'm not supporting eithr.. but BoK's still the bigger idiot imo.


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## Codex Todd (Mar 22, 2009)

MadCowCrazy said:


> 08/06/2013 Update
> 
> After reading the BF C&D it seems they are trying to scare him into paying them $2.500 and never to post anything related to BF ever again.



Wouldn't the court cost alone be more than this? (I have no clue or would ever claim to have a clue) and surely not being able to post about BF would eventually affect business? 

(simple soul asking a genuine question?!?!)


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## GrimzagGorwazza (Aug 5, 2010)

Codex Todd said:


> Wouldn't the court cost alone be more than this? (I have no clue or would ever claim to have a clue) and surely not being able to post about BF would eventually affect business?
> 
> (simple soul asking a genuine question?!?!)


I think BF are of the oppinion that they are too big for a few non reviews, especially those that paint them in less than favourable light, to have a huge impact. Also it's my understanding that a lot of court cases nowadays tend to end up with the losing side picking up the bill. I know that a couple of times when one of my friends ended up in small claims court, the fees were collected from the other side.


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## Zion (May 31, 2011)

GrizBe said:


> Personally I think they're as bad as each other.... BoK stirring things and posting all the smack talk in public.... Romeo, if he has done these things probably deserves it. But as theres zero proof of this apart from here'say we've gotten through guess where... BoK's website.. I dunno if its true or not, especially given the only credible and known source mentioned... BoLS, has zero mention of anything to do with this anywhere on their website
> 
> 
> BoK's a known trouble causer... till we get some official court stuff, I'm not supporting eithr.. but BoK's still the bigger idiot imo.


While I'm usually right up there with the rest when it comes to BoK and the crap they pull sometimes (like the "rumours matrix" nonsense that made no sense a couple years ago) I think they look to be in the right this time. In this case BoK reported the facts and presented them straight up, and Battlefoam flipped shit on them.

I'm not saying I suddenly support everything BoK does, but I think that in this case, with them presenting things as they had them and reporting them straight out as fact they were right.


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## Djinn24 (Jan 12, 2008)

I am more interested in how this turns out then the GW vs CHS. Not sure why but if half that is true Battlefoam may end up suffering. And Romeo can only blame him self most people wouldn't have even heard about this if it wasn't for the lawsuit. Lawsuit just takes it to a new level.


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## H0RRIDF0RM (Mar 6, 2008)

MadCowCrazy said:


> 08/06/2013 Update
> 
> Network News: Battlefoam vs Blood of Kittens Update
> 
> ...


If I attended a gaming event with family and someone at the venue put their hands on my wife, parents, or siblings I would've broke their jaw.


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## GrizBe (May 12, 2010)

H0RRIDF0RM said:


> If I attended a gaming event with family and someone at the venue put their hands on my wife, parents, or siblings I would've broke their jaw.


That's kinda my point why I don't believe this.... IF it happened, It's classed as assault and Romeo would have gotten arrested for it, which clearly isn't the case. 

Then you've also got the flipside on it, your at a game tournament surrounded by people and see a guy attacking a woman, and no-one steps in to help her? Yeah right... 

The only evidence for any of the trouble Romeo has supposedly caused has come only from the BoK website. No other website/forum/ tournament that's mentioned has any mentioned of any of this posted anywhere.... Hence why it sounds a lot of BoK trying to stir up shit to me.

As said, BoK's a known trouble causer... it wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if all this is made up... Until Larry of BoLs post publically himself that he's seen Romeo pull that stuff, i'm not beliving it for a second.


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## Djinn24 (Jan 12, 2008)

He would have only been arrested if the authorities hadbeen called and people going into spectator mode would not shock me. I say let this play out in court, since BoK would have to supply witnesses to back up his claims.


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## Zion (May 31, 2011)

GrizBe said:


> That's kinda my point why I don't believe this.... IF it happened, It's classed as assault and Romeo would have gotten arrested for it, which clearly isn't the case.
> 
> Then you've also got the flipside on it, your at a game tournament surrounded by people and see a guy attacking a woman, and no-one steps in to help her? Yeah right...
> 
> ...


Actually it's not a new thing for people to ignore a problem or not help when something like that happens. It's why women are recommended to yell "Fire" when someone is trying to rape them, because that's more likely to elicit and actual reaction out of people.

As for assault charges, that requires calling the police, pressing charges and so on. A lot of times people don't do that just because it's too much of a hassle for something they just want to be over with right away.

Joys of human psychology right there.

Anyways, possibly those quotes are legitimate and are being used as evidence in court. Which means those people will either be depositioned and possibly brought in to testify if it goes to court, so if BoK is making it up he'd be a whole lot more legal trouble than he is facing now with just Battlefoam.


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## GrizBe (May 12, 2010)

Zion said:


> Anyways, possibly those quotes are legitimate and are being used as evidence in court. Which means those people will either be depositioned and possibly brought in to testify if it goes to court, so if BoK is making it up he'd be a whole lot more legal trouble than he is facing now with just Battlefoam.


Hence why I think they're made up... as if they were being used as evidence in court, they're now completely inadmissible due to being publically displayed in such a fashion to try and discredit battlefoam before a hearing. 

If BoK had any sense, he'd not have posted them. BoK's shown themselves to have no sense though, and to have made up stuff in the past.


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## MadCowCrazy (Mar 19, 2009)

GrizBe said:


> Hence why I think they're made up... as if they were being used as evidence in court, they're now completely inadmissible due to being publically displayed in such a fashion to try and discredit battlefoam before a hearing.
> 
> If BoK had any sense, he'd not have posted them. BoK's shown themselves to have no sense though, and to have made up stuff in the past.


So you mean all those people who submitted written testimony of what they had seen, heard or experienced are all out to get battlefoam?
I guess someone created the Romeo account over at somethingawful, claimed to be Romeo and then threatened to kill (that's how I read it) some dude there who said something negative about BattleFoam.

I guess all those tournament organisers have a secret deal with KR or some other foam producer to discredit BF.

I guess BoK wrote all those testimonies himself and added them to the legal papers to look good, hoping none of the people he wrote down as having written them would notice. After all this he put up access to all the docs on his website for all to see as well thinking; -Nah, they will never read the documents I wrote in their names.

Yupp, sounds plausible to me... :crazy:


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## Zion (May 31, 2011)

GrizBe said:


> Hence why I think they're made up... as if they were being used as evidence in court, they're now completely inadmissible due to being publically displayed in such a fashion to try and discredit battlefoam before a hearing.
> 
> If BoK had any sense, he'd not have posted them. BoK's shown themselves to have no sense though, and to have made up stuff in the past.


He claims to have a lawyer, so I'd imagine he ran this by his lawyer first before posting it.

That or his lawyer is throttling him right about now.

I'm not trying to defend BoK, but I'm not going to side with Battlefoam on this issue just because I like their products either. Honestly I want to see it play out more before I truly sway one way or the next. From what we have though, it doesn't look good for Battlefoam _if this is true_.


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## GrizBe (May 12, 2010)

@MadCow: All that 'evidence' has only appeared on the BoK network. No-one mentioned within it has any mention of anything to do with it anywhere on their websites.... The so called 'public record' documents are all linked directly to BoK's website... all slightly suspicious.

As said, we know he's made up crap before so i'd not put it past him again.


Also... I'll point out I've never used Battlefoam and have no interest in using their product either. I'm just stating things as I see them that the only evidence made publically available about any of this has come through BoK... a network which we all know is desperate for attention and pretty much thrives on stirring up trouble and being controversial.

From how I read the statements... Romeo has provided the value of the prizes he agreed to give... no-where does it state he 100% said it would be X item. Just 'prizes to the value of'. If you say you'll give someone $1000 worth of merchandise, then give them $1000 worth of vouchers, fair enough you'd be pissed... but at no time has anyone said they specified that Romeo would give a specific item, and all said he's provided vouchers to the value of what he promised...

I've never met the guy so I can't judge him, but the only people I've ever seen badmouth him online are those related to BoK.... He may not be perfect, but I certainly don't think he's as bad as BoK is trying to paint him.


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## Djinn24 (Jan 12, 2008)

GrizBe said:


> Hence why I think they're made up... as if they were being used as evidence in court, they're now completely inadmissible due to being publically displayed in such a fashion to try and discredit battlefoam before a hearing.
> 
> If BoK had any sense, he'd not have posted them. BoK's shown themselves to have no sense though, and to have made up stuff in the past.


You do realize that its battlefoam suing BoK on a news article written about Romeo so those items would still be allowed in as proof that his article was factual. Unless there is a gag order on the prosecution or defense items like that can be given to the public with no harm being done to the case. And if he made those up and is trying to pass them off in court he is beyond stupid.

Difference between making up items in a news article and items going to be used in court. One will piss off viewers, the other will get you put in prison. If those statements are in fact true, which I happen to believe that they are, it was actually smart of him to publish them, for reasons like this, the court of public relations. Shows him as a more credible source, backs up his news story, and paints Romeo as a complete asshole.


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## MadCowCrazy (Mar 19, 2009)

GrizBe said:


> From how I read the statements... Romeo has provided the value of the prizes he agreed to give... no-where does it state he 100% said it would be X item. Just 'prizes to the value of'. If you say you'll give someone $1000 worth of merchandise, then give them $1000 worth of vouchers, fair enough you'd be pissed... but at no time has anyone said they specified that Romeo would give a specific item, and all said he's provided vouchers to the value of what he promised...


The problem is that we dont have the whole conversation. For what we do have it's obvious the TO's expected to get BattleFoam merchandise but were instead offered 50x $20 off shipping (which is not merchandise and a pretty shitty price as the merchandise was planned as price support.) or membership vouchers to the freeboota forums (which is not merchandise and a very shitty and useless price).

If you were contacted by Games Workshop and they said they wanted to sponsor your event and you agreed on $1000 worth of product. They show up and give $1000 worth of that months White Dwarfs, wouldn't you feel kinda cheated?

What Romeo offered was either free to him (shitty forum memberships) or requires you to buy products from him. It was of little to no use as price support to the winners of the competitions going on.

Congratulations, you are the 1st place winner of the NOVA open, we have had the fortune to be sponsored by BattleFoam, a company that makes bags and foam for you miniature needs! Here is your $20 off shipping cost the next time you buy from them...


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## MadCowCrazy (Mar 19, 2009)

10/06/2013 Update
Eldar is Here. Get Some! June 1st (Show 62)
40K Radio has their latest podcast out, they go over the documents BoK has laid forth and say they are all pretty much blatant lies.

I have a feeling this isn't really going to go anywhere, it's turning out to be a word against word type of situation. Seems allot of shady things are going on in the background with NOVA, BOLS etc
Seems they all have an agenda vs BattleFoam. It also seems TO's aren't deciding to deal with BattleFoam, it's BattleFoam who are deciding not to sponsor shitty events and this makes some people feel insulted.
If I'm not mistaken BattleFoam was told there'd be about 600+ people at NOVA but only 200 showed up, the T-Shirt thing was that they were meant to be given away in the swag back but the NOVA people decided to sell them to cover expenses for a hurricane and to save face.

They read some emails where the woman Romeo allegedly grabbed says they refunded the people who paid for the T-shirts and then also in the same email says they didn't.

Have a listen, decide for yourselves.


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## GrizBe (May 12, 2010)

I'd be inclined to believe this more then the stuff on BoK.

Looking into Nova, they do seem to be a smallfry tourament organiser, who happens to charge $45 for an entry fee.. Given their highest event sponsor was Coolornotmini... not exactly a glowing endorsement. As for the t-shirt stuff, even the documents on BoK said the t-shirts were meant to be a give-away item, but were then being sold... 

As said, defiantely seems to be something dodgey about the entire affair, and as said, BoK's been known to make stuff up before.


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## maddermax (May 12, 2008)

40k Radio is owned by Romero isn't it? So I'm not sure I'd take them at their word either.

However, the people who supplied the statements to BoK are real people, and are reasonably well known in the tournament scene apparently. The guy (a known event organizer) who had his mother assaulted and belittled by Romero confirmed his statement on Dakka as well, and the others I'm sure would have spoken up if BoK had made up the statements. What you have then is a bunch of unrelated people, unaffiliated with BoK, backing up their story, and on the other side you have Romero.

So it's more of a "He said/everyone else said" sort of situation. Assuming there's no great conspiracy to paint Romero as an asshole, I think I'll go with "Everyone Else". BoK, from what everyone says (and I've never read them) is dodgy at times, but this time everything seems to line up for them. I think Romero/Battle Foam will really regret bringing this case up, as otherwise very few people would have read the article or heard the claims made in it. I think that's known as the "Streisand Effect".

Edit: Statement made by MVBrant (Nova Organizer) on Dakka (http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/330/526744.page):



Long story; not really one to air old dirty laundry. Suffice to say, the January e-mail about prize support was later revised to a much smaller level; the t-shirts were supposed to match a certain criteria ... and did not ... at all; the sale of a few of them was done erroneously by NOVA staff and attempts were made to correct / reimburse / etc. - the affidavit confirms that error on our part. Kyle came and got the T-Shirts instead of Romeo b/c of the altercation that occurred b/tween him and my mother. It was already agreed upon w/ Romeo, which is why no one in a crowded registration staffed area minded a guy walking up and taking a bunch of things from behind the reg desk. The switching of them to the BF booth for hand-out was agreed upon b/tween us after that altercation. *shrug* It's not material to the BOK stuff - not only is he not reading from the final sponsor agreements/e-mails, the case has nothing to do with miscommunication and errors regarding T-Shirt sales / giveaways. Yes, they were sold and should not have been. Yes, that was corrected. The only thing at issue in the affidavit relative to the case was the verbal/physical interaction between Roman F. and one of our staff members, a woman.

The lower attendance due to hurricane was NOT the direct issue - we had over 400 people show up regardless, including 210 for just the 40k GT, and that was within the range we in writing let Romeo and all other sponsors know we intended to have (of over 33 sponsors, all but one left happy and returned the next year ...)

The only real thing that is at issue from the BOK case is that Romeo directly confronted my mother, per the affidavit's remainder regarding physical contact, yelling, belittling, etc., with dozens of witnesses, b/c it was done in the main gaming hall right near the Invitational tables. Hence why people gathered around / came to intercede while others went to get me.

These things were discussed b/tween BF and NOVA in e-mail following the 2011 con, and we agreed mutually to part ways. We never brought it up since. The story got out because other people unaffiliated who witnessed it started spreading it around. Exactly per Kyle's 40k Radio question about why it wasn't spread around. Well, it was, that's how BOK heard about it yada yada. We certainly wouldn't contact them - BOK has thrown NOVA under the bus plenty historically. When we were contacted for an affidavit, our attorney advised we do so regarding only the facts in question, and so we did. *shrug*


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## Djinn24 (Jan 12, 2008)

From what I can gather it's this:

BoK posts article saying BF/Romeo is screwing over TOs

Romeo sues for slander aka BoK is lying 

BoK backs up his statements with TOs who dealt and we're screwed by Romeo. Doesn't matter if it was 3000 people at the event or 20

Sounds like BF is going to lose this. Romeo doesn't pass go and collect his $2500.


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## Vaz (Mar 19, 2008)

Fuck me. What a load of handbags at dawn.

Anyone bored of this shit and want to play spacemen and aliens?


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## Grokfog (May 4, 2009)

Vaz said:


> Fuck me. What a load of handbags at dawn.
> 
> Anyone bored of this shit and want to play spacemen and aliens?


Definitely. Personally I think all altercations should be settled with an Apocalypse battle. Both parties have fun, a clearly defined winner is decided, and it'd probably be cheaper than a full on court case.


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## slaaneshy (Feb 20, 2008)

I reckon they should all get their mummies to fight it out in a pit of candy floss and chocolate spread....
Winner gets a used tea bag to the value of 50 pence.
Or a voucher for 50 pence. Whatever is easier.


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## Djinn24 (Jan 12, 2008)

Listening to the newest 40k Radio and Kyle is a hypocrite. He keeps saying they are a business but complain about how BOLS does their business. In a nut shell he s pissed because they wouldn't pull BoK article because it pulls in traffic, which for a site is how they make money. 

KR is going to be getting my business I believe.


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## maddermax (May 12, 2008)

Case has now been settled.

From Czakk on Dakka Dakka:



czakk 526744 5792618 null said:


> http://bloodofkittens.com/blog/2013/06/28/network-news-blood-kittens-v-battleform-settled/
> 
> 
> 
> ...


So, it's settled, and a Joint donation to the group that gave legal support to Blood of Kittens. I wonder if Romero had to be beaten round the head with how stupid it was to pursue a libel case in this situation.


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## GrizBe (May 12, 2010)

Actually, that read more like both sides knew they would have gotten screwed over to me.... Only reason to settle out of court is if one side would loose out majorly, and IF BoK could have won, they'd have been unlikely to accept this.... Afterall, a donation to a legal company pretty much means both sides would have gotten screwed. So BoK certainly isn't blaimless here as they're trying to make out.


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## maddermax (May 12, 2008)

GrizBe said:


> Actually, that read more like both sides knew they would have gotten screwed over to me.... Only reason to settle out of court is if one side would loose out majorly, and IF BoK could have won, they'd have been unlikely to accept this.... Afterall, a donation to a legal company pretty much means both sides would have gotten screwed. So BoK certainly isn't blaimless here as they're trying to make out.


Actually, even if BoK was likely to win, this would have been the best outcome for them anyway, so they probably just decided to call it instead of dragging out a suit that would have been stressful and disruptive (required traveling and going to court), his Pro Bono lawyer probably would have preferred an early settlement and finally Battlefoam was suing both him AND his wife for anything they could get - however right you may be, you don't want that crap hanging over you. 

And for all that, in the end they would have won... the right to keep the article up, and maybe some money for their Pro Bono lawyer. As it is, they gained the right to keep the article up, and some money for their legal defense group. Boom, done, no reason to continue except for the satisfaction of saying you won, and that's just not worth it in the real world.


Also...


GrizBe said:


> loose out majorly


Majorly loosing out might look like:


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