# Malcador hiding Titan?



## GiftofChaos1234 (Jan 27, 2009)

So I'm curious, when the forces of chaos entered the Sol System during the Heresy. How did they not notice that one of the biggest moons in the solar system had disappeared? I mean did Horus just say "Oh, looks like dad lost a world again. It's a good thing I'm going to take control."

But seriously though, what do you guys think happened? Did they simply not care?


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## Haskanael (Jul 5, 2011)

it is noticable already during the events in the Isstvan campaign that Horus himself enters a bit a of a tunnel vision, he is starting to miss little details, and for example fails to predict that Angron would personaly fly down to take on his legions stragglers on the surface.

asside from that, they probably made a direct push for Terra as soon as they entered the Sol system, all focus and attention was on Terra itself, and most likely on Mars. compared to those 2 most likely heavely fortified planets, and the militarized Luna, I doubt they paid much attention to the other planets. 
especialy an uninhabitted gas giant. 
tho I dont know for sure if any of the moons besides Luna have ever been propperly colonised.

on another note as I mentioned. Saturn is a gas giant, wich probably means that any attempts at sensor scanning anywhere near the planet, would be interfered by radiation of different kinds


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## Child-of-the-Emperor (Feb 22, 2009)

GiftofChaos1234 said:


> But seriously though, what do you guys think happened? Did they simply not care?


What could they have done? Their focus was Terra and the Emperor. I can't imagine they would have paid it too much attention. It didn't play a part in the Siege whatsoever anyway, so their decision to ignore it was vindicated.


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## Brother Lucian (Apr 22, 2011)

One could wonder about Horus starting to miss the little detail, is the chaos gods affecting him to ensure that he will lose in the end to ensure the comming dark age of the Imperium after he have crippled the Emperor.


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## Reaper45 (Jun 21, 2011)

Brother Lucian said:


> One could wonder about Horus starting to miss the little detail, is the chaos gods affecting him to ensure that he will lose in the end to ensure the comming dark age of the Imperium after he have crippled the Emperor.


Horus always missed details. It seems like it's his character flaw, he's a great military mind and political leader but blatantly obvious things are missed for strange reasons.

He missed erebus manipulating him.
That entire thing with the interex happened because he messed up the one crucial thing that happens in all negations. 
Since we don't have allot before the heresy those are the two things that really stand out.


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## Brother Lucian (Apr 22, 2011)

Reaper45 said:


> Horus always missed details. It seems like it's his character flaw, he's a great military mind and political leader but blatantly obvious things are missed for strange reasons.
> 
> He missed erebus manipulating him.
> That entire thing with the interex happened because he messed up the one crucial thing that happens in all negations.
> Since we don't have allot before the heresy those are the two things that really stand out.


You might be right there. Whereas Guiliman is completely obsessed with details. Its little wonder Horus chafed at being Warmaster, all the details and minutiae of the post frustrating him.


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## Uveron (Jun 11, 2011)

Also depending on how they entered Sol, the moon could have been on the far side of the sun, so it was a long way from Terra.


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## Over Two Meters Tall! (Nov 1, 2010)

From what I've heard, Malcador hides Titan in the Warp, right? So the effect of the other celestial bodies in the solar system shouldn't make a difference to an awareness of Titan being in normal space or not. I think the OP is right to wonder how, as the Chaos fleet nears Sol in the Warp, there's a moon just sitting there all sigiled-out or the mother of all Gellar fields. I think it's been pretty well established there is geographic proximity between the Warp and Reality, in general terms. So how does anyone in the Heretic's fleet miss Titan, or one of the Chaos United gods tap Horus on the shoulder and say, "um, you may not have noticed..."?


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## Tawa (Jan 10, 2010)

Reading the thread title just gave me the image of Malc stood in front of a Warhound going "There's no titan's here!"


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## Brother Lucian (Apr 22, 2011)

Tawa said:


> Reading the thread title just gave me the image of Malc stood in front of a Warhound going "There's no titan's here!"


Nah, you need to add some handwavium and sprout, "These are not the titans you are looking for." :grin:


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## Serpion5 (Mar 19, 2010)

Haskanael said:


> on another note as I mentioned. Jupiter is a gas giant, wich probably means that any attempts at sensor scanning anywhere near the planet, would be interfered by radiation of different kinds


Titan orbits Saturn.


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## BlackGuard (Sep 10, 2010)

Tawa said:


> Reading the thread title just gave me the image of Malc stood in front of a Warhound going "There's no titan's here!"


Had he done so, would you have doubted him? It_ is_ Malcador after all.


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## Haskanael (Jul 5, 2011)

Serpion5 said:


> Titan orbits Saturn.


that was completely my mistake xd thanks for noticing!


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## Tawa (Jan 10, 2010)

BlackGuard said:


> Had he done so, would you have doubted him? It_ is_ Malcador after all.


Of course not.

Wait, what's that in the shad.... :hang1:


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## emporershand89 (Jun 11, 2010)

Clearly Titan, at the time iof the Heresy, was a "Black Ops" project of the Imperium and the Emporer himself. No one knew aboutm, including Horus, and every few people had access to it. Additionally Malcador, probably the great psyker of the time, second only to the Emporer himself, was using some type of latent abilities to camoflague this project from both public and private eye. So when the Origional Warriors arrive to find a fully stocked fortress-monastary(practice a full-seized fortress city in it's own right), it was quite the feat. As Lexicanum state........



> Titan, through Malcador's mystical means, had been hidden away from the ravages of the Horus Heresy. When they arrived they found a Fortress-monastery already fully prepared and stocked with everything necessary to create a new army of Space Marines including supplies of gene-seed, which is suspected to have been taken from the Emperor directly, and all the necessary armaments. The fortress was also already populated with hundreds upon hundreds of suitable recruits from across the Galaxy. Some were raw and untrained, whilst others were selected in secret from among the ranks of loyalist Legions.


Therefore I only have two question. First why did Malcador go to such lengths to hide this Fortress from all knowledge? Daemonic Hunters or not, Emporer's command or not, it was one of hundreds of black projects they had. Why so different, what makes them special? Secondly how did they manage to keep such a fully operation center completely hidden from the naked eye?


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## Reaper45 (Jun 21, 2011)

emporershand89 said:


> Clearly Titan, at the time iof the Heresy, was a "Black Ops" project of the Imperium and the Emporer himself. No one knew aboutm, including Horus, and every few people had access to it. Additionally Malcador, probably the great psyker of the time, second only to the Emporer himself, was using some type of latent abilities to camoflague this project from both public and private eye. So when the Origional Warriors arrive to find a fully stocked fortress-monastary(practice a full-seized fortress city in it's own right), it was quite the feat. As Lexicanum state........
> 
> 
> 
> Therefore I only have two question. First why did Malcador go to such lengths to hide this Fortress from all knowledge? Daemonic Hunters or not, Emporer's command or not, it was one of hundreds of black projects they had. Why so different, what makes them special? Secondly how did they manage to keep such a fully operation center completely hidden from the naked eye?


Perhaps there's more to the story than meets the eye?

There's enough reason to believe the grey knights were malacador's pet project. Perhaps he intended for them to fight the warp tear. But when the emperor was killed they were re purposed.


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## Child-of-the-Emperor (Feb 22, 2009)

emporershand89 said:


> Therefore I only have two question. First why did Malcador go to such lengths to hide this Fortress from all knowledge? Daemonic Hunters or not, Emporer's command or not, it was one of hundreds of black projects they had. Why so different, what makes them special?


Because the Grey Knights were intended to be the one thing that was capable of defending the Imperium from the daemonic when the Emperor was gone. The rise of the Grey Knights was seen as critically important to the survival of the Imperium: 

"As Horus' final campaign began, the Emperor foresaw that the end of the Heresy would cost him greatly, so much so that he would no longer be able to take an active hand in Mankind's survival - if he even survived at all. Yet he also knew that the threat of Chaos would not see defeat with Horus, but would continue to haunt humanity. Who then would defend Mankind against the Chaos Gods and their daemons?" - Codex: Grey Knights.



emporershand89 said:


> Secondly how did they manage to keep such a fully operation center completely hidden from the naked eye?


"Through sorcerous means, the Sigillite had long ago shielded the moon from the sight and deeds of loyalists and traitors alike... [the prepared Fortress Monastery was] prepared under a shield of illusion... Before leaving Titan for the final time, Malcador forged one last enchantment, greater than any that had come before it. Titan vanished completely from its orbit, hidden from Horus in the most unlikely of refuges - Malcador had anchored it amongst the tides of the Warp. Protected by Macro-Geller fields and sigilic rites of Malcador's own devising. Titan rode out the tumult of the Warp whilst the rest of the galaxy endured through the last months of the Horus Heresy and the tragedy of the Emperor's final battle." - Codex: Grey Knights.


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## Romanov77 (Jan 27, 2013)

Tawa said:


> Reading the thread title just gave me the image of Malc stood in front of a Warhound going "There's no titan's here!"


Wouldn't that be Creed? 

Anyway, I would have hidden Terra instead...just imagine the lulz as the Horus fleet reached the orbit...


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## emporershand89 (Jun 11, 2010)

Child-of-the-Emperor said:


> Protected by Macro-Geller fields and sigilic rites of Malcador's own devising. Titan rode out the tumult of the Warp whilst the rest of the galaxy endured through the last months of the Horus Heresy and the tragedy of the Emperor's final battle."


That is quite a feat, especially if they managed to create Gellar fields aroudn the entire planet. Is that even possible? Why have they not recreated this technology over and try it again. Sorcerer or not Malcador, unlike the Emporer, realized his time was coming so why leave if he could have used it to his advantage?

I'd also ask if Titan is still in the Warp? Or did it come out, how long did it stay floating through the Warp?



Reaper45 said:


> There's enough reason to believe the grey knights were malacador's pet project.


This is true, but they were also the Emporers pet project as well. Keep in mind the Emporer was the scientists, the Genome and DNA master, and ruler of sequencing. It was more him, than Malcador, that started this project. Malcador was just the handler the Emporer sent to keep an eye on it.


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## Child-of-the-Emperor (Feb 22, 2009)

Romanov77 said:


> Anyway, I would have hidden Terra instead...just imagine the lulz as the Horus fleet reached the orbit...


:laugh:



emporershand89 said:


> Is that even possible?


Considering it actually happened, yes. 



emporershand89 said:


> I'd also ask if Titan is still in the Warp? Or did it come out, how long did it stay floating through the Warp?


No, Titan emerged from the warp sometime around the Second Founding when the Grey Knights subtly joined the ranks of the Adeptus Astartes as Chapter 666. Time, however, passed much slower so that by the time Titan re-emerged the Grey Knights Chapter was at full strength and fully trained. 

This is all in Codex: Grey Knights btw.


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## Words_of_Truth (Sep 20, 2007)

God I hate Grey Knights now, I used to love the idea of them but now, they are just wrong.


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## BlackGuard (Sep 10, 2010)

Romanov77 said:


> Wouldn't that be Creed?
> 
> Anyway, I would have hidden Terra instead...just imagine the lulz as the Horus fleet reached the orbit...


And this is why _you_ should have been the Sigilite. Pile yet another failure of the Emperor upon the heap.


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## Over Two Meters Tall! (Nov 1, 2010)

emporershand89 said:


> Clearly Titan, at the time iof the Heresy, was a "Black Ops" project of the Imperium and the Emporer himself. No one knew aboutm, including Horus, and every few people had access to it. Secondly how did they manage to keep such a fully operation center completely hidden from the naked eye?


I will point out that in "The Last Remembrancer", a short story in the Age of Darkness anthology, the story takes place on a base built on and within the moon Titan and it already has a group of unknown Astares of at least Chapter strength. At the very least Dorn and Iacton Qruze were aware of the base and plans for the Grey Knights... ya' know, since Qruze is supposed to become one himself


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