# Omnissiah a C'Tan?



## Kendares (Sep 9, 2008)

is the Omnissiah a C'Tan? i read somewhere that mars is a tombworld. so could it be possible that inf act the Omnissiah is a C'Tan? a machine god.... sounds like a C'Tan to me.


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## Baron Spikey (Mar 26, 2008)

Mars isn't a tombworld but the Void Dragon is currently in stasis there.
Some factions of the Adeptus Mechanicus who know of the Void Dragon's presence regard the C'Tan as the Omnissiah for others it's just a facet of the God-Emperor.


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## Fangio (Nov 23, 2008)

It is a BL novel isn't it? If anyone knows if this is true/which one it is, I'd be eternally grateful.


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## Kendares (Sep 9, 2008)

so the Omnissiah is not a ctan and its just the void dragon not other crons?


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## Vaz (Mar 19, 2008)

The C'Tan, known as the Void Dragon, is rumoured to be what the Imperium know as the Omnissiah, or the Emperor, in his guise as the Machine God (as the AdMech believed that he was the Omnissiah, so he used that to sway them to his side).

However, if it is a C'Tan, then in all likelihood, should it awake, then probably the entire AdMech will follow it, not to mention all that which relies on AI, created by them (Machine Spirits etc) being either Possessed, or Controlled, or even the Spirits following 'cognitively', recognising the Void Dragon as the Omnissiah. Bit of a biggie, really.


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## Kendares (Sep 9, 2008)

titans out of control scary:shok:


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## Ferrus Manus (Apr 28, 2008)

This is in the HH novel "Mechanicum", the Void Dragon (a C'tan) is in statis on Mars, and he kinda of created the Mechanicum like the C'tan created the Necons. The mechanicum could be seen as semi-necrons :biggrin:

If the Void Dragon does wake, then the Imperium is doomed, the whole of Mechanicum will join him to destroy everything around, and Mars is right next the Terra so the Emperor, High Lords of Terra, and the Astromincum? (the telepathy thing) will be the first targets!!


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## weasly (Jun 18, 2008)

This is according to the book "Mechanicum" btw:

Pre 1500AD the Emperor went to a village where there was a dragon, and to sate the dragon's thirst the village would give it a sacrifice (cant remember how often). The Emperor rides up on his horse and says he will kill the dragon, he fights it and eventually overcomes the dragon, but doesnt kill it. The dragon is in fact the Void Dragon C'Tan. 

He (somehow) takes the dragon to Mars and imprisons it there, he also appoints a guardian to protect the dragon (in a way but I'll come back to that). 

The Void Dragon creates dreams in human's minds who live on Mars, which leads to them creating the Mechanicum. The moral of most of the book is, not to defeat the enemy but progress through the suffering. So by defeating the Dragon and letting it live, the Emperor knew it would make the Mechanicum, which he needed to take over the Universe. 

On the point of the guardian, every thousand years there is a new guardian. During the genesis of the Dark Mechanicum, a woman called Dalia Cythera is drawn towards the position of the dragon, and becomes the new guardian. When becoming the Guardian the person learns all knowledge in the world that exists, has existed and ever will exist (knowledge is power :biggrin. The book containing this exists where the Void Dragon is held, but while Dalia is the guardian it is stolen. 

The end of the book specifically says that after 10,000 years (to the the 40k game setting) , the next guardian was attracted to the dragon, but "the damage was already done". 

Whats odd with the book is that you find out, that the Void Dragon is obviously a dragon (duh) but also a place at the same time. It is through this place that Dalia learns how the Dragon was imprisoned. 

As far as I know no necrons exist at all under Mars and its not a tomb world, since the Emperor took the Dragon there. Not to say that Earth is a Tomb World, since the Dragon probably went to Earth because of the huge amount of life there which it needed to exist.

Hope this clears everything up, and then some.


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## kungfoomasta (May 8, 2008)

at the same time the void dragon could be useing the imperium to try and destroy the remaining c'tan. if i remember correctly one of the primarchs killed a c'tan and by arming all of the primarchs and their armies the void dragon could have hoped to take over the universe this way with no competition from the other c'tan(being dead at this point in time) or from the imperium considering that mars would be the best place to launch a supprise attack on earth. the c'tan opbviously arn't afraid of any of the old one's creations and if they really didnt want to finish off the nids they could just go into their tomb worlds again.


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## odinsgrudge (Apr 11, 2008)

weasly said:


> On the point of the guardian, every thousand years there is a new guardian. During the genesis of the Dark Mechanicum, a woman called Dalia Cythera is drawn towards the position of the dragon, and becomes the new guardian. When becoming the Guardian the person learns all knowledge in the world that exists, has existed and ever will exist (knowledge is power :biggrin. The book containing this exists where the Void Dragon is held, but while Dalia is the guardian it is stolen.
> 
> The end of the book specifically says that after 10,000 years (to the the 40k game setting) , the next guardian was attracted to the dragon, but "the damage was already done".


I was always curious, but could this somehow elude to the events in Titanicus?


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## Daneel2.0 (Jul 24, 2008)

kungfoomasta said:


> if i remember correctly one of the primarchs killed a c'tan


No, a primarch couldn't kill one of the C'Tan. They may have destroyed the living metal body that a portion of it's essence resides in, but it's pretty well established that it takes 3 Talismans of Vaul acting in concert to destroy a C'Tan (which is why the Eldar God made them after all).


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## weasly (Jun 18, 2008)

Yh i agree with Daneel. The C'Tan are a form of God after all. 

BTW I'll look into Titanicus. Isit a good book?


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## Epic Fail (Jun 23, 2008)

So is a C'tan a daemon? From the book Mechanicus I scanned the recount of empy vs void dragon as emperor fighting a daemon, but the description of the chamber and the mechanical based dreaming all points at c'tan. 

Appetite for souls is both very chaos daemon and C'tan, so how do all these different pantheons fit together? Are necrons just the first form of chaos worshipper?


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## Daneel2.0 (Jul 24, 2008)

No, actually a C'Tan is about as far from a daemon as you can get. The daemons come from the Immaterium (Chaos) which is the antithesis to the C'Tan.

They are Star Gods - beings that originally lived (and fed) on the substance of Stars. They have a bottomless appetite and until the Necrontyr contacted them, they pretty much ignored everything that wasn't their star. Once contact was made, the Necrontyr made bodies for them, and they brought that bottomless appetite with them. 

Nightbringer (the first brought across) began killing and eating the Necrontyr, having discovered he liked their flavor better than plasma, and the Necrontyr offered up the other races for food, rather than being eaten into extinction.


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## War$m!7H (Jun 20, 2008)

on a side note. Titanicus is VERY good. a bit slow on some parts, but when the Titan action gets rolling, its a hard book to put down. Too bad w/e Chaos Legio that was didnt have the Dies Irae :biggrin: and that is the only thing that i will rip on the IW for. THEY LET THE _*DIES IRAE*_ FALL!


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## Baron Spikey (Mar 26, 2008)

As Daneel said the Primarchs couldn't kill a C'tan, even the Emperor said (in Mechanicum) that he didn't have the ability to kill a C'tan, only subdue it.


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## Epic Fail (Jun 23, 2008)

Daneel2.0 said:


> No, actually a C'Tan is about as far from a daemon as you can get. The daemons come from the Immaterium (Chaos) which is the antithesis to the C'Tan.
> 
> They are Star Gods - beings that originally lived (and fed) on the substance of Stars. They have a bottomless appetite and until the Necrontyr contacted them, they pretty much ignored everything that wasn't their star. Once contact was made, the Necrontyr made bodies for them, and they brought that bottomless appetite with them.
> 
> Nightbringer (the first brought across) began killing and eating the Necrontyr, having discovered he liked their flavor better than plasma, and the Necrontyr offered up the other races for food, rather than being eaten into extinction.


So immaterial beings with an endless hunger for stars were contacted by a race of mortals that gave them access to the material world where they went berserk and started consuming them. Yes that sounds totally different to chaos gods and daemons.

I'm just saying that I think the immaterium is the wellspring for all of the races' divine beings, different races just see and worship different facets - tell me Khaine isn't just an aspect of Khorne. 

Isn't the warp is just a big churning pot of energy shaped by the consciousness of the life forms around at any given time? Wouldn't that make all the "gods" the same thing, just shaped by different thoughts?


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## Daneel2.0 (Jul 24, 2008)

No, the C'Tan lived in the material universe, and consist of material beings even in their original state. They weren't contacted and given access to it, they already lived in it. They aren't aspects of Chaos Daemons. 

Creatively, there are similarities, and the process that the designers used to describe them or come up with them may very well have been derived from ideas of chaos. But from a strictly fluff based perspective, they aren't the same at all.


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## lomaxxdurang (Jun 24, 2008)

Actually Mechanicum and Titanicus have a lot of connections... the main one i noticed was the invention of the noosphere. Also another important thing is where i found the engine fights in mechanicum to be slow and well boring as hell, the fights with the engines in titanicus were much more impressive. There are a lot of interesting things in those two books. As to the dragon, I want to know more so my marines can whoop some Cron B#tch @$$


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## Lord Lucius (Sep 18, 2008)

what if the emporor and the void dragon were working together,becouse ,isnt the void dragon the most powerful c'tan,the emperor couldnt have really defeated him/it


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## Calamari (Feb 13, 2009)

weasly said:


> This is according to the book "Mechanicum" btw:
> 
> Pre 1500AD the Emperor went to a village where there was a dragon, and to sate the dragon's thirst the village would give it a sacrifice (cant remember how often). The Emperor rides up on his horse and says he will kill the dragon, he fights it and eventually overcomes the dragon, but doesnt kill it. The dragon is in fact the Void Dragon C'Tan.


So the Emperor is St George? I like that idea lol.


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## Child-of-the-Emperor (Feb 22, 2009)

Lord Lucius said:


> what if the emporor and the void dragon were working together,becouse ,isnt the void dragon the most powerful c'tan,the emperor couldnt have really defeated him/it


Don't forget though that the C'tan are vunerable to Warp Energy. The Emperor being the most powerful Psyker in the galaxy could direct some pretty harmful warp energy at a C'tan :victory:



Calamari said:


> So the Emperor is St George? I like that idea lol.


Aye. 

In the same way as the Emperor engineered it so that the Martians would recognise him as the Ommnissiah, i see him as also engineering it so that the earthlings would recognise him as particular characters from folklore who promised they would return.

Eg. King Arthur is supposed to return
The second coming of Jesus (no offense intended:no 

And countless other legends which involve the character returning in the future. 
This in a way may have helped him in the unification wars, being recognised as the returning figure of legend. :biggrin:


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## xiawujing (Mar 2, 2009)

Mechanicus and Titanicus are supposed to relate.

The Emperor took ideas of the Void Dragon and used them to create every bit of modern technology that the Imperium has.

The Void Dragon is the Omnissiah.


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## Col. Schafer (Apr 15, 2008)

Well more acurately there is no omnisiah, but the scorce of all the stuff atributed to the omnisiah is the C'tan.

So yes, you could say he is the omnisiah, but he isnt as nice as the omnisiah, and we definately dont want him to wake up. Well other than chron players anyway.


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## Child-of-the-Emperor (Feb 22, 2009)

Col. Schafer said:


> Well more acurately there is no omnisiah, but the scorce of all the stuff atributed to the omnisiah is the C'tan.
> 
> So yes, you could say he is the omnisiah, but he isnt as nice as the omnisiah, and we definately dont want him to wake up. Well other than chron players anyway.


Indeed its more accurate to say the Ommnissiah doesn't exist. The Emperor planned it so that the Martians would recognise him as the Ommnissiah and therefore pledge allegience to him.

But the Machine God certainly is a C'tan. Here is a nice link on it.


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## kungfoomasta (May 8, 2008)

I have an idean and please correct me if im wrong. Couldnt the Void Dragon tie in human souls to machines the same way the necrons were origanlly created but weaker considering that the Void Dragon is imprisoned. it does give some reinforcement to the idea of the machin spirit and that the titans have minds of their own.


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## Arcane (Feb 17, 2009)

kungfoomasta said:


> I have an idean and please correct me if im wrong. Couldnt the Void Dragon tie in human souls to machines the same way the necrons were origanlly created but weaker considering that the Void Dragon is imprisoned. it does give some reinforcement to the idea of the machin spirit and that the titans have minds of their own.


I believe the Necrons chose to give up their flesh to gain power. I am not an expert but I get the feeling that they worshiped the Star Gods where as if the humans ever found out what the Machine Spirit was, they may just have a civil war on their hands, rather than out right enslavement.


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## Child-of-the-Emperor (Feb 22, 2009)

kungfoomasta said:


> I have an idean and please correct me if im wrong. Couldnt the Void Dragon tie in human souls to machines the same way the necrons were origanlly created but weaker considering that the Void Dragon is imprisoned. it does give some reinforcement to the idea of the machin spirit and that the titans have minds of their own.


Its plausable but i find it unlikely. Remember at the beginning of Mechanicum, the Emperor was able to heal/fix a mini titan just by touching it. So the Machine Spirit could actually be the Emperor? although it could be the Void Dragon i guess?


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