# How's this for a Chaos Khorne Lord CC Monster?



## XxDreMisterxX (Dec 23, 2009)

This setup was made because i just wanted to make the most BA Khorne lord there can be! (and because i was a little bored. lol)

This is made so that the Khorne lord can get the maximum of CC attacks and stats available to make him kick butt! 
(Criticism is very much appreciated! plz no flaming.)

Khorne Lord: all for 190pts. Total attacks: 3+1(charge)+ 1(Khorne icon)+1 (steed) =6 base, + 4-12 attacks from daemon weapon= 10-18 total! 

Mark of Khorne
Khorne Juggernaut (steed)
Daemon Weapon
Combi-melta
Melta Bomb
Personal Icon

And who else out there hates the fact that when the Lord is equiped with a Khorne steed, his unit type is infantry and not Calvary?!!?! and giving him FLeet would make him a total monster!


----------



## maddermax (May 12, 2008)

He is a monster in CC, but with severe drawbacks too  Firstly, he's walking into battle, 6in a turn. It takes a loooong time for him to get there, and he'll have a lot of trouble catching important targets in combat. Secondly, when you do get up to him, you have a 30% chance that he'll do absolutely nothing in that turn. If you've spent 3-4 turns getting into combat, then spending another turn doing nothing but hurting yourself is rather annoying.

If I were you, I'd drop the juggernaut for a bike, or wings and a transport, just to get him stuck in early, then it doesn't matter as much if your daemon weapon backfires the first time. If you really want the juggernaut, and don't mind having a powerful assault unit walking very slowly across the table, then I might suggest dropping the demon weapon for a pair of lightning claws, just to reduce the chance of being unable to do anything.

Just my 2c


----------



## XxDreMisterxX (Dec 23, 2009)

Thank you for your imput, but this wasnt ment to be used in any competitive match or used seriously, lol. I dont think i would ever field something likes this unless the rules for getting Khorne steed changed his movement to calvary so he could move 12", and also giving him Fleet and Furious Charge. Now a viable CC lord would be:
Wings, Mark of Khorne, Combi-melta, Daemon weapon, melta bomb- 175pts.
or Wings, Khorne, Pair of lightning claws, combi-melta,melta bomb- 165pts.

Or just get Kharn and stick him in a group of berserkers in a landraider. XP


----------



## Katie Drake (Nov 28, 2007)

I think this guy's biggest flaw is that he's a Chaos Lord.


----------



## XxDreMisterxX (Dec 23, 2009)

Yeah.. i just wish Chaos had a Chapter master equivalent or something when it comes to wargear.... makes taking Special characters/ Lash sorcerers less often or DP's....


----------



## Mud213 (Nov 20, 2008)

I'm in the process of converting the Fantasy Khorne Lord on Juggernaut into a Khorne lord with lightning claws. Once he's finished, I've been thinking about running him in a 16 man squad of berzerkers behind a line of rhinos/landraider. If possible, this guy will split off from his large running meatshield and take on a squad all by himself, while whoever is left from the 16 man squad will assault another target.

The lightning claws on a S5 model is a little superfluous since he's probably going to wound anyway, it makes him a more likely monsterous creature killer than most lords out there.


----------



## Cyklown (Feb 8, 2010)

Well, against t4 it's still noticable. I imagine it'd really come into it's own when someone throws plaugies at you as a tarpit.


----------



## Winterous (Mar 30, 2009)

XxDreMisterxX said:


> Yeah.. i just wish Chaos had a Chapter master equivalent or something when it comes to wargear.... makes taking Special characters/ Lash sorcerers less often or DP's....


The best solution is to make Daemon Princes 170+ points base.
They are supposed to be LEGENDARY warriors after all, but they come up much cheaper than a Hive Tyrant.


----------



## Sephyr (Jan 18, 2010)

Winterous said:


> The best solution is to make Daemon Princes 170+ points base.
> They are supposed to be LEGENDARY warriors after all, but they come up much cheaper than a Hive Tyrant.



That would leave Chaos with exactly zero competitive HQs. 

Though I'd be for bringing DPs in cost up a bit if they made the other HQ choices a bit cheaper, or just let us pay an extra to give them Eternal Warrior like Space Wolves get to.


----------



## Katie Drake (Nov 28, 2007)

Sephyr said:


> That would leave Chaos with exactly zero competitive HQs.


Which is why the other HQ choices need work too.


----------



## ninja skills (Aug 4, 2009)

I really like my khorne lord with daemon wpn and jump pack in with some raptors, he can butcher pretty much anything you send him at, i know the issue with 1's and all but it never seems to get in the way too much. 

people always go on and on and on about daemon princes, i know they are good but they are not your only option. being able to hide your lord in a unit is underated


----------



## Katie Drake (Nov 28, 2007)

ninja skills said:


> people always go on and on and on about daemon princes, i know they are good but they are not your only option. being able to hide your lord in a unit is underated


They're not your _only_ option, no. They are the best one, though.


----------



## Winterous (Mar 30, 2009)

Katie Drake said:


> Which is why the other HQ choices need work too.


Yeah, because compared to the price/effectiveness of the DP, both the Lord and the Sorcerer should cost 50/60 points.


----------



## Katie Drake (Nov 28, 2007)

Winterous said:


> Yeah, because compared to the price/effectiveness of the DP, both the Lord and the Sorcerer should cost 50/60 points.


Pretty much, yep...

Naturally the best way to fix this is to increase the cost of the Prince and such plus give the Lords and Sorcerers more options.


----------



## Winterous (Mar 30, 2009)

Katie Drake said:


> Pretty much, yep...
> 
> Naturally the best way to fix this is to increase the cost of the Prince and such plus give the Lords and Sorcerers more options.


Yes.
Like, for example, give the Lord a retinue thing, like the Command Squad, but made up of chosen who are awesomecore.
And Sorcerers just need *MOAR* powers!


----------



## Katie Drake (Nov 28, 2007)

Winterous said:


> And Sorcerers just need *MOAR* powers!


MOAR because MOAR!


----------



## Cruor99 (Mar 11, 2009)

Easy fix to the khorne lord would be something equivilant of a Wolf Standard


----------



## XxDreMisterxX (Dec 23, 2009)

Would a Chaos Sorcerer with MoT, Warptime, Gift of chaos, Terminator armor be more effective?


----------



## MyI)arkness (Jun 8, 2008)

I dont think even changing prices would change HQ thing, i was thinking of something else to take instead of DP's just because, and all the other choices are just useless even if its just 10 points. Lords and sorcerors just dont add much power to the army like HQ should, DP's do, sure khorne lord can dish out alot of dmg, but if you want best performence you need stability, and even slaanesh dp with warptime is alot more useful just because you can predict better wtf is going to happen to him.

Chaos would need something interesting in HQ choices, or make special characters do something more than be "good" at meele, each in a different way.


----------



## Winterous (Mar 30, 2009)

MyI)arkness said:


> I dont think even changing prices would change HQ thing, i was thinking of something else to take instead of DP's just because, and all the other choices are just useless even if its just 10 points. Lords and sorcerors just dont add much power to the army like HQ should, DP's do, sure khorne lord can dish out alot of dmg, but if you want best performence you need stability, and even slaanesh dp with warptime is alot more useful just because you can predict better wtf is going to happen to him.
> 
> Chaos would need something interesting in HQ choices, or make special characters do something more than be "good" at meele, each in a different way.


That's why the actual solution is to hugely increase the cost of a DP, to more suitably reflect the fact that these guys are ANCIENT WARRIORS WHOM THE CHAOS GODS HAVE A THING FOR.
And also to make Lords have some fancy ability/retinue, and Sorcerers get moar psychic powers/more useful ones.


----------



## XxDreMisterxX (Dec 23, 2009)

I do agree that Chaos lord and sorc need more work, but the Dp is super cheap for its purpose which i like.


----------



## Winterous (Mar 30, 2009)

XxDreMisterxX said:


> I do agree that Chaos lord and sorc need more work, but the Dp is super cheap for its purpose which i like.


No one else likes it, it's easily one of the (if not the) best HQ choice in the game, and doesn't cost anywhere near enough points.


----------



## MyI)arkness (Jun 8, 2008)

Winterous said:


> No one else likes it, it's easily one of the (if not the) best HQ choice in the game, and doesn't cost anywhere near enough points.


Eh i think lots of codexes nowdays got something really good really cheap, maybe it just started with new edition csm, while sm were the exception. Imo its just lash that needs a price-up.


----------



## Winterous (Mar 30, 2009)

MyI)arkness said:


> Eh i think lots of codexes nowdays got something really good really cheap, maybe it just started with new edition csm, while sm were the exception. Imo its just lash that needs a price-up.


And wings.

Hell, even stock, the thing is still underpriced.
150 points, minimum.


----------



## Sethis (Jun 4, 2009)

But hang on, the problem people are outlining is that the Lord can be instant killed by a fist, right? But if he's charging in with 10-16 attacks (or whatever) striking before the Fist with a power weapon, plus the unit he is with, unless the power fist squad is more than 10 men, he'll never get to attack your character because everyone in base contact with him will have been slaughtered. If the powerfist even survives he'll have to strike the unit and then take a leadership test on minus 7 or something. He should only have issues with S8 MCs and TH/SS Termies with their overpowered 3+ Invul.


----------



## MyI)arkness (Jun 8, 2008)

Winterous said:


> And wings.
> 
> Hell, even stock, the thing is still underpriced.
> 150 points, minimum.


well nid tyrant costs more, but flying tirant would rape any dp in majority of fights. Besides without wings dp is just a very good slow target :/


----------



## Winterous (Mar 30, 2009)

Sethis said:


> But hang on, the problem people are outlining is that the Lord can be instant killed by a fist, right? But if he's charging in with 10-16 attacks (or whatever) striking before the Fist with a power weapon, plus the unit he is with, unless the power fist squad is more than 10 men, he'll never get to attack your character because everyone in base contact with him will have been slaughtered. If the powerfist even survives he'll have to strike the unit and then take a leadership test on minus 7 or something. He should only have issues with S8 MCs and TH/SS Termies with their overpowered 3+ Invul.


That's not the problem, that contributes, but it's far from the main problem.
For an extra what, 20 points? You get a FAR better HQ choice, one which would only be 5 points more expensive if you buy your Lord a Power weapon.
The only reason to take a Lord over a Prince, if playing competitively, is to put him in a unit of something, or use a Daemon Weapon (which is still basically worse than a Prince most of the time).


----------



## Sethis (Jun 4, 2009)

Surely it depends on the job he's given?

I understand that most of the time a Daemon Prince will be better, due to MC status and all that that entails, no problem. I also recognise that he is undercosted for what he does.

However I believe that Chaos Lords can sometimes be a superior choice. In the example above, a Demon Prince would actually be in danger from a Powerfist due to 1. Not having enough attacks to kill the unit or the powerfist and 2. Probably have taken at least 1 wound due to shooting (because he can't hide in a unit, and everyone hates Daemon Princes). The Daemon Prince can also be much more reliably tar-pitted with disposable units, due to only killing ~2-3 models per turn.

I just get annoyed when people say "Oh forget about any other HQ unit - always take 2x Princes" because both of the other choices can actually be viable for a specific job you want them to do.


----------



## MyI)arkness (Jun 8, 2008)

Sethis said:


> Surely it depends on the job he's given?
> 
> I understand that most of the time a Daemon Prince will be better, due to MC status and all that that entails, no problem. I also recognise that he is undercosted for what he does.
> 
> ...


Or just kill one marine with whatever cheap means you got, send in two warptime princes and they will most likely kill the 9-8 remaining ones. Rince and repeat.


----------



## MaidenManiac (Oct 2, 2008)

Sethis said:


> Surely it depends on the job he's given?


To try to make it as clear as possible in an Eldar players eyes its like comparing Eldrad and an Autarch, with the exception that in this case "Eldrad" costs only a wee bit (say 15) more points then the equipped Autarch


The CSM Codex is not bad when talking metagaming, it is the worst one there is when talking options though.

On topic: that lord is made of lol and fail, Im sorry. He moves like infantry and wont fight at all 11/36 and suffer a wound for his failures too, and then risk getting fisted to hell. He also costs, as others have pointed out, more then a DP, which quadruples his lol and fail status:alcoholic:

If you really want to make a Khornate Chaos Lord then give him Lightning Claws. He will deal the same damage over 3 CC phases as the Daemon Weapon will on his 3, since the Daemon Weapon one wont fight 1 of them at all.


----------



## screenedwings (Mar 5, 2010)

lol, lots of atcks. :shok:


----------

