# Tau Pulse Rifle or Pulse Carbine: which is better?



## beamspam

Basically, as the title says I was wondering what people thought of the various strenghs and weaknesses of the two basic weapons avalible to fire warriors. Which is better? thoughts? comments?


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## Midge913

For Firewarriors it is my opinion that your best bet is to stick with the Pulse Rifles over the carbines. Yes the carbines are pinning and that is an attractive option, but the fact that they only have an 18" range limits their tactical effectiveness with any army that wants to stay the hell away from an opponent. I would almost always recommend the pulse rifle to take advantage of its long range and rapid fire option.


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## Stella Cadente

one has a range of 30" with str5 rapid firing goodness which fits the role of long range attack or short range bombardment perfectly.

the other has only got 18" of 1 shot failure, sure it makes you take pinning checks....bit failing a pinning check is as rare as michael bay making a good movie, it never happens.

pretty obvious, depsite me prefering the concept and look of the carbine and wishing it was better, if it was assault 2 even without pinning I'd love it.


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## dspadres

In an army that favors staying away from everything you don't want to get yourself into a position that forces you to get close. The problem with carbines is they are only assault 1; 2 and they would be sick.

What you could try doing is putting a squad of them in a devilfish and have it run around providing close range fire support for squads of rifle equipped warriors but that may be tricky to pull off.


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## ChugginDatHaterade

I would recommend using the pulse rifles for the reason stated above. But you only want to use 1 squad of 6 fire warriors, and fill the rest of your army up with kroot.


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## JAMOB

For FW its a waste to give them carbines in most cases because they cant always reach and only ever get 1 shot, but they can be useful. Im Blood Angels and was playing my little brother who has tau, and i used scouts to come in from the side via outflank. He managed to run away and keep out of range while still firing for a while and had other FW to back them up.

Either can be useful: mostly rifles with a squad of carbines on the side (depending on your opponent of course) is probably what i would do. Alternatively you could place gun drones on the sides.


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## Stella Cadente

ChugginDatHaterade said:


> and fill the rest of your army up with kroot.


your opponent would agree, add more no-save piss poor CC units please


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## MetalHandkerchief

Leave the carbines to drones. Putting carbines on FW's is a waste of points for a weapon that should be cheaper than the Rifle. Even with a rifle, Fire Warriors are currently overpriced in 5th edition.



dspadres said:


> In an army that favors staying away from everything


Is this another "Tau is a shooty gun line army" fallacy, because if it is, stop giving advice. Tau are mobile first and foremost, then shooty second. Playing Tau right means lots of jet packs and precise movement to just barely deny enemy assaults - and using vehicles to their full extent.

Static Tau will always lose against mobile Tau.


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## Midge913

MetalHandkerchief said:


> Leave the carbines to drones. Putting carbines on FW's is a waste of points for a weapon that should be cheaper than the Rifle. Even with a rifle, Fire Warriors are currently overpriced in 5th edition.
> 
> 
> 
> Is this another "Tau is a shooty gun line army" fallacy, because if it is, stop giving advice. Tau are mobile first and foremost, then shooty second. Playing Tau right means lots of jet packs and precise movement to just barely deny enemy assaults - and using vehicles to their full extent.
> 
> Static Tau will always lose against mobile Tau.


I know that you quoted dspadres, but I said something similar. I meant it solely as staying out of assault not necessarily meaning a static gun line, because that is suicide for Tau. I solely meant to take advantage of their mobility to remain firing as much as possible for as many turns as possible, not to promote the "Tau are a shooty gun line army" fallacy.


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## Stephen_Newman

Rifles any day of the week. The army relies on keeping the other guy away as far as possible by shooting over long distances. So lets give your troops weapons that relies on them being close to the enemy when a lot of units have the capability of 18 inch assaults. Not thanks.

Oh filling the army with kroot is the best thing for most opponenets. Kroot are laughable and scare nobody and can be kept off with a few boltgun rounds.


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## beamspam

Agreed. I got some kroot with the Tau battleforce, and Iswear that they are the worst units that the Tau have.


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## Stella Cadente

Stephen_Newman said:


> Oh filling the army with kroot is the best thing for most opponenets. Kroot are laughable and scare nobody and can be kept off with a few boltgun rounds.


why are you wasting boltgun rounds on them?, just blow in the general direction and kroot quickly die, or let them get in close combat and laugh as they do nothing (especially with there extra close combat weapon, but no close combat weapon to be extra to), hell I'd be more more terrified of 10 grots, or even 10 fire warriors in close combat.


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## Midge913

Stella Cadente said:


> why are you wasting boltgun rounds on them?, just blow in the general direction and kroot quickly die, hell I'd be more more terrified of 10 grots.


I have found that a mere 10 Devilgants will deal with Kroot quite effectively.


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## darkreever

MetalHandkerchief said:


> Is this another "Tau is a shooty gun line army" fallacy, because if it is, stop giving advice.


I thought you ragequit Heresy last week? Was that only temporary so you could get over yourself or something?

Tau really can't be just a static shooting army, not when our battlesuits and vehicles are moving every turn. (And since you must take at least one battlesuit, can't say you won't be moving since you likely will to be getting weapons in range or denying return fire.)


Between the two guns, the pulse rifle has always had the spot for me and for the reasons Stella gave before. Longer range lets me shoot at my enemy sooner, and if they get in close enough then I get double those higher strength shots. Sure I don't get pinning, but then when you have it you still need to hit, to wound, for a save to be failed, and for the leadership test to be failed. The odds may not make it impossible but its still not terribly likely all the time.

And kroot can be good, I once saw them get charged by a great unclean one once. Sure it killed them, but the guy wasted a turn moving in their general direction and the kroot put a wound on it with their guns, I think.


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## Forty Three

Kroot are actually essential for a Tau army that doesn't just fall apart.

This Article explains why Kroot are better than Fire warriors better than I could, so I'll just leave it here


43


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## Stella Cadente

Forty Three said:


> This Article explains why Kroot are better than Fire warriors better than I could, so I'll just leave it here


oh dear, a 3++ explanation, the people who label everything as fail, thats not biased at all.


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## Zjoekov

Stella Cadente said:


> oh dear, a 3++ explanation, the people who label everything as fail, thats not biased at all.


Rather biased and right than ignorant and wrong.


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## beamspam

Stella Cadente said:


> oh dear, a 3++ explanation, the people who label everything as fail, thats not biased at all.


What's so bad about 3++?


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## Tanis.16

rifles but if you want to test carbines get some pathfinders


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## Stella Cadente

beamspam said:


> What's so bad about 3++?


they all sing the same boring idiotic chorus
"unit ABCDEFGHIJKLMNOPQRSTUVWX and Y are all shit, unit Z is the only good unit, and your a prick for not using unit Z, oh and you all suck at this game, only we are the true players, we are better than all of you"
at least the the impression you get from those who are part of it who have posted here and from reading what they say

I spit upon 3++


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## Wolf_Lord_Skoll

Stella Cadente said:


> they all sing the same boring idiotic chorus
> "unit ABCDEFGHIJKLMNOPQRSTUVWX and Y are all shit, unit Z is the only good unit, and your a prick for not using unit Z, oh and you all suck at this game, only we are the true players, we are better than all of you"
> at least the the impression you get from those who are part of it who have posted here and from reading what they say
> 
> I spit upon 3++


What about the recent articles they put up about using Tyranid without Hive Guard? I wouldn't call that "All other units are crap" since Hive Guard are easily one of the top units in the Codex for their ability to open up transports so you can chew on the squishy bits inside.


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## Zjoekov

Dont believe Stella; she/he seems highly frustrated. Being biased about 3++ because it's biased is hypocrism at it's best.

Many people just misunderstand 3++. When Kirby or some other guy says that a certain unit sucks; you gotta look at it with the right perspective: When saying such things they hint at top competative play in 95% of the cases. And it's true: many codices have a very limited choice when making competative lists. And it's true: many people don't get this game.


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## ChugginDatHaterade

What zjoekov said. 3++ is fine. Stella is just an insufferable troll.


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## Forty Three

Stella Cadente said:


> they all sing the same boring idiotic chorus
> "unit ABCDEFGHIJKLMNOPQRSTUVWX and Y are all shit, unit Z is the only good unit, and your a prick for not using unit Z, oh and you all suck at this game, only we are the true players, we are better than all of you"
> at least the the impression you get from those who are part of it who have posted here and from reading what they say





Stella Cadente said:


> our opponent would agree, add more no-save piss poor CC units please





Stella Cadente said:


> The other has only got 18" of 1 shot failure, sure it makes you take pinning checks....bit failing a pinning check is as rare as michael bay making a good movie, it never happens.



Wait, so when other people argue that a certain unit is better than another they're being power gaming WAAC jerks that kill all the fun, but when you do it is good for the game? Didn't you just dismiss Kroot without a second thought? 




ChugginDatHaterade said:


> What zjoekov said. 3++ is fine. Stella is just an insufferable troll.


This, tbh.


43


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## dspadres

MetalHandkerchief said:


> Is this another "Tau is a shooty gun line army" fallacy, because if it is, stop giving advice. Tau are mobile first and foremost, then shooty second. Playing Tau right means lots of jet packs and precise movement to just barely deny enemy assaults - and using vehicles to their full extent.
> 
> Static Tau will always lose against mobile Tau.


What I said had nothing to do with a shooty gun line. What I meant was exactly what I said, tau want to favor staying out of assault. If you took it to mean I was implying static tau then that's your problem. Don't tell people to shut up when you yourself don't know what you're talking about.


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## OddJob

To answer the OP, it doesn't really matter because it's rare that FW's will be on the board.

6 Bods in a devilfish. Only get out if you are guaranteed no retaliation in the turn after (then find better opponents).

For what it's worth- kroot are much better value than FW's. They shoot better than FWs (point for point), survive better (everything gets cover saves anyway), assault better and get to infiltrate/survive better in woods. I still only use a couple of squads of kroot as bubblewrap for broadsides.


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## Cheese meister

yes kroot get cover saves but 1 guy with a flamer is goinjg to bloody sting


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