# New wargaming case developed and for sale



## Zartosis (Oct 20, 2010)

Hello all,

A while back I made a thread about developing trays and a case for miniatures and now they're finally made.

This will be a test launch to see if to if this will be a popular product therefore I have only made a small batch and will be selling them at promotional prices until they run out. If this is successful I will expand on this tray system to compete with others.

£35 - one case
£60 - two cases

Shipping prices are as follows;

One case

UK - £free
EU - €26
USA - $56
AUS - $56

Two cases

UK - £free
EU - €43
USA - $71
AUS - $71

Payment will only be paypal or you can pay on collection if you're in Bucks.

For those of you who have never traded with me in the past or don't know who I am and are a little sceptical this is my ebay account http://feedback.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewFeedback2&userid=artie40k&ftab=AllFeedback - I have a 331 feedback score at 100% satisfaction.

*Tray Dimensions* (all measurements in millimetres)
Case - 360x560x140
56 slot - 360x280x23
36 slot - 360x280x
50mm pick and pluck - 360x280x50 or 360x560x50
65mm pick and pluck - 360x280x65 or 360x560x65
100mm pick and pluck - 360x280x100 or 360x560x100
120mm pick and pluck - 360x280x120 or 360x560x120
Plucks are 20x20mm 
All trays are on a 5mm base, 120mm is on a 10mm base.

Please PM me to place your order and please tell which trays you want. You can have the following configurations -

5 x 56 slot trays + 4 x 36 slot trays 
10 x 56 slot trays 
8 x 36 slot trays 
Pick and pluck + 56/36 total cannot exceed 140mm depth






















































I would just like to say thanks for reading and hopefully you like what you see. I am more than happy to answer and questions you have.


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## Straken's_Fist (Aug 15, 2012)

Nice. How does this differ from KR cases? Or is it the same design?


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## Zartosis (Oct 20, 2010)

Straken's_Fist said:


> Nice. How does this differ from KR cases? Or is it the same design?


With this case it differs from KR because you would be spending £50 for two cases, which you'd have to carry in each hand compared to my one case, which makes it more convenient for transporting and storing or £92.99 for two cases and a bag to store them while you pay a lot less with mine, £35 if you're in the UK.

Also the 56 slot trays allow you to store 6 terminators/odd shaped models compared to their 50 slot tray.

My foam is a lot stronger and wont bend as much when fully loaded compared to their trays.

And finally my products will always be cheaper.

Hope that helps.


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## Straken's_Fist (Aug 15, 2012)

Zartosis said:


> With this case it differs from KR because you would be spending £50 for two cases, which you'd have to carry in each hand compared to my one case, which makes it more convenient for transporting and storing or £92.99 for two cases and a bag to store them while you pay a lot less with mine, £35 if you're in the UK.
> 
> Also the 56 slot trays allow you to store 6 terminators/odd shaped models compared to their 50 slot tray.
> 
> ...


Excellent!! I will be watching this closely, might make an order on ebay when I have the spare cash. 
I do find KR a little expensive for what you get, so this is much more reasonably priced.


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## Zartosis (Oct 20, 2010)

Straken's_Fist said:


> Excellent!! I will be watching this closely, might make an order on ebay when I have the spare cash.
> I do find KR a little expensive for what you get, so this is much more reasonably priced.


Thanks, I appreciate it.

HO seems the hardest for people to take interest in this product it seems, I don't know why.


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## Fallen (Oct 7, 2008)

Zartosis said:


> Thanks, I appreciate it.
> 
> HO seems the hardest for people to take interest in this product it seems, I don't know why.


Probably because a lot of your pictures look to be lifted from/or personal pictures of KR Multicase, Battlefoam, and GW cases and it didn't have a disclaimer.


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## Zartosis (Oct 20, 2010)

Fallen said:


> Probably because a lot of your pictures look to be lifted from/or personal pictures of KR Multicase, Battlefoam, and GW cases and it didn't have a disclaimer.


None of them use a brown background and bad lighting, and if people checked my ebay account I use the same for the foam trays I sell there (304 feedback).

I could take a picture of all the trays I glued for the case if it helps.


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## bitsandkits (Mar 18, 2008)

Zartosis said:


> Thanks, I appreciate it.
> 
> HO seems the hardest for people to take interest in this product it seems, I don't know why.


HO has alot of veterans who are not easily impressed, your product isnt new or innovative its just a bit cheaper than the market leader, also personally i would never store my minis in a cardboard case, plastic or aluminium case if im gonna travel with them, card is great for some things but its easily crushed and really doesnt offer enough protection for models in my opinion.


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## Varakir (Sep 2, 2009)

I've recently been looking for a similar product, but in corrugated plastic.

We use these boxes at work all the time for hard drive transport, but for the life of me i can't seem to find where to order such a thing. In plastic i would be interested, but card just doesn't seem like a suitable material on it's own for transport.


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## Zartosis (Oct 20, 2010)

bitsandkits said:


> HO has alot of veterans who are not easily impressed,


People on Warseer, Dakkadakka, Warhammer.org seem to show interest.



bitsandkits said:


> also personally i would never store my minis in a cardboard case, plastic or aluminium case if im gonna travel with them, card is great for some things but its easily crushed and really doesnt offer enough protection for models in my opinion.


The cardboard case is similar to those used to transport computer monitors so this box is very suitable. And you're talking with the perspective of someone who uses public transportation. The case will do more than fine in a car or any other form of personal transport. If you're travelling via public transport than that's another issue but the models won't get damaged.

Also cardboard keeps the the product cheaper for gamers who can also use it at home to store models, why would they need a plastic/aluminium cause for home purposes? It just bumps the price up for little gain.



bitsandkits said:


> your product isnt new or innovative its just a bit cheaper than the market leader,


I'm not trying to reinvent the wheel here. There's only so many ways you can store models in foam and it's all been done.

So let's get real here, it would cost you £50 minimum to store similar amount of models, then you'd need the bag so you can carry it with one hand (£90 for the set) or mine which is £35 which includes postage holds more models if you go for the 8 x 56 tray and better foam. I think this is the best deal gamers have seen compared to the others and that's what I'm going for.

Most online stores (and this is for wargaming related) offer pretty much the same products or very similar for the same price and do not differ from one another, such as your Bits And Kits vs Bitzbox. 

I don't see anyone else offering gamers a good product for a very low price (without the use of sales).


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## Zartosis (Oct 20, 2010)

Varakir said:


> I've recently been looking for a similar product, but in corrugated plastic.
> 
> We use these boxes at work all the time for hard drive transport, but for the life of me i can't seem to find where to order such a thing. In plastic i would be interested, but card just doesn't seem like a suitable material on it's own for transport.


But if you're using your own transport it would be more than enough or even home storage. Why do you need a stronger case unless you're really heavy handed with them.

Again I can understand people who use public transport but when you have your own transport and weigh up the prices and what I offer for £35 (includes the postage) that's a bargin.

Lastly if cardboard cases were that bad KR would be out of business.


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## LokiDeathclaw (Jun 19, 2013)

Definately interested in something like this! Especially as a lot of my models are dynamically posed and struggle to fit in GW cases. I do however have a number of thunder wolf cavalry and dreads, they wouldn't fit in your trays would they?


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## Straken's_Fist (Aug 15, 2012)

I wouldn't take it personally: Traffic is especially low on heresy at the moment and even when it's high it isn't anywhere near as frequented as the forums you mention. 

As for it not being a suitable material. I have been using KR cases for large armies and have overpacked them frequently and they have never been damaged or dented (and most the time I walk to games or take in the back of a car). It's not as good as plastic but it's quite suitable as a cheaper alternative in my experience. Just my view.


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## Varakir (Sep 2, 2009)

Zartosis said:


> But if you're using your own transport it would be more than enough or even home storage. Why do you need a stronger case unless you're really heavy handed with them.
> 
> Again I can understand people who use public transport but when you have your own transport and weigh up the prices and what I offer for £35 (includes the postage) that's a bargin.
> 
> Lastly if cardboard cases were that bad KR would be out of business.


I'm not saying your product is bad, and i agree it's a very good deal compared to what others are offering, just offering some feedback. 

Even the best card is more susceptible to rain and damage than plastic, so personally i wouldn't want to use a card case but i'm sure others would.


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## torealis (Dec 27, 2006)

I hope it doesn't rain.


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## Zartosis (Oct 20, 2010)

LokiDeathclaw said:


> Definately interested in something like this! Especially as a lot of my models are dynamically posed and struggle to fit in GW cases. I do however have a number of thunder wolf cavalry and dreads, they wouldn't fit in your trays would they?


Sadly they don't but I can get pick and pluck foam to accommodate that for you. 



Straken's_Fist said:


> I wouldn't take it personally: Traffic is especially low on heresy at the moment and even when it's high it isn't anywhere near as frequented as the forums you mention.


I am surprised though because HO has always been a good forum, and when Fallen asserted I didn't own the pictures I don't know anymore.



Straken's_Fist said:


> As for it not being a suitable material. I have been using KR cases for large armies and have overpacked them frequently and they have never been damaged or dented (and most the time I walk to games or take in the back of a car). It's not as good as plastic but it's quite suitable as a cheaper alternative in my experience. Just my view.


Exactly, £35 for what I offer isn't too bad I thought. I have the skids greased for the trays to be put into carry on cases but I will get them done at a later stage. I just wanted to keep the cardboard cases nice and cheap for players to start with.



Varakir said:


> I'm not saying your product is bad, and i agree it's a very good deal compared to what others are offering, just offering some feedback.


I understand that, I was trying to show the merits of my product that was all  And I appreciate any and all feedback.



Varakir said:


> Even the best card is more susceptible to rain and damage than plastic, so personally i wouldn't want to use a card case but i'm sure others would.


But would you use the card if you had your own transport where it wouldn't get wet, or for storing mins at home where they wouldn't get wet?




torealis said:


> I hope it doesn't rain.


Me neither but if you keep them in the car when you travel or use for home storage they should be fine


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## Straken's_Fist (Aug 15, 2012)

Honestly you would have to submerge it in a swimming pool for the box to lose it's integrity. I just put mine in carrier bags if it's raining. Problem solved. 

Budget option.


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## Kreuger (Aug 30, 2010)

Hmm. Is there a mismatch between the value proposed here and the product?

In other words, if I have the money for a car wouldn't I also have the money for a case with a more durable build?

And likewise, if I didn't have the money for a car and I had to take public transport, wouldn't I be encouraged again to buy a more durable material?

How big is the demographic who has both the income for personal transport but wants to go cheap on their cases?


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## venomlust (Feb 9, 2010)

Kreuger said:


> Hmm. Is there a mismatch between the value proposed here and the product?
> 
> In other words, if I have the money for a car wouldn't I also have the money for a case with a more durable build?
> 
> ...


Eh, I see your point, but personally I don't think so.

I have a car, and buy minis, but there's no reason for me to buy expensive cases. I buy foam trays to store infantry and simply stack them before placing them in huge tupperware containers. For vehicles, I use boxes of GW products lined and stuffed with bubble wrap.

I doubt I'd ever bring any miniatures if taking public transportation or on a ship/plane. I'd just drive wherever I'm going, and use my own containers loaded into the back of my car. I'm not the type who would fly across the country or the world to play 40k. More power to those who do, and I understand why they would want something as heavy-duty as possible.

The things that give me problems are oddly-shaped large models like winged Daemon Princes, Juggernauts, and so on. Especially those that I've converted that have fragile elements to them. I usually have to build a little customized bubble-wrap/foam lined box out of something I've received from Amazon/eBay.

I really appreciate this product at the price point. I doubt I'd buy any, though. 

Best of luck selling your merchandise! Both the price/quality look solid to me.


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## Kreuger (Aug 30, 2010)

I typically just use double layer pistol cases. They can be had for reasonable prices and the foam can be cut or replaced as needed


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## bitsandkits (Mar 18, 2008)

Kreuger said:


> Hmm. Is there a mismatch between the value proposed here and the product?
> 
> In other words, if I have the money for a car wouldn't I also have the money for a case with a more durable build?
> 
> ...


that is pretty much how i feel about them, im pretty familiar with cardboard as a material and i have yet to come across a cardboard that will stand up to a size nine boot or 15stone mans arse or that wont crumple if dropped or for that matter didnt go soggy in the rain, all of these are potential issues for a model case( rain being a particular problem in the UK) , Ok some gamers have cars, very true, but a considerable number of GWs demographic are teenage boys who dont drive and can be seen luggin black GW cases and aluminium tool cases etc into local stores.
Im not saying its impossible to sell cardboard cases, i just think corrugated plastic would make more sense as its much more durable and weather resistant.


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## Zartosis (Oct 20, 2010)

Straken's_Fist said:


> Honestly you would have to submerge it in a swimming pool for the box to lose it's integrity. I just put mine in carrier bags if it's raining. Problem solved.
> 
> Budget option.


Agreed and thanks, I tested it last night and bashed it against a wall and it was still functional.




Kreuger said:


> Hmm. Is there a mismatch between the value proposed here and the product?
> 
> In other words, if I have the money for a car wouldn't I also have the money for a case with a more durable build?


Not at all you're paying £35 for something that costs £50+

Why would you need one with a durable build if it's in the car? Why not save yourself some money?



Kreuger said:


> And likewise, if I didn't have the money for a car and I had to take public transport, wouldn't I be encouraged again to buy a more durable material?
> 
> How big is the demographic who has both the income for personal transport but wants to go cheap on their cases?


I don't understand your gripe with cardboard cases, it's £35... and cheaper than anyone else for similar miniature count storage.





venomlust said:


> I really appreciate this product at the price point. I doubt I'd buy any, though.
> 
> Best of luck selling your merchandise! Both the price/quality look solid to me.


Just to get some feedback, why wouldn't you buy it?

And thanks  




Kreuger said:


> I typically just use double layer pistol cases. They can be had for reasonable prices and the foam can be cut or replaced as needed



We don't have guns here.


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## Kreuger (Aug 30, 2010)

Zartosis said:


> Not at all, you're paying £35 for something that costs £50+
> 
> Why would you need one with a durable build if it's in the car? Why not save yourself some money?
> 
> I don't understand your gripe with cardboard cases, it's £35... and cheaper than anyone else for similar miniature count storage.


I'm not totally against your product. I don't think I would buy it, but I can certainly see the use. I can definitely see your system working well with miniatures stored at home. Just as we don't store every document or knick-knack in a heavy duty cabinet, bin, or tub I can see how these cardboard cases would be perfect for long term storage at home in a closet, attic, or under the gaming table.

Perhaps I'm being closed minded, but if I had to travel I would still prefer a plastic case.

And if I were a kid traveling it might be necessary to use something stronger/weather resistant to protect my miniature investment. I know when I started playing at age 12, a cardboard car would not have survived with me all that long. They were dropped, kicked, and stepped on at my FLGS and rained on several times.

So in other words, even if you make a more affordable case, it may still not always be a better value.



Zartosis said:


> We don't have guns here.


Which I think is very sensible. I don't own any guns, just the cases to store figures. Are gun _cases_ regulated in the UK as well?

Anyway, good luck with the venture!


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## Sethis (Jun 4, 2009)

Well I've just paid for one of the 56-slot cases and will drop a review on here once it arrives


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## venomlust (Feb 9, 2010)

Just don't need any cases. As I said, I tend to buy foam trays and just cram them in a big plastic tupperware. Not as tidy or compact as your cases, but cheaper than even your budget option :laugh:. It's gonna start getting awkward once I have my army painted though, for the bigger minis at least.


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## DarkDisciple_Nahum (Oct 6, 2013)

I like these cases. Like others though I tend towards plastic cases (for figs) or land raider boxes (for vehicles/MCs). I do a cardboard case and it works very well, especially after I spray laquered it. That fixed the main rain/snow problem for me.


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## khrone forever (Dec 13, 2010)

What class of postage would you send them?


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## Zartosis (Oct 20, 2010)

Kreuger said:


> So in other words, even if you make a more affordable case, it may still not always be a better value.


But why is KR so popular when they use cardboard cases?




Kreuger said:


> Are gun cases regulated in the UK as well?


We don't have gun cases either except for game keepers and other professions but I have never seen them in shops.



Kreuger said:


> Anyway, good luck with the venture!


Thank you, I appreciate the feedback and I am not taking it as a slight. 




Sethis said:


> Well I've just paid for one of the 56-slot cases and will drop a review on here once it arrives


And thanks again! Hopefully you received it today?




venomlust said:


> Just don't need any cases. As I said, I tend to buy foam trays and just cram them in a big plastic tupperware. Not as tidy or compact as your cases, but cheaper than even your budget option . It's gonna start getting awkward once I have my army painted though, for the bigger minis at least.


Is Battlefoam popular there?




DarkDisciple_Nahum said:


> I like these cases. Like others though I tend towards plastic cases (for figs) or land raider boxes (for vehicles/MCs). I do a cardboard case and it works very well, especially after I spray laquered it. That fixed the main rain/snow problem for me.


I did think about spraying them but I'm not sure about regulations and what not here so I just left it. 




khrone forever said:


> What class of postage would you send them?


Second class royal mail.


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## venomlust (Feb 9, 2010)

I've seen two players with Battlefoam cases/foam before, but there may actually be more. I just haven't gone to a store to play in a good 5 months.


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## Sethis (Jun 4, 2009)

The case did arrive today in fact, I'll drop an in depth review when I'm not working 13 hour days, which will probably be Tuesday next week or so. First glance looks reasonable though!


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## Zartosis (Oct 20, 2010)

Thanks, enjoy the sweets when you review it


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## Sethis (Jun 4, 2009)

Hi all,

So I have a few spare minutes and want to let you know how I found this case.

First off, it arrived promptly, which is nice. Two days after payment, which means it was posted ASAP after payment and delivered by 2nd Class post. Free postage is also a decent thing - the cost was £35, flat.










So size wise it's about twice that of a GW case, maybe a little less.

Looking at the exterior, there was a little bit of creasing in the cardboard - exclusively in the lid, which is natural since it's the only part that moves.





Obviously at the moment this is minor, and only time will tell if it becomes an actual problem or not. I will note at this stage that the cardboard is not as rigid or solid as the KR Multicase cardboard, which is significantly denser, and therefore presumably more resistant to things like rain.

Opening the case, there was a fun size packet of Haribo, which was nice, and hasn't biased my review in any way... 

Looking at the foam, you certainly get a lot of it! The case holds 448 models, which is something on the order of quadruple the regular GW case capacity. It'd certainly do well for people who enjoy things like collecting Companies of Marines, or you could easily add the sheets to other cases for more infantry-dense armies. I know a lot of my cases are mixed up layers of KR, Battlefoam, GW and so on depending on the army and system.



With regards to the foam itself, it does the job very nicely. It's kind of a halfway house between KR and Battlefoam in terms of rigidity, it's also stronger than GW foam. The foam is glued quite strongly (pretty much the most strongly glued I've come across) to the base along the horizontal lines, the vertical lines are unglued. Obviously if you want to cut them up for models then you want to go vertical, which is favourable for back banners and bikes, but less good for wide models like Terminators.

The slots themselves are pretty much the perfect depth, holding models with swords etc deeply enough to make risk of damage from blades sticking out negligible. It's also slightly accomodating with height - Marines with bigger backpacks should just about fit in neatly. The larger slots along the base are actually an invention that is more useful than you first think - they hold things like Sang Guard (which are actually rather large compared to normal slots) in enough numbers to mean you don't need to chop up the case as much as you otherwise might. Also makes it easier to find special/heavy weapon troopers or Sergeants if that's something you struggle with (Imperial Guard, for example).



Overall, I think this case is great for storing models and taking them to the local workshop. It seems solid enough for most use, but I do have reserves about taking it outside when it's absolutely BELTING it down. Drizzle etc should be fine, but I don't want to risk an actual downpore.

Finally, there is nowhere, absolutely nowhere else, that will let you case up and store almost 450 models for £35. Not a chance. So on that basis alone, even if you use the trays in other cases, it's very good value for money, because the foam quality is superb.


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## Varakir (Sep 2, 2009)

Nice review sethis :victory:

Seeing it vs the GW case it's clear that it's a very good value bit of kit. Good luck with your sales Zartosis!


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## LokiDeathclaw (Jun 19, 2013)

Can the larger made trays hold fantasy cavalry??


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## Zartosis (Oct 20, 2010)

Sethis said:


> Snip


I would just like to thank you for your purchase and your review. 

I will try to reply best I can to your review.

From this week/early next I will be using a different delivery service which provides tracking, which will be emailed to customers allowing them to track the progress to give them peace of mind.

The Haribo sweets will be a regular theme. I have never seen the other competitors do it and I believe it's something that will help me stand out. And a little thank you gesture to customers while they pack their trays.

As to the case, I believe because of it's size it will be more prone to creases, but that was the only option to keep the set cheap. I am looking into getting flight cases made (the nylon ones) so players have more choice.

I'm very happy you like the foam and price as those are my main selling points. I was going to use the softer foam KR use but as you say this one is inbetween them and BF which seems perfect.

Again thank you for your purchase and review, hopefully I will see you again!




Varakir said:


> Nice review sethis
> 
> Seeing it vs the GW case it's clear that it's a very good value bit of kit. Good luck with your sales Zartosis!



Thank you very much, hopefully I will be able to send you one or two soon  




LokiDeathclaw said:


> Can the larger made trays hold fantasy cavalry??


Personally I don't think so, I will eventually make a tray for them though. I have taken a picture so you have an idea.


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## LokiDeathclaw (Jun 19, 2013)

Zartosis said:


> Personally I don't think so, I will eventually make a tray for them though. I have taken a picture so you have an idea.


Ah I see. I am still interested as it is definitely a good product, if you could make a cav tray I would buy one ASAP!!


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## Zartosis (Oct 20, 2010)

How many would you want? There is another person who wants them but there would have to be a decent demand for me to pay for it's development. 

I do sell pick and pluck foam that could suffice for now though.


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## Grins1878 (May 10, 2010)

Might have to pick one up next month, I've bookmarked this thread for that reason! I'm in serious need of storage so these would be ideal (and transporting for me).

I'd be interested in cavalry trays too in the future. There's rumblings that I may be delving more into fantasy.

Bravo!


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## LokiDeathclaw (Jun 19, 2013)

Zartosis said:


> How many would you want? There is another person who wants them but there would have to be a decent demand for me to pay for it's development.
> 
> I do sell pick and pluck foam that could suffice for now though.


Around 40 cavalry slots? I have also ear marked one for the near future as will be in need of storage!


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## Dakingofchaos (Sep 29, 2009)

Case looks good, not innovative just much better thought out than most others. A small point to people who gripe about rain, I PVA'd my KR case just to 'seal' it, had it a couple of years and its still going strong, same would probably apply to these ones. Good product!


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## Zartosis (Oct 20, 2010)

Grins1878 said:


> Might have to pick one up next month, I've bookmarked this thread for that reason! I'm in serious need of storage so these would be ideal (and transporting for me).
> 
> I'd be interested in cavalry trays too in the future. There's rumblings that I may be delving more into fantasy.
> 
> Bravo!


Thank you very much, how many cavalry trays would you be interested in?




LokiDeathclaw said:


> Around 40 cavalry slots? I have also ear marked one for the near future as will be in need of storage!


Heh I am not sure how many I could fit in a tray but I will look into it. I also meant how many trays would you be interested in? 






Dakingofchaos said:


> Case looks good, not innovative just much better thought out than most others. A small point to people who gripe about rain, I PVA'd my KR case just to 'seal' it, had it a couple of years and its still going strong, same would probably apply to these ones. Good product!



Thank you, hopefully you will be able to see one first hand 

______


As a side note for those wanting cavalry trays would you prefer them laying down sideways or standing up?

Cheers!


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## ntaw (Jul 20, 2012)

Sethis did a great review of the product, and I'm glad to see there's cost effective options out there for people....but....the idea of paying $70+ for a cardboard box is ridiculous to me. I'd rather shell out the coin for something that doesn't look like I could make it for less.


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## Zartosis (Oct 20, 2010)

Well it must be a good idea as it works for KR.


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## Jonny B (Aug 22, 2013)

What about covering it yourself with pva and paper of some sort? This could make it more waterproof (at least less likely to get completely ruined in the rain) you'd then have a nice personalised case


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## LokiDeathclaw (Jun 19, 2013)

Zartosis said:


> Heh I am not sure how many I could fit in a tray but I will look into it. I also meant how many trays would you be interested in?


Ha I would look to have the larger ones (6 x 36 slots is it?) and maybe some cav ones if you decide to make them?:wink:


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## Zartosis (Oct 20, 2010)

Jonny B said:


> What about covering it yourself with pva and paper of some sort? This could make it more waterproof (at least less likely to get completely ruined in the rain) you'd then have a nice personalised case


I am looking into it. The boxes will be branded at a later date also. 



LokiDeathclaw said:


> Ha I would look to have the larger ones (6 x 36 slots is it?) and maybe some cav ones if you decide to make them?:wink:


Ah ok, wouldn't pick and pluck be better that way you can shape it to how you want and comes in handy if you have them magnetised on a movement tray?


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## ntaw (Jul 20, 2012)

Zartosis said:


> Well it must be a good idea as it works for KR.


Never heard of them. I assume they are another purveyor of cardboard boxes, which is probably why. 

Millions of people eat at McDonalds but it doesn't mean they make good food.


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## ChaosRedCorsairLord (Apr 17, 2009)

ntaw said:


> Never heard of them. I assume they are another purveyor of cardboard boxes, which is probably why.
> 
> Millions of people eat at McDonalds but it doesn't mean they make good food.


I dunno, cardboard can be pretty tough. My battlestar galactica box has survived several hundred games and is still going strong, and I'm not exactly careful with it. 

If you're worried about water, you could always get that contact stuff you stick over books.


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## Zartosis (Oct 20, 2010)

ntaw said:


> Never heard of them. I assume they are another purveyor of cardboard boxes, which is probably why.
> 
> Millions of people eat at McDonalds but it doesn't mean they make good food.




I am confused. How you can compare my product, which provides utility and a cheaper alternative than similar products (if you had bothered to look before chiming in), and an actual use, compared to a fast good chain which provides little to no nutritional value and causes more problems than it solves.

*epic facepalm*


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## ntaw (Jul 20, 2012)

I checked into your product, and the first thing I said was that I was glad there is a less expensive alternative and that Sethis' review was a good one. What I said afterward is that it ain't for me.

You said it must be a good idea because another company is doing well with the cardboard approach. You can count any number of companies that have tried copying the McDonalds approach to fast food, and they all pretty much suck just as hard because they are copying a bad idea. People think it's a good idea, maybe because McD's is making so much money, but in fact it's just crap (a shortened version of your description of their product) that people are buying based on price and availability. Likewise, I think you have started this product based on an idea that is...shall we say less than optimal, since I don't think it's total crap. To me, it doesn't matter how much less your product costs: it's still a cardboard box.

Doesn't mean other people can't enjoy it, just means it's the internet and not everyone is going to love what you got going on.



ChaosRedCorsairLord said:


> I dunno, cardboard can be pretty tough.


I get that, I worked in international shipping for 4 years in my early 20's. Also means I've seen a ton of the bad things that can go wrong with cardboard though, which is where my dislike of the product comes from. Cardboard works for some, not for me.


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## Sethis (Jun 4, 2009)

ntaw said:


> I get that, I worked in international shipping for 4 years in my early 20's. Also means I've seen a ton of the bad things that can go wrong with cardboard though, which is where my dislike of the product comes from. Cardboard works for some, not for me.


Which is why I mentioned in the review that I think the best part of the product is the foam. If you can find 450 slot foam for £35 that is actually stiff enough not to bend under the weight of metal models and is glued together well, then it's news to me.

You can take or leave the cardboard, but I think this works excellently for those who just want more trays to fit in their current cases - making it easier to swap armies in and out, store them at home, etc.


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

Yikes, this thread went poorly.


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## bitsandkits (Mar 18, 2008)

Einherjar667 said:


> Yikes, this thread went poorly.


Well the OP forgot the first rule of selling, it is impossible to please everyone all of the time, one mans ideal product is a piece of shit to the next man in the line, a cardboard box is a cardboard box at the end of the day, for some people that is adequate to use as a container to carry around there precious collection, to other people its not adequate because of *insert reason*, that said the OP must realize the limitations of cardboard as a medium, i use boxes to send through the mail, i expect the box to stand up to normal handling in the postal process, and in that process it will take a beating,while at the same time protecting the contents, but im under no illusion that once the package has arrived that the customer will most likely bin the box as it will be beaten up and maybe rained/snowed on, the reason we use cardboard for packing is its a cheap and robust in the short term.

At the bits and kits office we use very sturdy ABS plastic tool boxes(the segmented ones you put screws in) for all our bits, they have strong locking lids, i know that if i drop on of those boxes from 7ft it will bounce, never smash and also never unlock or mix up the bits because of the fall, i chose these boxes because i know at some point someone will drop a box and that i need to minimize the fall out if they do, same principles apply with a mini carry case, if i drop a plastic carry case on the floor out side, it might get a few scratches but its gonna be fine, if i drop a plastic case in puddle it will dry off no problem, if someone gets too close on the bus the plastic case wont crush, if a family member with poor eyesight doesnt see my plastic mini case on the chair and sits on it for a second it isnt gonna collapse(unless its aunt Margret shes a huge lady) and in my house atleast a plastic mini case isnt gonna get chucked in the recycle bin by my wife because she thought it was "another bloody amazon box".
But that aside, to the right person, this carry case is ideal, it will have a market.

Yes its cheap, but cheap also means it has limitations and short comings, dont deny them or get defensive about them, they are legit reasons for a non sale, accept the reasons or look to improve the product or expand the range, dont take internet criticism personally, people in forums will tell you the truth,or lie,or blow sunshine up your arse or spit on you, they will tell you your stuff is amazing and promise to buy shed loads and you will never see a dime from them, they will slag you off and yet never actually use your products and services,some folks you will never hear a peep from, and they will be your best customers,some will rush to your defense,big you up to others, and happily promote you to anyone that will listen,others will forget to mention you even exist despite happily buying from you for years, others will simply throw fuel on the fire and happily see you burn, just do your thing, promote your stuff, answer questions and dont get drawn into arguments online as it makes you look bad.


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## Grins1878 (May 10, 2010)

I'm glad shops aren't like forums. Every time you went to pick something up there'd be a queue of folk waiting to tell you why you shouldn't pick something! 

Re: cavalry trays, I'm not entirely sure how much cavalry I have, but probably only the one tray. I was looking at your ebay shop yesterday, seems good stuff! k:


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## ChaosRedCorsairLord (Apr 17, 2009)

bitsandkits said:


> Well the OP forgot the first rule of selling, it is impossible to please everyone all of the time, one mans ideal product is a piece of shit to the next man in the line, a cardboard box is a cardboard box at the end of the day, for some people that is adequate to use as a container to carry around there precious collection, to other people its not adequate because of *insert reason*, that said the OP must realize the limitations of cardboard as a medium, i use boxes to send through the mail, i expect the box to stand up to normal handling in the postal process, and in that process it will take a beating,while at the same time protecting the contents, but im under no illusion that once the package has arrived that the customer will most likely bin the box as it will be beaten up and maybe rained/snowed on, the reason we use cardboard for packing is its a cheap and robust in the short term.


Don't be so hard on your boxes. They fair OK, I use them to store paints in.

A cardboard case seems like the kind of thing you'd just keep at home to store your extra stuff in. Have a single aluminium/plastic/wood case for going places.


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## Zartosis (Oct 20, 2010)

A lot of people seem to keep missing the point of this product.

For £35 you get a cardboard box that can take a beating, 6/8 trays capable of storing 216-448 models that will last a long time so long as you don't run it over, beat it up 24/7 or just purposefully try to destroy it.

Now lets look at the alternatives.

You would need 2 KR cardboard cases for £50 that will hold 216-400 ro pay £150+ from BF.

Like Sethis understands, for £35 you get to store a lot of models which is cheaper than other companies are providing and this is what peopel are missing and just seeing a cardboard box.

And I have mentioned that I will be expanding to luggage cases and bags at a later date as I am trying to do this without the use of crowd funding.


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## Nordicus (May 3, 2013)

Curious; Do you also manufacture travelbags to store them in?

I find cardboxes perfectly fine for transporting and protecting your models. People have a tendency to underestimate the durability they provide, so I will gladly agree that they are completely fine for the purpose. The price you ask for is quite cheap as well :good:

What most people do though, unless they just put them in the back of their car, is put them in a bag when transporting them. For example, I bike everywhere - So it's a fair bet that I would want the extra protection and easy of transport that a travelbag provides.

With a bag and those cardboxes combined, they miniatures will be completely fine unless you throw them under a damn car - In which case, nothing will help them anyway.

Keep at it mate - It looks like quality to me!


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## Zartosis (Oct 20, 2010)

Nordicus said:


> Curious; Do you also manufacture travelbags to store them in?
> 
> The price you ask for is quite cheap as well :good:


I am in the process of getting prototypes made coming in between 2-3 different bags available and one luggage type case.

And thanks!



Nordicus said:


> What most people do though, unless they just put them in the back of their car, is put them in a bag when transporting them. For example, I bike everywhere - So it's a fair bet that I would want the extra protection and easy of transport that a travelbag provides.
> 
> With a bag and those cardboxes combined, they miniatures will be completely fine unless you throw them under a damn car - In which case, nothing will help them anyway.
> 
> Keep at it mate - It looks like quality to me!


Exactly people are getting a barging for how many models they can store at these prices!

And thanks for the support! :gimmefive:


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## Zartosis (Oct 20, 2010)

Hi all,

I'd just like to thank those of you who bought my cause and many of you have bought single cases.

To celebrate changing couriers I will now be selling 2 cases for £60 in the UK giving you a further saving of £10.

So for a little over 2 KR cases (£50 216-400 models) you're getting 2 of my cases (4 KR's worth) storing 432-896 models for £60! And that price *INCLUDES* delivery!

Also you can buy each tray for £4 which *includes* delivery!

These offers runs out at the end of May and if you do the calculations are the cheapest miniature storage options around

Any questions feel free to post here.

Thanks!


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## Straken's_Fist (Aug 15, 2012)

ntaw said:


> Never heard of them.
> Millions of people eat at McDonalds but it doesn't mean they make good food.


KR are a pretty successful business (in UK at least), selling (surprise surprise!) cardboard cases like these.

Millions of people eat at McDonalds, the food may not be healthy (understatement of the year), but they are massively successful and a certain number people like it enough for it to be successful.


Sethis your review was great, thanks for that. I think this will be my go-to purchase next time, the amount it can carry and foam quality trumps it over KR for me.
As for rain - i'll just repeat what I said earlier: There is this wonderful invention called a plastic bag, which is often free at most shops, and I use this to cover the box if it is raining. Problem solved. lol


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## Old Man78 (Nov 3, 2011)

Bit of duck tape on that case your golden as far as creasing is concerned, this could be on my buy list


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## revilo44 (Sep 17, 2010)

I've not been on here a while and must have missed this thread, I am looking in to getting foam insets for the old GW cases, and I think this is quite a good idea,








The front one.
Would these fit into this kind of box,


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## Sethis (Jun 4, 2009)

Yes, they do. You can get three of them into one of the above cases, hence storing 168 infantry models.


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## Sethis (Jun 4, 2009)

Some pics now that I've actually had time to put my models into the foam from their previous storage. This is almost my entire Eldar and Marine infantry collection, and I still have a spare tray and space in a couple more.


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## Zartosis (Oct 20, 2010)

revilo44 said:


> The front one.
> Would these fit into this kind of box,


Yeah they will do.

Middle











Top












Sethis said:


> Some pics now that I've actually had time to put my models into the foam from their previous storage. This is almost my entire Eldar and Marine infantry collection, and I still have a spare tray and space in a couple more.


Very nice thanks for the pictures, looks good.

Here is a picture of someone from Warseer who bought the case.


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## Zartosis (Oct 20, 2010)

Great news people. 

I have done some tweaking with the trays and you can now fit ten 56 (previously 8) slot trays or eight 36 slot trays (previously 6) totalling the case capacity to hold 288-560 models. 

I also now have pick and pluck trays available. You have have them the size of one tray or as two trays and you can cut them in half if you wish, the depths are as follows; 
50mm (plus 5mm base) 
65mm (plus 5mm base) 
100mm (plus 5/10mm base) 
120mm (plus 5/10mm base) 
Plucks are 20x20mm 

You can mix and match all the different trays so long as they fit into the case (140mm depth) still for £35 for one case or £60 for two cases. 

I will amend the OP with the new options! And to those who recently bought a case before the tray tweaking you will get two trays of your choice for free on your next order! 

Cheers!


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## Sethis (Jun 4, 2009)

Have you done that by making the trays shallower?


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## Zartosis (Oct 20, 2010)

Yeah I halved the support base to 5mm and shaved off a few mm on the trays to fit up to 10 trays now.

I think my product current;y stores more models than the others for cheaper?


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## venomlust (Feb 9, 2010)

Are any of the cells appropriately sized for Bloodletters? Their swords are really screwy.


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## Zartosis (Oct 20, 2010)

I think they will fit the 36 slot if I make them 45-50mm deep.


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## Zartosis (Oct 20, 2010)

I'd also like to say today is the last day of the 2 cases for £60 deal and will end at 24.00 GMT. 


Thanks to all of you who bought them.


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## Zartosis (Oct 20, 2010)

Hello all just a quick update.

I will be doing a kickstarter next week or so to try and release a half case (and hopefully other products later down the line), so I thought I would show a picture (product isn't finished needs logo added etc).










Still working out the numbers but they should firmly be around the following:

UK - £22
International - £24

These prices include shipping and there will be bigger savings dependant on pledges. For those of you who buy cases you know this is a good deal 

I still need to do some more work but I thought I'd share something with you all.

Cheers!


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## Zartosis (Oct 20, 2010)

Hello everyone!

I am pleased to announce my kickstarter campaign Mantis Model Storage Case.










Hopefully with your help you will like the case and trays and possibly the stretch goals and fund them. I aim to be the cheaper solution for as many gamers as possible and offering more for less!

Please feel free to ask any questions and I will do my best to answer them.

Again thanks for reading and hopefully w can make this happen!


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