# Grey Knights in White dwarf



## revilo44 (Sep 17, 2010)

the 40k bombardment goes on 









yay gray knights (sarcasm) to be honest i couldn't care less about this,as i don't like or collect gray knights, but what do guys think? 


bonus question is it me or are people are getting tired of 40k after 40k each week?


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## Iraqiel (May 21, 2008)

Not me, love the knights, love the 40k. Definitely target audience.


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## neferhet (Oct 24, 2012)

Love 40k, despise the Knights. Ward's poster boy under steroids. Fuck 'em.
DO i read a "new codex" there??
Are they the next in line?
I hope not, i want DE...


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## Ravion (Nov 3, 2010)

Tired of 40k!? HERESY!!!unish:


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## Brother Cato (Jul 26, 2014)

neferhet said:


> Love 40k, despise the Knights. Ward's poster boy under steroids. Fuck 'em.
> DO i read a "new codex" there??
> Are they the next in line?
> I hope not, i want DE...


By all appearances, yes they are unfortunately. Which makes it three solid months of 40K, and also one of the armies I happen to be working on right now. Goddamnit, GW.

Also, the Grey Knights existed long before Ward bastardised them. Codex: Demonhunters would like a word.


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## elmir (Apr 14, 2011)

Wow, that came out of nowhere. As a demonhunter player for over a decade, I'm excited though. 

I heard rumours that they'll be removing the inquisition totally. It would be a kick in the teeth for all the powergamers who use coteaz/henchmen spam for the powerdice (remember that codex: Inquisition vehicles don't have psychic pilots). Also, in the codex: Inquisition FAQ, they removed the entry that coteaz makes henchmen act as troops... He's still a pimp in all other ways though. 

So yeah, I'm excited. And to all the grey knight haters who were touched by a GK during 5th in naughty places, I stick my middle finger up!


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## Stephen_Newman (Jul 14, 2009)

Could not care less to be honest.

I am getting rather annoyed at all this constant 40K as well. Mind you I admit bias on my part as a Brettonian player. I want my new book damnit! I've waited long enough in my eyes.


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## Brother Cato (Jul 26, 2014)

Stephen_Newman said:


> I am getting rather annoyed at all this constant 40K as well. Mind you I admit bias on my part as a Brettonian player. I want my new book damnit! I've waited long enough in my eyes.


Yes, the sooner the better. Mind if I join the que? All this 40K is kinda burning out my enthusiasm X3


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## Tanthachon25 (Apr 25, 2013)

Oh god, not a GK update. If this codex is as bad as the last I will kill myself

:suicide:


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## Tha Tall One (Aug 16, 2008)

Being some kind of Warhammer Amish, I don't care much about any new army books anymore. However, I still can't imagine why you'd want a Bretonnian army book, now of all times. With 9th ed. around the corner, who would want to be stuck in that terrible 8th edition for years, only to be updated again when 10th ed. is coming? If 9th edition is any better than 8th, I'd be much more happy to have my armybooks updated then rather than now.
Since I've started working on my 40k army an entire edition has passed with me only having a single game of Kill Team. Will 8th ed. come with christmass?


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## The Irish Commissar (Jan 31, 2012)

Ye I'm all burnt out on 40k. Never had much experience with grey knights, but when I played against them = ouch :ireful2:


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## falcoso (Apr 7, 2012)

Yeah every month for the past couple I have been expecting fantasy stuff, I don't like the new release schedule since it went to weekly, because everything becomes drip fed so the excitement disappears from it, I mean when Orks came about I thought great this is going to be really nice, but everything came through so slowly so that by the time the codex appeared I couldn't care less. Heck I remmeber the old days when there were a couple fo months between updates, which made every new update incredibly exciting for me.


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## MidnightSun (Feb 10, 2009)

I don't have a real beef with the new release schedule if I don't keep up to date with it - it's not like I'm going to fight most of these armies anyway, and it leads to some interesting situations when I deploy against someone using a book I've never seen before.

The main cause of 40k fatigue for me is when I keep up to date with the rumours and know the stats for every single unit in the game, at which point I get bored. Tuning out of the rumour mill usually makes things a bit better for me.


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## Serpion5 (Mar 19, 2010)

I don't care about the constant 40k, since it's all I play anyway. 

It is the bulk of their revenue, and if that means they prioritize it then oh well, that's just how it is. 

If it means I get my nice new necron codex sooner than I normally would then great.


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## Sethis (Jun 4, 2009)

Don't get all upset, it's basically exactly the same codex with the Inquisition removed as well as any unit entry they don't have a model for. Other than that, it's the same codex copy/pasted.

Not really bothered tbh. At some point I might do a GK army, specially since they seem to be trying hard to lose the "cheese" factor associated with certain armies by fixing problems they've had since 5th (i.e. removing Air Cav from IG as an option, removing Nobz spam, fixing Grey Hunters etc). As far as I'm concerned, getting rid of "power builds" and "must have" units like Coteaz is only a good thing.


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## whittsy (Feb 8, 2013)

I'm just getting sick of the constant fucking space marine updates. We get it. There are other teams out there though.


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## fatmantis (Jun 26, 2009)

MidnightSun said:


> I don't have a real beef with the new release schedule if I don't keep up to date with it - it's not like I'm going to fight most of these armies anyway, and it leads to some interesting situations when I deploy against someone using a book I've never seen before.
> 
> The main cause of 40k fatigue for me is when I keep up to date with the rumors and know the stats for every single unit in the game, at which point I get bored. Tuning out of the rumor mill usually makes things a bit better for me.


i totally agree with this...just take it as it comes..when it comes and the excitement is still there..

its funny reading the comment here...all the complain about the release schedule..ha last year everybody complain about not enough content....

no it we want warhammer...well theres only 3 codex left for 40k..then they all complain too much warhammer...

people will complaion if there ass is on fire and if you piss on them to put it out..

its no wonder GW doesnt use social media


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## OIIIIIIO (Dec 16, 2009)

The BA need updated too ... fuck the other factions ... I want my book to not suck a bag of dicks. Now that Ward is gone I hope that Kelly hooks me up with 10 point Marines with JP and 3+fnp.


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## ntaw (Jul 20, 2012)

whittsy said:


> I'm just getting sick of the constant fucking space marine updates. We get it. There are other teams out there though.


There's four armies left to update, two of which are Imperium (GK and BA) and two of which are Xenos (Necrons and DE). Pretty straight up split, and this is the first two-in-a-row release for the Imperium that I can recall since 6th hit. Unless you're talking about LotR or WFB...then yeah. I get it.

I'm stoked. One more Codex closer to a BA update.


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## Ravion (Nov 3, 2010)

whittsy said:


> I'm just getting sick of the constant fucking space marine updates. We get it. There are other teams out there though.


Space marines are the bread and butter of GW. If they are going to release new codexes Imperium aligned codexes will take priority. If they keep releasing a codex a month then we should see the xenos books soon so keep your panties on.


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## Vaz (Mar 19, 2008)

whittsy said:


> I'm just getting sick of the constant fucking space marine updates. We get it. There are other teams out there though.


Like... Orks? You mean? That 7th edition book I imagined then? Or Nids? Or Tau? Or Eldar? Yeah, fuck GW for not touching xenos and focussing on 5th edition books, when there are 6th edition xenos armies which haven't been updated for a full fucking year.

Scrubs.


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## mrknify (May 15, 2014)

Ravion said:


> Space marines are the bread and butter of GW. If they are going to release new codexes Imperium aligned codexes will take priority. If they keep releasing a codex a month then we should see the xenos books soon so keep your panties on.





Vaz said:


> Like... Orks? You mean? That 7th edition book I imagined then? Or Nids? Or Tau? Or Eldar? Yeah, fuck GW for not touching xenos and focussing on 5th edition books, when there are 6th edition xenos armies which haven't been updated for a full fucking year.
> 
> Scrubs.


Oh I don't know my BA still shames other lists and its the oldest. Wonder if they will giv it the same treatment like last time. Split the codex in 2 white dwarfs. That was so fun.

Right now rumours sustaining, GK DE BA.... with whatever magical fluff between.


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## Orochi (Jan 28, 2009)

Ward deciding Draigo is a bit short in the attack count department.

I've never had a good time playing either with or against Grey Knights. Boring armies to play. 
I get the concept of them, and understand the angle they are going for. But ultimately, playing a 2k game against 14 models just isn't fun.


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## revilo44 (Sep 17, 2010)

> via an anonymous source on Faeit 212
> All Pre-Orders August 16th
> Release Date August 23rd
> 
> ...


Don't know why they would do. A reboxing of ALL of the kits but this makes more sense











And Wow 22 comments already I only put the thread up yesterday


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## MidnightSun (Feb 10, 2009)

OIIIIIIO said:


> The BA need updated too ... fuck the other factions ... I want my book to not suck a bag of dicks. Now that Ward is gone I hope that Kelly hooks me up with 10 point Marines with JP and 3+fnp.


Kelly will write you a book that will be really good for it's one release month, but then it'll fall into a monobuild after six weeks. Most of the Kelly books are really badly internally balanced, with really really obvious choices in each slot.

Ward will write you a book that has horrendous fluff (so... go read Black Library instead), and it might not necessarily be an all-star at release but it will have longevity. 5th ed Marines stayed playable almost up until their 6th ed book. Can you say the same about Dark Eldar? (I will admit Dark Eldar suffered from the 6th/7th ed ruleset, but the point stands).

And then there's Cruddace and Vetock... not sure about Vetock yet, but Cruddace is pretty terrible.


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## Nordicus (May 3, 2013)

MidnightSun said:


> Ward will write you a book that has horrendous fluff


Not a problem anymore as he seems to have left GW in May '14 according to his Linkedin profile.


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## Archon Grimherald (Apr 10, 2014)

i think the reason they are churning out 40k is how old some of the codexs are. From my LIMITED i repeat LIMITED understanding most of the fantasy codexes are only one editon behind the main not two in the case of 40k so this could just be a case of catch up. and now one of my friends wives will be pissed cus he runs the gay knights and now has to buy a new codex...god i couldnt marry a woman who hates any game not made by milton bradley


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## bitsandkits (Mar 18, 2008)

Lol GW really cant win can they , we used to hear " come GW you take too long to release new codex/models for *insert 40k faction* " now its "oh GW you are releasing too much for 40k" 

GW Gamers wanting the opposite since 75


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## elmir (Apr 14, 2011)

Vaz said:


> Like... Orks? You mean? That 7th edition book I imagined then? Or Nids? Or Tau? Or Eldar? Yeah, fuck GW for not touching xenos and focussing on 5th edition books, when there are 6th edition xenos armies which haven't been updated for a full fucking year.
> 
> Scrubs.


Exactly. We've just seen over a month of none stop ork releases... ONE BOOK is all the "release" the GKs are getting. The rest is just repackaging. And yet still there's people mindlessly droning on that GW only does space marines. 

Some people just have a really short memory I guess. 

Just BA, necrons and DE left now with a softcover? Or am I missing one (besides sisters, trololol)


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## Nordicus (May 3, 2013)

elmir said:


> Just BA, necrons and DE left now with a softcover? Or am I missing one (besides sisters, trololol)


Nope, I think that's all of them. After this, they will most likely update the current 6th edition armies so all of them get unique tactical cards etc.

I wouldn't be surprised if they turned up the speed of getting these out. It's a bit embarrassing to have 5th edition codexes right now after all. I think it's a good sign that they are upping the ante on this issue


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## elmir (Apr 14, 2011)

Nordicus said:


> Nope, I think that's all of them. After this, they will most likely update the current 6th edition armies so all of them get unique tactical cards etc.
> 
> I wouldn't be surprised if they turned up the speed of getting these out. It's a bit embarrassing to have 5th edition codexes right now after all. I think it's a good sign that they are upping the ante on this issue


Well, I hear people say embarrasing to still have a 5th edition codex. But at the same time, that's like what? 4-5 years ago max (except for BA). 6th was only a brief moment in time that lasted 2 years. 

It's still impressive that they are churning them out so quickly, but I do hope 7th and their codexes will last a bit longer and that the quick release pace will slow down (with maybe the odd new model/dataslate in between).


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## Nordicus (May 3, 2013)

elmir said:


> but I do hope 7th and their codexes will last a bit longer and that the quick release pace will slow down (with maybe the odd new model/dataslate in between).


Personally I think the armies will go over more to a sporadic update and dataslates after everyone is updated to 7th (Where everyone have their own tactical cards etc). It seems to be the way things are going.

Solely my own opinion though


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## Vaz (Mar 19, 2008)

Yay, Microtransactions!


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## MidnightSun (Feb 10, 2009)

Nordicus said:


> Not a problem anymore as he seems to have left GW in May '14 according to his Linkedin profile.


But it was never really a problem, because the fluff is entirely mutable and you could ignore all the crap in the codexes anyway. Besides, Ward was far from the only one doing shitty stuff with fluff.

And yes, I know he's gone know, and I'm sad about it because he was one of the few actual RULES writers GW had worth a damn.


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## mrknify (May 15, 2014)

http://southmsgamers.blogspot.ca/2014/08/40k-incoming-upcoming-grey-knights.html?m=1
UPCOMING RELEASES:
GREY KNIGHTS CODEX & UNITS,

SPACE WOLVES and BLACK LIBRARY


All Pre-Orders August 16th
Release Date August 23rd

Sanctus Reach
Sanctus Reach: Hour of the Wolf $49.50 Hardback

Space Wolves
Warriors of the Fang $170 Plastic box
Space Wolves Skyclaws $37 Plastic box
Space Wolves Long Fangs $37 Plastic box

Grey Knights
Codex: Grey Knights $49.50 Hardback
Codex: Grey Knights (limited edition) $110 Hardback Book (web only)
Datacards: Grey Knights $8 Cards
Grey Knights Purifier Squad $33 Plastic box
Grey Knights Strike Squad $60 Plastic box
Grey Knights Paladin Squad $50 Plastic box
Grey Knights Nemesis Dreadknight $53.75 Plastic box
Grey Knights Land Raider $74.25 Plastic box
Grey Knights Venerable Dreadnought $46.30 Plastic box
Grey Knights Stormraven Gunship $82.50 Plastic box

Black Library
Horus Heresy: Horus Rising $9.99 Novel
Grey Knights Omnibus $17.50 Novel
Sanctus Reach: Blood on the Mountain $24 Novel
Sanctus Reach: Volume 2 $90 other book (web only)

Grey Knights Datacards
Grey Knights will be reboxed as Purifiers
GK terminators reboxed as Palidins
Specific GREY KNIGHTS LAND RAIDER
Specific GREY KNIGHTS VENERABLE DREADNOUGHT
Specific GREY KNIGHTS STORMRAVEN GUNSHIP

This is all right from the order form. Everything will be out at the same time AUGUST 23.
(Pre-order AUGUST 16)


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## the_barwn (Jul 23, 2011)

MidnightSun said:


> But it was never really a problem, because the fluff is entirely mutable and you could ignore all the crap in the codexes anyway. Besides, Ward was far from the only one doing shitty stuff with fluff.
> 
> And yes, I know he's gone know, and I'm sad about it because he was one of the few actual RULES writers GW had worth a damn.



I have a suspicion that this is why we have 7th edition now because Ward left in May 14, GW wanted to replace all the work with his name on or the rules that he appeared in. It does look like a douche move by GW but if we can get good rules & good fluff that would be a big bonus

:good:


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## revilo44 (Sep 17, 2010)

mrknify said:


> http://southmsgamers.blogspot.ca/2014/08/40k-incoming-upcoming-grey-knights.html?m=1
> UPCOMING RELEASES:
> GREY KNIGHTS CODEX & UNITS,
> 
> ...


great job on finding this rumor dude, but i think i posted it a page back 




Nordicus said:


> Not a problem anymore as he seems to have left GW in May '14 according to his Linkedin profile.


WAIT WHAT :shok::shok::shok:



Archon Grimherald said:


> i think the reason they are churning out 40k is how old some of the codexs are. From my LIMITED i repeat LIMITED understanding most of the fantasy codexes are only one editon behind the main not two in the case of 40k so this could just be a case of catch up. and now one of my friends wives will be pissed cus he runs the gay knights and now has to buy a new codex...god i couldnt marry a woman who hates any game not made by milton bradley


brets are like the sisters of fantasy, untouched and left alone for ages, i think they have a book in 5th/6th edition, and they only gay if paint them in a rainbow colour scheme,have psychic manbags, there gun shoot flowers and there battle cry is "I Am What I Am" :victory::grin:


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## falcoso (Apr 7, 2012)

bitsandkits said:


> Lol GW really cant win can they , we used to hear " come GW you take too long to release new codex/models for *insert 40k faction* " now its "oh GW you are releasing too much for 40k"
> 
> GW Gamers wanting the opposite since 75


I think personally the best release schedule was the start of 6th when it was a 3 month cycle including a 40k and fantasy book, now it just all seems to merge into each other.



Nordicus said:


> Not a problem anymore as he seems to have left GW in May '14 according to his Linkedin profile.


How come he left? I never even realised.


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## Vaz (Mar 19, 2008)

Mat Ward made good rules.

Unbalanced compared to those written by others, but internally? They were pretty well balanced (Fantasy 8th edition magic, notwithstanding - and that's more down to how some unupdated armies were able to capitalise on the radically different mechanic), with several options. Purifiers, Coteaz, Paladins were all fairly well done. Some options are clearly better than others (I never saw Interceptors, but that was down to the core mechanics, more than anything).

His fluff writing (or his approval of said fluff before some clever cunt comes in and says "he may not have written all of it) reads like a 13 year old hyper on sugar so much they can taste colours - which funnily enough is their target audience - which oddly enough, as older sarcastic gamers, seem to put on the newer younger up and coming gamers.


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## Creon (Mar 5, 2009)

I am wondering what a Grey Knights Land Raider is. No other Marine Faction has it's own boxed Land Raider. Is this a new model with Psycannons? I hope so.


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## MidnightSun (Feb 10, 2009)

Creon said:


> I am wondering what a Grey Knights Land Raider is. No other Marine Faction has it's own boxed Land Raider. Is this a new model with Psycannons? I hope so.


The cynical part of me wants to say it's the standard Land Raider kit with the GK doors from the Stormraven.


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## scscofield (May 23, 2011)

Could just be a reboxing of LR kit with GK on it. Pushing for the new art boxes that have the mainly dark background.


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## psactionman (Jul 1, 2012)

falcoso said:


> I think personally the best release schedule was the start of 6th when it was a 3 month cycle including a 40k and fantasy book, now it just all seems to merge into each other


You will have to forgive me as I am about to rant to a lot of people and not just you. Your post was simply the easiest to start from. So, this is not all pointed at you as an FYI. 

Why is anyone whining about fast releases? Everyone wants new stuff, especially when they have none. Do yourself, and the rest of us, a favor and step out of your own selfish bubble and realize that old army books suck. Using an old army book because you have no choice, also sucks. But we all love the game, so we all deal with the crappy books until a new one comes out. Ignoring the 7th edition scenario, a fluke at best, why should anyone have to wait 4.5 years (unless my count is wrong there are 18 codexes, at 3 months a book that is 4.5 years before the unlucky guy gets his codex). Meanwhile, everyone else is enjoying new models, new rules, and kicking his teeth in because his choices are; be made fun of for playing a broken codex, or get made fun of for selling his soul to play one of the nice new codexes. Why as a business, and as a fellow player, would you wish that upon someone!?? I am a Dark Angels/Space Wolf player, and before the new codex came out I wasn't able to play my wolves a lot because they were just not as effective as my Dark Angels (contrary to popular belief DA are not a lesser codex, they are just played wrong by a majority of people). 

If I had my way, Day 1 I could go get a new rulebook and 3 codexes, then buy new models as I can afford them. That way the 3 month release schedule could make sense, with the new content being data slates, formations, supplements, etc... Everyone has a level playing field day 1, then fluff and just plain awesome stuff came out after that. Too much all at once? Really? How many of you play EVERY SINGLE ARMY GW OFFERS? I can guarantee only like 2 of us, at best. Since you don't have to worry about new rules for anyone except what you are playing the fast release doesn't actually affect you, but makes others happy. I can't wait for my friend to get his BA codex because I empathize with him paying way too much for a Librarian. 

"But what about when I fight armies I don't play? If we are getting all this new stuff so fast how can I keep up with them?" You won't have to, because they have no idea what they are doing yet, it's so new! Whenever I fight a new army I check out tactics articles about them. Then, I at least have an idea of what I am looking at and plan accordingly. "What, what? Tactics are for playing that army not fighting them." Not always. By utilizing tools you already have you can better know what is out there without spending the time analyzing everything about them first. Let someone else do that, then use their conclusions. There is no reason we should have to wait for the core rules of our faction to be released, and there is no reason you as players should ask for it either.

And to the guy whining about Imperium releases: do me a favor and cram it. Of those 18 codexes 10 are Imperium. There is eventually going to be two in a row, it is a mathematical certainty. As a Dark Angel player my book is not the same as Space Wolves, and the two are not interchangeable. But making the claim that all Imperium players are the same is rude and short sided. When they release a stream of crap from the same book over two months you can complain. Until then, just keep in mind that the Space Wolves release did not make the Grey knights players happy, and the Grey Knights release does nothing for Blood Angels players.


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## mrknify (May 15, 2014)

revilo44 said:


> Don't know why they would do. A reboxing of ALL of the kits but this makes more sense
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yes you did, my bad. 
There was some additional info for black library release on the one I posted.

At least we have a speculative date for this months madness to end.


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## Creon (Mar 5, 2009)

scscofield said:


> Could just be a reboxing of LR kit with GK on it. Pushing for the new art boxes that have the mainly dark background.


Still, it's probably a LR with GK/]I[ markings, yes. But I can hope! Psycannons and purging flames!


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## mayegelt (Mar 18, 2014)

Maybe the Land Raider will have Heavy Incinerators on top and twin or quad linked (or just a heavier version) of PsyCannons on the side.

What I am wondering is as they seem to want to put a £50-100 knight / stompa model in every army now what will the Grey Knight one be.


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## bitsandkits (Mar 18, 2008)

mrknify said:


> http://southmsgamers.blogspot.ca/2014/08/40k-incoming-upcoming-grey-knights.html?m=1
> UPCOMING RELEASES:
> GREY KNIGHTS CODEX & UNITS,
> 
> ...


this seems to buck the trend of late, this seems like an awful lot of product to pump out in one week? plus if genuine skyclaws and long fangs would be new? the specific grey knight kit could just be normal kits with additional sprues?? like i say seems like alot of "new" for one week? why not release the space wolf stuff this week and hold on and do the grey knight stuff the following week?


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## Nordicus (May 3, 2013)

falcoso said:


> How come he left? I never even realised.


No clue, all I can see is the position was stated as finished in May this year. I haven't been able to find any statements or the like as to why.


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## elmir (Apr 14, 2011)

It doesn't look like there's enough GK stuff to last a few weeks. 

Also, isn't there rumours that the GKs are getting tied in with some santus reach stuff? There was chitter about a mini demon release soon too... so that might explain why they quickly updated GKs?


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## mrknify (May 15, 2014)

elmir said:


> It doesn't look like there's enough GK stuff to last a few weeks.
> 
> Also, isn't there rumours that the GKs are getting tied in with some santus reach stuff? There was chitter about a mini demon release soon too... so that might explain why they quickly updated GKs?


I am sure some data slates or a mini dex... because it more important to rush this to get out BA and DE before christmas.


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## revilo44 (Sep 17, 2010)

anyway


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## Zerodyme619 (Jul 1, 2011)

Damn! That cover lookes ace!
Man, I haven't even gotten all the SpaceWolves stuff that I want. And I was actually planning on eating quite regularly for the rest of the month >_<
Damn it GW, my wallet is crying...


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## Archon Grimherald (Apr 10, 2014)

As much as I dislike the grey knights because of the changes to shakers I have to say that cover work looks good


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## fatmantis (Jun 26, 2009)

this thread actually makes me a little angry...see this is the reason we cant have a social media connection with GW...waa waa this waa waa that..GW cant win...people in this hobby is the hobbies worst enemy!

people in the world should be grateful for what the have and be even more grateful they get anything at all!


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## mrknify (May 15, 2014)

fatmantis said:


> this thread actually makes me a little angry...see this is the reason we cant have a social media connection with GW...waa waa this waa waa that..GW cant win...people in this hobby is the hobbies worst enemy!
> 
> people in the world should be grateful for what the have and be even more grateful they get anything at all!


Grateful? What that gw prices are based off of British disposable income. Minimum wage there, is well very high in comparison to north american income.

Besides, its not the guys that want to voice their opinion its the guys that can not handle other peoples opinion.

Of course this is just my opinion

Cheers. 

Ps I may bitch about prices (though they are getting more.... well the packages are cool) but I still love to hobby.


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## fatmantis (Jun 26, 2009)

mrknify said:


> Grateful? What that gw prices are based off of British disposable income. Minimum wage there, is well very high in comparison to north american income.
> 
> Besides, its not the guys that want to voice their opinion its the guys that can not handle other peoples opinion.
> 
> ...


you are correct...everybody is entitled to their opinion....but the price is the price regardless of who.what.or where...people need to stop harping on about it..deal with it or leave it..same goes with the codex issues...what is the point in a broken record..
i love the hobby.. i would love to be able to interact with GW but as i said people can stop the constant bitching hence why we dont have that connection any more...

and as for grateful...yes we should be grateful...there are people in this world that cant afford to eat..buy cloths medical care..and we bitch about the price of a piece of plastic...so yeah be greatful..


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## mrknify (May 15, 2014)

fatmantis said:


> you are correct...everybody is entitled to their opinion....but the price is the price regardless of who.what.or where...people need to stop harping on about it..deal with it or leave it..same goes with the codex issues...what is the point in a broken record..
> i love the hobby.. i would love to be able to interact with GW but as i said people can stop the constant bitching hence why we dont have that connection any more...
> 
> and as for grateful...yes we should be grateful...there are people in this world that cant afford to eat..buy cloths medical care..and we bitch about the price of a piece of plastic...so yeah be greatful..


Very true. Not having food does really suck.


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## Kreuger (Aug 30, 2010)

It's also worth remembering that almost any publicity is good publicity.

People bitch about price, but the entire time they're bitching about price they are thinking about, talking about, and devoting time to Games Workshop. 

I find it fascinating that high prices keep some gamers more engaged than just played games might.


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## elmir (Apr 14, 2011)

Well... I do fully get where the frustration comes from for a lot of the Old daemonhunter players though. Let me show you what GW has done with this army over the past 10 years for people who started out with them in their earliest days: 

Codex: Daemonhunters

Inquisition:was there, only ordo malleus was an option though (there was nothing for ordo xenos and ordo hereticus was in codex:witchhunters). You could take henchmen back in those days, so no probs there. 

Assassins: were in there. All 4 of them in the book, but you needed an inquisitor to "unlock them"

Grey knights: were in there. Psycannons were pure infantry killers (no S7rending wonders we know today). If you did go full GK infantry, you'd have ZERO anti-tank troops in your army. Hell, there was even a paragraph in the book in army selection that discouraged newer players from taking this type of force (saying you'd definatly need the emperors blessing to pull it off). 

Inquisitorial stormtroopers: remember those guys? That was for the people who didn't want to run GKs or wanted to play a radical inquisitor playstyle. Half of your wargear was not allowed if you played with GK infantry, it really was a bad case of "take this to unlock this" and "avoid this to allow this". 

Inducted troops: To flesh out the codex a bit, daemonhunter players were allowed to use some entries from imperial guard and space marines. Many took this option, it was all in one book (mind you, they did reference to the "parent codex" to select them). It was your only decent source of getting some much needed anti-tank options really... 

Codex Grey knights: 

Scratch the inducted troops and inquisitorial stormtroopers. This was also in the days that allies was not a thing... Effectively scrapping over half of my models. I still have 20 painted kasrkin troops standing around and around 40 IG veterans with a leman russ that were just plain unusable. 

If you say: "well, you could still use them as IG, so no worries". There is a HUGE difference in playing a large, fully painted 2500p army on a regular basis, to then be told that you now own 2 small ones in a pointscale that your regular opponents never play. 

Luckily, you got acces to ordo Xenos and ordo Hereticus inquisition, along with a decent fleshing out of the grey knight section. Still annoyed that there weren't any bikes added though (how much more "knight" can you get than riding your iron steed). Your assasins are still in. 

New Codex Grey knights: 

Inquisition: GONE, assassins: GONE. All that remains is GK stuff (and that really isn't a lot, I'll do a quick overview in the end). 

In order to potentially play an army that you collected over 10 years ago, players now have to buy: 

-Codex: Grey knights
-Codex: inquisition
-Codex: astra militarum/tempestus (depending on what you want). 
-Codex: Space marines
-Dataslates: Assassins (lord knows they'll try to sell you all 4)

So... you can understand why a few older players have their jimmies rustled. I don't think there has been any army so far that has had such dramatic changes to what you could and couldn't field in one source as the old codex: Daemonhunters. 

Also, if no new stuff is added, this is the amount of choices GK players will have in each slot: 

HQ: 7 (down from 14)
Elites: 4 (down from 9)
Troops: 2 (same as before, but without Thawn as an option), lowest option possible?
Fast attack: 2 (same as before), lowest option possible?
Heavy support: 6 (same as before). 

Grey knights already felt "spammy" before they cut out all those option. I'm afraid that won't get any better under these conditions. They'll also feel more powerwhore like for being forced to take so many different sources just to play with your old models. 



TLDR: It's been a long essay, but in response to the "just be happy you are getting something" attitude, some GK players really do have a more than good reason to be slightly upset at yet another splitting up of their army.


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## revilo44 (Sep 17, 2010)

Guys. Could we just stop bitching at each other. We all our own options and don't think they gonna change, yes I agree it's got worse for older player now that GK is just GK now and I agree the that the deamonhunter was brill, however at the end of the day GW is company and they want to make money (all company wants this) and I don't think we gonna go back that now. 

So would u rather have expansive metal models (cough sisters cough) or would like to have new plastic figures with there OWN dex. Tbh I like the last option as I could do a Inquisitorial army by allying the codex inquisition and dex Astra Milltarum and I'd be happy with that. 

So let's just leave it there. 



And look at the reboxing of Gray knights kits 









And a assassin dataslate (how did u know @elmir)











Enjoy


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## elmir (Apr 14, 2011)

revilo44 said:


> And a assassin dataslate (how did u know @elmir)


I play grey knights... Don't you know we are psychic?


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## Asamodai (Oct 19, 2008)

First thing I'm noticing is separate boxes for Strike Squads and Purifiers. That must mean they're adding something new or wouldn't you just get the 10 man Strike Squad and paint their helmets white?


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## Breaman (Jul 21, 2014)

I'm always excited when we get new models, regardless of the army. Just means more bits to play with. I do think they've been a little 40k heavy as of late, but it's been said a couple of times here that 40k is their bread and butter. I haven't followed the time lines as closley as some of the you here, but I feel like they're trying to role out all of the armies to 7th as quickly as they can. I would love to play fantasy again, but there's no one in my area that plays. All that being said, I'm always excited for new models, it's what's kept me in this hobby for so long!


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## revilo44 (Sep 17, 2010)

More pictures if anyone is interested 





























This seems to right as the fantasy stuff is coming out and these is just a book and rexboxing.


> via Steve the Warboss on Faeit 212
> Only 1 Week for GK, no other releases for them.


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## elmir (Apr 14, 2011)

Pre-orders for the grey knights are up. 

Well, the codex, the cards (with a whooping 6 new cards in there!!, the rest is just copy paste) and the dataslates. 

This has to be the least impressive army release ever. In order for me to play with all my old models, I would have to buy a $50 codex, a $25 codex and a $20 dataslate... all previously in one $33 book... *sigh*

But GW keeps droning on that they are a model company, not a rules company. This is disappointing to say the least.


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

How do we know that this is the only release week for GK? Maybe they are just releasing the codex first (which is what EVERYONE wanted anyway)


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## Nordicus (May 3, 2013)

Einherjar667 said:


> Maybe they are just releasing the codex first (which is what EVERYONE wanted anyway)


So much this.


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## elmir (Apr 14, 2011)

everything is pointing towards only this. The new codex will include no new units, I dare put money on that...


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

I'd sill wait and see. No rumors on new units, sure, but this whole rumor way of announcing new models usually wishy washy anyway


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## elmir (Apr 14, 2011)

Don't think so. Apparently, the devs already said in WD that they intend GKs to work more as an allied force, or a standalone force that needs some help from allies to really become powerfull. 

So they are just going to go back to the way it was in codex: Daemonhunters in a way. Missing serious anti-tank firepower or scoring bodies that you'll have to grab from other codexes. 

They might still add the odd dataslate later on, but I doubt there will be unit entries in the codex that "mysteriously" have no models yet released. That got them into the legal pile of horse manure they got into recently... Ironically, one of the few mistakes GW has learned from...


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

Jeez, as fun as conversions are, a Mordrak model would have been cool.


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## Reaper45 (Jun 21, 2011)

elmir said:


> Don't think so. Apparently, the devs already said in WD that they intend GKs to work more as an allied force, or a standalone force that needs some help from allies to really become powerfull.
> 
> So they are just going to go back to the way it was in codex: Daemonhunters in a way. Missing serious anti-tank firepower or scoring bodies that you'll have to grab from other codexes.
> 
> They might still add the odd dataslate later on, but I doubt there will be unit entries in the codex that "mysteriously" have no models yet released. That got them into the legal pile of horse manure they got into recently... Ironically, one of the few mistakes GW has learned from...


So instead of the Mary sue mess that ward created it's going to be awesome again?


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## Nordicus (May 3, 2013)

Was just about to say that, fluffwise it makes sense. Of course I realize it sucks for those that play the army as a primary, who are used to them being a 100% stand-alone army so you have my sympathies.

But considering their nature, their elite-of-the-elite status and the way the inquisition has been laid out in their supplement, it makes sense for the Inquisition, Adeptas Sororitas and Grey Knights to all be sorta-mini codexes meant for allying.

Interesting route - To me it's both good and bad. Good as I think it gives the army some flavor and bad for those who were expecting a ton of new models.


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

Granted, the existing GK models and units are pretty damn cool.


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## elmir (Apr 14, 2011)

Reaper45 said:


> So instead of the Mary sue mess that ward created it's going to be awesome again?


If you would consider it awesome if the models you worked on all this time suddenly got split into several different source... "They are not losing half of their Codex, you are gaining the opportunity to buy that separately"

BTW, what Mary Sue stuff was it exactly that Ward created? I know bitching about Ward is the really recent hot thing to do right now ( :laugh: ), but if having a Ward codex means that you would have to trade in a bit of bad fluff (Black library does it better anyway) for superdecent rules in your codex that allows for several builds where you don't deliberately gimp yourself for choosing something other than the OP unit in each slot... I'll have a Ward codex any day. 

What's the alternatives... Having Cruddace screw it up completely and leaving you with nothing? Or having Phil Kelly do it, which means a codex where even the dumbest tactician can fingerpoint the OP unit in each slot. Don't forget that right now, it's the allmighty Phil Kelly's brainchild that is almost half on the top tables in tournaments with his Eldar BS. 

So really, what's so awesome?

The new Cut-Copy-Paste codex format they are trying now?


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

How do we know that this new codex is copy and paste? How do we even know what's in it? All I have seen is a picture of the front cover.


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## elmir (Apr 14, 2011)

Well, because of a massive cock-up of biblical proportions, parts of the GK armybuilder files were included in the digital release of the SW codex... 

Now... Unless they are actually able to send all their books back to the press to have the things changed in there, that's a pretty massive leak and pretty... well... final. That's where you can read that teleporting dreadknights with 2 heavy incinerators and a personal teleporter will clock in @200 points etc. 

Now it may still be one elaborate hoax... But if it is, it sure as hell would be a good one! We'll know in 5 days now. k:

http://astropate.blogspot.co.uk/2014/08/nuovi-cavalieri-grigi-lista.html If you want to have a look at those pictures. 

http://www.belloflostsouls.net/2014/08/40k-you-got-your-grey-knights-in-my.html for the story about the big cock-up. 

Mind you, this may all still not be the final version. All of it remains to be seen on this saturday to come. But as it stands right now, I'm not really all that hopeful. It's the first time something like this happened... It would be the oddest way yet for GW to cause "leaks" to happen


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

Yikes! I wasn't aware of that. That's pretty odd. I thought you were just assuming it was going to be copy and paste.

However if this was a planned leak, it might omit new units, but, sounds like it's just a major goof up.


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## elmir (Apr 14, 2011)

Yeap. None of it is set in stone ofcourse... But this is about the fishiest leak we've had in ages... 

I mean. This is a digital leak 2 weeks before the pre-orders go up? It could ofcourse be a very, very old and outdated version of the rules that accidentally slipped in. But given that the printed versions of books are usually done months prior to release, I don't have high hopes for it.


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

It does sort of seem like GK is going to be a one week deal, with a bunch of repackaging. But, it still seems odd to me. If this were going to be such a brief release, why not just make it digital only like Codex: Inquisition? 

but, with the Nagash rumor fleshing out, it does look like that is going to be ringing up the rear the following week.


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## elmir (Apr 14, 2011)

Well... they can do that to inquisition. Same with assassins. 

But Grey knights was an actual codex. A completely stand alone army in 5th before all this allies things broke out and them not caring that you need to buy 3 books to field your old army. 

But you are 100% right that this "release" almost doesn't warrant a hard cover book. It's slightly outrageous. I play this army as my main army... I'm generally positive about what GW does. But this is just a downright dirty move they pulled. They demoted a previously fleshed out codex to something that's almost "doomed" to become a consideration for allies... and that's about it. 

If you are not a GK player, you might find it hard to empathise. But just imagine that they removed all Stormtroopers from the full IG book... And then stuck them in codex: Militarum Tempestus. 

Can you still field them? Sure... Is it cool that all imperial players would have acces to stormtroopers now? Sure... Would it be a dick move to pull on al IG players? Hell yes! You'd have to buy several books to keep playing with your old army.


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## Einherjar667 (Aug 23, 2013)

I don't play GK, but I am a fan. I like the idea of an elite army being all inclusive, and not needing anything added on. I do try to be positive about GWs moves as well. I can't help but feel like they are moving up a lot of 40k releases to get them finished up so they can move on to the 7th ed books. Though that shouldn't come with any sacrifices :\

I was looking forward to seeing GKs expanded on, new units, and perhaps a model for Mordrak and Ghost Knights.


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## Reaper45 (Jun 21, 2011)

elmir said:


> If you would consider it awesome if the models you worked on all this time suddenly got split into several different source... "They are not losing half of their Codex, you are gaining the opportunity to buy that separately"
> 
> BTW, what Mary Sue stuff was it exactly that Ward created? I know bitching about Ward is the really recent hot thing to do right now ( :laugh: ), but if having a Ward codex means that you would have to trade in a bit of bad fluff (Black library does it better anyway) for superdecent rules in your codex that allows for several builds where you don't deliberately gimp yourself for choosing something other than the OP unit in each slot... I'll have a Ward codex any day.
> 
> ...


I'm not getting into a tactic debate with you, I've seen most of the new books play the only reason why Eldar is such a powerful book is because the players understand their book and their opponents book extremely well. 

Greyknights have plenty of broken builds and personally they feel like they should be a support force that compliments a players army.


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## elmir (Apr 14, 2011)

Reaper45 said:


> I'm not getting into a tactic debate with you, I've seen most of the new books play the only reason why Eldar is such a powerful book is because the players understand their book and their opponents book extremely well.
> 
> Greyknights have plenty of broken builds and personally they feel like they should be a support force that compliments a players army.


Yeah, cute... Eldar really aren't too bad. It's all their players who are magically better than all the rest. Just like GKs were at the end of 5th. Just plain magically better!

It has nothing to do with the fact that their 130-140 point transports shoot harder than most battletanks of other armies. It has nothing to do with a damn near invincible seerstar. Wraithknights are also just fine k:


I'm sure that all those eldar players were just "on vacation" when their old dex was there, and then just showed up out of nowhere again when the new book hit. 

This is the top ten of the last ATC tourney: 

Top Ten
4x Eldar
3x Imperial Knights
1x Dark Eldar
1x Grey Knights
1x Necrons

I'm sure those brand new imperial knight players just know their army better and their opponent better than ALL the others, right? You wouldn't happen to play Eldar, do you? 

Anyway, this isn't even about that. Regardless of whether or not a GK player touched you in naughty places during 5th, it just really blows chucks that they suddenly decide to "turn back the clock" and make GKs a mere support codex. Especially after having been a stand alone codex for so long (one that didn't have to rely on allies to fill crucial battlefield roles). 

If you actually look at how the army got treated since their early days of codex: Daemonhunters, it's pretty appalling what they already scratched off the list, then added, then scratched again...


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## Reaper45 (Jun 21, 2011)

elmir said:


> Yeah, cute... Eldar really aren't too bad. It's all their players who are magically better than all the rest. Just like GKs were at the end of 5th. Just plain magically better!
> 
> It has nothing to do with the fact that their 130-140 point transports shoot harder than most battletanks of other armies. It has nothing to do with a damn near invincible seerstar. Wraithknights are also just fine k:
> 
> ...


People also said tomb kings would never be a competitive book.

Yet somehow they won a tourny. People also say that Nids are a weak codex now, most of the players who played against them say they are still a force to be reckoned with.

It is all about the players, I'm fairly certain most of the guys who won tournaments actually took the time and read their damn rules and know their opponents armies better than they do.
I watched eldar play, if you get the wrong unit in the wrong place you die fast so yes it is about the player.

Oh and for the record I play orks.


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## scscofield (May 23, 2011)

What does any of that have to do with his valid issue of half his codex being turned into other codex/supplements?

Or are you just here to go neener neener gk ward sucks yadda yadda.


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## Reaper45 (Jun 21, 2011)

scscofield said:


> What does any of that have to do with his valid issue of half his codex being turned into other codex/supplements?
> 
> Or are you just here to go neener neener gk ward sucks yadda yadda.


At this point I have no idea how we got onto that track.


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## elmir (Apr 14, 2011)

Reaper45 said:


> At this point I have no idea how we got onto that track.


If you just go back a bit, you'll see that that mr. Reaper over here suddenly starts claiming everything well be awesome again if GKs just lose half of their codex because apparently, Matt Ward made a Mary Sue mess of it...

Because ironically enough, the units that "Ward" (because let's face it, no man wrote a codex singlehandedly anyway) added to the 2005 daemonhunter books when the 2011 codex came out, are:

- Librarians
- Brotherhood champions
- Crowe
- Draigo
- Purifiers
- Paladins
- Rifleman dreads
- Dreadknights
- Interceptors
- Stormravens
- Mordrak and Ghost knights
- Thawn

Baiscally, everything that was added then, is almost the only thing that remains of the book. Because you know... Ward sucks, and even though he's no longer here, it's somehow HIS fault again that they have to cut out the mess that he's made of the book. 

Except that, when you have any knowledge of the prior books and think for 2 seconds before mindlessly droning on about a "Wardcodex".... you'll see that the stuff that "Ward made", is all that remains in this new codex. 

The stuff that remains in the new codex that was already there in 2005:

- Brother captains
- Terminators
- Normal dreads
- Normal PaGKs (now knows as Strike Squads)
- Landraiders
- Rhino
- Razorback



> Or are you just here to go neener neener gk ward sucks yadda yadda.


This pretty much sums up his arguments thus far. GKs were OP, all the rest is fine now (despite... you know... facts about Eldar presence on top tables). So they deserve this treatment because Mat Ward made an insanely powerful codex. Even though almost all the stuff he added is still there, and the list that he didn't add to the army is SHORTER than the list of things he did add to the new codex. :crazy:


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## Bindi Baji (Apr 23, 2009)

scscofield said:


> Or are you just here to go neener neener gk ward sucks yadda yadda.


Congratulations; you win


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